Bitcoin Forum

Read the article (http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/06/e-gold/) today. Now I know at least one person who's got good reasons to revenge by creating Bitcoin  :)

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I'm sure it's an interesting article, but try and avoid misinformation in your topic subjects

Sorry. Fixed the title.

yes it is possible that he is Satoshi Nakamoto.
but it is also possible that i am Satoshi Nakamoto.
and also possible that you is Satoshi Nakamoto.

Satoshi Nakamoto is anonymous, we don't know who he is. or even if he exist any more.

I am The Satoshi Nakamoto  ... 

I get it. When someone dies in bitcoin, they get a name.

His name is Sathoshi Nakamoto.
His name is Sathoshi Nakamoto.
His name is Sathoshi Nakamoto.
His name is Sathoshi Nakamoto.

Interesting article indeed.

I see that e-gold peaked at $85 million, roughly where bitcoins are now. I wonder if that's some kind of cut off point where the authorities start freaking and taking whatever action they need to spoil the party.

I personally don't think that there is something special about 85 milllion. Probably it is just the point where it becomes "visible" to the government and starts affecting regular stuff bit by bit.
With Bitcoin such point might even be much higher, since a lot of Bitcoin adopters prefer to keep Bitcoins rather than spend them.

Very interesting article.

He could be involved. But I dont think its him alone.

This was very interesting, maybe the bitcoin future.

A gold bug would never create bitcoin.

Have you ever wondered why it takes so much to generate a single block?

It's because all the rest of the computing power is being pooled into to virtualize a human brain perfectly. Satoshi Nakamoto isn't the creator of Bitcoin, he IS Bitcoin. He is the AI spawned of a network with massive computing power.


But not really.

how does this article not apply to mtgox tradehill etc etc? isn't it the same thing? this article was alarming to me.

It's not as though people aren't aware that the exchanges and other Bitcoin services they're dealing with are unlicensed and unregulated.  Anyone using those services should be well aware that their funds can be frozen by outside agencies without any notice and not store money or Bitcoins to which they might need immediate access with those services.

I also think it's a bit disingenuous for businesses to claim that financial services regulations don't apply to them unless they've actually applied for licensing and been told it's unnecessary.  It comes across as intentionally avoiding finding out about legal requirements until some outside authority steps in, which hardly inspires confidence that those services are following standard business practices with regard to separation of funds, maintaining adequate records, keeping data secure, etc.

From the article:
"Timberlake, the economics professor, is convinced that Jackson’s radical dream, his goal of upsetting the economic status quo and overturning the government’s monopoly on money, is what really got E-Gold targeted.

“No matter how innocent a person is you can always find a law that government agents can use to convict him of something,” Timberlake says, “And this is a perfect example of it. Any time anybody tries to produce money, the federal government is going to be on their tail.”"

E-Gold was a centralized currency run by scammers.  Over three years I dealt with them, there were numerous reports of accounts being hacked and all the money stolen.  Many suspected it was the owners.

The differences I see between EGold and Bitcoin.

There is no central operator with Bitcoin. All transactions are visible, so nobody needs to get a subpoena. They only need download the transaction blocks. Also, bitcoin makes no promise to exchange into any other currency. Bitcoins are only tokens or chips and have no intrinsic value or backing by fiat, they are only as valuable as the need for a secure transaction is.

The transactions may be visible but the block chain can't tell you whether they were legitimate transactions or not and in most cases ownership of the addresses can't be tied to a specific individual.

Very interesting article. Thanks for posting. The thread title is foolish though.

LOL, Satoshi has been a real technical genius, while that guy is just regular opportunist who launched his own centralized currency. Doing that doesn't require much technical skills.

All we are Satoshi Nakamoto

wrong! we all could be Satoshi Nakamoto.

but only if we have the private key ;)

true. the only proof that he is Satoshi Nakamoto, is if he haves the private key from block 1.

I doubt this guy is at all involved in bitcoin. he already has the SS on his ass.

...just not all at the same time.   ;)

The article certainly illustrates why Satoshi chooses to remain anonymous.   

This quote from the article was interesting:

This is why bitcoin will eventually be a target...assuming the user-volume rises above its current noise floor.

and how would they hurt us? just asking... freeze all bitcoins?

There are a myriad of ways an entity with the resources of a nation-state can hurt bitcoin, even destroy it for all practical purposes.  Will they?  I think they will if it gets on their radar as anything other than a momentary blip.  To what extent will they go after it?  To whatever extent is necessary to remove the threat they think it poses to them.

From the article:

This represents the nut of it.

so they will just say: bitcoins are illegal.
know what i would say: FUCK YOU. i live in europe, you can't touch me, im behind 5 proxys.

the main diffrences between bitcoin and e-gold is that bitcoin is decentralized, and backed by nothing.

They could do exactly that, and other things as well.  They could get the EU to pass similar laws, and EU would do it; they have anti-money-laundering interests too.  They can target the BTC/$ interfaces (the exchanges).  They can devote very significant CPU time to screwing with the bitcoin validation process.  These are just a few of the things they could do.  I'm sure their are tons more.

