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Economy => Economics => Topic started by: dazbog835 on June 21, 2017, 02:47:20 PM



Title: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: dazbog835 on June 21, 2017, 02:47:20 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: taxmanmt5 on June 21, 2017, 06:10:19 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

You need a real understanding of the economy and how it works to be around the trading world and there are very few that have that here and it appears we now have a new one.  Making money in any form makes more money for the economy, it is a base and core element of the economy and taught in high school.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: VC George on June 21, 2017, 06:40:35 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?


In a world of 7.4bn people where you already have some 35 million millionaires I don't see why 100~500 even 1000 new ones would make a huge difference. Add to that the billionaires which even if they have huge chunks of money they can't really change the world (only rule part of it ;) ) and you get the picture. There's just too much value created every day in every possible way to be consumed even by the richest.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: freeyourmind on June 21, 2017, 06:53:28 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

I would just think of it as a wealth transfer to a different type of crowd.  The tech crowd is where the huge revenue potential is coming from nowadays...whereas maybe 20 years ago, it was more going towards professionals with formal education.  Things are changing and I think the impact of having more wealth in the hands of a younger and more tech savvy crowd is a good thing.  These are people that are typically against the current financial / banking / government system.  Those voices have always been around, but now they have wealth.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: GreenBits on June 21, 2017, 07:33:52 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?


In a world of 7.4bn people where you already have some 35 million millionaires I don't see why 100~500 even 1000 new ones would make a huge difference. Add to that the billionaires which even if they have huge chunks of money they can't really change the world (only rule part of it ;) ) and you get the picture. There's just too much value created every day in every possible way to be consumed even by the richest.

I different a bit. While a lot of people will likely squander their money on bullshit, there will be some that use the immense capital gain to start serious businesses. Like Coinbase or Kraken, these are pretty large, decent hiring, tax paying corps that are generating revenue for the Fed and State in a meaningful way. That job creation, tax revenue and promotion of widespread adoption are some seriously positive takeaways. Not the biggest chunk of Mammon in the world, but a nice one, at least.

I'll be honest and say the majority of early adopter bitcoin will be used on Thai hookers and blow. But 1 or 2 people incentivized to use the value the right way, could effect a huge change.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: passionsurf on June 21, 2017, 07:33:57 PM
One thing you're forgetting is that the percentage of investors/traders who are buying bitcoin (or any digital coin) is extremely small compared with those investing in stocks/bonds/forex. I can't give you a number, but there is still a HUGE population of well-educated people who have not even heard of bitcoin yet. Anyone buying bitcoin even at today's price of nearly $3000 is still considered an "early" investor, compared with the potential. Imagine what might happen if even just 10% of the stock traders start investing in bitcoin. Price would go through the roof.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: LuanX3 on June 21, 2017, 07:37:37 PM
It just means they got rich and they have to pay taxes when they convert those cryptocurrencies before they can use them. Generally this is like getting rich from investing in stocks. Life goes on if those traders get rich.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Iranus on June 21, 2017, 08:36:55 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?


In a world of 7.4bn people where you already have some 35 million millionaires I don't see why 100~500 even 1000 new ones would make a huge difference. Add to that the billionaires which even if they have huge chunks of money they can't really change the world (only rule part of it ;) ) and you get the picture. There's just too much value created every day in every possible way to be consumed even by the richest.

I different a bit. While a lot of people will likely squander their money on bullshit, there will be some that use the immense capital gain to start serious businesses. Like Coinbase or Kraken, these are pretty large, decent hiring, tax paying corps that are generating revenue for the Fed and State in a meaningful way. That job creation, tax revenue and promotion of widespread adoption are some seriously positive takeaways. Not the biggest chunk of Mammon in the world, but a nice one, at least.

I'll be honest and say the majority of early adopter bitcoin will be used on Thai hookers and blow. But 1 or 2 people incentivized to use the value the right way, could effect a huge change.
The problem is that if these people are "getting rich off crypto" instead of "investing in blockchain startups and technology", it means they're in it for fiat, and therefore what they do will not contribute to blockchain technology.

