Bitcoin Forum

So a month ago it was difficult to find a decent Asic for sale on Ebay, and within the past week more and more are being listed.

Jalepenos, Blades, Avalons you name it. Must not be as profitable to mine anymore time to cash out.

Because in the next month or so another 5PH is expected to roll out.  Clueless buyers may use a calculator with the current difficulty instead of one twice as high.  The sellers of said equipment know that they can buy more BTC with the proceeds from the sale than they can mining with it.

Having said that, I abhor the idea of ever returning to the scam that is eBay.  The buyer will mine for 30 days, drop a couple of drops of water and file a claim stating item is dead.  Sell local on or here.

BTC's hitting $800 didn't help either.  asic sticks are back up to $25+ from the low of $6-7.  I picked up a pair of 13gh Blades for $190 each, maybe I should sell them.

yea don't mine.. buy coins instead

 ::)

Another possibility is that people is mining other SHA-256 based crypto-currency with the "first generation" of ASICs?

All the SHA256 coins are less profitable than BTC.  It would be better to mine BTC and convert it to the alt-currency if you suspected that those currencies had a better chance of increased valuation vs BTC in the future, but then again people hate to do the extra steps...

Simple. Because more and more of them are becoming obsolete.  Everyone's racing to ditch them to recover their cash investment to either a) purchase bitcoins, b) purchase the next gen miner, or a & b.

LOL That's funny... I've done that... Guilty if you charge me...

And why would he do that? Does ebay checks physically if something is broken?

The seller will get back dead mining equipment, nobody will argue that it's dead.  eBay always sides with buyer (can't you tell I'm a spiteful previous eBay seller).

eBay has no ethics and I make the assumption that everybody on there is out to scam.

Save the headache and sell on here and use an escrow... unless you like headaches.

People are crazy or really bad at math!!

http://www.befr.ebay.be/itm/KnC-KnCMiner-Bitcoin-Miner-ASIC-Jupiter-mit-550-GH-s-Standalone-Gerat-ohne-USB-/251384445642?pt=DE_Computer_Sonstige&hash=item3a87ae3aca&_uhb=1

a kncminer Jupiter sold for 16.716,00 EUR that's insane. At the current price that's about 33 bitcoin, there is no way this machine is going to mine more than 20 bitcoin.

to someone with 5 feedback, could be all shills for all we know

i would damn the ebay rules and sell it to that 2nd fellow with 2400 feedbacks

Beh, you don't have to destroy the equipment... you'd still get your money back from paypal regardless.

I suspect since I've never done a paypal reversal from an eBay auction (registered since '99 & 350+ feedbacks) I could buy any of those miners listed.... open up some dispute process claiming that I didn't receive what was listed in the description (htf would they know?) & stall quite a bit on return shipment & replies etc.  i imagine you have several weeks, eh?

I'm not sure that would work. I sold a miner on ebay 1 months ago, the buyer paid with paypal and  the money was in my bank account 2 days later. Now there is no way for paypal to get the money back, at worst they close your account but who cares?

I think he means to do it to avoid a negative feedback  :P

There is, they will pull it back from your bank, use your other funding sources on the account (CC, etc. if you have them attached), and if they can't get it from any of those it'll get sent to collections.  PayPal f'n sucks.

So I am confused. So I shouldn't have started mining?

I got my equipment pretty cheap back in the middle of this month when Bitcoin was worth about $400. Now with the prices rising, my equipment is going to be paid off within a month. Hear I though that was good. The difficulty only raised by 1 since I have had it, but the price of Bitcoin has raised nearly 50%. Even with that 550gh if difficulty does rise to about 9 or 10 within the next couple of months it seems like it would still be paid off within 2 or 3 months. I just don't get it. Is there something I am missing?

Yes, You could have bought 550gh/s of bitcoins instead of the miner. You would have had more bitcoins than you'd ever eventually mine, and since you still assume the price will rise you would have made more money.

Difficulty doesn't raise by 1, it raises by a percentage. Every two weeks I'd expect to make 25-40% less coins than the week before, possibly more, probably less.

You're right. I keep forgetting about that. However, I see mining a way as making "free" money. I mean hey all I am doing is leaving my miner on while I go out to eat. However, the same could be said just buying instead. I can imagine how somebody that is doing both is getting.

One thing I have noticed on ebay is that there are tons of people bidding on mining equipment from people that have 0 feedback WAKE UP PEOPLE! YOU WILL BE SCAMMED! I cant believe the amount of bids people with no feedback are getting on this equipment. Do they actually think it is worth the gamble sending $8000+ to unknown sellers? And one other thing I noticed is people are selling preorders for equipment they dont even have yet? How does that work would the winning bidder send the money when auction is done and wait however long till the original purchaser recieves it?

