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Bitcoin => Bitcoin Discussion => Topic started by: westkybitcoins on June 08, 2011, 05:22:32 PM



Title: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: westkybitcoins on June 08, 2011, 05:22:32 PM
So...

I find out about bitcoins, and am naturally excited, seeing its potential. I invest in some, and decide one of the big things that is (for now) holding it back is a lack of ready liquidity. Lots of people are reluctant to invest, thinking they'll be "stuck" with them, and those who want them may not have ready access.

I place an ad on craigslist, offering to buy and/or sell, for a small fee.

Within hours I get this email:

> You do understand that the bitcoin program is in fact not legal in this state. There is a 2007 law that outlawed virtual currency in KY. It falls under the tax codes. It is punishable by 1-5years and a min fine of 50k. You will remove this ad. If you fail to do so your account will be turned over to kirs. I will email from other accounts asking for info to get your address unles your dumb enough to reply. The facebook account and ad have 24h to be closed.
>
> I hate tax dodgers like you..
>
> http://westky.craigslist.org/sys/2427861692.html
>
>
> Sent from my iPad 2

Now, obviously I'm not taking anything down. I'm just floored by the level of hostility some folks have toward bitcoins. I'm sure the Silk Road stories aren't helping any, but still... wow.  :o


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: Bazil on June 08, 2011, 05:25:23 PM
This should be interesting.  If the Kentucky revenue service does come after you run to the press.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: Anonymous on June 08, 2011, 05:27:13 PM
Quote
I hate tax dodgers like you..

Hahaha.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: rezin777 on June 08, 2011, 05:27:43 PM
unles your dumb enough

Oh, the irony.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: tymothy on June 08, 2011, 05:29:39 PM
Ask him to cite the law in question. Bet he can't or that the law doesn't apply to bitcoins.

Obviously buying and selling in bitcoins and not reporting gains to the IRS is tax evasion, but it's the "not reporting gains" portion that makes it illegal, not the bitcoins.

And who the hell reports income to the IRS on things they sell on craigslist anyways?


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: Anonymous on June 08, 2011, 05:32:07 PM
And who the hell reports income to the IRS on things they sell on craigslist anyways?
Said threatener. He's a government duck.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: triforcelink on June 08, 2011, 05:34:47 PM

> Sent from my iPad 2



I seriously LOLd

I imagined some guy sitting on his couch browsing craigslist with his iPad 2 looking out for any money laundering scams


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: westkybitcoins on June 08, 2011, 05:40:07 PM
This should be interesting.  If the Kentucky revenue service does come after you run to the press.

I don't see why they should. Virtual currencies are illegal? Really? So Paypal, Linden Dollars, eBay Bucks, etc. are all in danger of being kicked out the state? Possessing or trading them will result in jail time? And this from KENTUCKY'S legislature? Please. It's a dumb, poorly-thought-out law, even if it actually exists (and I'm not exactly finding it right off. Go figure.)



Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: Freakin on June 08, 2011, 05:41:07 PM
Was he so kind as to share the actual statute that banned virtual currencies?  

More importantly, is this the sort of thing that a state can regulate?  Isn't banning virtual currencies a potential hindrance to interstate commerce?  

I heard recently that an actual town established its own currency and that was legal under federal law.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: Bazil on June 08, 2011, 06:06:11 PM
This should be interesting.  If the Kentucky revenue service does come after you run to the press.

I don't see why they should. Virtual currencies are illegal? Really? So Paypal, Linden Dollars, eBay Bucks, etc. are all in danger of being kicked out the state? Possessing or trading them will result in jail time? And this from KENTUCKY'S legislature? Please. It's a dumb, poorly-thought-out law, even if it actually exists (and I'm not exactly finding it right off. Go figure.)



All the more reason to run to the press.  Not only do you get to highlight a dumb law if it exists (I doubt that it does), but you also give Bitcoin publicity.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: Jaime Frontero on June 08, 2011, 06:17:24 PM
And who the hell reports income to the IRS on things they sell on craigslist anyways?
Said threatener. He's a government duck.

for you, Atlas:

http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=13344.0


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: proudhon on June 08, 2011, 06:21:03 PM
So...

