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http://cryptomining-blog.com/8822-ethereum-hashrate-drop-for-radeon-rx400rx500-gpus-is-incoming/

I didn't believe the news so I tested it myself.

The news is true.
Just tried it now on my 580 aorus, which to clarify is an 8 GB model.
My settings are:
-ubermix timings
-2195 mhz memories
-1165 mhz core
Epoch 130: 30.2 MH/s Epoch 140: 27.6 MH/s Epoch 150: 23.5 MH/s
I'd be really curious if somebody could run the test on a different cards.

R9 290 390 is good, however they do use 2 or 3 times of power compared to the RX 4 and 5 series, while dual mining.
I have several R9 390, just thinking sell them while the price is high, as they use too much fuel

can you run the benchmark for 290s?

Don't really think most of us will mind this small increase when the difficulty is doubling every 30 days and in 45 days the block times are going be double. So losing 1MH/s won't really be that much when the difficulty quadruples anyways.

So now you believe me :) 29-22 drop is not really a 1mh but anyway, where can i read about blocktime increase?

Thank God I went Nvidia, fully justified. Nvidia always comes out on top one way or the other.

As soon as RX cards go the 7950/7970 way (13 mhs or lower) you'll see all Nvidia stock dry up for 1050ti, 1060 and 1070.

It`s the Rx 470,480,570,580 4GB GPU`S that will be affected not the 8GB versions.

Hi Folks,

Etherium has activated the difficulty bomb
on the way to POS (will affect all cards/miners).

Maybe you can read about it here (german):

https://bitcoinblog.de/2017/05/30/ethereum-der-winter-naht/ (https://bitcoinblog.de/2017/05/30/ethereum-der-winter-naht/)

This, btw. is also the reason, why ETH will never take the place of BTC ^^

 ;D

Wrong, 8GB versions are affect all the same. Better start selling your AMD cards for max profit and switch over to Nvidia, which doesn't have any issue.

Check the top comment : https://www.reddit.com/r/EtherMining/comments/6i1ulz/incoming_hashrate_drop_for_rx_400_and_500_cards/

What's with tongas?

Damn, 8GB Models aswell? This is big..

Run the benchmark, but mostly affected are Polaris cards.

Im selling my 480's and 580's for 1070s! $400 each easy on eBay, and an excellent upgrade.

... it seems you all don´t get it:

You can´t escape the difficulty bomb !

Do your own research or cry later !

 8)

This has nothing to do with the diff bomb. This has to do with the hardware architecture of the cards. The reason it started now is because DAG size is over 2GB. In a simplified manner, you could see it as part of DAG now physically ending up on a different IC. This causes the memory controller to switch the IC it reads from more often. The larger the DAG, the bigger the part of the DAG that ends up on a different IC, the more switching it has to do.     

Hats off to AMD for making trash cards once again.

Those cards are meant to be used for gaming, not mining.

GPU mining will be dead as disco in a few months.  There's no doubt about it.  It soared in the last few months because of the rapid rise in prices.  Now prices have stopped rising, the decline has started.  You can see it in whattomine.com if you've been checking it daily.  Of course it will still be marginally profitable at the end of this year if you have cheap electric but for most people, it will cost more to run your rig than it will return in profit.

The only way I can be wrong about this is if we get another rapid run up in prices which seems like a very remote possibility.  I think the majors will increase over time but at nothing like the rate needed to compensate for the increasing difficulty.

Now is a perfect time to sell your cards if you are in this as an investment.  The drop in hashrate for Polaris cards really won't make much difference.  None of the cards mining any of the coins are going to be making more than a couple of bucks a day by the end of this year and how much of that, if any will be profit will depend on your electric costs.

This aint no nostradamus prediction, it's really really plain and obvious to anyone who understands anything about how mining difficulty works.

This forum will be a lot quieter in 2018.

Yeah yeah, we've read stuff like this hundreds of times.

Right, so you know already the mining boom is about to end.  But what about all those newbies who are thinking of sinking 10s of thousands into it now as an investment?  I'm just trying to save them a lot of grief.  There has never been a worst time to start out building rigs!

Really funny how people worry about their GPUs slowing down 0.2% every 5 days but they don't mind the doubling difficulty or the upcoming difficulty ice-age. Or the huge 30% swings in prices every few days.

I cant really belive this will happen year end, eth is gona keep rising , mining wont die till eth goes pos 3rd or 4th q next year.  yeah profitabilty ia slowing but even at 50% profitabilty if u suplement mining with trading you can still make decent profit

You are reminding me of an email I came across telling a friend how people were kicking themselves for selling Ethereum at $1 right after it hit $10.

Thing is, we are already seeing evidence of declining profitability and this is only a week after eth stopped rising.  I agree most likely in the long term, eth will increase but I really can't see it climbing at anything like the rate is has so far this year.  If eth continues to be rangebound for the next few months, which is entirely possible, profitability will decline to stuff-all well before the end of the year.  Consider a week of flatlined price has already caused profits to drop nearly 15%  But of course difficulty has increased and will continue to do so.

