Bitcoin Forum

According to a PayPal spokesman:

"Due to the recent decisions of the Greek authorities on capital controls, funding of PayPal wallet from Greek bank accounts, as well as cross-border transactions, funded by any cards or bank accounts are currently not available. We aim to continue serving our valued customers in Greece in full, as we have for over a decade."

http://qz.com/444188/paypal-no-longer-works-in-greece-and-why-that-matters/

In another words:

Those who already have money in their paypal accounts can use it but those who want to deposit money can not do it.

This will certainly be a positive development for Bitcoin. Overall, the situation in Greece could turn out to be very good for Bitcoin Holders. This could deeply impact the price before the Bitcoin  halving early next year!
Let's just wait and see what happens.

BTC seem a good option in Greece today.
If I were in Greece I would rather receive BTC to a personal wallet than Euros in a bank account which can't be accessed and may well be wiped out.

I hope paypal do the same for every other country then there will be no options left for people ...
c'mone Greece ! Switch to Bitcoin , find your hapiness and make us happy by bumping the price like hell ;D

it would be interesting to know what greece people think of this, if there is someone that live there, i would ask him if he is using bitcoin now, becaue many there don't even know what bitcoin is, especially old people and women...

but it's indeed true that paypal is helping bitcoin indirectly in this way...

A long way to go for Bitcoin, still Fiat currency has a good strength, about the Greece, those who have knowledge about Bitcoin they might be considered as an option, and for others it is merely word of mouth passing to them to secure their money.

That's a pretty brutal measure. At this point Bitcoin is objectively the best way to move money in and out Greece hands down. Too bad most people still are ignorant about it.

Paypal isn't doing much that it wasn't doing before. It's the dependence on the banks that it has that is limiting them. It still works but people can't use their bank accounts to finance their paypal.


The country isn't going to switch to another currency they can't control. And the people don't have the money to do so now.

It's not paypal's fault Greece has capital controls. Greeks can't fund their paypal account because Greek banks can't send money out. This is where Bitcoin trumps the banking system. Government can shut down an exchange, but they can never put capital controls on bitcoin, unless they shut down the internet.  ;)

Lots of people just think of Bitcoin as a mobile payment system, just like Paypal.
It's always good for there non-bitcoin entities to show thier real colours in moves like this.

Yeah, I guess Greece might have seen online transactions as a threat and an escape of the money which they might lose out. also, paypal might have thought about how Greeks might turn to paypal in need and give a rise to new scams, so they'd rather let this go than try earning revenue from a doomed country.

Maybe I missed something but the only restrictions are the capital controls that were in place this week right? It's not that Greece banned online transactions. Or that paypal banned Greece. Despite the title of the thread. It's that unless you had money in your paypal account already, you can't now fund it with your bank account. You can still receive payments with it though.

I think it would be a great idea if Bitcoin users that are currently in greece would socialize Bitcoins
Like, explaining what's bitcoin and their functionality or maybe visiting houses and telling them about the Bitcoins
But i think it's too late for all of that  :P

It is not too late for the other countries. It is a good lesson for us to realize the benefits of bitcoins comparing with centralized fiat money! If we act now, it is not late for us! The ironic thing is that the masses is so dumb to watch Greek's event.

In the end, paypal is also an ass kisser of decentralized currency, no matter how they deal with electronic banking system, they themselves are a kind of a bank. Their deal with xoom recently might spike some interest for bitcoiners though...

they cannot, they have their hand tied, they should have bought bitcoin before the default, now it's too late for them, the smart guy may have some funds in a abroad bank or in another paypal clone, maybe skrill?

those can still do something to save their economic situation

This is the same as Western Union has done. Paypal has to operate within the laws that a country puts in place, clearly they didn't want to deal with managing the restrictions Greece has temporarily deployed on conducting international transactions and/or the $60 withdrawal limit. This isn't some scandalous or brave declaration against the establishment, it's more of an admission of respect for it.

That is correct. The local Bitcoin exchanges in Greece also will be following the government orders, rejecting all cash deposits from the Greek residents. If they refuse to comply, then they will be banned by the government. The referendum is scheduled for tomorrow, and I hope that the banks will re-open shortly after that.

