Bitcoin Forum

Holy crap:

http://pastebin.com/3ZXYMmwr (http://pastebin.com/3ZXYMmwr)

Care to disclose your source(s)?
A raw Pastebin link is no source at all.

Care to disclose your source(s)?
A raw Pastebin link is no source at all.

   Subject: Bitcoin Securities Offerings (NY-8834)
    From: Moustakis, Philip MOUSTAKISP@sec.gov
    
    The staff of the United States Securities and Exchange Commission is conducting an investigation in the above-referenced matter.
    
    We are contacting you directly concerning your possible investment in Bitcoin Savings & Trust.  If you have information concerning Bitcoin Savings & Trust, we would be interested in speaking with you.  I may be contacted by this email address or at the telephone number below.
    
    Our principal purpose in requesting information from you is to determine whether there have been violations of the statutes and rules the Commission enforces.  However, information provided by members of the public is routinely used by the Commission and other authorities to conduct investigative, enforcement, licensing, and disciplinary proceedings, and to fulfill other statutory responsibilities.
    
    The federal securities laws authorize the Commission to conduct investigations and to request information from you, but you are not required to respond.  There are no direct sanctions and no direct effects upon you for refusing to provide information to us.  However, we would appreciate your cooperation in this matter.
    
    This investigation is non-public and should be construed neither as an indication by the Commission or its staff that any violation of law has occurred nor as a reflection upon any person, entity, or security.
    
    Thank you.
    
    Philip Moustakis ∙ Senior Attorney ∙ Division of Enforcement ∙ United States Securities & Exchange Commission ∙ 3 World Financial Center, Suite 400, New York, NY 10281-1022 ∙ (212) 336-0542 ∙ moustakisp@sec.gov

I did not receive the e-mail directly.....several forum members and depositors in BTCST have confirmed receiving the e-mail, and one pasted the content and shared it in the #BTCST channel.  

I cannot verify the accuracy, simply sharing it here for discussion sake.  

boing.

I got exactly the same email an hour ago...
Here is the full copy: http://pastie.org/4791945

- Anyone know what is this about?
- How did they got my email address?

I didn't invest with Pirate, so I honestly don't know why I am receiving this anyways.

The theory is they were monitoring IP addresses that accessed various Pirate associated entities.  

I didn't invest with Pirate, so I honestly don't know why I am receiving this anyways.

I got exactly the same email an hour ago...
Here is the full copy: http://pastie.org/4791945

- Anyone know what is this about?
- How did they got my email address?

I didn't invest with Pirate, so I honestly don't know why I am receiving this anyways.

But can they get my email address from my ip address?

Theymos might get a paper to turn over all logs, even if he is in another country, they do help each other out. 5 million in loss is a great reason to do so.

Forum accounts can't always be directly tied to BTCST accounts though.

Why would they. You list it on your webpage that your profile links to.

Theymos might get a paper to turn over all logs, even if he is in another country, they do help each other out. 5 million in loss is a great reason to do so.

I think we need to stop perpetuating the $5 million urban legend. Blockchain analysis in the 1DkyBEKt5S2GDtv7aQw6rQepAvnsRyHoYM thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=94675.600) points to it being a SilkRoad address, so it's doubtful pirate ever had that many funds under control. with 459 accounts (23 of which are probably sock puppets), that would be an average holding of $11,467. Yes some accounts have been stated to be higher than that, but I find it hard to believe that there would be as many people as gullible as a barnyard animal to get an actual balance that high (maybe a virtual balance, but not coins transferred).

To date, I haven't received one of these emails.

There was a guy here selling pirate debt last week which totally amounted to somewhere in the lower six figures (US).

I think we need to stop perpetuating the $5 million urban legend. Blockchain analysis in the 1DkyBEKt5S2GDtv7aQw6rQepAvnsRyHoYM thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=94675.600) points to it being a SilkRoad address, so it's doubtful pirate ever had that many funds under control. with 459 accounts (23 of which are probably sock puppets), that would be an average holding of $11,467. Yes some accounts have been stated to be higher than that, but I find it hard to believe that there would be as many people as gullible as a barnyard animal to get an actual balance that high (maybe a virtual balance, but not coins transferred).

The investigator will not pick up the phone anyone else have luck? Next the FTC will be after butterfly labs lol

There was a guy here selling pirate debt last week which totally amounted to somewhere in the lower six figures (US).

I think it was already proven that he owes about $5.5-6.0 million (depending on BTC/USD exchange rate) but amount he received from people is somewhere around $1-2 million. But that is a lot of money nevertheless.

Not much of an investigator if he will not even pick up the phone.

Not much of an investigator if he will not even pick up the phone.

Not much of an investigator if he will not even pick up the phone.