I think well before POS comes about, it won't matter anymore.

Have you tried to benchmark with older DAG Epoch? (60 or 80 for example)
What results are you getting?
(Just to be sure that the benchmark is working correctly)
If you are getting hashrates above the normal (let's say 60Mhs for epoch 60) then this is not normal. Cards never got that high hashrate.

Because from what I have read, the DAG size 4GB limit will be reached on September 2019, but POS will come earlier.

Some answer from an other forum regarding DAG size:

This is the REAL threat to mining.

Everyone, I mean literally everyone mines ether with Rx 4xx/5xx cards so the reduction means nothing.

Of course if you could find the buyers and not get scammed, then trade in AMD for gtx 1070.

Wrong, both are affected but more so the 4gb polaris cards

For example if you mine others coin like Music or Expanse Or Ubiq,

This ill happen too?

Music is in epoch 20 for example

it will but not now

You're precious 8GB isn't saving you now. 100% wasted money.

Why are you all so obsessed with Ethereum, there is Zcash too which is soaring and I have switched my mining boards from Ethereum to Zcash and I am very happy with such move. Each board have 5 RX 480 Gpu-s from Sapphire with a bit of overclock I am reaching 335 Sols for a card and I making a good amount of money. I don't think this will stop for at least a good few months.

DOOM DOOOOOOOM DOOOOOOOOOOOOM

Thats all anyone wants to talk about. ONE COIN might not be profitable anymore and all of a sudden the entire ecosystem is dead? Give me a break.

Kinda happy I didn't wait for RX cards and bought 1060 instead. Sure this Hynix memory is a terrible performer and they hash a lot lower than other 1060 without Hynix, but I benchmarked DAG and my cards passed up to 180, at which point 3gb was not enough. So they will become obsolete for ETH mining somewhere early 2018. I'm fine by that.

I hope this drop comes soon, so like 85% of miners will sell their cards/change coin/mine at a lower speed which means it will be easier to mine. Yes I'm evil XD

Its the giant in the room, if every with RX cards switches to Zcash what do you think will happen? It will be far less profitable than it is now....

Point is, Nvidia cards are now king for crypto. Claymore himself just said he could do nothing software wise to stop the eventual decline of the RX cards.

If you want 1070's you buy them TODAY. Ive already sold what little I had a 480/470/580/570 and got a nearly free upgrade to 1070's.

It feels pretty damn good to be justified in buying 10's of 1060s. recently too. Soon we will see 1050tis dry up as well. Some of those are capable of 15 mhs with samsung memory at +1000.

Ive always been for team green, AMD is trash and always will be. I should have never bought those RX cards.

There are alternatives but the simple fact is we need ether and it's millions of dollars of minable currency.

In the future when it is harder to have profit out of ETH then those gpus will flood to other coins.

RX cards will basically be worthless on ETH maybe 6 months out.

It is hard to predict, maybe this will be a bit of a switch to GTX for ether and AMD will sink Zcash profit as users switch over hardware.

DOOM is factually correct if eth ceases to be profitable.  Considering 90% of people are mining eth, what do you expect to happen to the other coins if that 90% changes over to start mining them?  10 x more miners = 10 times difficulty = 1/10 revenue.

Ethereum will go PoS eventually, losing a few percent is not a big deal. Those Polaris chips will continue to be great for any other crypto.

Its not a few percent.... after some months people will feel the pain. The main point is, RX cards are not sustainable(over the next 6 months) for mining now. Its a fact at this point, confirmed by claymore.

Calm down my people claymore just analysed the situation(today quick peek), he ill figure something out

you can also mine Musicoin and set auto exchange to eth in bittrex for example,

You can mine expanse, you can mine ubiq,

stop talking no sense shit like polaris is dead

my 480s ill aways be better them the shit 1060 in dual mining, even on dag 4248328946324632

No, he said it CAN NOT BE FIXED.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1433925.msg19652577#msg19652577

Your 480's will NOT be better than 1060's a few months down the road. You'll be left holding the bag if you hang on to those 480's. Actually I prefer you hold on to them. Dont sell them, you're right. You'll have no issues at all.  ;D

"I see the speed drop. I checked possible workarounds, at least for Polaris, they failed. So probably this hashrate drop cannot be fixed, at least on miner software level."

When he says THEY, he reffer to minergate, and he says probably, so how you are so certain about that?

I dont know what you are smoking but he is 100% saying he personally checked for workarounds: "I checked possible workarounds"

Then goes on to say "So probably this hashrate drop cannot be fixed, at least on miner software level"

Its all there in plain text. Deal with it, Rx cards will be shit for mining over the next 6 months.

Check eBay people are offloading RX cards in droves, "barely used" "tested for 2 weeks" BS but we all know they were mining cards.

at epoch 170, gtx 1060 will outperform any polaris card.