In recent economic crisis in Greece i think bitcoin is a better options for Greece people's where they can easily play with their money

Yeah, its too late for that. Even any collateral damage cannot be stopped because Government has given all such services a pretty decent warning that if they fuck around with their citizens, they'd be banned directly. They cannot accept any deposits as of now. Any hope for better survival can only be told in the next 2-3 days, when major events are about to take place.

Good info and view on the situation, thanks!

So far I felt that PayPal since operating online should remain relatively undisrupted in such a scenario. It's good to know that if my country suffered the same faith, my PayPal funds were just as useless as my banking funds.

I assume though that PayPal funds can be accessed without restriction for transfer within the country? So technically I could pay my bills and similar with PP, assuming it is accepted.

I think that this is nuts because the capital controls are probably only a temporary measure like they were here in Cyprus. Paypal here is also restricted but I think we had the same happen over here when the banks closed for three whole weeks.

There are major events taking place right now. Tens of thousands of people have gathered in Athens for two rallies, held by the yes and no camps. Greek prime minister Alexis Tsipras expressed a “proud no to ultimatums and those who terrorize you”. He then tweeted that Greece will be sending a “message of democracy and dignity to Europe and the world”. Rallies showing solidarity with Greece’s anti-austerity movement are also being held in other European countries, including several German cities and Rome. Shit is getting real  :P :P

Bitcoin may be a good option for Greece at the moment but Greece at this moment needs to be speculative and be very careful of the way it will handle its expenditures. Technically Greece shouldn't have joined the Euro zone countries and frankly it wasn't even eligible but how it managed to show that is still a wonder. Not only awareness on cryptocurrency is needed they also ought to learn more about economic strategies and policies.

So, Who is the loser here, Greeks or PayPal, according to me it is PayPal. They lost the revenue and also loose the reputation to Greeks while they are experiencing bad economic conditions at present. If PayPal think Greeks are valued customer then they should take a read following note too.

“A customer is the most important visitor on our premises. He is not dependent on us. We are dependent on him. He is not an interruption on our work. He is the purpose of it. He is not an outsider on our business. He is a part of it. We are not doing him a favour by serving him. He is doing us a favour by giving us an opportunity to do so.”

(MAHATMA GANDHI)

bitcoin is a great alternative for every one world wide. not only greece. but they are too late now. smart people would have bought bitcoin way before this drama.

even it is not good news for Greece and people living here, it is actually amazing news for Bitcoin and another argument in pocket, why stop being slave of fiat and some authorities, which can do anything with your OWN money..

maybe one day, there will be no paypal anymore..

it could explain why they have still not adopted bitcoin, because they cannot control it, i'm talking about paypal...

take this ban of Greece for example, if paypal had adopted bitcoin before the greece's departure, now they will not be able to deny the deposit of their money, unless they  remove the bitcoin payments altogether

Does anyone know how much business Paypal was doing in Greece before this decision? Is this really a significant decision for them to make? If they don't facilitate many purchases in Greece this could be a non-story.

There are lots of people that have given the middle finger to paypal and are already accepting BTC in greece thanks o the bank.
http://www.thepressproject.gr/support/confirms
This page is pretty big in greece and now they accept BTC, so thanks paypal.

i doubt they were doing anything significant, greece's people were only buying the essential to live in their last years, before their default on loan happened

also i do not think paypal is stupid, they have calculated that there won't be a great revenue from leaving greece among the countries they sustain

I hate PayPal, I've seen terrible things come out of the service. I cannot wait until the day when currencies such as Bitcoin surpass services like PayPal.

Their currency is pretty much devalued. They're literally thinking about an exit. Paypal is basically honoring the money that's previously been deposited into the accounts, or, have been funded from other PayPal accounts, but they aren't allowed them to deposit more funds because they know it's next to worthless. Adding to that, the Greeks are already having to endure other bank and ATM limitations. Not looking good. I won't be surprised for other payment services that support Greece (if any) to slowly withdraw as their situation worsens.

