Bitcoin Forum

Prolog:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=318706.0

Since cedivad won't allow pefectly reasonable, on-topic discussion such as this



in his thread, I've made one where the open exchange of ideas is appreciated, not slandered as "trolling."

It isn't HashFast's fault cedivad can't comprehend a simple Terms and Conditions agreement specifying DEC 31 as the deadline after which refunds are issued.

Oct 20th - 30th is (obviously) the old range for the anticipated start of shipping, and (obviously) not the entirety of guaranteed shipping dates.

HashFast never promised to start shipping Batch 1 on Oct 20th.

HashFast never promised to finish shipping Batch 1 on Oct 30th.

HashFast never committed to shipping all Batch 1 orders in 10 days.

That interpretation is prima facie absurd and cedivad is going to be laughed out of court.

EDIT: Even if cedivad has the best lawyer he can afford...

http://flavorwire.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/saul1.jpg

Personally I don't think cedivad has a leg to stand on.  IIRC he doesn't even have a copy of the terms of sale he agreed to.  It also appears as though he isn't (wasn't?) able to critically evaluate the ToS as it is.

I'm interested to hear legitimate discussion on the topic, not because I'm interested in legal action though.

yes, that's my point...they spent the money already (and tape-out was announced in Sept). i should have used the word "needed" instead of "need".



if you want to measure your ROI in USD..fine by me -- i prefer not to lose btc. Hashfast trying to twist the fact that customers are losing BTC but potentially gaining USD (due to exchange rate) is disingenuous.

Oddly enough, when I spoke with Eduardo he assured me all ROI metrics were evaluated (by HF) in BTC.

I feel sorry for anyone that owns a hashfast preorder thinking that we would at least get RIO. I dont see them meeting mid nov deadline. They over price the hardware only selling the idea that they will ship starting oct 20.

I'm sincerely interested in knowing how much your services sells for, icebreaker.
I really don't want to lose time arguing on every other lay you posted...

1) I personally think i do.
2) I have a copy of the terms; i was asking a copy of the terms of the people that agreed before me.
3) I think to be able to read and to do a critical evaluation of some text. I read contracts in English from when i was 15, after all. Thanks anyway for your trust.

Yes, they have said that a few times.

"I think to be able to read and to do a critical evaluation of some text?"

What is this gibberish?  You can't even a complete, grammatically correct sentence.  And you expect us to you can read a contract?

Yes or no, do the Terms and Conditions to which you agreed state a deadline of Dec 31?

Please answer with a simple yes or no.  We don't want you to further embarrass/possible injure yourself trying to another sentence, after all.   ;)

English is not my first language. Yet, i don't see the mistake i did in that phrase. Please, show me your deep knowledge.
I will reply by asking a better question.

Do federal consumer protection laws apply to HF?

You can troll how much you want on your points, but you won't win any fans - they already knows your pathetic techniques.

I know FTC laws apply to selling within US, but internationally?  The definition of "consumer" might also be iffy when dealing with big pricey lots of (potentially custom-built) industrial HW.  Honestly don't know.

I already responded to this question in the other thread, but you deleted the post because you didn't like the answer.

Oh when you said:

cedivad is gathering funs for legel action against HashFast

You meant:

Cedivad is gathering funds for legal action against HashFast

to which I say....


SERIOUSLY??

Let me find some BFL customers for you to speak to.

You don't know what LATE is.

Again, you are making things up.

Customers are entitled to full refunds if they cancel their order, independently from the promised shipping date of a preorder. Full point.

Is there still someone other than you missing the point?

Remember that this does not apply to on-demand built stuff.
Courts have to clarify first if it's really an on-demand order or just a preorder for a mass-produced article. I'm totally with you if it's the second one.

Well, that certainly is your opinion.  Of course, you don't know the difference between an FTC rule and an actual law, so that opinion counts for very little.

From https://hashfast.com/checkout/terms-of-sale:


Many people don't agree with your points and POV.

