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Title: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: imjustagirl on September 08, 2018, 09:20:30 PM Hi guys,
I was investigating the recent market plunge and this is my two cents as to why the crypto market is experiencing this situation. Some people were tying this to the fake news about Goldman Sachs crypto desk plans change, but I think this is due to an exchange faking data. The news that BitForex is faking data came around auguest 26th. Now this is what can really be happening on the market. An exchange lists fake data about the price dropping rapidly, then it buys the real crypto at the discount price (knowing that the price is "fake") on other exchanges. After this, the same exchange spams fake data the other way around and sells the currency at the real or overvalued price = profit! Today Coinmarketcap states that BitForex ethereum volume is $1,090,589,986, which is 40% of the whole market. I do not see a real economic situation in which this can be true. The question is when will such hoax schemes of market manipulation stop? Really, coinmarketcap was such a trusted source of market data and now this is just a very sad situation. What do you think? What are your speculations about the recent price changes? Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: davis196 on September 09, 2018, 05:28:55 AM "lists fake data"?Where?
So you think that only one crypto trading platform can manipulate the entire market by just spamming fake data about prices?Are you talking about ethereum price manipulation only,or about all cryptocurrenicy prices being manipulated?Spamming around social media and crypto news websites isn't for free,This requires serious investment.I'm pretty sure that some altcoin can be manipulated by using this method,but it just won't work with bitcoin. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: aoihs00 on September 09, 2018, 06:14:21 AM "lists fake data"?Where? So you think that only one crypto trading platform can manipulate the entire market by just spamming fake data about prices?Are you talking about ethereum price manipulation only,or about all cryptocurrenicy prices being manipulated?Spamming around social media and crypto news websites isn't for free,This requires serious investment.I'm pretty sure that some altcoin can be manipulated by using this method,but it just won't work with bitcoin. I guess this has got to be related with the CMC data manipulation. It is proven that CMC is always playing with the prices and they are not showing the real time data or may be they are showing prices which are either less or more at a time and present them in that way so that people can take the wrong decision while investing. This is meant to be manipulated because if the prices are shown less then people tend to buy huge amount of money and thus price naturally grows for the market and they can benefit from this pump. Similar things can be done with the exchangers also and many think that most of the exchangers keep doing such manipulation all the time. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: peter0425 on September 09, 2018, 10:26:58 AM ~ snip ~ I don't know if you are aware about the fake volumes and manipulations done by the Chinese exchange during the early part of 2017. And then suddenly Chinese turn their backs on country for good. But to stop it globally, I don't think its possible because we all know that cypto is decentralized and free market. So there's no central authority to look at this so called fake volumes or market manipulations. I agree that its very fraudulent but I don't think that its the first time that we have witnessed it. It's just very obvious lately because of the bear market and every tilt of the price is noticeable. So the only thing we can do is just be vigilant and take every precautions possible to avoid losses in our end.The question is when will such hoax schemes of market manipulation stop? Really, coinmarketcap was such a trusted source of market data and now this is just a very sad situation. What do you think? What are your speculations about the recent price changes? Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Ranly123 on September 09, 2018, 10:51:46 AM Hi guys, I was investigating the recent market plunge and this is my two cents as to why the crypto market is experiencing this situation. Some people were tying this to the fake news about Goldman Sachs crypto desk plans change, but I think this is due to an exchange faking data. The news that BitForex is faking data came around auguest 26th. Now this is what can really be happening on the market. An exchange lists fake data about the price dropping rapidly, then it buys the real crypto at the discount price (knowing that the price is "fake") on other exchanges. After this, the same exchange spams fake data the other way around and sells the currency at the real or overvalued price = profit! Today Coinmarketcap states that BitForex ethereum volume is $1,090,589,986, which is 40% of the whole market. I do not see a real economic situation in which this can be true. The question is when will such hoax schemes of market manipulation stop? Really, coinmarketcap was such a trusted source of market data and now this is just a very sad situation. What do you think? What are your speculations about the recent price changes? Maybe you got the point that there is market manipulation on crypto prices. But with that you have stated, one exchange cannot manipulate the whole market of crypto. Maybe fraudulent news or price data has been spread to misguide investors but they cannot totally manipulate crypto prices. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: kryptqnick on September 09, 2018, 10:55:20 AM An exchange lists fake data about the price dropping rapidly, then it buys the real crypto at the discount price (knowing that the price is "fake") on other exchanges. I've never heard about the data on price dynamics being faked, could you provide a source of proof? I still trust coinmarketcap more than anything and I'd relaly like to know whether it is not to be trusted anymore. I do remember an article on 'top' (de facto top, but the names don't sound familiar) exchanges faking their thading volume to get in the lists of the best exchanges: https://www.blockchaintransparency.org/reports/. Any manipulations of such kinds are undermining the trust of people and that can only lead to panic selling. And yet I still believe that the main reason behind the market going down is non-believing investors and regular insignificant but bad news.After this, the same exchange spams fake data the other way around and sells the currency at the real or overvalued price = profit! Today Coinmarketcap states that BitForex ethereum volume is $1,090,589,986, which is 40% of the whole market. Really, coinmarketcap was such a trusted source of market data and now this is just a very sad situation. What do you think? What are your speculations about the recent price changes? Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: GDragon on September 09, 2018, 11:18:12 AM As my own perspective, the market was not responsible for this scheme, it will not do a thing that can hurt their clients because at the end of the day, investors are their main player here. So you may think that manipulation might be done by the whales or a group of investors.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: tomahawk9 on September 09, 2018, 11:21:06 AM Really, coinmarketcap was such a trusted source of market data and now this is just a very sad situation. What do you think? What are your speculations about the recent price changes? CMC is not to be trusted, they already have a histority of data manipulation to manipulate the entire cryptosphere, but I doubt some they're behind the recent drop. What we're seeing lately is just blatant market manipulation, big whales playing games by dumping big chuncks of btc to scare off the weak hands and panic sellers so that the price goes further down. I don't know if exchanges are also trying to bring the prices down, but I wouldn't be surprised to see them collaborating with the whales, at the end of the day, it's all a business. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Kakmakr on September 09, 2018, 11:30:11 AM Price manipulation is one of the reasons why the SEC is reluctant to approve Bitcoin ETF's, but that is not necessarily a bad thing. ;D We have had price manipulation on some less reputable exchanges for many years and this was so severe at one stage that some governments had to close down these exchanges.
