Bitcoin Forum

Bitcoin => Bitcoin Discussion => Topic started by: Noitev on June 28, 2011, 06:32:37 AM



Title: Keypair cards now available through Bitbills!
Post by: Noitev on June 28, 2011, 06:32:37 AM
The picture is just a prototype. The finished product will have 2 cards (One with just the public key so people can send funds to it on the go. and a public private one to stash.) I have a fairly high level of trust on Bitcoin-OTC (I go by noitev on there too.) My engraver that I used my Bitcoins on should be here soon and its a high end engraver. There's also a small possibility of a business card sized usb drive with a public address on it. put your own wallet in it and send me a btc address to put on the front and you have a usb backup you can send coins to on the go.

http://i55.tinypic.com/s4xvdi.jpg

Big news:
I Work for Bitbills now and im getting the final product ready with him!
Stay tuned!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: peach on June 28, 2011, 06:35:29 AM
Very neat!

So how exactly do you engrave the metal card?


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Anonymous on June 28, 2011, 06:43:04 AM
I want to PREORDER now!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Anonymous on June 28, 2011, 06:44:51 AM
Thats epic. I want one :)


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Oldminer on June 28, 2011, 06:53:55 AM
Man how awesome is that!

Love the ingenuity we see in these forums :)


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on June 28, 2011, 07:08:07 AM
Very neat!

So how exactly do you engrave the metal card?

with an engraver

to everyone else, thanks for the support, found a good way to burn my bitcoin money I made, happy I bought at 2 hehe.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: gigabytecoin on June 28, 2011, 07:27:45 AM
STOP THE PRESSES.

TAKE MY MONEY.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Garrett Burgwardt on June 28, 2011, 07:34:38 AM
http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/14604016/images/1302918014522.jpg


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Sannyasi on June 28, 2011, 07:45:28 AM
i'll grab one up too- that usb device sounds even nicer, though not quite as convenient.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on June 28, 2011, 07:47:20 AM
i'll grab one up too- that usb device sounds even nicer, though not quite as convenient.

It's an experiment, and I LOVE dealing with chinese wholesalers

Ill keep you posted guys, nice to know there such a demand lol. it should be here in at most a week.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Anonymous on June 28, 2011, 08:19:38 AM
I am willing to invest in this if you need financing to buy a large enough order, which would be very justified. Look at Bitbills.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on June 28, 2011, 08:36:00 AM
I am willing to invest in this if you need financing to buy a large enough order, which would be very justified. Look at Bitbills.

Oh golly, I appreciate the offer, but I had like 320 coins I got when they were very cheap, I'm using that.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Isepick on June 28, 2011, 11:19:56 AM
Oh my, this is going to be huge. Imagine using these with a smartphone app or (much later) even a P.O.S. solution. Most modern barcode scanners could easily handle the QR codes. This is a very elegant solution that a lot of mainstream people can wrap their head around. Scan card, spend money in your account. Existing PCI-DSS rules could easily handle loading a private key into memory and then securely erasing it once it is no longer needed for the transaction. Now, if we just had a way where someone didn't need to wait 10+ minutes for confirmations after they've made their purchase we could make some pretty large steps forward in mainstream adoption.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: frycicle on June 28, 2011, 02:44:40 PM
I want one too!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on June 28, 2011, 10:48:16 PM
I have an exciting update in the near future!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: spruce on June 28, 2011, 10:54:44 PM
I guess you could make (public key) QR-code earrings or necklaces or bracelets too. :)

Love the card idea!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on June 28, 2011, 10:55:28 PM
I guess you could make QR-code earrings or necklaces or bracelets too. :)

Love the card idea!

I'm sure custom anything with a metal or plastic base is possible.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: enmaku on June 28, 2011, 10:58:50 PM
WANT.

Please add me to your list of prospective customers good sir, and do let us know when your services become available!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: SgtSpike on June 28, 2011, 11:02:09 PM
I have to say the metal engraving is a nice touch, but wouldn't a laminated card (like a credit card) work just as well and be a lot cheaper?