Some people are in denial, they don't want to accept the simple facts.

The amount of AMD bashing in this thread is just ridiculous.

Isn't the 2% drop in hashrate (globally due to more than 80% of miners use rx4xx or rx5xx cards) going to get difficulty to drop also?

p106-100 incoming, so no.

Even if P106-100 will become available, how many will buy them (with 3 months warranty and no resale value).
Let's say that the difficulty will raise for 10% (with the P106-100) then due to rx series drop in hashrate it will drop 2%, so total raise in difficulty 8% instead of 10%
If you consider the upcoming panic sale of rx series (check ebay) until they get their new cards (which you can get 2 nvidia 1070 cards for every 4 amd cards you sell due to price difference) and nvidia cards hashrate is a little lower than rx cards, I think difficulty will drop more.
Also people are switching to the Zcash train...

Just a thought...

Those cards are only for mining farms, not being sold to the public except maybe some shops in China.

The drop was 0.1 MH/s. So isn't that like 0.35%. Who calculated 2%.

Looks like difficulty went up 4% in the last 24 hours; the 0.35% doesn't really bug me.

They listed it in CZ with 24 months warranty for about $300.

yupp all the noobs thinking these will see newegg will be sorely mistaken, i bet the first batches are damn near already sold out, us plebs wont see them for a while :D
idk im happy im a Nvidia miner mainly, ill keep 1080ti's, buy top of the line, and get easy 75% resale after i ROI x3-5x , the 1080ti is and will be profitable for prob 2 years

Poor, poor ETH babies...

MEH!

Back to the mine, holy crap i feel bad for yun99 :/ that dudes got ALOT invested in AMD mining

He probably mined and held a ton of eth while it was $10 and could probably replace all his 470s with 1080tis

 Not dead but gonna be bad.

 I did a calculation a few days back - and came up with a ballpark estimate of something like 10 MILLION AMD cards having been added to the ETH mining rolls over the last 3 months alone, and a total of ballpark 17 Million total - this was a conservative estimate as I assumed 30 Mh/card (which is marginal-high for a RX 480/580 with bios mods and high overclock, close to a hair high for the R9 290/290x/390/390x with bios mods and high overclocks, right ballpark for the GTX 1070 with high memory overclock, and quite a bit high for the RX 470/570 even with BIOS mods and high overclock - almost all other cards that CAN mine ETH have significanly lower hashrates, or almost no presence like the GTX 1080ti).

 Did the same calculation on ZEC - and came up with more like *1* million cards total.
 Nothing else came even close.


 ETH mining dies, everything else is going to get SWAMPED by ex-ETH miners looking for new homes for their rigs - and profitability will crash bigtime 'till folks just start shutting down rigs in quantity, and even THEN it's going to be the folks in Very Low Cost Electric areas being the ONLY ones making a profit.

 Continued price rise on non-ETH coins will mitigate this somewhat - but it's gonna take a LOT of climb to avoid the crash destroying profitability entirely for most small miners and even SOME mid-to-large farms.


 THAT is when I predict the next "mining crash" will happen - but it's still months off at the soonest, shouldn't happen overnight given the plans for ETH to phase in POS gradually, and SOME of us have made provisions to survive when it does happen.


 I strongly suspect that a lot of the folks "unloading RX cards on eBay" are more about taking advantage of the current GOUGE pricing as opposed to dumping still-profitable mining cards 'cause they're worried about a crash that's several months away at the soonest.
 I've been strongly tempted to put my pair of RX 470s up on cragslist and see if they'll sell at some crazy-high price.


 BTW - anyone else noticed that GTX 1070 pricing is climbing a LOT and AVAILABILITY IS CRASHING HARD?
 I wonder how much of that is ETH miners going for the "at current AMD crazy pricing GTX 1070 is NOW THE HASH/$ CHAMP for ETH mining" cards, and how much is NVidia using available foundry capacity to stock up on whatever the new stuff is they mentioned at their last Earnings Call (a couple-three weeks back or so).

 Keep in mind that a foundry has a lead time measured in WEEKS even for customers the size of AMD and Nvidia, between "put the order in" and "deliver chips".



 Nice thing from my point of view - my R9 290s are all paid off long since on ETH mining, my R9 280Xs are working on other stuff (that's not as profitable but pretty close, and more satisfying), and my lower-end AMD stuff is mostly also working on other stuff with higher satisfaction value but lower profitability (those cards though have never been big profit makers).

 Moo!

10 millions is way too much, the correct figure is something in the 2 millions range.

I've done several posts last year on the increase in average block times - most were out by 40 days. It has become one of the most difficult aspects to write about or post on.

Nearly, all of the old published estimates are wrong, because it has changed with upgrade forks. Consequently, people are no longer taking it into consideration and are simply adding GPU rigs for mining Ethereum.

