Bitcoin Forum

I'm not saying it is a scam, but if it is, just how much do you think he can make from it.

I don't know how many he managed to sell at $20, probably not a great amount, but how many has he sold from his pre-mine and how much longer can he go on for. I mean 12 million coins are still worth a lot of money even at 10 cents!

He's a genius. Hats off to him if it's a scam, has a lot of people convinced its still real.

Yeah it is.

The only thing that shocks me is how anybody can believe in such a large market cap so quick.  "At the time of valuation, PayCoin was also informally launched on 16th December with an initial investment of $54.5 million brought into the market" (http://www.btcfeed.net/fraud/paycoin-next-big-scam-crypto/) . 

A genius who had better move to country with no extradition treaties with the USA. That fucker will be going to prison otherwise.

Has he actually done anything illegal?

He committed fraud.

It is a good point though, in such an unregulated market what constitutes as fraud?

They committed fraud. Their 'business connections' and 'partners' dismissed and denied any relations with GAW.

Expect federal raid and arrests anytime.

Maybe in the spirit of ethical trading he committed fraud, but in law did he? I think he's been very clever dropping hints here and there and the rest of the community, or people with an interest in the coin have done the rest.

Yeah I would like to know whether laws on fraud stretch to cover cryptocurrencies, as the investors don't pay in US$ they pay in BTC.

Didn't people buy on his site direct for $20.

Mind you, they got exactly that they paid for: 1 Paycoin. Incredible.

He/gaw made millions upon millions.

There was supposed to be 100 million set aside to support the coin's price. It might be sitting in a nice little slush fund offshore by now.

Gaw was working on Paybase for months. All it is; is a very basic exchange for their own coin. Looks like a weekend project for a decent coder.

As far as Paycoin goes:

Gaw could care less. They made their money on it already. It will sink or swim on its own.
I can foresee desperate investors taking it over in the future after Gaw totally abandons it.
Its nothing we haven't seen come and go here before.

Its amazing that anyone would take GAW's promises on face value.

I think Gaw developed a loyal following in the early days by selling hardware and cloud mining.

Apparently he treated his customers well and many will attest to making money.

Declining prices pretty much made hardware and cloud mining a losing proposition. That's when the Paycoin idea was hatched.

Was it a grand exit plan? Who knows.

Current price: $ 6.63

I was told $ 20?

https://i.imgur.com/HnotyMB.png

For those too lazy to click on a link.....

https://i.imgur.com/HnotyMB.png

amazing people would buy something at once price becuz someone else guaranteed they'd buy it back at another.

why would they do that? i sell to you at 3 and buy back at the guaranteed 20 and i go broke....

I can't believe this fucking place...seriously, it's like another planet this crypto world, made up of kids looking to make money on whatever scheme they can think of next.  So many promised fantasies and half assed "projects" and coins....ugh.  2014 proved to be one giant shithole for this market...I hope 2015 improves, else it'll just be the same old crap with anyone trying to make fair/"legit" investments will just get burned.  sad.

Did he? are you sure about that.

Big words being thrown around here with very little actual evidence. and by evidence I do mean evidence, not baseless arguments, slander, rumor, hearsay, and articels by people that do not back up there claims with anything more then he said she said...

The only thing i've seen, read about is business practices that any business with a half decent team behind them would do

You all really need to grow up a little I think, or how about attacking Apple, Microsoft's, Starbucks business practices

No?

What the devs think....
http://i2.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/001/886/itprintsmoney.jpg
What the investors think
http://cdn.meme.am/instances/250x250/56701122.jpg

So over 4X what Ethereum raised.

Wow... impressive.

They will think of something. They have the money to do it and they aren't people who pack their bags and run.
The facts are that people, who bought hashlets from GAW early made a lot of money, those who didn't because bitcoin went down and mined hashpoints instead, also made money.
If you mined paycoin you also made money, so IMO GAW is a succesful company.

