Bitcoin Forum

Just a question.

Maybe I'm wrong, maybe my eyes are lying to me but I see a few people on here who ABSOLUTELY HATED ETH, who are now ABSOLUTELY LOVING ETH(ETC). The problem I have here is that those haters say that they hated the ETH principle and technology blah blah blah... but the principle and technology blah blah blah... has not changed. ETH(ETC) is still the old ETH, on the same old 'old chain', but now they're arguing for it!!! The very thing they said they hated!!!

I don't get it...

So, did they really hate ETH,
or did they just hate the profit people were making with ETH,
or did they just hate the fact that they didn't create ETH,
or did they just hate the fact that they missed the big bus that was ETH,
or is this just a relic of them still wanting to buy cheap ETH,
or do they still hate ETH so much that they'll buy ETH(ETC) to kill ETH,
or is the enemy of my enemy my friend, therefore ETH(ETC),
or is it something else and I've completely missed the actual factual point?

Can anyone explain why 'the intelligent ones' who used to hate ETH and argued with such vitriol against ETH are now buying and supporting ETH(ETC)?? I thought 'the intelligent ones' were immutable!

This industry is pure fiction!

:D :D :D

etc gives eth haters more reason to hate eth than ever and they can make money at the same time. what's not to love? I guess also etc's existence clears up some of the doubts others had about eth's morality and backbone. if etc sticks around they're gonna have to hold themselves to some rigid principles. that appeals to a lot of people.

Amen.

Moreover, "rolling back because of theft through a fork" is impossible, because there will always be theft.  Bitcoin has known more than 50 spectacular thefts (exchanges, big wallet owners, ....) and many much more small thefts.  So if you fork EVERY TIME, then you fork your coin to oblivion, and if you don't, it means that not all users are equal for the "law", and only buddies and important people will get forked out of theft, which is morally even more fiat-like.

On top of that, "theft" in the bitcoin world is rather simple: it is stealing a currency.  "theft" in the ethereum world, "abuse of contract", is a much murkier water.  Who is going to be the judge ?

So what ETH did is impossible to maintain as a principle.  And if it is impossible to maintain as a principle, then that means that there are privileged and non privileged: those who will be bailed out by a fork, and the normal crowd.

ETH has lost all moral and legal foundations by forking, even if it was to "restore funds from theft", simply because that principle cannot be maintained.

And if now they claim that this was only once, then what do we have to think ?  That, in their dreams, by the time ethereum takes over bitcoin and has a market cap of say, $50 billion, with contracts running on it in the 5 billion dollars, when people loose now, due to a bug, 4 billion dollars, what are they going to do ?  They bailed out a meager 60 millions back in the old days.  What are they going to do when 4 billion is lost ?  "sorry guys, we said that it was the last time" ?

No, ETH has lost all grounds to know whether you'll get a bail out or not, and OF COURSE there will be a lot of theft and contracts doing funny things on it, unless ETH won't have contracts on it any more.

Yes. The new support momentum coming in to the original Ethereum classic is coming from the bitcoiners. I think even the attacker is a bitcoiner himself. There are even discussions that the attacker is the group of Mircea Popescu. He is one of the most feared men in bitcoin.

i really love ETH especially when the rate is down LOL  ;D because its good for margin. but i am not much like it ETC. but as long as ETC can give me profit, i will buy and sell it like other people.

I thought that Ethereum will be done after the DAO hack. I was wrong. Now this situation reminds me of mythological Hydra, when you cut one of its heads another grows.
This is what ETH (ETC) is now- a hydra. What I love, however, is the way ETH team is solving problems - 'just fork it boys, and full speed ahead'!

i didn't hate ETH because from old ETH i was already got small profit from these coin and now new ETH {ETC} has becomes the new celebrity in cryptocurrency world because it's being popular currently and market cap also looks pretty good but for me it's all about how i got profit not more from that because if i thought i will got profit from these coin i think i would love these coin too

you are a fool if you think people ever loved ethereum.

maybe some found the project somewhat interesting at some point. or liked it at best.

but in general everybody is loving the pump and dump and the BTC and $ they are earning from the pump and dump and that is all there is to it.