The best thing you can do is to exclude these exchanges from price determination, if it is proven that these exchanges are being dishonest. I seldom use the prices being reported from the smaller and less known Crypto currency exchanges. ::) You can also add and remove exchanges from sites like Preev.com, where a average price is being calculated from different data sources. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: 1Referee on September 09, 2018, 12:18:40 PM Price manipulation is one of the reasons why the SEC is reluctant to approve Bitcoin ETF's, but that is not necessarily a bad thing. ;D We have had price manipulation on some less reputable exchanges for many years and this was so severe at one stage that some governments had to close down these exchanges. Price manipulation happens everywhere, so that's not really the main criteria for them to keep rejecting ETF's. The SEC wants to walk into an exchange office within their own jurisdiction and raid the crap out of it in order to find out who the bad actors are in case of manipulation. Currently that's near impossible since exchanges operating within the US are so called 'following' exchanges and not those that are leading the market. The collection of current leading exchanges consists of Bitfinex, Binance, Huobi, OKEx, Bithumb. All Asian focused. No way the SEC is going to allow an ETF to come through like this. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Semosuchi Tesongrato on September 09, 2018, 09:12:00 PM Big investors have always manipulated the market with more or less legitimate means, spreading rumors, or suddenly making big purchases or big sales.
In the world of crytpo, where everything is firmly in the hands of the whales, it is even more possible. But to think that someone can influence the data of ALL the exchange ... well, it seems to me frankly science fiction. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: hubballi on September 09, 2018, 09:28:47 PM Hi guys, I was investigating the recent market plunge and this is my two cents as to why the crypto market is experiencing this situation. Some people were tying this to the fake news about Goldman Sachs crypto desk plans change, but I think this is due to an exchange faking data. The news that BitForex is faking data came around auguest 26th. Now this is what can really be happening on the market. An exchange lists fake data about the price dropping rapidly, then it buys the real crypto at the discount price (knowing that the price is "fake") on other exchanges. After this, the same exchange spams fake data the other way around and sells the currency at the real or overvalued price = profit! Today Coinmarketcap states that BitForex ethereum volume is $1,090,589,986, which is 40% of the whole market. I do not see a real economic situation in which this can be true. The question is when will such hoax schemes of market manipulation stop? Really, coinmarketcap was such a trusted source of market data and now this is just a very sad situation. What do you think? What are your speculations about the recent price changes? I totally agree that This coinmarketcap is just a fake and exchanges are making false trading and increasing their site trading value, so that seeing that more users will join the site and they will get more users joining. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: deisik on September 09, 2018, 09:29:23 PM "lists fake data"?Where? So you think that only one crypto trading platform can manipulate the entire market by just spamming fake data about prices?Are you talking about ethereum price manipulation only,or about all cryptocurrenicy prices being manipulated?Spamming around social media and crypto news websites isn't for free,This requires serious investment.I'm pretty sure that some altcoin can be manipulated by using this method,but it just won't work with bitcoin. I guess this has got to be related with the CMC data manipulation. It is proven that CMC is always playing with the prices and they are not showing the real time data or may be they are showing prices which are either less or more at a time and present them in that way so that people can take the wrong decision while investing. This is meant to be manipulated because if the prices are shown less then people tend to buy huge amount of money and thus price naturally grows for the market and they can benefit from this pump. Similar things can be done with the exchangers also and many think that most of the exchangers keep doing such manipulation all the time. As for myself, I don't believe very much in such things (or stories), like someone manipulating prices up and down now and then. Yeah, I know, you're not paranoid, they are really watching you. But you can't beat reality, at least not all the time. So if someone is selling a few (dozen) thousand bitcoins, no amount of manipulation will be able to stop prices from crashing. It works the other way as good. If someone with really deep pockets shells out and buys as many bitcoins, no manipulator will be able to stop prices from surging. In fact, real manipulation makes sense and takes place when the market is willing to be manipulated That's what market manipulation theorists seem to forget most of the time Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: ovbokhan on September 09, 2018, 09:31:01 PM It sound reasonable that those who profited from the recent price manipulation were the same persons that paid for the promotion of the fake news that caused the panic
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: fempat on September 09, 2018, 09:36:54 PM Hi guys, I was investigating the recent market plunge and this is my two cents as to why the crypto market is experiencing this situation. Some people were tying this to the fake news about Goldman Sachs crypto desk plans change, but I think this is due to an exchange faking data. The news that BitForex is faking data came around auguest 26th. Now this is what can really be happening on the market. An exchange lists fake data about the price dropping rapidly, then it buys the real crypto at the discount price (knowing that the price is "fake") on other exchanges. After this, the same exchange spams fake data the other way around and sells the currency at the real or overvalued price = profit! Today Coinmarketcap states that BitForex ethereum volume is $1,090,589,986, which is 40% of the whole market. I do not see a real economic situation in which this can be true. The question is when will such hoax schemes of market manipulation stop? Really, coinmarketcap was such a trusted source of market data and now this is just a very sad situation. What do you think? What are your speculations about the recent price changes? Maybe you got the point that there is market manipulation on crypto prices. But with that you have stated, one exchange cannot manipulate the whole market of crypto. Maybe fraudulent news or price data has been spread to misguide investors but they cannot totally manipulate crypto prices. It might not be just a single exchange. What if there are several others that are doing this also? We haven't heard about them yet because they have not been exposed. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: abruchifid on September 09, 2018, 09:39:48 PM The market may continue until people finally understand how it is played and will be less inclined to sell off their bitcoins in a panic or dump in price, it will gradually become less severe as everyone will learn to ignore it.And the market will just grow naturally
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: hxtop on September 09, 2018, 11:22:18 PM Of course, all sorts of price manipulations are heavily influencing the crypto market. Unlike manipulations this year, I think the changing economic conditions in the world are also having a negative effect on the crypto market.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: lephuqui on September 10, 2018, 12:10:00 AM Hi guys, I see the launch of many fud + spam large amount of transactions is absolutely not true. They are trying to make us think that there is a huge sale going on in the market and withdrawing from it. Trading volatility is quite unusual, perhaps this will be a terrible dump of the market this year. Prices may go down so they can accumulate a large amount to complete a year of decline for the market. And hold enough coins to keep the market.I was investigating the recent market plunge and this is my two cents as to why the crypto market is experiencing this situation. Some people were tying this to the fake news about Goldman Sachs crypto desk plans change, but I think this is due to an exchange faking data. The news that BitForex is faking data came around auguest 26th. Now this is what can really be happening on the market. An exchange lists fake data about the price dropping rapidly, then it buys the real crypto at the discount price (knowing that the price is "fake") on other exchanges. After this, the same exchange spams fake data the other way around and sells the currency at the real or overvalued price = profit! Today Coinmarketcap states that BitForex ethereum volume is $1,090,589,986, which is 40% of the whole market. I do not see a real economic situation in which this can be true. The question is when will such hoax schemes of market manipulation stop? Really, coinmarketcap was such a trusted source of market data and now this is just a very sad situation. What do you think? What are your speculations about the recent price changes? Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: entrepmind23 on September 10, 2018, 12:39:19 AM Of course, all sorts of price manipulations are heavily influencing the crypto market. Unlike manipulations this year, I think the changing economic conditions in the world are also having a negative effect on the crypto market. In our country alone, people are having problems how to budget their salaries because of the continuous increase of the basic necessities due to inflation that's why the investment vehicles are down not only in cryptocurrency market but including the stock market and exchange rates are going down as well. We are currently in a financial crisis that's why the market is down and you add to it the bad news about every thing related to bitcoin and it would cause people to panic sell. The market may continue until people finally understand how it is played and will be less inclined to sell off their bitcoins in a panic or dump in price, it will gradually become less severe as everyone will learn to ignore it.And the market will just grow naturally Every time the market goes down, it's not only the newbies who panic sell that are doing it but those who are professional traders are selling as well because they know how to short the market and if you have observed in the past, it is more profitable to short it because it's going down too fast compared to going up that's why they are at an advantage when it comes to shorting and when it drops, it drops hard. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: deisik on September 10, 2018, 05:36:09 AM Every time the market goes down, it's not only the newbies who panic sell that are doing it but those who are professional traders are selling as well because they know how to short the market and if you have observed in the past, it is more profitable to short it because it's going down too fast compared to going up that's why they are at an advantage when it comes to shorting and when it drops, it drops hard. Personally, I don't think that naked shorting makes sense unless you have insider info. I recall when a couple years ago some dude lost something like 600 bitcoins (when the price was still below $1000). He obviously expected that it wouldn't go above that mark and would soon correct, but it didn't happen and the price went exponential well beyond 1000 as we all now know. And in the end this hapless trader had his position forcefully liquidated by the exchange. Shorting makes sense when you are hedging, for example, against volatility or even exchange itself and their dirty tricks, while naked shorts can be fatal to your account sooner than you think Always remember that with shorts your profit potential is limited while your losses are limited only by the balance of your account Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Kakmakr on September 10, 2018, 05:54:37 AM Price manipulation is one of the reasons why the SEC is reluctant to approve Bitcoin ETF's, but that is not necessarily a bad thing. ;D We have had price manipulation on some less reputable exchanges for many years and this was so severe at one stage that some governments had to close down these exchanges. Price manipulation happens everywhere, so that's not really the main criteria for them to keep rejecting ETF's. The SEC wants to walk into an exchange office within their own jurisdiction and raid the crap out of it in order to find out who the bad actors are in case of manipulation. Currently that's near impossible since exchanges operating within the US are so called 'following' exchanges and not those that are leading the market. The collection of current leading exchanges consists of Bitfinex, Binance, Huobi, OKEx, Bithumb. All Asian focused. No way the SEC is going to allow an ETF to come through like this. There might be one way of doing this, that would satisfy them and that would be for these global exchanges to install the Stock exchange surveillance software that are running on all the major stock exchanges. Example, NASDAQ OMX offers a market surveillance product called SMARTS. ::) https://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/marketsurveillence.asp So this denial of these ETFs might just be a smoke screen excuse to get exchanges to install this software and to destroy Bitcoin anonymity. ::) Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: coinplus on September 11, 2018, 06:50:56 AM I do not think just because there is a manipulation on the exchange market data the whole market is reacting according to it. I mean I am not arguing against the fact that there is market manipulation but the manipulation of data is not the problem, the problem is the manipulation of peoples thoughts on the price trends, the price move according to what people think it will do and when you manipulate enough people to make them think the price is going down, they will sell and when they sell the price will go down, just a big whale (or group of whales) selling a tiny amount can make a snowball affect on the price.
Currently that's near impossible since exchanges operating within the US are so called 'following' exchanges and not those that are leading the market. I understand this is kind of tug of war. Those who are following the norms of USA unable to achieve the leadership. This is the reason why Winklevoss brother's Genimi exchange is not a big hit yet again these brothers want to enter another bitcoin business i.e. ETF whereas their first venture should have been the key for second one.Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Findingnemo on September 11, 2018, 06:55:40 AM Yes this can be one of the important reason but why the users were just reacting when they see the prices on an exchange or coinmarketcap they need to analyse the prices of different sites,so the full blame go to the lazy investors so the whales are using them as trap to bag good profits.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: deisik on September 11, 2018, 07:01:20 AM I do not think just because there is a manipulation on the exchange market data the whole market is reacting according to it. I mean I am not arguing against the fact that there is market manipulation but the manipulation of data is not the problem, the problem is the manipulation of peoples thoughts on the price trends, the price move according to what people think it will do and when you manipulate enough people to make them think the price is going down, they will sell and when they sell the price will go down, just a big whale (or group of whales) selling a tiny amount can make a snowball affect on the price. The process you describe here (which is properly called crowd manipulation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crowd_manipulation)) exists everywhere. It is conspicuously omnipresent in politics since ancient times. The methods and instruments developed and sharpened there through millenia are working exceptionally well with financial markets too. In fact, I would even say that in this field specifically they are working even better than elsewhere because people here are easily susceptible to fear, uncertainty, anxiety, doubt, i.e. everything which promotes successful manipulation So no surprise that people get manipulated constantly Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: prokerduit on September 11, 2018, 07:52:15 AM it's very difficult to stop it, because that is part of the team market's strategy. indeed, coinmarketcap is the best and most trusted in my opinion, the data from coinmarketcap is very clear and detailed
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Viviornitier on September 11, 2018, 08:12:45 AM we still have fiat currency as well. An economic collapse with the magnitude to make the dollar or euro worthless will equally make bitcoin worthless.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: ObsidianCharlie on September 11, 2018, 08:19:56 AM we still have fiat currency as well. An economic collapse with the magnitude to make the dollar or euro worthless will equally make bitcoin worthless. Or it may make it worthy. Transferring your assets into crypto when fiat is becoming worth less makes perfect sens imho. If others think like that, too, this would increase bitcoin price.Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: 1Referee on September 11, 2018, 01:01:00 PM There might be one way of doing this, that would satisfy them and that would be for these global exchanges to install the Stock exchange surveillance software that are running on all the major stock exchanges. Example, NASDAQ OMX offers a market surveillance product called SMARTS. ::) It's not going to combat bad actors operating on exchanges outside the reach of US regulators, because all the action happens in Asia. You can already see that the regulated exchanges within the US have turned into brave kiddies not doing much wrong. Their volumes have gone down significantly due to how there is more regulative oversight now.https://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/marketsurveillence.asp So this denial of these ETFs might just be a smoke screen excuse to get exchanges to install this software and to destroy Bitcoin anonymity. ::) People using exchanges don't have any anonymity to begin with, so what's not there can't be destroyed. You know what I consider to be a smoke screen excuse? All these sudden changes to grant governments more precious information about users. We don't know how much of people's information has been given to governments already in the last couple of years. It's surely more than enough to prosecute ignorant large holders if they want to. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: carlisle1 on September 11, 2018, 01:36:57 PM I don't wanna speculate and I don’t want to bring burden to my mind by thinking whats the reason and so and sk,because i trust cryptocurrency and most specially bitcoin.i will be contented on whats the value now and besides i can still make some income even this market drops more than grows