But you deleted their posts, like a coward afraid to defend his hasty conclusions from inconvenient scrutiny.

I only deleted your posts from my thread. Any moderator can confirm that.
When will you stop lying?

When will you learn to read?


When will you learn to only risk what you can afford to lose?

When will you learn to stop blaming others for your own lack of due diligence and responsibility?

And let's not forget that the firsts batch 1 customers never had that date on their ToS.
I keep forgetting about them.

Wrong again.  Some batch 1 customers did have "that date" on their ToS.

Did you have Dec 31 in your ToS?

I did.
The first half of batch 1 didn't.

So, i'm not wrong.

You are.

I'm wrong because i keep replying to you.

And ^that^ is why you have no case.

Please send me 1 Bitcoin to cover the cost of my valuable legal advice.

You did manage to raise at least 1 Bitcoin in your "gathering funds" thread, didn't you?

 :D

I'm still interested in how much they pay you. Also, what is the kind of skills required for your work? I guess it can't be really that easy.
Anyway, to answer your last post attempt, i'm not trying to raise anything as of now. I will start with my own funds, if the case has a base, others will join me.

Since that HF will miss their mid november deadline there will be all the time needed.

Every BabyJet is 100% identical to every other BabyJet. Mass produced. Refunds must be available at any time.

You're "not trying to raise anything as of now?"

Funny, the self-moderated thread you created and foolishly chose to exclude me from demonstrates the exact opposite.

What kind of idiot would make a thread called "Gathering funds for legal action against HashFast" when they aren't actually doing that?

Until HashFast fails to deliver by Dec 31 and then refuses to issue refunds, you have no basis for any legal action.

https://i.imgur.com/cRzAnEY.jpg

The same idiot that decided to start with his owns money and take community's money only if people decided to join me later.
What an idiot i'm.

TIL it's possible to gather money from yourself, and it (somehow) makes sense to create a thread for the sole purpose of announcing such a solo adventure.

Correction -
You made TWO threads publicly announcing your self-gathering fund effort.

Correction to correction -
You failed to gather any interest in (and only scorn for) your absurd legal tantrum adventure, so you decided to double down and go it alone out of sheer malice and spite, heedless of the facts.  And you accused everyone who tried to give you a clue of being a paid shill using a sockpuppet account.

What gall; how boorish!

Update to corrected correction -
cedivad is a liar:

I closed that thread and continued in a new one where i stated that i wasen't looking for anyone's money, but yes, that makes me a layer. Keep believing that.

Will you start to trow that around for the next months too (until when hf delivers?)

My opinion is that HashFast is untrustworthy. They represented something overly optimistic to make more sales, but put their actual expectations into the contract. My advice is to seek your refund per this thread:

http://www.justanswer.com/consumer-protection-law/82mir-made-pre-order-online-product-august-9-2013.html

It is probable that you will only get the dollar amount of the Bitcoins you paid.

Thank you for the link. I will crosspost your quote in my thread if you don't mind.

That shyster 'consumer protection lawyer' doesn't know WTF he's talking about and should stick to representing victims of McDonald's coffee burns.

There is nothing ambiguous about the guaranteed delivery date.


Now we know what happened to Saul after he skipped town!

At least your last post was funny. Thanks.

 :)  You're very welcome!

Getting your sense of humor back means you're moving along the road to recovery.

Changing your angry, accusative signature to something more calm and rational would be another healthy step forward on that path.

Getting my sense of humour back doesn't mean that i'm gonna see more than 25% of my investment back, tough. It just means that after a few hours of answering to your trolling posts i start to see a funny pattern.

Informing you that you have no case, no leg to stand on, and no basis for legal action at this time, isn't trolling.

OTOH, your persistent insisting that the T&C to which you agreed's Dec 31 guaranteed delivery date is ambiguous does constitute trolling.

That's why nobody gave you a single Satoshi (and instead mocked your delusions) in your begging threads.   :D