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Title: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on October 31, 2014, 05:58:49 AM I realized that I made a grave error in my assessment thanks to a Bitcoiner much wiser than I setting me straight.
BFL is using BitPay as an exchange to convert their BTC to fiat and deposited into their bank oppose to only using them as a payment service provider of which that is all BitPay is, again, not an exchange. You can't do! I can't do it! Yet, BFL has converted millions via BitPay. I just found three other BFL BWAs that have used BitPay to convert their BTC to fiat. BFL has been sooooo NAUGHTY! Where's the fuckin' media on this? #ASKFTC I'm too lazy to figure out what you are ranting and raving about this time, but I don't see why BFL selling bitcoins to Bitpay would be considered illegal or fraudulent. Merchants exchange bitcoins to fiat through Bitpay all the time. Why can't BFL? Those TOS that you quoted may apply to you, but they don't have to apply to everyone. BitPay will covert anybody's BTC to fiat as long as you have a bank account. No questions asked and for any amount. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is now officially an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: franky1 on October 31, 2014, 06:07:37 AM phin, you do realise that bitcoin is meant to be financial freedom. would you like it if a company refuses to send money to your bank account purely because of speculation. (meaning in a world of innocent till proven guilty in a court, its speculation till a judge makes judgement)
although i hate BFL as much as you, lets put BFL aside and treat what im about to say as a general note about monetary freedom ideals, unless there is a court order to freeze funds the ideal of bitcoin is not to stop transactions. thus because there was no court order to stop transactions, there should be no reason to freeze accounts or stop payments. so would you prefer a world where i can get your bank to stop doing wire transfers, or force visa/western union/ paypal to not do business with you purely because there is a complaint that you may have sent goods later then promised. or would you prefer these third party services to only freeze funds with proper authorization. bitpay should not freeze anyones funds without a court order.. even if they are scammy a-holes like BFL. the issue is not that bitpay is doing anything bad, but the fact that when people want financial freedoms, they need to take extra care and responsibility for funds and if they want some third party to do something, not to expect it to happen automatically. what should happen is that when there are customer issues. customers dont bitch and moan on forums. but instead they go to court and put a lien on the company and get a court to freeze funds. then send that request too bitpay so they are informed. Title: Re: BitPay is now officially an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on October 31, 2014, 06:39:01 AM I'm too lazy to figure out what you are ranting and raving about this time, but I don't see why BFL selling bitcoins to Bitpay would be considered illegal or fraudulent. Merchants exchange bitcoins to fiat through Bitpay all the time. Why can't BFL? Those TOS that you quoted may apply to you, but they don't have to apply to everyone. https://bitpay.com/legal#limitation-of-liability Quote 1. The Services We are a Bitcoin payment processor—we enable you to accept Bitcoins as payment for goods or services, and process Bitcoin payments that you receive from your customers. We are not a Bitcoin exchange, Bitcoin wallet, or a place to purchase Bitcoin. By using the Services, you authorize us to receive, hold and disburse funds on your behalf and to take any and all actions that we think are necessary or desirable to provide the Services and to comply with applicable law. http://blog.bitpay.com/2013/03/23/how-fincen-guidelines-affect-bitpay.html Quote We have received numerous industry and press inquiries as to how the March 18 Guidance from FinCEN regarding virtual currencies would affect BitPay. FinCEN’s guidance that “virtual currency” is a type of money and should be treated like “real currency” is a step in the right direction. We have always worked under the impression that virtual currency is money, so we are glad that FinCEN now agrees with that position. The heart of FinCEN’s guidance recommends that activities which are classified as Money Services Businesses (MSB) or Money Transmission Businesses (MTB) should be applied equally to both real currency and virtual currency. Therefore activities such as remittance, payroll, and check cashing would be regulated whether the type of money is real or virtual. We should pay close attention to footnote #10 of the guidance, which states: 10 FinCEN’s regulations provide that whether a person is a money transmitter is a matter of facts and circumstances. The regulations identify six circumstances under which a person is not a money transmitter, despite accepting and transmitting currency, funds, or value that substitutes for currency. 31 CFR § 1010.100(ff)(5)(ii)(A)-(F). Looking up the six exemption circumstances in 31 CFR § 1010.100(ff)(5) will return the following: (ii) Facts and circumstances; Limitations. Whether a person is a money transmitter as described in this section is a matter of facts and circumstances. The term “money transmitter” shall not include a person that only: (A) Provides the delivery, communication, or network access services used by a money transmitter to support money transmission services; (B) Acts as a payment processor to facilitate the purchase of, or payment of a bill for, a good or service through a clearance and settlement system by agreement with the creditor or seller; (C) Operates a clearance and settlement system or otherwise acts as an intermediary solely between BSA regulated institutions. This includes but is not limited to the Fedwire system, electronic funds transfer networks, certain registered clearing agencies regulated by the Securities and Exchange Commission (“SEC”), and derivatives clearing organizations, or other clearinghouse arrangements established by a financial agency or institution; (D) Physically transports currency, other monetary instruments, other commercial paper, or other value that substitutes for currency as a person primarily engaged in such business, such as an armored car, from one person to the same person at another location or to an account belonging to the same person at a financial institution, provided that the person engaged in physical transportation has no more than a custodial interest in the currency, other monetary instruments, other commercial paper, or other value at any point during the transportation; (E) Provides prepaid access; or (F) Accepts and transmits funds only integral to the sale of goods or the provision of services, other than money transmission services, by the person who is accepting and transmitting the funds. We have highlighted exemptions (B) and (F) which describe the activities performed by BitPay. The IRS has defined rules for classifying Payment Processors, or Payment Settlement Entities (PSE) in 2008 with the Internal Revenue Code 6050W. This ruling and others clearly state that Payment Processors and Payment Settlement Entities are not Money Transmitters. BitPay has a contractual agreement with our sellers for transaction processing, clearance, and settlement of funds that arrive for a given merchant account. BitPay does not have any contractual agreement with any sender of funds, and does not engage in any activities that would be considered Money Transmission activities. BitPay has voluntarily registered with FinCEN in 2011, so that we have an online account to electronically report any suspicious activity that may arise. However, to date we have not seen any suspicious activity and have not filed any reports. All of our merchants are identified and we know their bank account information, so there is little likelihood for someone engaging in criminal activity to use our service. On a side note, FinCEN may want to get clarification from Ben Bernanke, who says that gold is not money. Thank you, odolvlobo, for playing. But, if you want to continue to play, be forewarn I have an ace up my sleeve: http://www.coindesk.com/former-sec-chair-takes-advisory-roles-bitpay-vaurum/ #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is now officially an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on October 31, 2014, 07:10:35 AM I'm too lazy to figure out what you are ranting and raving about this time, but I don't see why BFL selling bitcoins to Bitpay would be considered illegal or fraudulent. Merchants exchange bitcoins to fiat through Bitpay all the time. Why can't BFL? Those TOS that you quoted may apply to you, but they don't have to apply to everyone. 1500 BTC: https://blockchain.info/tx/03e15e056bc367222c96ec2a840f36028a2fca5c4e9fa1247bf4e2da3ca90c86 2000 BTC: https://blockchain.info/tx/c9b267bfef483c23032002a206ff8067d80688496afb4d12d61fb4918a5df7f4 2300 BTC: https://blockchain.info/tx/7ab6e12411370990ccfaaebd037a3f5d9cd1b374c8d283b902c85c9256d797bc 1000 BTC: https://blockchain.info/tx/b8051afcfcc5778b1f871c7c81358e38b13688d76847956d907ac69295ea5761 500 BTC: https://blockchain.info/tx/2f73b5f120d87c10cb7be68b2a711fbb82122df5d8c799740217a8518b8a17ef 1700 BTC: https://blockchain.info/tx/a2acd03f700af1111c102c4d43a5aaccfe9bc98fb634df71cd60d7ddca1ea777 800 BTC: https://blockchain.info/tx/ff2805f515a6b5e35dbc972056dcad841835ddff97eb9fafe5022bd2fdea1741 And, the granddaddy of them all... 5,562.354 BTC ($1,000,000 USD via HashTrade MY ASS!): https://blockchain.info/tx/1b6ea350c094071412df1f801651263fd65ffa0b89ad6c8626ceeca8755f50bc All the transactions above was BFL using BitPay to covert BTC to fiat to be deposited into their bank account using their 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA pretending they're all for purchases of some types. If such a practice is legal, then BitPay would surely have included said practice of such on their website, but they can't, hence don't, hence the legal disclaimer. Quote We are a Bitcoin payment processor—we enable you to accept Bitcoins as payment for goods or services, and process Bitcoin payments that you receive from your customers. We are not a Bitcoin exchange, Bitcoin wallet, or a place to purchase Bitcoin. By using the Services, you authorize us to receive, hold and disburse funds on your behalf and to take any and all actions that we think are necessary or desirable to provide the Services and to comply with applicable law. But, Sonny Vleisides always seems to think that he's above the law and can do what the fuck he pleases, going as far as sticking it up his probation officer's ass with three fuckin' big lies that I can prove, but lucky for him she bought them... up to the date of the raid forward, that is. Now she knows that a ~$1K webside is NOT worth $2M USD, among other things, that Sonny Vleisides is on record in stating was worth. Here's that site: http://web.archive.org/web/*/dealerhound.com (http://web.archive.org/web/*/dealerhound.com). #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is now officially an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on October 31, 2014, 09:06:30 AM http://www.csbs.org/regulatory/ep/Documents/EPTF%20Hearing%20Panel%203.pdf
Quote BitPay was formed in May of 2011, so that has been operating for three years, which makes us pretty old in this space today. During this time we've acquired over 30,000 merchants to accept bitcoin with our service. Our merchants include small, medium, and large sized businesses in every state who accept bitcoin side-by-side with credit cards as a form of payment. At BitPay, our role in the bitcoin ecosystem is very close to that of a traditional merchant-acquirer in the credit card space. Our software helps merchants clear and settle payments, transactions rather, over the bitcoin network. BitPay is not an exchange. BitPay is not a bitcoin bank. We do not have any consumer facing services. Consumers have no risk of loss from our service. BitPay is committed to being a good corporate citizen. We employ a strict KYC policy to protect against money laundering. Our KYC policy follows the best practices of traditional merchant acquirers. We need to know who our merchants are and what they're selling. We only want the good actors on our platform. Bitcoin does have risks as other forms of payments do. Criminals use cellphones, email US dollars, and banks. BitPay shares the tasks force policy goals to protect consumers from fraud and money launderers, keeping money launderers away from our business. We implement a risk-based approach for merchant acquisition as recommended by FinCen BSA, and the Patriot Act. This approach provides increased CIP in KYC due diligence as the merchant's daily sales volumes increase. Sonny Vleisides' BF Labs Inc. used BitPay as their private exchange. BFL used BitPay as a bank. Sonny Vleisides thought he was clever when he thought he could really get away with bypassing BitPay's stick KYC policy. The 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA truly belongs to BFL and NOT HashTrade as was demonstrated to the world in this infamous press release - BF Labs, Inc. Processes $1 Million Bitcoin Merchant Transaction for Institutional Bitcoin Mining Hardware Purchase (http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/10/prweb11283333.htm) - first mentioned by me a year ago to the day: http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/10/prweb11283333.htm Quote Overland Park, KS (PRWEB) October 31, 2013 Josh Zerlan has never once called me out as a liar each and every time I've mentioned this. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is now officially an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: bornil267645 on October 31, 2014, 03:21:21 PM Now I don't know what to believe. here people talking about special edition BTC community, elsewhere people thinking about never to use BTC again.
