Bitcoin Forum

Bitcoin is crashing at 25% so far, it seems there are rumors that China banned Bitcoin payment processors from dealing with Bitcoin Exchanges, some confirming this to be true.

http://www.coindesk.com/china-bans-payment-companies-working-bitcoin-exchanges-sources-claim/

If indeed this is confirmed further in the next couple of days, This means Chinese can't deposit money to exchanges, which is very grave.

I wish all Bitcoiners the best in the coming days.

Oh shit :O

Time to sell everything I've got left.

I'm holding ... who needs China  8)

Anyone have any other sources ?

This seems a little strange to me.

Just watch the charts and cry  ;D

Sell so you can buy it all?  ;)

No kidding. A few months ago we didn't know there were Chinese bitcoiners.

BUY NOW CHEAP
                            
                

Finally the bears will come out to play, 400ish coming soon...

So they can still sell their coins, but no one can deposit money into the echanges? Things will not be good for a few weeks, imo.

wut?? this means that only people outside of China can still transfer money to Chinese exchanges?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=372998.60

Yes, when bitcoin was 100 USD

Then BTCChina is dead, and users are just getting money out... IGNORE THEIR PRICES.

This thread is very unenlightening.

This is further clarified in the article:

People will still be able to withdraw their money from Chinese exchanges, they just won’t be able to deposit new funds. - You can only sell Bitcoins on exchange and withdraw Fiat, but not deposit Fiat to buy coins.

People will still be able to sell their bitcoins for local currency and then withdraw that currency

So they are cashing out and the price should drop for a while until we are where we would be without them, plus whatever they do localbitcoins style. Interesting.

The thought of that $100 XBT makes me excited yet sad at the same time  :D

So chinese are getting f in the a. I guess now they will see that unless they actually *own* their money they will be told what they can or can't do with it, like little children. Seems very bullish to me... After the panic dissipates in a week or two. Meanwhile, cheap coins.

If true, I guess this is better than exchanges not being able to operate at all, but having to deposit in BTC prevents new people from coming in and obtaining bitcoins. Also, this doesn't bode well for what might happen in the future.

I remember only a week ago when all the bulls on here were patronizing everyone who sold their bitcoins based off the China news as sheeple who didn't understand what was happening and irrationally panic sold. Well, I guess those people had pretty good foresight afterall.  :)

i don't quite get it. how is an exchange supposed to happen if funds cannot flow in + out?

i feel we are missing some important information here. the previous releases did not sound like they want to ban exchanges..

They aren't banning exchanges. That's the PR beauty of it. It's like a knife in the voodooo doll that kills you anyway.

If no more money cannot go in, owning Bitcoin for Chinese must be extremly valuable, the price will go much higher in China, Bitcoins can be used to move wealth out of China

I would suggest having some perspective and stop contributing to volatility that puts traders off adopting Bitcoin, but I guess I would be pissing in the wind right? Obviously the actions in any one country matters to an International payment system and I'm an idiot.

It's the time of the year when most financial magazines and websites round up how well their stock picks have done and congratulating themselves on beating the trackers or maybe even getting over 20% growth on their portfolio over the year. Personally I am not ditching something that has outperformed everything else I hold by a huge margin and has the potential to do so again next year.

That's a pretty positive spin on it actually. But it essentially makes it useful for black market transactions again, which has value....but I thought we were past courting the black market.

started with the banks, now the payment processors.

Yep, I guess a huge black market will emerge. In either case, it would be an interesting and long awaited confrontation between government and bitcoin. And bitcoin will win this, what remains to be seen is how fast.

We'll never fully get away from our roots, just like cash  ;)

Not sure if it's bullish for Bitcoin, but I feel it's kinda bearish for the Chinese economy. I was considering other ways to protect my savings, apart from Bitcoin, well... Today I made a decision that Chinese stocks are not going to be a part of my portfolio.

But at what point is it all going to be too much trouble to deal with? Those who still own bitcoin in China can use them as a store of value, but given the level of regulation, it might be easier at this point to make a trip to Macau for poker chips or another alternative, like precious metals or something. It's really hanging by a thread.

