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Title: Forks are highly important Post by: RawDog on March 13, 2017, 08:59:33 AM Look at the Ethereum fork. Perfect. Two sides have a difference of opinion. Neither will budge. It is a full impasse.
Fork. Everyone says the world is over. Chaos everywhere. Time passes. More time passes. One side wins and the chain is fine and perfect and strong again. The other side proved it was the side destine to die. That idea is gone forever. Everyone wins. The network is improved and the impasse is settled. Forks are the way to settle a difference of opinion. Avoiding forks guarantees infinite and endless fighting. In Bitcoin where everyone is crying about a hard fork - they question never gets settled. More than two years now, no settlement. It is just like the Shia and Sunni. Fighting forever, no settlement. One side needs to die. It is like the Jews and Palestinians. Fighting forever. day, after day, after day. killing with no solution. The impasse assures more killing in the future. Ethereum settled the fight with a fork where one side dies off. This is the way to make the network strong. We need a bitcoin hard fork. Bitcoin BU and Bitcoin SegWit. after some time, one side will be better than the other. The network will be stronger and the impasse and killing will be gone. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Pursuer on March 13, 2017, 09:08:34 AM I wonder how much more does it take before you are banned because of constant trolling and continuous creation of bullshit topics in this forum!
so far forum admins/mods have been so generous to you!!! Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: NorrisK on March 13, 2017, 09:17:22 AM Ethereum didn't settle with a fork in this way. They decided to fork and leave the old chain behind, instead, the other fork was used to make a lot of profits by having exchanges credit the coins to the users and creating a market place for them.
If the exchanges weren't so greedy at that point, ETC would've never lived. Nobody cared about it, just the profits. The same will happen with bitcoin. Nobody will care which fork wins, they only care that the total of the two coins is worth more than the originial bitcoin. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: RawDog on March 13, 2017, 09:21:18 AM I wonder how much more does it take before you are banned because of constant trolling and continuous creation of bullshit topics in this forum! All you SegWit guys think the impending fork is a bullshit topic. You guys understand you are going to lose this fight. Censorship hasn't really worked so well in this forum. It actually pisses people off when you try to stuff rags down their throat.so far forum admins/mods have been so generous to you!!! Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: NeuroticFish on March 13, 2017, 09:27:17 AM Look at the Ethereum fork. Perfect. Two sides have a difference of opinion. Neither will budge. It is a full impasse. We need a bitcoin hard fork. Bitcoin BU and Bitcoin SegWit. after some time, one side will be better than the other. The network will be stronger and the impasse and killing will be gone. Hard fork is like a revolution. It's good if it's the bringer of a new (and better?) world. If it does a significant improvement it's good. There are 2 keyword here: significant and improvement. Hard forks should be however rare, because if they are too many they become a sign that the coin is not mature yet. Hard fork can make the price drop. Some are scared of that. Hard for can split communities and both may lose of it. Somehow the politics around Bitcoin always made us believe that hard fork is bad for Bitcoin, they will hurt at least the public image of Bitcoin. I am not sure of the actual reasons behind the scenes. Imho Bitcoin could use hard forks now and then. Major change, new major version, name it: hard fork. One this year, ope in 2 years from now, then 4 years, 8, 16, .. you know the opposite of halving :) Now BU and SegWit. This is not only a significant improvement, it's an ideological split. I don't like it. I didn't like it with ETH either, and I never had ETH, so I am not involved. The biggest power of Bitcoin is the impressive hash rate behind it. You want that diminished. Why? From my understanding BU can split away at any time. Not even 51% needed. Just mine > 1MB block, accept it, and bang! The block is accepted by one chain and not by the other. There's the risk that a few times the BU network could resync with main chain (and miners will lose the fee), but at some point the split will happen. You want that, mine on BU pools, support it and increase its hash rate, giving it more chance to happen. SegWit 95% approach is... too soft. Maybe somebody will end this war. Somebody proposed 2MB + SegWit, to somehow make everybody happier. I still believe that such smart people can do it good. TL;DR: Hard fork = good. Community split = bad. My 2 satoshi. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: samuraijin on March 13, 2017, 12:31:39 PM I think it looks good at least kill one of them may also be a way fork loud but if this does not work maybe we can find other ways nothing better than this hard fork
Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: dinofelis on March 13, 2017, 12:37:56 PM Look at the Ethereum fork. Perfect. Two sides have a difference of opinion. Neither will budge. It is a full impasse. Fork. Everyone says the world is over. Chaos everywhere. Time passes. More time passes. One side wins and the chain is fine and perfect and strong again. The other side proved it was the side destine to die. That idea is gone forever. Everyone wins. The network is improved and the impasse is settled. I agree with you, but bitcoin has a problem to fork: there can only be one "first mover". Bitcoin is afraid to be an alt coin like the rest of crypto, because technologically, bitcoin is the oldest and the most primitive crypto currency. Most alt coins are technologically much better developed. So, what bitcoin has going for it, is its first mover status, its "innocence from the start" status, and hence, the biggest network, the most secured chain and other "branding" aspects, which don't really matter in the *use* of the coin, but are hugely important in the *image* of the coin. With a fork with two prongs, that is over. The only fork that could honestly claim to be "the real bitcoin", would be the coin that is NOT modifying the protocol. But this means that those, most keen on forking, will have to settle losing the "first mover" brand name, which will send a shiver along their spines: no advantage, brought by a fork, is so important, that losing the brand name can be compensated, as long as this brand name is important. Which is why I think that bitcoin really forking is not going to happen as long as bitcoins brand name isn't eroded away. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: European Central Bank on March 13, 2017, 12:44:12 PM BU has gone about in an incredibly stupid way that shows how goddamn brainless they are.
all they had to do was take the core code, tweak one line of block limit and run with that. they would prove that larger blocks weren't the end of the world. maybe everyone would agree and then we'd finally progress. instead they've introduced a bunch of untested messy shit that most people hate. people who previously might have approved of a clean increase won't get behind this. they're throwing away an opportunity that might have drained this swamp once and for all. instead they're gonna make it all way worse. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: AliceWonderMiscreations on March 13, 2017, 01:32:15 PM BU has gone about in an incredibly stupid way that shows how goddamn brainless they are. all they had to do was take the core code, tweak one line of block limit and run with that. they would prove that larger blocks weren't the end of the world. maybe everyone would agree and then we'd finally progress. instead they've introduced a bunch of untested messy shit that most people hate. people who previously might have approved of a clean increase won't get behind this. they're throwing away an opportunity that might have drained this swamp once and for all. instead they're gonna make it all way worse. What messy sh*t did they introduce that people hate? Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: RawDog on March 13, 2017, 01:45:56 PM BU has gone about in an incredibly stupid way that shows how goddamn brainless they are. all they had to do was take the core code, tweak one line of block limit and run with that. they would prove that larger blocks weren't the end of the world. maybe everyone would agree and then we'd finally progress. instead they've introduced a bunch of untested messy shit that most people hate. people who previously might have approved of a clean increase won't get behind this. they're throwing away an opportunity that might have drained this swamp once and for all. instead they're gonna make it all way worse. What messy sh*t did they introduce that people hate? Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: AngryDwarf on March 13, 2017, 01:51:26 PM It looks like we have consensus created during the phoney/cold war:
Segwit supporters think BU supporters are DimBUts. BU supporters thing segwit supporters are Dimwits. The consensus being we are all dim. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: David Rabahy on March 13, 2017, 02:00:31 PM I recommend compromise. Second best would be to just walk away from each other.
Is the ETH run up over or is there more to come? I may pull out of Bitcoin altogether. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: mining1 on March 13, 2017, 02:07:49 PM Well, metropolis is a major eth update / hardfork and will come in june, that alone will spike the price 20-30% more. And for now Enterprise eth alliance is what's pushing the price up. On bitcoin side there's a risk of civil war that may push some investors on the sidelines or in other projects with strong fundamentals and potential.
Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Holliday on March 13, 2017, 03:50:57 PM All you SegWit guys think the impending fork is a bullshit topic. I don't know that I'm a "SegWit guy", but I prefer that over BU any day. I've been waiting for a fork since at least May 31, 2015. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1076412.0 Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: virasog on March 13, 2017, 04:07:08 PM All you SegWit guys think the impending fork is a bullshit topic. I don't know that I'm a "SegWit guy", but I prefer that over BU any day. I've been waiting for a fork since at least May 31, 2015. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1076412.0 Last month, Bitcoin Unlimited briefly passed 25 percent of total blocks mined, indicating that a hard fork to increase the block size might be on the horizon. So maybe one day SegWit prediction of Hardfork for bitcoin may become true. You never know. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Vaccinus on March 13, 2017, 04:33:16 PM Look at the Ethereum fork. Perfect. Two sides have a difference of opinion. Neither will budge. It is a full impasse. Fork. Everyone says the world is over. Chaos everywhere. Time passes. More time passes. One side wins and the chain is fine and perfect and strong again. The other side proved it was the side destine to die. That idea is gone forever. Everyone wins. The network is improved and the impasse is settled. Forks are the way to settle a difference of opinion. Avoiding forks guarantees infinite and endless fighting. In Bitcoin where everyone is crying about a hard fork - they question never gets settled. More than two years now, no settlement. It is just like the Shia and Sunni. Fighting forever, no settlement. One side needs to die. It is like the Jews and Palestinians. Fighting forever. day, after day, after day. killing with no solution. The impasse assures more killing in the future. Ethereum settled the fight with a fork where one side dies off. This is the way to make the network strong. We need a bitcoin hard fork. Bitcoin BU and Bitcoin SegWit. after some time, one side will be better than the other. The network will be stronger and the impasse and killing will be gone. what you said would be true if etheruem classic is dead, but this isn't true, ethereum classic is there running, they effectively created two coins now each one with its marketcap, and ETC is stealing an amount of money from the marketcap of eth, this might happen to bitcoin, although it would be more devastating, i don't like it Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: watashi-kokoto on March 13, 2017, 04:41:31 PM This thread needs more information with respect to the topic. I suggest we may consider to dedicate some time to studying the topic of hard fork, but to understand what a hard fork is, we may need some theory. To quote Satoshi:
HashTube One-Time Signature Scheme Hash tube is used to sign a single k-bit long message digest. The security of the HTOTS depends on the used cryptographic hash function H producing s-bits of output. Any secure hash function can be used. Key generation. Let H : {0,1}* -> H:{0,1}s be a cryptographic hash function. Private key is defined as a triplet (A0, B0, C0) where A0, B0, C0 are different random s-bit numbers. Public key is defined as K, a s-bit number. Next level of tube consisting of a three values (A1, B1, C1) is computed from (A0, B0, C0) as follows: A1 = H( A0 || B0 ) B1 = H( B0 || C0 ) C1 = H( C0 || A0) Here || denotes the concatenation of two values. This is repeated k-times, because in order to sign a value having k bits, the hash tube must have k levels: Ai+1 = H( Ai || Bi ) Bi+1 = H( Bi || Ci ) Ci+1 = H( Ci || Ai ) At the top level Ak = K (The public key) corresponding to the private triplet (A0, B0, C0), is given to the recipient. Last-level Bk and Ck values shall be discarded and never used as public keys. Interestingly Bk is corresponding to the triplet (B0, C0, A0), and indeed Ck is corresponding to the triplet (C0, A0, B0). This is because the tube is symmetric and it is possible to rotate the tube around the axis. But only one top level value shall be used as the public key, to avoid signing multiple messages using this one time signature scheme by accident. Signing a message. Given is a message digest M = m1, m2, ..., mk with mi ∈ {0, 1} . In order the algorithm for every message M to converge to the Ak public key (and not to Bk or Ck), the bits of message digest M are summed and divided modulo 3 and a private key rotation is performed. Private key rotation: If the sum modulo 3 is 0; then D0=A0 ; E0=B0 ; F0=C0; if sum is 1 ; then D0=B0 ; E0=C0 ; F0=A0 ; if the sum is 2 ; then D0=C0 ; E0 = A0 ; F0 = B0 The signature is a sequence of k+1 s-bit numbers. D0 is the first number pushed to the signature. Depending on the first bit m1, either E0 or F0 is pushed as the second number of the signature. The next (level