Bitcoin Forum

Thanks to hard work of administrators, moderators and many volunteer reporters very often forbidden behaviors are disclosed and punished by bans. Unfortunately as the number of users and bans increase, more and more banned users complain about their situation or look for its reason by writing new threads in Meta section. I’ve checked only first three pages (last few days) of Meta section and found more than 30 single threads regarding someone's problem in this matter. I didn't check more but I'm sure that it could be close to hundred of them every month. It makes real mess in the Meta board…

The realize how many of them there are look the list below (only last 4 pages)
1.   hay hay i have been banned, please somebody explain to me (-_-') (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5056549.0)
2.   Good day I would like to appeal my banned account.  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5056469.0)
3.   My Legendary account has been banned, any Modo to tell me why ? (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5056278.0)
4.   Unreasonable account ban  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5056236.0)
5.   My account had been banned,what should i do??  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5056249.0)
6.   Requesting mods to reconsider the banning of our project's account.  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5056495.0)
7.   Please Help  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5056391.0)
8.   Account lockout. Why ?? (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5055709.0)
9.   My Account has been Banned, Why ??   (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5054595.0)
10.  Ban appeal  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5054787.0)
11.  account fullmember in read-only mode for more than 9 months. theymos not react  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3156685.0)
12.  Autoban. Help  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5055392.0)
13.  Hello Please Help me for My account  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5055498.0)
14.  help me figure out where I broke the rules  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5054388.0)
15.  Ban Duration  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5054432.0)
16.  Account Banned  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5055095.0)
17.  Recovery of my account zefirka  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4306385.0)
18.  For that ban???  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5054503.0)
19.  Why was my account banned?  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5054736.0)
20.  I was very silly and consequently my account was blocked  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5054328.0)
21.  Account banned  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5054448.0)
22.  Why my account get banned?  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5054104.0)
23.  Can Someone Tell Me why My Account Get Banned?  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5053034.0)
24.  Can you explain ban evasion ? (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5053867.0)
25.  Account lockout  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5053319.0)
26.  Account blocked, why?  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5053329.0)
27.  Why was my account blocked?  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5052721.0)
28.  The reason why the account is blocked, why ??  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5052776.0)
29.  Auto ban!!!  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5052567.0)
30.  My account got banned and wanna know the reason.  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5052215.0)


Of course I do understand that being banned could be a disaster for each user and there have to be a place for threads related to this matter (and the meta section seems the most appropriate). What even more important creating a thread about banned account in Meta section is the only permitted activity for banned people (rule 25th). But maybe considering a really large amount of similar threads, it would be a good solution to create a Child Board especially for this...  I think it could clean a bit Meta board...

If you like this idea please vote... If not please do it as well.

Just like you said and rule number 25 states that a banned user/account is only allowed to make a single thread here in meta about his/her ban

And that's exactly what this users/members did/are doing,and I do not see anything wrong in it, probably making more than one thread or persistently commenting on the thread made,then it's definitely against the rules

Having numerous threads about it is acceptable considering the fact that it's the right section for it, I guess we're having more of it because our MODs are cracking down on more cheaters,copy/past posters and plagiarist saving Tman the stress of swearing at them..

I think it would be a good idea since we will be done with all the posts about banned accounts etc.
But if you think about it, It's like you are not banning them anymore, you just quarantine them in a subforum topic that they can keep spamming.

Can we call it The Swamp?

Thats the reason why i am created this thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5043370.0 !

To reduce the threads maybe a bit for every single banned account asking !

Would be a nice thing to have a board for all Asking why are  Accounts Banned !

I've never said it's against the rules, I wrote that it stays in compliance with rule 25, but considering the large amount of these threads moving them into one Child Board would clean a bit Meta. It's only a little organizational change. I think I would be also more comfortable for for them because getting into Meta they would immediately know where they should put their thread and what also important - having all similar threads in one place some of them maybe first read some other threads before writing their own.



According rule 25 "The only exception is creating a thread in Meta about your ban." so they can't post in others threads...


Why not ;-)


Great we already have a first pinned message for this Child Board...

The Swamp is just a sub when a temporary ban is issued but the deep well is harder to climb  :P (edit : deportation zone is the best thing ever)

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I read several times users asking for subs for topics started by banned or hacked users in meta or about merit topics.
Well, nothing happened until now but it would be good if meta get ride of such topics one day.

Not only do I agree with OP, but I recently posted much the same idea in another thread:


It was a bit off-topic in that thread, so I'm glad OP started a new one for the suggestion.  

Most of these ban appeal threads are much the same--same excuses, same lies, same reasons for getting banned, same replies from members, and the same outcomes.  If you're looking for decent threads in Meta, the ban appeal ones are just clutter.  I'm not sure if a child board would require another moderator or not, but at least if you're sick of people appealing their bans you can put the child board on ignore.