Yeah, that's what we are seeing now  ;)

what we are seeing now is called panic :) when herd panics (either direction), rational thinking is turned off.

Assuming it's true* that you can withdraw but not deposit to BTCChina, then why would a rational individual withdraw?  Whenever you have a one-way financial valve like this, it makes the less-restrictive money (money in BTCChina) worth more. 

I can understand selling in the panic to buy back later, but Yuan in BTCChina--if the rumour is true--is now better than Yuan in a bank account. 

*I can't see this actually being true

it also means no new Yuan will be coming to Chinese exchanges, which is a huge blow for them.

I am sick and tired of this "nobody knows what chinese do" thingy.
Fuck them all

I think your missing important information is China is essentially a communist capital state.  They never have had the freedoms most westerners are concerned about losing.  We complain about the fed.  Their economic power is tightly held by the government.

This is no surprise.

The surprise for the Chinese gvmt in the end will be the fact the you cannot stop bitcoin trade.

But for now?  Look out below.  BTC technicals have been bad for a while.  This news is gas on embers.

Chinese who didn't catch the news early wake up in a few hours, maybe another sell off.

Hmm.  Not maybe IMHO. ☺☺

But the real good news is this just helps what is a needed retraction in price to speed up.

The west has a chance to lead in financial freedom here.  But we need to see the us continue to back off from interfering with exchanges.

We need gentle regulation.  Asap.  And then see US exchanges gain steam.  I believe this is true for the EU as well.

Poisonous for CN government.  Not gonna happen.

yes but the good news is, that it looks like we may finally get clarity and that really is good cause nothing is as bad for some market as uncertainty

Oh Yeah !!!

Buying cheap coin :)

Am I missing something here?

It's clear that banks and financial institutions are not allowed to deal in Bitcoin. They've also ruled that Bitcoin exchanges are legal and people can buy and sell them.

Sending money to an exchange from your Chinese bank account is surely classed as just another movement of cash. I assume a Chinese person can do a bank transfer to buy some garlic or gold in exactly the same way.

I've never used a third party payment system to buy Bitcoin in my entire life. Having investigated the sheer ball ache and sketchiness involved in doing so I'd actively avoid any exchange that required it.

I assume this is a move to keep closer tabs on the movement of money. Considering how China operates this shouldn't be surprising to anyone.

When I see a headline saying - 'All transfers from all sources are banned' is when I might start thinking it's over for China.

We are all missing something.  Here are the possibilities as I see them:

1.  All yuan transfers to BTCChina are banned.

2.  Only 3rd-party payment processor transfers are banned.  That is, you are still permitted to deposit and withdraw to/from BTCChina using your bank account.  (This change was made so that China could keep a better track of capital flows for AML purposes.)

3.  This is all FUD and nothing has changed.

Exactly.

Looks like $1000 btc needed china...

China gave us Bitcoin $1250, fact can't be denied.

I'm voting for number 2. Nowhere have I seen anything about banning all transfers in.

It's perfectly logical for the Chinese government to keep tabs on the movement of all money. They can do this by consolidating the channels it can move down.

Barring third party payments is an inevitable step in the course they've been taking. I don't see why anyone would be surprised by this. They're trying to keep it contained and tamed.

What they're doing is what all authorities would like to do. They're just not messing about.

I'm ambivalent I bought my bitcoins long time ago and currently only speculate with altcoins just for fun, paranoia is not good for health just wait for clarification don't make wild guesses.

He who panics first panics best  :P

+1

What's nuts is that we were trickling downwards today anyway. Then the China news a few hours ago. A few coins sold and "boing" up we go like we hit the bottom!  :D All those people with itchy trigger-fingers getting ready for the bottom of the trickle bought in early! Ironically the China news gave the price a new lease of life. Let's see where it goes.

