|
Title: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: kochpat on October 10, 2018, 02:57:40 PM Hi all,
nowadays there are ton of Bitcoing / Altcoint dice gambling sites - Primedice, Bitdice, safedice, stake.. just to name a few. The "provably fair" algorithm makes gives them a clear advantage compared to traditional FIAT currency gambling websites. But why are there no dice sites that offer the "provably fair" algorithm with FIAT currencies? Best Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: kryptqnick on October 10, 2018, 06:26:42 PM Well, that's because there's a cryptographic algorithm that makes something provably fair. The data has to be hashed and then 'reopened' to see if it matches the initial one. Blockchain allows such things to be performed, while fiat doesn't use cryptography. The reason that the same same provably fair thing cannot work with fiat is that blockchain records data automatically and nothing can be changed by people after that, while with fiat people have influence during many stages of proceeding a transaction. Read more in this article to understand why fiat provably fair casino doesn't really make sense: https://bitcoinchaser.com/provably-fair-gambling/.
Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: Bitfort on October 10, 2018, 06:51:28 PM Well, that's because there's a cryptographic algorithm that makes something provably fair. The data has to be hashed and then 'reopened' to see if it matches the initial one. Blockchain allows such things to be performed, while fiat doesn't use cryptography. The reason that the same same provably fair thing cannot work with fiat is that blockchain records data automatically and nothing can be changed by people after that, while with fiat people have influence during many stages of proceeding a transaction. Read more in this article to understand why fiat provably fair casino doesn't really make sense: https://bitcoinchaser.com/provably-fair-gambling/. What are you talking about? Provably fair is not linked to type of deposit. Provably fair is about how the roll result is generated (and blockchain is not involved in this at all). You can apply the very same algo for whatever deposits you want. EDIT: Back to topic. I actually don't know any fiat "pure dice" site. But e.g. bitdice is currently working on it. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: SyGambler on October 10, 2018, 06:56:44 PM Hi all, nowadays there are ton of Bitcoing / Altcoint dice gambling sites - Primedice, Bitdice, safedice, stake.. just to name a few. The "provably fair" algorithm makes gives them a clear advantage compared to traditional FIAT currency gambling websites. But why are there no dice sites that offer the "provably fair" algorithm with FIAT currencies? Best I think this isn't a good question to ask , the best question would be why players would trust a certain casino where they can't verify their rolls casino owners would love to see people not asking about provably fair , and to be honest I don't trust them at all and feel like they balance the winners and losers to end up always profitable but of course this can't be proved ( unless on live casino games ) when gamblers start realizing that they can verify the game they are playing I guess all fiat casinos will start adopting provably fair Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: stomachgrowls on October 10, 2018, 07:52:29 PM Hi all, nowadays there are ton of Bitcoing / Altcoint dice gambling sites - Primedice, Bitdice, safedice, stake.. just to name a few. The "provably fair" algorithm makes gives them a clear advantage compared to traditional FIAT currency gambling websites. But why are there no dice sites that offer the "provably fair" algorithm with FIAT currencies? Best I think this isn't a good question to ask , the best question would be why players would trust a certain casino where they can't verify their rolls casino owners would love to see people not asking about provably fair , and to be honest I don't trust them at all and feel like they balance the winners and losers to end up always profitable but of course this can't be proved ( unless on live casino games ) when gamblers start realizing that they can verify the game they are playing I guess all fiat casinos will start adopting provably fair This is why gambling industry is booming up here on crypto because of that feature where anyone can see sites fairness which you cant really see on a typical fiat gambling site. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: Sukut on October 11, 2018, 01:19:33 AM Well, that's because there's a cryptographic algorithm that makes something provably fair. The data has to be hashed and then 'reopened' to see if it matches the initial one. Blockchain allows such things to be performed, while fiat doesn't use cryptography. The reason that the same same provably fair thing cannot work with fiat is that blockchain records data automatically and nothing can be changed by people after that, while with fiat people have influence during many stages of proceeding a transaction. Read more in this article to understand why fiat provably fair casino doesn't really make sense: https://bitcoinchaser.com/provably-fair-gambling/. How is this relevant? So, anything that uses cryptographic algorithms has to use crypto-currencies? LOL WTF? Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: adaseb on October 11, 2018, 07:06:17 AM I think what he is asking why are there no dice sites with stable coin currencies like USDT. This is actually an ongoing topic because it would make sense to have USDT since BTC and other cryptos are so volatile.
