Bitcoin Forum

   Im pretty sure you've all heard about Josh's new escrow plan for PayCoin. Josh has tried to hype this, but it's obviously not working. If you have no idea what i'm talking about, just google it.

   The escrow system will begin on February 1st. I am begging the cryptocoin community to not fall for another trap by GAW. You invested your time and well earned money into PayCoin with the hopes of getting a profit in the end. Well that obviously did not happen. Did GAW suffer? No. Did Josh suffer? No. They blamed the community for their errors.

    I've created my own saying about GAW. When I see someone making promises I tell them to not pull a GAW. If something is to good to be true, it probably isn't.

    Remember the VISA partnership? I bet you forgot about that. What happened to the Paycoin Card? Josh has lied and failed to deliver on his promises. He sounds more like a politician.
  
    Do not fall for these lies. You can criticize me about my opinions but these are true. I made a a post on hashtalk talking about the scams and I was instantly banned and my post was removed. GAW censors post that they don't want others to see. I don't believe in Internet Censorship. Information should be free. Someone that censors information has something to hide or is embarrassed about it.

    Do you really want to spend more time and money on this? If a president completely failed his first term, would you re-elect him? GAW and Josh have lied to you over and over again. They continue to do it because they see you as gullible. Don't do something that you will regret in the future. GAW wants to take your money again. Don't do this escrow. Let Josh know how you feel about everything he has done. I have given you the information. The rest, is up to you.

You are right. After all the lies and broken promises how can anyone trust GAW? GAW will go bankrupt long before anyone gets their money. It will be a nice and clean exit for the GAW with a nice stash somewhere.

Everyone knows how easy it is to cook the books with altcoins. Every scammer has gotten away with it somehow. Even the outright thieves walk away laughing.

Let's face it, altcoins are a license to steal.

This is very true, hopefully there is some truth to the reported SEC investigation.

I do believe GAW started out good but got greedy. I hope they deliver. If not it (paycoin) will be another altcoin in the trash heap.

Josh has now said in this thread
https://hashtalk.org/topic/30401/honors-program-q-a/126
that he doesn't believe Paycoin will be worth $20 within 12 months. Big change on his part, it's like he wants you to put all your coins in escrow. (Escrow means Josh's wallet.)

So the terms are announced of 1st Feb, you then get 30 days to commit how ever much you want to the scheme. Once sent you can't get them back.

He will then split $100k worth of bitcoin per month pro-rata.

Being the honest person he is (lol) I expect these payments won't actually start until May so he can keep on dumping for as long as possible. If enough users are stupid, he might be able to make more money dumping then he does actually paying these $20 refunds per month.

Don't forget, the only person who knows how much is in escrow is Josh, so he might only be spending $10k a month. Obviously users will be all happy and saying Josh is our saviour and we are all getting our money. Meanwhile Josh is dumping more coins from his pre-mine and spending some of the windfall on buying back a tiny fraction of the escrow coins. So long as Josh is making more money from dumping then the refund he can keep this going for ever.

Anyway, at some point there will be more paycoins in the system cos he keeps dumping them, the price will not go up. This is where phase 2 comes in. He will give everyone the opportunity to join a new escrow buyback.

Now it doesn't take a genius to work out that Josh can't pay people $20 dollars that only paid him $5 or so for the privilege. But while his outgoings are less than his income he can continue to build his personal wallet.

Guy is a genius. Enron has come to the Altcoin market.

"They hate us cause they ain't us" - Josh Garza

You posted the usual FUD without any proof and your post on hashtalk was deleted and you have been banned for a reason.

The only FUD is what Josh says.

Think about it.

How much did people pay for paycoin on average? This is for new coins not those but on the resale market. But should also include coins that Josh dumped. I reckon maybe $5

How is he going to pay $20 when he only got $5 for each coin in general circulation.

He's not, simple. There is a catch somewhere, you don't seem to have worked it out yet.

No, they did not start out good, from everything I've read.

They started out taking orders for mining hardware they didn't have, and my understanding is that they just took the money, bought Zeus miners (maybe mined with them a while before shipping), then shipped some of those Zeus miners to people and called them GAW miners.

