Bitcoin Forum

Provocative title... but so true...

Today, the market cap off all the Cryptos is north of $100B.

It is EXTREMELY low compared to the values seen in the tech world (except for some shady ICOs ;-) )

In details, Bitcoin counts for $50B mk, and if we only take the top20 alts, we are at roughly $45B mk to add, the rest being peanuts.



If we take the biggest financial places in the world:
NYSE = $16T
NASDAQ = $7.4T
...
...
KOREA Exchange = $1.3T
... etc.


http://money.visualcapitalist.com/all-of-the-worlds-stock-exchanges-by-size/
There are 60 major exchanges in the world, with a mk of $70 Trillion ($70,000 Billion!)


There are lots of sh1t companies listed to the stock exchanges as there are lots of sh1tcoins on the alts-market, it's a "reasonable" statement to compare them as they both deal with a wide array of technology companies.


-> That means a market cap of cca. $13 Trillion to reach for the crypto market. Doable, at least on paper.
Compared vs today, that is a x130 factor vs. the current market cap of the "BTC+ALTS world"

That said, if you have $10,000 worth of BTC+ALTs, you should end with $1.3M in the next years if the market raises to the aforementioned levels.
Of course, not ALL your coins will raise, and you may lose a significant part of your portfolio... but even if 30% goes to dust (or to exchanges...), you should end up with the magic 7-figure.




Your thoughts?

P.S.: if we assume that BTC will continue to trust the top and will account for at least 30%-40% of the total marketcap, it means a BTC mk at cca $5Trillion
with 21M coins, that is $250,000 per coin. John McAffee is just x2 more bullish but we are in the same realm of figures; and he could be right...

I think you are right, since I've been doing similar research recently and had come up with the similar conclusion, but I won't adventure to say millionaire or not.

I like to compare with numbers, which makes it hilarious like

BITCOIN VALUE Vs. APPLE STOCK VALUE

$045.000.000.000
$780.000.000.000



BITCOIN VALUE Vs. ALL CRYPTO VALUE Vs. ALL EXCHANGE COMPARED

$000.045.000.000.000
$000.102.000.000.000
$079.000.000.000.000


I don't know the derivatives value, but I would add 1 quadrillion ($001.000.000.000.000.000) as I read similar quote somewhere else. So in order to be true balanced bitcoin still has place to grow 100 (that's $270.000) times keeping 40% market dominance. And this figure is to make a BALANCE between both worlds, aside from any revaluation as a higher technological improvement that it comes with it, and the ecological and fair approach to our nature, rather than blowing up mountains and forests for the sole purpose of carrying iron and paper that worth NOTHING since it is counterfeited.

 
If any of you have concerns on what I am saying, and that all our economy has been counterfeited and a corporation was placed in place check the following link and website http[Suspicious link removed]cutive%20Summary%2021Dec2015.pdf

You are making a good point here. I am not so sure one will become a millionaire, but it is possible with the increase of money pouring into crypto. I think we will see a huge amount of money coming in when BTC pumps again and destroys the current ATH. Mainstream media is talking about bitcoin more than ever. Even ethereum and ripple get mentioned nowadays. Before the pump of march not many people knew about crypto currencies at least from what I have observed in my country. But after the recent pump a lot more people are starting to get interested.

You are probably right, provided you don't get scammed or hacked before 2025. The risk of being scammed or hacked is kind of high, so to speak.

Maybe not or yes. Its all about what  happening in bitcoins now so many Improvements now on part of BTC i think yes this well doubled or tripled in 2025  because bitcoins get a very good performance on the past 3 years from 400$ price to 1000$ in 2016 and now 2800$ now in 2017  maybe the continues high price will be go on until no one can afford 1 BTC.

It was already possible to take $100 and make $1M or more over the last few years.
And you have to KEEP that. That is the hard part. After big rises there are large drops and you don't know when they come so easily.

But it won't be as easy now. So starting with 10k would be more likely to be successful at that goal. True.

I would NOT say "should" lol..... I would say "might with great skill".

Its possible but there's a lot of variables crypto moves so fast, it will be determined mainly on market growth, the alts that you choose to invest in and the decisions that you end up making.

Forex alone is a $6 Trillion market and there is a speculative chance that digital currencies may end up being as big as the FX Markets.  However I think you won't even need to invest $10,000 as even with $5000 or less it stands a chance to make $$$$$$$.  Crytpo's are similar to penny stock.  Likes of eBay, Google etc where the started of and look where they are now.

The ordinary Joe does not have $10,000 spare as it's the way it is but even a small investment can go a long way.  Look back to what I have heard and read people whom bought Bitcoins in 2009/2010 for $100 or so and now how much they are worth.

I think Crypto Currencies especially cheaper one's are worth taking a punt on.

Well noone can disagree. I don't know how many times that I had chance but couldn't realize.
In last 3 years there were lot of coins that made their owners millionaire but as YoyodyneSystems said, it is very hard to hold that much after you see 10x etc.

Even if your prediction is true, only economics itself does not work for humans well, taking into account psychology your prediction can be come true by only few people.