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: gabmen on September 11, 2018, 06:34:24 PM Yes this can be one of the important reason but why the users were just reacting when they see the prices on an exchange or coinmarketcap they need to analyse the prices of different sites,so the full blame go to the lazy investors so the whales are using them as trap to bag good profits. Exactly. That's why i don't really rely on just onr exchange since they don't have the same value for all the coins they have from other exchanges. I learned this a long time ago when it was still sensible to buy one coin from one site and sell it in another. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: btccrusher on September 11, 2018, 07:25:43 PM The top cryptocurrency exchange like OKex, Huobi and many more are actually misleading the market with fake trade volume/ non-existent trades. In coimarketcap they are in top five exchange but it is pathetic to know that they are fake. The crypto trader Sylvain Ribes accusing that 93% of trade volume is fake. What do you think? Here is a link for his explanation and analysis https://medium.com/@sylvainartplayribes/chasing-fake-volume-a-crypto-plague-ea1a3c1e0b5e
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: shinharu10282016 on September 11, 2018, 10:00:40 PM We can't really hold true of anything the market has going through up until now. Why do I say that? Many people are so into pumps and dumps, news agencies spreading quotes by many rich people like Elon Musk and the likes, how the CEO of this company says crypto is dumb and people are all going panicky about these. Why are we so easily swayed by this? Why do we keep being involved in this? If you think you can get rich by holding certain crypto then do it. In this world, you have no one to trust but yourself. The market is down because of many reasons and people are swayed by it. That is why the market is down.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: darkangel11 on September 11, 2018, 10:45:13 PM Personally, I don't think that naked shorting makes sense unless you have insider info. I recall when a couple years ago some dude lost something like 600 bitcoins (when the price was still below $1000). He obviously expected that it wouldn't go above that mark and would soon correct, but it didn't happen and the price went exponential well beyond 1000 as we all now know. And in the end this hapless trader had his position forcefully liquidated by the exchange. Idiot was bearish in a bull market. We were in a bull market since well below 500 USD and he didn't notice. Many people got screwed by trying to be bullish in this bear market that we're seeing right now. Trading against the trend is one the most common mistakes. That said, my opinion is: fuck shorts, true bitcoiners go long. We need this bear market to finally end. I've heard stories of a guy from my town who lost all his money and money borrowed from his family by trying to short with high leverage. Shorting is gambling, you're paying the house a large chunk of your money for the potential chance of a quick gain. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: timerland on September 11, 2018, 11:46:44 PM I think that the primary stakeholders with exchanges manipulating their stats would be the users themselves - they are essentially gamed into thinking that they are trading on some major exchange, while in fact their volumes are in fact, faked.
A major exchange faking their statistics would influence total bitcoin trading volume as well, probably to a lesser extent. Some people do trade bitcoin according to the volume, but I think that overall, if anything, faked volumes would in fact drives prices up somewhat instead of down. I don't think it makes much of a difference anyways. I don't think that anyone is faking "prices", here. It's just volume, and there are no reports I could find of Bitforex faking prices altogether. The price drops we see are most likely due to regulatory concerns of Goldman Sachs and just the bear market itself, and shouldn't be affected by exchanges faking volumes per se. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Flor1982 on September 12, 2018, 04:50:26 AM I don't think this is possible because i don't think if all market exchanges can be possibly to unite just to manipulate the crypto currency prices. It will be difficult if only one market will release a false data just to manipulate the whole world wide prices but if they (market exchanges) will all conspire to do this manipulation then it will be possible.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: deisik on September 12, 2018, 05:30:25 AM Personally, I don't think that naked shorting makes sense unless you have insider info. I recall when a couple years ago some dude lost something like 600 bitcoins (when the price was still below $1000). He obviously expected that it wouldn't go above that mark and would soon correct, but it didn't happen and the price went exponential well beyond 1000 as we all now know. And in the end this hapless trader had his position forcefully liquidated by the exchange. Idiot was bearish in a bull market. We were in a bull market since well below 500 USD and he didn't notice. Many people got screwed by trying to be bullish in this bear market that we're seeing right now. Trading against the trend is one the most common mistakes. That said, my opinion is: fuck shorts, true bitcoiners go long. We need this bear market to finally end. I've heard stories of a guy from my town who lost all his money and money borrowed from his family by trying to short with high leverage. Shorting is gambling, you're paying the house a large chunk of your money for the potential chance of a quick gain. It is not like just shorting is gambling, it is all trading which is gambling unless you truly know what you are doing. And not just think you do but actually do. For example, shorts may come in quite handy. With them you can hedge against the risk of an exchange going bust provided the exchange allows margin trading in the first place (which is kind of obvious). I don't even mention a lot of other more sophisticated strategies of spreading risks over many exchanges through shorts. But these would always be covered shorts, i.e. you don't lose much however strong the market may go against you. On the other hand, reckless naked shorts are a shortcut to a disaster as many traders learned the hard way Just because you can short doesn't mean you should Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: gambitcoin53 on September 12, 2018, 05:38:37 AM if this is true then it really must be stopped, faking market data is a serious crime, if you have watched the movie of leonardo di caprio, the famous pump and dump method that is artificially inflating the price just to look expensive to other players, a lot of exchanges are using this, i have no solid proof though, but i think it can happen and can be done.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Ericgreen on September 12, 2018, 12:59:27 PM The market may continue until people finally understand how it is played and will be less inclined to sell off their bitcoins in a panic or dump in price, it will gradually become less severe as everyone will learn to ignore it.And the market will just grow naturally People will only be able to understand anything until they start seeing the need to use it. The nature of the market currently tends towards the speculative side, and in that case for a very much decentralized market, I would not expect not to see any form of manipulation. Manipulations are there every time for most markets and it is really nothing new like someone rightly said, and for things like this to change, this is the reason it would be more appealing to see a decentralized market get to do better in the long run with real life usage, more demand for it, and less manipulation as the case may be. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Andrej Peiboski on September 12, 2018, 11:30:40 PM I do not see where the news is: the investors have always manipulated the markets in their favor.
