Bitcoin Forum

https://localbitcoins.com/gdpr

Most people knew this was coming but here's the confirmation anyway. ID verification will be required when you hit certain volume limits. Thank the EU rather than them. I presume this'll speed up decentralised options.

Yeah, the rules are really tightening surrounding trading platforms.

I've already been identified as someone with significant trade volume and been asked for my ID. It's honestly disappointing to see a platform previously known for its anonymity all of a sudden requiring so much in terms of KYC, even though it is the EU regulations to blame.

They are still using pretty vague terminology in their terms and conditions, and nobody knows when you'll be asked for ID verification.

You're right, this will probably prompt faster development for decentralised trading options for sure.

If people think this is bad, then look at how the market will turn into one heck of a regulated legal circus.

Governments and their regulations while in some cases are helpful if fairly implemented, are an absolute plague to a free and healthy market development. It's perfectly showing how nervous the current system is.

Funny is that I can buy as many precious metals from whatever site as I want, and that without sharing any details aside from shipping information of course. It's solely meant to slow down crypto.

I can also start trading stocks and securities without verification, so the risks and financing of terrorism authorities always point to as being the reason is just nonsense. Just say it, you are afraid of crypto.  :P

Dunno where you're at, but that's not the case for me in the UK.

Most metals places have a limit on how much you can buy before they start having kittens and I've never come across a stock trading place that lets you get rolling without ID.

If they're not already then crypto services will be the same as everywhere and everything else in the EU - onerous.

Decentralized incentives are great, but they face one challenge they can't (at least for now) overcome, which is to incorporate fiat in a totally decentralized manner. All decentralized platforms right now rely on centralized payment services to settle fiat to crypto transactions, which is something they need to figure out somehow. Only crypto to crypto transactions are truly decentralized.

Tether is somewhat of a decent alternative, but again not decentralized since they work with fiat reserves being held by one party, where on top of that they don't enjoy that much of a clean status with everything going on. Unless we start disregarding fiat and use Bitcoin as base, it will prove to be a real challenge having decentralized platforms offer truly decentralized fiat to crypto trades.

Short of handing over cash in person it can't be done. The best you'll get is keeping your deposit or payment obtuse enough for your bank to not notice or care. And that still does nothing to deal with charge backs or claims of scamming. I'm not sure how these platforms handle it but as they get bigger they'll get ever more gamed.

This is the reason why we should start using decentralized p2p platform but there are not many working options available right now because of budgetary constraints. Bitsquare (decentralized p2p trading platform) started more than year ago but still struggling to survive because  of almost zero fund for marketing and development. Don't know much about other similar platforms but I think all of them are struggling to survive. Localbitcoins like platform should start thinking about moving to decentralized ecosystem to get rid of all this regulatory requirement also this opens up space for dark net based localbitcoins if anyone willing to create one. ;D

Is there a market for a darknet Localbitcoins type service? I think it will have to charge more. The price on keeping your anonymity is high nowadays. If you do not want to. You can always verify your ID on the regular Localbitcoins lol.

I'm pretty sure that when you sell a gold bar to a registered bullion dealer in the UK as well as asking to see your passport they are also compelled to inform HMRC. At least we haven't got that bad yet.

It's difficult to see a way other than f2f cash deals how to avoid ever creeping regulation.

Yup.

https://www.sharpspixley.com/buy-gold-using-bitcoin/

That's the best place to get metals with BTC in the UK. If you're going above £5000 then you have to hand your ID over.

The £5k limit only applies to buying. If you want to sell then you need it for all transactions.

https://www.sharpspixley.com/sell-your-gold/

Fair enough. Note how much less ludicrous that requirement is compared to Bitstamp wanting your tax records and all of your Bitcoin addresses so they can trace everything when they retrospectively demand more info when your money's locked up.

Yeah, that is ludicrous.

I can see this ending up with the government treating Bitcoin as digital gold eventually. It doesn't mention it on that site but I have sold gold bars before and when you do it they make you sign a form that tells you that they will file a report to HMRC. Then you, of course, have to put that on your tax return and pay any CGT if it is due. I'm pretty sure government will catch up and extend that to crypto. Again that applies to licensed bullion dealers, not p2p trades. That's the slightly odd thing about LBC being forced into this, they're being treated as a dealer rather than just a platform hooking up individuals.

So GDPR is looming and exchanges based in the EU have to take note. I agree, all for speeding up decentralized exchanges. I like LBC and we have to note the huge role they have played and continue to play in the space of Bitcoin, allowing so many people to trade in Bitcoin even in places like Iran where it has been banned. It's a shame this had to happen, but at least there is more clarity on personal data among exchanges. Please let's all start using Dexs!

Be happy with the £5000 because here no matter, if it is for buying or selling 10€ your ID card, is required (for taxes purpose mainly). If I didn't have the sea to cross, I would be happy to come in your country to avoid the ridiculous limit in mine.
Belgium and Germany are less strict but can be waste of time

I have had a look at the terms of the site I occasionally buy gold from, and they indeed seem to have a limit they work with, but it's quite easy to bypass. All purchases below €11,345 don't require any identification.