In the last month, about 4,000 less Ethereum are available in mining rewards per day. But, no new and accurate estimates have been published on the internet (this year), that could be used to know what will happen in next 5 months.  

i'm still sitting here with 7970's and 290(x)'s :P

23-24Mh on those.. Just so you know..


Edit: So much panic  :D

Edit2: I see no hashrate drop on my rigs whatsoever :) (6 x 480 8G cards). Still going strong  8)

Hey man right now you may be safer then alot of people haha, your prob ROI on those cards and can always just (keep?) mining equihash or XMR ;p
very unknown times for the bigger AMD miners tho

The same here, I have gtx1070s and 1080ti's )))

What's the purpose on mining Ether with 1080ti ? You would gain a lot more $ with Zcash

What I find both interesting and disturbing is the number of newbies who are so blinded by optimism they refuse to listen to any warnings.  The chances of turning a profit mining by December this year is very close to zero.  This is not some crazy prediction but is guaranteed to happen unless eth rises a lot between now and then.  A lot like 4 or 5 hundred percent.  If rises much less than that or just stays the same, it will most definitely, without any doubt be unprofitable in a few months unless you have really cheap electric in which case you will be making cents per card.

The unassailable logic:

Every single day, more miners come online causing difficulty to rise.  The only way that profit does not fall is if eth price rises in sync with the difficulty.  It's possible but extremely unlikely considering how much and how fast it has risen this year already.  The past week or so certainly shows little sign of an increase and we are already seeing mining profitability fall.

Buying the coins or building a rig, both depend on rising eth value to turn a profit.  Buying the coins seems a lot less risky in a business sense and probably more profitable in the long run.  But certainly not as sexy as a magic box that makes money.

Some of the really dumb things you hear often are along the lines of "If eth isn't profitable any more then I will mine other coins that are".  Why is it so hard to understand that when all the hashing power currently mining eth, moves to the other coins, their difficulty will skyrocket and their profitability will crash?  How can people be so totally blinded to these simple to understand concepts only because they don't like the conclusion?

This is not speculation, it is cold hard brutal reality.  Unless eth starts to skyrocket in price again, mining profitability will plummet, not just for eth but for all the coins.

Believe me, nothing would make me happier to hear a counter argument that ran contrary to the above and actually made sense.  But no, the optimists ignore all the evidence and rather than deal with the facts, prefer to simply ignore them as the rantings of chicken littles.

Obviously if you have dirt cheap electric you will do ok, but for most people who are stuck paying over 10 cents a kwh, GPU mining's end-of-days is almost upon us.

Eth difficuly just jumped to 850.
It was 350 in May.

It is too bad sites like "what to mine" don't add in a graph showing profit declining with difficulty so the window lickers understand that each day's income declines.

They do the math on the "right now" number shown and go "hey my ROI is only XX days!".
Wrong.

Supply and demand will probably drive the price higher.
When the difficulty quadruples I'll still be profitable with my setup.

Mining and selling for daily profits is never a good idea.

The real money made is mining a cheap coin and hoping for growth.

"When others are fearful, be greedy.  When others are greedy be fearful" - warren buffet

But I do agree the current "daily roi" is going to decrease 50% by December.


Advice to noobs - find a coin with a finite supply ( maybe hushcoin ) and point your miners at
That when they are unprofitable "daily" and hold for 3 years.

Thank me later.

Exactly.
Mining is more than 4 times more profitable than last year or beginning of this year.
And when the difficulty quadruples, if the ETH stays at this price, we will still be making more money than before :D

And, well, its gonna take a while to quadruple.

No need to panic, enjoy mining  8)

And if the time comes when its unprofitable, just shut down the rigs and wait for a few months or a year till the pump show starts again :)

Same like the miners with 79x0 and R9 series did  :-*

EVERYONE STOP BUILDING MORE MINING RIGS!

I need the profitability to hold out till August 29th so all of my gear is ROI  ;D ;D ;D

Currently I'm not mining neither ETH nor ZEC with 1080ti. There are more profitable cases. But sometimes dualmining ETH+SIA or ETH+DCR can be rather good for gtx1080ti ))

Maybe I overread it, but why is it only affecting AMD and not nvidia? Shouldn't ETH difficulty affect all GPUs?

It does effect, but some more than the others.

I just sold all 7 (all 4 Gb models) of my 470/480/570/580 for right over $400 each on average. Managed to nab 7 GTX 1070 fo $399.99 each (or less) in the past few days.

Feels damn good. Free upgrades all around.

yes indeed, 7970s mine mostly equihash, 7870s cryptonight, and the 290(x) eth, though the last might change soon due to the difficulty rise, we will see
cards have roi'd a long time ago :P

Isn't equihash more profitable for your 7870? You should get close to 200h/s with them.

the two i own don't, they give only about 160-170

but yes, recently they mined equihash a lot as well

 My 290s are mixed right now - got one rig of them still pointed to ETH mining, but the other 2 have moved over to GRC via BOINC and the MooWrapper project (that rig is very close to hitting #1 on the "top host" list).
 My R9 280x moved to GRC / BOINC / Milkyway though they spent a short time on MooWrapper before that.
 My HD 7870s and HD 7850 also moved to GRC / BOINC / MooWrapper.