But then they kept taking orders for hardware and stopped shipping hardware.  After people waited a few months to receive the hardware they had already paid for, GAW eventually told them "You're not getting any hardware, but you can have these imaginary hashlets instead."

But the hashlets didn't exist, it was a ponzi scheme where they paid out a little bit at a time to make people think they were earning money.  But it was just "Give me $3,000 and I'll give you back a few dollars a day of your own money".

So it couldn't last forever;  eventually the money would run out...unless they could convince everyone to "convert" their hashlets into Hashcoins, Paycoins, HashStakers, and other made-up b.s. that GAW can create out of thin air. 

So GAW kept the dollars, GAW kept the bitcoins, and they made up a new worthless money to give people instead.  And people accepted it, based on false promises such as "guaranteed $20 price" and "XPY debit card" and "major retailer acceptance" and "Paybase services" and things like that.  You know, basically fraud.


So at what point was it a legitimate business of any kind?  Wasn't it all a scam from the start, which just kept morphing into different kinds of scams?

If any of my facts are incorrect, please tell us what really happened.

This guy gets it. Not sure how anyone can't see this...

Gaw never intended Paycoin to succeed. It is a well executed exit plan.

There are questions about the existence of Gaw mining farms in the first place. Did Gaw sell cloud mining with the idea to build the infrastructure from proceeds of hashlets? Maybe at first but why put the money into a dead horse when btc prices were falling low.

So Gaw is stuck with having to supply payouts to hashletminers while not bringing in enough money to support payouts unless delving into capital. Hashlets brought in a shitload of money. Why not improvise on the same theme?  Paycoin is born in Sept.

So they get the majority of their hashletminers mining hashpoints for months with the promise of riches. A feature filled Paybase with hundreds of merchants on board will arrive in Dec. And, yes, Paycoin will be worth $20 and that is a promise. People will be able to cash in their paycoins at Paybase for $20 and that is a promise.

In the meantime a once in a lifetime offer to exchange hashlets for hashstakers happens. Most everyone jumps on board. $20 Paycoins! Wow! Not only does Gaw get people to convert hashlets to hashstakers they sell a shitload of hashstakers.  

So... the time for Paybase to open nears. Paybase is delayed a couple times. In the meantime Gaw starts backtracking on promises. Incriminating posts, and threads are deleted on hashtalk. Dissenters are banned and shadow banned.

Finally Paybase opens. Guess what? No merchants, no Amazon, no Walmart, squat. No $20 buy back. It is a very basic website for exchanging Paycoin and btc.  Three months for this! Come on. Where did all the money go? Where is the 100 million Coin Adoption Fund? LOL.  


Paycoin did what it was supposed to do. Pump & Dump. It will die off and leave behind a wake of unhappy bagholders like so many other coin scams schemes we have witnessed. Gaw will have a pocket full of money don't worry.

Now we have the "honor payback" or whatever they call it. Another scheme to satisfy the unhappy-about-the-$20-floor crowd. Good luck with that. Recent Gaw history tells us bagholders are never going to see their money back.

The end.

It's stupidly simple: If it's too good to be true, it probably is.

Premises of Paycoin: buy one at less than $20 and receive $20 later for one guaranteed! <-- read first sentence.

Out of all the people who ordered hardware, how many of them ever received the hardware?

For the people who did receive hardware, how many months did they have to wait before they received it?

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NDgwWDY0MA==/z/tnwAAOSwQJ5UUT4D/$_35.JPG
http://cryptomining-blog.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/zeusminer-blizzard-1.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-v14lBhfjng0/U902tR4rM7I/AAAAAAAACxo/17g7R32bRQU/s1600/DSC_4393.JPG
http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/Nzk0WDEwMjA=/z/EYgAAOSwGvhUBl3D/$_35.JPG

I wouldn't know if your "facts" are correct or not for the simple reason there aren't any in your post... And, mind you, I don't say this as a bad thing -as you will find out below-, but as a matter of simple FACT. What you do is SPECULATE -and quite orderly so- and elaborate on what you believe to have been a scam, or ponzi scheme, from the get go... which is quite possible.

