Bitcoin Forum

this is the guy account https://localbitcoins.com/accounts/profile/btc2okpay/

it seems that they contacted him on localbitcoin then they arrested him in the meeting

they released this statement about him
 (Google translate may help you if you want to follow the full story)
https://facebook.com/MoiEgy/albums/1101763136534015/

the post summary :


it seems that bitcoin is going to be illegal in Egypt soon !

remind me with this user.lol
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=177526

Can't read a damn thing as it's in Egyptian language (Google translate doesn't help much.). Is there some other reason why the guy got arrested, or did they arrest him just because he's trading bitcoin?

it is because he is reading bitcoin. there is no other reason.
the release summary is they explained what bitcoin is and how they caught him with $13900, a tablet and a cellphone

So, did he get arrested because bitcoins are illegal or because he was using bitcoins for money laundering/Tax Evasion.

Here I was thinking bitcoin was going towards global acceptance :-\

That's a shame. It's kind of a dick move arresting someone for trading bitcoin without first declaring it to be illegal, though.
Not an expert on law here, but I don't think they can do that. There should be a legit reason for them to arrest someone.

if he's really arrested for a bitcoin transaction there must be a regulation that makes bitcoin illegal unless he's doing criminal things such avoid the taxes,laundering money,or even cybercrime,but i never read a news that state egypt had make bitcoin illegal i guess

You're right in Egypt, and something has a relationship with Bitcoin will become illegal activities. Sometimes ago, I've never heard the Egypt government give a statement if there will welcome to bitcoin or support bitcoin to enter their country.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_bitcoin_by_country

I think not listed Egypt on the list. Because it's, i can make assume for this.

I don't think he was arrested for trading bitcoin alone. Bitcoin is not even illegal in Egypt, and you can't be arested for something that potentiallycould be illegal in the future.
There must be some additional second bottom to this situation (maybe he was linked with terrorism somehow, potentially Al-Qaeda or ISIS?) We need more info about this case.

btc2okpay was a scammer , you can find many scam accusations against him: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=626733

Involved in money laundering , he was just using bitcoin as a means to swap currencies locally. Finally got caught.

Scam thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=626733

It's the official Facebook page for the Egyptian Ministry of Interior.

Basically the article says a 30 year-old Egyptian dentist, which it names as Ahmad A. H., was arrested for trading in foreign currencies. The security services contacted him on localbitcoin, and arranged an exchange of $13,900 for BTC at a rate of $570/btc. They met him in New Cairo and arrested him. He had $13,900 USD on him and a tablet, as well as pictures of various exchanges and deposits. The article concludes saying he confessed to the incident confirming that he was using the tablet and money to buy Bitcoin, and that he was put in front of the public prosecutor.

The article doesn't specify what the exact charge is, but it does mention trading in foreign currencies several times. Many of the comments refer to the government as ignorant or stupid, and asking where is the crime?

Someone that knows Arabic needs to translate it to make it more clear. Google translate is not exactly reliable (took me awhile to realize what "Alpetkoan" is).
This guy may have been arrested for other reasons like mcb1221 had said.

Must be tax problems. Their government did not receive his income in the form of taxes?

The demand for foreign currencies is very high in Egypt as people there are trying to hedge against the decline of the Egyptian pound. The banks can't keep up with the demand and black market exchangers charge more than the banks, further weakening the Egyptian pound. The Egyptian government is cracking down on everyone illegally exchanging foreign currencies at rates that differ from the governments official ones.

EDIT: I speak Arabic and can translate. The first paragraph gives a rough explanation of Bitcoin and mentions that it's use in Egypt has been increasing recently. The second and third paragraphs talk about the identity of the user and how he was lured. The article goes on to explain how he was nabbed and what he had on him; I already summarized it in my previous post.

Oh dear. And the world thinks Egypt is a better place after Mubarak's regime.

I had never heard that bitcoin was illegal in Egypt.  Although in a country as corrupt as that they were never going to let the freedom that bitcoin provides ever take hold, but actually bitcoin will increase in Egypt now...... persecution usually has the opposite effect of stopping things

yeah, this was the first thing that came to my mind also.
i don't think bitcoin is illegal there it must be either tax related because of conducting business or maybe he was doing some kind of illegal activity + money laundering .

Then this is actually pretty positive news, good to see that the Egyptian police is able to catch scammers that operate on the internet.
Does someone have a decent translation of the entire article by any chance, or could someone check if there is any mention of scamming?

So trading in foreign currency was also an actual charge? If that's the case it's pretty weird that they can prosecute you for that... 