I've asked some mods of gambling sites to add USDT, it would be very easy since it uses the same blockchain as BTC and they all refused to list it due to regulation reasons. Basically they don't want to be under scrunity from the US government if they list it, especially on an gambling site. The best way to gamble with Fiat currencies is to deposit 1 BTC at a casino and at the same time go on some exchange which allows margin orders and sell that 1 BTC for US dollars (or EUR or GBP) and you will be hedged against huge down days like today. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: shield132 on October 11, 2018, 11:03:46 AM No, there is. For example local casino has dice and game similar of bustabit, both available in fiat. Dice don't has verify your roll function but bustabit like game has, also it has different name. Dice is usually called HI-LO but mostly casinos offer 2x win, you can't edit it. Local casino has almost every feature on it's HI-LO game that other dice websites have, except autobetting.
Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: Theb on October 11, 2018, 01:05:49 PM I don't think that there is one, by accepting Fiat currencies in their gambling site it will automatically subject them to other laws and licenses to that country of that fiat currency you are accepting. That is why all Curacao licensed gambling sites based on cryptocurrencies are only accepting cryptocurrencies and not fiat. Also other big reasons I see is that it will become a big problem in the future as once they accept Fiat currencies, members might demand that they also have Crypto to Fiat exchanges or vice versa in their gambling site and also demand fiat based withdrawals which will be a nightmare for them. Other problem that might arise with this is that they will use the gambling site for money laundering which automatically will make the gambling site be in trouble with the law.
Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: panjul07 on October 11, 2018, 02:29:17 PM Just checked on my favorite local fiat casino site, but I could not find any dice game like what we have in this crypto gambling industry. I can only find SICBO which is a game that using dice but of course it is not what you are looking for. As per my experience, there is no fiat casinos that using provably fair mechanism. Maybe I'm wrong, but most local fiat casino sites where I usually play is not having such system.
Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: slaman29 on October 11, 2018, 03:45:16 PM There are so many reasons NOT to.
Big reason is, if you deal with fiat, then you need to get licensed, you need to get regulatory approval, you need to prepare your entire system to work with a fiat system. Do you honestly think you could enjoy low house edge, fast approvals, fast play, and all that, while using fiat systems? The whole reason dice games and crypto games can offer much lower house edge is because of lower operational cost. Choose to use fiat and kiss goodbye to those low operational costs. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: Dice-Bet on October 11, 2018, 04:40:40 PM House edge would have to go up. Would be a nightmare running a dice site in fiat currency.
Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: shield132 on October 11, 2018, 05:49:20 PM There are so many reasons NOT to. How can you say not while such thing exists in reality?Big reason is, if you deal with fiat, then you need to get licensed, you need to get regulatory approval, you need to prepare your entire system to work with a fiat system. Do you honestly think you could enjoy low house edge, fast approvals, fast play, and all that, while using fiat systems? The whole reason dice games and crypto games can offer much lower house edge is because of lower operational cost. Choose to use fiat and kiss goodbye to those low operational costs. I already said, let's take for example about butstabit lkke game, absolutely same game played by fiat money is on local casino's website. They have provably fair system too and you can verify each bet + they offer jackpot in this game, withdraws take 0% fee and are immediately on your card. My example is 100% opposite of what you say, such thing exists, it even offerd jackpot and 0% withdraw fee. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: kochpat on October 11, 2018, 08:19:30 PM There are so many reasons NOT to. Big reason is, if you deal with fiat, then you need to get licensed, you need to get regulatory approval, you need to prepare your entire system to work with a fiat system. Do you honestly think you could enjoy low house edge, fast approvals, fast play, and all that, while using fiat systems? The whole reason dice games and crypto games can offer much lower house edge is because of lower operational cost. Choose to use fiat and kiss goodbye to those low operational costs. Ton of existing Fiat online casinos already exist and they make millions of profits; although they have all the disadvantages that you have mentioned: Need to get licensed, get a Fiat payment system, etc. But just by changing the random-number-generator of a Fiat casino to provably-fair would give them a huge advantage over traditional online casinos with intransparent algorithms. Also a provably-fair Fiat casino could target a much wider audience than the current coin-based casinos. I still donīt understand why no large Fiat provably-fair casinos exist yet!? Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: hubballi on October 11, 2018, 10:12:12 PM There are so many reasons NOT to. Big reason is, if you deal with fiat, then you need to get licensed, you need to get regulatory approval, you need to prepare your entire system to work with a fiat system. Do you honestly think you could enjoy low house edge, fast approvals, fast play, and all that, while using fiat systems? The whole reason dice games and crypto games can offer much lower house edge is because of lower operational cost. Choose to use fiat and kiss goodbye to those low operational costs. Ton of existing Fiat online casinos already exist and they make millions of profits; although they have all the disadvantages that you have mentioned: Need to get licensed, get a Fiat payment system, etc. But just by changing the random-number-generator of a Fiat casino to provably-fair would give them a huge advantage over traditional online casinos with intransparent algorithms. Also a provably-fair Fiat casino could target a much wider audience than the current coin-based casinos. I still donīt understand why no large Fiat provably-fair casinos exist yet!? Above the reason was given clearly that in fiat currency bets you dont have fair policy as the bets can be manipulated but in cryptocurrency dice sites the bets are automatic and it cannot be manipulated. That is why dice site in cryptocurrency got famous. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: kochpat on October 12, 2018, 08:26:30 AM The quality of answers to this threat has been really low... roughly half of the answers are either plain wrong or do not answer the question.
To clarify, we all agree that provably-fair algorithms are superior to the intransparent algorithms of traditional online casinos! However, the question in this threat is: Why are Fiat online casinos not adopting the new provably-fair technology? To have a reasonable discussion on this, please only reply if you either (a) know a Fiat casino that already offers a provably-fair algorithms or (b) give ideas on why Fiat casinos are not adopting the technology. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: Bitfort on October 12, 2018, 09:35:50 AM Sorry, but I was outraged by reply above me because it was completely misleading. I had to react.
As of question ...Why are Fiat online casinos not adopting the new provably-fair technology?... I'm going to react because of option (b).To me it's pretty clear. Why would casino bother implementing something that could negatively affect their profits when it's users don't require such thing. Once players realize provably fair concept exists it can be game changer but first they need to start complaining (or stop playing). Apparently this is not happening. In addition casino must be sure the lost profits (due to people stop playing their unfair games) exceeds lost profits due to offering actual fair game. Unless this condition is met, there is no will to change anything. BTW I fully agree with SyGambler post. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: Stedsm on October 12, 2018, 10:04:56 AM Well, that's because there's a cryptographic algorithm that makes something provably fair. The data has to be hashed and then 'reopened' to see if it matches the initial one. Blockchain allows such things to be performed, while fiat doesn't use cryptography. The reason that the same same provably fair thing cannot work with fiat is that blockchain records data automatically and nothing can be changed by people after that, while with fiat people have influence during many stages of proceeding a transaction. Read more in this article to understand why fiat provably fair casino doesn't really make sense: https://bitcoinchaser.com/provably-fair-gambling/. It is the brain of human that found blockchain, and so, it'll be human himself who'll find a solution for those fiat casinos to implement this "provably fair" thing if they really want their players to know everything about their bets and to prove that they've not cheated over them (users). -snip- ...Why are Fiat online casinos not adopting the new provably-fair technology?... I'm going to react because of option (b).To me it's pretty clear. Why would casino bother implementing something that could negatively affect their profits when it's users don't require such thing. Once players realize provably fair concept exists it can be game changer but first they need to start complaining (or stop playing). Apparently this is not happening. In addition casino must be sure the lost profits (due to people stop playing their unfair games) exceeds lost profits due to offering actual fair game. Unless this condition is met, there is no will to change anything. BTW I fully agree with SyGambler post. That's true, no casino is stupid enough to strike a hammer on their foot by adding such algorithm as "provably fair" because it'll help a lot of users to validate if their loss was actually real or they were cheated. I tried to find a casino where a player could get a verifier to check if their bet was provably fair, but none was found. Bet365 is one of the biggest names in the gambling industry and has a lot of users playing there all day long and they have a dice game too, but there were many users complaining about their losses as it's really easy for a fiat casino to cheat on its users by not letting the users verify their rolls through any means. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: slaman29 on October 12, 2018, 03:25:33 PM There are so many reasons NOT to. How can you say not while such thing exists in reality?Big reason is, if you deal with fiat, then you need to get licensed, you need to get regulatory approval, you need to prepare your entire system to work with a fiat system. Do you honestly think you could enjoy low house edge, fast approvals, fast play, and all that, while using fiat systems? The whole reason dice games and crypto games can offer much lower house edge is because of lower operational cost. Choose to use fiat and kiss goodbye to those low operational costs. I already said, let's take for example about butstabit lkke game, absolutely same game played by fiat money is on local casino's website. They have provably fair system too and you can verify each bet + they offer jackpot in this game, withdraws take 0% fee and are immediately on your card. My example is 100% opposite of what you say, such thing exists, it even offerd jackpot and 0% withdraw fee. Then you didn't understand what I was pointing out. Yes, fiat currencies casinos exist in reality, but as I said, you would have to do a lot more things to run a fiat gambling site for dice. Licensing and provably fair for example. Provably fair for fiat casinos are usually RNG verification, NOT self-provably fair like dice site on dice sites. And, yes, it is possible, but I bet you your casino has a house edge much higher than standard Bitcoin dice sites which is 1% or lower. IF you bet x2, what is your win chance? You can see house edge from there. Then you know what I'm talking about. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: examplens on October 12, 2018, 03:52:19 PM There are so many reasons NOT to. Big reason is, if you deal with fiat, then you need to get licensed, you need to get regulatory approval, you need to prepare your entire system to work with a fiat system. Do you honestly think you could enjoy low house edge, fast approvals, fast play, and all that, while using fiat systems? The whole reason dice games and crypto games can offer much lower house edge is because of lower operational cost. Choose to use fiat and kiss goodbye to those low operational costs. I absolutely agree with slaman29, I would add a very important part it is anonymity and restrictions. With crypto, you can play anonymously without any bank and personal data. Also, you can play in the country where is gambling prohibited. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: naidray on October 13, 2018, 01:21:05 PM Dice is something much more common in bitcoin because provably fair seed checking was a blockchain technology hence the satoshidice the first dice website of crypto was made based on that, since it was based on blockchain it was only logical to accept bitcoins at the time and ever since than there was never another reason to look back at the options and ever accept payments in fiat which would create huge legal troubles if you are not careful about it however when the dice websites accept crypto that is as anonymous as it gets both for gambler and casino which made it easier.
