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Title: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 21, 2011, 07:11:40 PM ProBiWon.com
The principle is similar to famous bitcoin darts, just used a different target. The main innovation: now you can bet a lot of coins at the same coin acceptor address. The address is reserved for a player within 90 days after last use, so you can add it to your address book. (To play will not need to even open the site) http://probiwon.com/images/target.png The maximum gain 1000%. The game returns 93%.[/s] At the time of testing maximum bet is 15 BTC. If you send more then the bet will be cut to 15 bitcoin. Come and try! No registration is required http://probiwon.com/ Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game Post by: pc on January 21, 2011, 07:26:03 PM Hooray! Just gave it a try, bet 0.05 BTC and hit the 350%! Thanks!
While I really appreciate all the hex at the bottom trying to convince me that the game is fair, I'm not sure what I should do with it (and the same was true for Bitcoin Darts). Can you include on the page what command line I should be passing into openssl (or provide the source to a verification program in some popular language, or whatever) in order to verify the fairness? Otherwise I think we might as well just be trusting you (which works too). Also, you seem to not wait for any confirmations at all before showing the result or before paying the winnings, which is great for playing quick games, but I hope that it doesn't leave you too open to a double-spending attack. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game Post by: bitcoinex on January 21, 2011, 07:46:51 PM Hooray! Just gave it a try, bet 0.05 BTC and hit the 350%! Thanks! Congratulations! :) Quote While I really appreciate all the hex at the bottom trying to convince me that the game is fair, I'm not sure what I should do with it (and the same was true for Bitcoin Darts). Can you include on the page what command line I should be passing into openssl (or provide the source to a verification program in some popular language, or whatever) in order to verify the fairness? Otherwise I think we might as well just be trusting you (which works too). Oh, I am forgot about this! http://probiwon.com/site/index/game/9d62438a-2585-11e0-a627-e395834f75d9 Code: $ echo -ne 8f1388996b1032ed886e2ce7cdd46c4c | xxd -r -p | sha256sum Quote Also, you seem to not wait for any confirmations at all before showing the result or before paying the winnings, which is great for playing quick games, but I hope that it doesn't leave you too open to a double-spending attack. We took care of it Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: Mahkul on January 21, 2011, 08:00:21 PM It is so nice to see something finally happening on the "gambling" field! First Double Trouble and now this. Keep up the good work guys!
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 21, 2011, 08:38:56 PM It is so nice to see something finally happening on the "gambling" field! First Double Trouble and now this. Keep up the good work guys! Thank you Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: FreeMoney on January 22, 2011, 12:30:08 AM It looks and works nice, but my luck is bad! Max bet and off the board! :)
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: Mahkul on January 22, 2011, 12:35:37 AM It looks and works nice, but my luck is bad! Max bet and off the board! :) I had more luck - bet 0.90 and got 13.50 back! Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: FreeMoney on January 22, 2011, 03:56:27 AM I like how fast the throw happens. I'm curious about how it works. Do you count a fixed number of seconds from the time you see the transaction show up to avoid double spends? Could this number be displayed as a countdown? Or are you throwing as soon as you first see the tx?
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: chris200x9 on January 22, 2011, 04:26:36 AM It looks and works nice, but my luck is bad! Max bet and off the board! :) I had more luck - bet 0.90 and got 13.50 back! I made out well too, you got your 5 btc back. Thanks again! Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: ColdHardMetal on January 22, 2011, 05:25:32 AM I sent 0.5 to the acceptor address and all worked fine, other than only getting back 65% lol.