 These were not moves due to greater profitability, they were moves due to "I can AFFORD to do this now".

 8-)

 I might move my RX 470s over to MooWrapper as well at some point, they have almost the same performance on that particular project as the R9 290s do.

Great prices, we don't have 1070 for these good prices here :(

sold my 3 1070s for 350€ (~390$) each, here the competition is hard, you get them new for 395€ :D

1070 all sold :D 1060 only with highest prices or 1 fan and ITX versions :D But lot of 1050 ti in stock :D

What exactly is MooWrapper? Milkway?

Some type of Folding experiments?

Lol...

You do not seem to realize that ETH is just one coin you can mine. Granted nvidia do better on coins like zec, but AMD is still the way to go for mining with the fastest ROI on most of the popular coins (granted, they need to be in stock for 200$ or less). This is what matters, ROI. Just mho, not saying I'm right, but this is how I see it.

Your nvidia cards won't matter with the artificial ETH difficulty increase anyway. POS will come soon and your nvidias won't be more usefull than AMD cards for mining the coin anyway.

well it's not like ETH si the only coin that you can mine out there, plenty of choice are awaiting you, just mine somethign else, oh wait amd can not, because they are stuck with ETH, will be funny to see the huge hashrate desperately switch to another alt when ETH go pos

Actually, I went back and checked my posts from last year; I said the slowdown in rewards (slowing average block times) would start in April 2017 and it did start in April 2017.

14seconds to 14.3seconds average block time before April 8th.

Afterwards, slowed to around 14.8 seconds.

27th April slowed to around 15.2 seconds.

13th May slowed to around 15.85 seconds.

29 May slowed to over 16 seconds.

21 June slowed to over 17 seconds.

So far - there has been around 21.8% reduction of Ethereum rewards for POW.

In july block times will increase to 30 seconds so it will be pretty bad then.

That could cripple the network considering the congestion currently is getting bad.

Which could mean panic sells and price dump among the fear.

The price of Ethereum is high because mining rewards are being reduced. So, I'm sure the Ethereum price will do just fine - because people have been snapping up Ethereum because they know it will be rarer tomorrow, than today!

Congestion is being artificially created by the structure of Initial Coin Offerings - they do time limited offerings, which encourage people to try to watch the blockchain and then throw in their Eth at the last minute when they think it has been underfunded and they will get more of the new tokens for each Eth.

However, it is better to have all of this ICOs business in the long-run - a little short-term inconvenience always comes along with a rapidly growing ecosystem.

R9 280 can make mining ???

 BOINC projects.

 Moo Wrapper enables BOINC participation in the distributed.net RC5-72 project (which I've been active in for almost 20 years now).

 Milkyway is mapping our galaxy, and is very reliant on DP FLOPS (which is where the Tahiti chips shine, somewhat less so Hawaii though they're sorta-close, and nothing current outside of workstation-specific cards and NOT ALL OF THOSE).



 The longer block times for ETH are going to hammer profitability some, unless ETH resumes it's price rise enough to compensate - THAT might be where the ETH mining crash ends up comming from, I'd forgotten about that part of Ice Age happening.

 The price of Ethereum has NOTHING to do with miners though - miners REACT to the effect of price on profitability they don't CAUSE the price to change.

Why not?

...and we'll see how AMD deals with it.
Legitreviews tested nvidia gpus vs polaris gpus at higher epochs and saw that nvidia gpus weren't affected almost at all. This suggests that AMD might be able to fix the issue in the driver.

If they do, we should all be happy chaps for a little longer.

No the price of ETH was much higher $400 while mining rewards were higher and now less rewards yet price has slide down nearly $80

Look at this chart and tell me if you think 30 sec or 1 min  block times won't cause problems https://etherchain.org/charts/capacity

Price adjustment started around the beginning of March - one month before the reductions in Ethereum mining rewards. Reductions in Ethereum reward was scheduled to begin at the beginning of April.

And, it has continued to rise as reductions in Ethereum POW mining rewards has been realised.

This, is quite normal, for cryptos with reductions in their POW mining rewards.  

It can do without any problem. The best coin it can mine is the Zcash but the problem with that card is that it consumes a lot of energy so it is not that profitable compared with the RX 4xx and 5xx series, there is a big difference between the two. If you have it in your PC you can start mining if you like to test the waters.

what about gtx 1060? anyone test it and share results?

They work well... with "full size" GTX1060 (dual fan) I'm seeing 4 of them equal to about three 1070s all at stock speeds.

The "mini" single fan ones are a bit behind that rate... the MSI Mini ones are the better of what I've tried, the EVGA Mini runs 10 degrees C hotter... luckily only got two of the EVGA.

I can't say that I've sat down & heavily tuned them... just drop power down in Afterburner and they are quite efficient.