I find out about bitcoins, and am naturally excited, seeing its potential. I invest in some, and decide one of the big things that is (for now) holding it back is a lack of ready liquidity. Lots of people are reluctant to invest, thinking they'll be "stuck" with them, and those who want them may not have ready access.

I place an ad on craigslist, offering to buy and/or sell, for a small fee.

Within hours I get this email:

> You do understand that the bitcoin program is in fact not legal in this state. There is a 2007 law that outlawed virtual currency in KY. It falls under the tax codes. It is punishable by 1-5years and a min fine of 50k. You will remove this ad. If you fail to do so your account will be turned over to kirs. I will email from other accounts asking for info to get your address unles your dumb enough to reply. The facebook account and ad have 24h to be closed.
>
> I hate tax dodgers like you..
>
> http://westky.craigslist.org/sys/2427861692.html
>
>
> Sent from my iPad 2

Now, obviously I'm not taking anything down. I'm just floored by the level of hostility some folks have toward bitcoins. I'm sure the Silk Road stories aren't helping any, but still... wow.  :o


http://i52.tinypic.com/27xqsk0.jpg


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: evoorhees on June 08, 2011, 06:29:32 PM
LOL @ sent from his iPad hahaha. What a tool.

Just tell him Bitcoin isn't a "currency," it's just math. I don't think math is yet illegal, save within the borders of DC. For you to be prosecuted, the state would then have to prove that Bitcoin was indeed a currency, and wouldn't that be fun?



Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: westkybitcoins on June 08, 2011, 06:38:12 PM
LOL @ sent from his iPad hahaha. What a tool.

Just tell him Bitcoin isn't a "currency," it's just math. I don't think math is yet illegal, save within the borders of DC. For you to be prosecuted, the state would then have to prove that Bitcoin was indeed a currency, and wouldn't that be fun?



Frankly, I hadn't even planned on responding to him. It's pretty clear his/her mind is already made up.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: tymothy on June 08, 2011, 06:42:15 PM


Frankly, I hadn't even planned on responding to him. It's pretty clear his/her mind is already made up.
[/quote]

For the hilarity of all of us, I highly suggest you do respond.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: Freakin on June 08, 2011, 06:46:38 PM
Offer him 50 bitcoins for his ipad and see what he says


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: ryepdx on June 08, 2011, 06:49:47 PM
For the hilarity of all of us, I highly suggest you do respond.

Agreed. You shouldn't let people make uncontested claims like that anyway. At least ask him to cite the statute. Post it back here if he replies. I'm really curious to see if there's actually something like that on Kentucky's books.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: westkybitcoins on June 08, 2011, 06:59:43 PM
For the hilarity of all of us, I highly suggest you do respond.

Agreed. You shouldn't let people make uncontested claims like that anyway. At least ask him to cite the statute. Post it back here if he replies. I'm really curious to see if there's actually something like that on Kentucky's books.

Hmm.

Sent the following:

Quote
Hi!

As I'm not in this to facilitate illegal activities, could you cite the statute illegalizing virtual currencies?

Much appreciated

I am a bit curious as to how he'll respond.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: SgtSpike on June 08, 2011, 07:06:10 PM
Offer him 50 bitcoins for his ipad and see what he says
Hahahaha, DO EEET!  Please!


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: niemivh on June 08, 2011, 07:33:15 PM
Hopefully the community learns not to be me such cowards as we've all be conditioned to be since birth.

I'd like you to respond to him.  I would.

Ask him to go to the Cayman islands where Trillions are laundered yearly since he's such a Defender of Justice.

Oh yeah, don't forget to tell him to bring his crime-fighting iPad2.

 ::)


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: billyjoeallen on June 08, 2011, 07:34:10 PM

> Sent from my iPad 2



I seriously LOLd

I imagined some guy sitting on his couch browsing craigslist with his iPad 2 looking out for any money laundering scams

I literally returned my iPad to Sam's Club and used the money to buy bitcoins. at $17/BTC. :-D


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: billyjoeallen on June 08, 2011, 07:37:54 PM
For the hilarity of all of us, I highly suggest you do respond.