However, it's false to pretend that rich people spending a lot of money on things doesn't help the economy.  It brings all this money back into circulation, helps the businesses which they're buying things from and reduces inequality.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: darkangel11 on June 21, 2017, 09:05:03 PM
One thing you're forgetting is that the percentage of investors/traders who are buying bitcoin (or any digital coin) is extremely small compared with those investing in stocks/bonds/forex.

That's a good point. What I would add is the number of people that are getting rich through their steady jobs.
There was a time when I didn't even know how much people around the world are earning a year. I thought it's normal to get $12k a year and if you're earning $20k you're lucky. Then I met people who were getting over $40k steadily for the last 20 years and that's nothing special if you're living in certain areas. There are neighborhoods of people earning this much. Now investing in crypto and taking out a fat sum of $500k may seem like a big deal to people, me included as I'd be able to retire on it, but some people need only 8-10 years to earn that in a normal job, while some need only a year. When you realize how much money is being made every single day around the world by people just like you, you'll see how insignificant crypto markets are.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Rahar02 on June 21, 2017, 09:18:52 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?


In a world of 7.4bn people where you already have some 35 million millionaires I don't see why 100~500 even 1000 new ones would make a huge difference. Add to that the billionaires which even if they have huge chunks of money they can't really change the world (only rule part of it ;) ) and you get the picture. There's just too much value created every day in every possible way to be consumed even by the richest.
35 Million millionaires? I'm wondering where you got this kind of information, just speculation of some people maybe or Forbes has stated it "in 2017 there are some number of rich people". I'm​not sure how much people who get rich because if cryptocurrencies, but 1000 is make sense.
There are a lot of money (unlimited) because govs always print it for their citizens, then people want to spend it on something which one of the option that available is cryptocurrency, the main reason bitcoin (or altcoins) always growing up because fiat currency flow into this digital currency. Then people trade these objects and some of them could make profit through all of these cryptos.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Ewinsane on June 23, 2017, 10:18:35 AM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?
Not sure what you meant by 'people getting rich off crypto' - no they aren't in the first place because of crypto; they are becoming rich, if so, for their efforts and strategies. The only difference a crypto currency can contribute is a decentralized mode of payments.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Amph on June 23, 2017, 10:30:38 AM
not much because the money they are making come from other people that did lose something, it's like the homeless on the street that beg $1 from 100k different person, and he become reach because they helped him

the money just move from one place to another, and for someone becoming rich many other have lost a tiny portion of their wealth, this translate in that some people are actually losing on crypto and only a few are making big money


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: talkbitcoin on June 23, 2017, 10:31:09 AM
two things to consider in my opinion about your question:
first is the fact that there aren't really that many who get rich doing what you read in the news. these are very rare cases of random people. the rest who get rich by investing in bitcoin or ... would have gotten rich any other way so no balance is being disturbed.

second is the question of what will they do with their money. again those random cases who got rich randomly, will most probably blow it off as easy as they gained it. and the other group who worked for getting rich will use it wisely and again no balance is disturbed.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Windpower on June 23, 2017, 11:26:39 AM
There are not that many people who have become rich off Bitcoin. Many people were early investors, but instead of holding onto their coins, they sold them and that train kept on going so Bitcoin was spread out quite a lot. Because of this, there are not many people in the world right now who are rich because of Bitcoin. The ones that are rich, they don't really make much of an impact on the world's economy at all. Pretty much everyone who became rich off Bitcoin are just millionaires, they aren't even close to becoming billionaires. Millionaires aren't the ones who have an impact on the economy, only billionaires and above do.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: xuan87 on June 23, 2017, 12:38:09 PM
There are only few people that knew bitcoin or crypto currencies, so there are not many rich people from crypto, if there are too many people getting rich from crypto it can caused chaos to the economic stability, that is the first concern from the economic expert when they heard bitcoin, but people still need crypto currencies because there are still so many people live in poverty, so actually the crypto now is helping the people for a better life and gave a better economic for people


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Xester on June 23, 2017, 12:41:33 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

When there are many people getting rich with cryptocurrencies there are also people who are losing profit and getting bankrupt. The balance is maintained and the fiat currency that goes into cryptocurrency will also goes to other person who sold their virtual currency. Money is not being reproduced but was only transferred.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: dazbog835 on June 23, 2017, 12:47:02 PM
yes, I can understand the argument.. naturally, the value is in the value given by purchasing crypto with fiat. in hindsight it seems pretty obvious. It just seemed like money coming from thin air, when so many new cryptos are coming around, but yes, I do see that there needs to remain a balance.

