Bitcoin Forum

Genesis mining has been a major market player when it comes to cloud mining services, the recent turn of invents ( declining bitcoin price and increasing difficulty) does not spell well for those who have contracts with them, investors are now required to pay for upgrade of their open-ended contracts to the new 'RADIANT contracts with just a little discount or else have their open-ended contracts cancelled.
Is this a fair deal with investors?
what do you think?



Credit: https://cointelegraph.com/news/genesis-mining-compels-certain-customers-to-upgrade-btc-mining-contracts

No, it is not fair play as their was no such  passus  in their TOS, if I remember right. I think, they begin to scam and try to get new money for paying out the old contracts, or they will take the money and shutoff their site
To say it clearly. This is in my opinion scam.. Similar things happen at hashflare.

That's bullshit, and if anything, payout rates could fall under maintenance costs again in the future, making the contracts once again worthless. If you're already invested in the site, I would say just leave at this point- not worth continuing to pay for hashrate and then potentially not making the money back on that. I'm definitely bookmarking this page, as this serves as a great example as to why you should never, under no circumstances, invest in cloudmining.

Members hardly get ROI with the previous contract, if they invest again, they will just increase the amount they need to recover. To add, upgrading the contract don't guarantee an increase in Mining Reward, so, better let the contract terminated.

It happened because of the decrease in Bitcoin price together with the mining difficulty, which are unpredictable. Even Genesis stated in their blog (https://blog.genesis-mining.com/bitcoin-contracts-upgrade-live-now-with-a-premium-discount) that they cannot control the two. That being said, if there will be an unexpected downward trend of Bitcoin price together with rising difficulty in the future, this upgrade/terminate option could happen again and again, just like a cycle.

Oh and maybe the discount is a bait?

Why would need up to pay even more? Only dumb or desperate ones would tend to agree into their new terms which is really obvious that they do lure in investors to have no choice but to upgrade yet they do still have a contract. If im not that case then i would just let it cancelled and move on because it doesnt change anything even you do pay up for the upgrade because you would still end up on the same phase or scenario later on.

We've said it before and we'll keep saying it again, for the sake of those not aware of these contract-ending practices from cloud mining services: just don't do it.

Radiant is just the latest ploy to hook in more money from investors. You're being trapped here, making you think you've got 2 choices: end your contract and lose money, or pay a little but more to upgrade in the hopes of recouping losses. The fact is, you can cut your losses right now or put more money in and wait with more worry and stress for the next half a year to break even.

End it, use your money to buy some Bitcoin. In the same period it'd take for you to break even, either Bitcoin will have increased in price and you're in profit, or you still hold Bitcoin. It's really a win-win.

It's guaranteed to happen.

Genesis Mining is looking for creative ways to get fresh money to enter their scheme, because the bear market is really pressing on their platform with how people have no incentive to touch anything related to crypto. I honestly consider this move to be one of the last warning signs that people should really pay attention to, because without money entering they can just as easily claim to not be able to pay out anyone due to the lower price higher difficulty, etc.

My best guess is that Genesis Mining will implode if this bear market lasts for another year, or at least will implode before the block halving in 2020.

Of course it is not a fair deal for investors, but for the people who invested they have no choice this was a blackmail and the situation gets worse when they say the following:



Do they still have space to make discounts? how is this possible? I am not an expert in mining, to be more sincere I do not understand very well the management of this mining business. it is possible to have space to make discounts?


I believe it's time for people to stop investing in cloud mining

Unfortunately, people don't seem to care at all considering that they have been warned not to jump into cloud mining years ago already. The constant supply of new noobs just makes it impossible to see any improvement.

It however makes me wonder if we can take a different approach to combat the popularity of cloud mining. Most newbies invest in cloud mining due to the shills on YouTube praising how profitable and easy it is.

What if we start pooling our efforts together and report videos where YouTubers are over-shilling cloud mining services? I have done so already where it was obvious that it concerned either a referral or paid shill.

The more reports come through the more likely it is that YouTube will step in, or at least I hope they will do.

The popularity of those cloud miners are their ads everywhere and the possibility of to buy contracts on well known auction platform, which is familiar to many noobs. They often don't know better ways to buy into crypto. Additionally they get a placative (and wrong) promise of passive "lifetime" earnings. All we can do is, tell them, how and where to get/buy Bitcoin easily and avoid those scammers.

Absolutely agree with this. At current rates, assuming this (https://www.cryptocompare.com/mining/calculator/btc) mining calculator is correct, current mining revenue daily per TH is around $0.25, and maintenance fees are $0.14 daily, so that makes current (8/20/18) revenue ~$0.11. A stagnation in price or difficulty going up without BTC prices going up will be catastrophic for this new plan, considering current yearly revenue per TH is just $40.15 after electrical costs, and the upgrade is $180, and that's at current difficulty and costs (difficulty will almost certainly rise).

There's just so much risk involved here with difficulty and if the bear market holds that upgrading is just throwing money away/gambling at this point.

They don't say this to new customers when they will sign up and invest in their first mining contract and when situation start to get worse they are trying to defend themselves. All their mining contracts are really expensive in first place and after the end of the contract they can still keep the device bought by their customer's money. So the only one who get maximum profit out of cloud mining is just the cloud mining service operator and not the investors.

That is the reason why we shouldn't trust any cloud mining platform.

Not only is it a guarantee, it has been happening at a pace far quicker than any calculation you've been doing will prepare you for. The only reason a lot of people were profitable earlier was because Bitcoin price had been increasing. But come a bear market like now, along with growing difficulty and hashrate, profitability dries up so quickly.

Implosion is not only inevitable, it is imminent.

I used to operate Hashie. (Plug: Refunds are now available for Hashie users (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4933260.0)).

All of these cloud mining services, at best, are designed so that you never ROI due to difficulty increases. You will do better just by buying bitcoin.

Genesis mining offers lifetime contracts where a lot of nice and attractive words are used for describing them. Seems it's still not enough and they decided to earn more from their scam scheme.
Personally I suggest everyone to not purchace any contract from them, not update your current contract too, you will lose in any way, genesis is already proved as scam: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1185909.0

Lifetime contracts was already over and we have seen they do already have changed those arrangement. BTC do have 5 year contract and 2 years contract for the rest. ETH,DASH,XMR,LTC
those good days are gone when they are just starting of and I do remember those earlier years of business but mining difficulty rises up which they would really normally make such changes and I cant blame them for that and as an investor I don't even see a reason why would I let myself to put up money if I do already know the outcome.