one) value D1 is equal to H(D0||E0) or H(F0||D0) , depending on bit m1. At level i, the bit mi decides what value (Ei or Fi) gets pushed. Di is always revealed by the two values known from the previous level. In the end the signature contains two values from the private key (level 0) and one value from each next level, until the Ak public key is computed. Verifying a signature. Let M:{0,1}k of m1,m2, ..., mk where mi ∈ {0, 1} is the signed message digest. Let D0 = signature[0] ; now D1 = H(D0|| signature[1]) or H(signature[1]||D0) , depending on bit m1. In pseudocode: Di = mi ? H( signaturei || Di-1) : H( Di-1 || signaturei) // this is repeated k=256 times If and only if at the top level of the tube (the Dk) is equal to public key K, the verification has passed. I've come to believe that hard forks are highly improbable. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: RawDog on March 13, 2017, 06:02:43 PM Look at the Ethereum fork. Perfect. Two sides have a difference of opinion. Neither will budge. It is a full impasse. Fork. Everyone says the world is over. Chaos everywhere. Time passes. More time passes. One side wins and the chain is fine and perfect and strong again. The other side proved it was the side destine to die. That idea is gone forever. Everyone wins. The network is improved and the impasse is settled. Forks are the way to settle a difference of opinion. Avoiding forks guarantees infinite and endless fighting. In Bitcoin where everyone is crying about a hard fork - they question never gets settled. More than two years now, no settlement. It is just like the Shia and Sunni. Fighting forever, no settlement. One side needs to die. It is like the Jews and Palestinians. Fighting forever. day, after day, after day. killing with no solution. The impasse assures more killing in the future. Ethereum settled the fight with a fork where one side dies off. This is the way to make the network strong. We need a bitcoin hard fork. Bitcoin BU and Bitcoin SegWit. after some time, one side will be better than the other. The network will be stronger and the impasse and killing will be gone. what you said would be true if etheruem classic is dead, but this isn't true, ethereum classic is there running, they effectively created two coins now each one with its marketcap, and ETC is stealing an amount of money from the marketcap of eth, this might happen to bitcoin, although it would be more devastating, i don't like it Yeah, but the real Ethereum is over $2.5 Billion. Before the fork - it was only $1 Billion. So, a very short time after a contentious fork - BIG VALUE!!! Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: thejaytiesto on March 13, 2017, 06:05:49 PM Look at the Ethereum fork. Perfect. Two sides have a difference of opinion. Neither will budge. It is a full impasse. Fork. Everyone says the world is over. Chaos everywhere. Time passes. More time passes. One side wins and the chain is fine and perfect and strong again. The other side proved it was the side destine to die. That idea is gone forever. Everyone wins. The network is improved and the impasse is settled. Forks are the way to settle a difference of opinion. Avoiding forks guarantees infinite and endless fighting. In Bitcoin where everyone is crying about a hard fork - they question never gets settled. More than two years now, no settlement. It is just like the Shia and Sunni. Fighting forever, no settlement. One side needs to die. It is like the Jews and Palestinians. Fighting forever. day, after day, after day. killing with no solution. The impasse assures more killing in the future. Ethereum settled the fight with a fork where one side dies off. This is the way to make the network strong. We need a bitcoin hard fork. Bitcoin BU and Bitcoin SegWit. after some time, one side will be better than the other. The network will be stronger and the impasse and killing will be gone. The difference is, ETC didn't die, it is still a top coin in poloniex. The result was split wealth. Imagine where ETH would be if ETC event didn't happen. I guess sometimes hard forks are inevitable tho, we will see what happens. But over a long enough timeline, infinite forks can potentially happen, perpetually making the value lower. BU has gone about in an incredibly stupid way that shows how goddamn brainless they are. all they had to do was take the core code, tweak one line of block limit and run with that. they would prove that larger blocks weren't the end of the world. maybe everyone would agree and then we'd finally progress. instead they've introduced a bunch of untested messy shit that most people hate. people who previously might have approved of a clean increase won't get behind this. they're throwing away an opportunity that might have drained this swamp once and for all. instead they're gonna make it all way worse. Im pretty sure Jihan Wu is state sponsored to cause this shitstorm. Otherwise how can someone with so much vested in bitcoin be this stupid? Roger Ver? no doubt he is an idiot, but Jihan Wu as well? Maybe that is the case, who knows. What is clear is, Jihan Wu benefits from BU since it would make him even stronger under the BU model which is insane. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: AliceWonderMiscreations on March 13, 2017, 06:15:33 PM Im pretty sure Jihan Wu is state sponsored to cause this shitstorm. He might be, I don't think so but I have no evidence either way. Claiming that he is or isn't doesn't bear any fruit without actual evidence. However it doesn't really matter, bigger blocks are something we knew we needed a long time ago. BU isn't when this debate started. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: manselr on March 13, 2017, 06:34:14 PM Im pretty sure Jihan Wu is state sponsored to cause this shitstorm. He might be, I don't think so but I have no evidence either way. Claiming that he is or isn't doesn't bear any fruit without actual evidence. However it doesn't really matter, bigger blocks are something we knew we needed a long time ago. BU isn't when this debate started. It's obvious BU is being promoted by big pockets which have only one intention: Attack bitcoin by divide and conquer and cause havoc, which is its only weakness as we can see, and it is easy to make it look cool for the average joe if you promise big onchain transaction volume, cheaper fees and faster transactions without side effects. I think Roger Ver legitimately wants the best for bitcoin and is falling into the trap, he is what we could call "the useful idiot" used to promote the trojan horse. Since he is immature and butthurt at theymos and Core devs, he thinks he is destroying them in the process too, when the only guaranteed outcome is Roger will end up with worthless tokens. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: franky1 on March 13, 2017, 06:34:46 PM blame blame accuse accuse 1. jihan only manages 15% and of that 15% not all of it is actually his. 2. your forgetting the ~50% undecided either way .. so trying to blame a few small numbers as the reason why segwit is only achieving 26% is a laugh.(segwit is at 26% not 85%) 3. core CHOSE to avoid node support first then pool support second by going soft. dont blame who core allowed to vote. blame core for making them the only voters. .. because smart pools wont activate /flag unless they know that the nodes can cope/accept the changes. so even without official vote, pools will wait for node acceptability(to avoid orphans and ensure that people accept their version of blocks to atleast spend the rewards) .. thus core have literally shot themselves in the foot thinking they can get 100% dominance without REAL full network consent by going soft. 4. if core done a node first pool second. whereby a OVER say 75%-95% nodecount triggers a pool vote. the pools would have been more confident. but 5. even if you think its just about votes. you need to remember WHY they vote. segwit is not perfect, core devs are not gods, they are human and can come and go.. ..what CODE is best for the long term survival of bitcoin for generations to come mean more then some temporary gesture that is meaningless in a few years. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: AngryDwarf on March 13, 2017, 06:53:43 PM Current signalling rate over last 1000 blocks:
BU: 30.6% Segwit: 27,4% 8MB: 6.5% So currently only 35.5% not signalling a preference. Note: Antpool is not yet signalling on all blocks. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: topminingcontracts on March 13, 2017, 07:01:32 PM We need a bitcoin hard fork. Bitcoin BU and Bitcoin SegWit. after some time, one side will be better than the other. The network will be stronger and the impasse and killing will be gone. fork is always happened when two miners find a valid hash within a short space of time. A one block fork usually takes a week, whilst 2 block fork happens rarely. Ethereum has get around the issue by having the ghost protocol which rewards uncle blocks only. blocks that are valid solutions but not included in the blockchain itself. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: manselr on March 13, 2017, 07:25:03 PM ..what CODE is best for the long term survival of bitcoin for generations to come mean more then some temporary gesture that is meaningless in a few years. So you are saying you trust a bunch of idiots that survive off copy-pasting 99% of Core's hard work, then everytime they introduce something they somehow always manage to fuck up: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/5z47f3/it_looks_like_chinabu_developers_forgot_to_add/ Good luck, can't wait to dump BUC in poloniex to get double BTC for free. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Pettuh4 on March 13, 2017, 07:34:19 PM Not every fork, clean and safe forks are paramount and that's what we need for Bitcoin and not just any fork that will render it vulnerable to attacks.
Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: ImHash on March 13, 2017, 08:35:05 PM Create 2 different addresses and put them up one for SW and one for BU, if Satoshi sends 0.01 to any of the addresses using bitcoins mined in first 10K blocks for everyone to see and then decide which side they want to be or if not then it means either he is dead or doesn't give a da*n about bitcoin and it's future along with the community.
So I'd like to propose a hard fork where Satoshi's coins are no longer valid and excluded from blockchain, which one is it? you either care enough to step in for the continues success of bitcoin or you are dead, in any scenario no use for almost a million coin sitting idle eating dust. Who's gonna be the Robbin Hood of crypto and does what I suggested? Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: franky1 on March 13, 2017, 09:05:00 PM ..what CODE is best for the long term survival of bitcoin for generations to come mean more then some temporary gesture that is meaningless in a few years. So you are saying you trust a bunch of idiots that survive off copy-pasting 99% of Core's hard work, then everytime they introduce something they somehow always manage to fuck up: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/5z47f3/it_looks_like_chinabu_developers_forgot_to_add/ Good luck, can't wait to dump BUC in poloniex to get double BTC for free. are you saying that core are independent.. and that those non BU (but do "99% copying-pasting" and surviving off each other) is not the same. (EG matt corallo has his own repo, luke JR has his own repo. as do many others... are they all bad gys for having their own repo.. including the pools are you saying that having a repo of your own is the problem because all you care about is core because of its management are you saying you trust core because its not independent because they only want to work with blockstream devs. are you saying that no one should take the core code and make tweaks. and instead have to beg blockstream for something are you saying that if a core release has not been completely rewritten and only adjusted slightly. that suddenly its an altcoin(eventhough it runs on bitcoins mainnet as other implementations do) are you saying that independent devs cannot do anything unless gmaxwell is involved and where it has to have gmaxwells wishes complied with. personally i think pruning is stupid. once pruned you cant be part of the full node syncing mechanism. you might aswell just run a litenode. allowing a node to be no witness and pruned should be treated as third tier nodes and not categorised as a full node. i can think of many things core have not done. or even things core have done that have caused big issues (sipa's 2013 leveldb mega orphan event) devs are not perfect. and only code matters. people should decide what node to use on the abilities and features the code allows or doesnt allow. in my eyes segwit is an empty gesture of half promises that opens up new attack vectors Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Hydrogen on March 13, 2017, 10:23:08 PM I ask myself: would there be a fork if money wasn't involved?