It's just that I see how I made a 1000% profit in my savings through crypto and I immediately become suspect. But yes, I see now. It's pretty logical actually :D

thank you all for clarifying it to me :)

in a sense, cryptos have only enabled a democratization of wealth in the sense that anyone could do it if they were being smart about it.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: iamTom123 on June 23, 2017, 03:03:12 PM
There is nothing to be alarmed because the total global population is now beyond seven billion and yet the cryptocurrency market is still so young and small. And the money made by many cryptocurrency millionaires would always go back into the real economy which can help to induce more growth stimulus.

Cryptocurrency for all of its hypes is still a small boat in the middle of the big ocean. It can be growing by leaps and bounds but still compared to many countries GDP and big corporations' stock value we still have many rice (I am an Asian, you see) to eat to get there. 

We should instead be happy that finally there is a great opportunity to build wealth on a new frontier -- and that is the relatively new cryptocurrency market.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: webtricks on June 23, 2017, 04:31:56 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

Two points,
Number one, until and unless holders sell coins, it won't add anything to economy. Their wealth will just be estimated and won't count towards economy because Bitcoin and other crypto aren't legalized yet.
Number two, when holders sell coins, it leads to shift of wealth from one nation to others. Suppose A from US bought Bitcoin for $500 and sold for $3000 to B from UK. So it would result in addition to US economy by $2500 and deduction in UK economy by $3000. Several people think cryptocurrencies are blowing up the economy which isn't true, it is just shift of money worth either inter country or intra country.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: sana54210 on June 25, 2017, 03:55:31 AM
There is nothing to be alarmed because the total global population is now beyond seven billion and yet the cryptocurrency market is still so young and small. And the money made by many cryptocurrency millionaires would always go back into the real economy which can help to induce more growth stimulus.

Cryptocurrency for all of its hypes is still a small boat in the middle of the big ocean. It can be growing by leaps and bounds but still compared to many countries GDP and big corporations' stock value we still have many rice (I am an Asian, you see) to eat to get there. 

We should instead be happy that finally there is a great opportunity to build wealth on a new frontier -- and that is the relatively new cryptocurrency market.
No doubt the cryptocurrency is a new technology and many of the people still require get educated on the crypto system. The real or I will use the traditional economic system is too old and too strong that almost all the money earned from the crypto becomes part of that old system.

The only thing that makes a difference is many people are accepting it because they see that people attached to the crypto system have handsome earning.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Seansky on June 25, 2017, 05:29:28 AM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?
Nothing will happen to the world even if many new people get rich off cryptocurrency. The only effect I have seen is that these new millionaires because of cryptocurrency encourages others who still don't believe in cryptocurrency to try and invest in it just because there are many new rich people now because of it but the truth is the value right now is so high, they might not be rich by the time next halving comes and even in the next 5 years.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: dazbog835 on June 25, 2017, 07:51:11 AM
they might not be rich by the time next halving comes and even in the next 5 years.

What do you mean by the next halving? Has this happened before? I understand there are corrections, but a trend I see is an upwards one all the way with major or minor corrections along the way. Am I wrong?


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Amph on June 25, 2017, 08:21:50 AM
they might not be rich by the time next halving comes and even in the next 5 years.

