Bitcoin Forum

Bitcoin’s network energy consumption has become somewhat of a hot topic as the cryptocurrency grows in popularity. A clean energy researcher, however, says that naysayers are missing critical factors when making their claims.

"Electricity production can increase while still maintaining a minimal impact on the environment. Rather than focusing on how much energy Bitcoin uses, the discussion should center around who indeed is producing it – and where their power comes from."

Source:

Miners exploit bitcoin massively by investing a lot of Bitcoin mining machinery. This helps the student to earn a lot of money, but it consumes a lot of electricity to run the Bitcoin-based virtual currency. This is quite affecting the environment when producing too much electrical energy. In addition, the problem is that the price of Bitcoin is going down too because of this reason, when Bitcoin is exploited too massively, Bitcoin discount is also natural.

The Researcher is a idiot.  ;)

There is not enough Hydro electric to supply the amount of electricity needed by bitcoin.

The problem is not the current drain of bitcoin , the problem is the energy drain is growing geometrically.
And that Geometric Grow is greater than all of the Energy Growth of all forms of current energy production (Clean or otherwise).
By 2020 , it will be undeniable how bad bitcoin insane energy waste has become.

Unless someone finds a way to create Limitless Energy , the energy waste of bitcoin will be unavoidable within 2 years.


  

Won't change anything. It's not Bitcoin's energy consumption that's the main problem politically, but Bitcoin itself. In other words, even if Bitcoin's entire network runs on clean and environmental friendly energy, politicians and other hate filled idiots will find something else to complain about.

Another thing that people for once need to get straight, is the fact that securing almost $1 trillion in transactions every year isn't waste. I would even like to point out that Bitcoin miners are one of the most consistent industrial energy consumers in existence. We at home on the other hand, are the worst ever actual energy consumers, ahum, wasters the world has ever seen. People need to look at themselves instead of pointing their dirty finger at Bitcoin.

Limitless? We don't need a limitless source of energy, we have the Sun. It has a limit and it's only 5 billion years from now :)
The Sun delivers more energy to Earth in an hour than we use in a year from fossil, nuclear and all renewable sources combined. That said, I see the problem in not using all of that potential power, not the drain or consuming.

This assertion is laughable to say the least.
Only if the poster is aware that , it is estimated that the anount of energy that bitcoin mining consumes  is more than the energy consumped by the entire country of Singapore.

The Amount of Energy Waste is not what secures bitcoin, it is the collusion of the Chinese Miners that secure bitcoin, nothing more nothing less.
If the Chinese Miner switched to an energy efficient consensus , it would be just as secure, because the energy waste is not securing it,
the collusion of the majority is securing it. (Look up 51% attack)

The mere fact that Bitcoin's payment system requires more electricity than multiple countries combined is pure stupidity already and it is just going to get worse.

https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption

This helps the student to earn a lot of money, but it consumes a lot of electricity to run the Bitcoin-based virtual currency. This is quite affecting the environment when producing too much electrical energy

Bitcoin energy consumption has never been an issue not even a "hot topic". what happened was that last year thanks to the big price rise  that we had the FUDsters exhausted their subjects they usually use and they had no more new stuff to use so they started inventing issues. one of them has been the energy consumption. and the thing that is ignored in their arguments is the utilities that bitcoin is providing.

The idea that banks consume more energy than the bitcoin mining is not necessarily so. What makes the energy consumption high is inefficient energy activities, high energy losses etc. The energy crisis, if any should be addressed specifically and in context not using a one off data to generalise the issue on hand

People have been warning about the insane energy waste since 2015.
https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/ae3p7e/bitcoin-is-unsustainable
It is not a new concern. In Fact: Proof of Stake was created in 2013 as a solution to the PoW Energy Waste Issue.

Bitcoin is not providing a utility equal to the energy it wastes.
*IE: Visa Network handles far more transactions and requires far less energy than BitWaste.*
*Almost all Proof of Stake coins can outperform bitcoin transaction capacity at a fraction of the energy used.*

Miners could switch to a more energy efficient consensus , even if they only switched to a more energy efficient PoW such as Groestl or x13 .
It would help slow their insane waste.

This topic is mainly concerned with speculation. Consumption of a large amount of power for mining of bitcoin is not an acute problem for anyone. Soon the mining of bitcoin will end and the topic will be exhausted.

LOL, WTF  ???

Bitcoin Mining won't end unless the bitcoin network dies.

So WTF are you Thinking the mining will end?