So it begins the banning of online payment options will trigger a massive movement in other centralize payment companies to follow the ban, once the online payment user cant find a exit to their online transaction bitcoin will become the solution.

ban all centralize payment solutions bitcoin is left standing!

Perfect example of why Centralized payment systems will one day (hopefully within my lifetime) be a thing of the past!

It's unfortunate that the issue is bank related but it does illustrate the weakness of being dependant on a financial institution to manage funds, that said their are benefits in the transferability of Bitcoin and the movement of capital with these type of concerns the finance of the future will be interesting whether its punishing austerity or strengthening the economy a better system to protect a persons assets is something that is becoming a serious issue in Greece.

I do not think that until countries with central governments exist, a decentralized currency would be possible. A government wants and needs control over the official currency, at least to some extent. It's more likely that such currencies would co-exist next to the traditional system.

paypal is not country-friendly.
People in India complain about not being able to receive payments. And now it is outright banning nations?
Hopefully paypal will implode soon  ;D
There are so many other options available and since they did a 180 on bitcoin I don't see myself using their high fee based payment system in the near future.

https://i.imgur.com/IZN5V6h.jpg

It seams that bitcoin is currently trending in Greece, and this situation with paypal is just adding fuel to the already large fire.
Where other payments are failing, bitcoin is thriving it seams.

cheers

Yeah, I might agree to that but that's how we all should evolve our economy and our nation to be like. How can we expect the trades to be fast, free and friendly if all of it is controlled by a system, especially a corrupt system. So would we let a corrupt system control something they have no right over, just to find corruption bye others? Good irony.

That is how the world works, buddy. They will always try to have a higher hand above everybody, because they think they have special powers and they are special, that they are above us. I think there must be an economic revolt which will change things for better, for good. We can't convince the government, we can only convince the people for their own betterment.

I don't know about country friendly paypal or if it's not, but I have been using paypal for a long time, it has been a very helpful way of transaction for me before. Yes, I also use bitcoins and even trade in it, but I don't want to compare paypal, its not going to be a decentralized currency being adopted, is it? Also, I've transferred money to India often and never heard any complaints. Idk what you are saying.

Yeah it is pretty surprising lol, maybe this is an opportunity for bitcoin. As PayPal wallets in Greece is unavailable for now, in the meantime, the customer deposit for btc have increased by a 400 percent from May to June. Maybe Greece can help bitcoin.

Can someone explain to me if what's going on here???
Is it true that paypal banned greece? Why?

Now I read, I did not see this thread so far. Where are from this informaton about Paypal ban Greece?

Read the topic. It's related to the capital controls imposed back in July.  No conventional finance operator could've been used to move money out.

This banned has one postive development for Bitcoin. Overall, the situation in Greece could turn out to be very good for Bitcoin Holders. This could deeply impact the price before the Bitcoin 
Bitcoin will rule thw world lol k can't say rule but u undereit on ur own

The bad thing at Greece is that they are restricted to use and moove their money,even trying to get bitcoin to avoid government control of their economies,one thing has been show when country faces a problem they control banks and restrict them,with bitcoin investment ,they cant do nothing against it and will be the way out to protect our precious savings.

Posted this a while back in regards to the adoption of bitcoin in South American countries but it also apply to Greece with these capital controls.

Watch the governments of this world becoming the biggest drivers of bitcoin adoption.

I just came across this article on Business Insider. Its not about Greece but about Europe and what some have planned in regards to controls on banking activities.

If you think it's just Greece that have problems then read it. Controls in several other forms are on its way for most of Europe.

http://www.businessinsider.com/banks-discussing-negative-interest-rates-for-consumers-2015-10 (http://www.businessinsider.com/banks-discussing-negative-interest-rates-for-consumers-2015-10)

Well uh, Greece has capital controls paypal wasn't really prepared for that. Some paypal services aren't available to Greeks to avoid money laundering during capital controls and other services aren't accessible or are very limited due to the capital controls. There are indirect ways to fund a paypal account for Greeks, so the title is an exaggeration.

