Bitcoin Forum

Other => Beginners & Help => Topic started by: doghouse on February 07, 2013, 11:30:04 AM



Title: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: doghouse on February 07, 2013, 11:30:04 AM
As a newbie, I'd like to know what the most popular bitcoin client other newbies and experienced users alike are using.
Perhaps I've made a bad choice? - Mine (who will not be mentioned in case it prejudices the poll) is a bit clunky.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: DannyHamilton on February 07, 2013, 12:40:05 PM
I use multiple clients. Each client serves a different purpose.  The poll might have been better if it allowed us to choose more than one answer. Also blockchain.info/wallet isn't on the poll. I suppose I could have just marked "OTHER" for that.  I don't see MtGox or BitFloor either (both could be considered extremely limited web hosted wallets).

EDIT: As of 2013-04-17 BitFloor has ceased all operations.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: doghouse on February 07, 2013, 01:19:48 PM
I use multiple clients. Each client serves a different purpose.  The poll might have been better if it allowed us to choose more than one answer. Also blockchain.info/wallet isn't on the poll. I suppose I could have just marked "OTHER" for that.  I don't see MtGox or BitFloor either (both could be considered extremely limited web hosted wallets).

DannyHamilton, you're right about choosing multiple answers. I thought I'd clicked the right checkbox, but it won't let me go back and edit it now! :-[
Regarding blockchain.info, MtGox etc.. I kept this poll specific to client software which runs on the computer itself, so I guess they would fall under the category of "other"


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Gabi on February 07, 2013, 01:30:15 PM
For daily use, definitely Multibit.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Nyhm on February 07, 2013, 02:21:44 PM
VanillaWallet (http://vanillawallet.com/) is designed to be simple/friendly (for casual or new users), but it's only in Beta (v0.5). Also good as a USB key wallet.

That said, I rely on bitcoin-qt most of the time. I also use blockchain.info/wallet (and associated Android app) to hold a couple coins for alternate access.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Jaques on February 07, 2013, 02:39:41 PM
amory with bitcoin-qt because without the latter the first won't work ... ::)


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: pier on February 07, 2013, 02:46:28 PM
Just bitcoin-qt ;)


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: CornFly on February 07, 2013, 04:25:37 PM
amory with bitcoin-qt and Electrum


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Gabi on February 07, 2013, 05:42:21 PM
Probably a lot of newbies know only the qt client...


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: gweedo on February 07, 2013, 05:50:29 PM
Armory and bitcoin-qt is the way to go. I keep most of my funds in armory and like maybe 10-20 bitcoins in qt for quick transactions.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Nyhm on February 07, 2013, 09:14:46 PM
Probably a lot of newbies know only the qt client...

Bitcoin-qt works well for tech-savvy folks, but I feel it's confusing for new users (it confused me when I first started). Of course, full credit for developing this solid client from the beginning with no other point of reference.

Regarding online/Web wallets, I'm aware of blockchain.info's MyWallet service. It's not too hard to use. What other online/Web wallets are there (not exchanges; just services that strictly act as an online wallet)?


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: DannyHamilton on February 07, 2013, 09:35:37 PM
What other online/Web wallets are there (not exchanges; just services that strictly act as an online wallet)?
For the sake of knowledge of it's existence I'll mention:
https://www.instawallet.org

But I wouldn't recommend it for anything except very briefly holding extremely small amounts of bitcoin.  You don't have control of the private keys, and therefore there is no way to back up your wallet, or prevent people at the wallet hosting company from running off with your bitcoin.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: eXcelleNt on February 07, 2013, 09:59:37 PM
And does this poll do anything positive for those who have yet to choose a bitcoin client? Would a solid majority vote be a reliable endorsement for that particular client?


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: DannyHamilton on February 07, 2013, 10:03:22 PM
. . . Would a solid majority vote be a reliable endorsement for that particular client?
No.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Gabi on February 07, 2013, 10:08:22 PM
And does this poll do anything positive for those who have yet to choose a bitcoin client? Would a solid majority vote be a reliable endorsement for that particular client?
No. Especially when in this subforum most people know only the qt client.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: World on February 07, 2013, 10:16:30 PM
Multibit - Online Spending, Bill Paying 40%
Blockchain mobile app - Mobile Spending 40%
Satoshi-Qt - Savings 20%
Electrum - testing


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: eXcelleNt on February 07, 2013, 10:22:14 PM
. . . Would a solid majority vote be a reliable endorsement for that particular client?
No.

