Bitcoin Forum

I am interested in creating my own dice/gambling site (like Primedice and Just-Dice) and my own altcoin exchange (like Cryptsy and Poloniex). Does anyone know how passive such sites are? For example, writing a novel is passive income because once you write it and find a publisher, you don't need to do any work for the money to keep rolling in. Another type of passive income is a rental property - especially if you have a property manager, and automated trading where you write the trading bot and it does all the trading for you. Most large businesses also generate passive income for their owners.

So how passive is a dice site/altcoin exchange? Could I write a site using PHP and Javascript, announce it here on the forums, and then leave it alone and still get money? Since it would all be automated and the site will automatically skim the profits from the house edge or trading fees, am I correct in assuming that I won't need to do anything further other than maybe check to see how it's going every once in a while?

It all depends on how much traffic the site gets.

PrimeDice for example most likely earns up to a 100 btc a month, easily.

Altcoin exchanges need to be very secure as you could deal with 1000s of BTC too.

You would need to constantly work with the site to ensure it is updated and such.

There will be strong competition with Dice site - there are a lot of them. Players like to play in their own favourite dice, which they know already, so I would suggest even not to think on this

You'd be competing with the other larger sites with more funding and more recognition and reliability. You'd have to distinguish yourself somehow. But, it could be extremely profitable if done correctly, I would assume. Every now and then, you'd have to check in and update it, making sure it's secure, and stuff like that, but there shouldn't be as much work as there was required for setting it up in the first place.

Of course. Player wants to play in a dice game which has a big bankroll in way to win a great amount of BTC. So, I don't advice you to create a dice game, there will be many problem in future and it's very hard to grow up when there already are dice game like "PrimeDice" "JustDice" and "PRCDice".

If you're asking this question you're probably not suited to run one. You have to be a good coder or have a good team. You will have to be constantly on alert, and you have to spend a lot of time and money advertising it as these are risky and customers will prefer to use the established places.

Be careful otherwise you will end up losing a lot.

For example 24h volume on cryptsy= 2300BTC They have 0.25% FEE, so 2300*0.0025=~5.75BTC per day. But of course you have to pay for servers and electricity and maintainance.

You have to create a good marketing campaign, and remember the possibility that you may enter in losses

You will have to hire programmers to do the work you alone won't be able to maintain the website and it needs lots of investment too.And most important thing is trust.

Coinichiwa has gotten a lot of good reviews because of their "stop if balance if over/under x" options in their automated betting feature. I think you'd have a chance against the other more well known dice sites if you'd implement similar/better features.

Good luck though. :)

On a side note, I'm curious to why you chose "Mt. Gox" as a username considering everything that's happened.  ???

Sometimes they can cause serious headaches.

Like bugs in the site, people getting mega luck, people crying because they lost their money gambling, marketing things like signature programs, etc.

And include among the time and money consuming things laws and taxes.

It all depends on the amount of traffic you receive. But considering even minimum traffic (a few BTC volume on alt-coin trading), you can't just sit back on the couch and watch the show. Such sites require regular maintenance, updates and security checks to ensure users don't get hacked.

Also, given your username, I recommend naming your sites differently. Mt. Gox does not go well with most people here. :P

Hi.

I run BitsinoDice which is open source. https://github.com/Bitsino/BitsinoDice

Basically, no site starts out passive, but may become passive later. The flow of money is simple.

Visitors -> Registrations -> Deposits -> Profit ?

The problem is firstly getting traffic. Secondly a dice site runs a house edge typically of 1%, however this is an average over many bets, you could lose the entire capital of the site through a few lucky customers.

So even if you are able to get a constant flow of traffic you have to look out for security issues. A security issue could also wipe out your profit.

Good luck.

most popular casino and dice sites make 10-100s of btc daily, a gambling site should also require monitoring

The basics are the same for any sit,

More the traffic,

Better the earnings.

If you are looking to create the website and leave it alone and try to profit, I advice you not to bother doing so. Successful dice sites like just-dice, primedice, etc and exchanges do not simply create the sites and leave it alone. They have to constantly listen to he community's feedback and improve on it. You also need to regularly test out your site for vulnerabilities and provide support for your user. Thats the reason why Stunna has a development team and quit his job to manage the dice site. Dice sites mostly generate 1% of the total wagered amount in the LONG run, sometimes, you may have positive or negative profits but in the long run, it usually evens out to 1% profit.

After coding, you will need to spend time/effort/money to advertise your site and attract users to your new site with promotion and bonus.
And even after you have established a stable customer base, you will still need to make improvements, fix bugs, and organize some events from time to time to make your existing customers happy and attract even more new customers.

No, running a successful business requires a lot of work. You will have to be ready to fix any bugs that are discovered on your website. Additionally, you will need to constantly market your website, or run the risk of traffic to it decreasing. You may have to introduce new updates to remain competitive against similar websites.

If you think about it, there is no such thing as a truly passive business that is at its full potential. Even if you write a book, you will still have to market it, and work out deals such as merchandising or movie rights, which will make you even more money. If you just published it and left it there without doing anything, you would not make the maximum amount of money possible from your business.

Marked is almost full, you would need good marketing strategy and good developers, and with the current nickname you don't have even one of these.

Trustworthy dice sites with an investing option are something special. Currently, I would only trust Just-Dice because of many scams with the investing feature in a dice game.

cool, yes agree with it :)

That's true.