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on October 31, 2014, 09:34:52 PM The FTC froze ~$1.2M USD in BFL's bank account: http://ia902308.us.archive.org/32/items/gov.uscourts.mowd.117531/gov.uscourts.mowd.117531.23.0.pdf
Quote 2. On or about September 19, 2014, BFL’s bank account with BMO Harris Bank N.A. (“BMO Account”) was frozen, along with other assets. The BMO Account contains approximately $1.2 million. Let's see if the cash adds up, shall we? Skip to the end of this post to find out and check my maths, otherwise enjoy the screenshots that I've put so much effort into for your viewing pleasure. :-* http://www.walletexplorer.com/address/1LBEfBCDrwQyxL4yGxZ14Y3uZ37UdBEzK5 http://s22.postimg.org/rhxmb0fup/page_1.jpg https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs http://s30.postimg.org/lta083yhd/671k.jpg $671,385 USD (1500 BTC) on 2014-09-17 20:17:27 (less than 24 hours prior to the FTC on BFL) http://s29.postimg.org/4ox29epgn/1188m.jpg $1,188,650 USD (2500 BTC) on 2014-09-10 01:15:24 http://s24.postimg.org/h5wi3mgtx/1219m.jpg $1,219,950 USD (2500 BTC) on 2014-09-04 20:41:25 http://s29.postimg.org/4smqvamhz/765k.jpg $765,780 USD (1500 BTC) on 2014-08-26 21:14:52 http://s28.postimg.org/5gyy4j2f1/1206m.jpg $1,206,606 USD (2300 BTC) on 2014-08-21 17:57:45 http://s1.postimg.org/p6vduw3r3/496k.jpg $496,000 USD (1000 BTC) on 2014-08-15 19:10:14 http://s1.postimg.org/ckpkbsqnz/293k.jpg $293,032 USD (499 BTC) on 2014-08-07 18:03:04 I only screenshot the 1LBEfBCDrwQyxL4yGxZ14Y3uZ37UdBEzK5 (https://blockchain.info/address/1LBEfBCDrwQyxL4yGxZ14Y3uZ37UdBEzK5) BWA, a known BitPay BWA, ignoring the other addresses surpassing $2M USD that BF Labs Inc. liquidated during the same time period, ALSO along with the millions of dollars liquidated prior to the last tx depicted above, thus only checking if the sum in BFL's bank account is close to what was converted to fiat approximately a month prior to the FTC raid forward. Please, I beg you, check my maths, for I've been known to error. :'( $671,385 $1,188,650 $1,219,950 $765,780 $1,206,606 $496,000 $293,032 $1.2M(+change) Well, that was a total waste of time! The figures add up and most every penny/satoshi is accounted for. I would have sworn that the figure would've been $5,841,403 thus providing an argument for money laundering on BFL's part, but guess I was mistaken. Apologies! ::) #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: ScryptAsic on November 01, 2014, 07:05:30 AM They are essentially a one way exchange in that anyone can open a merchant services account with bitpay, the customer can price something at the amount of bitcoin they wish to sell, then use their own bitcoin to pay for the sale. This would be very similar to how a merchant could potentially swipe their own credit card at their own CC terminal
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 01, 2014, 08:52:59 AM They are essentially a one way exchange in that anyone can open a merchant services account with bitpay, the customer can price something at the amount of bitcoin they wish to sell, then use their own bitcoin to pay for the sale. This would be very similar to how a merchant could potentially swipe their own credit card at their own CC terminal Again, BitPay is not an exchange. They can ONLY process payments for customers that purchase a product or service off a website, et al. They can not convert BTC to fiat for you or me or even BFL, especially a million dollars worth week after week after week... which is exactly what BFL did just prior to them getting raided on September 19th. To date, I've uncovered no less than $10M USD that BFL converted to fiat that was deposited into some bank controlled by BFL. BitPay may be able to explain away last year's $1M USD supposedly from HashTrade - which it wasn't - but that's it. Hell, I'm staring at ~$4M USD missing in only a 30 day period from BFL's coffer. I'm sure so is the IRS and the FBI and the FTC and probably now the CIA, SEC, AAA and NASA (maybe not AAA). BF Labs Inc. has no idea what cans of worms they've opened up due to Sonny, et al.'s, actions. Yet, Josh came here today and tried to quell nerves about BFL's EMC, of which WILL soon be shut down thanks to their former actions. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: elvizzzzzzz on November 01, 2014, 10:05:27 AM "BF Labs Inc. has no idea what cans of worms they've opened up"
Maybe that prompted the SEC's & FinCen's recent initiative that is "exporting" various bitcoin businesses. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Bit N Roll on November 01, 2014, 02:13:25 PM I still dont know if I am going to be happy with it or should I just congratulate them and dont comment about anything.
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: segvec on November 01, 2014, 02:43:05 PM OP got me excited all for nothing by the title.
Thanks... :'( Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Lethn on November 01, 2014, 03:02:20 PM You're not supposed to be rational and understanding! You're supposed to be an ignorant and arrogant bastard who argues with people for several pages despite being provided evidence of being wrong! That's how forum topics are supposed to work!
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 01, 2014, 09:23:16 PM You're not supposed to be rational and understanding! You're supposed to be an ignorant and arrogant bastard who argues with people for several pages despite being provided evidence of being wrong! That's how forum topics are supposed to work! I'm having a tad of difficulty connecting what you're in reference to, bud. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: bitnanigans on November 01, 2014, 09:38:03 PM Is this a good thing or a bad thing? What are the long term implications?
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 01, 2014, 09:44:39 PM Is this a good thing or a bad thing? What are the long term implications? I honestly believe and hope that BitPay weathers the storm, but it'll be at a great financial cost thanks to BFL's actions. Unfortunately, I have undeniable proof that such was the case, but not privy to discuss such at this time. Suffice to say that Sonny Vleisides and company did tremendous damage to Bitcoin, but that, too, will be weathered, again, at a cost. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 01, 2014, 11:29:31 PM http://www.kansascity.com/news/business/technology/article2236696.html
Quote It said Butterfly Labs’ funds had been spent at stores “including Nordstrom, Bed, Bath, & Beyond, Restoration Hardware, and Hobby Lobby” as well as for “massages, auto maintenance, day care services, gun stores, hunting stores and sporting event tickets.” It also noted that the company quickly moved money out of corporate bank accounts once it was received from customers, keeping no more than $2 million in the business accounts at any time. The FTC also cited a federal mail fraud conviction for which Vleisides, Butterfly Labs’ principal stockholder, was on probation. The court should freeze assets because Vleisides had failed to provide his probation officer accurate information about his own finances, the document said. “The record shows that once defendants take possession of consumer funds, they quickly exit company accounts, and that defendants, in many instances, have diverted them to personal use,” the document said. Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/news/business/technology/article2236696.html#storylink=cpy Reads to me like the FTC was well aware of BFL using BitPay to liquidate BTC to fiat to their bank account and making withdraws, hence only $1.2M USD in BFL Harris bank account by the time they were able to freeze said account. #ASKFTC Note: Josh Zerlan has yet to come here and try to disprove the facts laid out above. Maybe he's too busy reading the WTF sub-forum on Reddit. Oh, wait! I've already proved that that's exactly what he's doing now oppose to addressing concerns over on BFL's forum from customers who've paid their hard-earned monies for products they'll now never see, let alone a percentage of their investment any time soon. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 01, 2014, 11:54:07 PM This is interesting: All three of the following are located on the same exact server: Name Server: DORA.NS.CLOUDFLARE.COM:
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22dora.ns.cloudflare.com%22+Bitcoin (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22dora.ns.cloudflare.com%22+Bitcoin) Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Argwai96 on November 02, 2014, 12:01:44 AM They are essentially a one way exchange in that anyone can open a merchant services account with bitpay, the customer can price something at the amount of bitcoin they wish to sell, then use their own bitcoin to pay for the sale. This would be very similar to how a merchant could potentially swipe their own credit card at their own CC terminal Again, BitPay is not an exchange. They can ONLY process payments for customers that purchase a product or service off a website, et al. They can not convert BTC to fiat for you or me or even BFL, especially a million dollars worth week after week after week... which is exactly what BFL did just prior to them getting raided on September 19th. To date, I've uncovered no less than $10M USD that BFL converted to fiat that was deposited into some bank controlled by BFL. BitPay may be able to explain away last year's $1M USD supposedly from HashTrade - which it wasn't - but that's it. Hell, I'm staring at ~$4M USD missing in only a 30 day period from BFL's coffer. I'm sure so is the IRS and the FBI and the FTC and probably now the CIA, SEC, AAA and NASA (maybe not AAA). BF Labs Inc. has no idea what cans of worms they've opened up due to Sonny, et al.'s, actions. Yet, Josh came here today and tried to quell nerves about BFL's EMC, of which WILL soon be shut down thanks to their former actions. #ASKFTC EDIT: This would probably actually be a good thing considering that the bank accounts that BFL controls are under the control of the FTC receiver now, while it would be impossible/difficult to be able to control all the private keys of BFL with any amount of certainty Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 12:16:46 AM This is interesting: All three of the following are located on the same exact server: Name Server: DORA.NS.CLOUDFLARE.COM:
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22dora.ns.cloudflare.com%22+Bitcoin (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22dora.ns.cloudflare.com%22+Bitcoin) Wow, you FUD is gaining new heights! The my server uses jay.ns.cloudflare.com & meg.ns.cloudflare.com I must be in on it too!!!!1!!! Neil Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 12:21:40 AM This is interesting: All three of the following are located on the same exact server: Name Server: DORA.NS.CLOUDFLARE.COM:
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22dora.ns.cloudflare.com%22+Bitcoin (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22dora.ns.cloudflare.com%22+Bitcoin) Wow, you FUD is gaining new heights! The my server uses jay.ns.cloudflare.com & meg.ns.cloudflare.com I must be in on it too!!!!1!!! Neil Instead of calling it FUD, how 'bout just letting me know where I erred? http://www.walletexplorer.com/wallet/d8dd8fcafb08ba5c = 1ERVh27gZfPSDaaagL9R3W12xpMJ38ZBA7 http://s11.postimg.org/6o8nlp66b/bdf.jpg Note the [13be0fef96]: Reads to me like BFL's used their BDF to some other money laundering: http://www.bitcoindf.org/project/bitgive-22/ Quote If you would like to donate or become a member of our charity selection board, please email submit@bitcoindf.org or send BTC to 1ERVh27gZfPSDaaagL9R3W12xpMJ38ZBA7 (https://blockchain.info/address/1ERVh27gZfPSDaaagL9R3W12xpMJ38ZBA7). Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 12:31:42 AM They are essentially a one way exchange in that anyone can open a merchant services account with bitpay, the customer can price something at the amount of bitcoin they wish to sell, then use their own bitcoin to pay for the sale. This would be very similar to how a merchant could potentially swipe their own credit card at their own CC terminal Again, BitPay is not an exchange. They can ONLY process payments for customers that purchase a product or service off a website, et al. They can not convert BTC to fiat for you or me or even BFL, especially a million dollars worth week after week after week... which is exactly what BFL did just prior to them getting raided on September 19th. To date, I've uncovered no less than $10M USD that BFL converted to fiat that was deposited into some bank controlled by BFL. BitPay may be able to explain away last year's $1M USD supposedly from HashTrade - which it wasn't - but that's it. Hell, I'm staring at ~$4M USD missing in only a 30 day period from BFL's coffer. I'm sure so is the IRS and the FBI and the FTC and probably now the CIA, SEC, AAA and NASA (maybe not AAA). BF Labs Inc. has no idea what cans of worms they've opened up due to Sonny, et al.'s, actions. Yet, Josh came here today and tried to quell nerves about BFL's EMC, of which WILL soon be shut down thanks to their former actions. #ASKFTC EDIT: This would probably actually be a good thing considering that the bank accounts that BFL controls are under the control of the FTC receiver now, while it would be impossible/difficult to be able to control all the private keys of BFL with any amount of certainty To address what's in bold, BitPay could've easily surmised that something's afoot when weekly purchases(?) were made from BFL in nice round BTC figures, unlike most all other purchases in the past, with the exception of the infamous $1M USD from HashTrade that BFL would have had to let BitPay know what it was for otherwise BitPay wouldn't have been able to release the press release espousing such. Only BitPay and BFL know for sure that the same bank - Harris - was used for all those ~million-dollar transactions. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 12:33:33 AM Instead of calling it FUD, how 'bout just letting me know where I erred? http://www.walletexplorer.com/wallet/d8dd8fcafb08ba5c = 1ERVh27gZfPSDaaagL9R3W12xpMJ38ZBA7 What you are looking at are taints, they are coins that can be associated with addresses that have been tagged by someone as belonging to someone (probably someone else, why would you tag your own coins after all). It is kind of like Chinese whispers with bitcoins. A good example would be the 20k bitcoin Pizza deal. A vast majority of bitcoins are now tainted by that transaction, that means that fairly much anyone can trace the inputs of their coins back to that pizza. It does not mean they ate it though. Neil P.S. You going on to using people using the same name-server as some sort of "evidence" shows you have absolutely no idea what your doing. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: HobbzHobbleton on November 02, 2014, 12:37:31 AM So, essentially bitpay only performs certain jobs that a full exchange does, and not the full spectrum. This argument brings us to a question.... What truly defines an "exchange"? Surely there are other sites and programs that provide more of the spectrum than others, yet many opf the ones that are lacking are still considered "exchanges". I mean technically isn't it an exchange by definition just by providing the possibility of purchasing goods and services for a currency? i mean there is an "exchange" happening in that equation.