And here I thought these forums were caveat emptor.  The moment you lose, though, you run crying to the Big Government you hate so much to clean up your mess for you.  I guess you'll start paying taxes on your bitcoin earnings now that you're defending them with federal socialized resources.

The investigator will not pick up the phone anyone else have luck? Next the FTC will be after butterfly labs lol

Oh, they've been reached quite all right https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=112438.0

The party boat is coming for pirate.

Wait, so Shavers was already convicted?

He did.  I talked to him.

First off: Never in my phone call did he say pirate was going to prison.  They are investigating it, but anything can happen.

No, they are doing an investigation.  See above response as well.

Any chance we can get a rundown of your call?

Did you register for gpumax?

The SEC is investigating ZEEK rewards (see: http://www.sec.gov/divisions/enforce/claims/zekerewards.htm ) and because Zeek rewards has been discussed on this forum as a possible explanation for the exact date BTCST defaulted, the SEC could be investigating a possible association.

and this actually surprises people here?

It seems the problem for some people is they think the law of the land does not actually apply to Bitcoin, but believe me uncle sam does not care if your trading in Bitcoins or camel dung, he's going to get his piece of the pie.

I have no doubt that by the end of today, Philip Moustakis will have received emails describing every Bitcoin hack, theft and scam to date in great detail.

Well, Pirate sure did great things for Bitcoin then, didn't he ?......

"just selling coins through out of the system"......"Dead Man's Switch".......FUCKING BULLSHIT.

I am a firm believer in the scorched earth way of doing business, so if I don't get my BTC back from him, I will make sure he doesn't get to keep them either.

And here I thought these forums were caveat emptor.  The moment you lose, though, you run crying to the Big Government you hate so much to clean up your mess for you.  I guess you'll start paying taxes on your bitcoin earnings now that you're defending them with federal socialized resources.

I have no doubt that by the end of today, Philip Moustakis will have received emails describing every Bitcoin hack, theft and scam to date in great detail.

Any chance we can get a rundown of your call?

I have no doubt that by the end of today, Philip Moustakis will have received emails describing every Bitcoin hack, theft and scam to date in great detail.

Any chance we can get a rundown of your call?

http://pastebin.com/RPKW4XkK

So-called high yield investments are (almost?) always dressed-up Ponzi schemes.

I hope they round up every ponzi and "bank" on the forum. They are a cancer on bitcoin, and make us all look bad.

I don't think that it's fair to simply call all 'banks' or savings plans that exist on the forum, an outright scam or cancer.
There are still a few honest guys that do a decent job of transparent lending/savings plans etc, so I would like to think that there is still a future for some of them.

The unfortunate fact of the matter is, most of the recent 'problems', are all tied to a single entity and the exposure that people had to it.

At the end of the day, some of these so-called 'Cancers' stand to lose far more than many average users combined, if a certain defaulted 'bank' does not repay, especially those who are currently going 'out of pocket' to repay their own Investors, even though the bulk of their funds are still missing currently.

This has been a huge lesson learned, for alot of people.

I still have high regards for those who are currently moving forward (perhaps operating 'with a limp') and repaying their Investors (even contrary to the terms that the Investors originally agreed to, ie. Default = 100% loss, no insurance...etc).

The past 6 Weeks has been a constant Witch Hunt and has ruined the reputations of more respected forum members than it should have.

either you're sick and that's the best sarcasm I've ever seen from you.

either you're sick and OR that's the best sarcasm I've ever seen from you.

either you're sick and that's the best sarcasm I've ever seen from you......OR....

Which was it supposed to be ?

For the record, I was being truthful.....NO sarcasm.

The unfortunate fact of the matter is, most of the recent 'problems', are all tied to a single entity and the exposure that people had to it.

Which comes down to risk management.  If you have significant enough exposure to an investment that its failure would cause you significant liquidity problems then you shouldn't lend money to others to place in that same investment because if it collapses there's a high risk that they'll default and you'll get squeezed from both sides.  This isn't a novel concept.

Are we talking about pirate or AIG?

I'm talking about bitlane's comment regarding the problems being tied to a single entity (pirate).  The cascade effect is because people who already had exposure to pirate also lent funds to others to invest with pirate.  Those people are down two lots of money - the money which they didn't receive from pirate and the money from borrowers who invested funds with pirate and are now in default. That kind of double exposure to pirate was an insane risk to take.

People who did not get the joke, buy and read The Big Short before posting again.

Are we talking about pirate or AIG?

Neither I think. Sounds like he is talking about usagi's CPA.

I'm talking about bitlane's comment regarding the problems being tied to a single entity (pirate).  The cascade effect is because people who already had exposure to pirate also lent funds to others to invest with pirate.  Those people are down two lots of money - the money which they didn't receive from pirate and the money from borrowers who invested funds with pirate and are now in default. That kind of double exposure to pirate was an insane risk to take.