The answer to that, seems to be: no. Forks done for profiteering or political purposes could be illegitimate. I wonder sometimes if many of the bitcoin forks are motivated by greed. The same with all these people coming out claiming to be Satoshi. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: freedomno1 on March 14, 2017, 02:58:32 AM Look at the Ethereum fork. Perfect. Two sides have a difference of opinion. Neither will budge. It is a full impasse. Fork. Everyone says the world is over. Chaos everywhere. Time passes. More time passes. One side wins and the chain is fine and perfect and strong again. The other side proved it was the side destine to die. That idea is gone forever. Everyone wins. The network is improved and the impasse is settled. Forks are the way to settle a difference of opinion. Avoiding forks guarantees infinite and endless fighting. In Bitcoin where everyone is crying about a hard fork - they question never gets settled. More than two years now, no settlement. It is just like the Shia and Sunni. Fighting forever, no settlement. One side needs to die. It is like the Jews and Palestinians. Fighting forever. day, after day, after day. killing with no solution. The impasse assures more killing in the future. Ethereum settled the fight with a fork where one side dies off. This is the way to make the network strong. We need a bitcoin hard fork. Bitcoin BU and Bitcoin SegWit. after some time, one side will be better than the other. The network will be stronger and the impasse and killing will be gone. The real question is if/when the Hard-Fork happens What Fork of Bitcoin do we base all the alt-coin prices upon until the network breaks the impasse. The only way that would be resolved is if some smart politician or hero of the network came in and decided to basically rule the world and dictate the future of Bitcoin in a way that cannot be refused. Unfortunately we have consensus instead ;) Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: U2 on March 14, 2017, 03:04:14 AM Another outcome is if there is an even 50/50 split and both forms continue on with their own followers. Not everyone needs to have a vanilla bitcoin. Maybe it's time for some mint chip swirl.
Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Capradina on March 14, 2017, 03:29:55 AM Not every fork, clean and safe forks are paramount and that's what we need for Bitcoin and not just any fork that will render it vulnerable to attacks. Yup, we do not need anything very much. But the main thing we need is how can we survive wallet from hacker attacks, because if we just focus on the use of the software then we get only an imperfect information. So, to be able to do something good then we should get to know more about these things in order to get the maximum results and profitable Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Quantus on March 14, 2017, 04:00:14 AM Is everyone in agreement that BU well be an alt-coin if they go forward with this hard-fork? And after the BU losers fork off will Sigwit have enough support to be enabled? Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Wind_FURY on March 14, 2017, 04:15:08 AM Look at the Ethereum fork. Perfect. Two sides have a difference of opinion. Neither will budge. It is a full impasse. Fork. You could sure argue for it. My opinion on it is, why not? Is it not what they are trying to do anyway? Quote Everyone says the world is over. Chaos everywhere. Time passes. More time passes. One side wins and the chain is fine and perfect and strong again. The other side proved it was the side destine to die. That idea is gone forever. Everyone wins. The network is improved and the impasse is settled. Sometimes no. The emergence Ethereum classic is the perfect example. I am sure there will still be enough Core supporters to make it run in parallel with any fork. Quote Forks are the way to settle a difference of opinion. Avoiding forks guarantees infinite and endless fighting. In Bitcoin where everyone is crying about a hard fork - they question never gets settled. More than two years now, no settlement. It is just like the Shia and Sunni. Fighting forever, no settlement. One side needs to die. It is like the Jews and Palestinians. Fighting forever. day, after day, after day. killing with no solution. The impasse assures more killing in the future. Ethereum settled the fight with a fork where one side dies off. This is the way to make the network strong. We need a bitcoin hard fork. Bitcoin BU and Bitcoin SegWit. after some time, one side will be better than the other. The network will be stronger and the impasse and killing will be gone. Or it could split into 2. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: European Central Bank on March 14, 2017, 07:59:46 PM What messy sh*t did they introduce that people hate? https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/5zdkv3/bitcoin_unlimited_remote_exploit_crash/ how about this for starters? a bug that's been in the code for over a year. compare the node count compared to a few hours ago. you want to entrust the entire bitcoin system to a team that allows this to happen? Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Soros Shorts on March 14, 2017, 10:35:23 PM What messy sh*t did they introduce that people hate? https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/5zdkv3/bitcoin_unlimited_remote_exploit_crash/ how about this for starters? a bug that's been in the code for over a year. compare the node count compared to a few hours ago. you want to entrust the entire bitcoin system to a team that allows this to happen? Why am I not surprised? I've seen this many times over mainly due to MBA programmers touching non-trivial code. The code seems to work? Ship it! Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Wind_FURY on March 15, 2017, 02:33:02 AM What messy sh*t did they introduce that people hate? https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/5zdkv3/bitcoin_unlimited_remote_exploit_crash/ how about this for starters? a bug that's been in the code for over a year. compare the node count compared to a few hours ago. you want to entrust the entire bitcoin system to a team that allows this to happen? Yeah doing the hard fork to Bitcoin Unlimited is very risky. But they are welcome to split the chain if they want. I know one person who is probably very excited with the fork just as he was excited with the creation of the DAO in Ethereum. Some of you know who he is. I will also not be amazed if he came up with the BU exploit. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: European Central Bank on March 15, 2017, 02:37:47 AM Yeah doing the hard fork to Bitcoin Unlimited is very risky. But they are welcome to split the chain if they want. I know one person who is probably very excited with the fork just as he was excited with the creation of the DAO in Ethereum. Some of you know who he is. I will also not be amazed if he came up with the BU exploit. what they should've done is push for one straightforward increase of the block size. no extra crap, just that. the extra complexity on top of possible contention was a crazy move. it's an honest upgrade. if people wanted it then it would happen. the small blockers would see that the world hadn't ended, core would maybe cut down on the hubris and some extra time would be bought after everyone had learnt something. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: ASHLIUSZ on March 15, 2017, 02:44:50 AM Look at the Ethereum fork. Perfect. Two sides have a difference of opinion. Neither will budge. It is a full impasse. Fork. Everyone says the world is over. Chaos everywhere. Time passes. More time passes. One side wins and the chain is fine and perfect and strong again. The other side proved it was the side destine to die. That idea is gone forever. Everyone wins. The network is improved and the impasse is settled. Forks are the way to settle a difference of opinion. Avoiding forks guarantees infinite and endless fighting. In Bitcoin where everyone is crying about a hard fork - they question never gets settled. More than two years now, no settlement. It is just like the Shia and Sunni. Fighting forever, no settlement. One side needs to die. It is like the Jews and Palestinians. Fighting forever. day, after day, after day. killing with no solution. The impasse assures more killing in the future. Ethereum settled the fight with a fork where one side dies off. This is the way to make the network strong. We need a bitcoin hard fork. Bitcoin BU and Bitcoin SegWit. after some time, one side will be better than the other. The network will be stronger and the impasse and killing will be gone. what you said would be true if etheruem classic is dead, but this isn't true, ethereum classic is there running, they effectively created two coins now each one with its marketcap, and ETC is stealing an amount of money from the marketcap of eth, this might happen to bitcoin, although it would be more devastating, i don't like it Yeah, but the real Ethereum is over $2.5 Billion. Before the fork - it was only $1 Billion. So, a very short time after a contentious fork - BIG VALUE!!! Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: uneng on March 15, 2017, 03:13:56 AM A fork isn't good. Bitcoin has the power and is the main currency today because it's a integrated currency, many persons trust it and support it. If there is a fork the community support will split also and we will have two weak currencies, bitcoin won't exist anymore.
It's easy for newbies to start investing in crypto currency, because everybody knows bitcoin always worth, with a fork the newbies will get lost and it will make them put away from this. Title: Re: Forks are highly important Post by: Wind_FURY on March 16, 2017, 01:36:48 PM A fork isn't good. Bitcoin has the power and is the main currency today because it's a integrated currency, many persons trust it and support it. If there is a fork the community support will split also and we will have two weak currencies, bitcoin won't exist anymore. It's easy for newbies to start investing in crypto currency, because everybody knows bitcoin always worth, with a fork the newbies will get lost and it will make them put away from this. In some ways it is. I used to think that the hard fork should be avoided totally. But now, with the big blockers pushing for it in a meaningful way, I would say go ahead. I will follow Roger Ver and play it safe by converting some Bitcoins into Dash or something "safer" than BTC. If BU starts getting 50% of the miners' support, that is when I start converting. |