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 12:42:40 AM Instead of calling it FUD, how 'bout just letting me know where I erred? http://www.walletexplorer.com/wallet/d8dd8fcafb08ba5c = 1ERVh27gZfPSDaaagL9R3W12xpMJ38ZBA7 What you are looking at are taints, they are coins that can be associated with addresses that have been tagged by someone as belonging to someone (probably someone else, why would you tag your own coins after all). It is kind of like Chinese whispers with bitcoins. A good example would be the 20k bitcoin Pizza deal. A vast majority of bitcoins are now tainted by that transaction, that means that fairly much anyone can trace the inputs of their coins back to that pizza. It does not mean they ate it though. Neil P.S. You going on to using people using the same name-server as some sort of "evidence" shows you have absolutely no idea what your doing. For a person who doesn't know what they're doing, I sure the hell seem to keep getting a lot of traction. I easily forgave you the first time you tried to shove it up my ass, but there won't be a second time, for you're showing the same fuckin' characteristics as Josh Zerlan, opting to not even get into an intelligent conversation with me showing me where I fucked up, whereupon I would have easily backed down. Now, thanks to your actions, you're on the radar of the dude that has absolutely no idea what he's doing. Well-played! I suggest you quit using Josh Zerlan's playbook while you're still allowed on the field, for it's riddled with errors. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 12:48:38 AM So, essentially bitpay only performs certain jobs that a full exchange does, and not the full spectrum. This argument brings us to a question.... What truly defines an "exchange"? Surely there are other sites and programs that provide more of the spectrum than others, yet many opf the ones that are lacking are still considered "exchanges". I mean technically isn't it an exchange by definition just by providing the possibility of purchasing goods and services for a currency? i mean there is an "exchange" happening in that equation. BitPay's business model is govern by the laws of the US stating exactly what they can and can not do. Acting as a clearing house for BTC to fiat stemming from the sales of services or products is all they're allowed to do, where they even stated that they CAN NOT exchange BTC for fiat when a service or product is not part of the equation. Hell, even some bitcoiners got arrested doing the Local Bitcoins thing on the street. Since BitPay is in an office, does the exact same practice now make it legal? Of course not. And, we're not takin' several tens of grand here. We're talkin' millions within a 30 day period, easily over ten million over the course of the past year. This is a fact! #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 12:54:52 AM I easily forgave you the first time you tried to shove it up my ass, but there won't be a second time, for you're showing the same fuckin' characteristics as Josh Zerlan, opting to not even get into an intelligent conversation with me showing me where I fucked up, whereupon I would have easily backed down. Now, thanks to your actions, you're on the radar of the dude that has absolutely no idea what he's doing. Well-played! I suggest you quit using Josh Zerlan's playbook while you're still allowed on the field, for it's riddled with errors. You're a fool. You have absolutely no idea what your doing. And now you threatening me. Just make sure any "evidence" you come up with is better than your normal shit. Neil Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 01:02:44 AM I easily forgave you the first time you tried to shove it up my ass, but there won't be a second time, for you're showing the same fuckin' characteristics as Josh Zerlan, opting to not even get into an intelligent conversation with me showing me where I fucked up, whereupon I would have easily backed down. Now, thanks to your actions, you're on the radar of the dude that has absolutely no idea what he's doing. Well-played! I suggest you quit using Josh Zerlan's playbook while you're still allowed on the field, for it's riddled with errors. You're a fool. You have absolutely no idea what your doing. And now you threatening me. Just make sure any "evidence" you come up with is better than your normal shit. Neil Jesus motherfuckin' Christ! Listen to yourself. You came here and made a point. I kindly disputed your claim paying it no further mind. You came back here to further stick it up my ass. I replied in kind. Now, you come here and claim I'm threatening you, of which is NOT THE FUCKIN' CASE, but for sake of argument, if I were, how the fuck in your mind would I be able to pull off any threat when I don't know what the fuck I'm doing? Hell, with your logic I shouldn't be able to find the door to leave my home, let alone be able to hunt down the driveway. I had no issues with you. NADA! Yet you have with me. Over what? Trying to advance Bitcoin to better your position. Your welcome. Now go fuck yourself! BTW, you're still on my radar. #ASKFTC PS: Thanks for bumping the thread that you're logical mind is trying to squash. Well-played! Again, toss out that Josh Zerlan's playbook. It filled with errors as I've already informed you. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 01:04:17 AM I easily forgave you the first time you tried to shove it up my ass, but there won't be a second time, for you're showing the same fuckin' characteristics as Josh Zerlan, opting to not even get into an intelligent conversation with me showing me where I fucked up, whereupon I would have easily backed down. Now, thanks to your actions, you're on the radar of the dude that has absolutely no idea what he's doing. Well-played! I suggest you quit using Josh Zerlan's playbook while you're still allowed on the field, for it's riddled with errors. You're a fool. You have absolutely no idea what your doing. And now you threatening me. Just make sure any "evidence" you come up with is better than your normal shit. Neil Jesus motherfuckin' Christ! Listen to yourself. You came here and made a point. I kindly disputed your claim paying it no further mind. You came back here to further stick it up my ass. I replied in kind. Now, you come here and claim I'm threatening you, of which is NOT THE FUCKIN' CASE, but for sake of argument, if I were, how the fuck in your mind would I be able to pull off any threat when I don't know what the fuck I'm doing? Hell, we your logic I shouldn't be able to find the door to leave my home, let alone be able to hunt down the driveway. I had no issues with you. NADA! Yet you have with me. Over what? Trying to advance Bitcoin to better your position. Your welcome. Now go fuck yourself! BTW, you're still on my radar. #ASKFTC Fool Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 01:06:14 AM I easily forgave you the first time you tried to shove it up my ass, but there won't be a second time, for you're showing the same fuckin' characteristics as Josh Zerlan, opting to not even get into an intelligent conversation with me showing me where I fucked up, whereupon I would have easily backed down. Now, thanks to your actions, you're on the radar of the dude that has absolutely no idea what he's doing. Well-played! I suggest you quit using Josh Zerlan's playbook while you're still allowed on the field, for it's riddled with errors. You're a fool. You have absolutely no idea what your doing. And now you threatening me. Just make sure any "evidence" you come up with is better than your normal shit. Neil Jesus motherfuckin' Christ! Listen to yourself. You came here and made a point. I kindly disputed your claim paying it no further mind. You came back here to further stick it up my ass. I replied in kind. Now, you come here and claim I'm threatening you, of which is NOT THE FUCKIN' CASE, but for sake of argument, if I were, how the fuck in your mind would I be able to pull off any threat when I don't know what the fuck I'm doing? Hell, we your logic I shouldn't be able to find the door to leave my home, let alone be able to hunt down the driveway. I had no issues with you. NADA! Yet you have with me. Over what? Trying to advance Bitcoin to better your position. Your welcome. Now go fuck yourself! BTW, you're still on my radar. #ASKFTC Fool Please include an image when you refer to me as such. It has more impact that way. http://creoleindc.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5e0053ef01b7c6e1db3c970b-pi Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 01:17:57 AM I easily forgave you the first time you tried to shove it up my ass, but there won't be a second time, for you're showing the same fuckin' characteristics as Josh Zerlan, opting to not even get into an intelligent conversation with me showing me where I fucked up, whereupon I would have easily backed down. Now, thanks to your actions, you're on the radar of the dude that has absolutely no idea what he's doing. Well-played! I suggest you quit using Josh Zerlan's playbook while you're still allowed on the field, for it's riddled with errors. You're a fool. You have absolutely no idea what your doing. And now you threatening me. Just make sure any "evidence" you come up with is better than your normal shit. Neil Jesus motherfuckin' Christ! Listen to yourself. You came here and made a point. I kindly disputed your claim paying it no further mind. You came back here to further stick it up my ass. I replied in kind. Now, you come here and claim I'm threatening you, of which is NOT THE FUCKIN' CASE, but for sake of argument, if I were, how the fuck in your mind would I be able to pull off any threat when I don't know what the fuck I'm doing? Hell, we your logic I shouldn't be able to find the door to leave my home, let alone be able to hunt down the driveway. I had no issues with you. NADA! Yet you have with me. Over what? Trying to advance Bitcoin to better your position. Your welcome. Now go fuck yourself! BTW, you're still on my radar. #ASKFTC Fool Please include an image when you refer to me as such. It has more impact that way. http://creoleindc.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5e0053ef01b7c6e1db3c970b-pi You have no idea about what you speak, your thread title is an outright lie, and yes, your shit stinks. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 01:23:19 AM Instead of calling it FUD, how 'bout just letting me know where I erred? http://www.walletexplorer.com/wallet/d8dd8fcafb08ba5c = 1ERVh27gZfPSDaaagL9R3W12xpMJ38ZBA7 What you are looking at are taints, they are coins that can be associated with addresses that have been tagged by someone as belonging to someone (probably someone else, why would you tag your own coins after all). It is kind of like Chinese whispers with bitcoins. A good example would be the 20k bitcoin Pizza deal. A vast majority of bitcoins are now tainted by that transaction, that means that fairly much anyone can trace the inputs of their coins back to that pizza. It does not mean they ate it though. Neil P.S. You going on to using people using the same name-server as some sort of "evidence" shows you have absolutely no idea what your doing. The FTC froze ~$1.2M USD in BFL's bank account: http://ia902308.us.archive.org/32/items/gov.uscourts.mowd.117531/gov.uscourts.mowd.117531.23.0.pdf Quote 2. On or about September 19, 2014, BFL’s bank account with BMO Harris Bank N.A. (“BMO Account”) was frozen, along with other assets. The BMO Account contains approximately $1.2 million. Let's see if the cash adds up, shall we? Skip to the end of this post to find out and check my maths, otherwise enjoy the screenshots that I've put so much effort into for your viewing pleasure. :-* http://www.walletexplorer.com/address/1LBEfBCDrwQyxL4yGxZ14Y3uZ37UdBEzK5 http://s22.postimg.org/rhxmb0fup/page_1.jpg https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs http://s30.postimg.org/lta083yhd/671k.jpg $671,385 USD (1500 BTC) on 2014-09-17 20:17:27 (less than 24 hours prior to the FTC on BFL) http://s29.postimg.org/4ox29epgn/1188m.jpg $1,188,650 USD (2500 BTC) on 2014-09-10 01:15:24 http://s24.postimg.org/h5wi3mgtx/1219m.jpg $1,219,950 USD (2500 BTC) on 2014-09-04 20:41:25 http://s29.postimg.org/4smqvamhz/765k.jpg $765,780 USD (1500 BTC) on 2014-08-26 21:14:52 http://s28.postimg.org/5gyy4j2f1/1206m.jpg $1,206,606 USD (2300 BTC) on 2014-08-21 17:57:45 http://s1.postimg.org/p6vduw3r3/496k.jpg $496,000 USD (1000 BTC) on 2014-08-15 19:10:14 http://s1.postimg.org/ckpkbsqnz/293k.jpg $293,032 USD (499 BTC) on 2014-08-07 18:03:04 I only screenshot the 1LBEfBCDrwQyxL4yGxZ14Y3uZ37UdBEzK5 (https://blockchain.info/address/1LBEfBCDrwQyxL4yGxZ14Y3uZ37UdBEzK5) BWA, a known BitPay BWA, ignoring the other addresses surpassing $2M USD that BF Labs Inc. liquidated during the same time period, ALSO along with the millions of dollars liquidated prior to the last tx depicted above, thus only checking if the sum in BFL's bank account is close to what was converted to fiat approximately a month prior to the FTC raid forward. Please, I beg you, check my maths, for I've been known to error. :'( $671,385 $1,188,650 $1,219,950 $765,780 $1,206,606 $496,000 $293,032 $1.2M(+change) Well, that was a total waste of time! The figures add up and most every penny/satoshi is accounted for. I would have sworn that the figure would've been $5,841,403 thus providing an argument for money laundering on BFL's part, but guess I was mistaken. Apologies! ::) #ASKFTC When I'm wrong, I admit I'm wrong. Ergo, I was wrong. It didn't occur to me that what I uncovered were only TAINTS. Millions of dollars worth of TAINTS, some of which transacted on the weekend and late at night when most TAINTS occur oppose during normal business hours when Jody Drake, et al., are in the office. It's those types of transactions I should be looking for. I sure the hell am glad you're on my side and duly hope you accept my apology with thinking that you're an asshole. PS: Sometimes I pen shit that TAINT real. ;D PSS: And, thanks again for the bumps. This is an excellent game when you play by the same rules that BFL plays by. If only I knew what the fuck I was doing instead of being a fool and all. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: HobbzHobbleton on November 02, 2014, 01:25:01 AM LOL well now, that escalated quickly.