Then, there are always new methods, and this could be really dangerous; however, I doubt it is really possible. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: el kaka22 on September 13, 2018, 09:02:40 AM it's very difficult to stop it, because that is part of the team market's strategy. indeed, coinmarketcap is the best and most trusted in my opinion, the data from coinmarketcap is very clear and detailed It is a general thing in any market and as long as you will keep having people with big stash of the money, there will always be market makers who are simply the ones driving the price in the way they want or simply suit them or how the market is currently perceived. This kind of thing is generally curtailed to an extent in a stock market and even though it is not allowed as it is against the rule, it still happens even though on a little scale.Let alone, for a market that is totally decentralized, no regulation, and so on, then that is just like an open target for the whales. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: anderson705 on September 13, 2018, 09:36:18 AM if this is true then it really must be stopped, faking market data is a serious crime, if you have watched the movie of leonardo di caprio, the famous pump and dump method that is artificially inflating the price just to look expensive to other players, a lot of exchanges are using this, i have no solid proof though, but i think it can happen and can be done. I think its possible, just read somewhere that even Bitmex was accused of manipulating prices of a certain coin. We dont know, but its possible it may happen. Also, maybe they are doign a worldwide FUD network to influence cryptocurrency price. All are speculation but its happening and we are asking why. Is BitMEX Manipulating the Price of Ether; CEO Arthur Hayes Claims ETH Will Drop Below $100 (https://bitcoinexchangeguide.com/bitmex-accused-of-manipulating-ether-price-as-ceo-claims-eth-will-drop-below-100/) Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Ewinsane on September 15, 2018, 09:45:50 AM Of course, all sorts of price manipulations are heavily influencing the crypto market. Unlike manipulations this year, I think the changing economic conditions in the world are also having a negative effect on the crypto market. Changing economic conditions has always been outcomes of bad economic policies, manipulations, controls, monopolies by the government, name them! Now, if care is not taken, just like we started having price suppression for physical assets such as gold and silver, these same set of manipulators will want to make the space the same thing. The only solution to this is for people to realize this should not be just about them getting rich over night, but basically having the freedom to spend without being tied to the government bullshit policies that is affecting everything globally. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Guideare on September 15, 2018, 10:06:24 AM The market may continue until people finally understand how it is played and will be less inclined to sell off their bitcoins in a panic or dump in price, it will gradually become less severe as everyone will learn to ignore it.And the market will just grow naturally People will only be able to understand anything until they start seeing the need to use it. The nature of the market currently tends towards the speculative side, and in that case for a very much decentralized market, I would not expect not to see any form of manipulation. Manipulations are there every time for most markets and it is really nothing new like someone rightly said, and for things like this to change, this is the reason it would be more appealing to see a decentralized market get to do better in the long run with real life usage, more demand for it, and less manipulation as the case may be. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: barbara44 on September 15, 2018, 12:12:33 PM I do not think just because there is a manipulation on the exchange market data the whole market is reacting according to it. I mean I am not arguing against the fact that there is market manipulation but the manipulation of data is not the problem, the problem is the manipulation of peoples thoughts on the price trends, the price move according to what people think it will do and when you manipulate enough people to make them think the price is going down, they will sell and when they sell the price will go down, just a big whale (or group of whales) selling a tiny amount can make a snowball affect on the price. The process you describe here (which is properly called crowd manipulation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crowd_manipulation)) exists everywhere. It is conspicuously omnipresent in politics since ancient times. The methods and instruments developed and sharpened there through millenia are working exceptionally well with financial markets too. In fact, I would even say that in this field specifically they are working even better than elsewhere because people here are easily susceptible to fear, uncertainty, anxiety, doubt, i.e. everything which promotes successful manipulation So no surprise that people get manipulated constantly In this way, it is more like reading emotions through the chart, doing the needful, getting the response desired from other traders response, both professional and wannabes, and then they just simply rinse and repeat the process every single time. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: royalfestus on September 15, 2018, 12:27:19 PM exchanges involve in fake data are many but they are done to attract traders not the other way. The issue of CMC also providing false information is not new and the website moderators seem to always work to avoid this. I beleive the information on the CMC has such a great impact on traders and investors than what one think, cause if it doesn't there should not be the regular complain like I see on the figure manipulation. If numbers of exchanges are giving out fake data, It will definitely have effect on the CMC, cause it provides the average data price from all the exchanges on it
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Lagrood on September 16, 2018, 10:21:29 PM Actually I am not surprised because there are much scam on the crypto market. There are no organization which would control the entire market that is why such things happen. You are right having written about it because traders should know that the crypto market is manipulated. I am sure that we need to discuss the similar incidents to attract as much attention as possible and then it is possible that such discussions will effect on the entire crypto market by decreasing market manipulation. By the way it would be nice to public your observation as an articlt that other traders can read your it and make their own investigation to prevent scam.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: himtater87 on September 17, 2018, 12:09:15 PM I do not see where the news is: the investors have always manipulated the markets in their favor. Yeah it is really dangerous situation. People will withdraw their money when they realize that there is no profit in bitcoin investment. They will transfer their money or convert their money to Altcoin. The controllers should think seriously about it, otherwise it will eliminate bitcoin from the list of cryptocurrency. Monopoly of few big investors is not acceptable.Then, there are always new methods, and this could be really dangerous; however, I doubt it is really possible. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: skish85 on September 17, 2018, 12:21:46 PM I think it's impossible to stop manipulators, because most of the bitcoins are concentrated in their possession.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: deisik on September 17, 2018, 03:10:11 PM I do not see where the news is: the investors have always manipulated the markets in their favor. Yeah it is really dangerous situation. People will withdraw their money when they realize that there is no profit in bitcoin investment. They will transfer their money or convert their money to Altcoin. The controllers should think seriously about it, otherwise it will eliminate bitcoin from the list of cryptocurrency. Monopoly of few big investors is not acceptable.Then, there are always new methods, and this could be really dangerous; however, I doubt it is really possible. Practice doesn't confirm your assumption In fact, it confirms quite the opposite. I've read a post of some member here where he gave some stats about recent price changes, and it looks very much like money flows from altcoins into Bitcoin. Otherwise, it is hard to explain why Bitcoin fell only 10% while the other cryptocurrencies fell like 50% on average. Obviously, the whole cryptomarket is going down, but if it were like you describe, that people were going to withdraw their funds from Bitcoin and pour them into altcoins, we would be seeing a very different picture now Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Brunus on September 22, 2018, 03:14:39 PM The market is certainly manipulated by big players, and this is part of the game.