I then sent another 0.5 to the same acceptor address and nothing has happened since. I may have messed it up because I didn't refresh the web page and click the OK next to the "Player's address" box again. However you also say that the site doesn't even need to be open for it to work, so maybe the problem is elsewhere. It's been 3 confirmations since I sent the second 0.5 and the first one happened quite quickly which makes me think that waiting longer isn't going to do much. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: romanoza on January 22, 2011, 07:33:23 AM I sent 0.5 to the acceptor address and all worked fine, other than only getting back 65% lol. I then sent another 0.5 to the same acceptor address and nothing has happened since. I may have messed it up because I didn't refresh the web page and click the OK next to the "Player's address" box again. However you also say that the site doesn't even need to be open for it to work, so maybe the problem is elsewhere. It's been 3 confirmations since I sent the second 0.5 and the first one happened quite quickly which makes me think that waiting longer isn't going to do much. You can go to http://probiwon.com/ and it will show your last game. Also you can copy link from right top and copy it here to show result, if there is something goes wrong you think. http://habreffect.ru/files/e7a/fa5a585ae/screenshot1.png Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: Mahkul on January 22, 2011, 12:07:45 PM It looks and works nice, but my luck is bad! Max bet and off the board! :) I had more luck - bet 0.90 and got 13.50 back! I made out well too, you got your 5 btc back. Thanks again! Hah, thanks. If we keep on doing this we may become millionaires - or homeless. :) Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 22, 2011, 06:29:16 PM Double spend protection are enabled.
Max bet is increased to 15 BTC. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: wobber on January 23, 2011, 10:26:26 AM Can I add daily bets on BitBet for the probability of someone winning 3500% on PROBIWON?
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 23, 2011, 10:41:47 AM Can I add daily bets on BitBet for the probability of someone winning 3500% on PROBIWON? Of course! :) When we did the last test before opening the site, we threw in a row 1500% and 3500% Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 24, 2011, 12:58:19 PM The target was changed!
100% gain ring replaced by 110% and also changed other rings to provide same return 94% For games played earlier probiwon.com now did not shows arrow in the results of shooting because target was changed. Also some users could lose cookies that store his addresses - sorry, please enter your address again. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: fabianhjr on January 24, 2011, 02:26:40 PM A quick question. Could you show some pseudocode of how you handle the bets? Does the acceptor plays any role in the odds? What are the odds of each individual ring?
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 24, 2011, 03:14:51 PM A quick question. Could you show some pseudocode of how you handle the bets? Does the acceptor plays any role in the odds? After creation of a new addresses pair (your address + acceptor address) site generates random secret, shows sha256(secret) to you and waits for your bet. After bet is accepted and game played new random secret generated immediately and site waits bet again. Quote What are the odds of each individual ring? Each ring of various diameters and area, respectively, the different probability of shooting to them. Each ring has a width 0.05 of a target radius. (But 1500% ring and 3500% circle has radius and width 0.025 each.) My calculations of probability for each ring (from center): 0.0019634954 <- 3500% 0.0058904862 <- 1500% 0.0235619449 0.0392699082 0.0549778714 0.0706858347 0.086393798 0.1021017612 0.1178097245 0.1335176878 <- 65% 0.149225651 <- 50% Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: nelisky on January 24, 2011, 03:18:38 PM Major kudos to you, this game is an awesome way of loos^H^H^Hgambling :)
Although, maybe a little rounding is in order? 110.00000000000001% You won 1.10 BTC Your bet 1 BTC Heh Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 24, 2011, 03:32:35 PM Major kudos to you, this game is an awesome way of loos^H^H^Hgambling :) Although, maybe a little rounding is in order? 110.00000000000001% You won 1.10 BTC Your bet 1 BTC Heh This game? http://probiwon.com/site/index/game/0de06f02-27c4-11e0-b63c-6f09a48f663d We will fix it. Thank you! Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: nelisky on January 24, 2011, 03:38:43 PM Major kudos to you, this game is an awesome way of loos^H^H^Hgambling :) Although, maybe a little rounding is in order? 110.00000000000001% You won 1.10 BTC Your bet 1 BTC Heh This game? http://probiwon.com/site/index/game/0de06f02-27c4-11e0-b63c-6f09a48f663d It seems, it is bug in javascript code on the client side, its does not affect calculations of won. We will fix it. Thank you! Heh, ok, my (browser's) bad then :) Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 24, 2011, 03:55:53 PM It is not clear why this is happening. The fact that there is multiplication of 1.1 * 100. How from this multiplication system can take an inaccurate answer? I do not understand.