And does this poll do anything positive for those who have yet to choose a bitcoin client? Would a solid majority vote be a reliable endorsement for that particular client?
No. Especially when in this subforum most people know only the qt client.

Didn't think so.

So then what are your recommendations, and why?


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: DannyHamilton on February 07, 2013, 10:57:24 PM
So then what are your recommendations, and why?
That's like telling someone you are thinking of purchasing a vehicle and asking which vehicle you should buy and why. It depends on the purpose of the vehicle.  Is it for a large family?  Do you need to tow heavy loads? How many miles do you expect to put on the vehicle each year? Do you intend to keep the vehicle for many years, or sell it after a few?  How tall are you? Will you spend a lot of time driving in hot environments? Cold environments? Is comfort important to you? Is fuel efficiency important to you? Etc.

It's the same with a wallet. It depends on the purpose of the wallet.

Will you be storing a very large amount of bitcoin in the wallet?  Will you need access to the bitcoins while mobile? Will you only be receiving bitcoins, or will you be sending them as well?  Will you be sending a lot of transactions frequently? How important is security to you? What level of technical ability do you have?  How important is anonymity to you? There are many other factors as well.  Each wallet has it's benefits and it's shortcomings.

When I'm ready to purchase a vehicle, I learn as much as I can about several vehicles that seem like they might fit my needs, and then make an educated decision about the best fit for my purposes.  I recommend that anyone choosing a bitcoin wallet do the same.  (Learn about the various features and limitations of the available wallets and make an educated decision about which wallet will best fit your purposes.)


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: MoonShadow on February 08, 2013, 01:44:23 AM
. . . Would a solid majority vote be a reliable endorsement for that particular client?
No.

And does this poll do anything positive for those who have yet to choose a bitcoin client? Would a solid majority vote be a reliable endorsement for that particular client?
No. Especially when in this subforum most people know only the qt client.

Didn't think so.

So then what are your recommendations, and why?

How do you see yourself using it?  Personally, I have BitcoinSpinner on my android smartphone and Electrum on my desktop.  I can't really recommend a full client anymore, the bootstrapping is a huge burden; and we don't really need more full clients anymore.  10K copies distributed across the Internet is enough.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Nagato on February 08, 2013, 07:05:25 AM
If you are running a Bitcoin business selling goods/services and need to receive Bitcoins, a full client is your only logical choice.
A full client is the only way to verify transactions, check for double spends without having to trust anyone else.

For a spending account with small balance, monitoring your balance, other clients are great.

The inconveniences of the full client give you something no other client can, trustless verification.
For anyone else who does not receive bitcoins often or does not need to receive bitcoins from untrusted parties, it might make sense to use the ligher/web clients.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: gweedo on February 08, 2013, 07:18:37 AM
If you are running a Bitcoin business selling goods/services and need to receive Bitcoins, a full client is your only logical choice.
A full client is the only way to verify transactions, check for double spends without having to trust anyone else.

You could use cold storage and blockchain.info inside of a full client, I have implement that before.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Nagato on February 08, 2013, 07:25:00 AM
Im assuming you mean have a wallet in cold storage and use blockchain.info to watch your address and notify you of any incoming transactions?

That does not give you trustless verification.
You would have to trust blockchain.info to be telling you your balance and incoming transactions.

Lets assume the owner of blockchain.info or a hacker who compromises blockchain.info servers wants to get your goods without paying for it.
He can alter the blockchain DB and post fake incoming transactions to your address which you will trust and ship out your goods.
Without a full client running, you have to trust someone.

For a small retail shop/cafe selling low cost items, it might be OK to use blockchain.info or any light client as your risk is minimal.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: BitStick on February 08, 2013, 07:26:47 AM
yay i'm on the winning team with bitcoin QT  ;D

I'm a total noob to bitcoins, is there any advantage to download another client or sign-up for an online wallet?
Eventually I want to have an interactive website so the web page can send and receive payments, etc


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Nagato on February 08, 2013, 07:38:10 AM
yay i'm on the winning team with bitcoin QT  ;D

I'm a total noob to bitcoins, is there any advantage to download another client or sign-up for an online wallet?
Eventually I want to have an interactive website so the web page can send and receive payments, etc

The advantage is mobility, lower cpu/memory usage.
Like i said, for an average user only looking to store/spend, using any of the light desktop clients(opensource and downloaded from trusted website) is fine.
For web wallets, there are 2 kinds

1) Hosted wallets
You have to trust the wallet provider to not run off with your coins or get compromised.(I would not use this for anything more than a few BTC)

2) Hybrid wallets (Blockchain.info)
Here the wallet and private keys are encrypted by a password only you know, such that even the server administrator cannot get to your keys.
Theoretically this is as safe as the desktop light clients.
Yet, you have to continually trust the service that it's source is not changed to send back your password to the server or that the server is compromised to send your password to a 3rd party.