I doubt, however, that there is a player so big that he can manipulate all exchange data. Be serious! Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: atsc10 on May 23, 2019, 03:17:57 AM Everyone is aware that large number of exchanges are still faking trading volumes. Be wary of which trading platform you use. It's easy to fall victim to these manipulations (https://coinscious.io/cryptocurrency/how-to-detect-suspicious-crypto-exchanges/) if you don't know what to look for.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Kimonoe on May 23, 2019, 04:58:27 AM in essence such activities will form a bad image of cryptocurrency and exchange. thus losing the trust of investors. and finally investors withdraw their funds so that the price drops
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: bonker on May 23, 2019, 07:07:05 AM The market is certainly manipulated by big players, and this is part of the game. Even coinmarket found faking the data of exchange volumes so we don't have to trust all the things which we are seeing online,we have to enter into the exchange and watch is there clearly the trading activities were happening or not.I doubt, however, that there is a player so big that he can manipulate all exchange data. Be serious! Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: GregH37 on May 24, 2019, 05:59:51 AM You didn't give any reason as to why you think the data you saw on their ethereum volume is fake, just that you don't believe that what you're seeing is right, so you you just think it is fake and nothing else. Well, I don't regally believe things when there is reasons for me to believe them.
So it can be that you're wrong, although I do know that faking of data do happen a lot of times in the crypto field, there are lots of exchanges that fakes their trading volume even all these bigger exchanges do it as well. It's no longer new thing. But what I'm trying to say is that when you accuse someone of something, you give reasons for it, that's if you want people to believe what you are saying is true. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: shesheboy on May 24, 2019, 06:08:59 AM The market is certainly manipulated by big players, and this is part of the game. I doubt, however, that there is a player so big that he can manipulate all exchange data. Be serious! Whales can only manipulate the price of a certain coin or the whole market but datas and volumes are being manipulated by the owner of the exchange . They say that cmc is also manipulating their data's but some says that cmc is only synchronizing its data on other exchanges so cmc is not the real suspect here . Not all believes on the datas that they see online so this does not affect the price of cryptos too much but the price manipulation of whales do have a major impact on the coin or on the market . Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Ucy on May 24, 2019, 05:36:24 PM This is interesting one. Centralized exchanges are just bad for cryptocurrency. Anything can happen behind those private servers . It is unfortunate we don't have great decentralized exchanges to replace the exchanges yet.
If you can control majority of the exchanges, you can control the market. I guess the Centralized exchanges should be transparent enough or be throughly regulated Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Adriano2010 on May 24, 2019, 05:52:01 PM Even if there is manipulation i think it affects more the altcoins, but yes there can be manipulation on centralized exchanges, but maybe in future this will change if the websites who collect info can somehow drop the fake volume and show real volume if exchanges
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: awik p on May 25, 2019, 02:57:48 AM The market is certainly manipulated by big players, and this is part of the game. I doubt, however, that there is a player so big that he can manipulate all exchange data. Be serious! Whales can only manipulate the price of a certain coin or the whole market but datas and volumes are being manipulated by the owner of the exchange . They say that cmc is also manipulating their data's but some says that cmc is only synchronizing its data on other exchanges so cmc is not the real suspect here . Not all believes on the datas that they see online so this does not affect the price of cryptos too much but the price manipulation of whales do have a major impact on the coin or on the market . Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: jrrsparkles on May 25, 2019, 05:34:40 AM The market is certainly manipulated by big players, and this is part of the game. I doubt, however, that there is a player so big that he can manipulate all exchange data. Be serious! Whales can only manipulate the price of a certain coin or the whole market but datas and volumes are being manipulated by the owner of the exchange . They say that cmc is also manipulating their data's but some says that cmc is only synchronizing its data on other exchanges so cmc is not the real suspect here . Not all believes on the datas that they see online so this does not affect the price of cryptos too much but the price manipulation of whales do have a major impact on the coin or on the market . And also the price manipulation causes major bump and dump in the way as whale wanted because of the new investors attracted by the sudden bump or dump and getting losing everything. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: upsidedown75 on May 25, 2019, 10:17:54 AM You didn't give any reason as to why you think the data you saw on their ethereum volume is fake, just that you don't believe that what you're seeing is right, so you you just think it is fake and nothing else. Well, I don't regally believe things when there is reasons for me to believe them. I agree with your point mate, so many people just drop some points just because they needed to make contribution. And I hate it when people follow trend or don’t get their fact available before coming forward to share it with people.So it can be that you're wrong, although I do know that faking of data do happen a lot of times in the crypto field, there are lots of exchanges that fakes their trading volume even all these bigger exchanges do it as well. It's no longer new thing. But what I'm trying to say is that when you accuse someone of something, you give reasons for it, that's if you want people to believe what you are saying is true. It’s so glaring to see how useful ethereum has been and how their project concept has really gain popularity and usage, if they have everything needed to make their volume skyrocket naturally, why would they have to fake their volume again. Down from the hype to the ICO projects that has launched their project through ethereum, we will know that they can’t fake volume like other smaller projects and exchanges. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Gozie51 on May 25, 2019, 11:09:23 AM Down from the hype to the ICO projects that has launched their project through ethereum, we will know that they can’t fake volume like other smaller projects and exchanges. I think this issue with some fud around etheruem could be linked with the icos that were on etheruem platform. This unsuccessful project and scam icos made people to lose so much money and they capitalized on the platform to spread fud. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: maydna on May 25, 2019, 12:44:23 PM The market is certainly manipulated by big players, and this is part of the game. I doubt, however, that there is a player so big that he can manipulate all exchange data. Be serious! Whales can only manipulate the price of a certain coin or the whole market but datas and volumes are being manipulated by the owner of the exchange . They say that cmc is also manipulating their data's but some says that cmc is only synchronizing its data on other exchanges so cmc is not the real suspect here . Not all believes on the datas that they see online so this does not affect the price of cryptos too much but the price manipulation of whales do have a major impact on the coin or on the market . I don't think all whales will do the same because I am sure that some whales still doing a good thing related to the market. But yes, the whales can do whatever they want because they have a large of funds so they can move the market to one price that they want. But I don't think that exchange market data manipulation will bring the whole market is going to down because if we take a look at the market, especially big exchanges, they are serving the data that is happening in their site. I think they give real data to traders so traders can see what is going on in the exchanges. Traders will only use the data from the source they know. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: befriendmywater on May 25, 2019, 12:52:26 PM Hi guys, I think that manipulation will not stop. The legal authorities in countries cannot control the crypto market. because transactions are not intermediary and people who transfer money and receive money are anonymous.I was investigating the recent market plunge and this is my two cents as to why the crypto market is experiencing this situation. Some people were tying this to the fake news about Goldman Sachs crypto desk plans change, but I think this is due to an exchange faking data. The news that BitForex is faking data came around auguest 26th. Now this is what can really be happening on the market. An exchange lists fake data about the price dropping rapidly, then it buys the real crypto at the discount price (knowing that the price is "fake") on other exchanges. After this, the same exchange spams fake data the other way around and sells the currency at the real or overvalued price = profit! Today Coinmarketcap states that BitForex ethereum volume is $1,090,589,986, which is 40% of the whole market. I do not see a real economic situation in which this can be true. The question is when will such hoax schemes of market manipulation stop? Really, coinmarketcap was such a trusted source of market data and now this is just a very sad situation. What do you think? What are your speculations about the recent price changes? therefore, it is impossible to investigate and arrest manipulators. Besides, the black market is also more active on telegraph channels. Our market is just to manipulate and you should see this as its characteristics. ;D Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: armarsterling7 on May 25, 2019, 01:49:16 PM Hi guys, The crypto market is born for organizations to manipulate money. We call them whales and certainly the price of altcoins is unpredictable in the future. Because people with money will often control the market and we cannot do anything else.I was investigating the recent market plunge and this is my two cents as to why the crypto market is experiencing this situation. Some people were tying this to the fake news about Goldman Sachs crypto desk plans change, but I think this is due to an exchange faking data. The news that BitForex is faking data came around auguest 26th. Now this is what can really be happening on the market. An exchange lists fake data about the price dropping rapidly, then it buys the real crypto at the discount price (knowing that the price is "fake") on other exchanges. After this, the same exchange spams fake data the other way around and sells the currency at the real or overvalued price = profit! Today Coinmarketcap states that BitForex ethereum volume is $1,090,589,986, which is 40% of the whole market. I do not see a real economic situation in which this can be true. The question is when will such hoax schemes of market manipulation stop? Really, coinmarketcap was such a trusted source of market data and now this is just a very sad situation. What do you think? What are your speculations about the recent price changes? And one more thing is that the SEC also cannot control our crypto market and manipulation will never stop. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: yusupjatigumilar on May 26, 2019, 12:45:43 AM Of course, the manipulation of market data will reduce investor confidence and trigger them to sell or withdraw all the assets they have, automatically it will make the market quiet and of course it greatly affects the supply and demand balance in a market, when the balance sheet it is no longer balanced between demand and inventory while demand decreases and inventories remain or even increase then it will make prices fall. So manipulation makes trust decrease and it is directly proportional to price.
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: guoyu78 on May 27, 2019, 06:36:32 AM Everyone is aware that large number of exchanges are still faking trading volumes. Be wary of which trading platform you use. It's easy to fall victim to these manipulations (https://coinscious.io/cryptocurrency/how-to-detect-suspicious-crypto-exchanges/) if you don't know what to look for. That is not true, most of the top ten exchanges that has been recorded to have a real statistics on coins registered under them have the real data on cryptocurrency market. The ones that do have manipulated data are mostly upcoming exchanges that requires volume to get the attention of people which they basically just use as a marketing strategy which I am not saying its good, but exchanges that already have big volume will not fake data again. Let’s take a look at Binance and bitfinex, why would they fake volume again when they already have volume that will keep them in operation for the rest of the decade. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: rijaljun on May 27, 2019, 06:43:23 AM After read few replies on this thread, I have a simple question. I'm sure there are a lot of exchanges are faking their trading volumes, can we just simply call them scammer? or this is normal things in trading world...
Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: beerlover on May 27, 2019, 10:07:16 AM The crypto market is born for organizations to manipulate money. We call them whales and certainly the price of altcoins is unpredictable in the future. Because people with money will often control the market and we cannot do anything else. Cryptocurrency technology was never created specially for the whales to manipulate the market, they simply just saw one of the lapses of the system and decided to take advantage of it. Satoshi created it for peer to peer transactions, so that everyone can have full control over their financial transaction without any blockage to it. And one more thing is that the SEC also cannot control our crypto market and manipulation will never stop. People investing large sum of money is natural in every market, both stock and forex market, you need to research to see how much people are moving through these markets too, but because they are both regulated, it become quite difficult for it to be manipulated like crypto, therefore the call for regulation is very necessary. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: JeffBrad12 on May 27, 2019, 11:27:56 AM After read few replies on this thread, I have a simple question. I'm sure there are a lot of exchanges are faking their trading volumes, can we just simply call them scammer? or this is normal things in trading world... It's the usual thing and if you wanna see another worst case like the manipulation that happened with the gold market. Even there was a lot of news that the bankers admit if that was true. Manipulation in the stock market will always happen.It's impossible to create a market without any manipulation especially on the centralized exchange site. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: cryptoknightt on May 27, 2019, 01:10:26 PM After read few replies on this thread, I have a simple question. I'm sure there are a lot of exchanges are faking their trading volumes, can we just simply call them scammer? or this is normal things in trading world... some may not be like scammers, usually this is only used as their strategy to attract interested people but there is nothing wrong if you remain vigilant when trading.Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: SaShiRaJaVu on May 27, 2019, 03:38:48 PM I think this issue with some fud around etheruem could be linked with the icos that were on etheruem platform. This unsuccessful project and scam icos made people to lose so much money and they capitalized on the platform to spread fud. There were many scam projects that had fake valuation and volumes, but the real issue is the exchanges showing fake volumes and now we all know that coinmarket cap always show fake volumes and there is no way we can know the real volume, you cannot trust the fake volumes shown in CMC and enter an exchange thinking that we will have more liquidity, these fake volumes might not bring the market down, but will make investors think twice before deciding which exchange to trade.Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Netnox on May 27, 2019, 03:59:36 PM After read few replies on this thread, I have a simple question. I'm sure there are a lot of exchanges are faking their trading volumes, can we just simply call them scammer? or this is normal things in trading world... Yes. We can call them scammers. And no. This is not normal in the trading world. I have been involved in equity and mutual funds trading for the last 10-12 years. They never fake the trading volumes. In case someone does that and get caught, then it is very likely that he goes to jail. Faking the data can't be justified, no matter for whatever purpose they are doing that. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: LUCKMCFLY on May 27, 2019, 04:49:31 PM Well either, what exists in them, I do not think there is manipulation, if we take into account that the volumes that we observe in each Exchange is not the real volume, because the consolidated volume tool does not exist. Due to this we have to take into account that each Exchange handles its own volume, manipulation can not exist because in CMC they do not have the volume of all the Exchanges of the world, this means that whenever the market is reviewed in any Exchange we will have the information of the exclusive Exchange in analysis.
