Bitcoin Forum

There will be no "Development" of the Cryptoindustry for quite a while there are substantial attuitudes that prevent a development, here is why:

many of those bitcoin hodlers think that there will be institutionalisation that will return their beloved bitcoin back to 20k usd so they can sell with profits again

but thats not how instutionalisation will work.

current cryptomarket will not develop itself for certain well defined reasons.

bitcoin founders didnt created the cryptomarket for everyone to develop, they as first and mainly created and marketed bitcoin.

in the end the bitcoin founders created a bitcoincentristic cryptoindex and economy (bitcoin is best and biggest) that they now want to impose on the whole world. and it is surprisingly still taken serious by many without much resistance.

That is the main issue why the cryptoindustry will not develop itself. its the dictatorial bitcoincentrism and bitcoin maximalism, of the founders out of this forum. they want everybody to look at it and adapt it in their "interest" and push their bitcoin hodlings, its actually still not a cryptomarket its a bitcoin centristic market. and its not decentralised away from bitcoin to ever be called "a cryptomarket" yet.

and i doubt they will be taken serious in long run in fact, they will be considered more and more a joke. with more and more people creating their own "coins"

institutionalisation of cryptoindustry will not help because instutitions mainly will desire to fund themselves, and not join a pow token, they therefore will create their own token, or support a local communist/national socialist regime like its getting more and more obvious in the usa.

regards

Sounds like you have it all backwards.  Contrary to popular belief, what's best for crypto is not necessarily what's best for the speculators and the institutions.  Go invest in PayPal and Ripple if you want the kind of "development" you're talking about.  Anyone who actually understands why crypto is important will know that you're barking up the wrong tree with this. 

wrong tree?

didnt you lost around 75% value last year?

i think you need more facts till you understand better

but i dont worry they will come,

i am no paypal or ripple fan.

Bitcoin developers care less about the price than you think they do.

1. price and marketcap are meaningless to the code itself you wont find a single dollar in bitcoin code
2. the founders of bitcoin are not the same guys coding it now, hense why its taking a different path than originally envisioned
3. though point one is true, what is also true is that the price does affect and influence the devs decisions to what new code should be added

4. but with all that said the crypto industry will develop. but bitcoin as just the bitcoin network has not actually done much for the last few years apart from open doors to new networks, and shut doors to those wanting to work on this network

i expect the usual developer defense camp to raise pitch forks. but maybe they need to have words with the developers more so than debate with me

Yes sir, you are right... There will be no development in crypto industry now.. Some experts assure price will develop within few months but not similar to 2017 but develop.

Code development doesn't translate to price hikes. We've been receiving updates and development for bitcoin consistently for years no matter the weather. Also, the 'founders' you're referring to may or may not be involved with bitcoin anymore, given how many changes had happened in the past 10 years or so. The issue of maximalism has been around for quite a while, and I don't even think the devs are pushing for that. Just so you know, any other devs of different coins are pushy on maximalism but bitcoin devs doesn't seem to have that; it's the community, not them.

Interesting argument! I too think that instutionalisation (OMG my vocabulary is getting better day by day) will not help bitcoin or other cryptos to taste the development that they desire.

The most basic question is, what is the main vision of Satoshi behind the creation of bitcoin?? The header of whitepaper says these exact words,


Do you think bitcoin is being used as one? No! It has majorly become an investment asset. Why? Because the free market sentiment decided it to be used as an investment.

The market is full of short term profit seeker who made it look like an investment and they promoted it as an investment to others which created a huge hype during late 2017 and we all know what happened afterwards! Remember, this hype was never created or supported by maximalists and they are not the one who sold off their holding during that peak.

Secondly, Companies will always want to fund themselves and that's not what institiutionalisation means!! Institutions are profit seeking groups who would obviously want to have control on their own asset. Since this can't be achieved on bitcoin, simply its out of their choice list. Otherwise we wouldn't have seen thousands of valuless ICOs and tokens in cryptospace. I am sure, that is also not supported by maximalists.

I see maximalists as purists who still dreams to see bitcoin is being used as a "Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System" and not as an investment. Bitcoin will continue to develop till the time we have support from maximalists. These developments are not related to the price of it so it can't be deciphered by the blind class who thinks, pricing is the only development.