Unless you read the entire javascript source everytime you login, you can never be 100% sure.


For all options, a compromised PC means you will lose your coins as soon as your wallet is decrypted.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: gweedo on February 08, 2013, 07:38:53 AM
Im assuming you mean have a wallet in cold storage and use blockchain.info to watch your address and notify you of any incoming transactions?

That does not give you trustless verification.
You would have to trust blockchain.info to be telling you your balance and incoming transactions.

Lets assume the owner of blockchain.info or a hacker who compromises blockchain.info servers wants to get your goods without paying for it.
He can alter the blockchain DB and post fake incoming transactions to your address which you will trust and ship out your goods.
Without a full client running, you have to trust someone.

You could do it trust-less,it be a pain but could be done


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Nagato on February 08, 2013, 08:15:18 AM
Could you elaborate?


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: Rarrikins on February 08, 2013, 03:44:50 PM
As a newbie, I'd like to know what the most popular bitcoin client other newbies and experienced users alike are using.
Perhaps I've made a bad choice? - Mine (who will not be mentioned in case it prejudices the poll) is a bit clunky.

I used bitcoind because I'm planning on using the Armory or something like it when it finishes updating the block chain in about three months from now....


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: MoonShadow on February 08, 2013, 04:02:33 PM
If you are running a Bitcoin business selling goods/services and need to receive Bitcoins, a full client is your only logical choice.
A full client is the only way to verify transactions, check for double spends without having to trust anyone else.


That's not completely accurate, there are several levels of trust.  I use Electrum because it combines the small local footprint of a light client, without the need to trust a third party with my private keys.  Electrum basicly uses a specially designed p2p network overlay to offload the blockchain database to a remote server (stratum server) but it keeps the wallet.dat local, and all transactions are created and signed locally.  While it's true that certain blockchain based deceptions can theoretically be performed against a particular Electrum client, this is far from an easy fraud method, and there is no case of this happening in the wild that we know of.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: flatfly on February 08, 2013, 06:26:03 PM
If you are running a Bitcoin business selling goods/services and need to receive Bitcoins, a full client is your only logical choice.
A full client is the only way to verify transactions, check for double spends without having to trust anyone else.


That's not completely accurate, there are several levels of trust.  I use Electrum because it combines the small local footprint of a light client, without the need to trust a third party with my private keys.  Electrum basicly uses a specially designed p2p network overlay to offload the blockchain database to a remote server (stratum server) but it keeps the wallet.dat local, and all transactions are created and signed locally.  While it's true that certain blockchain based deceptions can theoretically be performed against a particular Electrum client, this is far from an easy fraud method, and there is no case of this happening in the wild that we know of.
Actually it is completely accurate.  Nagato specifically states that the only way to verify transactions and check for double spends with a client such as Electrum is to trust someone else.  You then indirectly point out that Electrum requires you to trust stratum server to verify transactions and check for double spends.

Wrong! Electrum clients verify transactions locally using SPV, the light-client payment verification method originally suggested by Satoshi. Which means a rogue server just can't show clients any fake transaction. There are other attacks possible in theory, but to my knowledge this is not one of them.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: DannyHamilton on February 08, 2013, 06:30:13 PM
Wrong! Electrum clients verify transactions locally using SPV, the light-client payment verification method originally suggested by Satoshi. Which means a rogue server just can't show clients any fake transaction. There are other attacks possible in theory, but to my knowledge this is not one of them.
Interesting.  I'll look into that.  In the meantime, I'll delete my post as it may be incorrect due to a misunderstanding on my part about how Electrum works.


Title: Re: POLL: Which bitcoin client do you use?
Post by: haitispaceagency on February 08, 2013, 06:51:52 PM
bitspinner on my phone