Looking forward for this prediction to happen!  ;D

i agree to the op and this. make sure your bag of gold not to get hack or left with exchange

I've thought also about this topic sometimes. Crypto market cap has potential at least (midterm) to reach 10% of total market cap (including classic exchanges). You're values are right. Classic exchanges are around 70 trillion, and cryptos only 0.1 trillion. 10% would be 7 trillion, so growth is x70.

I'm confident this could happen sometime before 2025 (2022, 2023 maybe...)

Best case, and long term, could be crypto having about 30 - 60% of total market cap, but for this we would need at least 30 years from now. Could be useful for retirement anyway :)

If that would really happen then that would really be nice I don't have 10k$ as of now so i wont be a millionaire then but Ill try gather some more.

Interesting post, I bookmarked it for the skeptics that I meet everyday.

But frankly, I see a bigger growth potential into altcoins than into Bitcoin. Bitcoin will lose and more dominance, because of the altcoin nature. They are quoted on Bitcoin. So let's say altcoin 1, called A1, is quoted at 0,01BTC at T1. Bitcoin is quoted at 3000$. Thats makes A1 quoted at 30$. If Bitcoin rises to 4000$ A1 is worth 40$. But if in the same time A1 rises to 0,02BTC, it is now worth 80$. This double price increase, added to the fact that there is more and more altcoins on the market, will reduce Bitcoin dominance to less than 10% by 2025 I guess. But question is : is it a problem ?

Well this is true. That is why people that hodled on 2011. Because some people I knew bought 2000 of bitcoins. And right now he is harvesting his seed. He trusted bitcoin and hodled it for these years that have passed. Well if I only had a paypal at that time I could hodled that much also. But no sadly.

It makes sense since active crypto traders are a tiny sliver of the population. I am hoping that cryptocurrencies will become more normalized that the market can really take off so it's more like 2020 instead of 2025 ;).

Well i guess you are speaking to a future millionaire then ;-). If only we had some kind of "!remind me in 10 years" trick. I beleive in crypto so much that i invested 90%.

My house is not finished but i am willing to wait because where can i get a rendement like this huh. Don't care that the ceiling is not done or some doors are not in place :p.


Get rich or die trying! ... sort of ;-)

Honeslty, if you go from 10k to even 20k you should be happy. If you go from 10k to 100k you should be ecstatic. Those are incredible returns! People need to appreciate all the money they make even if they aren't necessarily millionaires

Sure hope so:)

BUT i doubt it. I got into crypto this year bought abt 350$ CAD worth of Ether from coinbase. I think it was somewhere around 27. At the peak even i were to hold some and sell them at 400$ I would have my 10000$ BUT our little brains don't work like that.

Don't get me wrong, for sure there will be people out there with 10000$ portfolio will be millionaire. I think most of us will sell out before we get there cuz of fear of losing it all or we will try to leap frog: 'Oh let me just sell now and will buy it when it gets low again'.

Anyways planning on getting to 5 bitcoin and lock that shit up in a deposit box for 10 years. Retire early:)

Sounds like a plan to me.

Good luck to ya all!

P.S.: Don't be me and sell out too early. Patience is a virtue.

Even I think the same way as you predict it.For example take Real Estate industry, 20 years it prices are so cheap that now they rose up to X100 times.But at this levels in Real Estate it is almost impossible to become one more X100 times even after 20 years from now.So same can be predicted in Bitcoin industry.

I already have more than 20k of valuation. I did not pick $10k bc it suited me but bc it is a simple figure that does the job in terms of explaining the potential we *might* have here.

Honestly, I will cash out some USD as soon as I need money for Real Estate or other irl projects. Maybe I'll miss the $1million club... maybe I'll reach it another way... who knows.

I think you are right OP. It's possible. It's likely to be.

We do know this speculation and it may get true with only Bitcoin, leave other coins. I think 10 BTC should be the minimum value in your cold storage for a longer term like 6-7 years. Some altcoins have a bright future but recognizing them now would be an issue.

I agree that the crypto space is likely to receive capital fleeing the equity and FX markets, but 100x seems a tad over optimistic. Lets due something more conservative and estimate where we might land.

Assume growth of 20%, then industry market cap = 100B x (1 + 0.2)^8 = $430B, this implies 4.3x from where we are today in 2025

Assume growth of 30%, then industry market cap = 100B x (1 + 0.3)^8 = $816B, this implies 8.2x growth

I think its definitely possible to exceed these growth rates if a person is an astute investor and has a decent sized allocation to small cap coins with strong technologies.  Which one might these be that could deliver 100x +? Well, thats the million dollar question. I think the best chances of making a large hit are owning multiple $1000+ USD positions in sub $10m market cap coins. If you coin increases in market cap from $1M to $300M, you would not be a millionaire but will be very pleased with the result.

Here are some low market cap ideas.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2054157.msg20482712#msg20482712
 

I agree, but I also believe that on the short term, there is room to make more BTC via Alts. And I need to increase my BTC assets.

I believe I can double on some ALTS by the end of 2017.

I'll cash-out some BTC once I reach some thresholds, and once I would have reached a value high enough to be able to put 10BTC on cold storage I will.
So far, I don't have enough. But yes, 10BTC is the magic figure to have on cold storage.