In short, while they can't really kill the underlying bitcoin algorithm, they can certainly apply enough leverage to destroy it's perceived value; destroy the 'general' confidence in the system, thus making the trade value zilch...or close enough to zilch so its not a threat.

true. but im still behind 5 proxys. and you can't really not stop innovation.

sure they can, but only the ones in the states. mtgox is in japan.

no. fallacy. the governments could *maybe* perform double spending, they could not create new coins, or use mine coins, or destroy mine coins. or do anything that would screw with my coins. to perform double spending, they would also need to isolate the node the want to double spend with.

they can not destroy my confidence in the system. i could still use it.

This isn't about you.  It isn't [wouldn't be] about YOUR confidence in the system.  It doesn't matter how many proxies you're behind, and I honestly don't know what that has to do with anything.  They're not targeting YOU.  Their goal would be to destroy 'general' confidence in the system and destroy the trade value. 

i know its not about me.but if I and other people are using the currency, and giving it value. there is nothing they can do about it. i can trade anonymously on slikroad if i like, they can't trace me.

You say you know it's not about YOU but then you talk exclusively about YOU.  While it has some novelty value, like Pet Rocks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pet_Rock), its real value is in its utility, current and potential.  That's what they'll target.  Kill its utility and you kill its value.  What good are your BTC holdings if they trade at a penny per coin?

well if i buy 100000 of them, is would have the same value are $1000. and i could go buy drugs anonymously.
and no im not only talking about ME, i do need some people to trade with, and im sure there will be some.
thats why i said .

it does not matter how many there is using it. only that there are more then one.

OK, but when that happens, it is no longer a threat.  They 'win'.

i don't see any difference. i get to use bitcoin as a currency, im happy, and i will try to get more people to use it.
they cannot 'win'. simply not possible.

Let's say all governments team up against Bitcoin since it can be used for illegal transactions.

All exchange website and all businesses accepting Bitcoins are sued and therefore have to close or survive hidden.

What would you do with a currency that you can only get by "mining" and buy nothing legal with it? I'm not even talking about the trust issues and their effect on btc price. That's maybe not a "win" to you, but it's pretty close...

"...if he haves the private key from block 1." ...and is kept in a purse over at Cell Block H.

http://www.ioffer.com/img/item/159/775/155/hZ5UgcqlRFC9AC9.jpg

not gonna happen.

not gonna happen either. silkroad is anonymous, therefor it can't be shutdown.

is this fictive scenario, i would buy illegal things. or use bitcoin as a friend2friend currency.
two friends could sell stuff to each other with bitcoin, it does not make the things illegal that they are trading.
and i would be able to exchange my bitcoins to a local currency, i would just need to find someone that is using it.

and i don't even think that there is something that is illegal all around the world.

"...and backed by nothing." http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=%22bitcoin+is+backed+by%22  OR  http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=%22bitcoins+are+backed+by%22


Bitcoins: Backed By More Than You Know

+1

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Myths#Bitcoin_is_backed_by_processing_power

bitcoin are backed by nothing. gold is also backed by nothing.
money(USD) are(was) backed by gold.

Start your own fresh block chain and see if you can get someone to exchange your private block chain coins to a local currency.  If so, you'll be rich.  If not, you'll know why it takes more than your 10 friends to make bitcoins valuable.

So bitcoins will necessarily stay underground and never go mainstream? Too bad for all the small businesses and the economy that could have flourished around it!  :-\

why would i start my own blockchain?

no it does not take more then my 10 friends to make bitcoin valuable among us.
if we would like to trade little round white stones, instead of bitcoin, they would be valuable among us.

thats why it may go mainstream, even if they are illegal.
drugs are illegal too you know, people are using them anyway.
there will be small businesses taking bitcoin as payment.

:D

brought down by "the man"

I guess "the woman" brought them back up?

What if he spent block 1?

+1

then he would just be the guy who mocked Satoshi, and stole his private key.

no then he could proof that he was Satoshi. by signing something with it.
Satoshi is the only one with that private key, and its the only proof he haves.

If it took Justice Dept. four years to figure out what to do about E-Gold, it'll probably take them years to figure out what to do about bitcoin exchanges.

You can draw a parallel with the Napster affair and it's later distributed incarnation, Bittorrent trackers. Exchanges are vulnerable but they are many and easy to start.


Perish the thought that someone might get any financial freedom or privacy. No, we can't allow for that since the criminal might use it. Come to think of it, car and road builders make huge profits when criminals are allowed to purchase their products. They fully know that criminals use the motorways each and every day and move with impunity, and yet they do nothing about it ! I believe the solution to this travesty is to register each and every person that uses a car, which should submit ahead of time a detailed plan of his daily itinerary. Every driver should be fitted with an explosive collar that would automatically go off should he steer off route.

http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/threatlevel/2009/06/dougjackson10.jpg