But it is not critical, we will add rounding. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: theymos on January 24, 2011, 04:25:05 PM It is not clear why this is happening. The fact that there is multiplication of 1.1 * 100. How from this multiplication system can take an inaccurate answer? I do not understand. 0.1 can't be expressed exactly as a simple binary number. Like one-third in decimal (which is exactly 0.1 in base 3). So when you store 1.1 as a float in any language, it actually uses something like 1.10000001, which is as close as you can get. http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=0.1+to+binary Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 24, 2011, 04:34:20 PM thanx!
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: chris200x9 on January 25, 2011, 01:33:10 AM Can I add daily bets on BitBet for the probability of someone winning 3500% on PROBIWON? Isn't it a bad idea to have something be able to be bet on that the person betting can influence? For example some one could place a huge bet that someone will hit the 3500% and then just flood probiwon with 0.01 bets. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: nelisky on January 25, 2011, 01:56:09 AM Can I add daily bets on BitBet for the probability of someone winning 3500% on PROBIWON? Isn't it a bad idea to have something be able to be bet on that the person betting can influence? For example some one could place a huge bet that someone will hit the 3500% and then just flood probiwon with 0.01 bets. darn... *grumble* stupid geeks *grumble* can't keep their mouths shut! Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: chris200x9 on January 25, 2011, 02:35:45 AM Can I add daily bets on BitBet for the probability of someone winning 3500% on PROBIWON? Isn't it a bad idea to have something be able to be bet on that the person betting can influence? For example some one could place a huge bet that someone will hit the 3500% and then just flood probiwon with 0.01 bets. darn... *grumble* stupid geeks *grumble* can't keep their mouths shut! I brought it up because I do not have enough bitcoins to exploit it so I was like "f*ck it", but I will gladly edit my post before it is seen by the owner for 400 btc! :D Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: Mahkul on January 25, 2011, 01:38:25 PM Can I add daily bets on BitBet for the probability of someone winning 3500% on PROBIWON? Isn't it a bad idea to have something be able to be bet on that the person betting can influence? For example some one could place a huge bet that someone will hit the 3500% and then just flood probiwon with 0.01 bets. darn... *grumble* stupid geeks *grumble* can't keep their mouths shut! I brought it up because I do not have enough bitcoins to exploit it so I was like "f*ck it", but I will gladly edit my post before it is seen by the owner for 400 btc! :D I thought that bet was about someone betting 10BTC and then winning 3500%, no? Otherwise, you are a 100% right. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: chris200x9 on January 25, 2011, 03:27:01 PM Can I add daily bets on BitBet for the probability of someone winning 3500% on PROBIWON? Isn't it a bad idea to have something be able to be bet on that the person betting can influence? For example some one could place a huge bet that someone will hit the 3500% and then just flood probiwon with 0.01 bets. darn... *grumble* stupid geeks *grumble* can't keep their mouths shut! I brought it up because I do not have enough bitcoins to exploit it so I was like "f*ck it", but I will gladly edit my post before it is seen by the owner for 400 btc! :D I thought that bet was about someone betting 10BTC and then winning 3500%, no? Otherwise, you are a 100% right. I dunno I'll look. edit: I don't even see the option to bet on it. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 25, 2011, 08:04:38 PM Most likely, you will lose more money than wins: wins rounded down to 0.01, so almost all gains of
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: chris200x9 on January 25, 2011, 09:01:08 PM the point is moot because I don't see it on bitbet anymour, but I disagree. You said the 3500% has a 0.0019634954 probabhility 0.0019634954 * 100 = .19, that's a 20% chance of winning your bet for 1 btc spend (assuming you never hit 100% or higher). Unless it was the 10 btc rule previously stated.
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 25, 2011, 09:22:12 PM Ah! So you're still debating about bitbet!
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: wobber on January 25, 2011, 10:03:00 PM The bet on BitBet was for a 10 BTC game played on PROBIWON in the case one player would win 3500%.