Maybe he is selling bitcoin bitcoin for not a provably fair price thats why he arrested or there's someone who reported that he selling bitcoin for not provably fair price..

did i undertood that right?
The guy was selling some bitcoins, the buyer(police) ask for a meeting and he goes?

If i were in localbitcoins selling some, i would never go to a meeting... the whole point of this is anonymity.

The decline of tourists and foreign investors in Egypt has lead to a shortage of foreign currency, and the banks are unable to keep up with the demand. Many people turn to black market exchangers, who sell foreign currency at higher rates than the banks. This has caused the value of the Egyptian pound to slide lower and lower. The government doesn't want people selling foreign currencies at anything other than the official rates and is cracking down on black market exchangers. I doubt this is a battle the government can win though as the currency black market is huge there. Bitcoin use is going up too.

He wasn't the seller, the police were. The whole point of localbitcoins is to be able to engage in physical exchanges of BTC with others.


The article says the cyber crimes unit of the security services lured him. It doesn't mention anything about someone reporting him. It says that the police arrested "one" of those people who use Bitcoin, so I'd imagine that they are going after anyone who deals in BTC. It's not just BTC either - the government is trying to slow down the devaluation of the Egyptian pound and are cracking down on anyone who sells foreign currencies for more than the official rates.

Well, If this is the guy... he should be locked up...We are sick of these scammers any way. If this is not the guy, it could be judged as entrapment ..but I am not sure how the Egyptian laws work ???

In my country, you cannot trap people into doing crimes and then arrest them for that... He/she would not have done the crime, if you did not put him in a situation where he had the option to do that.

My guess is, that this guy were a scammer and he got caught out by the authorities.  ::)

To be honest, based on what I understand from the comments and the article here, it seems more like the guy was legitimately trying to avoid taxes or some other form of fraud and trying to use Bitcoin as a means for hiding his money from the government.

It definitely doesn't seem like the officers arrested the guy just because he was using Bitcoin, it seems far more likely it was some form of fraud.

$13,900 (or whatever it was) in cash? Really?

This is also my question exactly google cannot translate it only replies from the post,I also want to know is it about trading bitcoin or is it because he scammed people of Bitcoin there's a big difference here..

Wow a scammer got hunted. Egyptian police are supporting bitcoin by hunting scammers. :)
He must have scammed a police personnel or his relative. Else who can track you down in bitcoin world and he was meeting to exchange bitcoins for money. From now on no meeting to exchange, i can be arrested too.

I don't think so. it will have happened. because how can you proof that  pa particular person has how much bitcoin have. ithink it is deficult to detct that how  much bitcoin a person is holding.

anywhere in the world including the US dealing with BTC <> FIAT in amounts >10,000$ without the proper KYC/AML papers is a criminal offence

If I remember, Jordan and Lebanon are also in a 'warning' state on using bitcoin for transactions so this isn't really much of a surprise for me. Although I'm a little sure that Dubai wouldn't ban bitcoins because they are actually really fond of bitcoin. I guess Egypt just want to be able to regulate their currencies and transactions.

I was setting up simple buy bitcoin with NRS in my country Nepal but after seeing this i may first get one lawer and financial advisor before i open this service to public. THere isn't any rule about cryptocurrency so i may not get problem as suggested by financial advisor of my company. I think if i get problem about similar foreign currency exchange rule than it will be pain in my ass. ::)

its best to go through an exchange for buying or selling bitcoins for many reasons..
one of the reasons is all the legitly problems are on the exchanges shoulders not yours.

That may not be possible in some countries. The Egyptian government has imposed limits on credit card spending amounts. Even legitimate businessmen are unable to pay for imports because of bank shortages of US dollars, forcing them to turn to black market exchangers and sometimes travelling with large amounts of money to deliver it in person.

I found a thread on another forum discussing Bitcoin being banned in Egypt, although they don't offer any information beyond the original article: http://www.borsaat.com/vb/t949261.html

I don't trust facebook at all.
Has anyone a link to an article from a respected news source? Any language would be accepted.

Egypt is becoming such a crazy place with the current leadership in place any thing can change on a dime.
The place is so set on tourism that all the garbage coming out of there is just going to make it turn belly up in quite a short time.
I still can not get the image of that lady being dragged off to be raped with 50 dudes chasing after her to watch and partake.
Angered me so much to know that there where people living on that level of exsistence,turned me right off Egypt.

Hopefully a new leadership can turn things around but the current setup is a dictatorship,that will not end well.

If it is true that this guy is a scammer/fraudster, than good for him that he was arrested.

It seems crazy that the Egyptian Ministry of Interior operates an official facebook page. It's crazy, but it's possible: Maybe this way they want to show how progressive they are at adopting "new" technologies, while at the same time they can arrest people without charge. Even the "crime" was staged by them.

