Bitcoin Forum

BitFloor.com is a very good BTC exchange. The two things I like most about it are 1) you get a rebate for orders that add liquidity to the order book and 2) they have great ways for US residents to deposit and withdraw USD, namely ING Direct Bank's P2P service for deposits and ACH transfers for withdrawals. BitFloor just passed 10,000 BTC traded for the past 30 days according to bitcoincharts.com and their volume is steadily growing. Check them out!

I agree, I love the Popmoney deposit and ACH withdrawl.
That said, the market depth really isn't there.

I agree that the liquidity is not that great . . . yet. But it depends on how many BTC you need to buy or sell. Right now the market is 5.79 to 5.80 with a size of 64 by 576. So if you are buying 576 or fewer BTC, that's enough. The bids are thin but the offers seem to be thicker. I'm just a small BTC trader so I don't need much liquidity. For me, BitFloor has enough liquidity and it's getting better day by day.

And you can be part of the change that adds more market depth :) It takes time to glow the market and users who are willing to give us a try!

Very true! When I have a lot to sell I'll try bitfloor first. That's a promise.

While I like Bitfloor they have to be the only exchange where Bitcoin withdrawals are done manually.  I needed to pay someone so I paid from my bitfloor balance.  10 minutes later it hasn't hit the network.  So I can't cancel, I can't prove I have "sent" the coins.  I can't send them from another exchange as I risk bitfloor not canceling.  

So just stuck and look stupid.  Either move to automatic instant processing or put a disclaimer up.

On edit: tx processed. 

We do not do bitcoin withdraws manually. They are automatic. If for some reason you believe that your withdraw is not working please let us know and we will look into it. Don't assume we do them manually just because you have not seen it hit the network.

I responded to your email saying we will have instant withdraw deployed today (it has been a feature which was requested in the past and I am adding it).

Thanks and sorry for the bad assumption.  I have never seen a non-manual process take that long.  Since you are updating the withdrawal system a recommendation would be to provide the user the actual tx hash.

If I may, a suggestion: how about the option to enable non-instant withdrawals, preceded by an instant email notification? This could potentially allow a user with a hacked account to intervene before coins get sent, if they got an email and they knew they hadn't actually sent a withdrawal.

Indeed such a feature is on my todo list along with customizable withdraw limits which will allow users to receive better alerts about account activity.

I have been trading bitcoins for a year, and I know how exchanges compare to each other. I only have good things to say about bitfloor. Except for low market depth, it has been working great for me so far.

One thing I have to underscore here is exceptionally good communication from bitfloor. I didn't get that kind of communication from any other exchange. I have a request to CryptoX which is pending for over a week, and it's not one of those "give me that feature" requests - it's a request about case when they screwed up and cost me money, just stays unanswered. Bitfloor guys respond pretty much instantly, never delay, even when there is something they can not immediately fix. For those of us who run bitcoin business it is very important.

Just used it myself for the first time last night/this morning.  So far, so good...  MtGox is out, since their debacle with Dwolla means I am still waiting for my withdraw to go through.  Will not be using them again.  I like the direct ACH withdraw option, that's why I chose to try bitfloor out instead of any of the other exchanges.

I've no idea how they are accommodating the risk ACH reversals with those.

ING P2P and Popmoney are a different type of ACH service (not the same as Dwolla). These is still a chance of chargeback, but much less from fraudulent activity claimed on the account since they are not third party services which transfer on your behalf.

As always, cash is the preferred and fastest method for those able to do so.

Bitcoin withdraw is now instant and you should see your withdraw requests hit the network immediately.

When can I expect notice about my ACH withdrawal?  How often are those processed?

They are processed daily and we usually send out the notice every morning. You will see your funds arrive 1-2 business days after processing.

Thanks, that should do just fine.

I've been "eyeing" bitfloor for awhile might dive in soon!  ;D

Feature wise, this is as good as it gets. I plan to use bitfloor for all my exchange needs.

I can also say that bitfloor works as advertised. Bootstrapping by paying people to provide liquidity is a good idea as well.

To shtylman: At what point do you expect free deposits to end?

Currently at no point. The small cost of deposits charged by our banks is a small price for us to to pay to provide less headache for our users (you). We would rather you not worry about all the tiny fees since we hope you will deposit and trade with your funds :)

Right... it's hard to convince your bank to reverse it when you initiated it yourself.

What if your account gets hacked?

Then they have record that you logged in from an unusual IP, and record of the security questions they prompted the attacker with, and whether or not they had to try multiple times.

