Bitcoin Forum

Hi everyone,

The SDICE public offering we started this morning (our 7th public offering for SDICE) is now approximately half sold out. If you want to get in on SDICE without needing an MPEX account, give us a try!  At the end of this public offering, we will hold 325,000 shares of S.DICE (3.25% of the total publicly issued shares of S.DICE)

Havelock Investments has 0 setup fee, 0 trade fees, and 0 transactions fees.

https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=SDICE (https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=SDICE)

Cheers,
 James

[edit: changed offering from 500 units to 250 units, for total 325000 share instead of 350000 shares]

Seems a bit overpriced.

S.DICE last: 0.00459179

95% of that: 0.00436220

Havelock Passthrough: 0.00480000

+30BTC registration fee, +dealing with GPG

and mpex s.dice 24h high is actually greater than our PO price

1D: low: 0.00454703   vwap: 0.00474688  high: 0.0052

so I think we're pretty competitive.

Cheers,
 James

You might wanna check the price now on Mpex :)

A useful and free service for those interested:

http://live.coinbr.com/?mpsic=S.DICE

WARNING

Someone placed a bunch of buy orders which look reasonable, except they are shifted one decimal place (i.e., 0.0556 instead of 0.556). Curiously, order book was cleared on the buy side when this happened. Regular orders are now showing up on top, but I can see how someone can fall for it in a hurry, especially with one passthrough unit being worth 100 mpoex shares (not 10!)...

The open market self-corrected this pretty quickly. As liquidity grows (we're now at 350000 shares), this will become less likely to happen.

James

It was a fat finger mistake, somebody dumped on mpex. Surprisingly how havelock is tightly coupled. Is there an API?

Soon :)

When will the first dividends be sent? Not in a rush, just noticed that the other exchanges seem to have all paid out already.

Thanks!

Paid out this afternoon.

Cheers,
 James

will havelock be getting a slice of the newly released 5% shares at .0044?

While I don't know the answer, it's probably unlikely considering all were sold hours ago...

Yea, i had a headache last night and went to bed early, someone shoulda called the office and hit the 999 emergency extension to wake me up!

I did however get a fair sized slice of the release tonight... Havelock bought 120,000 of the 1,000,000 shares (12%) released tonight.... we also sold out within seconds of listing them on our site.. i think we could have used another 30000 still to satisfy all the bids on our order book.. ohwell, there's always the next tranche tomorrow night!

James

I will hold on to your word. Next time something of this caliber happens I will call you. :)

why do poeple have so many bids in the 0.6X
 ???
dont they know you'll be selling shares all the way down to 0.55
maybe you should write them an e-mail.

i thought i was tusday today.... lol shit now its 0.0062  :-[

If James is doing the same as yesterday the new units will be going on as an Ask at (100 times) what he managed to get them for plus ~.01 which for yesterday's average purchace price of .5534 were put on at .565*

So I definitely wouldn't put anything on for less than .63 and wouldn't put a massive one on at that level either if you really want them taken because it all depends on how many at what price James can get them for.  Hence people 'playing it safe' by bidding higher.


*

Can someone explain why people on Havelock are willing to pay 5-10% more than on BTCTC, MPEX and BitFunder?
It is not that Havelock is more trustworthy or has more other investment opportunities. So why use Havelock and pay more than on any other exchange?

Because there isn't enough liquidity on all the various outfits, nor an easy means of transferring stocks between them, for an arbing bot to level them off :)

Havelock users are possibly less aware, or less interested in the other passthroughs. Trust could still be a factor, but odds are they just don't know about all the other options. That's my guess.

The site is well built & its run by a reputable person. This alone is easily worth 10% over say bitfined or mpex. I dont know about btctc however.

If MPEX turns out to be a scam (which it isn't) Havelock will be affected since there's a direct link between Havelock and MPEX S.Dice shares.

Yeah - I thought it was obvious why people dont use MPEX. 30 coins just for the privilege of using that POS? Yeah, no thanks.

I'm wondering again about this substantial price difference between Havelock and MPEx.  Lightbox, on your site you say:

"Units of the fund ARE convertible to shares on MPEX at 1 unit = 100 shares PUSHED to your MPEx account for a fixed fee of 10 BTC per transfer (fee subject to change)."

Is that an automated service or do you have to do that manually.

No idea what you mean by bitfined, but since the various PTs are PTs of MPEx you can hardly imagine one'd be "more" trustworthy. At the absolute logical most they're equally trustworthy to MPEx for this application.