Agreed. You shouldn't let people make uncontested claims like that anyway. At least ask him to cite the statute. Post it back here if he replies. I'm really curious to see if there's actually something like that on Kentucky's books.

Hmm.

Sent the following:

Quote
Hi!

As I'm not in this to facilitate illegal activities, could you cite the statute illegalizing virtual currencies?

Much appreciated

I am a bit curious as to how he'll respond.

Criminalizing. "criminalizing". not "illegalizing".


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: Scientician! on June 08, 2011, 07:42:51 PM

> Sent from my iPad 2



I seriously LOLd

I imagined some guy sitting on his couch browsing craigslist with his iPad 2 looking out for any money laundering scams

I literally returned my iPad to Sam's Club and used the money to buy bitcoins. at $17/BTC. :-D

I bet the Chinese kid who sold his kidney for an iPad2 woulda thought of that. Ancillary question: Going BTCrate for a malnourished Chinese kidney?

/OT

And who the hell reports income to the IRS on things they sell on craigslist anyways?
Said threatener. He's a government duck.

for you, Atlas:

http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=13344.0

This bears serious examination. I can easily imagine that CIA/NSA/SS would deploy semi-automated HUMINT agents to troll for exactly these types of scenarios. Hell, BTC offers seem almost tailor made for a manipulation at these vectors.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: MoonShadow on June 08, 2011, 07:48:21 PM
I live in Kentucky, and have posted to Craigslist in the past.  I'm very interested in this sad little statist's response.  I'd certainly like to know if any such statute exists, and what it actually says.  I'd doubt seriously that it exists, the KRS (Kentucky Revised Statutes) are not really all that long or complicated for a state code, and I've read most of them.  I've never noticed anything talking about anything digital or currency related, but honestly I haven't looked either.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: mmdough on June 08, 2011, 08:02:26 PM
I'm no lawyer, but I've been combing through the Kentucky Revised Statues for about an hour now, and can find nothing related to the subject-- not in the statutes, not in 2007 legislative reviews, not in the press; nowhere. He may be confusing Kentucky with China, which evidently banned virtual currency for real goods in 2007. It's an easy mistake to make (if you're a jabbering mental patient).

The closest thing I could find was a 2006 law requiring a licence for "persons engaging in money transmission," which seems inapplicable.

It could be a judicial ruling? I think I could find those somewhere.

I haven't completely finished looking through the tax code yet, but unless it's listed in some obscure corner, I ain't finding it.

But yeah, challenge the douche to cite you chapter and verse. He's probably some off-duty cop trying to flex his dick by pushing you around. Don't make assumptions, admit no possibility of wrongdoing, and be as brief and polite as possible.

Your initial message was good; let's see how he responds.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: flaxceed on June 08, 2011, 08:08:51 PM
why are we taking this clown so seriously?  this is kentucky people!  no disrespect to the OP of course


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: enmaku on June 08, 2011, 08:11:26 PM
He may be confusing Kentucky with China, which evidently banned virtual currency for real goods in 2007. It's an easy mistake to make (if you're a jabbering mental patient).
This is probably the case, I know it's what came up when I first googled around on this one.

"Google before you post" really is the new "think before you speak"


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: MoonShadow on June 08, 2011, 08:12:20 PM
why are we taking this clown so seriously?  this is kentucky people!  no disrespect to the OP of course

Of course.  The name of the state is a proper noun, btw; which requires the respect of a capital.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: jhansen858 on June 08, 2011, 08:22:15 PM
found this:

http://www.facebook.com/pages/West-Kentucky-Bitcoin-Users/157592440973611?sk=wall


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: flaxceed on June 08, 2011, 08:22:45 PM
i know how to use capital letters but choose not to; i see you don't know the rules for semicolons though!


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: MoonShadow on June 08, 2011, 08:24:23 PM
i know how to use capital letters but choose not to; i see you don't know the rules for semi-colons though!