Sure, it's not impossible, but there is a lot more information to make a decision on than if dwolla pulls from your account.  In that case, they pretty much have to side with the customer.

+1

But make it necessary to respond to the Email too,before the TX can be completed ;)

Why? :)

Hello Shtylman,

Quick question about your trade engine:

If the highest bid on BTC/USD is 6.00 and I accidentally enter a limit sell order @ 0.60. Do I get filled at 6.00 or my 0.60?

The reason I ask is because I should get the best price of 6.00 even though I entered 0.60. Unfortunately, many times the trade engine isn't coded properly and customers get ripped off. This type of bad order matching happens frequently at non-regulated exchanges/ECNs.

Thanks in advance for your reply, cheers!

Bitfloor has been great and Roman has provided excellent customer service. I think covering ACH fees was very smart. I've recommended them to everyone.

Our exchange operates as you would expect. In your example, you will be filled at the best price available first, which would be 6, NOT 0.6

Once all of the available volume at 6 is gone, then you will be filled at the next best price and so on until your order is either filled or the remainder put on the order book.

One hidden gem of bitfloor as the mobile phone support.  The website is so lite and clean that it load quickly on my Android phone.
Other exchanges should take note.

On edit:  bug report.  I can't make a sell using mobile browser (Android -4.0)  The screen darkens but the popup to confirm never appears.

There's no Chase within an hour's drive of my house; there is, however, a Wal-Mart 10 minutes away. Can you coordinate with BitInstant? I hear nothing but great things about BitFloor, but for now I'm stuck with Wal-Mart deposits.

Trying to send a deposit via Popmoney, and PNC held up my deposit. They said they needed to verify my identity. I will do it, but has anyone else had this problem?

Hello shtylman,

Do you have any plans on adding any other contracts (i.e. BTC/EUR, Namecoins, etc) soon?

Any plans to allow account to account exchange of USD?  i

Something like MtGox codes or CryptoXChange voucher codes.  A simpler/easier version would be like how CampBX does it.  With CampBX you can't create a voucher/code but you can directly transfer USD to another account.

shtylman, How long does it take to get ACH setup? Do I have to email you for each withdraw I want to make? Or can I get ACH setup one time, then keep using it without having to email you each time?

On my account he set it up the same day.  You only need to send account info once.  There is no automated way to request a withdrawal you need to email support.  You don't need to send account info on each request though.  Low tech but it works and response time has been fantastic. 

I was concerned about security and asked for a public key to encrypt the account details.  He sent me his openSSL public key which I have no idea how to use.  I asked him if he could provide a PGP key instead and he did within minutes. 

TL/DR
shtylman is a pro!

I agree very good service, after going on week 3 to get funds out of Mtgox I signed up on Wednesday sent a few test coins, then decided to cancel a withdraw from Mtgox (which they surprisingly canceled very quickly LOL) bought back the coins from MtGox sent them to bitfloor sold them, requested a ACH withdraw late Thursday it went out Friday morning and as of now (Saturday) the funds are pending in my bank couldn't be any easier.

Did he email you to confirm your account info?  I sent an email 2-3 days back and haven't heard a peep...

+1
This would bring way more volume to bitfloor

Yes he did and quickly.  I would shoot him another email. 

Sometimes I don't respond to the ACH setup request right away. This does not mean there was a problem. Since most requests just send the info but don't wish to withdraw any funds at the time I just setup the ACH and wait until a withdraw request is sent. Soon it will be clear from your online profile that ACH is setup and no follow-up email will be required :)

We will not be integrating with Bitinstant at this time. We feel that it is easier for our customers to deal directly with us instead of having to create accounts at various third party sites. This allows us to keep the fees down and the user experience around our exchange clearer and simpler.

Hm, so will you start accepting mtgox codes, btc-e codes or bitstamp codes anytime soon, so that one can transfer funds in and out?
I would really like to use your exchange, but it seems that it is a US customers only club.
Regarding fees, look at bitstamp. You can use mtgox codes there, but they have a 2% fee. Doing the same using bitinstant the fee is only 0.89%. So it seems one can use bitinstant to actually get lower fees.
And BTW, for using bitinstant no account is necessary - just fill out the form - click send - done.

Bitinstant doesn't have any kind of accounts to sign up for, as far as I know. What you see on the website is what you get, and I hear they are planning to whitelabel their current deposit providers to make the process even simpler. Since they are US based as well, I wouldn't think that there would be too many hurdles to setting it up.