The manipulation can only result in the movements that the Investors and the Speculators give, which are not manipulations, they are normal movements of the market, the most they can do to manipulate is through news. In this case, there are many tools on the web that there are people who have dedicated themselves to frame the consolidated volume and this has not yet been fully developed, since the data is insufficient and the work it leads is very large, in fact They must do many schedules to collect each volume data of each Exchange. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: nur rochid on May 28, 2019, 05:33:11 AM After read few replies on this thread, I have a simple question. I'm sure there are a lot of exchanges are faking their trading volumes, can we just simply call them scammer? or this is normal things in trading world... Yes. We can call them scammers. And no. This is not normal in the trading world. I have been involved in equity and mutual funds trading for the last 10-12 years. They never fake the trading volumes. In case someone does that and get caught, then it is very likely that he goes to jail. Faking the data can't be justified, no matter for whatever purpose they are doing that. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: wuvdoll on May 28, 2019, 07:51:18 AM I think manipulation can work both ways, after all we all love it when bitcoin prices go up and hate it when it goes down. It is easy to blame the manipulations when the price goes down however it exists during going up as well. People do tend to manipulate it while it goes up too. That is why we have to accept the existence of manipulation during the both sides of the price movements.
Right now, there are more people buying bitcoin longs then shorts which means even the manipulators think that bitcoin price will go up, maybe we ran out of ammo for now and not going up too much but we have done over 100% in increase so it was expected to stall a bit at some point, not like we can go to a million dollars in a day, so we are regrouping and reloading and we will move further when we are ready. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: avarnet on May 28, 2019, 07:55:00 AM attacked by data manipulation is consumer trust. with the knowledge that the data is manipulated, consumers are worried, and trust in the exchange decreases. until in the end they transferred their assets to other more trusted exchanges. but I suggest not to save assets on exchange because it is more dangerous Currently most Exchange plays Volume. this is not an open secret. when it is indeed the attraction of a trader, many see the volume of exchange in the hope that a large movement can give them an advantage. but the fact that there is an exchange itself mostly falsifies their real volume.Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: FanEagle on May 29, 2019, 03:29:21 AM It is also a must. I mean I can understand why people are mad that manipulation is a thing and they want the market to be pure but without manipulation we wouldn't have come thus far. It was the people who manipulated the market that made bitcoin so famous and so volatile, it did went up a lot and went down a lot all because of manipulations and without them it would have been very slow and very stable which wouldn't create these stories and narrative of bitcoin making people super rich.
Without manipulators we are bound to live with a currency that is basically not moving that much and constantly on the same price, it would have some ups and downs but not as much and it would be quite similar to ups and downs of the stock market, it would still be good but not "life changing" amount of good. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Whosdaddy on May 29, 2019, 08:10:07 AM After read few replies on this thread, I have a simple question. I'm sure there are a lot of exchanges are faking their trading volumes, can we just simply call them scammer? or this is normal things in trading world... It depends mate, I would not blame some exchanges for doing so, there is something so common with all of us when new exchanges comes out, we don’t encourage them, we only advise people to go for already established exchanges and exchanges with large volume.If there is no one to patronize them, then how would they get the volume we desire of an exchange, the best would be for them to use this marketing strategy to attract some users gradually till they get the desired volume which I believe that they don’t continue to manipulate the figure once they get whatever volume that will keep their platform active. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: lyappa8 on May 29, 2019, 09:57:36 AM attacked by data manipulation is consumer trust. with the knowledge that the data is manipulated, consumers are worried, and trust in the exchange decreases. until in the end they transferred their assets to other more trusted exchanges. but I suggest not to save assets on exchange because it is more dangerous Currently most Exchange plays Volume. this is not an open secret. when it is indeed the attraction of a trader, many see the volume of exchange in the hope that a large movement can give them an advantage. but the fact that there is an exchange itself mostly falsifies their real volume.The thing is, it's impossible to check if any exchange posts real volume or fake one. At least now with centralized ones around ;D Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: Yutikas_11920 on May 29, 2019, 12:02:02 PM attacked by data manipulation is consumer trust. with the knowledge that the data is manipulated, consumers are worried, and trust in the exchange decreases. until in the end they transferred their assets to other more trusted exchanges. but I suggest not to save assets on exchange because it is more dangerous Currently most Exchange plays Volume. this is not an open secret. when it is indeed the attraction of a trader, many see the volume of exchange in the hope that a large movement can give them an advantage. but the fact that there is an exchange itself mostly falsifies their real volume.Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: playboy654 on May 29, 2019, 05:37:19 PM attacked by data manipulation is consumer trust. with the knowledge that the data is manipulated, consumers are worried, and trust in the exchange decreases. until in the end they transferred their assets to other more trusted exchanges. but I suggest not to save assets on exchange because it is more dangerous Currently most Exchange plays Volume. this is not an open secret. when it is indeed the attraction of a trader, many see the volume of exchange in the hope that a large movement can give them an advantage. but the fact that there is an exchange itself mostly falsifies their real volume.But as you said it won't bring down the total crypto market down because it will such only create temporary effect. Title: Re: Exchange market data manipulation bringing the whole crypto market down? Post by: beerlover on May 30, 2019, 04:56:27 PM The important part is, we should make them stay on our side. If there is manipulation then it should be for manipulating the price above what it should be. Lets assume bitcoin has a strict price instead of this volatile ways it goes everyday, lets say one bitcoin should worth 10 thousand dollars and not a dollar less or dollar more like a stable coin. If we can manage to get the manipulators on our side we can make it above 10 thousand dollars, that way we can all profit from it.
Nonetheless, if they are against us and tries to drop the price under 10 thousand dollars we will have to fight against the market to get it higher plus the whales that are manipulating which will make it hard for us. That is why give a reason to manipulators to actually be on bulls side when price is going up. |