(note: a few exchanges like Bittrex and Krakren are showing that they are could be trusted for "hodling long term". with 2FA and email validation, they start to be pretty safe, maybe safe than cold-storage solutions you can lose, or get robbed)

Agreed. 100x is a *STRONG* figure. Almost a marketing/clickbait one.
Still, if you have balls of steel, a bit of luck, you can piggy back on some Alts to make part of the x100 job.

I made x30 from BTC bought at $700 (1st hockey stick).
BTC at $2800 today means that the BTC-increase is "only" x4
the rest (rought x7) has been made via alts: I multiplied by 7 my portfolio value in BTC.

So, I think there is room for the same "game": reaching x100, with a x5 on alts->btc and x20 on BTC->usd


We will see... (gosh... Bancor is cheap since its dip!)

Interesting thread here.  So if you say 10k worth of btc and altcoins... how much percent of that 10k from bitcoin vs altcoin?


I assume you mean more than 50 percent altcoin right?  Because say someone has 90 percent of 10k in bitcoin and 10 percent in altcoin, i dont think its possible to be millionaire.  Im guessing its more like 60 percent minimum in altcoins?

really important figure that should be indicated by OP and I also assuming that Op should hold precious alt coins like eth , waves and some other coins
that have good potentials to succeed alongside of bitcoin better to split those money and not to hold major part of bitcoin.

Exactly  it matters a lot what you own.  Not every $10k will turn into $1m. Some will turn into way more then just $1m. There is still 8 years till 2025.

YES. More than 50%. Probably 75%, and again: well diversified within Alts (I'll name a few which are not necessarily in my portfolio)

Example:
1/. 30% on the big names, top 10 mk:  ETH+XRP+NEM... (you nem-it...)

2/. 50% or more on top top100, using coin-picking to fing the hidden gems: DGB, OMG, PIVX, NEO, NXT, ARK, TenX PAY, VIA, XVG, PTOY, and of course WAVES
On these, the idea is imho to diversify per verticals (Anon, gambling, platforms, specific verticals like health gaming or distributed computing,   etc..

3/. 20% (or less) of "shitcoins" with high risk/reward outcomes: I recently put a bit of BTC on POSW and XBY. These 20% follow a heavy rotation and serve pump and dump purposes mostly (note: some cat3 coins may enter the cat2)

I try to limit the number of coins by allocating AT LEAST 0.2 BTC per coin. Less that that dilutes too much the potential of a big raise.


Of course, as said above; 2025 if still freaking far away... 7 long years.

Okay that was what i was thinking of when you say close to 75%.  If thats the case, then what would be the point of holding bitcoin now?  Is it because most likely it will go up so you want to have some in case the altcoins fall apart and the profits from the 25 percent in bitcoin would offset the losses by altcoins?  Thus bitcoin is king and like your most important coin?

Exactly.
BTC is the hedge if Alts fall appart. (as ETH is a sub-hesdge on the alt side, if the other shitcoins to to hell etc...)

25% in BTC represents roughly 1BTC based on the $10k hypothesis, and could yield a 6-figure value on the 2025 horizon. (McAfee and a Jeremy Liew, the first investor in Snap Inc. are ultra bullish at $500,000. These big whales generally are right because they can make the market. But I think that $500,000 is kind of a stretch!)..

Ultimately, if you believe in the $500,000, put 2BTC on cold storage and wait... I am more thinking about a $100,000 to $250,000 value, hence having a stash of 10 BTC in the mid term is a nice goal I gave myself recently.

In the hypothesis illustrated above, going from $10k today (3.5 BTC) to 10 BTC generates a x3 goal that some Alts should help realize...
Ideally, you make more that that (bc you are lucky with your shitcoins investments, and can keep 10 BTC in cold storage + have room to play with alts (let's say 3 to 5 BTC worth of value)...
(Ideally, you are born with money and do not need cryptos to be rich...)


my 0.50cents (of BCH...not a lot...)

But how much will the dollar be worth then?

It wont be so bad in 2025.
It will always go down in buying power but it cant be completely useless in such a short time window

How high do you see bitcoin going up to?

Do you think 100k is possible?

What would you say are the top 5 altcoins out there right?  How much percentage would you have where your 10k could be worth 1 million?  So about 2500 in btc only... then 7500 in altcoins?  Which altcoins specifically?  I assume not ETH right since thats already too expensive?  Thus you mean coins that are 10 dollars and under etc but maybe even less?

Not quite noob :D

Anyone who spends 10 grand today on inflated shitcoins is a fucking retard.

Do I have to explain why or was the words NOOB and inflated a clue?
Oh and do the math.. Bank investment would give you a guaranteed safe return.

Start using a toilet pajeets ::)

@OP
I'm not saying you are stupid but.. It is your name LOL

Lots of questions.
I quite like WAVES and OMG on which I put money earlier this year. Their market cap is not at the level of other similar competitors (Waves vs ETH. Omg climbed hard recently, I need to decide if I keep or move...)
I consider XRP and ETH to be expensive, but I see lots of corporations using ETH, hence I hodl some.

Again, someone has to choose his preferred alts, his own recipe... I don't know which ones would be the best, and maybe I am wrong about alts too...
Hopefully not.

Your call dude.
I'd be a dumb stupid fucktard to claim you that you are wrong about Alts. I just hope you are not.
Some people made a fuckton of cash during the tulips-frenzy in the Netherpotlands a bit ago. So even if it's inflatuated, there is a way out. Risk/Reward.