What do you mean by the next halving? Has this happened before? I understand there are corrections, but a trend I see is an upwards one all the way with major or minor corrections along the way. Am I wrong?

yes before or after the halving the value usually go high, and this last halving was not an exception, i remember the value went almost 2x after the halving, peak was around $800

so the next halving could help the value go even higher, but we are talking about 2020 here, still a long way to go


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Yanisumin on June 25, 2017, 11:38:14 AM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

It depends whether the government of that country is open in legalizing and regulating cryptocurrencies. For example you hold your bitcoins and didn't sell it when your country doesn't recognized cryptocurrencies as money then it won't change the economy but when you sell it for cash then it might add up in the usage of fiat and it may benefit the economy. I think the economy will be benefited if btc provide less traffic in transactions and if it help the people everyday lives be much easier because of extra income and I think before that happens they will add some taxes on cryptocurrencies.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: iamTom123 on June 25, 2017, 02:50:54 PM
You seems to be worried what if all of us will get rich and no one can be poor...who might be working for us since all have the money to buy everything? Ok...it really sounds naive but I think can still be a valid question. Okay, maybe you assumed that Bitcoin and other altcoins are getting big maybe there would be no place for such growth. Actually, the current market capitalization of all the cryptocurrencies around is still peanuts compared to the global economy. In fact, we are just getting started in comparison to decades and centuries of existence of the current financial system.

In other words, there is nothing to be worried about. Just continue on "hoarding" some coins because am sure they can be growing fast and soon you can enjoy the fruits of your own labor. Time will see where this cryptocurrency revolution can be leading us as we can not predict the future in details.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: BrewMaster on June 25, 2017, 03:54:23 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

It depends whether the government of that country is open in legalizing and regulating cryptocurrencies. For example you hold your bitcoins and didn't sell it when your country doesn't recognized cryptocurrencies as money then it won't change the economy but when you sell it for cash then it might add up in the usage of fiat and it may benefit the economy. I think the economy will be benefited if btc provide less traffic in transactions and if it help the people everyday lives be much easier because of extra income and I think before that happens they will add some taxes on cryptocurrencies.

but when you invest and make profit like this and get rich you are just taking the money out of someone else's pocket! someone else is taking the money out of circulation, hands it to you and takes bitcoin and you are now owner of that money.
so in the end nothing is changed, the money just changed hand. and that is true for every trade and profit earned that way.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: michnelli6 on June 25, 2017, 06:28:42 PM
There are not that many people who have become rich off Bitcoin. Many people were early investors, but instead of holding onto their coins, they sold them and that train kept on going so Bitcoin was spread out quite a lot. Because of this, there are not many people in the world right now who are rich because of Bitcoin. The ones that are rich, they don't really make much of an impact on the world's economy at all. Pretty much everyone who became rich off Bitcoin are just millionaires, they aren't even close to becoming billionaires. Millionaires aren't the ones who have an impact on the economy, only billionaires and above do.
Yeah the bitcoin in the world today has a great contribution towards making many people rich. The number of the people became rich with the Bitcoin may be not much high but still we cannot deny the fact that the bitcoin is playing its part in making the life of many people.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: avikz on June 25, 2017, 06:38:01 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

Well, that's true that a lot of people become rich after investing in crypto currency and the list of going larger day by day. However, you should look at the brighter picture as well. A lot of people becoming wealthy means their purchasing powers are also increasing. They are spending more and more money is flowing in to the economy. Which is good for the economy as a whole.

I foresee no reason for depression because these currencies are regulated by any authority. Also crypto currency has paved way for the employment. People are living on their own through this crypto currency. So As of now, I don't see any bad things to happen in near future.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: deisik on June 25, 2017, 07:54:35 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

I think I can explain it to you

The core point you should understand is that Bitcoin as such doesn't create wealth, it only redistributes it. For example, some very early Bitcoin adopter mined a few thousand bitcoins essentially at no cost. Let's assume that he recently sold his stash at 3,000 dollars per coin, so now he is a dollar millionaire. But does it mean that anything changed at a larger scale? He just collected dollars from a few (or many) people, but the total amount of dollars didn't change. Basically, nothing has changed and wouldn't change until Bitcoin manages to get into real economy and compete with dollars (or any other fiat currency) there as a genuine means of payment for goods and services


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: d5000 on June 26, 2017, 05:50:43 AM
Bitcoin as such doesn't create wealth, it only redistributes it.

I put this into doubt. Bitcoin "as such" does create wealth, like every innovative service with new and useful characteristics. An example is the utility of cryptos for so different services like online gambling and international remittances, which is already visible (although gambling went mostly to altcoins). And in the future the biggest potential lies perhaps in "banking for the unbanked" / "banking without banks/middlemen".