Hence, there are no fiat dice websites that matter and even if anyone tried, it apparently failed since we do not know about it. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: earnadoge on October 15, 2018, 06:27:32 AM Hi all, nowadays there are ton of Bitcoing / Altcoint dice gambling sites - Primedice, Bitdice, safedice, stake.. just to name a few. The "provably fair" algorithm makes gives them a clear advantage compared to traditional FIAT currency gambling websites. But why are there no dice sites that offer the "provably fair" algorithm with FIAT currencies? Best I personally never found the casino gaming section versus rng that good, no matter what casino it's in. Slow gameplay, high mins and low ranges. Live casino is where it was at for me, and I think most people end up at live tables. All the live sections are very similar, there is a live feed, and it shows winners on the left. Baccarat was very good, because it can have a ton of players at one table, not like black jack. Also 25 cent auto roulette was fantastic too. Live action is basically provably fair, in my opinion anyways, although I can see some people proffering crypto dice over live casino, as cards can be preshuffled, roulletes can controlled, etc. Also female live dealers do interact with players, and some people like it. Not sure if replacing entire live section with provably fair algorithm would work for them. Also I'm noticing more sites accepting USDT, so its kind of like a digital representation of FIAT. Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: Samarkand on October 19, 2018, 09:33:25 AM The quality of answers to this threat has been really low... roughly half of the answers are either plain wrong or do not answer the question. To clarify, we all agree that provably-fair algorithms are superior to the intransparent algorithms of traditional online casinos! However, the question in this threat is: Why are Fiat online casinos not adopting the new provably-fair technology? To have a reasonable discussion on this, please only reply if you either (a) know a Fiat casino that already offers a provably-fair algorithms or (b) give ideas on why Fiat casinos are not adopting the technology. I started a similar thread a long time ago and received better replies (including answers from users like dooglus or Stunna, who are highly knowledgeable about the subject). Why has no fiat casino adopted provably fair gambling? (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2160572.msg21628835) Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: hahay on October 19, 2018, 12:37:24 PM You can find a fair algorithm in the fiat gambling forum, IMO. because here is a bitcoin forum so I don't think there are many people discussing this here despite the similarities of gambling but there is a difference with something at stake like crypto and fiat. So far I've visited fiat gambling sites several times and I'm only looking for and joining fiat gambling sites that only use my country's currency and they are proven to be just as good as the famous casino sites in the crypto world. So I think you can find your own casino site that uses your country's currency.
Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: hulla on October 19, 2018, 09:43:03 PM Hi all, Firstly, the word provably fair is the thing that enables gamblers to verify each roll result and make sure they were not being cheated which we both know blockchain is the best answer for that. Besides, this is crypto community and every gambling site found here has to be cryptocurrencies acceptance site.nowadays there are ton of Bitcoing / Altcoint dice gambling sites - Primedice, Bitdice, safedice, stake.. just to name a few. The "provably fair" algorithm makes gives them a clear advantage compared to traditional FIAT currency gambling websites. But why are there no dice sites that offer the "provably fair" algorithm with FIAT currencies? Best Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: BTCevo on October 21, 2018, 03:15:25 AM Hi all, Firstly, the word provably fair is the thing that enables gamblers to verify each roll result and make sure they were not being cheated which we both know blockchain is the best answer for that. nowadays there are ton of Bitcoing / Altcoint dice gambling sites - Primedice, Bitdice, safedice, stake.. just to name a few. The "provably fair" algorithm makes gives them a clear advantage compared to traditional FIAT currency gambling websites. But why are there no dice sites that offer the "provably fair" algorithm with FIAT currencies? Best Agree with that, and this is very important thing to make gambling site is trustable. This is a must thing to have when you firstly start a gambling site Besides, this is crypto community and every gambling site found here has to be cryptocurrencies acceptance site. Actually not always, some site offer fiat too besides the crypto. There is plenty site which offer the same thing on this thread but because of the KYC problem people seems do not have any intention playing on that site. Players need to be anonymous which is only in bitcoin world that thing exist, so there is seldom people want to play by using fiat Title: Re: Dice Sites with FIAT currencies? Post by: solarion on October 21, 2018, 07:41:39 PM You can find a fair algorithm in the fiat gambling forum, IMO. because here is a bitcoin forum so I don't think there are many people discussing this here despite the similarities of gambling but there is a difference with something at stake like crypto and fiat. So far I've visited fiat gambling sites several times and I'm only looking for and joining fiat gambling sites that only use my country's currency and they are proven to be just as good as the famous casino sites in the crypto world. So I think you can find your own casino site that uses your country's currency. So do you mean that gambling with cryptocurrencies will not be fair? I don't think so! You must try on multiple dice games sites available on the crypto platform. I suggest you try on duckdice, bustadice, bitdice and bitplay sites to make the better winning potential and great algorithm on it. There is many fiat betting and dice games site. Since it is centralized you may vanished your fund anytime on it but decentralised wount do that to you. |