How much will you be selling these for anyway?


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: benjamindees on June 28, 2011, 11:11:50 PM
So, lemme get this straight.  Your customers have to trust you with their private key?


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: SgtSpike on June 28, 2011, 11:19:56 PM
So, lemme get this straight.  Your customers have to trust you with their private key?
Or just the bitcoin address, if all they want is the reference card.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: enmaku on June 28, 2011, 11:22:20 PM
I have to say the metal engraving is a nice touch, but wouldn't a laminated card (like a credit card) work just as well and be a lot cheaper?

I like these for the same reason we began our civilization with gold and silver currencies: durability. Metal engraved cards will work exactly the same as laminated cards, but will likely last much longer.

Other things I'd like to see along these lines:

  • Punch the QR code all the way through thus creating metal bitcoin punchcards, for maximum durability and a retro look/feel
  • QR codes engraved onto round metal blanks - actual bitCOINS
  • Bitcoin QR code jewelry?
  • Forget the card/bill/coin form factor (it's so 20th century), bleed the QR codes all the way to the edge and make tiny rectangular metal currency - I'm imagining gold-pressed latinum for some reason
  • For the incredibly wealthy, take my QR coin idea and do it with actual gold or silver - combining a physical AND digital commodity

The possibilities are endless!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: nazgulnarsil on June 28, 2011, 11:40:06 PM
Do want.

don't trust anyone with a private code, but a reference card would be neat.  Any ideas on price (ballpark, under $20?)


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: spruce on June 28, 2011, 11:43:55 PM
For a savings wallet QR code you could also have it tattooed on.

Since you have to really spend it all once it's been opened, thus rendering the tat non-functional, that would be a good incentive not to spend it!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: LightRider on June 29, 2011, 12:01:06 AM
Really interesting. An upgrade from the bitbill concept in my opinion.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: SgtSpike on June 29, 2011, 12:23:14 AM
For a savings wallet QR code you could also have it tattooed on.

Since you have to really spend it all once it's been opened, thus rendering the tat non-functional, that would be a good incentive not to spend it!
Why would you have to spend it all once it's been opened?

Just tattoo your bitcoin address, then anyone can scan your skin to send money to you!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: FuzzyCoins on June 29, 2011, 12:27:51 AM
If this is a cute way of publishing your public address as a way to receive BTC then it is cute, maybe even classy.

If it is supposed to be a way to send money, then it is useless (or at least insecure). If the private key is printed on it (as a set of numbers or QR code or whatever) then all I have to do to steal the BTC is look at it, maybe even from a distance. I can use a camera with a telephoto lens and take a picture of you holding your card. As soon as I do this I can spend your BTC.

If you give me one of these as payments for something, I have to run the transaction then and there to make sure the BTC hasn't already been spent. It is not a way to perform a BTC transaction offline. It is not a way to securely hold BTC.

I suppose you can take the private card and keep it out of sight (literally), but why put it on a wallet size card if you aren't going to carry it around?


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: spruce on June 29, 2011, 12:38:34 AM
For a savings wallet QR code you could also have it tattooed on.

Since you have to really spend it all once it's been opened, thus rendering the tat non-functional, that would be a good incentive not to spend it!
Why would you have to spend it all once it's been opened?

Just tattoo your bitcoin address, then anyone can scan your skin to send money to you!

I would do it for safety. I guess it depends what software with what security is available at the time it happens. I like the idea of "one-time" savings wallets that you can send to as often as you want but then only expose the private key once. If you're happy with your crypto-nerd powers then it's probably not necessary, but being a crypto-weeny myself I'll settle for something like Casascius's paper wallet key-pairs, rather than having to deal with the change into a new address and so forth.

I don't mind dealing with a small day-to-day spending wallet client on my regular computer, but a savings wallet and arcane (for me) crypto precautions? Nope, sorry.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: phorensic on June 29, 2011, 01:12:28 AM
Noitev, how much acid were you on when you made your signature?