You need definitely PayPal (or credit/debit card). Because you need definitely fiat money. The fiat money which is used in your country. Bitcoin is known only by you and by me. This is the cruel true. No one or to many few merchants accept it. You can use bitcoin to transfer your money but that's all. Here finish its duty. Then you will need other kind money to live you life.

Just thinking about the situation in Greece. I don't know if the restrictions (60 EUR from ATM etc) are still live but I've heared that foreign people (tourists) were not restricted, or at least were able to pay with their cards at POS terminals, because their card was not issued by a local bank.
In this case a possible solution for greek people could be a Bitcoin debit card to pay with or to try to withdraw cash with. If this works, the only question would be how to fund the bitcoin wallet the bitcoin card is attached to. But I don't know if restrictions are over or not.

The bitcoin debit/credit card can be a solution only for those who are profits or salary or any other kind of revenue in bitcoin. If not, what to do with such card? How or where to find the bitcoin to spend if you have not source from where you can have those? You can use your money to have bitcoin to charge the card with those but why this way to use your money? You can use these directly.

Then the use of bitcoin in such way is not a good move according to me. Spend big amounts of bitcoin in this situation is loss. I hope (I think are to many and not me only) that the price of bitcoin go high - at least with the halving. So it will be a big loss to spend to many bitcoins now (this could be the amount needed to make normal life) when after 8-9 months these can have bigger value.

Thoughtful! Their economy is in chaos. Ppl there have no btc or fiat income. How could they build the bitcoin ecosystem or consider to adopt it? Abandon paypal and adopt btc is just our delusion.

i have not upload my ID with paypal, what you're talking about?

but i would fuck paypal anyday, just because of their stupid high fee, it's only nice to use in some website that are unknown and you need to buy rare thing, like specific supplements

There are not to much possibilities that some country (whosoever be that country, and less more Greece) adopt bitcoin as its money. Normally, no one country can adopt as its money a currency that is not owned by it, that is not controlled by it and that, the big amount of it is in circulation out of it. Then, if overpassed the above and the country decide to have bitcoin as its currency, that country need to buy big amounts of bitcoin to begin the monetary life in this country (to be able to maintain and pay the public administration, the public services, the policy, the army, the other governative agencies etc. depending from the public structure that country have). This is totally impossible for the Greece because have no money to do such operations. It will be hard to do such conversion even for one more developed and powerful countriy and not for Greece which it is in sore straits.

There is some localbitcoins where you can sell and buy bitcoins,but countries are ajusting their control over the banks to stop someone to get all savings and invest at bitcoin and when the people need fiat they could sell them,but those would require a huge ammount to handle such thing.The same way several stores had open to buy gold ,and where you can convert your gold into fiat or fiat into gold.

A lot of confusion here so let me clear few things. I live in Greece myself so I know what's going on.

---

ATM cash withdrawals are limited to ~400€ per week.

Paying taxes, buying from stores, transacting money to individuals or companies with an account in the country is done electronically without limits.

Remittances by individuals headed outside of the country are limited to 500€ a month.

Paypal hasn't banned Greece, Greeks were locked out from using it's features for a while but as capital controls loosened we're now able to use it (with the limitations in place).

Prepaid card paysafe had completely shut down it's services but is now offering normal service for consumers that want to buy products or services from companies using paysafe and have registered offices within the country. (selection is limited though, big names like steam aren't registered in Greece.)

Companies can transact money but transactions go through approvals from committees set in each bank.

There's currently no reliable way for Greeks to buy bitcoin. Yeah, believe it or not, despite all the hype we still have no reliable way to buy bitcoin even after capital controls have become less strict.

Bitcoin debit cards exist and are accessible by Greeks, they work normally with no limits in Greece too (as any card issues without a Greek bank would work). However, as there's no way Greeks can conveniently convert their money to BTC it's kinda pointless for people that didn't already own bitcoin to use one.

Cards issued with Greek banks allow to process certain transactions with companies outside Greece. Some activities like gambling and gaming are excluded and on top of that there's also a monthly limit.