We want to keep 3rd party financial dependence to a minimum to ensure timely withdraw and transactions for our users. Given all of the problems with USD withdraw on MtGox we will not be supporting codes from there as it would delay withdraw from our exchange.

At this time, the legal implications of supporting Bitinstant in our jurisdiction are not clear. To send USD from person to person (like MtGox USD-USD codes, and the way Bitinstant works at exchanges) we would need to be an MTB (Money Transmitting Business). This is different from and MSB and much more costly and restrictive. Until we understand how we can operate as such (or avoid being an MTB we cannot provide these services).

For customers wishing to deposit funds into Bitfloor, I suggest they look into our deposit options which include, cash, electronic p2p, and wire transfers. I think you will find that by fine tuning these we are able to provide a pleasant experience to account holders.

:(
I'm not willing to drive to a Chase bank to deposit my cash; not if the nearest one is an hour's drive. Can you at least provide more cash deposit locations? BitInstant uses ZipZap, which uses MoneyGram, which is really easy and fast.

Good to know! Yeah, I didn't request to withdraw, but just setup ACH. I'll make a withdraw later and give it a shot. Thanks!

I'm very glad to hear this. Accepting MtGox codes seems very risky and I'd rather trade somewhere that's not taking that risk.

It wasn't just a setup request though - I requested setup and withdrawal in the same email at the same time, still haven't heard anything back.

Please contact the support email if we haven't responded to you already. We respond when your ACH has been sent out and if your request was over the weekend it would only be processed today.

Are you thinking about putting some arbitrage bot to fill your orders book? For example rates 2% away from MTGOX?

Currently I do not run automated traders or market makers on the exchange. My focus remains on ensuring the platform is operational and providing fast service and solid APIs for those that do wish to run trading bots.

So ask someone... because your order book is "naked" and it's a pity that exchange capable of transacting shitloads of operations per second just in standby mode.

Go ahead and drop a bot on it if you are worried.

I agree ;) More bots are always welcome. My focus remains on my above stated goals. I feel that with the liquidity rebate and low fees we have a good structure for market makers and welcome all new users to try it out.

Working on it... relax... soon you will hear good news

I moved too slow guess I will have competition. :)

Don't worry, we all want efficient markets here... there will be enough place for all of us

I'd say - bot or not, someone please add some USD liquidity to bitfloor. It's a shame there's such a dismal depth on USD side.

Will bitfloor ever consider adding Check or USPS money order as a deposit method? There is no Chase nearby, and popmoney is not available to minors.
Until then, I'll have to resort to CBX (at least for buying).

It does seem like getting money into Bitfloor will be problematic. Current market shows that 50 BTC are wanting to be bought. While 1,000 BTC are wanting to be sold. It's full of everyone wanting to sell, but no one willing to buy. My guess is getting money into there is hard. So selling a large sum is going to be rather difficult. Probably not the best place to sell off your coins right now.

In other unrelated news, my MtGox --> Dwolla transactions are going through. I think I'll split up my coins amongst various exchanges to see which one bring the bread to my bank first.

My apologies - the money actually hit my bank account a few days ago!  I just never received any kind of notification, and hadn't even checked my bank account because of it.

Does Bitfloor have any kind of USD Codes systems on its own?

No. I wish they did.

We cannot offer this at this time until we are sure this does not make us an MTB (which requires other paperwork and registration).

Currently we focus on Bitcoin buying and selling and not on transfer of fiat currencies between accounts.

We will not accept checks as they carry chargeback and bounce risks. We are considering accepting Chase QuickPay. You can signup for a Chase account completely online, connect it to your other personal account to move funds into your chase account. Finally, you would be able to send these funds to use via QuickPay.

Other alternatives include wire transfers from your current bank. I will add the wire information to the website for those that wish to use this method.

I will add that for those who wish to deal only electronically, you can open an ING account online, then transfer funds to it from your other accounts. This process is simple and lets you manage your funds until they are ready to be sent to Bitfloor for trading.

Can you eleborate on those differences in your jurisdiction? Sorry if I am not too polite.

In simple terms an MSB is *any* business that deals with money. An MTB a type of MSB which moves funds from one person to another (paypal or western union are good examples). They take money on your behalf and deliver the same money to another individual.

The legal uncertainty of these and how it pertains to currency exchanges can be debated. However, to be clear, in our legal jurisdiction, it is currently more difficult/costly to be an MTB and as such we are currently not providing such services.

I just used your site and it's excellent! :D
I'd like to see more decimals, I just dropped a small ask into a big wall and would have liked to be in front but I can't.
All the best!