Last year, two big dice sites ended up becoming scams (or near scams) - dice.ninja and Dicebitco.in. Whether or not Dicebitco.in was actually a scam is debatable, but it's clear that a lot of people lost their money there. It was the biggest dice site that welcomed investors at the time and became very popular in the weeks after Just-Dice had closed. Dooglus even had them in their signature too which meant that a lot of people invested who otherwise probably wouldn't have done so. First there were a few problems with the site skipping winning rolls. Then some whale came who had a massive and highly suspicious string of good luck which devastated the site's bankroll. Then once everyone left the site, he came back and lost it all. Then the site announced they were closing.

Dice.ninja on the other hand, seems to have been a straight-up scam. No doubt about it.

Just-Dice is good and trustworthy but they don't use bitcoins. They use CLAMS which are an altcoin that you can only get by "digging" old wallets. There really isn't a proper dice site that is both trustworthy and uses BTC right now. Primedice is probably the only other trustworthy one but it doesn't allow investing. Because of this, there's a bit of a void in the market right now for a trustworthy dice site that offers investing using BTC.

Bitcoin Betting Guide posts reviews on dice sites he's invested in. Some of them look promising.
http://bitcoin-betting-guide.com/gambling-investments/gambling-investment-reviews/

He's also on the forum.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=213269

I'd also like to invest in Diggit.io, they're a bitcoin minesweeper site, but I haven't seen a lot of reviews on investing there.

The workload of running a dice site is much more than a full time job as you have to not only fix bugs and run marketing campaigns, but also to process users' queries and complaints.

I personally just use Just-dice to invest.

Way less bullshit to deal with and doogs a good dude.

Don't trust the page just because of dooglus.

Doog did me solid on Bitcoin.

Doog did me solid on Dogecoin.

I trust Dooglus more than I trust myself to hire someone to make something could even be in the same ball park as his place.

I trust that if someone could have taken the 60,000 BTC then they would have.  JD has time and tons of tries at the bankroll to prove its worth.

If you open a dice site... the chances are you'll have flaws found in your system by gentlemen who frequent JD and bug bounties are sweet :)

Once your site gets popular, someone will come in and take all your Bitcoin. They'd probably find flaws ahead of time. If it gets big, it would be great to hire a security team or open up a bug bounty program.

Just my .02

When a site starts getting popular, it's to be expected that someone will look for exploits. If the site managers can't implement proper security, I'm sorry, but they deserve to lose quite a bit. What they could do, like a lot of people, is offer bounties for when people DO find exploits, prior to release/during updates. There are reasons that faucets that pay 900 satoshis/10 min dry out within a day or two

Trustworthy Dice sites? Really? And I thought that if they have 'investment' option it is considered bad. Because they are trying to grab your money on many different levels. Imo Trustworthy Dice sited Do not have any investment options.

Its a high risk high variance business, lots of competition with exchanges or gambling sites.  If you manage to "make it" you then have to maintain your position so i dont think its that passive.

This is exactly what I just wrote . . .

Like it was said before you will need a lot of time to prevent cheating and solve bugs. If you rent a home, you may need a lot of time to deal with the problems and paperwork if you don't have a property manager.

Hire professionals who already have experience, otherwise you are almost guaranteed to lose funds through some exploit. Both exchanges and dice sites are very high risk targets.

At least one good professional who you can trust and who knows what he is doing.

The Bitstamp incident shows how passive the income of any money related can be

Nothing lasts forever. Exchanges have low fees and can use a fractional bitcoin reserve system that allows them to take cash out of the company.

You see, even Bitstamp lost funds. The very fact that you are asking here this questions shows that you are not ready to do this.

I would guess that it would be somewhere between passive and active income. Most of your income would come from the house edge for a dice site or trading fees for an exchange. This part is automatic since it is programmed into the software. There are some bits that aren't passive though. You will need to test the site for bugs and exploits, run marketing campaigns to attract new customers, run signature campaigns, answer customer queries, and update the site constantly to keep people interested and coming back for more.

If it's an exchange then you will need to perform security audits, add new coins, and delist old coins.

There are very few ways to make money that are either fully active or fully passive. I would guess that dice sites and altcoin exchanges are a mix of both.

If you can sell the exchange and keep a percentage of the revenue you would get a real passive income.

I do not think it is very passive. 

Dooglus was constantly responding to tickets on just-dice.  User dogedice.me has basically done what you are suggesting by having a dice site, actually a family of sites, as well as an affiliated exchange called simple swap.  He stops in once a day at least and there seems to never be a shortage of people asking for him in chat.

If you're really serious I'd suggest PMing some of the admins of the leading sites.  They might not welcome the competition, but still...

Good Luck!

ive got 0.01BTC on 3 days but not paasive
im active to trade on site exchange

Some dice sites allow investment to increase their bankrolls. You may try one, and it will give you a steady income till they take everything and run away.

As for running your own, it requires high level expertise.

OP was talking about opening a dice site or altcoin exchange and get a passive income from it which is not really possible.

Very much agree with others that you need to do a lot of work continuously to run your site. Otherwise you could lose your bitcoin to hackers and bug abusers, or you could lose your customers to your competitors. To be a successful business, you need to keep improving your service to retain customer all the time.