This is something good to read, lolz, 1 trillion being wasted over the security. Yeah and what do we know about the banking at all. I guess they are just fooling the crypto community and this hatred will keep on pushing through the market all the time. Even when the bitcoin is costing so much money then why should anyone be worried about the cost and waste of energy! Ask a bitcoin holder from the 2009's or 10's  and he will buy a total hydro power generation plant for them if they think its getting costly affair for them. LOLZ

LOL,  :D :D :D
You have not purchased a Dam recently.

google.com

At the rate Bitcoin Energy Waste is growing , you only got ~2 years to do something , much less 18 years to build a dam.

The thing that most of these idiot that are claiming that Bitcoin is using more energy than the Banking sector are missing, is the

fact that they are simply ignoring the electricity to run these financial operations. Let's look at the bigger picture.. If Bitcoin render

these institutions void, then they would not consume electricity to run their buildings, ATMs, Currency manufacturing and safe

keeping etc... so the bigger picture favours Bitcoin.  ;)

Well AFAIK, bitcoin technology require more electricity power especially when it's difficulty getting increase from time to time.
As I know bitcoin using VGA technology that require  more energy than ordinary process so it's quite confusing when I read the article.
Of course it need more research before finalize !

The problem, is that Bitcoin Usage is growing exponentially at an alarming speed,
the Banking sector is using ~ the same amount of power as it has every year for the past 10 years.
In other words the Utilities can easily keep up with the Banking sector because it energy growth is gradual and it has been around since even before the utilities. Bitcoin is not even 10 years old and it will be using more than the banking sector within 2 years and keep wanting more.

If you bitcoin fanatics were able to freeze bitcoin energy growth to only 15% per year, it would not be that big a problem as the utilities could meet that.

The Problem is Bitcoin Energy Waste is Growing Exponentially!

Which means more harm to the environment and more harm to poor people when they have to compete for electricity with a rich greedy bitcoin miner.

Do you have a reliable source for this statistic? I know bitcoin uses a lot of energy but having the said statistic makes literally no sense and is somewhat trying to give banks the positive vibe in here.


And at this point, I'm convinced that you just hate bitcoin for what it is now. Idk where are you getting your stats from, and with the amount of digitization and infrastructure added to banks after a couple decades, I don't think their power consumption would be the same as to where it was back then. Imagine, AC units, a bunch of computers, servers etc. etc. are being used by them everyday, and do you think with those added things electricity would remain stagnant? Of course not.



We all know that that would be improbable unless bitcoin switches into some form of greener algorithm, but that would, IMO, decrease the 'value' of the coin itself. Bitcoin's energy waste is not a problem, heck, the world's energy waste problem started from factories and the improper handling of greenhouse gases (CFCs and the likes). Also, garbage disposal is waaaaaay more dangerous and alarming than bitcoin's energy usage and output, but why are we turning a blind eye on to such things? Ahhh let me think, because bitcoin is a piggy bank waiting to be cracked by the banks and governments for profit. It's quite hypocritical to think that the people who seem to care about our environment are actually the same people who are the least concerned about even bigger problems.

@dothebeats

Bitcoin makes a massive amount of money , and they can't bother to spend any research to improve their energy efficiency.
All the data is out there, use your time and google it.

Most of you moon junkies, care little about the environmental or personal damage bitcoin does ,
which is why what is coming in ~2 years you will deserve.

That's why countries that keep using coal to create electricity should finaly change for other sources like wind, water and solar panels. Nothing will change just because we say that thing are going wrong.

I'm curious to know when they says "banks", do they mean literally just the banks or also the intermediaries like Automated Clearing Houses and all the Visa/MasterCard/AmEx/etc infrastructure?  Perhaps the real figure is even worse for fiat and the environmental scales actually tip further in our favour.



It's worth considering that Zin-Zang's presence in this thread is purely to promote the "energy efficient" shitecoin in his sig.  He might think he's doing a good job of promoting it, but since it's tied to his name and all he does is spout a load of mindless drivel all over the boards, he's probably doing more harm than good to the reputation of his preferred alt.  Judging by his posts, I'm happy to assume he's a total moron and I would strongly recommend against investing in any project he's actively promoting.

Personal hate speech toward me is all you got , looks to me like you are the jackass.

So how come bitcoin developers are too stupid to make the PoW more energy efficient?
Answer that doomad.

*I am sure the miners would appreciate the lower energy bills.*

FYI:
Cars improve their gas mileage.
Lights become more energy efficient.
Appliances improve their energy efficiently.
Almost every product either maintains or improves their energy use every few years, while bitcoin just wastes more with no increase in performance.

Wasting Energy is Lame ,and the people ignoring it in bitcoin are also lame doomad.
In other words go fix your shit!, so we don't have to point it out.