The moment these maximalists leave the space, we will be at the mercy of speculators and investors.

nonsense, they dont want to establish crypto, they want to enslave/fix the entire world to their bitcoin centristic cryptoindex.

if they would stop doing that bitcoin price will collapse.

i am sure that they will lose their power they have currently anyway, weather they volunarily develop the market, or weather they continue this childish bitcoin enslavement, they will lose social support and will be considered a big global joke

very well pointed out, i see this as a confirmation where this industry has gone (bitcoin used as investment asset, not as currency), its not really a cryptoindustry its a bitcoin marketing industry.

everyone else who says different has no idea whats going on, and i am sure  they will continue to take punishments for what they did

i said multiple times here the way we are supposed to go is different one, and i know it, but this forum and its developers are in no mental condition to actually start building a framework for it. its still just a bitcoin industry, and the bitcoincentristic indexmafia will prevent any change. it will end with a violent power loss for the index mafia, because they are not willing to adapt/change, or can't find someone they can trust.

What, exactly, do you think they should be developing?  It would probably help if you were a little clearer on that.  How is it the fault of Bitcoin developers that altcoins aren't getting the attention you feel they deserve?  What are you even talking about?

One live example of non-maximalist thinking where development means price.


There is a difference between education and marketing!

a framework for structural multilayered financial system with regulated organic entities.

i did some description in my topics (liberty index)

or the layer of engineering foundations i made in the project development board,

it seems i have to wait till the failure confirmation for this forums developers will become more. till they get serious about it.

Creating a layer of communism, nationalism, racism free financial institutions (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5086287.msg48730682#msg48730682)

Project Proposal Creating New CryptoCurrency Index (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5089957.0)

you have to create a cryptoindex for a cryptoindustry a world economy a world civilisation and not just an index for bitcoin maximalism, like its currently the case.

Cool story bro.

If you weren't willing to spend the time, you wouldn't be putting so much effort into creating all these topics to spout a load of meaningless waffle because you don't understand that the fiat price isn't the important part.  The market chooses the direction.  If the market decides it wants wants your "framework for structural multilayered financial system with regulated organic entities" word soup, it'll almost certainly find a way to obtain it.  Otherwise it'll ignore it like it does all the other myriad ideas that get buried without notice or attention because no one cared.  Blame whoever you want and make all the doomsday prognostications you like.  Doesn't make a difference.  You're just another person who thinks their idea is great, but has no way of making it happen other than shouting loudly and flailing your arms about in a desperate bid for attention.

lol you seem not to want to take developer work serious?

maybe the issue is simply that most of bitcoin developers arent really financially dependent on bitcoin and are just voluntary worker.

people at bitmain see that of course differen, and people running an encription service (ethereum, waves, also)

well in that case, lets just wait till next support loss.

no point to support those trash coins.

I will understand what what you want to elaborate, people are holding their bitcoin because simply the reason is they buy them at hight price during the all time high last few year ago 2017 then they wait for a year to bounce back again their value to avoid cut off loses from the capital investment.

Generalization will take you far away from the truth “mostly or some” is the right word to describe it. I’m hodling and accumulating bitcoin ever since for one reason “A great FUTURE” that most altcoin doesn’t have. Gold is kept not because of its value today but on the next decade or so same with bitcoin. It might look suffering now on its price value, but that shouldn’t be if you look back many years ago.

            

You have an interesting point there but I don't think so. The crypto industry keeps developing every day and night as time passes by. The crypto industry has been improving since the success story of Bitcoin. Industries are gradually adapting the use of blockchain technology.

Although I believe there is a certain saturation in development but that doesn't mean the development will eventually come to a stop.

Your generalization of holding crypto until 20k again is kind of off putting as this kind of mindset is not within everyone. It might be some traders having that mindset but that doesn't mean the developers will stop working for that reason as well.

Given the choice between:

a) running code that someone paid people to make so that it would benefit institutions and speculators, which would almost certainly end up as a walled garden early-Netscape type monstrosity

and

b) running code that people made of their own volition because they cared passionately enough about what they believed in, whilst also following underlying principles that espouse the notions of permissionless freedom, open source and transparency

I know which project I'll be following.  Have fun with your institutioncoin.  Feel free to come back when you get the point of crypto.

There will be and there are a lot of reasons. To my mind it's still development when it gets accepted in many placed and gets popular among people. On another hand development doesn't mean rise in price, development is when innovative products (coins) are created or innovative functions are added to specific coin, it's development when some new problems are solved too (for example high tx fees). Well, that's how I see it, price isn't indicator of bitcoin's development at this stage.

I think you confuse development as a meaning with another word. You talk about price increase and market increase which does not have much to do with coin development. Also development of coins is not usually responsible for the ups and downs of the market apart from minor movements.