This guy speaks the truth. The real intention here is to make money. The group supporting the original Ethereum classic is now looking for their opportunity to get their light in the day and make profit. But I hope they intend to build a better platform side by side with making money. That is only fair.

Agreed it's about the real desire.. BITCOIN !

I have seen nothing different with any of this post-fork shenanigans
that would make me think there is more support for Ethereum.. or variants.

End of the day ETH is ETH.

All i think is i figured it was scammy in 2014 and even more by 2016.
This all changes nothing for me..

You all wanna play around with this crap.. have at 'er ..go hard.
Don't complain when you get burned though.

..i wouldn't touch that coin with YOUR wallet guys !

Many ppl didnt like hf. hf happen only because vitalik, his friends and few miners were invested in dao, and wonted to get their investment back. This hf was made for all the wrong reasons.

etc is acctually what eth should be - running unstobable applications. this includes all the consequences of writing, and investing, into bugy contracts.

Yeah, traders don't love the coin itself. They love the fluctuation of the price which gives them opportunity to gain profit from it. They are supporting he coin when they got profit from it. When sudden drop of coin occur and their profit looses, they make accusations to the coin. It is funny how Ironic to those who just go with the flow. The dev's are doing great jobs to make the coin better but it is not appreciated.

If you think etc is acctually what eth should be, are you going to support the ETC and buy it or mine it?

What??? It's no more immutable now than it was before. If our DAO thief and a few guys start up another foundation and miners start to give them the same level of respect that the ETH miners gave the Ether Foundation and one day things don't go their way then ETH(ETC) could also potentially be forked somewhere down the road. What if there's a transaction issue like what we're seeing with BTC?

What makes you claim that forking ETH(ETC) is impossible?? Isn't that the same as Slock.it dudes claiming that The DAO funds are secure??? What if our famous thief decides to show you just how great he is and forks it all by himself using this 'immutable' code.... again!



It was always about the BTC and $. I'm not sure about the PnD statement (not everybody is a trader) but people saw it as a way to become like old school bitcoiners with 1000's of expensive little tokens.

And that's why imo lots are jumping on ETH(ETC). They are hoping to see it at $20 like ETH got to. They want profit! ETH2 has touched down. They're hoping it's 'Destination Moon' and not Destination Gobi' next :D

Absolutely agree with that.
In terms of alts it's all about the money.Short it, pump and dump it to increase your bitcoin stash or to make some profits in fiat.
Sure some Bitcoin maximalists ight take advantage of this whole Ethereum debacle as well to make Vitalik and Brian Shitstrong feel even more pissed.And guess what? They deserve it!!

well spoken! I totally agree.

[sorry to be harsh but I have to say this] take your heads out of your asses, there is no Love or Hate ethereum. it is as it has always been about the money. even a newbie looking at the charts can see the potential and also the huge risk that etherum has brought to us to make money.

all the support (love) or deny (hate) topics that you see for either eth or ethc or for both has one purpose and that is contributing to the pump. so far from start of this rally ethc has gone up 400% and dropped down again.

who is to say the same people behind the ethereum are not pumping classic? don't they love $$$

I feel theajority of us that would be branded 'ETH haters' are honestly indifferent about the coin. Most of us reacted to the hype and bullshit that came pouring in, and tried to steer the weaker sheep away from the wolves. ETC is Ethereum, without all the branding and filigree. That, I can appreciate. The fact that it feeds my inner troll to invest in an asset counter to ETH (inversely related) is just icing on my dark hearted cake.

Indeed. Real bitcoiners love core devs cause they know they will not fuck with the immutability of the blockchain. This factor was not found in Vitalik. Vitalik is just an immature kid, intelligent yes, but very immature. This bailout thing has caused the chain to spawn a new coin that they were not expecting: ETC. ETC is actually the real pre-bailout Ethereum. Bitcoiners pay respect to ETC supports for staying true to the definition of decentralized immutable smart contracts, and that definition includes letting the DAO fall without disturbing the time/space of the blockchain, and they have played with fire by doing a rollback. Remember kids, never fuck around with time/space or you will pay for it. Let things develop. This is the ETC approach. No bailout and rollback for ETC.

Poor Bitcoin bagholders. I understand them, putting their mouths where money is. They hope for ETH death, it's their only exit. ;)

P.S. Yes, I'm sick and tired of Bitcoin scalability drama. Bitcoin community showed dissonance with miners, that didn't happen in Ethereum's case. For now.