There are a few things that don't check out though, not completely. First and foremost, all that I read negative to Gaw, Garza or Paycoin, comes from a few individuals, you included. Less than half a dozen, who post basically the same theories here in BTCT. One would reasonably expect that if people has been giving big amounts of money, thousands at a time, to Gaw over many months if not more than a year and getting nothing or almost nothing in return, by now we would have quite a few quite angry people being quite vocal everywhere about the "scam", don't you think?

And oh yes I know only too well the kid of mass blindness that can occur in crypto when greedy, deluded people act -or stay silent- because they believe that bringing up the truth will cause them to lose more money, meaning sinking Paycoin even lower. I still believe that out of hundreds if not thousands of people, you would find at least a few dozens of unsatisfied customers\... to put it mildly. Where are those? Don't you think that if a lot of people who bought miners wouldn't have received the hardware at all, they would come forward and say so? Even if they were convinced that non-existent hashlets would cover their investment, many of them would protest EVEN IF THE SCHEME was true and favored them in the short and the long run. Miners are very peculiar people: They want their hardware. They want to touch it. They want to worship it. They want to warm their garages with it. They want to break up with their living companions because of it. They want to jerk off near them... and yet, I can't find anyone protesting angrily. That tells me they are rather satisfied customers. Not only that: Satisfied customers ready and willing to follow Garza and his projects by bringing in more money to invest. And yet, at this point, with the price of PayCoin in the gutter, they still, massively, support and believe in anything Garza says... ALL of them, not just a few, not even just a majority but ALL of them... while the only ones describing scam in all shorts of speculative ways, are just a half dozen guys who, by their own admission, never bought anything from GAW nor invested in Paycoin. I'm sure you see my problem with your scenario...

And, like I said above, the FACT that you don't have any facts but speculation, is NOT something that will put me off at all. As I have explained, I am quite familiar with the kind of amoral, greedy blindness infecting ALL of crypto that would silence quite a bit of the vast majority, regardless. If you read my THE WALL OF SHAME, you'll see that I fully support reasoned speculation to counter the shameful activities of so many in Cryptoland and try to protect the naive and/or new to digital currencies. But, as mentioned above, the reasoning in your speculation is flawed in my view. In other words: By this time, if your speculation was even remotely close to the truth, the clamor would be of humongous proportions and Garza would be forced to come up with much faster solutions to his troubles... or become a fugitive of the American justice. He's not even close to that at this point. So the question, again, remains: Where are all those unsatisfied customers that have been giving GAW thousands upon thousands of dollars, for many months, more than a year, without having ANYTHING AT ALL to show for it?

Without those, and in significant numbers, sorry but you have no case.

I knew these guys were crooks when I saw their hilariously bad photoshop image of their mining "warehouse".

https://i.imgur.com/hNgpugG.jpg

Hmm, If you read the cult following on hashtalk you'd think Josh could walk on water. But for a dose of reality look at the share price.

Mind you, some people think that 911 was all made up as well.

Only people promoting paycoin are people who would gain from it. Presume you're one of them?

So you're saying you would believe it, if people were quite vocal about it, but you don't believe the people who have been vocal about it.



Other than the "few individuals", you mean?  Or maybe you just don't pay attention.



ALL of them?  There are plenty of them here who are not satisfied.



Look at the pictures I posted.  

Look at the price of Paycoin.

Look at all the people who say their "guaranteed profitable" Hashlets are paying 1 satoshi per day.



You mean, there would be people boycotting Garza's appearance at the Miami Bitcoin conference, and Garza would be forced to change his planned speaking appearance?

Or do you mean that a crypto news site would report that the SEC is investigating GAW for illegal activity?

 

Where are they?  Some of them are still at hashtalk, being censored, and some of them come here to hype their investment even though they know it's a scam.

