Bitcoin Forum

Hi guys!

I don't know that much about bitcoin and i was wondering what will happen to transactions which are in unconfirmed state for a long time. like this : https://blockchain.info/nl/tx/f24ff339fc651b0b28cdfc0e67bb4c2f91b46cbd39935ff4d70c95bb5c33b0e9

This could be a fake transaction, which gets no confirmations simply because it's fake. Alternatively, it gets resolved  ???

it's a real transaction i did ...
just with a really low fee :(

it also never occurred to me bitcoin payments, which only we can do is wait until the confirmation is completed, sometimes transferan bitcoin confirmation had to wait 50 or 25 confirmation, hopefully transferan can get more quickly into our wallet ...  :P

You just have to wait. It'll get confirmed in due time. Always best to include a fee to keep things moving along.

Zero transaction fee again,wait it will confirm eventually with time but next time be sure to include a fee.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=232979.0

so around which time will it be confirmed?
and i put a really small fee like 0.000001 but i don't see it anymore

If you don't know enough about how fees are calculated, better to send a transaction with the standard 0.0001 fee and not worry about it. Your transaction could confirm if you are lucky, but you couldn't be lucky every time.

So perhaps your client removed the fee since it was irrelevant.
Just wait. Most zero-fee transactions will be confirmed eventually, don't be impatient.
If it isn't confirmed after a day or so, it might get thrown out of the pool of transactions waiting to be confirmed, and you should be able to retry it (this time with sufficient fee).

Onkel Paul

If you stop rebroadcasting the transaction it will be dropped and forgotten from the network eventually (if it doesn't get confirmed in the mean time)

What are you talking about? There are NO fake transactions! It is impossible to create a fake transaction(well in theory you can create a fake transaction but you will not be able to push because nodes will drop it and miners will not pick it) If you meant create a transaction that will never confirm because miners just not pick it than yes it is possible all you have to do is create a transaction which has a lot of inputs and low fee in that case miners may not pick the transaction and thus forget about it but you have to wait. In op's situation it will likely drop(but nothing stops for another bitcoin user to rebroadcast it.

Fees    0.00 BTC
this one tell everything :D that's why your tx is not confirmed till now
network will forget this tx and your bitcoin will be refunded into your address
but this step need some days, if you lucky, it will happen in 2-3 days (my experience), but i can takes a week too
just pray for the best :D
minimum fee recommended is 0.0001 BTC

The transaction input isn't old (313 confimations) and isn't big (0.00399 btc).
And so that free transaction will take a very very long time (if ever) to be confirmed.

The result of the unconfirmed transaction depends on the wallet you use. If you use bitcoin core, the transaction will stay in your wallet and will be re-broadcast again and again.

Because of this I created this transaction https://blockchain.info/tx/0c9b97eabf40271ef4f5061903e9731ac95d0bbe6bc9fb9e93fc9a18e16af2f2 (https://blockchain.info/tx/0c9b97eabf40271ef4f5061903e9731ac95d0bbe6bc9fb9e93fc9a18e16af2f2) it is too a medium priority transaction and includes 0 as a fee I don't remember when was the last time I tried to double-spend this kind of transaction. I got this in debug window 5d7a1d6a648fc1944c750e48c65e3204b09a2e93bdd4370c7666398e14b25508 lets see if it appears here http://respends.thinlink.com/ (http://respends.thinlink.com/)

The amount of time needed for the transaction to be dropped depends on the client you use. Some broadcast it forever while some drop it after a while. It will eventually be confirmed if it is broadcasted for a long time but it does take a lot of time. Minimum fee is 0.0001 unless the input is old enough plus the input and output is at least 0.01 and above.

What happens if a node continuously pumps dust into the blockchain?  Like a server farm of 100s of PCs that do nothing but pump dust into the BTC blockchain, in an attempt to cripple it like a DOS attack?  Does that node get somehow cut off?

In the past people have done that but it would cost them alot in fees. Or they would get rejected.

It would cost a lot in fees and coins. In order for it to be sucessful, the nodes must accept it. Nearly all of the node refuse to relay dust transaction if the fee is too low. Most of the node and mining pool are designed to reject these kind of dust transactions. There are however, still a few mining pool willing to include dust transaction.

so just keep waiting? :)

Transactions without fee may be long, several miners are choosing blocks with higher fee.
Has it occurred to me that a transaction without fee delay 4 days to confirm.