I do believe this is not the right thread to start asking which card works for mining.

Going back to the topic, would it be safe to say that new miners still have until December 2017 to reach ROI before the difficulty bomb freezes everything?

The difficulty bomb will go away in August with the Metropolis release. However there are talks of reduced blocks rewards instead.

Use that card for ZEC.

Polairs (and Tonga) both have 4 channels, with 2 GDDR5 chips per channel, making a total of 8 chips.  Each chip does 32-byte burst xfers, so 2 chips provide a single 64-byte cache line.  The memory layout switches channels every 256 bytes (4 cache lines).
http://developer.amd.com/tools-and-sdks/opencl-zone/amd-accelerated-parallel-processing-app-sdk/opencl-optimization-guide/#50401334_pgfId-472173

AMD docs say the cards use a direct-mapped cache, which means TLB thrashing can't be the problem since there is no TLB.  It sounds a lot like the Pitcairn performance issues as the memory working set grows beyond 1GB (except the issue starts at 2GB with GCN3 devices).  I haven't had much time for coding over the past few months, but hopefully I'll have some time over the summer to figure out what's really going on here.

Could this have anything to do with the memory straps? Maybe with stock straps it doesn't slow down with every new DAG

LOL )) funny but I see such sentences not for a first time.
No, std straps won't help you. )))
Moreover, even Hawaii - now top performer - will go to 17mhs on epoch 333 ))

Drop of hashrate for Polaris cards incoming

when that happens mine other coins and adjust ...  i don't mine ETH much now any way .... I'll buy it from time to time and trade. an  i hate trading  . and would rather mine what i make ...so pretty much i buy eth if I want any , so it won't brother me ..

ETC might pick up more ...

No, not possible.

 R9 280 and 280x are better on ZEC than ETH, and have been that way for a while now.

Why are people even worried about this? The current run up in hashrate (from about 20-55TH) is ALL from polaris cards. Therefore the majority of miners are effected by this, which means that the relative distribution of coins among miners wont change.

To put it in simple terms, if everyones cards went from mining 30MH to 1MH overnight, your profitability would remain EXACTLY the same.

 I would bet that a significant part of the hashrate climb THIS WEEK has been from NVidia 1060 and 1070 cards.

 Prior to that, though, probably mostly Polaris.


 Also, keep in mind a lot of folks are using other stuff, like my own R9 290 cards....


 On the other hand, I would say it's not a big factor as the LARGE majority of ETH GPUs are probably Polaris and it will even out for those.


 I'd be more worried about the Ice Age "block time gets a LOT higher" stuff dropping rewards quite a bit.

Big news from BBT about the Claymore epoch benchmark issue. He reached out to AMD who confirmed they are aware of the issue and are working with Claymore to resolve the issue which DOES NOT affect other miners, such as SGminer. So, it appears it's an issue related to the Claymore miner and NOT the RX platform.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3XOtQtFKSQ&feature=youtu.be&t=978

How much of the market do you think the Nvidia 1060/1070 make up? Probably less than 10%.

Most large farms are all running RX 470/480 since those GPUs came out about a year ago.

The R9 290/390 Hawaii series is probably in low numbers since it was originally a flagship model and probably sold in much smaller quantites than the RX series.

This guy is in over his head.

 AS I SAID, "I would say it's not a big factor as the LARGE majority of ETH GPUs are probably Polaris".

 Upon reflection though, network hashrate has approximately DOUBLED just in the last month - during which time all RX 470/480/570/580 cards have been in VERY short supply.
 Given there was still a lot of stock in the channel of NVidia 1060/1070 cards a month ago, but since those cards are now in just as short of supply as the RX cards coupled with the existing shortage of AMD cards, I believe that the amount of ETH hashrate added by NVidia cards exceeds 30% and likely is an outright majority of the hashrate added in the past month - which would put Nvidia share of TOTAL hashrate at a minimum of 15% and likely over 25%.
 I believe the NVidia share of total hashrate that was in place PRIOR to a month ago is very small, likely 2% or LESS.

 What farms were building with a year ago - or even 6 months ago - isn't a significant part of the CURRENT ETH network hashrate.

Great news. Any validations done already?

Only what BBT said in the comments of his video.


He also said he was going to do a live stream last night once he was able to confirm whether what he was told about it only affecting Claymore's miner was true, but nothing yet showing any confirmation.

Claymore more or less denies

Yes, he asked for someone to send him proof of SGminer woking with a future epoch

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1433925.msg19807290#msg19807290

Wolf0 also says SGminer is affected

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1612329.msg19794732#msg19794732

As I said, BBT is in over his head.  Among other dumb statements in the video, he claimed the issue is because Claymore uses an asm kernel.
There's also nothing special about exchanging emails with AMD devs.  Matt, Tom, Alexander, and others are reasonably responsive.  What would be impressive is if they can tolerate a mediocre Russian programmer with an ego bigger than his mouth.