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Ryland R. Taylor-Almanza on June 29, 2011, 01:19:39 AM
I can't wait for you to start selling these!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Kermee on June 29, 2011, 01:26:11 AM
Would purchase at least two.  What a wonderful way of 're-investing' into BTC's future with your earnings.

Cheers,
Kermee


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: jonathan on June 29, 2011, 01:41:46 AM
aww, sweet!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: SgtSpike on June 29, 2011, 02:51:28 AM
For a savings wallet QR code you could also have it tattooed on.

Since you have to really spend it all once it's been opened, thus rendering the tat non-functional, that would be a good incentive not to spend it!
Why would you have to spend it all once it's been opened?

Just tattoo your bitcoin address, then anyone can scan your skin to send money to you!

I would do it for safety. I guess it depends what software with what security is available at the time it happens. I like the idea of "one-time" savings wallets that you can send to as often as you want but then only expose the private key once. If you're happy with your crypto-nerd powers then it's probably not necessary, but being a crypto-weeny myself I'll settle for something like Casascius's paper wallet key-pairs, rather than having to deal with the change into a new address and so forth.

I don't mind dealing with a small day-to-day spending wallet client on my regular computer, but a savings wallet and arcane (for me) crypto precautions? Nope, sorry.
I still don't get it.

You'd never have to expose any private keys (beyond having them in your wallet).  Just pick an address that your wallet generates, then make a QR code out of it and use that for a tattoo.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on June 29, 2011, 03:30:20 AM
Noitev, how much acid were you on when you made your signature?

obviously not enough.

Don hertzfeldt is amazing



Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on June 29, 2011, 04:09:18 AM
For a savings wallet QR code you could also have it tattooed on.

Since you have to really spend it all once it's been opened, thus rendering the tat non-functional, that would be a good incentive not to spend it!
Why would you have to spend it all once it's been opened?

Just tattoo your bitcoin address, then anyone can scan your skin to send money to you!

I would do it for safety. I guess it depends what software with what security is available at the time it happens. I like the idea of "one-time" savings wallets that you can send to as often as you want but then only expose the private key once. If you're happy with your crypto-nerd powers then it's probably not necessary, but being a crypto-weeny myself I'll settle for something like Casascius's paper wallet key-pairs, rather than having to deal with the change into a new address and so forth.

I don't mind dealing with a small day-to-day spending wallet client on my regular computer, but a savings wallet and arcane (for me) crypto precautions? Nope, sorry.
I still don't get it.

You'd never have to expose any private keys (beyond having them in your wallet).  Just pick an address that your wallet generates, then make a QR code out of it and use that for a tattoo.

I think the biggest problem, especially after the recent theft of 25k btc, is that people dont trust their computers, the pairs help because they wont be linked to a computer and so any funds on them are safe until redeemed, I suppose you need to trust I won't hijack it, but I've been in btc for a while and really have no interest in theft and want to see btc take off. I got scammed out of 120 btc when they cost less and really dont want to see that happen. all of the keypairs will be made offline and deleted.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: SgtSpike on June 29, 2011, 04:20:41 AM
For a savings wallet QR code you could also have it tattooed on.

Since you have to really spend it all once it's been opened, thus rendering the tat non-functional, that would be a good incentive not to spend it!
Why would you have to spend it all once it's been opened?

Just tattoo your bitcoin address, then anyone can scan your skin to send money to you!

I would do it for safety. I guess it depends what software with what security is available at the time it happens. I like the idea of "one-time" savings wallets that you can send to as often as you want but then only expose the private key once. If you're happy with your crypto-nerd powers then it's probably not necessary, but being a crypto-weeny myself I'll settle for something like Casascius's paper wallet key-pairs, rather than having to deal with the change into a new address and so forth.

I don't mind dealing with a small day-to-day spending wallet client on my regular computer, but a savings wallet and arcane (for me) crypto precautions? Nope, sorry.
I still don't get it.