Thx for my name, It's actually shit test, my own Godwin thing on the forums.
You are the 1st one to pass it on this forum. CONGRATS ;-)

This is probably right. That is seven long years from now. The price of BTC as well as other alts should be very high by that time. There is even a possibility that it will exceed the million mark.

You guys need to look at why the price of altcoins go up.
And what it takes for the prices to keep rising for 8 straight years LOL
It's about people.
With out an ever expanding user base that is not possible.
The reality is a new coin is made every few minutes so the market dilution is at odds with enough people to buy them all at.. And here is the kicker.. A greater and greater price.
Apparently you noob pajeets are willing to spend literally any amount of real money on any shitcoin.. While the dev who got free coins laughs to the bank.
Imagine how hard Butters is laughing as ETH rises to $500 a coin :D

Try being smart and realistic.. And maybe even honest.

Historically we seen altcoins rise.. Briefly.
Not.. Keep shooting upwards for 8 straight years.
You NOOBS were not here after the shitcoin recession after 2013.
It was users leaving and cashing out.
It happens and this topic ignores that completely.

You guys don't have a clue what you are talking about.
You are NOOBS that did not do your crypto homework.

90% of the altcoins that you see today won't exist in 2020 let alone until 2025 and if you plan on investing in any of them to become a "millionaire" then maybe you should think again!
and the rest won't give you that much profit to begin with. they are mostly staying on low prices then during a couple of months tops, they get pumped heavily and then go back to their normal low prices which again means in long term you lose more money than you can make.

bitcoin is different because it is the only coin with real world application. and its adoption is growing. the rest of the altcoins are just tokens that are being speculatively traded and will cease to be profitable at some point.

I totally agree with you: it is a highly speculative market. The new tulips maybe, at least for most coins.

That said, it is still an environment where one can make money. The exit strategy is the key.

I already cashed out enough money to be happy with this  "game". Now I will try to "tulip my way up"
Maybe some tulips are diamonds... witha real use.
Really, i don't know, and blindly believing it is as stupid as refusing to accept this eventuality.
In both cases, playing "smart" and lots of luck could yield to big profits (and probably bc people will buy).

That said: I invested hundreds a while ago, and I cashed out thousands some months ago (I bought myself a LesPaul Studio :-) ). Now I play (not the guitar) without stress, just for fun and maybe I can make even more. I don't give a flying turd about losing 50% (I'll cash out and exit the table)



Btw, what is your strategy? 100% BTC? You post a lot on the alts forum, there must be a reason right? (Besides the joy of evangelization and a good sense of dark humor)

You maybe right. The people that had 1k usd of ETH or XEM 1 year ago are millioner at the moment  ;D
But the hard thing is keeping the coins for long term ;D. Whenever we see x2 x3 we sell and try to jump another cheap coin. It is not a good strategy for long term i guess huh?  ;D

!remind this funny guy in 10years.

Believe me i did enough homework. Bitcoin is nice but the blockchain isn't doing anything special, alt coins are future. Its actually inevitable, more people will find out and will want to join in. When the top is reached and will burst the people who got in now will still have gained a lot. Key is holding and following all the projects you hold, when a project loses interest and another similar one competes in price it is you who needs to decide what to do. But the technology is needed today and will get the attention it deserves. If you don't believe that then maybe you should do some more homework.

It's hard to predict. As the Bitcoin grows, it brings more problem. Though being one of the largest in supply coin, Bitcoin was a primitive crypto concept. And the bitcoin price can't go too has as have gone in the last decade.
The future is surely in the hand of newer alts. But predicting which will succeed is still difficult.

Realistically in 10 years, the price of 1 bitcoin will be above $10,000 each or more. This is due to the userbase increase and more people holding lesser bitcoins in their position. I mean what is the current user base I personally do not believe there are 1 million users of bitcoin at the current moment. but in 10 years it could be that more people are using it and keeping it. When that happens, your average joe may not afford to buy bitcoins unless, their salary is paid in bitcoins. so what options do the average joe has? most likely the cheaper coins due to those that they know that have knowledge in crypto among their circle of friends would advise that there are still ways of obtaining btc by investing in alt coins. so these average joe will start investing in other alts and if they are in the right alt, they will make money.

so the future in my opinion is not only bitcoin, but a few other will exist too just because of they want to increas their btc.

You really think its all about bitcoin do you :)

Have you thought about projects like decentralized cloud storage or decentralized supercomputers and their potential? Maybe the new banking system where ultrafast transactions with low fees become possibel? Or the fact that coins are a world currency that keep there value outside your borders? No you think about bitcoin... bitcoin is a storage of value, like litecoin even. But some altcoins are going to change the future because of the groundbreaking technology!

This might be the main problem at the moment:
Everyone compares, and everything gets compared with Bitcoin. Mostly from people, which have not a single idea of what the future could bring. And the development of the market in the past years until now confirms their theory. But the increasing marketcap and its increasing diversification will brake the influence of BTC. More: It will brake the influence of every coin to another. Doesn't mean, that BTC wouldn't be a save harbour in hard times, like gold is for the stock market. But the correlations will fade more and more and people will look at first at the single project, and for the second on the whole market. At the moment, they do it in reverse. And they act like this.