Yeah, but someone must have spoiled the ending for you.

Did you give him a rating on OTC?  It seems that everyone getting it so far has rated Pirate on OTC.

Nope.  I just know that they were insuring peoples mortgages who ended up not paying them back.

You didn't notice that whole housing bubble, recession, bank crash thing in the news?

Its sad to see there's people that still have the response that danieldaniel had, ignorance is bliss am i right?

Im not attacking you personally daniel, im just stating that your conditioning from living within the states is showing.

I have received this email, from a legitimate .gov address. AFAIK they got my address from OTC somehow... I rated him -10 for "defaulted on large loan."

Not sure if I agree with you. I also rated him -10 and my email can be found on my public key(just like yours) and I didn't get any email.

Don't ask for a bitcoin economy which isn't regulated or enforced by anyone or anything then expect the government of the united states of america (who all of you apparently detest with a vengeance) to bail you out.

Just saying it's extremely hypocritical and makes libertarians look even more like a bunch of whiners.

A little gasoline for this fire?

Anybody remember when the wheels were coming off this pirate thing how he was demanding all investor's details through his secret group of Pass Through Pimps on OTC? Remember seeing those logs where he demand individual contact and account details?

Anybody want to take a guess why those might have been important now? Think maybe somebody was already selling his ass to the SEC? Think maybe pirate has a relationship with the SEC and/or the DEA since he has ties with SR?

A little gasoline for this fire?

Anybody remember when the wheels were coming off this pirate thing how he was demanding all investor's details through his secret group of Pass Through Pimps on OTC? Remember seeing those logs where he demand individual contact and account details?

Anybody want to take a guess why those might have been important now? Think maybe somebody was already selling his ass to the SEC? Think maybe pirate has a relationship with the SEC and/or the DEA since he has ties with SR?

And here I thought these forums were caveat emptor.  The moment you lose, though, you run crying to the Big Government you hate so much to clean up your mess for you.  I guess you'll start paying taxes on your bitcoin earnings now that you're defending them with federal socialized resources.

bitcoin has no backer and thus no rules.

bitcoin, like anything of value, has some inherent 'rules' (even if they're not RULES, still expectations, and laws that apply to it).  If you steal, you're breaking one of those rules.

and governments are charged with maintaining law and order, and should do so whether or not they benefit from taxation of a certain resource.  imo.

fair enough, still why is it the SEC? This is on par with defrauding people of millions of pokemon cards.

fair enough, still why is it the SEC? This is on par with defrauding people of millions of pokemon cards.

Per the #gpumax channel topic on freenode:

<pirateat40> GPUMAX will be down on 10/08 at 12:00 AM CST.  The system may or may not come back up depending on the new owners.

For those who don't follow the mining forums.



Screenshot from reddit

https://i.imgur.com/yJV70.png

This. Bitcoin is not a government backed currency, that's cool and all, but then why should the government give a flip about it? I mean no one is really paying taxes on bitcoin. I'm not here to talk about the inherent value fiat currency or anything, fiat currency and bitcoins are equally worthless. The government is backing their fiat currency however, so they can apply whatever rules they want to it, bitcoin has no backer and thus no rules.

This whole situation reminds me of the simpsons episode where homer is sent out to hide as a missionary. When trying to get out of becoming a missionary he says "but I don't even believe in Jebus" but the reverend shoves him on the plane anyway, as the plane is taking off homer yells "HELP ME JEBUS!"

Defrauding people millions of pokemon cards - Not SEC
Setting up unregistered pokemon card securities and selling them to unsophisticated investors - Possibly SEC.

So the owners of GPUMAX are selling?

Wow...lol what bullshit....both entities were linked through financial means for sure.

Doesn't say anything about selling.

Yeah that pretty much says it. LOL

Not necessarily.  My understanding is that LLC members are the equivalent of shareholders - which means that in addition to being able to sell their interest under the terms of the LLC, they may be able to give them away or swap them.  It's not exactly the same thing, but remember that the Intersango guys got their interest in by swapping 250 Intersango shares for a combined interest of 25% in Bitcoinica LP.  While pirate definitely seems like the type to take money wherever it can be found, the possibility exists that the "new owners" didn't buy GPUMax with cash.

Or the obvious topic under discussion, which is that there is a seizure or receivership.

It's unlikely he'd have any advance notice of a seizure.  Receivership's a possibility if GPUMax has secured creditors, although why not immediately rather than in 5 days?  Or he could just be shutting up shop and claiming there are new owners to fuck with people's heads.  As with everything else pirate-related, people can do little but wait and see what plays out.