You'd never have to expose any private keys (beyond having them in your wallet).  Just pick an address that your wallet generates, then make a QR code out of it and use that for a tattoo.

I think the biggest problem, especially after the recent theft of 25k btc, is that people dont trust their computers, the pairs help because they wont be linked to a computer and so any funds on them are safe until redeemed, I suppose you need to trust I won't hijack it, but I've been in btc for a while and really have no interest in theft and want to see btc take off. I got scammed out of 120 btc when they cost less and really dont want to see that happen. all of the keypairs will be made offline and deleted.
True enough.  I suppose it's easier to trust a single person than trust that your computer will be safe from hax forever.

I do like the metal engraving idea, I just think it might be too expensive for most people.  But I'm anxious to see how they turn out.  :)


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on June 29, 2011, 04:40:19 AM
For a savings wallet QR code you could also have it tattooed on.

Since you have to really spend it all once it's been opened, thus rendering the tat non-functional, that would be a good incentive not to spend it!
Why would you have to spend it all once it's been opened?

Just tattoo your bitcoin address, then anyone can scan your skin to send money to you!

I would do it for safety. I guess it depends what software with what security is available at the time it happens. I like the idea of "one-time" savings wallets that you can send to as often as you want but then only expose the private key once. If you're happy with your crypto-nerd powers then it's probably not necessary, but being a crypto-weeny myself I'll settle for something like Casascius's paper wallet key-pairs, rather than having to deal with the change into a new address and so forth.

I don't mind dealing with a small day-to-day spending wallet client on my regular computer, but a savings wallet and arcane (for me) crypto precautions? Nope, sorry.
I still don't get it.

You'd never have to expose any private keys (beyond having them in your wallet).  Just pick an address that your wallet generates, then make a QR code out of it and use that for a tattoo.

I think the biggest problem, especially after the recent theft of 25k btc, is that people dont trust their computers, the pairs help because they wont be linked to a computer and so any funds on them are safe until redeemed, I suppose you need to trust I won't hijack it, but I've been in btc for a while and really have no interest in theft and want to see btc take off. I got scammed out of 120 btc when they cost less and really dont want to see that happen. all of the keypairs will be made offline and deleted.
True enough.  I suppose it's easier to trust a single person than trust that your computer will be safe from hax forever.

I do like the metal engraving idea, I just think it might be too expensive for most people.  But I'm anxious to see how they turn out.  :)

It really shouldn't cost too much


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: phillipsjk on June 29, 2011, 05:28:39 AM
Would the wax or plastic over the private key be tamper-evident? What happens when I shine infra-red light on it?

I think the engraving would be too durable and clear to securely store the private key.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: netrin on June 29, 2011, 05:44:11 AM
I still don't get it.

You'd never have to expose any private keys (beyond having them in your wallet).  Just pick an address that your wallet generates, then make a QR code out of it and use that for a tattoo.

It would be nice if our wallets were separated individually into the addresses and the private keys in digital form. The OP is engraving the private key (minimal wallet), hidden under tamper-evident gunk, with a lovely address line in plaintext and luxurious QR.

(I pondered similar ideas for Father's Day, but...)

Why?


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on June 29, 2011, 05:49:43 AM
Would the wax or plastic over the private key be tamper-evident? What happens when I shine infra-red light on it?

I think the engraving would be too durable and clear to securely store the private key.


I think you guys are missing the message.

The picture is a prototype, the finished product will have 2 linked cards. 1 public and a separate card that's private.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: enmaku on June 29, 2011, 05:59:32 PM
If you're keeping a list or something of interested customers, add me to it :)


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: phillipsjk on June 30, 2011, 05:08:14 AM
This may be of use in Point-Of-Sale applications: Public address is pasted on counter, private key is kept in a safe and emptied out every night.

The ~10 minute delay for confirmations may be awkward though.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: cypherdoc on June 30, 2011, 05:26:19 AM
i don't get it.  why wouldn't FirstBits be better?