The fact that your question demonstrates your total lack of any understanding of the nuances involved only supports what I'm saying.  It's down to the hardware manufacturers to make the ASICs as energy efficient as they can.  Miners need to take that into consideration when they make their purchases.  In terms of the algorithm, it's not as simple as merely "making it more energy efficient", it's about finding consensus to change it.  Changes to the algorithm invariably require a hardfork and also tend to have consequences for the overall security of the network.  People need to agree before it can be replaced with a new one.  Devs can't just go around making whatever changes they like.  It doesn't work that way.  At least try to have a rudimentary comprehension of how this stuff works before you go running your mouth off, please.

Banks would soon include bitcoin in their portfolio of services. Does that mean the electricity required will be doubled?  :D

You just said an algo change could make the difference,

Devs can change any damn thing they like, did they not soft fork and shove segwit down everyone throat, that no one really wanted.
Or have you forgotten why bitcoin split into two separate communities when it used to be only one.
They could slowly hybrid fork into a more energy efficient PoW algo and transition over a year or two.
(ASICS have to be replaced within every two years anyway.)

Fact is the Devs are too lazy to move to another PoW and too lazy to move to PoS.

So the world has to suffer because your bitcoin devs are too lazy to fix their wasteful consensus method.

And you go around defending lazy people and insult people that have already moved to a energy solution for their coin.

What kind of dumbass does that make you?


FYI:
You don't think the miners want a cheaper energy bill?
I suggest you poll them , and I bet they do want their energy cost to be lower so they can make more profit.
 

Yes, a change of algorithm could make it more energy efficient.  But if the miners care about their money, what they absolutely don't want to do is have to buy all new hardware because their current hardware isn't compatible with whatever new algorithm gets proposed.  ASICs are built for one hash function.  It's more energy efficient that way ( ;) ).  So, believe it or not, it's actually the miners who would be most strongly opposed to changing the algorithm.  If everyone else on the network decided that we had to change the algorithm, but the miners decided to keep using the old one because they don't want to replace their mining gear, we then have a big problem.  This, in turn leads to the aforementioned security issues.  If we experience a sudden drop in hashrate, it could leave the network vulnerable to attack.  It's all network effects and market forces.  If you can't even understand why it works like it does, don't go bleating about what you think could be done better.  

You have to earn the right to call people a dumbass by making sure that you know what you're talking about first, dumbass.

ASICS have to be replaced every 2 years, at 2 years old it is not even worth turning on.

Your pretense that a 2nd PoW can not be forked in and slowly become the dominant hash while phasing the old PoW out, shows you don't know shit.

Sorry , but I call a dumbass when I see one , and you are a dumbass. :-*
(I consider that a right granted by the creator.)

FYI:
It ain't my coin wasting the world's electricity , it is yours.

FYI2:
The miners would jump for joy , for new asics that cut their electricity bills in half.
They have to buy all new asics within 2 years anyway!

FYI3:
https://www.myriadcoin.org/
They support 5 Algorithms and you are saying the bitcoin devs are too stupid to hybrid two algorithms while phasing the wasteful one out.
 
FYI4:
Hell , even Theymos wanted Bitcoin to evolve into a 3 algo coin in 2016, did you want to insult him too?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1654457

If you actually learned to read, I never said it couldn't be done, I'm merely pointing out that it's not as simple as your tiny insect brain perceives it to be.  It still requires a hardfork unless someone has an absolute stroke of genius (so clearly not you) and finds a backwards-compatible way to implement it.  And SegWit was categorically not a case of devs forcing a change.  It took ages to get miners to agree to run it and even required the intervention of a non-Core contributor to write some new code in the form of BIP91 to help break the deadlock.  You and franky1 are constantly trying to rewrite history from this period and you both need to get a clue in your empty heads.

Putting that idiocy to one side, now your options are either:

a) Make it yourself,
b) Pay someone to make it,
c) STFU and wait patiently for someone to care enough to make it because they want to.

Then, once you've done one of those, do all of these:

Put it on testnet,
Find and fix any security issues and other bugs,
Put it out there in the market and see who runs it.

Or did you naturally assume that developers are just going to drop everything and start work on all this right away because you called them lazy?  You don't get to call others lazy if you aren't going to lift a finger to make it happen.  That's called hypocrisy. 

You're just peeved because Franky1 is smarter than you.   :D
(No one but you mentioned him here.)

You're the one that claims Bitcoin is the next coming, so go fix it yourself.

Some of us have already fixed it in our coins.  :)
(Source code is available to all.)

or just keep lying and pretend it is all ok.  :P

In the immortal words of iamnotback,  I have better things to do that waste any more time on you.   8)