They only fudded on ETH because they missed the train. Now that they've filled their bags with cheap criminal ETC coins they finally admit that ETH is a gud tech.

Yes. It is a good tech and without the hard fork roll back and tweaking of transactions. The Ethereum fork is a chain that is corrupted by a small group of people that have lost their principles and are now viewed by the community as frauds. Vitalik's career in crypto is now destroyed. He is now a joke in the eyes of his peers. He is not cypherpunk material. He is just another money seeking individual now in the eyes of the community.

@bbc.reporter

BULLSHIT it is not "good tech"

And it's pointed out out WHY millions of times so how the hell did you not see it ?
Blind or are you being deceitful ?

And this goes for fraud boy too..

Good tech ? that is rich LOL
Thanks for the laugh i needed that today hahhahaha  :D

It was hacked exploited for fuck sake's  ::)
Then it was a lazy attempt an an ICO scam.

Did they TRY and make something revolutionary with it's launch ?
Hell nooooo...
All they did was hobble some gimmick scheme idea together with the same old classic ICO.

Good tech would be actually improving over the concept of an ICO.
Did they try ? fuck no.
All they did was side step all that by launching an ICO then tacking on Mining later.
Then they did what people always do with ICO's.. they exploited the living fucking shit out of it
..in 2014 on Launch day.
Then paid each other a small fortune in coins.

Which was WORSE than bitching about a coin having a 2% premine.
Because the 2% coin would actually have to fulfill it's intended purpose right at launch.
Where ETH never did have to nor any other ICO.. they can spew verbal diarrhea an keep their hand out ..forever.

"Good Tech" ?
For what ?
All of you here would not shut up about "APP's"
Then you all at once dropped that for some mysterious reason
then reinforced the words "smart contract" for some weird reason.
Almost like your leader ordered you too ROFL

"Good Tech" ?
What smart contracts ? Like DAO ? and the NOW fork drama.. yeah that was a GREEEEEAT idea  :o
And what was DAO ?
A Pyramid scheme built within another Pyramid Scheme.. FOR PROFIT !

But ok then what about the other "smart contracts" ?
What about them ?
I never heard anyone ever talk about them yet that *IS* the intended purpose now isn't it ?
What *DO* we hear about non stop ? Profits on centralized exchanges.
So what does that ell us about the actual real world use of this "Good Tech" ?
It's sooooooooo "GOOD" ..it's not even used HHAHHAHAHAHHA  ;D

Gimmme a fucking break.
The launch had a million signs that it was setup for a massive profit scheme.
So the intention is stained right there ..right from the start of ETH.
Reinfocred by the Pump / Manipulation bullshit in 2016 that sealed the deal on bad intent.
Otherwise i would have said to you all here & now that..
Maybe the original dev's intention was honest but it ended up not being "used" as intended
and instead diverted into nothing but a "Fuel Tokens" money making thing.
Which would give Butters plausible deniability to play dumb.. but he knew damn well how it would play out.
Which is why he was caught on launch day with his team paying them selves millions in coins
they later dumped in 2016 on you all.

The "Tech" is a fucking failure.
If you make a new revolutionary Bicycle that is say electric powered but..
still has pedals on it to manually pedal around and NOBODY ever uses the electrical part.
Then the tech is a god damn failure.

And what is the fucking point with ETH ?
A currency ? ..noooope
If it was wouldn't it have to be used as such ?
And if it is not then what is it then ?
What would you HAVE to call it ?
A digital profit token for centralized exchanges ?
Sounds to me a lot like a Digital Pyramid Scheme token to me.

If ETC is criminal because it didn't fork over 1 (one) theft, is ETH going to become also a criminal coin when it will not fork over the next theft, or will it fork over the next theft ?  Or will there be no theft any more, and was this the only, sole, single theft that ever will happen on the ETH chain ?

What's your vision on that ?  Should BTC have forked over the 50 or more spectacular thefts it has known or not and is it a criminals' coin or not ?

what is not to love, it has been getting pumped in the past couple of days and those who have taken the risk to buy it early has made some money out of it.

and ethereum has been all about this, to get pumped and let us make money :D

For the miners, there are no criminal coins. One guy who said he was going to 51% attack the ETC is going to mine it now.

