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Title: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: mizike29 on July 09, 2011, 04:29:30 AM I have done some bitcoin sales using ebay and forums. I have this one person that continues to buy them over market value, about 3 bux over MTGOX sell prices. I am wondering why would someone choose that over just getting them for cheaper at MTGOX, unless someone was using it for illegal items and paid more to not have there bank account or anything linked? OR AM I JUST BEING PARANOID? Please any other reasons make sense?
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: MoonShadow on July 09, 2011, 04:33:53 AM If you are being paid in paypal or credit cards, you should be paranoid. If the transactions were local, and he was paying in cash, or otherwise couldn't get funds into MtGox (not easy, I can't do it either) and was otherwise unwilling to wait for the post to make it to one of the cash in the mail dealers, they'd be as legit as any others.
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: GeniuSxBoY on July 09, 2011, 04:43:53 AM He's paying face value + ebay fees + paypal fees.
I dunno why. I dunno why people do a lot of things they do. For instance: Someone asked me how long our footlong subs were. :facepalm: The obvious follow up question was how big was half? :double facepalm: Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: geek-trader on July 09, 2011, 04:54:18 AM He's paying face value + ebay fees + paypal fees. Because he wants to pay with a credit card, so his options are limited. And he's not paying ebay OR paypal fees, you are. Seller pays fees, not buyer. Of course, you factored that into the "$3 over MtGox" and he knows it. Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: mizike29 on July 09, 2011, 05:08:48 AM No because I charge him 3 bux or more per bitcoin, theres no paypal fees or ebay fees, its sent via paypal as a gift just to my email paypal, and that withdrawls to my bank for free. So its 3 to 4 dollars profit per coin, easily and only charged the small bitcoin fee for speedy delivery. It just makes no sense to me if you could do that, why you wouldnt trade through bitmarket.eu for paypal, or link bank to MTGOX/DWOLLA and buy all you want at lower prices.
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: phillipsjk on July 09, 2011, 05:10:44 AM Wire Transfers cost over $50. For smaller in-person transactions, it may be totally worth paying a slight premium. I don't trust Paypal or credit card companies though.
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: The_JMiner on July 09, 2011, 05:13:46 AM He can reverse the payment up to 120 days after, I "Heard" (rumor) that if they send it as a donation or a gift it can not be reversed.
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: phillipsjk on July 09, 2011, 05:19:56 AM I read in another thread that the "gift" can be reversed by sending the payment using the TOR network, then complaining to ebay the transaction was unauthorized.
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: Stephen Gornick on July 09, 2011, 05:58:14 AM I "Heard" (rumor) that if they send it as a donation or a gift it can not be reversed. Quote It is thus strongly recommended to avoid using PayPal for bitcoin transactions. - http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/Using_bitcoin-otc#Notes_on_chargebacksTitle: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: error on July 09, 2011, 06:23:13 AM A $3 premium for accepting a high-risk payment such as PayPal isn't unreasonable.
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: mizike29 on July 10, 2011, 03:44:34 PM I guess I have just been lucky so far using paypal, Yes the gift is tough to freaking reverse, most people are not using tor and saying there account was hijacked, sending multiple gifts at different times. Regular ebay sales, they could do that once but after that they would be banned. Yeah maybe saving money on wire transfers or something. Paypal has been fine and free for all my transactions using the gift method, so I am going to keep rolling with that for now lol 3 bux profit per coin is not much but it starts to add up in the 100 coin range.
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: koin on July 11, 2011, 04:20:54 AM Paypal has been fine and free for all my transactions using the gift method, so I am going to keep rolling with that for now lol as long as you are still selling, there's a disincentive for your buyer to start initiating the chargebacks. as soon as you no longer are selling, that's when it is time to get nervous. it's your call, though. best of luck to you with that. Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: CurbsideProphet on July 11, 2011, 04:33:38 AM If it looks too good to be true...
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: TiagoTiago on July 11, 2011, 04:36:55 AM Replying to the question in the title: perhaps they are trying to manipulate the market and increase the value of the coins they hoarded ?