If you stay below that limit, and purchase €11,000 worth of gold per day, you can get access to €77,000 worth of gold on a weekly basis. The site also operates a brick and mortar store, so you can buy with cash as well.

What sort of limits do you face in the UK when buying precious metals?

Do you honestly think they're not going to shut you down after a couple of consecutive buys? That's about as obvious as it gets.

I'm not sure there's any formal limit in the UK but this place has similar ID requirements to the other one noted - https://www.atsbullion.com/faqs/are-there-any-id-requirements/

Localethereum time gents...

Works on a smart contract, you don't need to wait 1 hour for your deposit and doesn't need KYC. I messaged a couple of the top sellers in my region and they are all moving over.

Was a good run.

The reason why Localbitcoin is now asking for ID is to avoid regulatory problems. How sure are you that Localethereum will not be pressured by the regulators to do the same? Is the service decentralized? But what about the website, it can be taken down or given a cease and desist order.

We had seen this that it will come and its happening but the people to be blamed is who I won't subscribe to because the EU cannot just come up with rules and regulations without having something to rely upon. We have read about several activities perpetuated on that platform, disputes that is left with the moderator to decides who is right and wrong without any deep investigation while they frustrate every move to get external help from the police simply because they have nothing to give.

Even though ID verification would come eventually, it should not be this early and the people I blame are those who have turn the crypto market into a funnel of scam, to carry their activities without any fear of being caught because there is no data of them that can be used against them and they can create so many accounts using disposable emails once one account is busted those are the people to be blamed and not EU or any government agency.

Dang, one account per person as well as a lot stricter KYC, it really means that the EU is regulating crypto trading platforms with much more force than before. Hopefully it doesn't turn into a ban altogether in the future, because I can only see these regulations getting stricter.

They actually started limiting people before the new terms were updated, as well.


Whatever reason these regulations are for, it's definitely not to address scammers. LBC was functioning perfectly with its escrow system to deter scammers, and I don't see how forcing people into ID verifying at certain limits would do anything to the scamming problem (which was pretty much nonexistent on LBC anyways) on a large scale.

Probably will be gone in 1-2 years, but for now we have to migrate to localeth, maybe in another couple of months, there will be another site.

Well said.

There are options beyond vanilla websites. People are trading via Telegram groups and so on. And why the hell aren't more operations using Namecoin .bit based sites? That's a censorship resistant option right there.

Even with the perfect functionality it is unable to safeguard its user community from the scammers who make traps in different ways. One such is creating accounts and scamming with ease and leaving it. Now, if the single account is made effective the security of the users get enhanced to some extent.

I think it's more an excuse to introduce an anticipation, something they planned to add long ago and are using this to make 2 in 1 shot
By the way, anyone knows what is this limit in term of volume traded?

I haven't seen a figure named anywhere which I think is a bit uncool myself. I would guess that it's similar to the 10,000 Euro limit where they start getting weird about bank accounts in the EU too, or maybe they'll equate it to cash in which case it's even lower.

namecoin isn't intuitive or easy to use. the wallet sucks; there's just no usability to drive adoption. people squatted lots of domains on the chance that it would take off, but it never did. based on my last look at the protocol a couple years ago, there was hardly anyone in the world set up to actually view .bit sites. a few thousand people maybe. i think it's safe to say that namecoin is a dead project.

in reality, most people just don't care very much. it usually takes the government years to shut anything down or force compliance. once that happens, people tend to just hop on the next centralized alternative. :-\

Nobody knows, nor is it stated clearly in their new terms and conditions. You could have a ban going on you at any moment, and you'd have no chance to argue against it, as long as they think that you're trading with "significant trade volume". It's a completely one sided judgment, if you know what I mean.

For me, the restrictions came onto my account when my trade volume was just around 2-3 BTC or so, over the lifetime of the account. No way was I even an active trader, but they still decided that my volume was significant.

And that's the thing, they should at least tell you when the requirement for verification will come. That way, people don't get a nasty surprise one day but can know in advance. But hey, everything in the EU is tighter now and probably is going to go in that direction in the future as well.

Ok I see. Like we say in my country 'It depends how cute you are'
Then who is going to use a platform if at any time you may be forced to verify (for guys who don't want to give personal info I mean)

There is not a compulsory ID verification for all accounts,and even if you do,you need to disclose your details of you and your bank,every time you do a trade. As it is,its a crypto-fiat trade and not a crypto-crypto trade. This might actually be  better for your future trades.

When you want to post you trade on localbitcoins. You need some amount of bitcoin in your LBC wallet along with you need to share the ID documents and phone number to verify there. If you want to sell your bitcoin to some trader in your location also you need to the get verified if the concern trader have the rule to verify the doc before open the trade.
If you verify your document with LBC you will not be shared to anyone mate. Please do not sell or buy bitcoins in your country's local exchanges.