Some of us don't care about making money.

Making money off scam coins does not interest me.

Personally ETH sounded like a scam to me for the whole time i knew about it.  The people shilling for it drove me insane hence i developed a real hatred for ETH.

Seems my instincts were right.

ETC at least had the morals to stick to what ETH supposedly stood for unlike the moral bankrupt HF brigade.

Im tempted to support that.  It deserves our support for at least staying true to its beliefs.

So yeah i like BTC and hate ETH and i may very well see what hashrate i can afford to buy and throw at ETC just on principal.  Not because i expect to make money from it. 

In fact i expect to buy some expensive hardware.  Spend precious time and waste electricity by mining ETC.  But you know what morally its probably worth every cent to watch the morally bankrupt ETH foundation squirm!

So you are not going to make some money from the ETC? Maybe the DAO hacker will not dump the coins.

I don't think the hacker has an incentive to dump. He can just wait, see his wealth get higher and then start staking as a whale once POS launches.

As long as she still owns the ETC, not many people dare to buy the ETC just in case she dumps a lot.

That overhang could kill the ETC. It gives people the impression that the ETC is a hack coin, bad for the reputation.

fear of a whale with big pockets has not yet stopped anybody from buying eth or etc. you seem to have forgotten how many million dollars worth of eth Vitalik has, also the ethereum foundation which is one of the biggest stash of all.

just try and enjoy the pump while it lasts.

Honestly i am also afraid about that problem about eth but they are now converting etc thats why the price of etc right now is increasing do you think etc will be good to choose or it will be the same worst will happen.. 

I'm enjoying it but i still have to think whether its going to be here to stay.  I have invested to it already and so maybe i should try to find out more.
is ETC owned by the DAO hacker?

ETC is making money for lots of people now. Question is:Will the ETC developers come up with another fork should someone hack ETC..? Then we will have ETCC :D :D

ETC was the chain that didnt decide to fork.  So i doubt they are planning on another fork considering they decided against the first one

most haters hate ethereum foundation and not ethereum technology.

they've kinda backed themselves into a corner by taking the stand they have, though I understand why. I guess they'll be happy to fork if it's for a technical glitch or a totally non controversial improvement. anything else might get sticky.

I'm not a big fan of the ETH hard fork, but ETC only serves to weaken the reputation of the alt coin community. If they didn't agree with the hard fork they should have moved their support to another coin instead splitting the ETH community into two camps.

I am not a big fan of the staff here taking away the nooby jail.
It led to the inevitable further abuse of this forum by fraudsters.

Yup NOOBS there used to be a probationary section you were stuck in for a while when signing up.
I know, i had to go through it !

Shame we can't put you back.

@Minecache

Indeed !

Then i could educate these NOOBS early on and teach them the right way.
You need to FUD noobs early on to reach them.. or they become a lost cause  :'(

That is right. The Ethereum community will support the ETH as most developers say they will support ETH.

If the ETC bag holder are very rich, they can employ good developers and pump the price higher so more people will use it.

I doubt that anyone who hated Eth before the fork is loving ETC after the fork.
In my opinion both are totally useless.But Eth after the bailout is even more ridiculous as they are going the way of a centralized controlled and governed altcoin.This is against all what a real crypto blockchain stands for and what the dev team of Eth have always marketed.

There is a discussion about return DAO ETC.
https://www.reddit.com/r/EthereumClassic/comments/4wyk47/re_the_etc_salvaged_from_attackdaos/?st=iroulnm4&sh=8725cd93

"We, as community members and because of the impending emergency, volunteered to secure the ETC that was immobilised in the “attackDAOs” after the “Robin Hood Group” disbanded.
Our number 1 goal is to ensure that the funds are distributed in a fair, transparent and just manner. Attempts have been made to convince us to manipulate the market and the distribution of funds for private individuals’ profit. We have refused to do so and are committed to treat every concerned party equitably and in a fair manner. We have been, and still are, in the process of seeking legal advice.
Achieving this will take time and thought to consider all of the reasonable options in the interest of all the concerned members of the various communities."

ETH is crap after what they did with this hardfork rush, price of ETC is irrelevant. I sold ETC and will buy more ETC once ETH forks again cause something goes wrong with a DAO part 2. Im sure ETC will go up again.