Well BBT said AMD claimed to their knowledge, only Claymore was affected. He's also not backing down from the comment he posted earlier.

so it sounds like we need more info. if amd is backing that its not an issue on their end, then I might feel bad about cancelling a 90 card order in favor of Nvidia. *sigh*

If it is in the hardware, there is nothing AMD can do.

Time to put cards on the table. Bits be trippin did not come up with a video

People should begin to get serious about selling their RX cards, if they haven't already. I got in while the gettin was good. Sold every RX card for over $400 and promptly bought cheap 1070's under $400.

The very day that it is fully confirmed that this is a hardware issue, essentially, non fixable I guarantee you eBay will get flooded with $300 RX cards while Nvidia will sell out that much more. You probably wont even be able to find 1050 Ti's for cheap.

Relax, he has a lot going on. Last night BBT did an excellent presentation and overview on the state of Crypto and insights of where POW mining is going. Highly worth watching even if you're not new to Crypto. He will do another video today or tomorrow that focuses on mining.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEedQT0oGYw

by the time we hit epoc 150 most rx cards if bough even today would have paid for themselves, gtx 1070s are price jacked up all over the place right now anyways or limits per 1 or two per order no reason to dump cards that are mining fine right now

I've been telling everyone the same thing but apparently no one can compute basic math.

"Yes lets sell our AMD gpus today for $300 which make $5/day so we can buy a $600 GPU which makes $4/day and in 6 months it will make me $0.50/day instead of the $0.33/day we would of made with the AMD gpu we've sold".

What if I sold an RX480 for $350, and bought a 1070 for $310?

Was that stupid too?

If you can actually get it sold for that price then go ahead. But you will still need to add money to get the 1070.

All over Craiglists its the same people over and over posting their RX gpus for $300-400 each, and they repost everyday and not a single one sold. Aside from a few lucky people, most people can't sell their RX gpus for $400.

I never said SALE for $300 only that the price WILL fall that low (or lower) when it is finally confirmed that this is a hardware defect with RX cards. Also what $600 GPU??? 1070's can routinely be had for $399. Just this morning around 2:30 AM EST I saw GTX 1070 on EVGA's website for $399.....

what you SHOULD have done was unload when RX cards were fetching $400 minimum and bought 1070's BEFORE they went $400+.

You can try to justify holding onto them but at the end of the day, some of us did actually get free upgrades to GTX 1070's. It was the smart thing to do no matter how you slice it. It cost me zero $ out of pocket. In fact I managed to get some GTX 1070 for under $300 on eBay thanks to best offer and 10% eBay bucks.

He just fucking said he got the 1070 for $310 or can you not read? Its like you have a severe selective reading disorder. anything you dont agree with, you simply dont acknowledge.

I was only able to get over $400 for brand new cards ($459 each). Getting mid 300s for the used ones I sold.

basic math is too hard man , they will figure it out and I call BS on even a used 1070 for 310 no way no how

New cards are re-stocking. Just purchased rx 570 sapphire nitro + 4GB for 215$. There was plenty of them in Europe last two days.

Where did you find those?
Every site says pre-order.

It's possible I was ahead of the curve and started switching cards before Nvidia skyrocketed.

Also have been boosting hash rate and dropping power by selling rx cards around $300 and buying 1060's for $200.

I agree.

Really no need to sell RX cards atm, people are just paranoid for obvious reasons.
Even if the hash rate drops, most of us got the cards for 200-240$, we will ROI a few times over by the time this bubble ends.
The ones that should worry are people geting in mining now, at high prices of cards and profits falling.

 Tonight bitsbetrippin video about Sgminer and DAG

oh fuk all this shit, im just only buying Nvidia from now on , there's always gonna be SOMETHING to mine, and there's NEVER any of these
 dag/epoch issues haha
i mean i already WAS a nvidia miner, but damn haha, too complicated AMD is, my man hours in headache are worth $ too, ill just buy Nvidia ;p

 Folks that bought RX cards while they were still near MSRP have likely come close to paying for those cards by now.

 It's the folks that paid GOUGE pricing that might be in trouble.

 What's more likely to have a noticeable impact on profitability for ETH is the Ice Age "longer block times", which are a much bigger factor and affect ALL miners equally.

I'm having no problem selling 580s for $400-$450 within 24 hours of posting. Was a no brainer for me especially since I've been getting 1080s cheaper than that

Even if I could sell my RX 480 for the exact same price of a NVIDIA GTX 1070, I rather not deal with the headache of eBay/Craiglist people. And its not worth the hassle to remove GPUs, add GPUs, configure GPUs, etc. I'm not a newbie, been mining for way too long and "assembling" rigs is no longer fun for me, its boring.

In the end I don't really care about making an extra $50 per GPU per year.

Like the previous poster said, the real money is in trading cryptos.