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: amincd on June 30, 2011, 05:44:14 AM
This is awesome!

Quote from: phillipsjk
The ~10 minute delay for confirmations may be awkward though

I don't think you need to actually wait for any confirmations for transactions that don't involve large transfers of value. It's only for cases where you think the person has the computational means to pull off a double spend attack that you would need some confirmations to be sure the transaction won't be reversed.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: phillipsjk on June 30, 2011, 05:53:14 AM
Yes, but if strangers are using their own untrusted smartphones for making the payment, I as a merchant would want to make sure the transaction is at least broadcasted.

I didn't really think my objection through anyway: the merchant also needs some way to know whom just broadcasted a payment as well. One way is to give each individual their own address, which would not work in this case. Could still work as a "drop box" for a bitcoin cash register though.

Edit: "Drop box" opens door to disgruntled employee scanning their own address. Better to have the bitcoin register just "know" the "drop box" address.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: amincd on June 30, 2011, 06:26:01 AM
You are notified that it has been broadcasted immediately, as the incoming transaction shows up on your client as unconfirmed. Your client then broadcasts to the rest of the network. The risk is that the stranger then immediately spends the same bitcoins again, and that subsequent spend becomes confirmed, while the ones you thought you received are not transferred to you. I believe that if the first transaction has a head start on the second one though, the chance that the second one will end up as the confirmed one is very low.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on June 30, 2011, 01:58:16 PM
i don't get it.  why wouldn't FirstBits be better?

Because its entirely offline. This is more to secure coins from computer hacking, etc.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on July 01, 2011, 04:07:40 AM
The engraver should be here tomorrow and I have 14 Gold metal USB drive business card I'm gonna test it on befire doing anything else, once i try one, i'll sell it to you with anything you want, whether it be a qr code, design, etc for 2btc. capactiy is 1gb


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: SgtSpike on July 01, 2011, 04:23:32 AM
Clarification:  Is that for two cards (one with private key and one with bitcoin address) or just one?


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Ryland R. Taylor-Almanza on July 01, 2011, 04:28:48 AM
Awesome! I can't wait!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on July 01, 2011, 06:43:17 AM
Clarification:  Is that for two cards (one with private key and one with bitcoin address) or just one?

This is a special release. you get 1 card witha n address alreay on your wallet engraved, or whatever else really on a gold metal credit card shaped usb drive with 1 gb capacity


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: SgtSpike on July 01, 2011, 07:43:02 AM
Clarification:  Is that for two cards (one with private key and one with bitcoin address) or just one?

This is a special release. you get 1 card witha n address alreay on your wallet engraved, or whatever else really on a gold metal credit card shaped usb drive with 1 gb capacity
DEFINITELY count me in for one then!

Thanks!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: bcearl on July 01, 2011, 08:13:36 AM
How do I know that my engraved key pair is secret?

I will stay with pen and paper (I wouldn't even trust a printer that much!).


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Ryland R. Taylor-Almanza on July 01, 2011, 01:42:08 PM
Clarification:  Is that for two cards (one with private key and one with bitcoin address) or just one?

This is a special release. you get 1 card witha n address alreay on your wallet engraved, or whatever else really on a gold metal credit card shaped usb drive with 1 gb capacity
Wait, gold? You mean it's colored gold, right? Not actual gold?


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Trader Steve on July 01, 2011, 01:53:22 PM
Looking forward to see how they turn out!


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Sandoz on July 01, 2011, 03:50:12 PM
I love the idea and will definitely order a set BUT there is something I don't understand:

1) The intended use is for an off-the-internet life savings account, right?
2) But as you potentially have the keys for that I cannot trust it to hold my life savings (nothing against you, I think it's just a common sense precaution)

If I got that wrong and it's just for holding a few bucks, then it's more for showing off and probably don't need the private key card as you often use the account anyways..