There's another solution, which is to require all appeals to be done via e-mail and not in a Meta thread.  The threads seem to be useless anyway; I think I've seen only one of them in the past few months where a person was erroneously banned, and it got reversed--and I'm sure that could have gotten resolved via e-mail.

The threads might help to take the load off admins/moderators because often these questions can be answered by regular users e.g. by showing plagiarism examples. Unfortunately some recent shitposters have been quite belligerent even after being presented with solid proof so the threads rage on for multiple pages where 2 posts should be the end of it. Also I'm seriously doubting the sincerity of some of those appeals that seem more and more like fishing expeditions (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5053329.msg47046334#msg47046334) trying to figure out how to improve their copypasta skills.

But I don't think we would be able to push them all into e-mails. They would still create threads and then we would wait for mods to nuke them and someone would still reply to the threads... would be a mess.

And some perspective: mods have been banning 1-2 thousand users per week recently. According to the OP there were ~30 appeal threads in ~ half a week, including bumps of older threads from before. Could be worse.

How about The Unforgiven? suits them well :P

and sometimes these threads revealed other connected users and lead to more bannings
so unintentionally they are helping us expose and catch more plagiators :D

I got the same feeling too... they looked like a trial and error method, looking for loophole or weakness

The question is if there is a new child board for banned user, will normal user visit that? Creating a child board will reduce the load in meta but wwon't it be an extra task for mod?

 Silent26 also proposed this idea back in July (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4610463.0).

Anyway, for the sake of having some necessary info on 1st page, we need to move this issue in another child board. I think theymos should now consider it.

Some more people have also discussed about it earlier. For having some more ideas-

Not bad idea, but mode could create a sticked post on meta to claim ban, hacked and locked account. Especially ban and lock possible solve and answer by mod.
I have created a thread about it; https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4924964.msg44361091#msg44361091
Although it's temp solutions but it might be reduced lots of post. On the other hand it's seems others user also helping ban user why they got ban. I think hilariousetc can do it since he is helping most of ban thread.

Anyone who wishes to challenge the administration’s decision about ban should first deposit a some amount of Bitcoin to the forum account.
I think this will significantly reduces the number of false claims about incorrect blocking.
The idea originally belongs to suchmoon.

It is quite an excellent idea and would help unclog the mass of spam on the meta thread.
But I'd suggest a board of its own, rather than a child board.

Most of these uses barely go through the rules and hardly venture to other boards apart from the alt section and there's a high chance they would miss a child board and have maybe never posted on one, and it would be a series of redirection links from members when they continue posting in meta.
But an actual board is more difficult to miss.

But if a board or a child board is opened, strict moderation would have to be used to pass the message home, thrashing any thread made on meta about ban appeal, and banning the accounts, as h that can be termed as ban evasion when posting outside the appropriate board. That should speed up the transition.

But this is what Meta is for: forum-based issues, and that's what a banned account falls under. It's even in the rules that banned users can only post in here. I don't think we need a new sub for this, especially as Meta would be pretty empty without them, but a way we can severely curb this behaviour is to just change the way bans are issued. If permabanned users are just actually told that they're banned for copy and pastes then 98% of them probably won't bother creating another account to ask why (though I'm sure some will still do so to try futilely protest and whatnot). Bans are clunky and tedious to issue on this forum and I don't know whether theymos will make any changes now, but I'm sure it'll be easier and more efficient on the new forum software and hopefully reasons can be given for all bans. We have one permaban button for Ban + IP ban and maybe theymos could issue another that does the same but automatically gives the reason as copy and paste since the bans issued for this are prolific and probably won't decline anytime soon. Only he can make changes to that though, but I'm not sure a new board is necessary. Same goes for account recovery. They just actually need to start being recovered and moving them into a new section is just sweeping them under the rug.

For me it's an idea, it makes sense, I also beg for (mod), (Admin) Forum to be considered? with the prohibition rules [ACCOUNT]. (New Children's Council for banned users).

effective: in making rules such as, (Meta), (discussion), (economics), etc.

The purpose of Identifying and documenting all problems (account bans), I this assumption is very important for database design.

To allow creators to develop rules of related participation and constraints and to make the correct data model, The rules also allow the creator to understand the process of the problem and the nature of the individual, this is a very good role to be followed up.

If this materializes there are benefits for all the troubled Bitcointalk members, from the right forum rules:

good indication:
>•< Allows Bitcointak members to be able to answer and ask questions about ban accounts.
>•< Creation and management of an effective Bitcointalk forum policy.
>•< improve quality and effectiveness through more consistent and accurate rules.
>•< Opportunities to establish formal and sustainable processes in the forum. on forum policy and improvement.
>•< Build good relationships with forum members (Meta) with forum members (local) and also members with other members.
>•< Creating justice in the Bitcointalk forum.

The style you are using for getting attention and highlighting the point, are really annoying and distract people. I just have skipped your reply cause I felt boring and it seemed you are trying to get attention = merit.