Lots more than half a dozen guys. Gethashing shows a lot of long time members and investors who were banned or shadow banned for asking questions and showing displeasure at hashtalk.

http://forum.gethashing.com/t/xpy-paycoin-discussion/90

Sorry but no, only about half a dozen people, all of them self-confessed not investors in GAW, either on the hardware, hashlets or Paycoin sides, post here unsubstantiated theories... when not outright falsehoods, like the pretended SEC investigation "reported by a news site". Obviously you do not know what a "news site" even looks like otherwise you would have already know from miles away that that site is nothing but the opposite of "news" AND that the "report" about the pretended "SEC investigation" was a total, fabricated falsehood. Even a pre-schooler would have identified both. Clearly.

And no, the "followers" continue following Garza, not complaining about promises not kept ... or hardware not delivered. Massively.

Trying to build a theory on falsehoods, as you did in this most recent post, not only doesn't work but actually destroys any semblance of credibility you may have attained with your orderly, though unreasonable, conspiracy theory of earlier.

Sorry, much less of a case, even.

AND I am far, far from sure that it is not an elaborate scam, ALL or at least the PayCoin part of it. It could very well be, I don't know. And, as stated above several times, the reason I don't know is because hundreds, if not thousands would have already come forward to protest unfulfilled promises. NONE -invested, that is- has done so. Only a total of about half a dozen -you can count them, including yourself- have done so. AND none of them, by thjeir own admission, has ever done ANY business at all with GAW.

So the "news site" is one of the "half a dozen people" you're talking about?

Since you admit that multiple websites are accusing GAW of being a scam, are you saying that the "half a dozen people" all have their own websites?

Or are you just full of shit?

Add in Coindesk, Cointelegraph, Altcointoday, Bitcointradingroom, Shapeshift.io, Dogecoin devs, Blackcoin devs, Neoscoin devs, and the Litecoin Developers, and I think "even a preschooler" can tell that your half a dozen people is a bullshit number.

I just took a look at that link you posted: NOT A SINGLE POST, not one, claiming it is a scam (GAW). Not a single one, not one, "exposing" unfulfilled promises regarding delivery of hardware. Not a single post, not one complaining about small payouts of hashlets. Not one. And those are supposed to be guys banned or shadowbanned of whatever you want to call it, from the main.

Again, it seems to me like the best possible endorsement of GAW's activities... not to mention full support for PayCoin.

But please, everyone comes here to BTCT, everyone in crypto. Why don't you start a list of people that can prove they have had wronged deals with GAW?

That way we could count them in exact numbers... and uh, ah, the ones, no matter how vocal, who only have theories about scams, well those do not count for now, ok?

That must be a hard case of wishful thinking, because I haven't stated such a thing... NOR actually exist "multiple websites" of any kind that have intended such purpose. Only a pretended "news site" -your definition, and none else, of course- has published a clumsy, obviously fake "report" about the "SEC investigation". Puerile to the point it wouldn't pass the scrutiny of a 5 year old kid... which seems to me it's about your mental age.

http://cointelegraph.com/news/113249/altcoins-dropping-off-coin-swap-in-boycott-against-gaw-miners

I know it sucks to see an investment doing badly(I still have hashstakers that I will most likely take a bath on). Hang in there bud miracles happen.

You are correct. Lots of theories and conjecture going on but Gaw supplied the ammo.  

Hey barabbas,

If you cashed out today how much money will you have made from the wonderful GAW?

Well, these days -months actually, even years- that is the norm (to see an investment doing badly), not the exception. That is not the point though.

And yes, Gaw supplied plenty of ammo with Garza being an obvious big mouth and with a launch plagued by significant problems, some of which should have been foreseen and corrected, no one is arguing that. What is in discussion though is if it was a scam. If indeed it IS a scam. And, as "charged" here, the continuation of a series of scams in a ponzi scheme.

So far those "charges" remain being pure baseless speculation and attempted by one a handful, less than half a dozen, inexplicably vocal and highly motivated individuals, none of which, by their own admission, having ANY financial interest whatsoever in either GAW or PayCoin.

Since you seem so interested, in spite of the fact that I have already told you my investment in XPY is very modest and I have traded, for profit, a few times already, I guess you would be interested in specifics. OK, my total investment is 2.5 BTC approximately. At the moment, after those trades I mentioned before, I own 170 XPY.