Don't add too many decimals.  I hate fighting bots jumping 0.000001 ahead of me on Mt.Gox.  I think whole pennies are fine but maybe 1 more decimal place I hope you don't go more than that.  Like gasoline $3.499 :)

If the asset is worth ~$5 then 0.001 as the min tick is 0.02%.  Anything smaller is just games.  It doesn't improve the spread in any meaningful way.

The penny increment will not be changing in the near future. If the price suddenly drops then we will update the increment to reflect that. But as stated, the increment is in place specifically to prevent people from "cutting" in line  against those that have been on the book.

I second that. At first it felt weird, but now I see that it is actually a more user friendly thing

To play devil's advocate, bots could be the reason why Intersango, CampBX and CryptoX show so much more traffic

Any reason why the market depth screen only shows 5 bids and 5 asks. 

It would be more useful if put into separate bid & ask tables in column form which show price, size, cumulative size.

+1

You can kind of gather that information from hovering over the charts, but it'd be nicer in a table

I'm working on getting a small amount onto the 'buy' side of bitfloor, but probably not at prices people are selling at currently (I'm thinking like ~6.0x per BTC).

So far, everything looks really good with bitfloor.com. If you guys keep up the great work, I can definately see you guys surpassing MtGox trade volume.  8)

FYI: Bitfloor's MSB Registration Number: 31000005224108 (FinCEN)

+1
 BitFloor is the best, had my coins in less than a hour of sending the first email. Will definitely use again!

And almost 20 cents under market price  ;D

I sent in a copy of my drivers license and my bank info to Bitfloor support.  Am I supposed to get a confirmation Email or something?  How do I know when my Bitfloor account is ready to withdraw to my bank acct?

Nope, they don't give confirmation.  Just send in your withdrawal request now.

Different guy here, but I did that and I haven't had a response yet. Sent an email to do a withdraw on Monday (Sent info the 14th), and it still hasn't been done. I still have the amount I requested lying in my Bitfloor account. It's Thursday now, should I wait another day or so?

Hmmm, I would.  My transfers all went through very quickly - I think in 2 days, I had the money in my account.

I want to know why there is not more liquidity/volume here, ESP with all the problems that fox is suffering.

Sure would be nice... keep spreading the word!

Hmm... I wonder if we can get Goat to bring his arb bot to BitFloor.
I'd make one myself, but I just don't have the volume to bootstrap it.

^^^^ this

Please send a followup email. We process requests daily and would not have omitted it without letting you know (maybe the email didn't get through?). We also send out an email once we have dispatched the funds. All of this should happen within a day of receiving your request so please do follow up with us and don't sit in silence :)

Alright, I sent another email. Hopefully it'll go through. Thanks for the quick reply!

Is there an amount limit on cash deposits?

No, but the bank may choose to ID you (per US government regulations) and fill out a form (this is not a bad thing nor does it mean your funds will be delayed) if you deposit a very large amount.

+1

International withdrawal > $3k in 2 days.
Congratulations.

Panda Mouse.

Wow... BitFloor is trading above Gox ATM:

6.4376/6.4700

Go BitFloor!

I think the excitement of trading above Gox is a matter of perspective...I just deposited a lot money to buy BTC, which yesterday would have been below Gox  :-\.

But my deposit took a whole 10 mins to get credited, and cost me $0 in fees...beat that Gox! 

A comparison: 

I requested an free ACH withdraw from Bitfloor on Thursday and it hit my account today.
I requested a $40+ bank wire from MtGox on 06/08 and it hasn't even been processed yet and then I got a 4 day delay once it does process.

Looking forward for you to bring your liquidity to BF Goat!

Is there a way to use a yubikey with bitfloor?

Also, can't place a limit order:


or

Or google authenticator.

I don't want to rely on my phone.

Google "JAuth". Works great for me.


or

I actually haven't used authenticator yet and don't really understand how it works. Do I need to do that before using JAuth?

I downloaded the windows installer from here to mess around with it:
https://github.com/mclamp/JAuth/tree/master/Installers

and it is asking me for "[my] one time key from the RC website"

The one time key is provided to you when you sign up for a service such as GLBSE. It gets stored in your home directory in a file called jauth.rc.

What I do on Windows is create a file called glbse.secret and aws.secret or whatever, and paste the secret key in there. Then, create a shortcut that points to "jauth.exe glbse.secret", and it will load the secret from the file.

You can skip the part in the installer where it asks for a secret. You don't need a phone or Google at all to use it. Backup your secret, and keep it in a Truecrypt volume.

And you do this on a different computer than you use to e.g. trade on bitfloor?