It's sad that developing countries, that have the most to gain from embracing Bitcoin at an early stage oppress innovation. Apparently everything they can't entirely understand or control is considered a threat. This attitude ensures that the country will remain in the same derailed state as it is in today for the next decades. :(

I really hope the guy will be released soon without injury...

ya.ya.yo!

Please educate yourself before typing. tnx

http://www.elnadanews.com/Egypt/421217.html
http://www.misr-eg.com/egypt/68187.html

Lol, remember the "Facebook Revolution" rhetoric from the Arab Spring uprising in Egypt? One minute the Egyptians are using Facebook the same way that Romanians used fax machines against Ceaucescu, the next minute the Ministry of Love is using it to "help" them choose their medium of exchange (and the rate) during the subsequent regime. They're real admirers of irony, these bureaucrats.

alpetkoan.com is available (gleaned from the translation, assuming it means Bitcoin).

What are you talking about?? ::)

There were similar incidents in different parts of the world, where someone dealing with bitcoins was arrested but iirc, it always involved huge cash trades, so maybe it isn't about bitcoin but tax fraud and money launder.

So this dentist bitcoin trader got arrested because he admitted to transacting foreign currencies? Since when did that become illegal? Unless he is using that for money laundering, I can't find any reason for him to be arrested.  Or maybe he figured in a previous scam, and he is already in the police's watchlist? If bitcoin isn't illegal in Egypt, what were the police thinking?

What if the Egyptian dentist was charging his patients in US dollars and he legitimately has earned these $13,900 USD ? Isn't he allowed to do anything he wants with this money? How can the police arrest him when Bitcoin is still not recognized as a digital currency in Egypt? This thing is pretty bad in my opinion and I would be very wary when buying coins off Localbitcoins traders as the police may be snooping around in other countries as well.

If he is same person with the scammer in the link, then he deserve it.

If he is a true scammer and caught, then we should thank Egytian authorities for doing the right things.

this was expected.

when you link bank account (money is involved) and he has scammed people who go to authorities then he will eventually get caught.

although we don't know the whole story the links in OP are not sufficient for that.

I'm stunned by the number of people expressing this sentiment. I get the feeling many such people have either never experienced police officers in their "natural habitat", or that they let TV pundits and pictures do their thinking for them.

Here is the news: the police forces of the world do not represent law enforcement, they represent official violence and in 95% of cases can mete out said official violence with impunity; statute or no statute, infraction or no infraction.

Their role today has very little correspondence with what they're really for: keeping the peace. Today, police forces are the No. 1 disturbers of the peace across the globe.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-egypt-dollars-blackmarket-idUSKCN0XI1W9

CAIRO | BY ASMA ALSHARIF

Egypt's war on black market currency traders is not going to plan. One month after a devaluation that was supposed to ease an acute dollar shortage in the banking system, clandestine business is booming in cafes, shops and flats.

The central bank, which hoped the 13 percent devaluation would relieve downward pressure on the Egyptian pound, has cracked down on exchange bureaux trading far outside its set range.

And yet the gap between the official and black market rates, which briefly narrowed with the devaluation, is now wider than ever, with dealers buying and selling dollars for 20 percent or more above the official rate of 8.78 pounds.

Traders say the crackdown has only exacerbated the crisis. People with dollars are shunning the official financial system, starving it of foreign currency. This is putting yet more pressure on the pound, with potentially dire consequences for inflation, investors' confidence and economic growth.

"No one sells dollars to the banks any more. They all prefer to go to the black market which will pay them more," said one banker who asked to remain anonymous. "The dollars don't come into the banking system any more and the central bank's dollar reserves are not enough to support the country's import needs."

Egypt has struggled to restore growth since the 2011 uprising that toppled President Hosni Mubarak scared away tourists and foreign investors - vital sources of the foreign currency it needs to import everything from fuel to food.

Eradicating the black market is essential to restoring investors' confidence, easing the risk that the pound's volatility will erase their profits.

Already, foreign investors are struggling to repatriate earnings because the central bank's reserves have more than halved since 2011 to about $16.5 billion in March. This has made it hard for them to convert pound earnings into foreign currency through the banking system.

Even before last month's devaluation, which was accompanied by the launch of financial instruments aimed at attracting hard currency to the banks, the central bank had resorted to legal force. In February, it revoked the licenses of four exchange companies with 27 offices.

Since then, the expected influx of dollars has failed to materialize and this month it referred 15 more exchange firms to public prosecutors. Then on Wednesday the central bank said it had revoked the licenses of nine more companies for manipulating prices of dollars in the parallel market.