It is obvious why you don't use MPEx. People do use it, to the tune of 90% of all BTC finance, actually. Simmer down.


If the stock trades on MPEx in the 70s and on Havelock in the 80s, then you need at least 10k shares moved for the price difference to make up that 10 BTC Havelock fee. I guess the explanation may be that "the people" (illustrated above) don't much trade in whole lots.

Pretty much. I was going to join ages ago, but then I realized that I'd only be trading, what, 3 securities? Talk about diversification  ::) ..not to mention it looks like a child developed it after reading "HTML for Dummies".

Definitely not worth it unless you're looking to put thousands of bitcoins into one stock without wanting passthroughs to take a cut. The provided security of GPG is also a plus..until another more professional exchange comes along and implements the same thing. Mix that with, oh I don't know, 4 securities to trade and *poof* MPEx is obsolete.

Yet another dood that knows better than the experts. You'll blow a hole in your own skull with that shotgun you think you know how to work, sparky.

Ha! Oh MPOE, it looks like you may need to go back and look up the definition of the word Experts. I can always count on you for a good laugh :)

I've noticed you seem to be on a "sparky" kick lately as well. ;)

As someone who was initially very impressed with the fund, I am now left wondering -- why hasn't Havelock taken advantage of the order book and filled the orders with new share units created from the MPEX sell side? I am sure there is a certain level of desire to keep the Havelock fund trading at X% premium for what ever reason, but it is not really a good reason... I don't think it's right for the fund to trade at an upwards of 20% premium to the underlying. For instance, right now there are 7000 shares on MPEX at an ask of .0063, and the Havelock bid is up to .736 for 21 units (2100 mpex shares).

There are only a few ways to resolve this issue, which is of course an issue because it means people are over paying by a significant amount. One would be: let people convert MPEX shares into the Havelock pass thru units, which I see is already existent -- although the process for conversion is not clear. The other would be: Havelock manages their order book as any broker would, and matches supply to demand, simply buying the units on MPEX and flipping them to the bids on Havelock.

This arbitrage needs to take place for the market to remain healthy, and frankly I am left feeling suspect as to why this hasn't already occurred. It seems to me (please correct me if I am wrong) that there is nothing stopping Havelock from buying the shares on MPEX, creating units (incrementing a SQL entry) on Havelock, and selling them to the market. It would be better for all parties involved if this kind of additional liquidity would be provided to Havelock shareholders.

I believe it is the duty of the fund to take advantage of these market dislocations when they exist to improve the overall efficiency, structure, and liquidity of our dear BTC markets. Look forward to hearing a response from James et al

I don't see any problem with Havelock choosing whether or not to fill asks, regardless of the price. New investors are welcome to get cheaper shares wherever they can find them.

Exactly. Additionally, let this be a lesson to those who want to do an IPO in the future what happens when you list on MPEX.

In principle what you describe is how things should work. I doubt the recent inactivity on the part of the fund manager is intentional - he hasn't been on irc either. I imagine the likely explanation is person had some irl stuff to attend to, couldn't log in for a day or two. These things happen, weddings, funerals, car gets stolen, hospital visit, thousand possible reasons. Probably once they get back online the backlog will be resolved.

James is out of town this whole week. He'll be back on the 18th.

I understand completely -- please excuse any undertones of criticism that may have penetrated my post; I do think Havelock provides a very valuable service, I was irrelevantly echoing how I would manage the fund to the benefit of all parties. Hopefully when James comes back he will consider matching the Havelock order book with MPEX shares so the spread doesn't approach 20%.

site's down..

Routing issue this morning. Nothing wrong with the site itself.

James

There was something similar reported re MPEx yest, some people couldn't reach it.

Some CCNE somewhere broke the interwebs and got fired. lol.

This stock is at an all time low sell/buy now!    ::)

I always seem to be on the wrong side of these routing issues, havelock or mpex :P. I definitely do understand it being from my end and not y'alls though.  as you were! ty ty ty

I know, I've been loading up on cheap shares all day. I tell ya, one bad month and all the weak hands freak out.

SDICE might be down due to poor earnings, but also because the price of bitcoins has been going way up. The valuation of sdice, measured in bitcoin, has been going down a little.

Not saying that it necessarily has to be this way, or that there isn't reason to believe that as new users flow into bitcoin, that's good for the valuation of sdice. But I just wanted to point out that it's probably part of why shares are down.