I hope this knowledge brings you a lot of satisfaction, which would be as inexplicable as your very vocal crusade against a project in which you have no financial interest whatsoever, as per your own words.

Anything to make you happy...

So currently about 40% down, I guess you need to see .015 to break even. Do you really think it will get there?

As you say, I have no financial interest in paycoin at all. A friend tried to convince me it was going to be huge, but the pre-mine was enough for me to smell a rat so I held back. He kept on telling me how this was going to change the world with wall street investment, credit card payments etc etc. I'm enjoying ridiculing his judgement at the moment but he continues to remain absolutely convinced that this is the best thing ever to happen and what a great investment it is. Can't even entertain the possibility that this is a scam. Sounds a bit vindictive but he really needs to wake up and smell the coffee as while he's lost a year's savings on this his wife is out working supporting them both.

So yes, I don't have a financial interest, but I do have an interest.

I've followed the whole process closely since I do have significant funds involved. Believe me when I say how unhappy I am with the way this has played out.

The lies, broken promises, avoiding questions/answers, censorship, bannings, hype, and dangling carrots from Gaw was enough for me. How can anyone say this is an above board operation defeats logic.

Please don't tell me there were no lies, broken promises, etc. Everything is well documented and available for public consumption.  

Because of this, Paycoin succeeding with merchant adoption and world wide acceptance is highly unlikely.  I think you know it and Gaw knows it. What is your exit plan?

My exit plan, since you seem concerned about it, is, obviously, to apply for my $3400 as soon as possible (the $20 per 1 XPY guaranteed in the Honor Program). If that is indeed honored, as I expect it to be, I will make a little bit of money on the thing AND I may reinvest part of it.

I haven't followed the GAW miners story, so I don't know about lies or promises broken there. What I know because I have read some of them, is that many satisfied customers praise the service they have gotten from them over a long period of time. Censorship, bannings and hype... it goes with the territory, doesn't it? I mean I personally detest the two former ones (there's no one, anywhere, which is more against censorship in ANY instance and for ANY excuse, than me. I have long established than whoever censors -or uses a "self-moderated" thread- does so only for one reason: He has something to hide, so there are no two ways about how I feel about those...).  That said, by the sheer nature of this project, the volume of posters asking question and repeated ones at that, would make it impossible to even remotely handle it in a satisfying manner for all involved. He, Garza, has the blog which is or should be more than enough. That he posts sometimes in that hash place, is simple a concession that he should probably stop for good. As for hype, for lack of a better word, is both inevitable and -in my book- good... when it is REASONED.
Loud mouth Josh Garza hyped PayCoin way above what was reasonable and reasoned. That, together with horrendous timing -debacle of BTC price-, put him and his project in the shambles it is now... together with opening his mouth about a bunch of things that he should have kept quiet about.

All that said, with a bit of help from the BTC market -first rebound was strong but now is going back down significantly again- and if he really has the money everyone assumes he has from the sale of PayCoin, he can easily buy back his credibility by carrying out the Honor Program for months without spending a single additional penny. I believe he will be compelled to do so. It just makes good business sense for it will allow plenty of time for a potential big rebound of the price of BTC, on one side, and for a rebound of the price of PayCoin itself when he can demonstrate that he's honoring his warranty, so it makes sense to me that he will do exactly that for at leas 6 months or more. And that in crypto is decades. In which anything can happen and all shorts of things WILL indeed happen.

I also seem to recall he, Garza, admits to trade heavily in BTC. If so, he surely made quite a mint riding the rebound from mid 160s to 310 recently and may be reading the moolah to do it again soon, if he is not already accumulating BTC in this retract from 310 -already a 25% haircut-. So there are many ways for him to make a lot of money even if PayCoin itself proves to be unsuccessful... which is far from a foregone conclusion.

And we haven even talked about PayBase yet...

So Josh sells most of the coins in circulation for an average of about $5. My estimate but I think it's close enough.

Where does he get the money to pay everyone $20 from?