If you came to the party to sell early and bail without profit, don't blame them, blame yourself.

Rather than debate is it a scam or not (Sure this is covered in other threads) please can we have some reasoned debate as to how much Josh has actually made so far in dollars.

A) 10k
B) 50K
c) 100K
D) 500K
E) 1 Mill
F) 5 mill
G) 10 Mill
H) 50 Mill

At this point it would all be pure speculation

Does it really matter? he was reasonably wealthy before ya no.

or is his wealth the real issue here?

Just wondering how much he's made so far, scam or not, must be quite a bit.

Yes.

Fraud and fuck off.

I'll bite, what Fraud did he commit, and have you been to the authorities about it? what did they have to say?
can we expect a public statement, major news articles about this Fraud?

Well reasoned reply thanks for your input

Go to the other thread for your proof troll

But which one there are so many these days

/ignore

They've been a fraud long before Paycoin. Many trusted members tried warning people. Reap what you sow and all that

Many of those statements are just that "statements". Josh runs a well known website and if any of those "trusted" members had enough proof they would do crypto a favor and file a lawsuit to bring it down but I think majority of statements in crypto are personal statements rather than absolute truth.

Spoken like a true shill

Why would we sue something we are smart enough not to get involved in? Herp derp

If you aren't involved in something your statements will ALWAYS be biased one way or the other.

"Fraud is a deception deliberately practiced in order to secure unfair or unlawful gain"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraud

only because the market is not regulated doesn't mean fraud couldn't happen or wouldn't be punishable or even allowed. Many have missconception. Talking to your lawyers is recommended.

Correct. The US Government got involved in the Mt Gox Scam. This one is on their own turf. They will be coming for Josh and company once the complaints start to roll in.

After reading the wikipedia page I am going to have to agree with both of you. Interestingly enough, wiki states that: "That difficulty is found, for instance, in that each and every one of the elements of fraud must be proven, that the elements include proving the states of mind of the perpetrator and the victim, and that some jurisdictions require the victim to prove fraud with so-called clear and convincing evidence".

Looks like fraud, smells like fraud.... Just another day in our amazing alternate reality.
This community used to be full of libertarians and quality discussions, but that changed dramatically during the first Huge bull run from under $1 to over $30.

So, didn't get an answer from you guys so done my own digging.

Looking at the past activity on bitrex, the split with other markets and some assumption that maybe 50-75% of coins sold were solely benefiting Josh's pockets I estimate he's made between 2 and 5 million dollars from you lot.

If it's a scam then its a pretty good one.

It still is, if you know where to look and how to avoid the altcoin threads full of credulous greedy children/redditurds.

Check out the 'gold collapsing - BTC up' and various Monero threads for some great reading material.

Adam B, the Grandfather of Bitcoin, has been hanging out in the former for the last few days!   8)

Notice how all the shills have now gone silent and their attacks have stopped? Fuckers had a fork stuck in them. Done and Done! Fuck you GAW. Fuck you Paycoin. Fuck you Homero.

This paycoin fiasco dragged on much longer than I thought it would. It appears the end is near. 

I cannot believe the balls this guy has for perpetuating the scam. I thought he would have ran away with the money months ago but he just kept milking the "cult" of more cash.

Definitely enough to afford a new real lambo.  None of those 10+ year old used lambos and lambo kits he has been seen playing with.   :o


I lol'd at one of the emails which said he needed bodyguard security for some random town in Florida.  As well for spending money on escorts - that was clearly a market demographic study, you know if hookers accepted PayCoin that could result in drastic user adoption and a boom in capitalization...

I think Josh thinks he is European Royalty or something but reality nobody knows who the f*ck he is and Cryptonerds are limp wrist types who would never hurt a fly.  If nobody pounced on that fattie Karpeles, they're not going to start a fight with a guy who is like 2x the size of Karpy and has a bodyguard with a concealed weapon.

I think he sets to make 3-5 in the slammer