Also, bitfloor appears to be down as well. I can't do anything but transfer funds around.

That would be the most secure way to do it, but not required.

Up for me

I am still getting this. Restarted browser, logged out, etc.


To rjk:
I am somewhat confused as to what is going on with JAuth and the readme is not very helpful. Do you have a link to a good guide?

No I don't know of any good guides. JAuth is meant to be a drop-in replacement for Google Authenticator, so you have to use a service that uses GA. When you enable GA on such a service, it will give you a "secret" which is a string of random characters. You then use JAuth to generate a 6-digit PIN from that secret, which is also Time-based. So they expire ever 30 sec or so. Make sure your system's clock is correct.

Home Directory//.JAuth.rc


Ok so right now it is using some algorithm to generate those 6 digit pins from "THIS-IS-A-DUMMY-SECRET" and the current time rounded to the nearest 30 seconds? So I can either change the text there or do what you recommend and open a file consisting of some secret string (key, whatever) using:


Or (same thing) create a shortcut pointing to:
"jauth.exe glbse.secret"

If I set up authenticator on bitfloor I will need to input my secret string. If I used google authenticator it would generate a secret string for me which I would then be telling bitfloor. Then when I log in bitfloor will ask me to generate a pin and input it, while at the same time generating one on their end. If these are the same I am able to log in. Also, if I write down the secret provided by google authenticator I can simply input that into JAuth if I lose my phone, which will then generate the 6 digit pin that allows me to log in.

If I only use a computer, should I have the secret.txt file saved only in a truecrypt volume? It seems insecure to have it just out in the open.

Yeah I used GLBSE as an example because I wasn't sure whether bitfloor supported it. Depending on how you want the balance of usability and security to be, you could store it in Truecrypt. You would have to unlock the volume any time you wanted to use it though. Generally, when you set up GA the website such as bitfloor would give you a secret string. You just create a blank text file and paste the secret in there, and then use the text file's name as the only argument to jauth.exe. For instance:


With that example, your truecrypt stuff is mounted at D:

The jauth.rc file is optional, and only used if you don't want to create a custom shortcut to launch with an argument. You could store the secret there, and then no other changes would need to be made.

So there is a trade on gox and now bitfloor started working for me as well.

Thanks for your help. One last thing I want to verify though:


Is the above true?

Yes. The secret is the key to it, and it theoretically should work across several devices and always generate a working OTP. Your clock must be correct since it is a time-based system.

Sounds good. So to bitfloor: What is the protocol for when I lose my phone and no longer trust my secret key? I like the yubikey because it can simply remain in a safe place.

Right because something that size can never got lost so that isn't a problem with the yubikey  ::)

I'm assuming you would just log in and disable 2FA, then re-enable it to generate a new OTP.

I don't travel with it... I have lost/destroyed a good number of phones in my time.



From Bitfloor site:

Right, but if you have backed up the compromised secret, you could use it one last time to log in and disable 2FA. This assumes that disabling it is an option, of course.

Not sure.

After thinking about this a bit more. The most convenient thing is to just create shortcuts to files containing the secret string on the computer you use to trade. The most secure thing would be to put JAuth and the secret keys on a boot cd/drive and only run it on a computer/device that never connects to the internet. Is this correct?

edit: I guess you would need to manually set the clock.

Sure that would work too.

Perhaps there is a market for dedicated portable devices that generate OTPs for a person's various accounts. You would have two of them. One as backup kept in a safe place, one to keep with you as you travel.

BitFloor just passed Intersango to move from #8 to #7 on the 30-day BTC/USD volume list at bitcoincharts.com. Congratulations BitFloor. Keep on Rockin'!

I wonder if I can make a simple bot which holds USD on one exchange e.g. MtGox and holds BTC on BitFloor, then continually updates BitFloor asks to be MtGox + MtGox Fee + .05. Would that result in any trades, or are the markets generally too close together?

take a look at bitcoin-analytics.com/#arbitrage (http://bitcoin-analytics.com/#arbitrage)

you should wait until data is fully loaded and arbitrage table is displayed
then it is possibile to analyze arbitrage apportunities depending on BTC volume you consider to trade

What is the MtGox fee per trade?

not sure, but as far as I can remember it varies between 0.6 - 0.5 - ... % depending on your trading activity
for sure you should consult on mtgox website

In that case it could be occasionally profitable to arb MtGox and bitfloor.
Off to the IDE!