So, if someone played 0.01BTC on PROBIWON, the bitbet bet wouldn't apply. This was actually a bet that made a service to PROBIWON more than BitBet since it ecouraged people to play 10BTC games. For example, 5 friends could gather, place a bet of 20 BTC on BitBet and then each play a 10 BTC game on PROBIWON. Max. loss for each=11 BTC, possible wins with odds 5/1 =20BTC. if the lucky one shared with his friends :) We have to make the economy grow, not just ourselves. Indirectly, helping a "competitor" can cause me to be wealthier. Like the butterfly-effect principle applied to an emerging economy like ours. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: chris200x9 on January 25, 2011, 11:49:04 PM The bet on BitBet was for a 10 BTC game played on PROBIWON in the case one player would win 3500%. So, if someone played 0.01BTC on PROBIWON, the bitbet bet wouldn't apply. This was actually a bet that made a service to PROBIWON more than BitBet since it ecouraged people to play 10BTC games. For example, 5 friends could gather, place a bet of 20 BTC on BitBet and then each play a 10 BTC game on PROBIWON. Max. loss for each=11 BTC, possible wins with odds 5/1 =20BTC. if the lucky one shared with his friends :) We have to make the economy grow, not just ourselves. Indirectly, helping a "competitor" can cause me to be wealthier. Like the butterfly-effect principle applied to an emerging economy like ours. ah i see, sorry :P Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 26, 2011, 07:51:41 PM Target was changed again. Please, refresh a page.
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: fabianhjr on January 26, 2011, 08:49:15 PM A technical request. Could you share the part that process the bets? ex. How does it know a when a bet is made and I assume it later calls the gambling system. I am interested in this to put an ATM where you can get the local currency for Bitcoins. This help would be appreciated.
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 26, 2011, 09:06:53 PM A technical request. Could you share the part that process the bets? ex. How does it know a when a bet is made and I assume it later calls the gambling system. It is just uses new 'listtransactions' call to bitcoind: https://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=2343.0 Quote I am interested in this to put an ATM where you can get the local currency for Bitcoins. This help would be appreciated. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: fabianhjr on January 27, 2011, 12:11:21 AM A technical request. Could you share the part that process the bets? ex. How does it know a when a bet is made and I assume it later calls the gambling system. It is just uses new 'listtransactions' call to bitcoind: https://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=2343.0 Quote I am interested in this to put an ATM where you can get the local currency for Bitcoins. This help would be appreciated. I suppose you are using the PHP library. Do you query it constantly(Ex. each 5 seconds) or does the client(bitcoind[.exe|.app|]) report on any transaction? I just want to know if there is a more practical way to do it. :P Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: BlackEye on January 27, 2011, 01:31:22 AM A quick question. Could you show some pseudocode of how you handle the bets? Does the acceptor plays any role in the odds? After creation of a new addresses pair (your address + acceptor address) site generates random secret, shows sha256(secret) to you and waits for your bet. After bet is accepted and game played new random secret generated immediately and site waits bet again. I haven't played this yet, and I'm curious how this hash verification works. If I understand correctly, you display the sha256 of some unique data, AKA "secret" before the player places his bet. Then the player bets whatever amount they like up to 15 BTC, and is shown the ring that was hit, along with the "secret" used. While it is easy to verify the secret matches the hash, I don't understand is how the "secret" relates to which ring is hit, as that would be the most important part to verify that the game is fair. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 27, 2011, 02:31:44 AM I have sent 2 bets that never received a page refresh telling we how much I won/lost. Each of the bets was sent right after a previous bet, so as to where the first bet hadn't been confirmed and I didn't know how much I won yet. Both bets were between 2-3 BTCs, and I never received a winning amount from them. I speculate that since they were sent so close after the previous bet, they never got processed through your system. If you could check this out for me, please, and if they never did get processed, send them back to the address they were sent from. If you need the address, just PM me please with the details you need and I'll respond as soon as I can. Thanks, and I love the concept of your site! talkinrock (Robert Karz) talkinrock@gmail.com If this is not a secret please write directly to here bitcoin address or acceptor address and I am check DB. So we will stay open (transparent) and show that the game is fair or do we have any bugs. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 27, 2011, 02:37:31 AM A technical request. Could you share the part that process the bets? ex. How does it know a when a bet is made and I assume it later calls the gambling system. It is just uses new 'listtransactions' call to bitcoind: https://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=2343.0 Quote I am interested in this to put an ATM where you can get the local currency for Bitcoins. This help would be appreciated. I suppose you are using the PHP library. Do you query it constantly(Ex. each 5 seconds) or does the client(bitcoind[.exe|.app|]) report on any transaction? I just want to know if there is a more practical way to do it. :P Unfortunately, bitcoin not able to report that that has received a new transaction - bitcoin concept contains only the probability of obtaining money defined by a number of confirmations, as I understand it. But a 1 confirmation is already a very good chance that you got the money. So I just ask regularly bitcoind. It is important not to miss a transaction, becouse listtransactions do not report number of transactions - it is gives only list latest from them. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 27, 2011, 02:46:41 AM A quick question. Could you show some pseudocode of how you handle the bets? Does the acceptor plays any role in the odds? After creation of a new addresses pair (your address + acceptor address) site generates random secret, shows sha256(secret) to you and waits for your bet. After bet is accepted and game played new random secret generated immediately and site waits bet again. I haven't played this yet, and I'm curious how this hash verification works. If I understand correctly, you display the sha256 of some unique data, AKA "secret" before the player places his bet. Then the player bets whatever amount they like up to 15 BTC, and is shown the ring that was hit, along with the "secret" used. While it is easy to verify the secret matches the hash, I don't understand is how the "secret" relates to which ring is hit, as that would be the most important part to verify that the game is fair. It determine coordinates of the hit by getting first 4 bytes from this secret number. For example: hash of secret: 4d1cb8895e10ed6f6dfc0013049df07f7e9794fd716b3b8e509f6581f2b934e3 After accepting your bet you will see secret and coords of hit: secret: 0d37cc844521dbfdb92399be793a1bc3 x=0.05162127107652399481 (d37 / ffff) y=0.79890135042343785763 (cc84 / ffff) Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: sputnik on January 27, 2011, 03:39:35 PM Some statistics:
Num. Out In 1. 0.50 0.25 2. 0.52 0.90 3. 0.30 0.10 4. 0.10 0.02 5. 0.90 0.18 6. 0.02 0.10 7. 0.18 0.36 8. 0.09 0.00 9. 0.37 1.11 Total Out 2.98 In 3.02 Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 27, 2011, 05:06:49 PM Too few attempts :)
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on January 27, 2011, 08:29:32 PM Added short sound when accepting bets. A very long time new blocks are generating, so it is convenient to hear when bid will be accepted.
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: Mahkul on January 27, 2011, 11:53:32 PM Added short sound when accepting bets. A very long time new blocks are generating, so it is convenient to hear when bid will be accepted. Nice! Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on February 03, 2011, 02:05:21 PM Total income: -103.88 BTC
Hmmm... Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on February 08, 2011, 03:46:32 AM Total income: -103.88 BTC Hmmm... What are you referring to in that statement? The total income of your website??! If so, that's sad; you need a better business strategy... fast! :-\ This is advertising, this amount casino already paid to players! :) Quote Also, on another note, regarding the lost Bitcoins I talked to you a while back about, I can't find the exact acceptor addresses I sent the Bitcoins to, but I do know the withdrawal address I used was 1MSgUtNsS2Nmfd4NH9ocXMhKRHoCAHEHKv. I hope that helps... :-[ All acceptors addresses used with this withdrawal address with creation time: Code: 1MSgUtNsS2Nmfd4NH9ocXMhKRHoCAHEHKv 19QUUtv2TyxxbczwqPWBeP8bzc5h7bjsnW 2011-01-23 01:55:33.594254+07 prizes (from backup, until January 25): Code: 1MSgUtNsS2Nmfd4NH9ocXMhKRHoCAHEHKv 3.00 Do not use these old addresses - it is deleted from DB because code was rewritten Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on February 17, 2011, 02:17:30 AM Maximum bet is increased to 25 BTC!
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: MDKing on February 17, 2011, 03:08:19 AM hmm am I doing something wrong, I've sent a bet to the acceptor address and it has currently 6 confirmations. Going to the main page, I just see my address in the field and acceptor address and a New Game Hash near the bottom. When I click Ok nothing happens.