It needs about one or two runs like this year to bring those 10,000 to 1,000,000.

I think this is very possible when the reall masses start entering crypto. A million newbies buying 1,000 usd worth of bitcoin is better than 10 millionaires buying a lot of bitcoins in helping us get there.

With BTC, yes I agree you're going to be a millionaire by 2025 undoubtedly but I don't believe in shitcoins making it through with huge market caps with their problem being, new laws that govern altcoins. When there's an outrage is altcoins occupying the market, countries will begin making their own law for cryptos and this will become a huge setback.

Have you ever tried to explain the concept of bitcoin to an average joe? I have and it is not easy. I have to use the concept of land ownership to explain it to them to make them to understand. and here you are talking about alt coins with technology. seriously dude, technology can be introduced to a generation but it will only be adopted fully in next or the next generation. so basically this alt technology is for your kids or grandkids.

I am not saying alt is not important. their features are important. but what happens when Bitcoin adopts that same successful technology? Have you thought about that? Dont tell me bitcoin will not evolve. It will evolve.

So I need to step up my crypto-earning skills. Right now, I am earning around $25 per week and that translates to some $1,300 worth of crypto per year. At this rate, even by 2025 I will not be able to accumulate crypto worth $10,000.  ???

Smoke more fucking crack ::)

There is few people on earth that are willing to show up here and.. Here is the kicker..
Throw out their morality and play pseudo penny stock shitcoin trader fer teh exchanger profits coins ROI's.

Dumb fucks.. Shitcoins cater to scammy idiots.
Like all of you here I have 0 respect for.
If you ever owned an ICO coin you are a scammy ass greedy little immoral douche.
Now smart fuckers with your noob accounts..
Tell me what is the grand outcome of a bunch of idiots showing up to pay literally any price for literally anything no matter how pointless, crooked and rigged it is.
 :D

The bubble pops pajeets.
And yeah it is easy to predict.
I made far more than all of you doing this and..
I did it with out spending one single God damn mother fucking cent of my REAL MONEY.
Unlike you!
Anyone showing up here buying shitcoins with real money is an idiot.

You are bullshitters spewing crap to pad your rotting shitcoin bags.
If others don't continually keep piling in at a greater and greater rate..
Then prices will stall then the momentum will predictably swing hard the other way.
You dipshits here are basically chanting that Oh..
It's so good now it will be like this forever.
And in eight years were gonna be millionaires from all these stupid ass scam coins.
You are so fucking dumb and noob you don't know how stupid you sound saying it.
Many of you idiot NOOBS are posting the same comments I already heard before and after alts CRASHED.

The OP here is back peddling and moving the goal posts because he's full of shit.
Speculative market?
Wrong.
Scam coin market that can be crushed by regulation?
Shitcoins that get created faster than we can buy them?
Money to be made?
I agree there and not because of a tulips flower analogy.
It's more like a brand new digital variant of a pyramid scheme.
This the new MLM scam.
Money to be made?
Off of what greedy scammy immoral inept douche's?
Seriously what is it you are speculating on?
And what is this market you speak of?
You don't have a clue because you are greedy stupid inept little shit heads piling in here buying literally anything at all because of the chance to get ROI's.

You are stupid.
You act like it.
You prove it when you open your mouthes.
I am not insulting you all..
I am warning you children you need to get smart and do your homework.
Start with traditional scams research.
You will find that yes they too are popular.
So I am fed up with the tired old retarded clichéd retort "there is money to be made"
..that wasn't the topic title was it?
And?
A whole lot of losers eventually.
Trust me your greedy immoral stupidity will ensure it one way or the other.
Proof is how I see you all acting now.
To say you are acting "risky" while the going is good would be an understatement.
So when the momentum shifts I will see the shit storm hit hard.
And oh it will.. Plenty of future idiot bag holders here singing the praises of shitcoins ROI's while the going is good.

Let's see YOU...... and Your noob account here in ten years jigging your little dick holsters around.

Holding good coins for a long period of time has proven to be very profitable.

The alts are specialising branches, a significant few have a very clear roadmap and to me a bright future ahead. For instance,

voter fraud is a thing of today -> could be solved with blockchain. (There will be demand for this)
Supercomputers that solve all kinds of medical roadblocks -> future there and demand
Don't need to talk t you about doa's
Paying all around the world with one coin? -> there is a market
Cloud storage that isn't in hands of one firm (microsoft, amazon,..) --> enough leaks that make this a market

Technology can move real fast if the right people are working on it!

It says legendary, but I haven't seen one optimistic or non-troll post from you... What are you doing?

Dear Spoetnik,
You do not make any sense. At all. You claim about the fact that you made money, built in these Ponzi schemes, even said you made far more than us, but at the same time "warn us" and tell people NOT to put real money in the game.

On top of that, you build your flawed argumentation on hypotheses that you don't even challenge:
You think that people here are noobs to the crypto world because they are new on the forum: WRONG
You think that people invest all their money on cryptos: WRONG
You believe that people here have no idea about cryptos and tech and are only doing speculative moves: WRONG. Even among the noobs as you call them, some posts are full of sense and worth reading.
You think that ALL alts are useless, because you see (a bunch of) scammy ICOs and sh1tcoins: WRONG. There start to be a massive adpotion by corporations of the blockchain technology (mostly around ETH and XRP)

All of this non-sense is wrapped in an insulting loud and obnoxious format, only hiding a blatant lack of real argumentation.