Is there some safe way you could create those cards without you keeping the private key? Maybe provide you with an encrypted version you would then engrave?

Just wondering.. I want that set, but I also want it to have real practical use


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: phillipsjk on July 01, 2011, 04:04:33 PM
How do I know that my engraved key pair is secret?

I will stay with pen and paper (I wouldn't even trust a printer that much!).

I trust all my printers with less than 1 MB or memory :)


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: cypherdoc on July 01, 2011, 04:07:04 PM
i already have a secure key pair.

i suppose i could just order the public key half for my card?


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on July 01, 2011, 09:05:02 PM
i already have a secure key pair.

i suppose i could just order the public key half for my card?

to clarify

SOON I will have 2 cards, 1 private one public

This is a limited release since people asked for cards with just an address already on their wallets.

I got a shipment of gold colored credit card sized usb drives with 1gb capacity.

you send me an address or a design and ill engrave it. this is just a demo to see how the engraver works, honestly idk how well they will engrave on these cards but we'll see


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Sandoz on July 02, 2011, 06:34:25 AM
Just a question: how easily can the QR codes be scanned if they are etched and appear white (instead of a high-contrast black and white)?

I tried to scan the QR on the photo of your prototype but the QR apps I usually use would not recognize it...


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: bcearl on July 02, 2011, 02:24:57 PM
How do I know that my engraved key pair is secret?

I will stay with pen and paper (I wouldn't even trust a printer that much!).

I trust all my printers with less than 1 MB or memory :)

And what about the printing job scheduler? Does it store the document somewhere? You cannot be sure, pen and paper is easy and fine.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Sandoz on July 02, 2011, 10:04:51 PM
How do I know that my engraved key pair is secret?

I will stay with pen and paper (I wouldn't even trust a printer that much!).

I trust all my printers with less than 1 MB or memory :)

And what about the printing job scheduler? Does it store the document somewhere? You cannot be sure, pen and paper is easy and fine.

I guess the solution is to encrypt a wallet with GPG and have that engraved. That gives Noitev an encrypted code he won't be able to do anything with.

Now: does anyone know whether a newly generated wallet is small enough to fit on a QR code when encrypted with GPG? See http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=16266.0 for how to generate a printable and encrypted wallet with GPG, which is what I use as a reference due to the simplicity...


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: TheBitMan on July 02, 2011, 11:22:34 PM
I have that mouse 8)
I also needed to post because this is interesting and I want the updates :)


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: done on July 02, 2011, 11:58:25 PM
Very nice


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: phillipsjk on July 03, 2011, 12:23:33 AM
And what about the printing job scheduler? Does it store the document somewhere? You cannot be sure, pen and paper is easy and fine.

If I was going to print them, I would probably boot from read-only media on a machine without network connectivity. My statement about less than 1MB of memory implies the printer does not have network connectivity either.

For the dot-matrix, there is the possibility of lifting the image from the ribbon, but it gets recycled/reused within minutes. A Laser printer may have a similar problem with the drum, but those tend to have over a MB of memory anyway.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: gigabytecoin on July 03, 2011, 12:46:00 AM
Is the "engraving" already rubbing off a bit on the cards?

See the left side of the card in your picture... looks like it's fading or something already? (And it's brand new I can only assume).


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: flower1024 on July 03, 2011, 09:10:25 AM
forprivate key security you could use am small chip on the card which needs some kind of pin (with self destruction ;).

so we have to possibility to name you a few recipient adresses and write our wallet+pin to the card ourselves.

(ok in the wild we would need some kind of terminal to do the actual payment)

i love your idea ;)


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: bcearl on July 03, 2011, 09:15:10 AM
And what about the printing job scheduler? Does it store the document somewhere? You cannot be sure, pen and paper is easy and fine.

If I was going to print them, I would probably boot from read-only media on a machine without network connectivity. My statement about less than 1MB of memory implies the printer does not have network connectivity either.