If he has to rely on incoming investment to pay a monthly buyback then this is a Ponzi scheme isn't it?

Simple math: If he has sold 6 million coins at $5.00 each that's $30 million right there. 12 months at $100,000 in the Honor program will be only $1.2 million. He can be honoring the Honor program for YEARS! And presumably he also still have another 6 million XPY in reserve all for himself. Now, you tell me: Is there ANY other coin out there that can honor such guarantee FOR YEARS, years in which it can establish itself as a crypto of currency value while establishing at the same time a trading platform in direct competition with Coinbase, which is an enterprise already wildly successful? Not only there's absolutely nothing even remotely close, but this is, EVEN AS A PONZI SCHEME, way better than 99.99% of other coins out there possibly including BTC itself, ok?

Just imagine if there's no Ponzi scheme and Garza actually sold tons of miners, delivered them to satisfied customers and now sit on a gigantic mining farm, tons of his own money AND Wall Street investors ready to plunk tons of Fiat in PayCoin as it progresses and PayBase...

Sorry, I just KNOW you just don't want to even remotely imagine that...

You're plainly saying that a ponzi scheme could possibly be better than Bitcoin.

Since you love scams so much, you probably deserve to lose your money.  But there might be some people who don't know any better, and you're helping to scam them when you promote this scam.  You're willing to encourage others to give their money to a scam, and you're not even benefitting.  So you've crossed the line from being a typical con victim whose own greed is used against him, and now you're a cult member.

I wouldn't get too excited about the Honor program yet. Details have yet to be released. The only thing I heard Gaw commit himself to was the $100,000.00 *minimum* payout a month. I expect the shit to hit the fan next week as numbers start coming to light.

He has to implement something to avoid litigation so expect it to be the bare minimum. The main reason for procuring a legal team I understand.

Barrabas, in the Bible, was a criminal who was released instead of Jesus, because of shills stirring up the mob.  So in your religion, Josh Garza is Jesus, falsely accused just because he was better than everyone.

Or maybe you're the shill trying to sway the mob. "Only about half a dozen" bitcointalk threads show up on a google search for barrabas shill, and they're talking about you.

Stargazer, I've read more than one source saying people who were waiting on pre-ordered hardware from GAW ended up getting cloud hashlets instead.

If that's the case, it fits the ponzi model of business.  Take orders, use some of that money to buy and ship hardware, take more orders, don't ship the hardware.

Now you have crossed several lines in a very clumsy and extremely stupid attempt that naturally fails as it should: I am not helping anyone to promote anything, first and foremost. I am debating, and reasoning, why in my personal opinion, it is more likely than not that PayCoin will honor their Honor Program. All the rest of stupid nonsense, you volunteer it, associating it, to more ridicule, with some biblical references thatare as idiotic as your "argument". I am done with you, sir. Fuck the hell off.

I certainly don't expect more than the minimum for the time being. And it is a very wise way to cover his ass by Josh Garza for no one can accused him of not honoring his promise... while, at the same time, gaining precious time if BTC is to ever rebound and PayCoin and PayBase to gain real traction and credibility.

And all for peanuts compared with what he has already collected.

I find the strategy quite brilliant, actually. And it could very well work in the end, favorably, for all involved.

.

What is that supposed to mean?  I have to stop posting or something?

All I did was post a summary of GAW's history, most of which I learned on this forum, and I said to correct me if I'm wrong.  You responded with personal attacks and bullshit instead of providing any facts to dispute what I wrote.  So what line did I cross that you didn't cross first?

Well, I admit I haven't crossed the line of ignoring reality and making stuff up.  Therefore, in the interest of fairness, I will follow your example and call it "half a dozen people lying for no reason", if 4 major altcoins ever boycott me.

I have to agree with you on this one sir.  Nice to see we are making progress without slinging a lot of mud at one another. LOL.

OK, that means he has to have $24 million to honour the buy back, he is $18 million short. He also has to pay his staff and other costs over this time. So where does he get the money from?