Bonus point: you seem to spend A LOT of time doing that based on the nb of posts you write and their lenght...

Dude, for instance, you cannot say that mass adoption is the only way up in the market, and st the same time bitch about the fact that  this forum is flooded by new profiles entering the crypto world!  Let them fail, they don't need you.

Trying to have a discussion here. (Tried...?)
So, what is your strategy btw? 100% mining + BTC? Writing a book about curse words?

(Anyway: i still like your writing style, learning new words as a non English native. Thanks for that at least)

First time i read something from that guy i thought we needed a refreshing wind around this way to positive forum. Now after the first sentinces i don't even read the rest. There is nothing in there worth reading if it only contains noob this noob that.
If he wants to warn people or noobs as he calls it then he should back up his claims. Actually i am all ears for possible crashes because there is a lot at stake. But not when it commes from a attention seeking crying Snob who thinks hes better then the lot.

Spoetnic or what ever your nick is, what are you still doing here if it is frustrating you like that. Go outside play some ball or something. Umad BRO?

I don't think the kind of price increase that we see now will be possible in coming years as the market matured, but It worth it to ride the tide. 2025  is 8years time just make sure youinvest into  the right set of project because in coming year before your forecasted year most of these project owuld have failed

Don't you beleive the high market cap ones have the resources to stay in the game? I do.

Read 2212 times since 3 August

before then. Bitcoin halving is in 2020. I think this will be the mother of all pumps.

Maybe, I think adding alts is a bad distinction to make since the vast majority of them will tank at some point. I dont believe they offer the valuation proposition that they currently carry. An idiot can copy paste a coin in half a day and make it worth 10 million.

Agreed.
Diversification is key (albeit not too much).

I personally see the cryptos as a new form of VC.
Both exercises share a lot a similarities:
- you invest more on a team and its capability to execute than the maturity of a product
- you should be ready to lose everything
- 1st movers have a decisive advantage
- deal flow and due diligence are key

That said, cryptos are more fun, bc open to non-accredited investors or funds, go faster (whoohoo + or - 20% per day!!), and your funds are not locked nor under a vesting condition.

In the end, until 2018, ones portfolio should dramatically change if he wants to make profit. Piggyback from one project to another, surf the tulips.

All in all, it a waves worth surfing. At least for the fun and the thrill of it.

Kind of depends which altcoins you have... Most of them are going to crash and burn over next 10 years

Over the next 3 years!!

It can be or cannot be... i am more of a swing trader... feels better to earn on the way

Pressures off when you already made a million :)

Being lucky enough to have enough funds for larger investments has allowed me to make easier gains. Nem at 0.19 and 0.21 has me up nearly 9k today with a 60k buy in. Playing it smart, moving from coin to coin at the right times is key. Cover your losses for future mistakes and research, research, research.

Not everything is gravy, I have Zec at a 28k loss at the moment but my patience has worn out. Would rather chuck what's left into waves, nem, ark etc

hey guys.  How much btc would you say you need right now in order to be millionaire with bitcoin? 

Not exactly, there are so many Altcoins out there, not every Altcoin can grow up, and so does Bitcoin, we can not make sure that Bitcoin price will be high in the far future, all we do is just "predict" and "dream" about the future we want to have.

John McAfee was trolling he said $500,000, but in any case, it is very possible that $10,000 worth right now means a million in 2025. BTC will grow exponentially, it will not be some smooth walk in the park. It will hit the world like a storm, specially when we establish the second layer solutions such as the lightning network, and just wait for sidechains to kick in, it will be crazy the amount of technology that can be used with bitcoin by then.

The market will explode overnight with billions coming daily.

But just to be sure, I would aim to get $100,000 worth of BTC as soon as possible, then it's just guaranteed that you will be rich in 10 years.

$100,000 worth of bitcoins will guarantee that you will be rich in 10 years. That is exactly my opinion

100 grands ONLY in BTC?

There was almost one million accounts created between mine and yours noob.
You also push a confirmed scam with a sig campaign.
You also had literally nothing to contribute to the topic at hand.

Your opinion of me or anything for that matter is pure dog shit.
So good luck with your "investment" junior.

Oh and see any Legendary accounts agreeing with the topic title?
No?
Hmm I wonder why.. But do you?

I hope it's true.  That would be a hundred fold increase - quite a bit from this point.

I think it's possible though, not out of the realms of possibility.

Well if we should beleive that you are a "legendary" poster then we can assume we shouldn't trust anything you say for the same reason.. so there's that.

I think $10k today could foreseeably turn into $1 million in ten years.  It would take a 77% compound interest rate over the course of 8 years.  Very doable but I wouldn't count on it, lol.

Also if you want to take crypto seriously you should file tax reports every year. I beleive it is 30% in my country so that mil is gonna have to wait a bit longer i think :-)

I was a legend before I got the forum rank.
Did you have anything to say about the topic though noob?
So yeah.. There's that :D

Yes that ist the correct timeframe when a major clean out will happen.  