One of the two makes sence, especially the 3.
We would see some official statement if 2. happened I guess

Chinese banks might get burned, if the only way to purchase bitcoin is cash purchase, then people have to withdraw money from banks to purchase bitcoin, and a mass scale of withdraw will create a bank run  :D

Holding like a boss

One thing people are discussing on here is the validity of the China news today. It seems likely that it is a false report. Everyone is panicking from the news of one reporter, who is interpreting one source.

Just sold all my BTC!
Thanks for the advice.

According to this article: http://forexmagnates.com/china-bans-payment-firms-from-working-with-bitcoin-exchanges/

"Upon encountering these rumors on Chinese internet forums the financial newspaper “National Business Daily” contacted the PBOC and the leading third-party payment providers in China, Alipay and Tenpay, and they all confirmed the reports."

Anyway too late to sell I guess, so hold might be better

Yes, but all this bad news is all coming one at a time... It seems like a conspiracy to me.

Who knows what bad news is still to come?

I was going to sell at $900 when the PBOC announcement was made, but then I only managed to sell at $814 earlier today.

A run could only be caused if a large percent of depositors withdraw their money - but bitcoin users are probably something like 0.1% of people in China?

And third-party payment providers had big share of money going in and out of China exchanges ? Bank wire transfers seems most used I guess...

All bullshit;

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1s61x1/what_the_actual_chinese_notice_not_summary_says/

FUD all along then? Okay, but say that's the case, most people are not reading this thread. So, now what?

No surprises here.

I suspect the mis-quote was spread by a whale or 2 that has also since sold some of his BTC to push the price down in preparation for their next big buy.

If it is as simple as a mistranslation/misquote why is btcchina down more than any other exchange. Presumably the people on their can read the original statement as it was written.

I don't know. The article (the English one) seems to indicate that people won't be able to make deposits from banks either, and people have until the Spring Festival (sometime in January?) to withdraw their fiat funds. I can't read Chinese, so I can't confirm this myself.


That's an 11 day old post talking about a completely different topic than the news released yesterday.

Umm.  That link is11 days old and concerns the FIRST announcement.

Wow.

At least people are right about the bs part.  Lots of that handy.

The crash in btcchina speaks of itself. I don't think that the chinese are mislead about an article in reddit or coindesk or in anywhere else.
I think they know better what's going on and they respond by selling...

Someone's noticed the informational uncertainty between China and the West and is exploiting it to manipulate the market. The gullible people will have their lunch eaten by the more astute observers.

I'm in China and speak Chinese:

• The BTC website is still accepting payments from my bank
• I called them and they told me that withdrawals are still happening and I can withdraw FIAT.  My guess is that they are cash rich as people putting money in there and withdrawing it overseas.
• Great arbitrage ops at the moment

Call them again and ask them to make an announcement in the front page and clarify the situtation.

it probably takes a couple of weeks for the law to be implemented.

coin desk did another article today confirming this news further:

http://www.coindesk.com/sources-confirm-chinas-payment-processor-ban-bitcoin-price-falls/

It's my understanding that the China entities have until sometime in January to cut off ties with BTC processors.  So it could either crash now or there could just be downward pressure for a while due to the Chinese selling.  However I bet many Chinese have other ways to buy BTC, unless the gov. blocks all BTC sites, which I have not heard about them trying to do.

Maybe they will find a way through the black market? Chinese probably expected this ban. I'm not seeing a massive price dip yet, given the news and am becoming more skeptical of a crash to the 3 or 500s.

All news that originates from china must be observed carefully. The most recent news about the regulatory update is sketchy at best. Either way bitcoin does as it has in the past massive drop that builds into a massive rise.

The worst scenario seems that chinese exchanges can't be fueled with money any more.

Suspect, this will happen - what will chinese  people do with their bitcoins? If they sell them all on chinese exchanges, prices will drop to a very low bottom. Western exchanges wouldn't follow it, no chance for arbitrage. So chinese bitcoiners could sell Bitcoins way under the global value on their exchanges, hold them to wait for better times, or look for opportunities to spend them - either in a chinese blackmarket or outside china.

Interesting times are coming.