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 01:32:30 AM I easily forgave you the first time you tried to shove it up my ass, but there won't be a second time, for you're showing the same fuckin' characteristics as Josh Zerlan, opting to not even get into an intelligent conversation with me showing me where I fucked up, whereupon I would have easily backed down. Now, thanks to your actions, you're on the radar of the dude that has absolutely no idea what he's doing. Well-played! I suggest you quit using Josh Zerlan's playbook while you're still allowed on the field, for it's riddled with errors. You're a fool. You have absolutely no idea what your doing. And now you threatening me. Just make sure any "evidence" you come up with is better than your normal shit. Neil Jesus motherfuckin' Christ! Listen to yourself. You came here and made a point. I kindly disputed your claim paying it no further mind. You came back here to further stick it up my ass. I replied in kind. Now, you come here and claim I'm threatening you, of which is NOT THE FUCKIN' CASE, but for sake of argument, if I were, how the fuck in your mind would I be able to pull off any threat when I don't know what the fuck I'm doing? Hell, we your logic I shouldn't be able to find the door to leave my home, let alone be able to hunt down the driveway. I had no issues with you. NADA! Yet you have with me. Over what? Trying to advance Bitcoin to better your position. Your welcome. Now go fuck yourself! BTW, you're still on my radar. #ASKFTC Fool Please include an image when you refer to me as such. It has more impact that way. http://creoleindc.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341c5e0053ef01b7c6e1db3c970b-pi You have no idea about what you speak, your thread title is an outright lie, and yes, your shit stinks. Excuse me, but if you would've read the OP you would've realized that the title is not necessarily a lie but sarcasm thanks to a Bitcoiner using the same playbook trying to stick it up my ass in another thread. Apologies for trying to drive the point home and garner media attention, the same media attention that's still trying to be garnered pertaining to KnC's bogus $100,000 USD payment to TBF, making this claim ten times worse. In fact, now 100 times worse we're easily pass the $10M mark that BFL laundered through BitPay. I have an excellent idea. Why don't you take the time to disprove that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA does indeed belong to HashTrade and not BFL, ergo wasn't being used for money laundering and I will leave this forum for good. I've already offered up the same proposal to SLok and Josh Zerlan, but so far they've opted to not take up the mantle, thus giving you the unique opportunity to outshine them two assholes. Deal? #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 01:33:55 AM LOL well now, that escalated quickly. Thanks for the bump. You're now on my radar! ;D Only kidding, bud. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 01:40:25 AM I have an excellent idea. Why don't you take the time to disprove that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA does indeed belong to HashTrade and not BFL, ergo wasn't being used for money laundering and I will leave this forum for good. I've already offered up the same proposal to SLok and Josh Zerlan, but so far they've opted to not take up the mantle, thus giving you the unique opportunity to outshine them two assholes. Deal? #ASKFTC Your an idiot. Why do I have to go around proving meaningless stuff to you? Your the one making unfounded allegations, prove your own stuff. You will find me a lot more agreeable that way. I particularly dislike how you mislead newbies with this stuff, how many people have gone away with the erroneous thoughts you have expressed in this thread. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 02:19:30 AM I have an excellent idea. Why don't you take the time to disprove that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA does indeed belong to HashTrade and not BFL, ergo wasn't being used for money laundering and I will leave this forum for good. I've already offered up the same proposal to SLok and Josh Zerlan, but so far they've opted to not take up the mantle, thus giving you the unique opportunity to outshine them two assholes. Deal? #ASKFTC Your an idiot. Why do I have to go around proving meaningless stuff to you? Your the one making unfounded allegations, prove your own stuff. You will find me a lot more agreeable that way. I particularly dislike how you mislead newbies with this stuff, how many people have gone away with the erroneous thoughts you have expressed in this thread. What the fuck are you talkin' 'bout? You dislike me misleading newbies with factual stuff, whatever the fuck that's suppose to mean, but you're 100% comfortable with BFL's actions to date. One of us is 100% fucked up in the head, and it ain't the dude penning this post. I've already proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA truly does belong to BFL and not HashTrade, with your and mine - OUR - peers more-or-less verifying such. http://s16.postimg.org/smfbkb9ut/BFL_Chip_Sales.jpg Sonny Vleisides' personal site, and not BFL's: https://web.archive.org/web/20130625050854/http://sonofodi.weebly.com/ It's also a 100% fact that the above was gleaned by Sonny Vleisides' site and the address depicted goes to the 1QAH... BWA that was misrepresented by HashTrade as paying BFL via BitPay $1M USD last October 21, 2013, for Monarchs that HashTrade stated in the press release would be available by the end of the year, 2103, and not 2014, now never, hence the FTC's actions. BTW, the house depicted is the one purchased by BFL of which Sonny Vleisides lives in. If this is not 100% factual, I will leave this forum and never return. I say that's pretty fuckin' good detective work stemming from a fool such as I, but sadly you've positioned yourself in the opposing camp, which makes everything you're involved in at risk. Of which to that I say makes you the fuckin' idiot for trying to paint me in some unfavorable light oppose to keeping your fuckin' trap shut or, at the very least, of which I kindly requested, engage in an intelligent debate, in which I would have easily backed down. That said, now about that threatening aspect you mentioned earlier that didn't occur. You can now safely assume that I'm threatening any endeavor you're involved in because you, my friend, are proving yourself untrustworthy due to the simple fact you have aligned yourself with the wrong crowd - BFL, et al. Again, well-played and genius! #ASKFTC PS: Where the fuck did you go? You were doing so well and almost had me and my newbie friends convinced that you were right and that I was wrong. SO FUCKIN' CLOSE, BUT NO CIGAR! Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 02:48:31 AM I have an excellent idea. Why don't you take the time to disprove that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA does indeed belong to HashTrade and not BFL, ergo wasn't being used for money laundering and I will leave this forum for good. I've already offered up the same proposal to SLok and Josh Zerlan, but so far they've opted to not take up the mantle, thus giving you the unique opportunity to outshine them two assholes. Deal? #ASKFTC Your an idiot. Why do I have to go around proving meaningless stuff to you? Your the one making unfounded allegations, prove your own stuff. You will find me a lot more agreeable that way. I particularly dislike how you mislead newbies with this stuff, how many people have gone away with the erroneous thoughts you have expressed in this thread. What the fuck are you talkin' 'bout? You dislike me misleading newbies with factual stuff, whatever the fuck that's suppose to mean, but you're 100% comfortable with BFL's actions to date. One of us is 100% fucked up in the head, and it ain't the dude penning this post. I've already proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA truly does belong to BFL and not HashTrade, with your and mine - OUR - peers more-or-less verifying such. http://s16.postimg.org/smfbkb9ut/BFL_Chip_Sales.jpg Sonny Vleisides' personal site, and not BFL's: https://web.archive.org/web/20130625050854/http://sonofodi.weebly.com/ It's also a 100% fact that the above was gleaned by Sonny Vleisides' site and the address depicted goes to the 1QAH... BWA that was misrepresented by HashTrade as paying BFL via BitPay $1M USD last October 21, 2013, for Monarchs that HashTrade stated in the press release would be available by the end of the year, 2103, and not 2014, now never, hence the FTC's actions. BTW, the house depicted is the one purchased by BFL of which Sonny Vleisides lives in. If this is not 100% factual, I will leave this forum and never return. I say that's pretty fuckin' good detective work stemming from a fool such as I, but sadly you've positioned yourself in the opposing camp, which makes everything you're involved in at risk. Of which to that I say makes you the fuckin' idiot for trying to paint me in some unfavorable light oppose to keeping your fuckin' trap shut or, at the very least, of which I kindly requested, engage in an intelligent debate, in which I would have easily backed down. That said, now about that threatening aspect you mentioned earlier that didn't occur. You can now safely assume that I'm threatening any endeavor you're involved in because you, my friend, are proving yourself untrustworthy due to the simple fact you have aligned yourself with the wrong crowd - BFL, et al. Again, well-played and genius! #ASKFTC PS: Where the fuck did you go? You were doing so well and almost had me and my newbie friends convinced that you were right and that I was wrong. SO FUCKIN' CLOSE, BUT NO CIGAR! You haven't proved squat, all you have is a circumstantial chain of hearsay. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 02:57:39 AM I have an excellent idea. Why don't you take the time to disprove that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA does indeed belong to HashTrade and not BFL, ergo wasn't being used for money laundering and I will leave this forum for good. I've already offered up the same proposal to SLok and Josh Zerlan, but so far they've opted to not take up the mantle, thus giving you the unique opportunity to outshine them two assholes. Deal? #ASKFTC Your an idiot. Why do I have to go around proving meaningless stuff to you? Your the one making unfounded allegations, prove your own stuff. You will find me a lot more agreeable that way. I particularly dislike how you mislead newbies with this stuff, how many people have gone away with the erroneous thoughts you have expressed in this thread. What the fuck are you talkin' 'bout? You dislike me misleading newbies with factual stuff, whatever the fuck that's suppose to mean, but you're 100% comfortable with BFL's actions to date. One of us is 100% fucked up in the head, and it ain't the dude penning this post. I've already proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA truly does belong to BFL and not HashTrade, with your and mine - OUR - peers more-or-less verifying such. http://s16.postimg.org/smfbkb9ut/BFL_Chip_Sales.jpg Sonny Vleisides' personal site, and not BFL's: https://web.archive.org/web/20130625050854/http://sonofodi.weebly.com/ It's also a 100% fact that the above was gleaned by Sonny Vleisides' site and the address depicted goes to the 1QAH... BWA that was misrepresented by HashTrade as paying BFL via BitPay $1M USD last October 21, 2013, for Monarchs that HashTrade stated in the press release would be available by the end of the year, 2103, and not 2014, now never, hence the FTC's actions. BTW, the house depicted is the one purchased by BFL of which Sonny Vleisides lives in. If this is not 100% factual, I will leave this forum and never return. I say that's pretty fuckin' good detective work stemming from a fool such as I, but sadly you've positioned yourself in the opposing camp, which makes everything you're involved in at risk. Of which to that I say makes you the fuckin' idiot for trying to paint me in some unfavorable light oppose to keeping your fuckin' trap shut or, at the very least, of which I kindly requested, engage in an intelligent debate, in which I would have easily backed down. That said, now about that threatening aspect you mentioned earlier that didn't occur. You can now safely assume that I'm threatening any endeavor you're involved in because you, my friend, are proving yourself untrustworthy due to the simple fact you have aligned yourself with the wrong crowd - BFL, et al. Again, well-played and genius! #ASKFTC PS: Where the fuck did you go? You were doing so well and almost had me and my newbie friends convinced that you were right and that I was wrong. SO FUCKIN' CLOSE, BUT NO CIGAR! You haven't proved squat, all you have is a circumstantial chain of hearsay. http://sonnyvleisides.wordpress.com/author/sonofodi/ Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 03:04:50 AM You haven't proved squat, all you have is a circumstantial chain of hearsay. http://sonnyvleisides.wordpress.com/author/sonofodi/ I could make a wordpress site saying that Obama was the man on the moon. Would you believe me? Fool Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 03:08:06 AM I have an excellent idea. Why don't you take the time to disprove that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA does indeed belong to HashTrade and not BFL, ergo wasn't being used for money laundering and I will leave this forum for good. I've already offered up the same proposal to SLok and Josh Zerlan, but so far they've opted to not take up the mantle, thus giving you the unique opportunity to outshine them two assholes. Deal? #ASKFTC Your an idiot. Why do I have to go around proving meaningless stuff to you? Your the one making unfounded allegations, prove your own stuff. You will find me a lot more agreeable that way. I particularly dislike how you mislead newbies with this stuff, how many people have gone away with the erroneous thoughts you have expressed in this thread. What the fuck are you talkin' 'bout? You dislike me misleading newbies with factual stuff, whatever the fuck that's suppose to mean, but you're 100% comfortable with BFL's actions to date. One of us is 100% fucked up in the head, and it ain't the dude penning this post. I've already proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA truly does belong to BFL and not HashTrade, with your and mine - OUR - peers more-or-less verifying such. http://s16.postimg.org/smfbkb9ut/BFL_Chip_Sales.jpg Sonny Vleisides' personal site, and not BFL's: https://web.archive.org/web/20130625050854/http://sonofodi.weebly.com/ It's also a 100% fact that the above was gleaned by Sonny Vleisides' site and the address depicted goes to the 1QAH... BWA that was misrepresented by HashTrade as paying BFL via BitPay $1M USD last October 21, 2013, for Monarchs that HashTrade stated in the press release would be available by the end of the year, 2103, and not 2014, now never, hence the FTC's actions. BTW, the house depicted is the one purchased by BFL of which Sonny Vleisides lives in. If this is not 100% factual, I will leave this forum and never return. I say that's pretty fuckin' good detective work stemming from a fool such as I, but sadly you've positioned yourself in the opposing camp, which makes everything you're involved in at risk. Of which to that I say makes you the fuckin' idiot for trying to paint me in some unfavorable light oppose to keeping your fuckin' trap shut or, at the very least, of which I kindly requested, engage in an intelligent debate, in which I would have easily backed down. That said, now about that threatening aspect you mentioned earlier that didn't occur. You can now safely assume that I'm threatening any endeavor you're involved in because you, my friend, are proving yourself untrustworthy due to the simple fact you have aligned yourself with the wrong crowd - BFL, et al. Again, well-played and genius! #ASKFTC PS: Where the fuck did you go? You were doing so well and almost had me and my newbie friends convinced that you were right and that I was wrong. SO FUCKIN' CLOSE, BUT NO CIGAR! You haven't proved squat, all you have is a circumstantial chain of hearsay. http://hotornot.com/sonofodi http://s14.postimg.org/xu1qtm2bl/sonofodi.jpg Sonofabitch, you proved me wrong again. I've mistaken blue berries for blueberries (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_bEXeTwrC8). Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Argwai96 on November 02, 2014, 03:13:11 AM They are essentially a one way exchange in that anyone can open a merchant services account with bitpay, the customer can price something at the amount of bitcoin they wish to sell, then use their own bitcoin to pay for the sale. This would be very similar to how a merchant could potentially swipe their own credit card at their own CC terminal Again, BitPay is not an exchange. They can ONLY process payments for customers that purchase a product or service off a website, et al. They can not convert BTC to fiat for you or me or even BFL, especially a million dollars worth week after week after week... which is exactly what BFL did just prior to them getting raided on September 19th. To date, I've uncovered no less than $10M USD that BFL converted to fiat that was deposited into some bank controlled by BFL. BitPay may be able to explain away last year's $1M USD supposedly from HashTrade - which it wasn't - but that's it. Hell, I'm staring at ~$4M USD missing in only a 30 day period from BFL's coffer. I'm sure so is the IRS and the FBI and the FTC and probably now the CIA, SEC, AAA and NASA (maybe not AAA). BF Labs Inc. has no idea what cans of worms they've opened up due to Sonny, et al.'s, actions. Yet, Josh came here today and tried to quell nerves about BFL's EMC, of which WILL soon be shut down thanks to their former actions. #ASKFTC EDIT: This would probably actually be a good thing considering that the bank accounts that BFL controls are under the control of the FTC receiver now, while it would be impossible/difficult to be able to control all the private keys of BFL with any amount of certainty To address what's in bold, BitPay could've easily surmised that something's afoot when weekly purchases(?) were made from BFL in nice round BTC figures, unlike most all other purchases in the past, with the exception of the infamous $1M USD from HashTrade that BFL would have had to let BitPay know what it was for otherwise BitPay wouldn't have been able to release the press release espousing such. Only BitPay and BFL know for sure that the same bank - Harris - was used for all those ~million-dollar transactions. #ASKFTC I would also repeat my previous statement.....it is better for BFL to have more money in fiat then BTC as it is much easier for the FTC to seize BFL's bank accounts then it is to seize BFL's private keys Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 03:19:28 AM You haven't proved squat, all you have is a circumstantial chain of hearsay. http://sonnyvleisides.wordpress.com/author/sonofodi/ I could make a wordpress site saying that Obama was the man on the moon. Would you believe me? Fool Looks to me you're the fool, for each time you bump this post once with your foolish posts, I get to bump it twice to prove you wrong, thus creating a much larger thread for the media, IRS, FTC, SEC, FBI, NSA, NES, AAA, NCAA, and NASA to sink their teeth into. Just to keep the context right, and note I'm not in any sense defending BFL in the following; it's just the facts. In disclosure, I'd rather piss on my Mother's grave than defend the business that they've run. There hasn't been a conviction, there hasn't been a trial, there haven't been any arrests. BFL is under a court order that has allowed the FTC to freeze the business, to seize the books, records, and computers, to obtain detailed financial disclosures by BFL and the three named officers, and to interview and take depositions from employees and others. Much of that will be under penalties of perjury. The Court has appointed a Temporary Receiver. He's a lawyer, but he answers to the Judge. His job now, basically, will be to assemble experts to follow the money. From the time a pre-order came in, to the time that money left BFL without the order having been fulfilled, they'll try to track where it all went, and to whom it went. Part of following the money will be following the machines from the time they were assembled to the time they were shipped to customers, if ever. BFL gets a day in court next Monday to try to have the order set aside and try to not have all that analysis and digging happen. The details of the various orders are all in this document, which I think is different than the one which CoinFire has shown, that being the FTC's pleading to the Judge to grant this order, unknown to BFL (that's Ex Parte) . http://www.ftc.gov/system/files/documents/cases/140923utterflylabstro.pdf This is, almost certainly, exactly the document that Techknowledgy asserted that he possessed on Friday (a 33 page, Sealed, Ex Parte order). His information was spot on, and I'd say his sources are sound. You bastard! More fuckin' shit I now have to read. Fine! Have it your way. But, tit-for-tat you have to read what took me 5+ hours to pen the other night. http://s16.postimg.org/smfbkb9ut/BFL_Chip_Sales.jpg Sonny Vleisides' personal site, and not BFL's: https://web.archive.org/web/20130625050854/http://sonofodi.weebly.com/ According to https://www.blocktrail.com/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ, Sonny Vleisides' bitcoin wallet address - 1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ - used to garner sales for bitcoin miner chips didn't pay any mining fees as shown below: http://s9.postimg.org/4bixaoadr/sonny_chip_sale_wallet.jpg Yet, with one of my old wallets I doled out 0.0035 BTC for the privilege of sending a lot less fewer bitcoins... http://s2.postimg.org/3swksoju1/my_fees.jpg The following is all four transactions for the 1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ address used by Sonny Vleisides for the supposed sale of bitcoin mining ASIC chips - https://blockchain.info/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3876/15283090026_7a2da40d39_b.jpg https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3914/15328900075_48e9749615_b.jpg All the bitcoins that flowed to 1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ (BFL's or Sonny Vleisides' personal account) went to 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) shown above, including the scant amount - 0.01001691 BTC - from 17HSPT3bhYE1rhrwAhi8k6GCGGXRdQimY7 (https://blockchain.info/address/17HSPT3bhYE1rhrwAhi8k6GCGGXRdQimY7) and the 59.9273 BTC from 1DiPE4TnBczmPVoy53tffrd1iNPq87B3PB (https://blockchain.info/address/1DiPE4TnBczmPVoy53tffrd1iNPq87B3PB), the latter seen here: https://blockchain.info/tx/827063279c43c50c3f4c690dbf491071386d80068115f48d0beee7e80b4c7f2f. Revisiting the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs?offset=50&filter=0) bitcoin wallet address, the following image depicts 0 BTC tx fees paid when HashTrade supposedly paid BFL via BitPay that infamous million-dollar down payment for their multi-million dollar order of Monarchs as the press release reveals here: http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/10/prweb11283333.htm. Quote BF Labs, Inc. Processes $1 Million Bitcoin Merchant Transaction for Institutional Bitcoin Mining Hardware Purchase Butterfly Labs Announces $1 Million Down-Payment on Multi-Million Dollar Order for Next Generation Bitcoin Mining Hardware. Deposit will help enable production of innovative 28nm Monarch card. <the following image gleaned from https://blockchain.info/tx/1b6ea350c094071412df1f801651263fd65ffa0b89ad6c8626ceeca8755f50bc> https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5576/15329065265_77561a2683_b.jpg According to the press release (http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/10/prweb11283333.htm), the $1M USD that HashTrade supposedly paid BFL stemming from 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs?offset=50&filter=0) was paid to BitPay's wallet address 16fus1FKurpDmPtEZLGbg7vRYtH2TEFbYf (https://blockchain.info/address/16fus1FKurpDmPtEZLGbg7vRYtH2TEFbYf). ONLY 16 hours later, that same $1M USD equaling 5,562.354 BTC had 437.646 BTC added to it, and a new wallet - 1EXDF4fvjRozJ96TjF4SPN7rbTx2ik6Dsd (https://blockchain.info/address/1EXDF4fvjRozJ96TjF4SPN7rbTx2ik6Dsd) - was created to store 6,000 BTC that has been untouched to this very day, as seen here: https://blockchain.info/tx/ff0fb375a2375b2b9ee7e8daa5759085d8fe8cd85280a97b1dfbb14005f36153, and further illustrated with... https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3897/15326689271_5776c04c80_b.jpg Again, nary a tx fee was paid to the miners, proof with the following: https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3898/15142862698_bf9e98119c_b.jpg Note the confirmation time: Only ~11 minutes to get the tx confirmed with nary a fee. I say that's an impossibility for HashTrade to transfer a million dollars worth of BTC to BFL via BitPay if they do indeed maintain the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs?offset=50&filter=0) bitcoin wallet address, of which I'm 100% confident they DO NOT! BFL/Sonny Vleisides owns the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs?offset=50&filter=0) bitcoin wallet address, as well as the 1EXDF4fvjRozJ96TjF4SPN7rbTx2ik6Dsd (https://blockchain.info/address/1EXDF4fvjRozJ96TjF4SPN7rbTx2ik6Dsd) BWA, for all the bitcoins that make up the 437.646 BTC to round the wallet up to 6,000 BTC also stemmed from BFL. BitPay may very well control the 16fus1FKurpDmPtEZLGbg7vRYtH2TEFbYf (https://blockchain.info/address/16fus1FKurpDmPtEZLGbg7vRYtH2TEFbYf) BWA used to funnel the infamous $1M USD from supposedly HashTrade to BFL, but, again, I contend that said funds were redirected back to BFL's control via parameters they set on their BitPay account. The only thing that puzzles me now is how if BitPay was used as the payment service provider for the $1M USD transaction, why were no tx fees accrued? To recap... Sonny Vleisides owned the 1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ BWA. Thousands of transactions from BFL ended up going to 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs?offset=50&filter=0). 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs?offset=50&filter=0) was claimed to be owned by HashTrade to pay the $1M USD down payment for BFL Monarchs. The $1M USD payment from 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs?offset=50&filter=0) plus other transactions stemming from BFL totally 6,000 BTC went to the 1EXDF4fvjRozJ96TjF4SPN7rbTx2ik6Dsd (https://blockchain.info/address/1EXDF4fvjRozJ96TjF4SPN7rbTx2ik6Dsd) BWA after one hop, supposedly BitPay's BWA 16fus1FKurpDmPtEZLGbg7vRYtH2TEFbYf (https://blockchain.info/address/16fus1FKurpDmPtEZLGbg7vRYtH2TEFbYf). http://www.hashtrade.com/about.html Quote CoinWare (http://www.coinware.io/) and HashTrade have received substantial venture capital investment from the Jacobson Brothers, in order to help establish these emerging businesses, ensure that they have a strong foundation and secure all the capital equipment necessary to deliver the data processing services that the different business models require. The Jacobson brothers own the Canadian Bitcoin Embassy and the Miami Bitcoin Embassy, both entities that the Bitcoin Development Fund (http://www.bitcoindf.org/) donated 25 BTC to, of which they, too, have yet to liquidate as seen here: https://blockchain.info/address/1LAT5Zzf12cZqDy86ee2mcWhNZpk9DLf1D. Furthermore, I can easily show other BFL moneys flowing to this very address, not to mention from pools closely aligned with BFL. All that said, which Bitcoin-themed periodical is going to be the first to publish this revelation? And, why haven't nary a one uncovered any of this before? ~Bruno Kucinskas All the above was centered around the BWA 1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ (https://blockchain.info/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ) that some unknown person included on some mundane website that had nothing to do with Sonny Vleisides even though it's his house that BFL purchased that's included on said site probably snapped by some intruder to frame poor ol' Sonny. It saddens me that I'm a fool and you're the genius. Look forward to your reply so that I can post twice more, thus bumping this thread three times. I'm sure Josh and Sonny and Jeff and BitPay will be thanking your for your genius efforts. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 03:24:18 AM Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then?
Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit. You are a fool Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 03:44:14 AM They are essentially a one way exchange in that anyone can open a merchant services account with bitpay, the customer can price something at the amount of bitcoin they wish to sell, then use their own bitcoin to pay for the sale. This would be very similar to how a merchant could potentially swipe their own credit card at their own CC terminal Again, BitPay is not an exchange. They can ONLY process payments for customers that purchase a product or service off a website, et al. They can not convert BTC to fiat for you or me or even BFL, especially a million dollars worth week after week after week... which is exactly what BFL did just prior to them getting raided on September 19th. To date, I've uncovered no less than $10M USD that BFL converted to fiat that was deposited into some bank controlled by BFL. BitPay may be able to explain away last year's $1M USD supposedly from HashTrade - which it wasn't - but that's it. Hell, I'm staring at ~$4M USD missing in only a 30 day period from BFL's coffer. I'm sure so is the IRS and the FBI and the FTC and probably now the CIA, SEC, AAA and NASA (maybe not AAA). BF Labs Inc. has no idea what cans of worms they've opened up due to Sonny, et al.'s, actions. Yet, Josh came here today and tried to quell nerves about BFL's EMC, of which WILL soon be shut down thanks to their former actions. #ASKFTC EDIT: This would probably actually be a good thing considering that the bank accounts that BFL controls are under the control of the FTC receiver now, while it would be impossible/difficult to be able to control all the private keys of BFL with any amount of certainty To address what's in bold, BitPay could've easily surmised that something's afoot when weekly purchases(?) were made from BFL in nice round BTC figures, unlike most all other purchases in the past, with the exception of the infamous $1M USD from HashTrade that BFL would have had to let BitPay know what it was for otherwise BitPay wouldn't have been able to release the press release espousing such. Only BitPay and BFL know for sure that the same bank - Harris - was used for all those ~million-dollar transactions. #ASKFTC I would also repeat my previous statement.....it is better for BFL to have more money in fiat then BTC as it is much easier for the FTC to seize BFL's bank accounts then it is to seize BFL's private keys Sadly, MineForeman.com can't take lessons from you as to how a discussion, especially of this sensitivity, should be pursued. Prior to the following transaction amounts from BFL to Bitpay... $671,385 $1,188,650 $1,219,950 $765,780 $1,206,606 $496,000 $293,032 ...there were very little normal sales of products. Prior to that lull were an influx of Monarch orders with at least one $1M USD sale that was supposedly from HashTrade, of which was not. In approximately a 30-day period, BFL cashed out ~$5,841,403 USD that BitPay had to convert to fiat and deposit in some BFL bank(s). Surely, with all the eyeballs looking at this at BitPays office, red flags would have been the order of the day, for they would be putting their venerable brand at risk if they simply ignored it. The FTC saw it clear as day, hence now have control of BFL's https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs bitcoin wallet address, hence it ceasing to conduct BTC transactions witnessed now on the block chain. This is a fact, hence Josh not coming here to dispute it. Said fact can easily be disputed within minutes, and I'll even tell you how. Josh simply calls up Greg Bachrach and have him declare that he's going to move X BTC - any amount - outta his HashTrade wallet at Y time. Once done, it will prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that I was gravely mistaken and will leave this forum to never return. Luckily, for me, such simple act hasn't and won't occur, for it hasn't happened in the past three weeks. Why? Again, because the FTC has 100% control of HashTrade's wallet. The FTC is such an asshole for stopping HashTrade's business that I'm currently beside myself, for they're the good guys and the FTC should've only directed their efforts toward BFL. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 03:48:05 AM Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then? Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit. You are a fool This thread is the evidence that WILL be presented in front of a judge thanks to Sonny Vleisides' money laundering practices. They'll also be looking into Jeff Ownby's ~100 online casinos, some of which accept bitcoins, of which some of those have had threads penned about them thanks to Jeff Ownby stealing from fellow bitcoiners. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 04:01:01 AM Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then? Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit. You are a fool http://s9.postimg.org/g92j7hgjz/Miner_Foreman.jpg Obviously, I'm trying to help a situation that you, yourself, contributed to. You witnessed how the community tore Bruce Peterson a new asshole thanks to his continuing to embrace BFL, and he's just a minion. Image what could possibly happen to your brand if you continue on the same path. Your call! #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 04:34:19 AM Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then? Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit. You are a fool Again, this fool shows that Sonny Vleisides was pretending that BTC was garnered from the sale of chips using https://blockchain.info/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ as seen here https://blockchain.info/tx/ce1000c2b32d26f472730d9e6e0c92da946c7beda8e7bdbe654194ea4925f49d, using said address to wash what was mined on EMC. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 04:47:16 AM Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then? Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit. You are a fool Again, this fool shows that Sonny Vleisides was pretending that BTC was garnered from the sale of chips using https://blockchain.info/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ as seen here https://blockchain.info/tx/ce1000c2b32d26f472730d9e6e0c92da946c7beda8e7bdbe654194ea4925f49d, using said address to wash what was mined on EMC. #ASKFTC Even if I accept your circumstantial evidence so what? Coins being tainted by others is not evidence of squat. It is laughable that you have found a taint from a mining pool and you think that proves something. All coins have to get mined somewhere, and what has this to do with bitpay? More taints. You know, I used to think you were an alright guy before you went on your current crusade of accusing anyone of anything on the flimsiest evidence creating misleading threads with bullshit titles. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 04:51:39 AM Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then? Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit. You are a fool Again, this fool shows that Sonny Vleisides was pretending that BTC was garnered from the sale of chips using https://blockchain.info/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ as seen here https://blockchain.info/tx/ce1000c2b32d26f472730d9e6e0c92da946c7beda8e7bdbe654194ea4925f49d, using said address to wash what was mined on EMC. #ASKFTC Even if I accept your circumstantial evidence so what? Coins being tainted by others is not evidence of squat. It is laughable that you have found a taint from a mining pool and you think that proves something. All coins have to get mined somewhere, and what has this to do with bitpay? More taints. You know, I used to think you were an alright guy before you went on your current crusade of accusing anyone of anything on the flimsiest evidence creating misleading threads with bullshit titles. Flimsiest? I thought I did a pretty damn good job connecting the dots, thus you're the only real one negating my findings. Hell, the court records even showed that the https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs BWA belonged to BFL, hence it now being under their control, and even verified to at least two bitcoiners on this forum. How much more proof do I need to show? #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 04:59:33 AM Hell, the court records even showed that the https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs BWA belonged to BFL, hence it now being under their control, and even verified to at least two bitcoiners on this forum. How much more proof do I need to show? #ASKFTC SO WHAT? Even if you get a court to accept something that was posted on a wordpress site that was deleted after being captured by a third party that uses the same username of someone on a social dating site that has used a photo that is used by someone else on a site saying it was someone? (Flimsiest defined). That proves that BFL used bitcoins for chip sales.... uhhh Idiot Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 05:04:44 AM Hell, the court records even showed that the https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs BWA belonged to BFL, hence it now being under their control, and even verified to at least two bitcoiners on this forum. How much more proof do I need to show? #ASKFTC SO WHAT? Even if you get a court to accept something that was posted on a wordpress site that was deleted after being captured by a third party that uses the same username of someone on a social dating site that has used a photo that is used by someone else on a site saying it was someone? (Flimsiest defined). That proves that BFL used bitcoins for chip sales.... uhhh Idiot You forgot the part where the chips were paid for with BTC directly from mined coins via EMC's BWA, albeit a tad flimsy, but I'm asking for a tad of latitude here. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 05:14:58 AM You forgot the part where the chips were paid for with BTC directly from mined coins via EMC's BWA, albeit a tad flimsy, but I'm asking for a tad of latitude here. #ASKFTC Great! Join up two flimsy bits of evidence and we have a REALLY flimsy "fact". You have built a case on bullshit, why should anyone give you latitude? While accusing people may be an amusing hobby of yours have you ever thought that it could cause damage to real people? Newbies are reading this shit and may believe what you have to say. I am not defending anyone else, but you're just making shit up. Truth is probably the victim I am most interested in defending. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 05:24:35 AM You forgot the part where the chips were paid for with BTC directly from mined coins via EMC's BWA, albeit a tad flimsy, but I'm asking for a tad of latitude here. #ASKFTC Great! Join up two flimsy bits of evidence and we have a REALLY flimsy "fact". You have built a case on bullshit, why should anyone give you latitude? While accusing people may be an amusing hobby of yours have you ever thought that it could cause damage to real people? Newbies are reading this shit and may believe what you have to say. I am not defending anyone else, but you're just making shit up. Truth is probably the victim I am most interested in defending. Asking for latitude was sarcasm attached to a fact and not to flimsy evidence. And, seriously, you don't honestly believe that I'm trying to harm newbies do you, for that the furthest from the truth? THIS AIN'T NO MOTHERFUCKIN' HOBBY OF MINE! BTW, this 1QAH... BWA episode started over a year ago, and BitPay had yet to denounce it after several attempts, even Tony going outta his way to purposely avoid me not once, not twice, but three times when I approached him at the Chicago conference. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 02, 2014, 05:54:45 AM And, seriously, you don't honestly believe that I'm trying to harm newbies do you, for that the furthest from the truth? Yes, people come to this forum to learn and you fill them up with your bullshit. THIS AIN'T NO MOTHERFUCKIN' HOBBY OF MINE! You love the attention, you thank people for posting in your threads because it brings them to the top again, your a total attention hore and accusing people of stuff gets you the most attention at the moment... so here we are. BTW, this 1QAH... BWA episode started over a year ago, and BitPay had yet to denounce it after several attempts, even Tony going outta his way to purposely avoid me not once, not twice, but three times when I approached him at the Chicago conference. He was running away from you because you're a kook! You make shit up and blast it out to as many people as possible to make yourself feel wanted. Reality is, you're a joke. Seriously, when bitcoin's get together the start conversations with "Did you hear the latest shit Phinnius is spouting" (Happened to me more than once). I apologize for being so harsh, but this shit has to stop. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 06:06:33 AM And, seriously, you don't honestly believe that I'm trying to harm newbies do you, for that the furthest from the truth? Yes, people come to this forum to learn and you fill them up with your bullshit. THIS AIN'T NO MOTHERFUCKIN' HOBBY OF MINE! You love the attention, you thank people for posting in your threads because it brings them to the top again, your a total attention hore and accusing people of stuff gets you the most attention at the moment... so here we are. BTW, this 1QAH... BWA episode started over a year ago, and BitPay had yet to denounce it after several attempts, even Tony going outta his way to purposely avoid me not once, not twice, but three times when I approached him at the Chicago conference. He was running away from you because you're a kook! You make shit up and blast it out to as many people as possible to make yourself feel wanted. Reality is, you're a joke. Seriously, when bitcoin's get together the start conversations with "Did you hear the latest shit Phinnius is spouting" (Happened to me more than once). I apologize for being so harsh, but this shit has to stop. Seriously, no apology needed in that regard, for I fully expect that such occurs on a regular basis. It doesn't take much to stop this kook from claiming that this particular episode is false. A simple transfer from HashTrade would suffice. But, like I've stated, such is impossible now because the FTC has control of the wallet. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: QuestionAuthority on November 02, 2014, 07:10:09 AM Bruno, BitPay isn't and never has been an exchange. They are more like "Bitcoin power of attorney" than an exchange. A merchant authorizes BitPay to trade at an exchange on the merchants behalf and BitPay locks in an exchange rate at time of sale and deposits the fiat into the merchants account. I don't think it matters how much BFL used BitPay as long as BitPay reported per the AML/KYC law.
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 07:53:22 AM Bruno, BitPay isn't and never has been an exchange. They are more like "Bitcoin power of attorney" than an exchange. A merchant authorizes BitPay to trade at an exchange on the merchants behalf and BitPay locks in an exchange rate at time of sale and deposits the fiat into the merchants account. I don't think it matters how much BFL used BitPay as long as BitPay reported per the AML/KYC law. This thread was sparked by the following post: Quote I'm too lazy to figure out what you are ranting and raving about this time, but I don't see why BFL selling bitcoins to Bitpay would be considered illegal or fraudulent. Merchants exchange bitcoins to fiat through Bitpay all the time. Why can't BFL? Those TOS that you quoted may apply to you, but they don't have to apply to everyone. Here we have a seasoned Bitcoiner, odolvlobo, not seeing why BFL SELLING BTC to BitPay for fiat would be considered illegal, claiming to be too lazy as to figure out what I'm ranting and raving about. Hence this thread, to show him and the rest of the world that what took place on a grand scale was indeed illegal, and it all started virtually exactly a year ago when BitPay first put out the press release depicting that HashTrade paid BFL $1M USD for Monarchs using BitPay, in turn BitPay deposited $1M USD into BFL's bank account. The bitcoin wallet address that was used per documents that BitPay, themselves, indirectly depicted was https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs as seen in the following press release: BF Labs, Inc. Processes $1 Million Bitcoin Merchant Transaction for Institutional Bitcoin Mining Hardware Purchase (http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/10/prweb11283333.htm). BFL's Jeff Ownby following up BitPay's press release with one of his own. The https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs bitcoin wallet address was created and used prior to HashTrade ever having a web presence and is mostly funded from EMC's bitcoin wallet addresses directly and indirectly, ergo it truly belongs to BFL and not HashTrade. The maneuver was probably orchestrate by BFL to launder their ill-gotten gains from mining bitcoins using their customer's miners as can easily be shown. The PR stunt was designed solely to liquidate said BTC to fiat deposited into BFL's bank account to be extracted ASAP as the FTC has declared and shown as proof that that was exactly what BFL did. In fact, BFL was in the process of liquidating the rest of the BTC in the 1QAH wallet successfully converting $5M+ prior to the raid. Unfortunately, there was ONLY $1.2M USD left in the Harris bank account when the FTC finally was able to freeze it with a court order. Over $5M USD was also converted to fiat via different wallet addresses. BitPay was 100% privy to the supposed HashTrade deal last year, for they're the ones that released the first press release, not BFL, for BFL's Jeff Ownby is on record in stating that they wished BitPay had not jumped the gun, but no damage was done in that regard in his eyes, thus a moot issue. TAINT has nothing to do with what I've uncovered and presented in this thread as proof that something illegal on a grand scale transpired that involves BitPay and BFL, thanks to the latter's money laundering attempts with some success, again halted by the FTC so that BFL's customer base may be able to get some of there monies back. BFL's EMC should be shut down as well, for very few, if any, regular customers are using that free service 100% overseen by Josh Zerlan. I contend that those who are mining there now are BFL's industrial clients and BFL themselves, at the very least over 90% of the 2,000+ miners currently using the EMC pool. Further, EMC was using Dwolla to convert to fiat when its customers opted for such. It'll be interesting to find out if EMC was using BFL's name or Josh Zerlan's, since EMC customers were under the impression that Josh was the owner and not BFL all the way up to the spring of this year. If in Josh's name, then there's another issue that BFL will have to contend with thanks to KYC laws. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Lethn on November 02, 2014, 08:35:51 AM Nevermind, topic creation is working as normal now.
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: belk on November 02, 2014, 12:20:52 PM Yeah! Congratulations to Bitpay! In the next few weeks or months, another payment provider will crossover to an exchange.
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 04:45:32 PM Yeah! Congratulations to Bitpay! In the next few weeks or months, another payment provider will crossover to an exchange. BFL could've easily used BitStamp to accomplish the same thing they used BitPay for, for BitPay uses BitStamp, among others, to reverse its position, viz. replenish fiat in their bank account. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 06:09:06 PM Honestly, I don't know what I was thinking. It's not like BFL committed the crime of the century or anything. It's not like they would use one of their own employees and pawn him off as a homeless US vet.