There are actually a few that will be standing out from the rest in the next 3 years. Those alt coins related to infrastructure may take more time, application wise probably lesser.
However all these will only matter when the masses storm in the cryptocurrencies. It is still a horse race at this point and we can only speculate. If your speculation is correct you may hit a jackpot and timing is crucial.
Everyone is speculating but not everyone is rich right.

So your choices will basically determine where you stand in the next few years. Yes, in the next few years is when the crypto currency community will mature (we just past newborn category imo).
Decisions, pov's of a matured community will be less riskier and will go for a solid project. Therefore those projects will good roadmap will survive. But i am not sure of all the others.
What you hold now is very crucial as the price of bitcoin will skyrocket further making the holdings lesser and lesser. With lesser bitcoins in hand, your decision may backfire if you make the wrong choices.
Therefore keep studying the coins you are investing in. 

I will be very happy if this is true, but unfortunately you are comparing apple to orange.

I'm quite confident too that in 5 years from now 10 000$ worth of crypto can lead to a million. However, the hardest part will be fluctuation.

Ex: Next boom value go up to 100 000$, then drop to 40 000$ --->>Panic will get many sell here.

Depends which Bitcoin alternative over 90% will fall on the wayside.
Once upon a time Terracoin, Peercoin (revolutionary first pos), Worldcoin, CHNCoin, Auroracoin............ where top coins, modern top coins are no different.
With everything and anything, what is it backed by?

Inside on 5 years i dont think so that we would able to reach such heights and its really high too consider and not realistic at all but possibilities are always there since we wont really know on what would be the potential price of bitcoin on upcoming years to come to us. We would really able to witness its progress as the time goes by and hopefully it would progress even more and we would able to see those numbers.

A x130 increase sounds great, but with x40 I would already be extremely happy  ;D

How the hell would you NOOBS know you just got here.
What is it you think you know about this stuff and economics in general.
Heard of a guy named Greenspan who crashed the entire planets economy by doing no regulations?
Yup we still have mass inflation and plenty of damage done from whole governments to people who lost their homes or savings.

You pajeets are stupid and blind and know fuck all.
You are lining up to sign your name on this topic like idiots.
Chanting buy teh ICO coinz fer the ROI'S cuz we gonna be millionaires!

What gonna play the some card again?
Jesus fucking christ does that clichéd silly ass bullshit retort get old.
Yeah? Like what?
Ethereum itself is a scam dumb fucks so what does that tell you about crypto when it's ranked the no. 1 Altcoin?

Your ponzi pushers..
Spewing idiotic crap to make Bitcoin.
That is all there is to it.

I don't even think that some scammy and useless altcoins will survive for 3 more years. Most of the weak ones will be diminished in the crypto market before 2019. The rest, icluding real funtional coins, will maintain with bitcoin.

From the market cap point of view, it's true that coins still have a lot of room to develop.

The tricky question is which coin will survive in the end? If we make one step wrong, it can be quite a big loss.

Maybe $10k worth of BTC and LTC lol

Not sure about LTC... fork-coins are not the new hype anymore imho.

These people can't forget such silly things. Let's say much people will try their best to collect 10 000$ and invest in bitcoin. Also waiting for 8 year is not hard for such a great profit. As everyone knows, bitcoin price can fall as it can to rise. Now we see good rise but it's not infinitive, maybe we will see shit fall in 1 year or even in some month, it is bitcoin's nature. So I am afraid that some people will read this title and really invest so huge money in btc, maybe they will be luckier and really get a good profit but for me it's really hard task.

I believe that most of the altcoins will not be exist in 2025 and bitcoin was only a try for blockchain system. So expecting something for 2025 for todays cryptocurrencies is very risky. I wouldnt make any so far long term investment in cryptoworld.

That means 100x your money, wich seems unrealistic for the period of time. But 20x sounds very reasonable to me, since coins like Ethereum did it in a year. The results also depends on the percentage of alts and bitcoins you are holding.
If you're willing to hold until 2025, it's unnecessary risk to hold too many alts, since Bitcoin would be enough to give great results.

Yea that is true but first to that happened everybody who dont know about bitcoin need more info abotu bitcoin to use it so btc price can go to  some very big amount because some pupil thinks that they can withdrawal bitcoin,that bitcoin is pyramid scheme and things like that so they dont use it but we need that pupil to make btc price bigger.

2 years ago I would have never thought we would be at over 100b .  It is insane. Here is to the next 100b! :D

If people are able to hold on to their nerves and never sell for a very long time then you could reach those valuations in the future,but my firm belief is that you could make more money riding the wave too,if you are able to invest in good projects then the amount you could make will be incredible and for sure you could make more than that in this time period.

This is an interesting way to look at it. Thank you for posting. :) I think we see bitcoin itself cross the Apple stock mark by 2020. We'll see though it's gonna be a fun 2.5 years or so to get us there :)

Anybody invested in ReCoin? i purchased 700$ but planning to do more. what do u think about investment like this?

Never heard that altcoin name. Purchased a random altcoin for $700 is too big in my opinion, don't invest your money only in 1 altcoin. You can buy another altcoin or bitcoin with the rest of your money

Well you are so right sir! And I think you could have at least 5 million or above. Right now we can see that bitcoin is rosing from above. And probably we could see that the price of bitcoin would probably be 55,000 US dollars. How cool is that? Bitcoin might reach the moon or other planet by that time. But first like to see it on the moon.