I think you are missing some key-points and just thinking backward.

Institutions have a greater interest in creating their own coin for several reasons. Not to be a coin developed in order to increase its value as much as possible but rather a coin to benefit from the technology, something like a stable coin.
If an institution is really interested in investing in BTC it will certainly not be through an exchange, and there is currently no positive signal showing an opportunity.

The crypto market is too dependent on BTC


OP is talking about the development of the industry, not the development of a coin

it is even worse, cryptoindustry is centrered on bitcoin

institutions haver no interest joining that crap.

the western institutions will then start supporting a communist nationalsocialist regime in their countries.

out of interest and the urban import dependend population will join them

there won't be any "development" of "cryptoindustry" for a long time for now because there are a lot of bag holders like you who are too caught up in the fake advertisement of shitcoins that promised them better cryptocurrencies than they really delivered. they were promising a coin better than bitcoin which you ate up and started bag holding it and then lost a lot of money in it.
the result is lazy developers who are more interested in making money by pump and dumping coins and take the money from gullible people like you  who bag hold their useless tokens.

How sorry you are mate because of being tagged ,and now upon desperation that you are spreading this stupidity?you use to love bitcoin upon the post history and why now you are barking against this?


You are getting too harsh here Mate,but you maybe right as this man spreading lies about bitcoin all over the forum,but he is still here in crypto for one reason,and that is to gain profit from shitcoins or tokens lol

cause my economic interest shifted from supporting bitcoin (damagin central bank)

towards supporting cryptoindustry (establishing myself as cryptocapitalist)

gliss and his cryptoindexers arent helping me and i cant bribe them like ripple, so i work towards weakening the authority of the cryptoindexation

a cryptoindex for a civilisation, not a cryptoindex for bitcoincentrism bitcoinmaximalism and bitcoinmarketing



something you dont understand maybe

I agree with someone said in comment,"Bitcoin developers care less about the price than you think they do". What's more, for the whole industry, there will be other developments more than price happening, such as launching ETFs, though it's difficult, and different in various countries.

all what has been said here is or are mere speculations as there is no facts pointed out or even figures as to when it happened but lets all consider the formula used as there is a word called disruption which exists in the dictionary and that gives rise to technologies taking over already existing technologies and giving a better service and function.

ETFs nare scam they are just an invention in order to attract pensioneers capital into bitcoin

nothing is a true development except the direct standardised replacement of the banks

People keep saying that because they don't see the market at the highs. But when the market will go up and go on a new rally then people would really say that things.

nope you are in a death spiral

You need to quote that post or you will get ban for posting someone's content even if it is general content to say.

Launching ETF is also not in the mind of developers because it can kills the traditional investors of crypto currency and make the bitcoin not usable for real life purpose.

that is only the way you think not what really is happening in the cryptocurrency world.

there is no denying that many are only interested in the price, you included, but that  doesn't mean that is the only thing that matters and because of it no development would take place! the fact is a lot of cool things are going on at all times in this world because the technology is a very interesting one. it just happens that bitcoin is the biggest innovation and it is ahead because of that otherwise things are very good if you stop looking at the price only!

The development will not happen still we don't trust the Bitcoin value because lots of people find it and sell their investment suddenly while the price getting lowered in the starting stage this will lead to the full value drop in quicktime and it cast many people to sell their investment.

now we seem to be getting to the crux of the issue

king scorpio is not upset about the industry/community of crypto.. he is upset about a BUSINESS which handles a basket of different altcoins and names the basket a "crypto index"

which i would say. knowing 99% of altcoins are crap coins anyway. and knowing that the BUSINESS that king scorpio is crying about is also not concerned with the value/utility of crapcoins. king scorpio should take a step back and realise that the BUSINESS that creates the basket of altcoins(index) do not make profit from if a coin is successful/usable/sustainable.

whether a altcoin is successful or not, the business that king scorpio is upset about just takes a commission from every trade of a basket, no matter what the basket contains and no matter what the altcoin in the basket actually does or doesnt do.

so now knowing this. king scorpion should realise making an altcoin and forcing it to only be listed if it meets certain standards wont make the BUSINESS any more or any less profitable. so in essense they will still not care if a coin meets a certain standard or not. as thats not their BUSINESS model

so in short. king scorpio is fighting a battle with the wrong weapon

I think the reason why crypto coin industry is not developing due to its greedy user's because majority of people who invest in crypto or bitcoin have no desire to use them for day to day functions as a means of payment alternative for fiat currencies and I don't think even people who launch ICO projects have that ambition and there only target is to make quick profits by introducing a currency so there are many cryptocurrencies in the world but still we don't see a significant contribution to the world   

i cant do much more than telling in this comunity the issue,

you have to decide you either build a cryptoindustry and help decentralisation also with regulatory features, or you market bitcoin and try to protect its eternal attentionhack with a bitcoincentristic corruption index, with cryptobribe ripple silently rising up in it.