That's also why the more pessimistic answers of this thread do not convince me. The cryptocurrency ecosystem as a whole does create genuine innovations and satisfies demands for some people. The effect may be still small because most of the "price growth" of Bitcoin is based exclusively on speculation, but it is already a fact. And with every potential new Bitcoin user, the ecosystem also potentially grows, opening room for new services and so the "genuine wealth".

You could imagine Bitcoin like a share of a company that comprises the whole Bitcoin ecosystem. It's true that the "new Bitcoin rich" often do not apport much to the ecosystem but the minority that invests their profits in well thought-out Bitcoin/crypto services moves the train forward.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: xypos on June 26, 2017, 07:18:34 AM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

Not really, at least for now.

Right now the players in bitcoin is very limited. I think the true bitcoin whales, ones that hold more than 1000 BTC which equates to quite a nice chunk of money individually is probably less than 200.

Speculation of bitcoin simply means that some people lose, some people win. So whales are basically playing each other, in a pvp game, if you like.

Honestly, bitcoin price does not matter that much. The most important thing is who and how many people are using it? If bitcoin can help the unbanked in third world countries with instant, safe and costless transactions, but is only worth $100, that would be fine.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: omonuyak on June 26, 2017, 08:29:36 AM
It is poverty that Couse economic depression and not wealth and prosperity. We should be grateful for what crypto currencies has made us intend of seeing it as economic sabotage and repression. May the God of crypto currencies be with us all.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: grermezter on June 26, 2017, 10:01:45 AM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

We should remember that the rich are taxed very heavily,some pay as much as 50% tax so its good news for the economy of the world, there will be more for the country and the cycle of life will just continue.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: emezh10 on June 26, 2017, 10:13:48 AM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

We should remember that the rich are taxed very heavily,some pay as much as 50% tax so its good news for the economy of the world, there will be more for the country and the cycle of life will just continue.
Rich people are taxed by government so by investing in cryptocurrency they can save they money by just putting it in crypto because the bitcoin is decentralized so that I think many big people now are investing in cryptocurrency because they are free from the tax. I think I will do that too.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Xavofat on June 26, 2017, 11:18:21 AM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

We should remember that the rich are taxed very heavily,some pay as much as 50% tax so its good news for the economy of the world, there will be more for the country and the cycle of life will just continue.
Rich people are taxed by government so by investing in cryptocurrency they can save they money by just putting it in crypto because the bitcoin is decentralized so that I think many big people now are investing in cryptocurrency because they are free from the tax. I think I will do that too.
Bollocks.  You shouldn't trust governments not to tax the air you're breathing.  In the countries I can think of off the to of my head, crypto profits are subject to capital gains tax.

Besides, it's not like rich people love shovelling their cash into crypto to watch it fly up and down by ten percent in a day.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Oralmat on June 26, 2017, 04:58:47 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

You need a real understanding of the economy and how it works to be around the trading world and there are very few that have that here and it appears we now have a new one.  Making money in any form makes more money for the economy, it is a base and core element of the economy and taught in high school.

Moving money is good money, crime is fine, war is fine and all these aspects are just fine, anything that causes a movement in the system makes the system stronger, those without any understanding will find that they are going to be eaten alive and will not survive, which, again, is a movement in the system and that small amount of $10,000 or more that is wasted by them trying to become something other than what society has chosen for them only provides greater support for the underlying low income labor force and that helps support the system above it all.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: squatz1 on June 26, 2017, 06:59:55 PM
Well to the economy at large it probably isn't going to be much in the least, this probably due to the amount of people who are already becoming richer and poorer on the daily so it's not going to show too much of a change in the overall economy. Also, a lot of the people that are becoming rich are becoming rich on paper, they haven't come to the point where they've REALIZED (sold) their profits and have put that gain right back into their banks or wallets. So it's unknown if all of these people are going to stay rich once everyone goes to sell their shitcoins, shitICO's, and so on and so forth.