I see that you don't have the sense not to irritate the mod.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: MoonShadow on June 08, 2011, 08:27:01 PM
Just for giggles, I flagged this ad "Best of Craigslist".  I recommend that others do so as well.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: flaxceed on June 08, 2011, 08:41:44 PM
"I see that you don't have the sense not to irritate the mod."

at this point i'm just hoping you're not from Kentucky, Sir!


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: enmaku on June 08, 2011, 08:46:43 PM
why are we taking this clown so seriously?  this is kentucky people!  no disrespect to the OP of course

Of course.  The name of the state is a proper noun, btw; which requires the respect of a capital.

"BTW" is an acronym, which should be capitalized. I recognize that it's grown common enough that we imagine it to be an abbreviation, but it is not.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: MoonShadow on June 08, 2011, 08:50:22 PM
"I see that you don't have the sense not to irritate the mod."

at this point i'm just hoping you're not from Kentucky, Sir!

Born and raised.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: enmaku on June 08, 2011, 08:53:27 PM
"I see that you don't have the sense not to irritate the mod."

at this point i'm just hoping you're not from Kentucky, Sir!

Born and raised.

I just find it humorous that a state with stereotypes associated with it toward... a certain kind of behavior... is abbreviated "KY"

(I'm from California currently living in Vegas via St. Petersburg FL. Let the hometown/state criticism wars BEGIN!)


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: em3rgentOrdr on June 08, 2011, 09:48:28 PM
Hilarious statist iPad 2 troll.  I can't wait for the response.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: syn on June 10, 2011, 07:27:22 PM
bump for follow up.  OP, did ipad2 luser respond yet?

Also I marked --> http://westky.craigslist.org/sys/2427861692.html <-- for best of craigslist


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: BotherMeNot on June 10, 2011, 08:14:29 PM
LOL.  Thanks for sharing.

Just a recommendation, let it be.  Don't reply or you are just giving him more info on you and you don't know what someone like that would do.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: mcdett on June 10, 2011, 10:44:47 PM
LOL.  Thanks for sharing.

Just a recommendation, let it be.  Don't reply or you are just giving him more info on you and you don't know what someone like that would do.

He already replied.  We're waiting for a response.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: pokermon919 on June 10, 2011, 11:48:37 PM
Juicy stuff, can't wait to hear Mr. Ipad2's response.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: gigitrix on June 11, 2011, 01:05:49 AM
I for one, welcome our iPad 2 wielding overlords.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: jaimedimon on June 11, 2011, 02:48:28 AM
There is no law against digital currencies in Kentucky.  The guy is an idiot.

The OP should have responded that he was an undercover agent trying to catch people, and to shut up before he blows his cover!!


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: westkybitcoins on June 11, 2011, 07:21:10 AM
bump for follow up.  OP, did ipad2 luser respond yet?

Also I marked --> http://westky.craigslist.org/sys/2427861692.html <-- for best of craigslist

Haven't heard a thing since my response. Don't really expect to though.

Thanks for the craigslist support. I'm not sure how many folks locally will go there to buy, but it was where I first saw someone selling bitcoins (although he never actually sold me any, prompting me to try to add more bitcoins to the market for everyone else.)


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: nickwit on June 11, 2011, 07:35:32 AM
Yea, well. Bitcoin is a crank-magnet... and in the end, the people that cranks really hate the most, are other cranks.

Probably because they're the only ones that listen to them.

So um... don't.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: mmdough on June 11, 2011, 01:03:58 PM
There is no law against digital currencies in Kentucky.  The guy is an idiot.

The OP should have responded that he was an undercover agent trying to catch people, and to shut up before he blows his cover!!

HA!

This.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: Basiley on June 11, 2011, 04:40:05 PM
Within hours I get this email:
find and kill him.
no offenders==no danger. to both you and public safety.
and anyone happy.


Title: Re: Threatened Over My Bitcoin Ad
Post by: AnonymousBat on June 11, 2011, 08:25:35 PM
Look!

It's a STATE WORSHIPPER!