To be clear, the foolishness above has nothing to do with the foolishness below, for I'm just a dude that doesn't have any fuckin' idea what I'm doing as I sit on this toilet taking a shit, hoping that my drama queen efforts will garner friendships from the Bitcoin community, all the while the FTC is fucking with the venerable BF Labs Inc. Perhaps he's suffering from PTSD. I don't know his service history so I don't know if it's likely or not. It doesn't excuse his behavior but could explain a lot though. I highly doubt that the "company guns" are the only ones he owns. Especially if he fells he needs them for protection. It is a convenient excuse though to buy some toys on the company's dime. Simply ask, and I'll supply a screenshot of his service history. For real! Nah, despite the situation I wouldn't want his military dox out unless he wanted them out. I wouldn't want mine just floating around even though I've got nothing to hide. More so because there are tons of military fakers out there who might do nefarious things like try to use the info to pretend to be a vet. Now, besides that I'll not try to convince you to hold back on anything you have. Your a fount of info with no reason I can see to be plugged. Asked. (As I have been in a war two times [Yugoslavia '91 & '94] and most people I know - especially those suffering PTSD - are honest, honorable people...) With apologies, for I'm now having difficulties relocating it, for Josh Zerlan has opted to lock down the files. Luckily, some were saved via the WBM: http://web.archive.org/web/20140905062309/http://www.communityhosting.net/ih/images/ Like this harmless file depicting a homeless vet, we'll call him John, mutruxing for bitcoin donations in some city, let's call it Kansas City because the word City is in it, taken by somebody handy with a camera, most likely a woman who also acts as an assistant to some photographer, but I digress, for none of that has any relevance to the pic below. http://web.archive.org/web/20140905142424/http://www.communityhosting.net/ih/images/homelessbi.jpg http://web.archive.org/web/20140905142424/http://www.communityhosting.net/ih/images/homelessbi.jpg But, in the spirit of circumstantial evidence and that I'm a fool, decide for yourselves if the homeless vet depicted above is the same $26-per-hour employed individual below who just happens to live with his assistant that's handy with a camera and owns a chicken named Maude. http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-xaf1/v/t1.0-1/1795752_10202463185275338_1658226800_n.jpg?oh=d176d6f2bd016e93a0562c31012c6b43&oe=54744964&__gda__=1416236383_5f62f9ceb4ef9f8ed484e81cd6a8f84e https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQ8nDNfaNe8 http://s24.postimg.org/rb9q2azv9/John_Mutrux_kc.jpg Wouldn't it be ironic if honorably discharged vets, let's call them Jody and Josh, were depicting a non vet to garner bitcoin donations knowing full well that said homeless vet and the honorably discharged vets were all employed at the same multi-million dollar facility, each earning a comfortable wage? Fuck the ironic part! That would be simply sick, and I don't mean sick in the modern vernacular either. I mean FUCKIN' SICK! #ASKFTC PS: Apologies if this post made the blood boil of honorable servicemen worldwide, for that was my intent. If it didn't make your blood boil, then may I suggest grabbing the nearest puppy and flushing it down the toilet to start your wonderful day. If you can't find a puppy, then a kitty used as a piñata would suffice. What are the odds of it being somebody at Butterfly Labs Inc. being the one that first introduced this homeless vet to the world? https://www.facebook.com/ButterflyLabs/photos/pb.470018806363264.-2207520000.1409132865./527528890612255/?type=1 http://s29.postimg.org/yeyn8c8mf/mutrux_john.jpg Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 08:33:50 PM And, seriously, you don't honestly believe that I'm trying to harm newbies do you, for that the furthest from the truth? Yes, people come to this forum to learn and you fill them up with your bullshit. THIS AIN'T NO MOTHERFUCKIN' HOBBY OF MINE! You love the attention, you thank people for posting in your threads because it brings them to the top again, your a total attention hore and accusing people of stuff gets you the most attention at the moment... so here we are. BTW, this 1QAH... BWA episode started over a year ago, and BitPay had yet to denounce it after several attempts, even Tony going outta his way to purposely avoid me not once, not twice, but three times when I approached him at the Chicago conference. He was running away from you because you're a kook! You make shit up and blast it out to as many people as possible to make yourself feel wanted. Reality is, you're a joke. Seriously, when bitcoin's get together the start conversations with "Did you hear the latest shit Phinnius is spouting" (Happened to me more than once). I apologize for being so harsh, but this shit has to stop. Hey, bud, just wanted to show you some more circumstantial evidence I uncovered: http://web.archive.org/web/20140905142424/http://www.communityhosting.net/ih/images/homelessbi.jpg Okay, I used Google maps and traveled down all the interstates and believe I found the sign and light pole. Please, Jehovah, let me have this one right, for I want to save face with the Bitcoin community because my cred is in jep. Amen! http://s30.postimg.org/ykrkskca9/sign.jpg #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 02, 2014, 09:31:05 PM And, seriously, you don't honestly believe that I'm trying to harm newbies do you, for that the furthest from the truth? Yes, people come to this forum to learn and you fill them up with your bullshit. THIS AIN'T NO MOTHERFUCKIN' HOBBY OF MINE! You love the attention, you thank people for posting in your threads because it brings them to the top again, your a total attention hore and accusing people of stuff gets you the most attention at the moment... so here we are. BTW, this 1QAH... BWA episode started over a year ago, and BitPay had yet to denounce it after several attempts, even Tony going outta his way to purposely avoid me not once, not twice, but three times when I approached him at the Chicago conference. He was running away from you because you're a kook! You make shit up and blast it out to as many people as possible to make yourself feel wanted. Reality is, you're a joke. Seriously, when bitcoin's get together the start conversations with "Did you hear the latest shit Phinnius is spouting" (Happened to me more than once). I apologize for being so harsh, but this shit has to stop. Hey, Neil, look at some more circumstantial evidence I the kook uncovered: http://s7.postimg.org/3uea9vdhn/2507_Jefferson.jpg http://s2.postimg.org/y5d1ej6hl/2507.jpg http://s22.postimg.org/88pdp5rch/Jefferson_Studios.jpg Question: What are the odds of the person who administers BFL's Facebook page just happens to come across a homeless vet panhandling for bitcoin donations in front of BFL's former facility, coupled with the homeless vet resembling John Mutrux, the photographer, just like Christ Vleisides, Sonny's step-dad, who lives with Jody Drake and a chicken named Maude, and also works at BFL? Then again, just chalk this up as being once again circumstantial evidence dreamt up by a kook - me - trying to connect dots that are in no way related because I want attention for being a drama queen. Your call! #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: wunkbone on November 03, 2014, 12:08:27 AM Yeah! Congratulations to Bitpay! In the next few weeks or months, another payment provider will crossover to an exchange. BFL could've easily used BitStamp to accomplish the same thing they used BitPay for, for BitPay uses BitStamp, among others, to reverse its position, viz. replenish fiat in their bank account. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 03, 2014, 12:19:06 AM Yeah! Congratulations to Bitpay! In the next few weeks or months, another payment provider will crossover to an exchange. BFL could've easily used BitStamp to accomplish the same thing they used BitPay for, for BitPay uses BitStamp, among others, to reverse its position, viz. replenish fiat in their bank account. #ASKFTC BFL wouldn't have had any trouble opening an account with BitStamp. In fact, they would've welcomed it. But, since BFL already had a relationship with BitPay, they felt that they could just about get away with anything forgetting all about the open-ledger aspect of the blockchain. Hell, from what we're able to ascertain, it looks like BFL was constantly having accounting issues, so why introduce another payment provider into the mix to further fuck things up and having later to answer to Sonny's probation officer when (not if) Courtney N. Pierce requests documents. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: wunkbone on November 03, 2014, 01:22:17 AM Yeah! Congratulations to Bitpay! In the next few weeks or months, another payment provider will crossover to an exchange. BFL could've easily used BitStamp to accomplish the same thing they used BitPay for, for BitPay uses BitStamp, among others, to reverse its position, viz. replenish fiat in their bank account. #ASKFTC BFL wouldn't have had any trouble opening an account with BitStamp. In fact, they would've welcomed it. But, since BFL already had a relationship with BitPay, they felt that they could just about get away with anything forgetting all about the open-ledger aspect of the blockchain. Hell, from what we're able to ascertain, it looks like BFL was constantly having accounting issues, so why introduce another payment provider into the mix to further fuck things up and having later to answer to Sonny's probation officer when (not if) Courtney N. Pierce requests documents. #ASKFTC I think this question has been asked a few times above, but not answered; wouldn't you prefer that BFL's money be in fiat form instead of bitcoin form as fiat is much easier for the FTC to control then bitcoin? Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 03, 2014, 01:44:44 AM Yeah! Congratulations to Bitpay! In the next few weeks or months, another payment provider will crossover to an exchange. BFL could've easily used BitStamp to accomplish the same thing they used BitPay for, for BitPay uses BitStamp, among others, to reverse its position, viz. replenish fiat in their bank account. #ASKFTC BFL wouldn't have had any trouble opening an account with BitStamp. In fact, they would've welcomed it. But, since BFL already had a relationship with BitPay, they felt that they could just about get away with anything forgetting all about the open-ledger aspect of the blockchain. Hell, from what we're able to ascertain, it looks like BFL was constantly having accounting issues, so why introduce another payment provider into the mix to further fuck things up and having later to answer to Sonny's probation officer when (not if) Courtney N. Pierce requests documents. #ASKFTC I think this question has been asked a few times above, but not answered; wouldn't you prefer that BFL's money be in fiat form instead of bitcoin form as fiat is much easier for the FTC to control then bitcoin? To address your question, BFL converted $5M+ USD worth of BFC to fiat that was deposited into their bank account during an ~30-day time period prior to the raid on September 19, 2013 by the FTC, and when they got to BFL's Harris bank, ~80% of the cash was already gone, as in Pufffff!, hence the FTC taking action, for they were able to show a judge that that was the case, and that the bleeding had to stop ASAP. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Btcvilla on November 03, 2014, 01:52:44 AM Hopefully they wont pull a moolah :P .
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: YangBus on November 03, 2014, 01:53:10 AM You should be a dectetive....wait are you a detective?