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: mizike29 on July 11, 2011, 01:46:46 PM Yeh I think it would be tough or impossible to retract gift payments, but possible. Thats why I thought about after this week, making sure all the money is pulled out of paypal into my bank then remove my bank information from paypal and set up a new account. The ones on ebay can not be retracted as positive feedback has already been made on all my ebay sales for bitcoin showing coins received so those are not an issue, and I understood paying higher going through ebay, but if only through paypal, then the user might as well just go through MTGOX, unless you wanted to remain anonymous which is the feeling I am getting from this guy lol
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: TraderTimm on July 11, 2011, 04:07:15 PM I have done some bitcoin sales using ebay and forums. I have this one person that continues to buy them over market value, about 3 bux over MTGOX sell prices. I am wondering why would someone choose that over just getting them for cheaper at MTGOX, unless someone was using it for illegal items and paid more to not have there bank account or anything linked? OR AM I JUST BEING PARANOID? Please any other reasons make sense? The answer is, most people are insufferably dense. I'd peg that number to about 80%, give or take. They'll take the most impulsive, ill-reckoned, emotional and haphazard plunges into things that would make a sane person stop and stare in disbelief. And then, they'll do it again. Just the way things are, I'm afraid... Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: kokojie on July 11, 2011, 04:38:35 PM If he's using paypal, he WILL get his money back if he initiate a dispute. A lot of paypal transactions are later reversed by the buyer, it's like a 100% no risk way of getting free money.
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: imperi on July 11, 2011, 04:42:48 PM If he's using paypal, he WILL get his money back if he initiate a dispute. A lot of paypal transactions are later reversed by the buyer, it's like a 100% no risk way of getting free money. This isn't true. I used to sell software over PayPal, and the buyer doesn't get the money back by default. The PayPal side reviews the case first. Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: Stephen Gornick on July 11, 2011, 06:48:12 PM I used to sell software over PayPal, and the buyer doesn't get the money back by default. The PayPal side reviews the case first. Apples to oranges. Selling software for PayPal payments is not against PayPal's Acceptable Use Policy. Selling bitcoin for PayPal payment IS against PayPal's Acceptable Use Policy. Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: mizike29 on July 12, 2011, 12:06:58 AM Not sure its against paypal policies, because its given as a gift, thats the way to stay the best protected I believe. So far so good. Ebay is another story, but ebay reviews feedback from a user then using just paypal as gift for payment has worked for me so far. Most of my transations have been through paypal, I have to really search or go just with forum requests to use dwolla, but would be better for sure.
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: Alex Beckenham on July 12, 2011, 12:13:53 AM If he's using paypal, he WILL get his money back if he initiate a dispute. A lot of paypal transactions are later reversed by the buyer, it's like a 100% no risk way of getting free money. This isn't true. I used to sell software over PayPal, and the buyer doesn't get the money back by default. The PayPal side reviews the case first. I initiated a dispute after being scammed here and PayPal said they couldn't return my money because the goods were 'virtual or intangible'. So even as a buyer, it's a huge risk buying with PayPal. (unless the bitcoins come to you first of course) Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: Alex Beckenham on July 12, 2011, 12:19:01 AM Here it is:
Quote Dear ........, We have concluded our investigation into your case: Case ID: PP-001-341-457-483 Transaction Date: 14 Jun 2011 Transaction Amount: -$150.00 USD Seller's Email: dsloco12@yahoo.com Seller's Name: richard francis Unfortunately, we were unable to resolve this claim in your favour because the item purchased was virtual or intangible. As a result, we have not taken any action against the seller at this time but we have noted your dissatisfaction in the seller's record for future reference. If you still have concerns about this transaction, we encourage you to continue to work directly with the seller for an amicable resolution. Sincerely, Shannon Protection Services Department Please do not reply to this email. This mailbox is not monitored and you will not receive a response. For assistance, log in to your PayPal account and click the Help link in the top right corner of any PayPal page. So a) steer clear of richard francis and b) note in bold how They never once asked me to send supporting documents, of which I could have sent a lot of evidence it was a scam. Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: kingbc on July 12, 2011, 12:57:40 AM to buy drugs asap
Title: Re: Why would someone continue to buy bitcoins over market value? Post by: mizike29 on July 18, 2011, 04:12:18 PM Yeah I am pretty sure he is using it for drugs just from some references he has made, and silk road, needing them for this weekend, wife being gone for 10 days time to party etc lol. So far I have had no issues with using paypal to sell my bitcoins. No chargebacks, the fees are nothing because I have them choose gift after the first sale to the user, they send the money first, and I am withdrawing the money to my bank account just in case if one claim is filed I will immediately close my paypal account and start over. So far has not been an issue, and I am glad to have buyers at 16 to 17 a coin considering it is down to 13 a coin now.
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