I would read this before you go all gungho https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=74291.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=74291.0)

it depends on volume of transactions in BTC for 100 and 1000 the situation can be significantly different.

for example almost all exchanges  have 100 on bid and ask sisds, so it is in principla possible to execute such transactions.

But when you filter 1000 BTC volume for exmpale currently bitfloor does not have enough volume on bid side and your BTC will not be bought, you will not close the transation pair.

Well my system would be simpler - keep BitFloor asks where they would be profitable. So when the gox bids go up, the bot adjusts BitFloor asks. Then, when a trade is made on BitFloor, the bot makes a trade on gox.
@genuise I don't have enough BTC for it to matter, really.

then I am afraid there little chance to get arbitrage profits, because on small volumes generally transaction/withdraw fees will eat all of them

Most fees are percentage-based, so that is fine. I also want to see bitfloor succeed, and bringing it more volume is one way I can do that.

That is exactly what happened to goat.

It is a surprize for me. Can you give any details?

It is long, but very interesting: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=74291.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=74291.0)

Thank you, it is really educative :)

that is why I was pointing out that it is important to see and be able to analyze the picture in a wider perspective before making any conclusions and decisions.

Exactly  :-\

Manual deposit request of cash transfer and... 8 minutes to availability on Bitfloor.

Goodbye Gox, BX, etc.

BitFloor recently passed CryptoXChange to move from #7 to #6 on the 30-day BTC/USD volume list at bitcoincharts.com. Congratulations BitFloor. Keep on Rockin'!

Down? Any news as to why?

-bgc

I'm able to access the website, are you having some difficulty?

I was, but its back up. Must have been intermittent. I did check downforeveryoneorjustforme before posting though.

-bgc

Looks like ING P2P does not work for $ withdrawals from Bitfloor; is this correct or did I miss something?

That is correct. We only offer ACH withdraws.

Just wanted to say that BitFloor.com worked out really well.  Transferred via PopMoney, and was able to buy up some BTC with no stress.

Thanks, I will be using this again.

I just wish you would open an account at US Bank, I have no Chase banks in my state even   >:(

I do have a US Bank right across the street from my office though.  For small purchases it is easier to WU money to people in -OTC and pay the ~%8 fee, just for convenience.

BitFloor has such low volume though.  If I wanted to cash out 1000 BTC, I'd be SOL.

You'd just have to put up a wall and wait a day or two for people to sell in to it.

What happens when you sell the BTC and then can't actually get your USD ;) Might as well not have sold in the first place.

That's funny because there's another exchange that... heyyy wait a minute!  You crafty slickster of the English language, you!

There are other sketchy businesses called RBS, and NatWest, and Banque Postale, and Societe Generale... I lost count. People can't get their fiat (http://maxkeiser.com/2012/06/28/max-the-rbs-natwest-etc-glitch-work-france-banque-postale-now-societe-generale-from-morning-one-readers/) there either...

BitFloor recently passed BTCex to move from #6 to #5 on the 30-day BTC/USD volume list at bitcoincharts.com. BitFloor volume for the past 30 days is over 23,000 BTC. Congratulations BitFloor! Keep on Rockin'!

Yay :)

BitFloor recently passed Camp BX to move from #5 to #4 on the 30-day BTC/USD volume list at bitcoincharts.com. BitFloor volume for the past 30 days is over 40,000 BTC. Congratulations BitFloor! Keep on Rockin'!

I really hope that doesn't happen.

Out of curiosity, why not?

Lets think this logically (not I wish x would happen because it helps me personally).

Why would someone use a MtGox code?  Why not just cash out from MtGox?

Someone will deposit a MtGox code because there is a long delay @ MtGox.  

If someone could cash out from MtGox with a 21 day delay or cash out from Bitfloor with a 0 day delay which would they pick?  

So you would see a huge influx of semi-worthless Gox codes.  Now when those users deposit a Gox code and attempt to cash out on Bitfloor where does the cash come from?  It is still on MtGox so the operator has to cash out from MtGox wait 21 days for it to get to his bank account and then pay users.     Quickly the cashouts will exceed cash on hand and delay for cashing out will go from 0 days to 21 days.   MtGox can then push shtylman's cashout requests to the back burners (oops this request took 28 days, that one too 32 days).   That would disrupt his cashflow probably fatally.  When Bitfloor no longer has fast cashouts it will die.  

Exactly. Part of the reason I'm using Bitfloor to shield myself from problems with MtGox. I don't want Bitfloor to shoulder part of the liability of MtGox's solvency.

This will not be happening for the reasons described above. We must be able to control all of our cashflow to ensure timely withdrawals.