It is good time to buy the ETC after the price crashes to below $1 after the hacker dump his coins from the DAO hack.

Hacker may not dump ETC so early as ETC is getting lots of support from other devs and hashrate is also rising continuously. May be price will test 0.01 btc atleast as ETH got dumped from 0.03 to 0.02 around after hardfork so that remaining bitcoin out of ETH marketcap may flow towards ETC making ETC 0.01 btc per coin and also hashrate is divided in same 1:2 ratio right now.

the previous traders are always traders so they are always trading both coins with no difference.
they will always go where the profit is. but ETC is showing more promise even with the massive ETH shills dumping on ETC and putting up big walls ETC is still alive and resisting.

Sorry the hash rate is not rising continuously. It is only fluctuating up and down in since the beginning and I do not think it has risen past the peak of around 1000 GH/s. Does anybody know why the miners go in and out of ETC?

most miners use an algorithm to calculate profitability, sometimes ETH is more profitable and some times ETC is more profitable. Is all about price.

im not a fan of fork either though i didnt hate eth before, right now etc is the best currency for me and i think that it is going to grow in the future

you must have bought your ETC when its price was just $0.50 yet.
Most users who love and support a coin are those that have bags of it. I don't have bags of ETC but sure have supported it that I've bought ETC even when its price was already $3.

I love ETH as well when it started and even DAO until what happen to DAO.

Banano that is a good point and I did not think of it that way until now. I am looking at it as 2 coins struggling for dominance but there should be cooperation. They are only hurting each other and that very unproductive. Why would ETH want to undermine or kill ETC? All ETH prefork has the equivalent amount of ETC. They are all stake holders from both sides so it would be better for them if both are successful.

And yet the scammy launch is of no interest what so ever ?

There is NOTHING more important than how a coin is launched.
That is the top of the list when it comes to concerns.
At least i thought it was for the intelligent folk around here.

Side stepping that glaring issue in the name of profit is vulgar and you all should be embarrassed.

It is 100% obvious you are all masquerading as "Supporters" for one reason.
To lurk around in the shadows doing trades to make Bitcoin.
So NO ..you are not supporters of anything.

Just because you join a Pyramid scheme and make a few bucks..
Don't mean it's a legit project.

Really not sure how the fuck you all fail to get that.
Like jeezuz did i hear that non stop as a retort defending Doge coin.
I say it's a scammy piece of shit and here is 10 tangible reasons..
Their retort ?
Well.. uhh... but but but I made money off it (Bitcoin)

SO ?  :D

And here you are all the same sleazy hit & runners moving to the next pumped coin
sniffing around for BTC pocket change firing off the same pathetic excuses.

Do you realize how pathetic that looks ?

It's so bad i just quit caring.. i just dumped my coins and gave them way.
I am not willing to participate in a gross blatant vulgar ponzi scam scene for profit.
..no matter the juvenile asinine kidiot excuses.

Keep it up though your outcome is predetermined.
Which is great for whales LOL
Play with your food before you eat it.. like a cat eating a mouse.

I think if the lost DAO can be recovered by the police, then it is good to have ETC. Otherwise, ETH is better.

The ETC can be killed by the dump of the Ethereum Foundation, the DAO holders including the hackers. That is the main concern.

The police? What are you saying? I am not sure if you know what you are talking about or if you are just posting nonsense for your signature campaign.

A dump by the attacker or the white hate group and the Ethereum foundation will be bad for the price of ETC. But it will not kill it. If they dump, whales and speculators will buy. I am also sure the miners themselves will also buy. It should be encouraged that they dump now to get that out of the way. But the wise thing to do is to hold.

The miners are mostly not the speculators. They will sell the most of the coins they mine as they have the bills to pay.

If there is incentive to hold because it will be profitable, I do not see why miners will sell right away. They would even find other ways to increase their holdings by increasing mining power if it is seen profitable to mine more.

I love it.. classic Crypto-Retort  :D

..you all chant for 7 years

FREE MARKET !

then.. something happens

OH MY FUCKING GOD !

CALL THE COPS !

You clowns are hillarious hahahahha

You all REALLY wonder why i say people in Crypto are dumb a lot ? Really ?