Answer
a) Josh is the most stupid businessman and will go bust in 2 years.
b) He's just pumping the price up further so he can continue dumping before running of before payments start in May/June.
c) It's a Ponzi scheme.


I think it will be c), Josh will only pay a token amount of refunds at $20 but claim he is paying £100k a month. This will allow him to continue scamming with various options open to him. All of which allow him to continue to sell his pre-mined coins at an inflated price to gullible investors.

Of course a reputable company would let you see an audited set of accounts before asking for investment, is one available for GAW? I'm guessing not.

He might have more money he has put his house up for sale.

Is he:

a) Selling up so he can pay everyone $20 a coin like he promised cos he's a really nice bloke.
b) To buy a bigger house cos he somehow has acquired a lot of money from somewhere.
c) He would like to live somewhere hotter, without an extradition treaty.
d) b + C

If Gaw was serious about Paycoin, he would have hired a real CEO when the shit hit the fan in Dec. It was the only way to salvage Paycoin after all the lies and broken promises.

Turning the company over to someone with credibility and an action plan would have went a long ways in rebuilding trust.

Instead, he allows Paycoin to become a pariah with little or no hope of credibility in the real world.

I am going to disagree on that, again. PayCoin IS Josh Garza. For good, bad and in-between. Removing himself from it would mean instant death of the project. And as for "someone with credibility", who would you suggest off the top of your head? Not anyone in crypto, that's for sure, I assume? No one but no one, no exceptions, no excuses, in crypto has ANY credibility, any at all. There are those who have credibility within a group of nutcases that lack any at all withing another group of nutcases. That's how the cookie crumbles. And please, lets not forget that crypto is the Land of the Nutcases, period. As for someone from outside, well, in the Land of Nutcases, anyone from outside would be immediately lacking any credibility whatsoever, so...

"Money walks", that's how the saying goes... even in Nutcase's Land, so the ONLY way to gain credibility, is by giving money, especially the money GUARANTEED, to the people that invested. And, as far as current info goes, that is exactly what Josh Garza intends to do. If and when he has disbursed half a million dollars after 6 months in the Honor Program, you can be quite sure that most everyone (there's always the nutcase's group that wont, regardless) will give him a lot of credibility. Nothing else will at this point. He knows it and most people know it. And, all in all, it is so clever that it is probably the cheapest way ever to buy credibility.

We will see soon enough if indeed that is the path chosen.

nan

Honoring the $20 guarantee will go along way with the Gaw faithful. Some of those will forgive and forget. Investors will be; "Phew, that was a close call. Won't take another chance on this shit."

You have to admit all this controversy is going to be next to impossible to overcome. Major merchants and business will never align themselves with something this sketchy. New investments will not be incoming.  Too many "fraud" and "scam" headlines in a google search.

The bottom line is GAW is not trustworthy.

Do you remember the Halloween shitstorm with XC and Blocknet? Both these coins/tokens are worthless now. The only ones trading are the cult members.

I sincerely hope paycoin lives long enough to satisfy investors but the future is bleak.

Once again I disagree. Buying credibility is akin to buying "worthiness", therefore PayCoin will be -if that scenario pans out- by far the most credible and worthy of all crypto coins. By far. And its price will reflect that.

Now to put a confirmed scammer like Dan Metcalf and his goons in the same sentence that Garza SO FAR, is ludicrous.  And extremely disingenuous.

Again, unless you just want to increase the Google count for those catchy terms, to pretend that wild speculation -and outright lies - have any weight at all at the moment is simply futile.

I remember Spoetnik tore them a new asshole over Blocknet, I miss that guy, total FUDmaster but was pretty much spot on all the time. Probably a good thing that he wasn't around for PayCoin, would have been a shitstorm of epic proportions.

Wonder if he ended up in jail or mental institute? Cannot see him leaving this forum otherwise. Unless ... the Xc/blocknet cult got to him ... LOL.

No idea, I figured he would be back by now but I guess he proved me wrong.

hmmmm.... zen cloud has a big red Cloud mining disabled message on the interface.....