REPEATED OFFENCES

"The decision ... comes after repeated offences by these companies which distorted the exchange market and has harmed the national economy," said Gamal Negm, deputy central bank governor, in remarks published by the state news agency MENA.

Negm added that the bank is working on a new law that could raise the punishment for violators to a prison sentence.

Bankers say the clampdown has backfired because as it became riskier to deal on the black market, the dollar strengthened against the pound and people began hoarding foreign currency to speculate on the rate. This pushed the U.S. currency yet higher, and the pound hit a record low of 11.50 to the dollar this week.

"Traders are speculating on the dollar and those who need dollars for imports can't find the dollars and must buy them from traders and speculators, so the black market rate is putting the Egyptian economy in a tight spot," said Ziad Waleed, an economist at Beltone Financial.

Any further official devaluation would threaten to fuel inflation, a politically explosive development in a country where millions live in poverty. That leaves the central bank with few weapons in its arsenal.

One trader described the situation as a standoff, saying that while the central bank is trying to punish black market dealers, it does not have the resources to fight them.

"We will secure ourselves and we will continue to work and we will do it carefully, as if we were dealing in drugs. We will hoard the dollars and we won't sell. Where will the central bank get dollars from?" he said.

EASY EVASION

Just a few blocks away from one Cairo exchange bureau, a trader sipped coffee at a downtown cafe as he closed deals over the telephone away from the prying eyes of the authorities.

"Do you have riyals?" he asked another trader, quoting the black market rate for the Saudi currency. "I will take all of it."

This is one example of how easily traders are adapting to tighter oversight.

They quote official rates at the exchange bureaux, which are closely monitored, without making any deals. Business is then done at cafes or elsewhere at black market rates, dealers said.

Outside the bureaux, young men puff on cigarettes and whisper to customers: "Dollars? Euros?"

"No one buys or sells at the official rate, so as soon as the customer leaves there are guys standing outside to catch them and deal with the unofficial rates," said another exchange bureau manager in downtown Cairo.

It should be easy to clamp down on these men, but traders say agents of the Interior Ministry's General Department of Public Funds Crime Investigation Unit, which is responsible for tackling illegal trading outside the bureaux, are easily bribed.

Reuters spoke to 10 traders who either work, own, or collaborate with exchange bureaux and all said that their operations run smoothly thanks to bribes and favors that are given to Public Funds forces and central bank employees.

"It does not put a dent in profits," said one exchange bureau worker, adding that a single branch of the company he works for makes around 6 million Egyptian pounds ($675,680 at the official rate or about $522,000 on the black market) in profit each month on black market trades alone.

The Interior Ministry spokesman did not respond to requests for comment and officials at the central bank, which does not have a spokesman, were not available for comment.

Exchange bureaus are licensed to operate with a certain amount of funds but most have offices or apartments where business is carried out off the books.

"If they close the exchange bureaux we will continue to work from the streets and this way the dollar price will reach 13 or 15 pounds per dollar," one trader said.

LUGGAGE SHOPS AND CARS

President Abdel Fattah al-Sisi has made economic revival a priority but is also mindful of protecting the poor, with his government slowing cuts to subsidies which keep down some food and fuel prices but burden the budget.

If the central bank is forced into repeated devaluations to keep up with the black market, this would be a nightmare for authorities trying to stabilize the economy.

But so is the current situation, where the public sector functions at an official exchange rate wholly disconnected from the rest of the economy which has to deal on the black market.

Black market activity is fast and efficient.

In Cairo, a luggage store manager took 20,000 pounds from his wooden desk in return for $2,000, a deal made with a customer who had been turned down at the exchange bureau next door. The operation took under a minute.

One trader showed Reuters a car he uses to transfer funds to clients in rubbish bags hidden in the boot. "The largest amount this car carried is the equivalent of 11 million Egyptian pounds," he said proudly.

Along with reporting the news, I guess.

http://www.theguardian.com/media/2015/dec/15/egypt-jails-record-number-of-journalists (http://www.theguardian.com/media/2015/dec/15/egypt-jails-record-number-of-journalists)

What do you mean to say? That Egypt is not a developing country? Maybe Egypt's economy has improved, but the country still ranks well below rank 100 in world GDP per capita comparisons. Its GDPpc is less then a 10th than that of the UK. I think that makes it quite safe to speak of Egypt as a developing country - even if one outrightly ignores the problematic political and human rights situation.

Btw. I was referring to actions of the officials, not to the citizen.

ya.ya.yo!