Oh there you go the transaction has been dropped https://blockchain.info/en/tx/f24ff339fc651b0b28cdfc0e67bb4c2f91b46cbd39935ff4d70c95bb5c33b0e9 (https://blockchain.info/en/tx/f24ff339fc651b0b28cdfc0e67bb4c2f91b46cbd39935ff4d70c95bb5c33b0e9) it says "Transaction not found" I recommend you to resend the coins now with a fee as some nodes might rebroadcast it(it happened once with me transaction got dropped and I decided to not resend it next day it was rebroadcast even though I have never opened my client)

Consider to send your transactions with a fee of 0.00000001 (one satoshi) instead of none fee.

Sorry, that's nonsense. Either leave out the fee (and risk that the transaction won't be processed) or add the standard fee of 0.0001 BTC to ensure that everything works as it should.
Miners that refuse to process no-fee transactions would most likely refuse one-satoshi transations as well.

Onkel Paul

It appears to be rebroadcasted again. Even if you don't open the client but the client behaviour is to rebroadcast after the transaction falls out of the mempool, it will still automatically broadcast. In this case, even though no node is relaying it right now due to its low fee (https://blockchain.info/inv/f24ff339fc651b0b28cdfc0e67bb4c2f91b46cbd39935ff4d70c95bb5c33b0e9) the transaction appeared to have been stored in Blockchain.info's mempool again. The only way now is to either doublespend it or just wait for it to confirm, it will confirm eventually but it takes a long time.

Here's a question that's not too far off-topic:  what if you suggest an amount *greater than* the 0.0001 or so BTC that's recommended?  Does it mean instead of waiting say 1 hour you would wait a lot less, if your reward for confirm is greater?  And how much faster would the confirm be?  Double the amount means half the time to confirm?  Or I guess it varies on the network congestion at any give time?

It isn't really like that. But the priority will be higher, so it will be confirmed faster but we can't say the correct time.

   ~~MZ~~

i dont think theres anything to worry, since its already sent.

If you put 0.0001 on 1000 bytes transaction it will be confirmed in the next block and there is no need to put the fee higher unless you want to donate that to the pool or the transaction is higher than 1000 bytes.

There are few things to worry about 1.It could be rebroadcast over and over again thus taking months to confirm. 2.It could never confirm(drops from memory pool(applies only for the receiver).

currently is ok to use 1 satoshi

The longer an input has been unspent, the higher priority it will have for the miners to confirm any TX that it contains. So *if* a TX was rebroadcast over and over again then it would have an ever-increasing level of priority.

No it isn't. 9999 satoshi or anything less than that is considered non standard fee. 1 satoshi won't even increase your priority by a bit and most nodes would consider it as a dust transaction and refuse to relay it. Most mining pool also wouldn't include it in their blocks unless your coin age is high and outputs are more than 0.01 BTC.

Yup ranochigo and Onkel is right.

AFAIK, transactions with at least min fee are ranked by pools by tx fee per byte.
And for transaction with less than min fee, they are ranked by the priority:

OP, you should also contact the receiver (if you are just the sender) and ask him not to rebroadcast the transaction. Otherwise, the receiver may keep rebroadcasting it again and again.

It will take very long time to confirm a tx like this.
No tx fee... no miner is willing to pack your transaction in their mined block.
You should always add a small fee, man

That is not absolutely right. First of all there is no such thing as non standard fee(unless it has negative value) every transaction fee included(or not) is considered standard.Secondly you should know that there are 0.9.x miners who mines transaction which put 0.00001(1000 sat) per 1000 bytes so 9999 satoshi fee is 9.999 times higher than they require.

This is what bitcoin wiki tells me
By standard transaction fee, I meant the fee for the transaction to be accepted ASAP. Obviously, you don't have to put one if your coin is old enough and have outputs of more than 0.01BTC.
That don't happen with majority of the pools/miners. Most of them require a 0.0001BTC fee at least. Obviously, that depends on the kind of software client they are running, different ones have different behaviour.

AFAIK, the min tx fee is unchanged for the upgrade from 0.8.x to 0.9.x and remain as 0.0001 btc per KB.
The one lowered to 0.00001 btc per KB is the relay fee.

For the meaning of relay fee, you may refer to https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=579460.0

Has anyone ever tried to send a transaction with .00000001 fee?
I did various;

