Bitcoin Forum

So you mean, both escrow agents are yourself and you'd essentially have complete control of the 2-of-3 transaction?

I am not associated with the 2nd agent in any way, we live very far from each other. He will need only if something happen with me or dispute situation. If You don't want to trust him, You can propose Your 2nd agent or choose another escrow scheme (3-of-3 or 2-of-3, etc.).

P.S. Also he will replace me when I'm offline (I can't be online 24/7), in this case i will play the roll of the 2nd agent.

if you "know" where "he" lives then you are somehow associated with him. What would stop you from colluding with one party and releasing the funds to that party inappropriately?

No use in multisig if 2 of the 3 parties (the escrows) are not trusted.

Sorry but this is much more complicated than usual escrow services imo.

The basic escrow: The buyer commits a payment to escrow. The seller receives a transaction with the money in escrow, but he can't spend it until the buyer unlocks it... If the seller doesn't send the goods, he doesn't get paid. The buyer would still be out the money, but at least the seller has no monetary motivation to stiff him.

The buyer can't benefit by failing to pay. He can't get the escrow money back. He can't fail to pay due to lack of funds. The seller can see that the funds are committed to his key and can't be sent to anyone else...

Sorry but this is much more complicated than usual escrow services imo.

your newbie and want to make escrow?

Exactly. Using a standard well trusted escrow agent is much easier...

Hi sorry I don't deal with alts.

I know that with multisig I don't need to trust you, but I have some questions regarding escrow procedure. Which is the best way to contact with you?

Hello! Don't hesitate to ask any questions here, in the thread. You can also chat me via Tox (check my Tox ID and send friend request to me).

Which Tox version is better for installing (win 8.1)?

Can not find trusted person for LTC escrow, some not response, others:

Escrow completed, funds successfully released (https://coinplorer.com/LTC/Transactions/20c47ac7800a95e0fbbbf46b28ad629bbc8d6b366e5c5f709656d6edacab0a48). Thanks for using our service, hope You assessed the security of MultiSig transactions and will recommend us for others.

Sorry, I was busy and couldn't reply earlier.
Serge was very patient and comprehensively answered all my questions. Entire process went smoothly. Thank you for giving us such trustworthy escrow. I will use this service for my future trades.

Multi-signature addresses are like joint bank accounts, and are partially owned by each person who put forward a key to create it. When creating a multi-signature address, you need to specify how many of the owners need to sign to release the funds.

The Case for Multisig
You could set up an account between you and your wife that both of you can spend from, by creating a 1 of 2 address. This means: of the two keys used to create this address, a signature from only one party is required. Any money that was sent to this address could be spent by either party.

If you wanted to create a joint account, but wanted to approve transactions before the other person can spent money, you can create a 2 of 2 address. Of the two keys used to create the address, a signature from both is required. Both people who partially own the address can create unsigned transactions, and sign them with their own key, but without a signature from the second party, the transaction cannot go through. This could be the savings account you have with your wife, or maybe your wallet on another website. If one of you gets hacked, you still need the other to approve payments.

You can generate addresses with up to twenty possible signatories. So you could have a 5 of 10 address, where 5 people of the 10 need to agree on where the funds are going. This is pretty arbitrary until you find a purpose for your address.

One of the interesting cases is a 2-of-3 signature address, which allows for funds to be safely locked in escrow. If two people wish to perform a transaction (like purchase of goods, or services), but both parties fear that the other might not be trust-worthy, they can elect a trusted 3rd party as a signatory. If either party reneges on the agreement, the third party can create a transaction paying the money to the deserving party.

while I understand the added security of multi-sig I still wouldn't trust any money with a newbie or people who's reputation I cannot verify.

Sorry, but without any arguments this is empty words...

P.S. Most people get trusted feedback while trade. MultiSig escrow agent don't need to be a trader!

Escrow from a NEWBIE
Hehehe Nice try
Go and have a sleep.. Don't waste your time

yeah but I don't get why anyone would want to use you for escrow when there are already so many more reputable escrow providers who have done many transactions.

the question is why would anyone take this risk, even if minimal to none, when there are already much less risky options?

Escrow completed, funds successfully released (https://coinplorer.com/LTC/Transactions/20c47ac7800a95e0fbbbf46b28ad629bbc8d6b366e5c5f709656d6edacab0a48). Thanks for using our service, hope You assessed the security of MultiSig transactions and will recommend us for others.

Hi! I need an escrow for a large amount of DOGE. Can you help me?

Hi! I need an escrow for a large amount of DOGE. Can you help me?

it would not be a good idea to use this person as escrow.

Why not? You want to say that MultiSig escrow is not safe ?!? Please provide arguments to us, otherwise your words are worthless...

multisig escrow does make sense however that is not what you are actually offering. You are offering escrow services using a multisig address (2 of 3) however you will control 2 of the 3 keys therefore you alone can spend the funds.