Hi, can you give some details about limits for international wire transfer withdrawal?

how it is done, what is the sequence of actions?

the second you can do SEPA next-day i will be there.

I like this site also, but volume sure is low.

Thought I would cross post this for those who were not aware ^^^

Makes perfect sense.  I was thinking about it just from my perspective where I would most likely be adding $$ with Gox codes and either withdrawing back again as Gox codes or withdrawing coins.

I'm doing arbitrage, so my money never really leaves the exchanges, just moves from one exchange to another.

i love BITFLOOR! i made my first transaction there today!! sold 10 btc and requested an ACH transfer.... it couldnt be seamlessly easier!! THANKS BITFLOOR!!!

So far so good. It's nice to walk into chase, deposit cash, and have my money in the account before i even get home. Used most of the features except withdrawl, and they work great. Hope more people start using this site. It could use the volume.

I can say that the Wells Fargo deposit works great for me. Haven't done withdrawal, but that's mostly cause I'm pretty long on BTC and prefer to avoid giving out my ID if possible. I'll give it when I feel like selling some, but that might be awhile.

-bgc

Same here... I have done a couple of deposits @ WF now and I am loving BF.

Speaking of ID... Can someone from Bitfloor say something about what information they need the ID for, what they do with that information, and how they store that information?  Thanks

In the event of an ACH dispute or other transaction issue with the receiving bank, we need to know who owns the account where the funds are going. It is important that the ID and name on file match what your bank expects.

We do not store your ID on our servers. It is kept in offline storage as a record if needed. We certainly don't give this information out to any third party and only use it to make sure your transactions go smoothly. The entire point of us handling the ACH process ourselves is to make it quick and also avoid exposing your data to third parties.

Would it be possible to provide full order book via api? Currently it looks like this:
http://btccharts.com/#m=bitfloor-BTC-USD

My understanding is that there are two APIs already, one with the full order book and one with the narrow order book. I think btccharts.com is just using the wrong one.

-bgc

It would be nice if the orderbook on the website had a bit more depth. 20-30 spaces instead of 10 would be great.

I use Clark Moody's display of their orderbook: http://bitcoin.clarkmoody.com/bitfloor/

I will look at expanding the number of returned levels (currently 50 on each side). It is doubtful that the full book will ever be provided since information about trades at prices of 1$ or 2000$ and such is not relevant to current market conditions. The goal of the REST API book is to provide information about the current relevant conditions.

If you want the entire stream as the data comes in, you can use the websocket API which has no restrictions but is more complex to use.

Umm how exactly is this not relevant as it provides information on the overall liquidity of the exchange.

Hey, I also can agree that this info is relevant for calculateing composite orderbook volume  and for comparison with other axchanges orderbooks volumes.

We use it on our bitcoin-analytics.com (http://bitcoin-analytics.com) service to calculate different bid/ask prices depending on BTC volume 10,100,1000, 10000, 100000.

I am surprized that your api do not provide full orderbook, especially that this was not explicitly stated anywhere :(

Is it possible to provide full orderbook mode?

From the docs:
"The L2 book shows the top 50 levels for each side. Each side is a list of the levels with bids being sorted from highest price to lowest and asks from lowest to highest. This makes the first element of the bid and ask side equivalent to the L1 book bid and ask."

I will look at expanding the REST order book levels. If you want a more detailed picture, use the websocket API for the streaming data.

Prices at 1$ and 2000$ are nowhere near relevant for current market activity. What do you glean from knowing that someone wants 0.01 BTC at 1$?. In some cases (equity exchanges, etc) trading wil leven halt if the price of the market moves too dramatically over a given timeframe.

I will look at expending the levels as I previously mentioned, but it will continue to be the inside book for some N levels. A full book may be available via REST in the future with some limited query requirements to make it clear that it should not be continuously polled. Users who want up to date info are strongly encouraged to use the streaming API and maintain their order book state. All of the above are advanced uses which target only a small faction of our user base.

Some heuristic bots might be very interested in that data.

Sure, or they may not be :)

It can be obtained via the websocket API. As I mentioned earlier, I will look at adding the full order book via REST, but it will have certain query requirements since polling it would be a waste of resources for everyone (even the bots). I don't disagree that this information should be available (and I will say again that it is ALREADY available via the websocket API, just not via the REST API).

Any idea why limit sell orders are approximating the fee to -0.4%? Don't limit orders get the +0.1% rebate because they are providers?

Coulda sworn the first limit sell order I entered approximated the +0.1% rebate... not anymore.

Limit orders only get rebates if they don't match an existing order.