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 03, 2014, 01:58:54 AM You should be a dectetive....wait are you a detective? I detect you're implying something. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=48022.msg573821#msg573821 http://s24.postimg.org/e62mjjod1/Psy_badge.jpg Psy didn't pass these badges out to everybody. In fact, I'm the only one who's gotten one. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 03, 2014, 02:01:09 AM Here's another 4800 BTC converted to fiat via BitPay using a different address that sneaked outta of BFL's Harris bank account: https://blockchain.info/address/15pZa4nTxGMcqjXUArPdjqJ162DoHCueMr
#ASKFTC http://www.walletexplorer.com/address/15pZa4nTxGMcqjXUArPdjqJ162DoHCueMr http://s12.postimg.org/n2x0tx3ql/15p.jpg Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: wunkbone on November 03, 2014, 03:11:57 AM Yeah! Congratulations to Bitpay! In the next few weeks or months, another payment provider will crossover to an exchange. BFL could've easily used BitStamp to accomplish the same thing they used BitPay for, for BitPay uses BitStamp, among others, to reverse its position, viz. replenish fiat in their bank account. #ASKFTC BFL wouldn't have had any trouble opening an account with BitStamp. In fact, they would've welcomed it. But, since BFL already had a relationship with BitPay, they felt that they could just about get away with anything forgetting all about the open-ledger aspect of the blockchain. Hell, from what we're able to ascertain, it looks like BFL was constantly having accounting issues, so why introduce another payment provider into the mix to further fuck things up and having later to answer to Sonny's probation officer when (not if) Courtney N. Pierce requests documents. #ASKFTC I think this question has been asked a few times above, but not answered; wouldn't you prefer that BFL's money be in fiat form instead of bitcoin form as fiat is much easier for the FTC to control then bitcoin? To address your question, BFL converted $5M+ USD worth of BFC to fiat that was deposited into their bank account during an ~30-day time period prior to the raid on September 19, 2013 by the FTC, and when they got to BFL's Harris bank, ~80% of the cash was already gone, as in Pufffff!, hence the FTC taking action, for they were able to show a judge that that was the case, and that the bleeding had to stop ASAP. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 03, 2014, 03:36:00 AM Yeah! Congratulations to Bitpay! In the next few weeks or months, another payment provider will crossover to an exchange. BFL could've easily used BitStamp to accomplish the same thing they used BitPay for, for BitPay uses BitStamp, among others, to reverse its position, viz. replenish fiat in their bank account. #ASKFTC BFL wouldn't have had any trouble opening an account with BitStamp. In fact, they would've welcomed it. But, since BFL already had a relationship with BitPay, they felt that they could just about get away with anything forgetting all about the open-ledger aspect of the blockchain. Hell, from what we're able to ascertain, it looks like BFL was constantly having accounting issues, so why introduce another payment provider into the mix to further fuck things up and having later to answer to Sonny's probation officer when (not if) Courtney N. Pierce requests documents. #ASKFTC I think this question has been asked a few times above, but not answered; wouldn't you prefer that BFL's money be in fiat form instead of bitcoin form as fiat is much easier for the FTC to control then bitcoin? To address your question, BFL converted $5M+ USD worth of BFC to fiat that was deposited into their bank account during an ~30-day time period prior to the raid on September 19, 2013 by the FTC, and when they got to BFL's Harris bank, ~80% of the cash was already gone, as in Pufffff!, hence the FTC taking action, for they were able to show a judge that that was the case, and that the bleeding had to stop ASAP. #ASKFTC Check # 2038: BFL to Acme Capacitors. $702,254 Check # 2039: BFL to Acme Resistors. $1,033,902 You get the idea. Update1: The two above companies have merged and is now called Acme CapRes. Update2: Acme CapRes just went outta business. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: wunkbone on November 03, 2014, 03:50:30 AM Yeah! Congratulations to Bitpay! In the next few weeks or months, another payment provider will crossover to an exchange. BFL could've easily used BitStamp to accomplish the same thing they used BitPay for, for BitPay uses BitStamp, among others, to reverse its position, viz. replenish fiat in their bank account. #ASKFTC BFL wouldn't have had any trouble opening an account with BitStamp. In fact, they would've welcomed it. But, since BFL already had a relationship with BitPay, they felt that they could just about get away with anything forgetting all about the open-ledger aspect of the blockchain. Hell, from what we're able to ascertain, it looks like BFL was constantly having accounting issues, so why introduce another payment provider into the mix to further fuck things up and having later to answer to Sonny's probation officer when (not if) Courtney N. Pierce requests documents. #ASKFTC I think this question has been asked a few times above, but not answered; wouldn't you prefer that BFL's money be in fiat form instead of bitcoin form as fiat is much easier for the FTC to control then bitcoin? To address your question, BFL converted $5M+ USD worth of BFC to fiat that was deposited into their bank account during an ~30-day time period prior to the raid on September 19, 2013 by the FTC, and when they got to BFL's Harris bank, ~80% of the cash was already gone, as in Pufffff!, hence the FTC taking action, for they were able to show a judge that that was the case, and that the bleeding had to stop ASAP. #ASKFTC Check # 2038: BFL to Acme Capacitors. $702,254 Check # 2039: BFL to Acme Resistors. $1,033,902 You get the idea. Update1: The two above companies have merged and is now called Acme CapRes. Update2: Acme CapRes just went outta business. There is also much more paperwork required to start a company and to "close" a company as you describe. The FTC would be able to trace the route of money from BFL to Acme CapRes (in your example) and can see who is authorized to write checks against their bank accounts, as well as what happened to the money that was deposited by BFL Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 03, 2014, 10:11:37 PM http://www.mobilepaymentstoday.com/news/former-sec-chairman-arthur-levitt-named-advisor-to-bitpay-and-vaurum/
Quote Arthur Levitt Jr., the former chairman of the U.S. SEC, has been named an official advisor to bitcoin payment processor Bitpay as well as to Vaurum, an institutional bitcoin exchange. I guess since BitPay has chosen to be silent on If Sonny Vleisides is brazen enough to convince his probation officer, Courtney N. Pierce, that his ~$1K dealerhound.com is worth ~$2M (Sonny's very words), then he's brazen enough to wash in excise of $10M worth of BTC through BitPay thinkin' that nary a one would notice. Well, guess what, Sonny Vleisides? The whole world notices now thanks to moi, which is French for... http://www.unclewaltersrants.com/.a/6a011168547078970c0133f5557d3d970b-800wi <Damn, I love the octopus in this "Sorry, Charlie!" image.> #ASKFTC If these fuckers want to don big-boy pants to play with the bigger boys, then us grunts that made the big-boy-wannabes desire to play too after we expended our unique efforts to further Bitcoin so that you clowns could run it into the ground. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/48/Rubicon-Cesena.JPG/300px-Rubicon-Cesena.JPG Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: grahvity on November 04, 2014, 05:55:46 AM Wow. This is getting good. The press is in on it.
https://twitter.com/bitcoin_latest/status/528659795486584833 (https://twitter.com/bitcoin_latest/status/528659795486584833) Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: wunkbone on November 04, 2014, 06:40:35 AM Wow. This is getting good. The press is in on it. I am not sure that "@BTC_news" should be considered to be "press" (I would say the same about many other "news" sites that report on bitcoin). All this really appears to be is a twitter handle with the term news in it, not only that but they have well under a thousand followershttps://twitter.com/bitcoin_latest/status/528659795486584833 (https://twitter.com/bitcoin_latest/status/528659795486584833) Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 04, 2014, 06:40:44 AM Wow. This is getting good. The press is in on it. https://twitter.com/bitcoin_latest/status/528659795486584833 (https://twitter.com/bitcoin_latest/status/528659795486584833) Dude, you're making my dick hard. This best be the real deal, for I'm about to click the link, thanking you in advance, but coming back here to dox your cat if I get Rick Rolled. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 04, 2014, 06:46:44 AM Wow. This is getting good. The press is in on it. I am not sure that "@BTC_news" should be considered to be "press" (I would say the same about many other "news" sites that report on bitcoin). All this really appears to be is a twitter handle with the term news in it, not only that but they have well under a thousand followershttps://twitter.com/bitcoin_latest/status/528659795486584833 (https://twitter.com/bitcoin_latest/status/528659795486584833) Well, that was fun: Following a link from here; Go to Twitter; Click another link; View an ad page, some of which probably owned by Jeff Ownby; Click off the ad; End up back here. I felt like I was in a Rube Goldberg machine. As promised, grahvity's cat licks itself. :P Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Piston Honda on November 04, 2014, 04:06:22 PM LOL the way these threads derail from pg. 1 onwards is hilarious
Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: dopecoindude on November 19, 2014, 07:01:25 AM LOL the way these threads derail from pg. 1 onwards is hilarious Laughing so hard....I read the whole thing with a bag of popcorn.... Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: QuestionAuthority on November 19, 2014, 08:26:03 PM LOL the way these threads derail from pg. 1 onwards is hilarious Word up Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 20, 2014, 01:40:46 AM BitPay processes $1 Million bitcoin order for Butterfly Labs (http://www.coindesk.com/bitpay-processes-1-million-bitcoin-order-butterfly-labs/)
Quote Geoffrey Hamilton • a year ago Who bought what from ButterFlyLabs for $1 million? This is the missing piece of information that is boggling my mind right now... Quote Milly Bitcoin • a year ago I thought Bitpay only handled legitimate companies? This whole BFL thing is a black mark on Bitcoin and everybody stands by while it continues unabated. I can't see a legitimate company processing a payment like this after all that has happened. It is about time these Bitcoin companies start taking responsibility for their actions. Quote slipbuck • a year ago lol!..This is just BFL cashing in SOME of the bitcoins it mined with our miners. Quote turn kit • a year ago BFL sent themselves the order to get free press. Well, maybe? Quote Jordan Merz • a year ago I would love to see Proof of this, otherwise it just seems like BFL bought a lie on coindesk to make them seem legitamate, seriously now people, why would someone order $1,000,000 worth of BFL gear when KNC and Bitfury have a better track record, perform better, have higher efficency, cost less $per.Mh/s and can be constructed faster?!! Quote John Law Mod -> Jordan Merz • a year ago "Bought a lie" ? It was a BitPay press release on businesswire sent by their PR team, available publicly - http://finance.yahoo.com/news/... etc. If you ignore the BFL/BitPay for a moment - Such large transactions could increase awareness, and so increase adoption by other merchants, buyers, which is a good thing, right? Quote Erik -> John Law • a year ago I disagree BFL, is like the Silk Road of mining. And should disappear from the scene completely Quote Jordan Merz -> John Law • a year ago In retort to the first half, That is exactly my point, I don't think it would be hard to offer bitpay somemoney to get them to say "someone bought 1m worth of gear through us!, We're great!" Untill I see proof of this Drastic mistake to order from BFL, I won't believe it. In response to the second half, I wholeheartedly agree. However BFL is a crooked company run by fraudsters (literally) and frankly puts a horrible stain on the bitcoin community with their horrible gear, terrible staff, lack of support, but most importantly their constant unyeilding lies and lack of transparency. BFL is untrustworthy and as the Seemingly largest ASIC producer it makes bitcoin look even less appealing when such a nasty company is considered the largest producer of mining hardware. Quote Erik • a year ago Somebody is clearly insane or overly greedy or both. There a slim chance someone will profit for buy equipment this late in the waiting line. Perhaps a massive discount and put ahead in line may be the reason why. Looks like a completely unfair advantage if that the case, unless there going to start there own mining lease company I was not aware of any of the above comments when I proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that BFL did indeed own the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs (https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs) BWA pretending to belong to HashTrade, and now the FTC has full control of what remains after Sonny Vleisides tried to liquidate the rest of the BTC via BitPay amounting to ~$5M USD within a 30-day period prior to the FTC raid on BFL, with only $1.2M USD remaining in BFL's Harris bank account that remains frozen sans court approved payouts, and having a receiver in place overseeing BFL's day-to-day operations. Now, thanks in part to BFL, a concerning issue looms for ESPN's upcoming televised Bitcoin St. Petersburg Bowl. What would ESPN's course of action be if they discovered that BitPay in essence help launder over $10M USD for BFL over the past year, with half that about as late as only this past October? That would not bode well for ESPN's advertisers, now would it? #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 20, 2014, 01:55:44 AM ............. snip bullshit ............. Doing business with people who later on turn out to have been crim's is not a crime. It is only in wakadoodle land that you can be guilty by association. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 20, 2014, 02:46:22 AM ............. snip bullshit ............. Doing business with people who later on turn out to have been crim's is not a crime. It is only in wakadoodle land that you can be guilty by association. KYC comes to mind. How was BitPay able to declare with 100% certainty that HashTrade did indeed transfer $1M USD to BFL, being so confident that such was the case that they were first to release the press release espousing such? http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/10/prweb11283333.htm Think about it! Think really hard... actually, not that hard, for the answer is plain as day as to what transpired. #ASKFTC Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: MineForeman.com on November 20, 2014, 03:27:04 AM How was BitPay able to declare with 100% certainty that HashTrade did indeed transfer $1M USD to BFL Jeepers.. the answer is in the link you provided, did you even look? HashTrade paid the BitPay invoice for BFL gear. BitPay was the payment provider... what is confusing about that? You're thick. Title: Re: BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider. Post by: Gleb Gamow on November 20, 2014, 04:09:57 PM How was BitPay able to declare with 100% certainty that HashTrade did indeed transfer $1M USD to BFL Jeepers.. the answer is in the link you provided, did you even look? HashTrade paid the BitPay invoice for BFL gear. BitPay was the payment provider... what is confusing about that? You're thick. Thick as a Brick. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV-ASc0qkrM) Let's revisit how that infamous $1M USD transaction went down, shall we? Did you know that BitPay had the heads-up from BFL a week prior, making sure that said million-dollar transaction would sail through sans any hitches? Me neither (or I forgot such), till I view (perhaps reviewed) this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdV48a-Ay2k (at the :30s mark). Also, in the same video, we learnt that BitPay DOESN'T hold any client's BTC on their site. That is, if a client wants X% in fiat transferred to their bank account, and the remainder Y% transferred to a bitcoin wallet address, said BWA is in the control by the client and NOT by BitPay. Toward the end, Tony goes into details as to how and where clients can cash out their BTC, for BitPay is only a payment provider for merchants. https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8126/15648959278_7edb4cd4df_b.jpg Note, as proven previously by me, over 95% of all the BTC that were transacted to the 1QAH BWA stemmed from BFL mining bitcoins and the sale of chips from one dedicated BWA only found on Sonny Vleisides' personal website. With the exception of the last transaction(s) conducted by the FTC on ~11/6/14, all as in ALL the major dumps (read money laundering) was processed through BitPay prior to, during, and after the infamous $1M USD HashTrade-my-ass transaction. I see it, you see it, and everybody else sees, but you telling me that BitPay didn't see? Are you seriously telling me that there are no KYC rules/regulations in place that BitPay has to abide to see who really owns/owned that 1QAH BWA as over $10M USD was funneled out into BFL's bank account. Goddamn it, I want in on some that action if that's the case. And, if the inept BFL's Sonny Vleisides can pull such off, then surely there are a myriad more not-so-inept actors pulling the same ruse. In fact, I know such was/is the case for it was openly discussed at Bitcoin conferences I attended. circa ~30 days prior to the FTC raid: Sonny: Hey, Tony, looks like HashTrade is about to pay us $5M+ for what's owed on their obsolete order that we're barely getting out the door now. Can BitPay handle such volume? Tony: Sure, but have HashTrade break it up into smaller weekly chucks. Sonny: Will do. Contacting them now. Sonny: Jody, break up those bogus HashTrade payments into smaller weekly chucks. We got to get them bitcoins liquidated ASAP, for I smell that smell again, you know that smell... Jody: Will do! And Bruce and Nasser are on line one. Something about garden hoses leaking. #ASKFTC |