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: MDKing on February 17, 2011, 03:29:28 AM hmm am I doing something wrong, I've sent a bet to the acceptor address and it has currently 6 confirmations. Going to the main page, I just see my address in the field and acceptor address and a New Game Hash near the bottom. When I click Ok nothing happens. Figured it out, I guess I missed the animation that I missed the target altogether :P Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: dissipate on February 27, 2011, 11:58:27 PM A quick question. Could you show some pseudocode of how you handle the bets? Does the acceptor plays any role in the odds? After creation of a new addresses pair (your address + acceptor address) site generates random secret, shows sha256(secret) to you and waits for your bet. After bet is accepted and game played new random secret generated immediately and site waits bet again. I haven't played this yet, and I'm curious how this hash verification works. If I understand correctly, you display the sha256 of some unique data, AKA "secret" before the player places his bet. Then the player bets whatever amount they like up to 15 BTC, and is shown the ring that was hit, along with the "secret" used. While it is easy to verify the secret matches the hash, I don't understand is how the "secret" relates to which ring is hit, as that would be the most important part to verify that the game is fair. It determine coordinates of the hit by getting first 4 bytes from this secret number. For example: hash of secret: 4d1cb8895e10ed6f6dfc0013049df07f7e9794fd716b3b8e509f6581f2b934e3 After accepting your bet you will see secret and coords of hit: secret: 0d37cc844521dbfdb92399be793a1bc3 x=0.05162127107652399481 (d37 / ffff) y=0.79890135042343785763 (cc84 / ffff) That's all well and good, but how do we know the secret was randomly and fairly generated? Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: deMangler on February 28, 2011, 06:27:42 AM That's all well and good, but how do we know the secret was randomly and fairly generated? I would say that it impossible to *know*, randomness and fairness are very often debated in maths universities and school playgrounds and it is a subject that is easily mis-understood (which is mostly why people gamble). However, I have done a lot of gambling and poker over the years and the successful houses are the ones that are trusted - especially in on-line gambling. That is why the more respected sites continue to plow so much resources into spotting cheating and robot players, because -in poker and other games of skill fairness is important, not so much with pure random games, where the honesty of the house about the odds is important. The successful houses know that the easiest way to do this is to actually be fair, take your cut, be open about it, and you will still make a fortune. As soon as a site is rumored to not be fair they shed players massively - even though such rumors are usually false - at least with the established providers, so it is just not worth it to cheat in providing gambling services - unless you are a very short-term scammer, who wants to make a quick buck and run. Which would be stupid as you will almost certainly make more money in the near to long term by being honest. I don't know the provider of this site, but I have played it and I do like it. Just responding to that particular question. dM Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: deMangler on February 28, 2011, 10:08:34 AM I did just notice something strange,
I have played quite a few times, One of my payments to Acceptor address:14XFTVDQrBhw79jYScyiZBx6bp17XHQq6f - for 10 BTC has not been confirmed after over 3 hours. Yet other payments have been ok (but not to this address I just doublechecked) - I am even up by a few BTC, but I thought I would let you know in case there is a bug. Is that address one of your Acceptor addresses? I am sure I cut and pasted it from your site while I was playing. dM Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on February 28, 2011, 10:54:06 AM A quick question. Could you show some pseudocode of how you handle the bets? Does the acceptor plays any role in the odds? After creation of a new addresses pair (your address + acceptor address) site generates random secret, shows sha256(secret) to you and waits for your bet. After bet is accepted and game played new random secret generated immediately and site waits bet again. I haven't played this yet, and I'm curious how this hash verification works. If I understand correctly, you display the sha256 of some unique data, AKA "secret" before the player places his bet. Then the player bets whatever amount they like up to 15 BTC, and is shown the ring that was hit, along with the "secret" used. While it is easy to verify the secret matches the hash, I don't understand is how the "secret" relates to which ring is hit, as that would be the most important part to verify that the game is fair. It determine coordinates of the hit by getting first 4 bytes from this secret number. For example: hash of secret: 4d1cb8895e10ed6f6dfc0013049df07f7e9794fd716b3b8e509f6581f2b934e3 After accepting your bet you will see secret and coords of hit: secret: 0d37cc844521dbfdb92399be793a1bc3 x=0.05162127107652399481 (d37 / ffff) y=0.79890135042343785763 (cc84 / ffff) That's all well and good, but how do we know the secret was randomly and fairly generated? https://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=3031.msg42895#msg42895 Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on February 28, 2011, 10:59:48 AM I did just notice something strange, I have played quite a few times, One of my payments to Acceptor address:14XFTVDQrBhw79jYScyiZBx6bp17XHQq6f - for 10 BTC has not been confirmed after over 3 hours. Yet other payments have been ok (but not to this address I just doublechecked) - I am even up by a few BTC, but I thought I would let you know in case there is a bug. Is that address one of your Acceptor addresses? Yes Quote I am sure I cut and pasted it from your site while I was playing. dM 10 BTC payment to this address is unconfirmed Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on February 28, 2011, 11:27:33 AM Site was changed. Please clear your cache and cookies.