Ebay is where I bought my Avalon 60gh and I see this all the time even now. I am surprised at this also. I was nervous when I bought my Avalon from somebody that had 14 feedback with 100%. Preorders too, I have seen some "ready to ship" or "low wait list number" selling on eBay. I am guessing that the company has a "ship to" address and the seller puts the buyers PayPal address in that section, which is weird since I think they could possibly not even put in your address and by the time they ship out it would be too late to put in a claim with eBay or maybe they have an account and give you the account info and password then the winner can change everything on the account. I don't know though it just seems sketchy. I only buy "In hand" miners off of it though.

 Yeah by the time it takes to recieve the order it would already be to late to dispute it. There are alot of people with 0 feedback selling mining stuff and people bidding like crazy It is unbelievable.

ehhh... the prices could fall tomorrow, the rates could change with more miners added, etc. etc. etc.

you're talking about working up to paying off your investment.

just think of it like this
you buy 1000$ worth of coins right now, any time your coins worth goes up over $1000, you sell them off and get the cash. when they drop under $1000 worth, you use your "+1000$ cash profits" to buy more coins because you think they should be worth $1000.

versus
you buy a $1000 miner that will generate $1000 of coins over X days (discounting fees, electricity, difficulty changes, price changes).


option a you will easily end up with more cash and coins than option b.



Actually purchasing enough hashing power that your $$$ investment over time generates any profit is a huge risk that isn't validated by the fact that all initial investments go into paying for the rig.
buying into coins directly is only as risky regarding valuation. you get the coins up front, so even if btc drops down to $1 ea, you're now not required to sit there churning away on an expensive rig for months just to get that $$$ investment back before you can profit.


Any ebay auction that isn't a flat out scam, even if it looks like an upsell "i bought for X just to resell it at X+???" is bs. even with the price of btc increasing asics should be going down in value relative to their power vs the power of the entire network they are that overpriced.

Right. I wasn't looking at the whole picture. I was thinking once my equipment was paid off I will be smooth sailing just making money with the turn of a switch. I ignored the fact that btc could drop in price drastically then I would have been pissed at the fact that I bought a $1300 rig only to have it be paid off to close to a year. Thank goodness it didn't turn out that way.

I'm a young investor and still learning the tricks of the trade. If I would have bought btc when they were ~$300 instead of the equipment I would have gotten a profit of $1200. Lesson learned. However, after my rig pays itself off, I will be making money by just leaving a box on the way I see it. BTC could drop off the planet at least I would get my money back from it. The problem was I was looking at it from a realtors POV instead of a stock POV. Lesson learned.

At least I can sit back and see how stock works while I mine away. Babbys first stock.

Mining equipment can only mine bitcoins. If you bought something that can ever mine 4 bitcoins, while you had the opportunity to buy, lets say 7 bitcoins then your haven't done the best investment.
$ wise you investment may hit a positive ROI in the first case, but whatever the price of Bitcoin, it will still be a worst investment compared to buying bitcoins.

Also one thing that you haven't considered is that difficulty rises exponentially and will continue to rise like that for at least for some time more. That means that there is an upper limit on how many bitcoins your rig will ever mine.

They won't charge your Credit Cards or do a transfer from your bank account. They will simply Put your account into Negative Balance. The collection is correct thought.

eBay and PayPal expert!

Im a Top Rated, Top Rated Plus and a Silver Star Power Seller. Most of the items I sell are over $300+ per item.

Its no shill.  We had a €15k bid on that machine.  Got the earlier one for €14050.

No Butterfly Labs Product is cost efficient now.
If you buy it, you automatically loose money. What you get is a liability or an expensive souvenier:

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/78ef3ed385

In fact, most ASICs are not cost efficient by the time that they arrive at your door. Such is the bane of the bitcoin rush...

Don't worry about collections. I have a friend who used to sell a lot on ebay, got scammed a lot with chargeback and stopped his ebay business. They are still calling him 5 years later to "find a solution" and threatening to go to court but they never did.. (and will probably loose if they did)

I don't really understand what's going on with ebay myself, I know the Price/BTC has gone up and so has the difficulty. But I just listed 4 USB Block Erupters that I bought at $9 a piece plus a cheap compatible USB hub and the bidding went up to $+150, like seriously wtf? I know prices were sorta high and I even gave it a buy it now price of ~120 because that's where demand was at the time.. guess not!

I'm seriously regretting not investing in these sticks when they were cheap before teh crazyness went full swing, but in this market everyone has those regrets.

I'm going to include a free USB fan I hacked together that keeps them nice and cool just to help ease my mind and their setup.. They earned it.