It's going to do nothing to the economy at large, our economies have seen crazier things before.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: beerlover on June 26, 2017, 08:11:15 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?
Not sure what you meant by 'people getting rich off crypto' - no they aren't in the first place because of crypto; they are becoming rich, if so, for their efforts and strategies. The only difference a crypto currency can contribute is a decentralized mode of payments.
If we say that the people the initial investors of the bitcoin were rich and the other users who at first provided services for the bitcoin are now becoming rich with it. It can be defended as the people earned bitcoin and invested them into alts gaining more of it and even holding Bitcoin and selling it for a higher price.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: deisik on June 26, 2017, 08:32:58 PM
Bitcoin as such doesn't create wealth, it only redistributes it.

I put this into doubt. Bitcoin "as such" does create wealth, like every innovative service with new and useful characteristics. An example is the utility of cryptos for so different services like online gambling and international remittances, which is already visible (although gambling went mostly to altcoins). And in the future the biggest potential lies perhaps in "banking for the unbanked" / "banking without banks/middlemen"

I basically agree with that

But the question was not about that. It was about having "a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'". It is certainly not about creating "innovative service with new and useful characteristics". Further, this effect, while undeniable, in minuscule at best, and right now Bitcoin is no more than a speculative asset which helps move wealth from one hands into other hands (i.e. redistribute already existing wealth)


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: dazbog835 on June 30, 2017, 10:46:46 AM
Thanks everyone for your answers. I can now see how naive my original line of thinking was. Seems pretty obvious now :D


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: audaciousbeing on June 30, 2017, 03:28:21 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

I believe its just new sets of Millionaires that is being made while those who are made already before venturing into bitcoin have to contribute marginally to the economy of their respective countries. Also, I see that not every one is getting rich at the same time because in the real sense, just like trading, its a zero sum game while some are making money and others are losing money and at the end of the day, summing up everything together means there is really no change whatsoever in the overall economy. So depression is not anything close to us.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: MRlong on June 30, 2017, 03:50:57 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

We should remember that the rich are taxed very heavily,some pay as much as 50% tax so its good news for the economy of the world, there will be more for the country and the cycle of life will just continue.
Rich people are taxed by government so by investing in cryptocurrency they can save they money by just putting it in crypto because the bitcoin is decentralized so that I think many big people now are investing in cryptocurrency because they are free from the tax. I think I will do that too.
In future, the government will find ways can tax cryptocurrency because they always want control crypto, maybe if can't do that, they will released a digital cash use technology blockchain for national bank and use as currency important after FIAT


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: infofront on June 30, 2017, 05:20:12 PM
Every major technological revolution creates a new generation of millionaires/billionaires.

This one is unique in that it will benefit everyone. In fact, the very poor may benefit from Bitcoin the most.
Bitcoin will greatly reduce monetary friction. For instance, it greatly reduces the cost of sending money internationally.
Bitcoin will ultimately spell doom for the "old world" monetary system we currently use. No longer will we all be taxed by central banks in the form of inflation.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Yakamoto on June 30, 2017, 05:47:07 PM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?
Basically everything is set for a massive recession due to poor wages, poorer people, everything shooting up in cost (well beyond inflation), housing bubble caused by "starter homes" being bought up by boomers and turned into expensive flip properties or rental properties resulting in money being thrown away into bank accounts that will never move. Student loans are also a major thing here.

Same thing is happening in crypto; old money is buying in, causing those with a vested interest (new money) to gain value and take money from the average money individual.

Basically put; everything is propagating a bubble and it will be much worse than 2008 at this rate. New money just pushes everything up. If they get value at the bottom of the barrel during the next recession, then they will walk away with a lot of value. If they just invest now, they're making a bubble that'll just have a bigger pop.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: deisik on June 30, 2017, 06:24:52 PM
Every major technological revolution creates a new generation of millionaires/billionaires

This one is unique in that it will benefit everyone. In fact, the very poor may benefit from Bitcoin the most.
Bitcoin will greatly reduce monetary friction. For instance, it greatly reduces the cost of sending money internationally.
Bitcoin will ultimately spell doom for the "old world" monetary system we currently use. No longer will we all be taxed by central banks in the form of inflation.