a more neutral cryptoindustry index would look more like this :

with an interactive globus and a layered indexation datapage for different functionalities
https://imgur.com/a/21PZBs8
https://i.imgur.com/eSmSjaC.png

Well, at least we can agree on something. But what to do then? If we are where we at today we can only blame ourselves. I don't even think institutions joining the crypto industry is a good thing, if I was an institution I would not invest in cryptos (perhaps on something related to cryptos) and you too surely.

i propose to build and establish our own regulated institutions

Institutionalisation brings a new type of buyer, not just believers in economic freedom but real investors that have bigger pockets than the average new bitcoin believer

institutionalisation is decentralisation from bitcoincentrism

you do it, or you lose all support and trust for bitcoin

Technically and in theory, it could be possible but I hardly doubt the mass population has testicles big enough to accept and endorse it. It's like dreaming about a world without famine. Democracies always fail, you will have always people shouting and it could into anarchy where everyone do what they want.

we dont have to be perfect instantly, i propose this layer of engineering foundations, i am building an example.
building some engineering foundations to guide the development of value sources would already be a great idea, we have to use a standardised currency for that, and i use the logo and emblem of the socio-economic source

if we dont start doing that, you will see bitcoin crash, and with it entire indexed market.

take tron as an example its goal was to create a value source (however an extremly difficult to realise one) and it still focused, people

we have to create a standardised layer of value sources engineering foundations, to give and guide genertivity into the economy, and it will help

regards

Bitcoin built a lot of infrastructure for bitcoin users and funded every "cryptocurrency"

Bitcoin appears tired of funding crappy cryptocurrency projects and huge scammers for a long time.

People have separate visions of what this "industry" will become and usually don't realize it needs to be in the best interest of everybody. Bitcoin being able to store wealth rather than fund crappy projects will be a nice change this year.

The 2nd and 3rd layer solutions for bitcoin to send payments are actually going to happen in 5 - 10 years... this is all funded by bitcoin.

All of these "other things" people want to try and sell, need to get used to hearing no for awhile. We need decentralized digital money rather than using gold to store value. Then we'll need a stable smart contract  solution -- maybe with some rules on these tokens -- who knows how it plays out.

Shitcoins must die though.

uhm well i am pretty sure with this attitude, you are gonna see bitcoin vanish, you dont look very pioniering like, like it would be expected from someone that hacks the global financial system.

well we build a working financial system the pos way, or you will see bitcoin disappear like a gimmick these are the options.

it will be cleared after bitcoin dropped to next low support level, i assure you.

i am sure that your beloved bitcoin will soon enter the realm of being questioned itself.

PoS coins have a zero cost of creation support value. the price is speculative of how pumped/promoted it is.

PoW coins have a cost of creation that gives it an underlying support. this has always been known factor even from th first year of bitcoin.

as for wanting to build your own 'crypto index' well thats just making a business that takes commission from getting people to buy/bet on a basket/group of altcoin..... nothing special there

no one actually cares about a crypto index. just like actual smart people dont care about 'market cap' as both things are essentially meaningless numbers.

if you were to make some revolutionary real world impacting exchange. here is an idea.
an exchange that does not measure coins in FIAT. but instead measures coins in 'minimum wage'/cost of living.

imagine it this way:
the fiat method. 1btc costs an american under 550 minimum labour hours to afford but somewhere like Afghanistan is like 8000 hours

the MW method. a coin is on the market at 550 MW. which an american can buy for the same 'value' but now the guy in the middle east only needs to work 550 hours to get 1btc.

the impact would be that americans would forex their dollars to buy afghanis so that the $->afs can buy them many btc. and cause the forex rate of usd/afs to swing where it brings middle easterners exchange rate up (due to forex arbitrage) to be more closer to 1:1 rather than 1:15

POS will be the future. all still care about the ranking in that scammy index

I think that now it is necessary for Bitcoin to be in the position in which it is now. For all my own program, and my time, I believe that it will improve more extensively in development, and will help many people to earn money.

well earning money is not the issue, if everyone can create money, the question is what value will you get for that "money"