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: deMangler on March 01, 2011, 05:15:06 AM I did just notice something strange, I have played quite a few times, One of my payments to Acceptor address:14XFTVDQrBhw79jYScyiZBx6bp17XHQq6f - for 10 BTC has not been confirmed after over 3 hours. Yet other payments have been ok (but not to this address I just doublechecked) - I am even up by a few BTC, but I thought I would let you know in case there is a bug. Is that address one of your Acceptor addresses? I am sure I cut and pasted it from your site while I was playing. dM The payment has now been accepted and the game played. (I won - yeehaaa!) It was not a problem with the Probiwon site - it was a network delay. Thanks. dM Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: Delia on March 20, 2011, 12:23:46 AM That's all well and good, but how do we know the secret was randomly and fairly generated? In theory, it should be possible to generate a provably random number. I don't know whether PIW's customers care enough for it to be worthwhile to implement. The protocol would go like this: PIW generates a secret. Secret: 0cd645b8cc7325838b2fa809f308e28ef9463494 PIW sends hash of secret to user. Hashed-Secret: d18b235bd2c80890a8aee4c564cfbce251633bb3 User records hashed secret. User generates a nonce. Nonce: ce61948f0d95be1746017cc327b8d28316055c8f Secret and Nonce are concatenated and hashed to form the final random result. Concatenation: 0cd645b8cc7325838b2fa809f308e28ef9463494ce61948f0d95be1746017cc327b8d28316055c8 f Random: 4f20d70d465fd0743a808048b7a7780e76627d58 Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on March 20, 2011, 01:15:30 AM Need a scheme that will work in user's browser.
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: Spudzz on March 22, 2011, 06:56:55 PM Probiwon thinks my Bitcoin address is invalid, and I'm not sure why. I'm unable to play the games now, and I previously could.
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: Delia on March 22, 2011, 08:50:00 PM The hashing can be done in javascript, and the nonce can be generated randomly by default or accept mashing keys into a text field if the user wants.
Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: dracoling on March 22, 2011, 09:13:10 PM Probiwon thinks my Bitcoin address is invalid, and I'm not sure why. I'm unable to play the games now, and I previously could. Yeah, I tried it today (first time) and was unable to play due to an "Invalid address" message. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: mndrix on March 22, 2011, 10:53:41 PM Probiwon thinks my Bitcoin address is invalid, and I'm not sure why. I'm unable to play the games now, and I previously could. Yeah, I tried it today (first time) and was unable to play due to an "Invalid address" message. I've seen this error message on other services when the underlying Bitcoin daemon stops responding to RPC calls. Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: bitcoinex on March 23, 2011, 03:47:34 AM Probiwon thinks my Bitcoin address is invalid, and I'm not sure why. I'm unable to play the games now, and I previously could. Yeah, I tried it today (first time) and was unable to play due to an "Invalid address" message. When you played last? Try to clean cookies. Quote I've seen this error message on other services when the underlying Bitcoin daemon stops responding to RPC calls. bitcoind is ok Title: Re: probiwon.com: New gambling shooting game with 94.2% return Post by: fabianhjr on March 28, 2011, 02:31:03 AM Hey, I am in a luck strike! Thanks for this great game! It is really fair at a near 100% return. ^^
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