There is no reason to think that you would not run away once you receive funds from one of your actual customers.

it would not be a good idea to use this person as escrow.

The problem is that I can not find anybody who can deal with DOGE, can you advice somebody? What is wrong with this service, is this a SCAM???

Yes it is most likely a scam.  If you send money to an address provided by this person then you will likely never see your money again. I can help you. I will send you a PM.

3.   The current FEE is 1% but I will return it if You leave feedback (half to buyer, half to seller), so it can be totally free.

So, if only me will leave you feedback, the fee will be 0.5%?

Discussing with my partner, we did not find any problem to use 2-of-2 multisig escrow, only that he don't have an account here.

We just finalized my first 2-of-2 multisig escrow, everything turned out! Thank you for teaching me this simple method, I'm going to use it for my trades instead of third party escrow services.

Yes. And if your friend will leave feedback sometime in future, I will give another 0.5%.

This looks like feedback trading for me.

yes, this is similar to buying trust ratings basically..

No, this will only stimulate parties to leave feedback (positive or not). This is more fair and more difficult for escrow agent than earning trust when making regular trading... And of course, I will make chargeback only to the address involved in escrow or person must be able to sign a message with it.

No, this will only stimulate parties to leave feedback (positive or not). This is more fair and more difficult for escrow agent than earning trust when making regular trading... And of course, I will make chargeback only to the address involved in escrow or person must be able to sign a message with it.

Stimulate lol. With that logic bribes are only used to stimulate or encourage a party too. Whether you want to admit it or not this is clearly trust farming and offering encouragement to leave feedback in exchange for discounts. A person of your rank shouldn't be offering escrow services either regardless if its multisig or not.

Reliable purchase/sell (also applicable for accounts) escrow scheme in which seller and buyer can't have any motivation to cheat each other (tested on DOGE):

1. Escrow agent creates 2-of-2 MultiSig address from Buyer and Seller pubkeys (https://coinplorer.com/DOGE/Addresses/AAUXv9TyNYoeSyzXKz9Yzxw19EB2V7Gz45).
2. Buyer sends 2x coins to MultiSig address (https://coinplorer.com/DOGE/Transactions/93c7d8a9d2d8685de33962c258d5809d213b6a0fc00dd19b310e07ed2ee00f9a) (buyer collateral + buyer payment for goods).
3. Seller sends 1x coins to MultiSig address (https://coinplorer.com/DOGE/Transactions/3ce36d1ac23b751bcb0c166122bd040240983586bbe5f61a0554daa20c5eb131) (seller collateral).
4. Seller sends goods to buyer.
5. Buyer receives the goods and informs the escrow agent.
6. Escrow agent prepares 1x coins tx from MultiSig address to buyer (buyer collateral) and 2x coins to seller (seller collateral + buyer payment for goods).
7. Buyer and seller checks and signs tx, 1x coins goes back to buyer and 2x coins goes to seller (https://coinplorer.com/DOGE/Transactions/fab1cdb9fe6edd92f40fbf868cdb8a55110872c3db2afc5c5a99e9f09b270d64).

Seller is interested to send the goods to buyer because he can lose an amount equal to value of the goods.
Buyer is interested to release the funds after getting the goods, otherwise he can lose an amount equal to value of the goods.
Collateral will encourage both sides to be honest, and if something happens with the parcel to conduct a thorough investigation and find consensus.

My first question to this would be why we need an escrow agent at all in this scheme. He has no power and doesn't do anything that the buyer or seller couldn't do.

My second question is what happens if the seller is a scammer, and doesn't send any coins in step 3? The buyer has just lost 2x his coins and has no chance of getting them back if the scammer doesn't cooperate. The scammer can make a transaction paying 1.9x coins to himself and 0.1x coins to the buyer. The buyer has to choose between signing the transaction and getting 0.1x coins back or not signing it and getting 0 coins back.

This scheme was modified (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1215033.msg12737166#msg12737166), but I have not edited this post (will do it soon). Actually, step 2 and 3 was combined in one, so the buyer and seller funds are sent to the MultiSig address at the same time and in the same transaction (https://coinplorer.com/PPC/Transactions/74aeaf11e040542ded67fe44a487c81b368c41bd345e547e7001f716a9af7248).

OK, so that gives you a way of 2 people safely transacting without the need of any escrow. Very nice.

There's still a slight issue:

The buyer locks up twice as much as the seller. If I pose as a seller when I have no intention of selling, I can get you to lock up 2 BTC of your funds while only locking up 1 BTC of mine. As soon as you lock up your 2 BTC I tell you I'm a scammer, and that I need a 50/50 split to release the coins. You have to choose between getting back 1.5 BTC or nothing. Which would you choose?

Maybe some people would sacrifice the 1.5 BTC just so the scammer takes a loss. But I expect most people would agree to the 50/50 split because it's in their own best interest.