For the dot-matrix, there is the possibility of lifting the image from the ribbon, but it gets recycled/reused within minutes. A Laser printer may have a similar problem with the drum, but those tend to have over a MB of memory anyway.


I would use a printer in principle, if I knew a printer as good as you seem to do. But I don't know any printer good enough to trust it.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on July 05, 2011, 08:51:14 AM
Well I was hoping it would come friday, due to weekend and holidays it'll be tomorrow hopefully.

To address concerns.

It does not do and dot matrix or inking, It runs on vectors and as such, the engraver has no real physical observations to get codes. I'll do the engraving offline on a different computer than my main machine. It probably doesn't have a terribly high on board memory. It's possible its fed via usb and would have no on board memory. If not I'll do everything in reason to assure you the codes are safe. If you can tell me a way to wipe any cache I'd be happy. This solution is made so that you don't have to worry about the sent coins. You can send me anything to be engraved. If I make a private public keypair, I can personally assure you that you can trust me and I'll happily use references on the forums that have personally met me if you have any concerns. Feel free to encrypt info should you want to send me personalized info. I'm here to serve you so you can get engraving done without anyone other than a single user on the forum.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on July 05, 2011, 09:10:32 AM
Is the "engraving" already rubbing off a bit on the cards?

See the left side of the card in your picture... looks like it's fading or something already? (And it's brand new I can only assume).

Yeah, I noticed that too. That was laser engraved not rotary engraved. I didn't burn all the way through and I was able to was it down to a scannable code. My engraver is a rotary engraver and shouldn't have that issue. Additionally the private key scanned well.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: eugene2k on July 05, 2011, 01:21:49 PM
So... this thread got my imagination running...

Not so far future... You get notified that your uncle you didn't even know about died and your presence is required for reading of his will. You soon find out that your uncle was one rich bastard but all he left you was a small diamond. So you decide to see how much the diamond is worth and take it to a specialist. While looking at the diamond the specialist notices there is an engraving on one of the sides of the diamond. Looking closely you realize it must be a QR code. The QR code is your uncles private key for his wallet containing hundreds of thousands of bitcoins. All in a small diamond :)


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Ryland R. Taylor-Almanza on July 05, 2011, 01:44:11 PM
So... this thread got my imagination running...

Not so far future... You get notified that your uncle you didn't even know about died and your presence is required for reading of his will. You soon find out that your uncle was one rich bastard but all he left you was a small diamond. So you decide to see how much the diamond is worth and take it to a specialist. While looking at the diamond the specialist notices there is an engraving on one of the sides of the diamond. Looking closely you realize it must be a QR code. The QR code is your uncles private key for his wallet containing hundreds of thousands of bitcoins. All in a small diamond :)
I'll be right back. I'm going to the grocery store to buy a small diamond.


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: eugene2k on July 05, 2011, 03:20:58 PM
I've already found one for you. No need to go anywhere.
http://www.bluenile.com/emerald-diamond-1-carat-or-less-good-cut-g-color-if-clarity_ld01435822?rf=pd


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on July 06, 2011, 11:57:55 AM
Well the engraver is here and anyone who can pm me or respond fast enough can get a cool little plastic card with a public key or whatever including whatever designs you want, on it shipped for 1 btc. only 1 person though for now, getting it all set up


Title: Re: Metal Engraved Keypair Cards! Coming soon!
Post by: Noitev on July 06, 2011, 12:02:31 PM
Well the engraver is here and anyone who can pm me or respond fast enough can get a cool little plastic card with a public key or whatever including whatever designs you want, on it shipped for 1 btc. only 1 person though for now, getting it all set up

dimensions are 75x50mm and a public key qr code should be very scannable and nice as it will be a white bg with black engravings on acrylic


Title: Re: Custom engraved stuff!
Post by: Noitev on July 06, 2011, 12:58:21 PM
it seems no one is awake, maybe later


Title: Re: Keypair cards now available through Bitbills!
Post by: Noitev on July 09, 2011, 09:11:07 AM
update!