I think along the same lines mostly

Though it is not so much about major technological revolutions but just about any significant breakthrough in a certain filed that creates a new pack of wealthy people. That said, I still don't think that Bitcoin belongs to this department. How come? People that got rich via Bitcoin basically didn't do anything at all. First, they were lucky to buy (mine) Bitcoin when it had been cheap and then sell it when it had become dear (or they continue to keep it). This simply cannot be compared to all other billionaires like Larry Page, Sergey Brin or Mark Zuckerberg (and their likes). All these people put enormous amount of time and effort into their businesses unlike Bitcoin nouveaux riches, who were just sitting idly. The bottom line is that most new Bitcoin millionaires (not sure about billionaires, if there are any) will likely lose their new wealth as fast as they acquired it. Even if they don't outright lose it, they will just eat it away eventually


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: cafucafucafu on July 01, 2017, 04:19:07 AM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

Well there is one thing that is definite. Banks are panicking because they can't control people's wealths anymore. And the central banks are forced to regulate the market because they can't just stand there and wait for the takeover.

People getting rich off crypto means that they are able to have their own assets, away from the prying eyes of the government. No longer does the government have the ability to debase the currency that you hold in your hands. That's the beauty of BTC.

Though there is still an extremely small amount of people using bitcoin compared to everyone on Earth, so until mass adoption this is really just a small dent in the economy.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: dazbog835 on July 01, 2017, 06:29:20 AM
No longer does the government have the ability to debase the currency that you hold in your hands. That's the beauty of BTC.
But is this sustainable? Won't governments inevitably find a way to govern crypto?


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: HashieNewb on July 01, 2017, 06:33:52 AM
No longer does the government have the ability to debase the currency that you hold in your hands. That's the beauty of BTC.
But is this sustainable? Won't governments inevitably find a way to govern crypto?
Well, if people within the Government find a method to make all the Internet servers and other electronic items to not work anymore then Bitcoin will survive through most of the disasters out there.
Bitcoin not being controlled by the Government is good, if Bitcoin was not built by the Government lol


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: dazbog835 on July 01, 2017, 03:33:59 PM
well, i meant tax, not necessarily govern. surely taxation will come, and legislation.

this buy-dump era can't go on forever, right?


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: syaripudin on July 22, 2017, 05:26:50 AM
I do not think so because the rich people in general are not originated from bitcoin. Usually initially they are someone who had a wealth. So before they jump in bitcoin world initially they already have enough capital. Like investors in bitcoin yangmereka Start and have had the capital before .. so I'm not sure what you say.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Kevin77 on July 22, 2017, 06:09:32 AM
I do not think so because the rich people in general are not originated from bitcoin. Usually initially they are someone who had a wealth. So before they jump in bitcoin world initially they already have enough capital. Like investors in bitcoin yangmereka Start and have had the capital before .. so I'm not sure what you say.
No there are common people who have bought bitcoins and still holding for years and will become richer in near future but I do not think it will not impact economy in negative ways in any any dimensions. Because we do see on every revolution there ever some people found their fortunes and it does not impact the balance of normal people.

Yes, bitcoin boom will bring many new millionaires and it may lead to larger economy still it will work in positive way for entire humankind so we never need to worry on this.


Title: Re: What do these new people getting rich off crypto mean to the economy at large?
Post by: Anegg on July 22, 2017, 06:24:50 AM
I apologize if this question is in any way naive.. I'm not really any kind of economics expert. I was just wondering what might happen to the world economy since there are so many new people getting rich off these cryptocurrencies... Just based off speculation or holding the right coins a lot of people have gained in wealth in the past years. And it doesn't seem to be slowing down.

So, you have a lot of 'new money' propagating even 'newer money'... and so on and so on, until a lot of people are pretty rich. Does this mean that there is a huge depression ahead of us? Surely just making more and more money can't go on forever, can it?

I'm sure I'm not seeing the big picture here so please, could someone explain it to me?

I think that not a lot of rich people have invested in Bitcoin, but people do become rich after investing in Bitcoin. After some research, I found that only 1 millionaire revealed that he had invested in Bitcoin. I think that Bitcoin provides an opportunity for someone to completely change their economic status without doing something illegal. Bitcoin is the red pill and you would think so if you have seen a number of millionaires Bitcoin has made.

Don't think huge depression will be ahead, only a select few members of the society has invested in bitcoin.