Guess we can add the Always profitable, never obsolete promise on the list

GAW is a bunch of thieves and Paycoin is a scam but I've got 2 GAW Black Widows.  They sold from stock, no wait at all.  The fact that they were just rebranded Zeus miners was never a secret or covered up.  They did start out as a quality reseller of ASICs, it was with the vaultbreaker and hashlets that everything started going downhill.

I hope you people will open your eyes and see the truth.

Today will be make or break day for xpy,If he goes back on his $20 promise or makes years of payback time he is totally finished straight away

Read this topic, people are still denying that fact.  So it's either a secret to them, or they're covering it up.

Dude, I hate GAW and XPY just as much as the next guy.  Josh Garza should be in prison.  We are on the same page on that one.

But harping on this completely unimportant old news is not productive toward continuing to spread the word about GAW's true crimes.  Anyone who is denying the fact that GAW sold rebranded Zeus miners simply doesn't know what they are talking about.  As I said, I own 2 GAW Black Widows purchased directly from them.  This fact was never covered up.  Everyone knew about it.  It was common knowledge at the time.  I purchased from GAW rather than directly from ZeusMiner because GAW generally offered better prices to the little guy who only wanted 1 or 2 miners.  Zeus seemed to be more about the bulk sales.

http://blog.paybase.com/status-of-honor-program/


I think we can safely say this is the END of paycoin as far as Gaw is concerned. I don't think we will hear much more from him going forward. We will hear lots from the losers with the usual lawsuit and "lets track down Gaw" types of threads.

Perhaps the community can resurrect paycoin later on but they will have to change the name to shake off some of the scandal.

That is your conclusion? You do know that wishful thinking doesn't achieve anything, right?

PayCoin will eventually thrive. And the Honors program will go into effect ON SCHEDULE... your wishful thinking notwithstanding.

This is too funny. Such an obvious scam, yet people have deluded themselves into believing that some guy is going to pay them $20 a piece for their (nearly) worthless tokens.

Really?  I see you around here a lot, you are fairly well known.  I don't have very much of an opinion on you personally but I know you have a lot of haters.  Whether I agree with your opinions or not though, you always seemed to at least have your head on your shoulders.

How are you still buying into this bullshit?  How can someone who seems to have a brain and a pair of eyes not see through Garza's bullshit?  How can you willfully ignore the mountains of false promises, backtracking, incompetence, and out and out lies?  How do you not see the irony in a Paycoin supporter calling someone else out for "wishful thinking"?

It's just hard to believe anyone has drank so much of the GAW kool-aid they still believe their bullshit.  It's silly to even argue anymore.  If you still believe at this point, nothing will change your mind.  Good luck.

Hey Bud. The honors program is running a little late. Could you let us know the minute it starts so we can buy some really cheap coins to get in on this once-in-a-lifetime-offer? Thanks.

I will, promise. Oh, and just to clarify, the Honors program's RULES were to have been announced on 2/1/2015; the actual implementation of the program was to run exactly a month later.

I know that facts are not of relevance to you but, as it stands, the program could easily be implemented ON SCHEDULE. We'll have ton wait till March 1st to see if it is in fact delayed of not. I also promise to keep you posted on that.

Looks like its happening already. Paycoin Foundation aka: bagholders taking over the reins. This is too funny and so predictable.

Btw, how's that $20 buy back coming along?

Well price actually starting to rise again

The jury is in. Paycoin/Gaw was a monumental scam right from the get go. Garza has disappeared. Hashtalk is gone. Only thing left is worthless coins, zenminers, and butt hurt investors. I thought it fair to end this thread accordingly.

Sorry barabbas. Hope you didn't lose too much. (sincerely)

Yup pretty much, people are lawyering up over it. I actually talked to some of the Team PayCoin guys a few months ago, some of them seemed quite nice and were/are trying in spite of all the things going on. I haven't heard anything from any of them in such a long time that I don't know who is still around there and last I heard there were people sort of moving away from it and doing other stuff.

There was no way to continue once the stink of scam permeated everything Gaw related.

Paycoin will go down in history as one of the most blatant scams ever witnessed in this space. 

Sadly, cryptocurrency is a scammer's paradise.