I voted yes because I'm in support of the discussion "New Child Board for banned users" I also have some additional suggestion. I notice all members who started the topic on ban accounts are new members and that can only mean as a ban user you lose the privileges to start topics or rely on topics so the only option is to create a new account to appeal your case. I believe this isn't the best solution since most users get banned and most times don't know why. So in addition to creating a separate child board for banned users, they should also have the privileges of using their old account to appeal their cases only on the child board section. this will prevent the amount of alt account created on the forum.

What are you talking about?
Whether it's your smart attitude or you are: (envy).
What is clear is that I gave what I knew about (discussion) the forum.
In this case I do not expect anything as you speak.
Maybe wealth I'm more than you, here doesn't make much money because I work in oil mining (Management). Lol.
What do you want to talk about?
(Merit): not attention or money.

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why are you, who fires ass.

Good idea in theory...

But, we are talking here about people that either didn't bother to read the rules, don' care about rules or are ..let' s stay a bit to stupid to follow them.

So I' m willing to bet a lot of them would simply ignore the board and open their topic wherever they want, adding more work to our mods by having them move topics around and answer a ton of duplicate reports as I'm sure a topic in meta gets a lot of attention from members that do report stuff.

The best way to deal with this would be to change the ban message or at least guide them to a single sticky megathread so we could also keep track of those guys easier.
Although as I said I doubt they will follow the instructions.


Would that be a bad thing?

But then what's the point in Meta? As I've said before we don't need sub boards for every little issue, especially when creating a new one will leave the existing one dead or largely inactive. Meta is the board for complaints and people are going to complain. If we want to cut down on these sort of complaints then just fix it so we can state the reason of the permaban more efficiently and most of these threads will stop instantly.

It wouldn't be empty, we could still have 50 threads about merit here, and of course the threads about other child boards that we would like to create.

I like CB's idea though, whether we create a child board, or a single megathread for appeals, or leave appeals in Meta:


It seems kinda pointless to force them to create a new account. The ban message could have a link to Meta/child board/megathread so they could just go and post there (but nowhere else).

Maybe the best thing would be a pinned Topic in Meta with maybe Titel "  Complaints about Banned Accounts "

But there will be always users they will give a shit about it and open a new Thread !

Best example from the last days are the users with the message : " https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=userID;sa=statPanel "
One User with a few accounts asking for every Account in new threads .

The final result was :  All these accounts have a connection !


Best solution should be the Reason of the ban in the Ban Message self !

I still like the idea of having a child board, but the above suggestion would probably help.  It would be even better if banned members were given an example of what they copy/pasted, which I think is usually provided when someone reports a plagiarized post to a moderator.  That's probably asking way too much if the current system for mods issuing bans is as clunky as you say (and I believe you), but showing someone exactly what they plagiarized would likely cut down on ban appeal threads even more--or at least we wouldn't get all the stupid "what did I do wrong?" posts.  Those are unnecessary and waste people's time, because invariably someone goes digging to come up with an example.

But even if a reason and an example were provided in the ban message, I would bet money that these people are still going to keep making Meta threads asking for mercy, giving excuses, and lying through their teeth about how their dog stole their laptop and somehow managed to copy someone else's content.  That's why I think the child board solution is a better one, and I disagree that Meta would be empty without ban appeal threads--if anything, it'd be easier to find actual discussion threads.

That's not the best solution, but as I said I do think the reason should be provided in the message.  It's a start.

That was suggested before, and the main problem with it is that most banned members won't read it or will still create an appeal thread begging for mercy, complaining about the ban, or whatever else.  I don't think a pinned topic would help at all.

Exactly, fix the reasons for complaints and be done with!!!

Right now meta is flooded with
- why I have been banned
- get those plagiarists banned
- complaints about the merit system
- bragging about the merit system
- adding features to the forum
- why are not features we need so badly added and so on

If we would fix all those somehow I guess nobody will complain that the meta section is empty and forgotten.

I'm also a bit active in a local forum, it's far smaller, probably with only 10k active users but in the forum feedback section that acts the same way meta does here the topic at the bottom of the first page is from 15th of June !!!!, and this is mostly because there are no actual issues with it. Of course, Btctalk is different and the amount of $ involved here is one of the main reasons but there are a lot of things that could be done in a few hours of coding (maybe more, not a programmer here) which would cut hundreds of hours of debating and mod work.

1-2k bans per week – damn it... it’s quite a lot - they have really lot of work…


Once again: no one wants to throw these threads out of meta board just to move them child board – I understand a child board as a part of main board just more specialized in a specific matter.
I wouldn’t also worry that meta would be empty without them. I gave the idea for consideration, because there are really lot of such threads (tens a week) but there are still not more than 15%-25% of all meta threads so there would still many threads left in main board, so I’m sure so it would not become inactive nor dead.

The description of meta bard is “Discussion about the Bitcoin Forum” what I see much wider than “Discussion about specific users complains”, more like place to discuss about forum like the whole – its rules, ranks, stats, inconveniences, possible facilities etc... where specific users issues are treated more like examples than main point of focus...