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Title: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: trout on November 27, 2014, 08:44:02 PM short version: Offering BTC swaps on Chinese exchanges: are there any (hidden) fees, limitation, requirements?
long version: Trying to profit from the bear market without trading (which I am not good at). I tried offering BTC swaps at Bitfinex, and I have no complaints apart from that the interest rate has become too low. Right now it is 0.0055% daily, which, in my opinion, is completely useless. (To put it more correctly, not worth the risk of keeping one's BTC on an exchange.) On the other hand, OKcoin swaps market seems to offer 0.1% daily (and that at no fees as opposed to bitfinex' 15%), which seems pretty good. So I am considering putting some BTC there, and I'm wondering whether there are any "surprises" waiting. Such as: - hidden requirements, like: you can't withdraw your BTC unless you do our KYC check. (I'd prefer not doing any verification, apart from email verification) - hidden fees - crippling withdrawal limits - ... I haven't checked the other Chinese exchanges, but I'd appreciate any feedback/experience accounts on those as well. Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: poncom on November 27, 2014, 08:54:14 PM I tried offering BTC swaps at Bitfinex, and I have no complaints apart from that the interest rate has become too low. Right now it is 0.0055% daily, which, in my opinion, is completely useless. That's really low, even Cryptsy pays you a tiny amount for any of your bitcoins on the exchange. There's some complicated way of working out how much that's explained in the post below. From the example given it sounds like Cryptsy's rebate rate is about half of Bitfinex's interest rate. Code: What Are Balance Rebates? http://blog.cryptsy.com/post/94775274327/updates-to-cryptsy-points-program-and-new-balance Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: trout on November 27, 2014, 10:00:09 PM yeah that's a strange scheme. Why are they doing this though? Just encouraging people keeping BTC on their site?
To be fair to bitfinex, I have to add that their swap rates are market-determined. Why would people manually place swap offers at as low as 0.001% daily is beyond me, but apparently that's what's happening. Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: poncom on November 27, 2014, 10:10:19 PM yeah that's a strange scheme. Why are they doing this though? Just encouraging people keeping BTC on their site? I suppose so, I found out about it because I kept getting little pop ups telling me cryptsy has sent me a tiny fraction of a bitcoin. Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: trout on November 28, 2014, 08:55:29 PM bump?
c'mon, speculators, I'm sure some of you know. more investigation from me: BTCChina allows you to "loan" funds, but does not (as far as I see) allow you to lend funds. This means they are lending out themselves. Weird (or rather: smells of fractional reserve). Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: Tzupy on November 28, 2014, 09:12:04 PM bump? c'mon, speculators, I'm sure some of you know. more investigation from me: BTCChina allows you to "loan" funds, but does not (as far as I see) allow you to lend funds. This means they are lending out themselves. Weird (or rather: smells of fractional reserve). Interesting, they could be pumping the price with fake fiat. Thank you for the information. Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: trout on November 28, 2014, 10:34:16 PM bump? c'mon, speculators, I'm sure some of you know. more investigation from me: BTCChina allows you to "loan" funds, but does not (as far as I see) allow you to lend funds. This means they are lending out themselves. Weird (or rather: smells of fractional reserve). Interesting, they could be pumping the price with fake fiat. Thank you for the information. as far as I understand, they are lending both fiat and BTC, so the argument works both ways. I agree that it makes one thinkg of fractional reserve though/ Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: inca on November 30, 2014, 09:33:32 PM bump? c'mon, speculators, I'm sure some of you know. more investigation from me: BTCChina allows you to "loan" funds, but does not (as far as I see) allow you to lend funds. This means they are lending out themselves. Weird (or rather: smells of fractional reserve). Interesting, they could be pumping the price with fake fiat. Thank you for the information. as far as I understand, they are lending both fiat and BTC, so the argument works both ways. I agree that it makes one thinkg of fractional reserve though/ How is it fractional reserve at all or any different to Bitfinex? It is simply allowing 'traders' on their respective sites to take long or short bets with leverage (i.e a bigger bet than money they have on the site) which involves someone actually stumping up the capital (either bitcoins or fiat). This capital is lent out for a daily rate and therefore is at risk during times of extremely wild major market moves, hence the 0.1% a day rate. Saying that I have lent coins out for some time on finex this year but took them off recently when the rates fell below a useful level. Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: criptix on November 30, 2014, 10:21:54 PM bump? c'mon, speculators, I'm sure some of you know. more investigation from me: BTCChina allows you to "loan" funds, but does not (as far as I see) allow you to lend funds. This means they are lending out themselves. Weird (or rather: smells of fractional reserve). Interesting, they could be pumping the price with fake fiat. Thank you for the information. as far as I understand, they are lending both fiat and BTC, so the argument works both ways. I agree that it makes one thinkg of fractional reserve though/ How is it fractional reserve at all or any different to Bitfinex? It is simply allowing 'traders' on their respective sites to take long or short bets with leverage (i.e a bigger bet than money they have on the site) which involves someone actually stumping up the capital (either bitcoins or fiat). This capital is lent out for a daily rate and therefore is at risk during times of extremely wild major market moves, hence the 0.1% a day rate. Saying that I have lent coins out for some time on finex this year but took them off recently when the rates fell below a useful level. its about who lends the money/btc. on bitfinex the traders/users lend out money/btc. here for example btcchina lends money/btc which doesnt come from traders/users, so its possible that they have fractional reserve. (they use the money/btc users deposit to give loans) Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: trout on November 30, 2014, 10:29:09 PM its about who lends the money/btc. on bitfinex the traders/users lend out money/btc. exactly. Quote from: inca Saying that I have lent coins out for some time on finex this year but took them off recently when the rates fell below a useful level. That's what I did as well. Now I'm looking for other platforms to lend coins on.Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: Mieehayii on December 01, 2014, 06:42:56 AM why not swap on tera exchange?
Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: gizmoh on December 01, 2014, 07:15:07 AM I contacted Okcoin twice to be able to offer swaps. Reply was they are not accepting new applications as they are saturated! And also that you have to be a company with capital of 100 million CNY ...
I have long positions at okcoin and been trying to refinance them cheaper at 0.09%. So far that loan demand has been sitting there for few weeks with no takers, while at some point there was an abundance of loan offers at 0.1% The only sane conclusion is that OKcoin itself and a few big friends are able to offer swaps. BTC/LTC being loaned are probably clients assets and part of CNY might be clients fund. That is how they make big money... Title: Re: offering swaps on Chinese exchanges? Post by: trout on December 01, 2014, 08:00:54 PM why not swap on tera exchange? can you give some more information about this? That's the first time I hear about this exchange. Quote from: gizmoh The only sane conclusion is that OKcoin itself and a few big friends are able to offer swaps. BTC/LTC being loaned are probably clients assets and part of CNY might be clients fund. That is how they make big money... Right, that makes sense. After all, they have to be making money *somehow* - and with 0 fees it seems difficult. |