Over the next 12 months I'd be very surprised if the total profit per 1080 is only $50 more than the total profit each of my 580s would have gotten

Well in 12 months instead of making $5/day you might be making $0.50/day so by then its going to be a completely different situation.

I wish you luck and everything with your GTX 1080 and so, but for the old buggers like me, I rather just leave my rigs as they are.

I know exactly what you mean.
It was fun at the start, puting rigs together, trying out hundreds of different settings, trying to get more hash, less consumption, doing nice cable management etc...

After that it just gets boring and something you don't want to do.
It's fun to have a rig or two, but having many is just boring hard work if something goes wrong.

Not to mention i have to work in my underwear because of the tremendous heat and still sweating like crazy.
I swear the god, there were times i nearly passed out...

Same here, with a full time job and a family to take care of, the hassle of removing GPUs, reflashing them back to stock, packaging them, selling them, just to make a few extra $ to buy nvidia cards just doesn't make sense to me. Plus the real smart choice would have been to buy ETH when it crashed to around 230$ and just hold for a few months, not to "upgrade" to 1070s which, by the way, aren't really any better than RX470/570. Granted they might have a better resell value but that's about it, they're not that much faster than the polaris based cards. But hey, if you got them for less than what you sold your 470s for, good for you.

And I don't get this consensus which seems to float around that "Polaris will be useless with the DAG problem so nvidia is the only good choice!". Like...you do realize I can mine other coins than ETH with my cards right? They are not just going to become useless overnight.

Anyway, all my 470s have paid themselves off long ago with what I've mined, traded and invested in.

Happy cryptoning

 The GTX 1070 is slightly better than any RX series on ETH - but it shines a LOT better on other coins like ZEC.
 It will also have better resale value down the road once the current "shortage-driven gouge pricing" collapses.

 IMO if you can sell off an RX 470/480/570/580 for close to the cost of a GTX 1070 you ARE doing yourself a long-term favor by moving up that way while you can.

 On the other hand, finding GTX 1070s at anywhere near MSRP has gotten almost as difficult the last 2 weeks as finding RX 470/480/570/580 for the last 2 months or so has been....



 Keep in mind that while ETH might command a small majority of all GPUs currently in use, it's NOT all of crypto or even close - and a lot of other coins perform MUCH better on NVidia hardware at this time.



 I can understand the "already have the card, just keep it going" concept though, and not saying there is anything WRONG with that.

I do agree man, just feel like the few extra hashes aren't worth the hassle of flooding the local market with some used 470s, too many people are already trying to take advantage of the shortage.

I just received 6 MSI RX570 4G Gaming X I ordered end of may and I got another 7 that are supposed to arrive in about a week. Got the cards for ~200$. From what I can see, some large stocks of AMD cards are starting to arrive, I'd say mid-july will be a nice time to shop for some GPUs again!

Why would you want to extend rigs when the era of mining is just about coming to and end?

Your order in May just arrived. It is a long wait.

One era stop, another kicks in :)

Coming to an end? Can't count the times I've read this.
How do you know it's coming to an end? Because ETH price is going down?
Even if this is the end of mining, I am sure you can't know it.

 
Overcapacity of miners looking for something else to mine after ETH mining becomes first unprofitable and next not possible to mine. With as a result very rapid difficulty rises for other coins that are not matched by insane gains for these coins which will render mining these coins unprofitable in no time if this rise is not accompanied by rapid coin value growth.

The space is satturated, both with hashing power and coins. No trippling of market caps so not sure where you think mining profitability is coming from (in case of no free electricity)

There is no major pow coin on the horizon to replace ETH with a chance to follow the same bubblepath as ETH. Hypes usually kill themselves which also holds for the mining hype.

Yep, not the first time we have overcapacity of miners. Not the first time when profit is going down rapidly. Not the first there isn't any good POW alternative.
And we see this since 2011 almost every year.

Problem of humans is that they think the future will be the same as the past. That is certainly the case when money is at stake

all the cries about Ethereum.. DAG bomb.. F*** Ethereum.. mine something else. If it's not the hashrate drop then it's the POS switch..  :-X if it's not that then it's something else.

It's not about ethereum it's the hashpower that starts to run that will kill mining profitability in no time for all other coins.

True, market is super saturated... Good thing i'm into other coins besides Eth. aww.. my poor GPU rig which will run out soon I guess  ::)

I like all this, eth price going to hell, noobs buying millions of usd in hardware and difficulty is rising, profit is 250% down, ice age coming, reduction coming, and in few weeks profit will be 1000% down so all this means that noobs will finally have a reason to commit suicide.

If it affects most people, then it is not a problem.

@metroid is spamer, ignore him :)

He probably have rig or two, and does not want any new "noobs" in mining world, cuz that mean less $$ for his ass. I bet he is crying every time he see diff increase and eth price change :D

Yeah, everybody mine ETH as much as you can :3

 No thanks, my "more NVidia than not" farm makes quite a bit more mining other stuff on the NVidia cards.

 The R9 290s though like ETH....