I’m not so sure about the millionaire thing but you are right on paper, the only thing is that we do not know how long it is going for bitcoin and other altcoins to reach those values, fortunately for me I’m close to your numbers so I hope you are right so I can earn great profits in the future.

Excuse me?
What in the fuck is a fork coin and what is the new hype noob?
Care to elaborate?
I suspect you know fuck all about LTC..or why it was made in the first place.
By the way pajeets Litecoin has achieved more adoption than any other Altcoin that ever existed.
And..
It was launched fairly unlike the scam coin Ethereum or the ICO inside an ICO scam coins made on the scam coin cloning platform.

But BTC and LTC I'd say even that would be a stretch.

Let's get real here for a minute.
Any pajeet showing up here now during the scammy ICO craze and buying 10 grand of shitcoins then sitting on them until 2025 is a fucking idiot.
Read that back to me smart ass's does that sound like a bright idea to you?

dude,

whether you like it, approve it or not, some of the alt coins will gain strength due to affordability. Instead of buying 1 bitcoin they can buy 15-20k NEM and have chances to add more into their portfolio in a year or two when the price increases. Not denying Bitcoins superior status in cryptocurrency but one has to or want to increase their bitcoin stash. how do you exactly increase your btc if you are only investing in btc?

This makes no sense to me, it's like my wifes parents who understand nothing about stocks thinking they are getting a deal on 'cheap stocks' NEM being affordable just means there are tons and tons of them and they will likely never hit the values seen by cryptos with fewer coins. This must be a really misguided motivation to buy NEM when NEM functionally has nothing to offer over some of the more recent platforms.

And bitcoin is divisible. It's almost like if someone took bitcoin and just rebranded it 'satoshis' you would all of sudden be behind buying it because it was affordable.  Satoshis are 10 cents this puppy could run up x1000! The whole thing is nonsense!

Happy to have discovered this feature :-)



Nevertheless, I still can read you when people quote you...  LOL


I agree 100%. Any new entrant investing 10 grands today is stupid, even more during the scammy ICO hype we see now.
It would be a dumb idea to dump fiat grands into such ICOs.
Even more stupid would be to sit on them!

That said, I was referring more about the early investors, who spent cash or got coins by mining when I was referring to the 10 grands limit. But, smart as you are with your legendary level, I am sure you had that figured out.
Maybe I should have written "COULD" instead of should in the title... but again, smart-asses will get it...

Anyway... I admit I missed your FUD a bit. Always makes me laugh :-)
I will get you out of the ignore list.

Yup.. What I was thinking too.
Do these guys not get it or what?
They seem to love leep frogging over the point..
Which is... WHAT the thing in question is.
And whether it will be fair and achieve its goals.. Which should be real world adoption.
Yet they ramble on that someone is going to come and buy them on an exchange and they will make money.. Real money.. There for if they get profit then it's legit and all great.

Look at what guy said..
That is like saying I am hoarding silver because of gold.
Silver is not gold guys :D
And it never will be!
Why is gold worth about $16 a gram CAN right now?
And silver worth 50 cents a gram?
I went in this week and sold some of my gold and the place refused to buy my silver.
They just didn't want it.
Hmm why?
Well.. There is a lot more silver out there and people flogging it.

The profiteers here are stupid selfish greedy immoral corrupt and don't have the faintest clue about economics or basic supply and demand.
Nor do they know anything about crypto.
The scamtards here keep launching thousands of worthless shitcoins and the legendary users here know damn well they are pure bullshit but they are luring in idiots to buy them so this whole shit show just rolls on and on.

An intelligent or even English comment here is rare.
Which speaks volumes to the general public watching all this..
They see a bunch of scammy ass greedy dipshits and will gladly swoop in and take their cash.
It's funny though because you'd think a forum on economics, cryptography and computer programing would attract a smart user base.

But looking at the quote above you can see that is not the case.
Nor is there any age requirments.
Half the idiots lipping me off are stupid children spending mom's money on ICO coins for ROI's while they are off school.

Most of the people here shouldn't even be here.
They contribute nothing of any use.
I have zero respect for the majority of sleezy douches in crypto.

Mmmhhmm you're all going to be millionaires :D

Not sure about a millionaire, but it will somehow work, for sure. I mean when Bitcoin reaches the market cap of Apple, its price will be much higher than it is now.
If in 2010 you would need only $100 dollars in Bitcoin to become a millionaire in less than 10 years, so now the sum of $10k is very likely to reach 100k or even more by 2025.

Coins like DGB, SC, Stratis, NEO, XEM, SYS, BTS, XRP
have been so so exceptional.. no one have thought that these coins will do x50-x70

I'n not so sure about DGB...

I have a cat. Its price about 50$. It is totaly nothing comparing with NYSE, Apple, Cryptomarket and etc.
 ??? is this real that in next year his price will do 100x?

Maybe, if the global cats supply remains limited because their reproduction is controlled (by the SEC), and if EVERYBODY wants a cat because people realize that they have a tremendous value in pest control ...

You dont understand - my cat is true cat. Other cats are just altcats.
So i think price of my cat will rize swiftly  ::)

He he he...
I have a lot of alt cats because they create cats easily. My goal is in the end to have more cats and less altcats...