If there were an existing order matched, wouldn't the limit sell have filled immediately? When I entered the second one, it didn't fill. So the approximation is now being made as if there were an existing order, when there isn't. (The first limit order with the +0.1% approximated didn't fill immediately either, so I cancelled it to add more BTC.)

The approximation is made for a worst case scenario (as it notes your actual fees may differ). The taker fee (0.4%) is used in the approximation since you must have that amount to enter the trade (it will be put on hold). Only after your trades go in and execute is the 0.1% rebate decided and given to you. It is possible for your order to have some part of it execute right away and another part remain on the book. These two parts will receive different fee treatments. All of this is only known after execution.

It just seems like something must have changed in the code, for the approximation to use -0.4% now, and +0.1% earlier. So earlier it was set to best-case scenario, and now it's worst-case, it seems.

The limit orders calculator was not approximating fees at all before. It now calculates the amount including fees which you will need available in order to place the order. It does not indicate final fees and is an approximation.

Weird. I thought the first time, I multiplied BTC to the furthest decimal place by unit price and got a slightly lower result on my calculator than the site showed. Oh well.

What is the usual turnaround time for emails to support@bitfloor.com for ACH withdraw verification?

-Dave

Usually a day. No ACH is processed on weekends so new ACH accounts are setup toward the end of the weekend in preparation for the new week.

Mine was less than 24 hours, around 12 IIRC.

Very easy to use and excellent support from shtylman.

Thanks,
Davecoin

They used to take Dwolla, I'm guessing they quit for very good reasons...like the fact that Dwolla is run by thieves and liars.

I'm very glad they don't, I have no worries that they'll be at risk of insolvency from Dwolla fraud.

It is also my understanding that dwolla doesn't like btc and will shut you down / freeze your funds. GOX had to get a special contract

Hi! sorry for my remark. I should first search before asking :)

I have read socket.io api docs carefully now as I am interested in implementing the book thru your api. And I even made some modifications to your example to analyze and prepare myself.
And I have a technical question if you don't mind. If you think this is not proper place for it please suggest where we can continue.

As I can understand from your api to build a book I first need to get full book and then listen for all events and modify the book state accordingly.
In general I have no problem with it except one thing.

As long as initial full book you provide in the form array of price/volume tuples and all next events arrive with order_id which can be used to find and select and filter orders to follow thier further state and alter or not the state of my local book.
What I stuck with is that initially I do not know ids of orders which are already in the book and thus I cannot understand how those already existing orders can be identified in subsiquent order events to be able to update local book correctly.

Can you please advice?

From what I can see it I would suggest to extend initial book response with order_id of each order currently in the book. this whould greatly simplify the task of keeping local book state.

thank you in advance

I'm thinking this would work similar to the Gox order book and socket.io API where the order id's aren't provided either.

You don't actually need to know the order id's, you just need to know the total volume at each price point.  So you keep a map where the key is the price and the value is the volume at that price.  Then you just update the values in the map at each price point as depth updates come in.

My concerns are about this:
in api docs we read

which basically mean that not all orders will make it into orderbook.

next we read that

And if right after I got initial book response there comes order_done event then I cannot tell for sure whether this done order was previously on orderbook or not, and thus cannot correctly decide whether to subtract the volume from local book or not.

What am I missing here?

It will be implied from the side of the order. Lets say you get an order done even for a buy order at a price above the highest bid you know about. This means that this buy could not have existed on your order book and you don't need to remove it. Like wise if a sell order done comes in for a price below the lowest ask, you know it was for an order which removed liquidity and does not require an order book update. Does that make sense? If you would like more clarification or examples please feel free to email support@bitfloor.com and I will be more than happy to go into more details. I will note that the websocket API is used on both our website and the clarkmoody site without issues so all of the relevant data to track the feed is there :)

Just finished the final option i didn't test previously which was the ACH withdrawl. Worked smoothly. Now
BitFloor really does rock.

bitfloor.com is down

http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/www.bitfloor.com

should be coming back online now. It was a power issue at our hosting providers data center.

Thanks!  I was just about to say it's back and post this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=105079

Is it back down?  I am getting timeouts trying to login.

Same here.

It's working for me now.

Website has been down for a few hours. What's going on?

Discussion thread here.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=105079.0

Sounds like API keys were revoked; there may have been a partial/attempted compromise.

BitFloor has reported a security breach.  No coins were kept in cold storage, and all coins from the hot wallet are now spent.  


 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=105818.0
 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=105819.0

now this is a good thread. lol.  ;D