• 83 minutes: 5457c17730a26da278ddf205246d05fc37f1219a790d929345752d3aeb867ce6 (http://blockchain.info/pt/tx/5457c17730a26da278ddf205246d05fc37f1219a790d929345752d3aeb867ce6)
• 22 minutes: 6b24f6dd17f144fd90b1fc198c83a61b9f8f9ea04b0b3341e9cc0b9ade4a8446 (http://blockchain.info/pt/tx/6b24f6dd17f144fd90b1fc198c83a61b9f8f9ea04b0b3341e9cc0b9ade4a8446)
• 3 minutes: 60ed62cc99fbccda0414f703b5833d5d43fc19000de4576e7eb412b3e373c270 (http://blockchain.info/pt/tx/60ed62cc99fbccda0414f703b5833d5d43fc19000de4576e7eb412b3e373c270)
• 39 minutes: 4a37a422c88bc18097cd0525b8c8e14132f5ce7bdde912d2904df9d396b298d2 (http://blockchain.info/pt/tx/4a37a422c88bc18097cd0525b8c8e14132f5ce7bdde912d2904df9d396b298d2)
• 137 minutes: 38c14c2390344611d85750fd58183fda9e8e6cb5b8d4202bb6442e6888a5ed19 (http://blockchain.info/pt/tx/38c14c2390344611d85750fd58183fda9e8e6cb5b8d4202bb6442e6888a5ed19)
• 8 minutes: 7427640b18d909dcb6974b8d83ef0ced4fd18519a3a16d1c2db284416dc397f1 (http://blockchain.info/pt/tx/7427640b18d909dcb6974b8d83ef0ced4fd18519a3a16d1c2db284416dc397f1)
• 11 minutes: 1b1cc2964d4fa94320de0df1db04883cffd18af3e98843b427b743e9bf0eead2 (http://blockchain.info/pt/tx/1b1cc2964d4fa94320de0df1db04883cffd18af3e98843b427b743e9bf0eead2)
• 56 minutes: a9ff214c644d43409726fae423e24a36492ca315745428928260761d3434e20f (http://blockchain.info/pt/tx/a9ff214c644d43409726fae423e24a36492ca315745428928260761d3434e20f)
• continue...

It took an average of 20 minutes to confirm.

The lowest amount I use is 1 uBTC. We can save our BTC, but because of miners, TXs are confirming, so it is better to send atleast 1 uBTC and if you can 0.1 mBTC. :)

P.S. When I looked the TX, all the tx were above 0.01BTC, so it has more chance to get confirmed even if you didn't send any fees. I think that is why, it confirmed in a short period. ::)

   ~~MZ~~

All the transactions above were 0.9 btc and more so it requires only one day for the inputs to be old enough(remember 1BTC one day(144confirms) 0.1BTC 10days(1440confirms)), thus meaning you could have set even the 0 fee and it still would have confirmed quit quickly. If you would have experimented with lower amounts(and not old) confirmation would have taken way way more time.

I think that you have wait! it's already happening to a friend

Your transaction got dropped again quickly resend the transaction with a fee!

all you have to do is just to wait for the confirmation is completed, if not completed the necessary confirmation of the bitcoin sent to us will never get to address our wallet ...  ::)

it usually happens when you send a small amount fraction below .1 etc.

I've Used without fee. some confirmed fast, some slow.

Wrong, transactions above 0.01 will confirm relatively fast if the coin age is high. Transaction above 0.01 can confirm slowly without a fee if the coin age is low. I haven't heard of cases which the transaction gets stuck when transacting 0.01BTC and above without fee.

It has been 3 days since the transaction got dropped I hope you resent it with a fee good luck and next time don't forget to put a fee.

Accidentally sent a low transaction without a fee and I've been waiting for over 12 hours now for it to get confirmed. At this rate, I highly doubt it would. I know transactions are not reversible, but a nice feature to have would be the ability to cancel transactions that have 0 confirmations after a certain period of time has elapsed.

The bitcoin nodes will soon drop those 0-confirmation transactions (after a day or a few days), and then you could create another transaction to double spend the original unconfirmed one.

I would not say that this is actually double-spending, spending the inputs that has never been spent before is not double-spending.

You are kind of right there.
In fact, I see people using the term "double spend" in two different ways, and to be honest I don't know which is the more accepted one.

1. There are two unconfirmed transactions spending the same inputs.
2. A transaction is confirmed in a block, the block is then orphaned, and another transaction spending the same inputs is included in a longer main chain.

There is the third one where an attacker gains 51% of the network hashing speed and then he could send two transactions which spends at least one same input and include them both in the block, and the block would not be orphaned. But I use the first one where two transactions spends same inputs but only one gets confirmed and one gets dropped.

you have just wait, its sometimes happens when you don t use without fee

It seems the problem is solved completely now.
OP has created another transaction (https://www.blocktrail.com/BTC/tx/a6845a2f1098e71accf26b88584a5a686623ac0e52f279b20ce980f6b78f6edb) with standard fee to replace the original one (https://www.blocktrail.com/BTC/tx/f24ff339fc651b0b28cdfc0e67bb4c2f91b46cbd39935ff4d70c95bb5c33b0e9), and it is confirmed already.