After translating I think he was not arrested solely for bitcoin usage.
He was engaged in some sort of illegal activities including money laundering and card cloning.
The confiscated items proves that.

Similar case to Escrow.ms

Thanks a lot.
I understand and I'm not surprised. Most poor countries impose controls on foreign currencies and BTC looks like one to many eyes. Then we're talking about a very large sum. Equivalent to $100K in cash to an American, probably more than what an dentist earns in one year in Egypt. To police forces and the taxman, such a sum is obviously suspicious.

Although the article doesn't specify what he was charged with, they do allude to what he was suspected of before taking action.


"With the completion of the technical analysis, it was apparent that the aforementioned individual was trading in foreign cash currencies, and carrying out cash exchanges, trading the currency 'bitcoin', for the dollar."

Please get your facts right before you throw in lies

Im the owner of btc2okpay account on localbitcoins , some1 is using my nickname here on bitcointalk.org to scam ppls , its not me , i have 100% feedback and hundreds of trades on localbitcoins , how come i would scam some1 for 366 euro ...its some1 who used my known name to scam

So is bitcoin legal in Egypt?

There is no rule yet regarding this but i think it should be legal as its legal in many other places all over the world as long as u r doing nothing illegal with the btc.

So you were the one arrested?

just trading bitcoin is not illegal anywhere in the world as far as i know, and so far all the arrests or problems with the law that i have seen was another type of problem like (most times) tax evasion, or money laundering, or scamming people, and other crimes which has nothing to do with bitcoin trading.

There are some countries that have issued bans on using Bitcoin according to Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_bitcoin_by_country

Not weird,bitcoin already illegal in some countries,but its not make bitcoin users lost their mass,its why in my country still so many bitcoin users.. ;D

would appear so, in Sydney Australia account holders do send other people for the meet i think

I find this very weird and wrong. Holding bitcoins is like holding any virtual tokens. Why is it illegal? Those guys are really crazy making bitcoins the enemy. Bitcoin is a friend and it should be treated like that.

Another instance about law enforcement being against bitcoiners  :-\
I do keep hearing that more and more countries are enforcing their laws to inhibit it's use within their jurisdictions.
Once they give the ok to have people arrested for using it that will not be good thing for it's progression in other parts of the world that are on the fence to allow it to be accepted at a retail level.

So is that you on a news?

yeah but a lot of them are just having "not regulated" status. there is saying using bitcoin is illegal. and those who are listed as such ("you will get arrested if you use bitcoin" like a couple of the countries) are not a law but a government official is saying this law should be placed if you follow the news. like russia.

I think it depends on country ,i hope they won't banned bitcoin in my country .it was very helpful to us.
I there this bitcoins in egypt is use on many illegal or illegal things to buy so the traders is also accused.

Egypt seems have bad problem for democracy. there was also a phd student from italy tortured and the killed without reason (and without a clearly guilty).
Anyone ever listen the story of Giulio Regeni?

That's really worse to arrest a person. They without proper understand believe bitcoin is full of illegal and antisocial activities. This makes authorities to do such strange things.

Yeah its not all country ready to accept bitcoin, its because bitcoin has some bad reputation due to people used it for money laundry and rumor that isis use bitcoin to purchase weapon

I don't know that why he was arrested, if it is the law of egypt then egypt is going to destroy their nation by denying them from the modern technology and if it is because of money laundering then it is good.

Yeah its not legal in other country.. because they know bitcoin uses for anonymous process.. yeah your right for illegal buying weapons . also for illegal buying hack accounts and drugs.. in darkweb they are using bitcoins to transact money without worry.. bitcoin has many features that we like.
some of the features are bitcoin is anonymous, you can use bitmixer so that you can not trace easily. and many features that some country don't like..

Well the whole point of LocalBTC was to trade with actual people, via meetups and the like. If you're buying and doing it all online you can just buy direct from an exchange.

if you are the real owner of the localbitcoin account that was mentioned by the ministry of interior in Egypt, can you tell us what happen? did you get released ?

just because a person is arrested for trading bitcoin doesn't mean bitcoin is illegal.

in many countries it's not legal for individuals to sell large amounts of national currency for international currency.

The same way real users would find him.

Not sure why people are praising the egyptian police.  Its not hard to find the guy on lbc and organise an in person meet up.

and that is exactly what happen. they contact him asking to buy bitcoin and in the meeting the got him. nothing hard at all in what they have done because any trader would not have doubt that he is not talking to a real customer

There is no data about the status of bitcoin at Egypt but as can be seen the status of the lion of the cryptos at this country is "not desirable". What a stupid behavior...

contact me on telegram .. @Thou_High5  .. I need an advertiser on reddit