Unfortunately I don't think the world or the Bitcoin are ready for such a huge Bitcoin use. We will get there in few years but until then customers worldwide will need PayPal and other payment methods. I am just being realistic here!

It's surprising PayPal cannot agree with the T&C of any country or it's the opposite case. They dislike Sri Lanka as well and it seems Sri Lankan PP accounts cannot receive PP funds. Even with regards to my country India, RBI doesn't allow PP to hold any funds and hence even a small amount as $0.1 is withdrawn to my bank within 2-3 days of it getting deposited into my PayPal. BTC is much better as till I don't make a transfer, the coins remain safe in my wallet and it is not regulated by the Government as well.

Once the lightning network is operative (and maybe the blocksize is increased a bit) I can see Bitcoin being a major player on future similar events in this and other countries, but until that day, we can't say that Bitcoin can replace the currency of those countries, it's not an alternative. People of course, can dindividually decide to use bitcoin as a way out from their governments at any time.

I hope it does not happen in the region of Southeast Asia, especially in Indonesia, because at this time is in need paypal for my foreign transactions, like when to know that at this time paypal is the only site accounts that were able to connect with many banks in the whole world

I counter that; as i believe that's exactly what's needed for bitcoin to become more popular there as well, if the other payment options get nulled.
You can use bitcoin for any transaction almost, because many sites are starting to use bitpay to process transactions, and you can transfer person to person funds via ATM or exchanges.
Don't really see what's making you stick with paypal, bitcoin is way better imho.

OK but you can't compare Paypal and Bitcoin, paypal is only a system, connecting seller and customer, with a money exchange function, but Bitcoin is not only like this but it's a currency itself too.
You can't compare them because people usually know paypal but only some of them know about Bitcoin yet, but hopefully it will get more widespread in the near future.

 I can tell you that pay pal isalso banned to Catalunia in Spain and  some other Spanish areas
But so what,thayare much better simillar to pay pal services,from UK,available forany EU citzens,Neteller for example

We'll never know what the future holds, but still it will depend on the economic stability of a particular country.

no store accept bitcoin there? you can always buy online if you want, and anyway open bazar is coming, every9one around the wolrd will have a chance to buy stuff with bitcoin directly

The reason people choose PayPal as it's not only legal to accept PayPal payments but PP is widely recognized and adopted as a payment method by many online shopping websites and it allows withdrawal to the banks.

Bitcoin is getting popular day by day but many countries have made this currency illegal and very few online shopping websites do accept bitcoins and they aren't even popular websites. Though it's easier to deal in bitcoins, we need to understand that till it doesn't get legalized in most countries like PayPal, it won't gain more popularity as compared to PayPal.

What about face to face exchanging thru localbitcoins.com?  There appears to be a number of advertisers for both selling and buying in Athens.  Greece has a sizable tourism industry for foriegners no?  Why not tourist venue operators advertise a discount when paying in bitcoin, and then sell the bitcoin to other greek nationals to spread the digital currency around?

Yes, there are people advertising bitcoin sales through localbitcoins, however most of them are fake. They're not filtered so there's a lot of spam. The only sellers with reasonable prices and volumes aren't even living in Greece and have invalid ads.

And yes, lots of tourists incoming. I haven't met any interested in bitcoin though. I think it'd be perfectly possible for a tourist to 'import' bitcoins and get paid in cash but such a procedure would fall under money laundering or at least make the parties look suspicious to the authorities if done at a large scale. Certainly not a reliable way to boost bitcoin adoption.

Even though i don't like and i don't use paypal.
They fast limit your account and require lots of documents to 'unlock' your account.
About the greece people i am a bit surprised that paypal has stopped their service in this country which i think needs to get 'donations' from others at least through paypal.

Seems like many people are replying to this topic only by reading the title... Come one guys, put a little more effort into your posts and read about what you're posting. Paypal is no longer "blocking" Greece, this is an old post.

Important is to tell something.  ;) At all important what.  :D Me first. Had more than one posts here.  ???   :o

Did Greece ban PayPal or did PayPal ban Greece?