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Title: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: KonstantinosM on February 25, 2019, 02:35:47 AM From the Amazing Atheist: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0gaW9NKAfA
I agree completely. I was Bernie or Bust in 2016, first election I could vote in. I walked over 15 miles to register as a democrat (even though I'm fiercely independent) just to vote for Bernie in the Primary(edit: I did have a car, just liked the symbolic gesture). Then the democrats basically cheated him out of the nomination and then I just didn't vote in 2016. If the same scenario plays out, I'm not voting for an establishment candidate that's compromised. It's Bernie or Bust (unless there's an other good candidate). Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on February 25, 2019, 03:59:37 AM The way it actually works, they'll let Bernie run and even give him a lot of publicity. But just like last time, they'll be aiming to fold his votes into the back-room-selected-bred-candidate.
And you'll be used, just like last time. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: squatz1 on February 25, 2019, 04:16:01 AM The way it actually works, they'll let Bernie run and even give him a lot of publicity. But just like last time, they'll be aiming to fold his votes into the back-room-selected-bred-candidate. And you'll be used, just like last time. Bernei bros got ruined last time when Bernie turned Pro Clinton, I would hope that they don't fall for the same thing again. Even if they're not out to get him this time, he's one of them at this point and he knows it. I don't know how someone could fall for all of his BS the second time around. At least support a candidate with a chance of winning, like someone like Biden. Bernie is a sellout. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: coins4commies on February 25, 2019, 05:29:12 AM The way it actually works, they'll let Bernie run and even give him a lot of publicity. But just like last time, they'll be aiming to fold his votes into the back-room-selected-bred-candidate. This is why I'm not giving another dollar or minute to Bernie's campaign until he has fully cleared the primary. And you'll be used, just like last time. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Beerwizzard on February 25, 2019, 10:14:44 AM The only fact that in 2016 such country like America got such a retarded far left-wing candidate like Bernie shows that the political system in the modern world sucks pretty much. Lets hope that people will be smart enough to avoid voting for this guy.
This is why I'm not giving another dollar or minute to Bernie's campaign until he has fully cleared the primary. It is a pleasure to see that even his former followers will not vote for him this time. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: coins4commies on February 25, 2019, 05:36:00 PM The only fact that in 2016 such country like America got such a retarded far left-wing candidate like Bernie shows that the political system in the modern world sucks pretty much. Lets hope that people will be smart enough to avoid voting for this guy. No I said I will not donate or volunteer in his camapaign this time because he was a sheepdog candidate in 2016 and all of that money and organization ended up being rolled into the Clinton campaign against my interests and will. This is why I'm not giving another dollar or minute to Bernie's campaign until he has fully cleared the primary. It is a pleasure to see that even his former followers will not vote for him this time. So there is nothing wrong with him as a candidate except that he is running in a corrupt right-wing party. If you have criticisms of him you need to say what they are instead of falsely claiming he is "retarded". Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on February 25, 2019, 06:27:24 PM .... No I said I will not donate or volunteer in his camapaign this time because he was a sheepdog candidate in 2016 and all of that money and organization ended up being rolled into the Clinton campaign against my interests and will. So there is nothing wrong with him as a candidate except that he is running in a corrupt right-wing party. If you have criticisms of him you need to say what they are instead of falsely claiming he is "retarded". Actually there was everything wrong with him, but nothing that his blinded foolish followers could see. Yes, the corrupt left wing Democrats saw through his shams and used him just like they used his followers. Although the corrupt Democrats are sane enough to know that America isn't going the way of Venezuela, Bernie's followers are not. So the joke's on you and always was. Don't feel too bad, though, because the Repubs played the exact same game. Except this last time around, the People saw through these shams and put Trump in office. That's really worth thinking about a bit. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Jet Cash on February 25, 2019, 06:55:51 PM I hope that Bernie Sanders support for the false Venezuelan claimant, Guaido, and the way he is pushing for military intervention to force an illegal regime change, will show him up to be the supporter of the globalist elite that are controlling America. Americans need to fight for their independence once again, and a vote for Bernie will take them back into servitude. Spend the tax dollars on rebuilding the US infrastructure and economy, rather than giving it to the bankers who own the defence contractors, and big pharma who are pushing the global eugenics project.
Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: coins4commies on February 26, 2019, 12:37:29 AM .... No I said I will not donate or volunteer in his camapaign this time because he was a sheepdog candidate in 2016 and all of that money and organization ended up being rolled into the Clinton campaign against my interests and will. So there is nothing wrong with him as a candidate except that he is running in a corrupt right-wing party. If you have criticisms of him you need to say what they are instead of falsely claiming he is "retarded". Actually there was everything wrong with him, but nothing that his blinded foolish followers could see. Yes, the corrupt left wing Democrats saw through his shams and used him just like they used his followers. Although the corrupt Democrats are sane enough to know that America isn't going the way of Venezuela, Bernie's followers are not. So the joke's on you and always was. Don't feel too bad, though, because the Repubs played the exact same game. Except this last time around, the People saw through these shams and put Trump in office. That's really worth thinking about a bit. You can't be as simple as "Venezuela tried to help the poor and Bernie wants to help the poor so they are the same" Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: theymos on February 26, 2019, 12:54:53 AM I think that the Democratic establishment put Kamala Harris in as insurance against Bernie-or-bust people. She's pretending to be a Sanders-style Democrat, even though if you actually look at her record, she's basically a neocon. Are you seeing many people fooled by Harris?
As a libertarian, I'd be reasonably happy with Sanders because he has OK positions on the two things that a president has the most power over: foreign policy and civil rights. His economic policy is garbage, but a president can't unilaterally make massive economic changes. More worrying is that he has been successfully browbeaten by the establishment into doing things inconsistent with his philosophy on several occasions, but he's still better than most about that. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: KonstantinosM on February 26, 2019, 12:59:01 AM The way it actually works, they'll let Bernie run and even give him a lot of publicity. But just like last time, they'll be aiming to fold his votes into the back-room-selected-bred-candidate. And you'll be used, just like last time. I didn't get used. I didn't vote for Clinton, I didn't vote for Trump. Frankly I think 2016 was a big win for what I want. (Which is for policy specifics to take center stage in American politics) And Bernie was the one who did it. I'm working class and I don't regret supporting Bernie, my only regret was that my support was mostly just money. This time around I may take it more seriously and volunteer a few hours for him as well. If you recall before 2016 Medicare for all was considered fringe by the democrats. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on February 26, 2019, 01:49:35 AM The way it actually works, they'll let Bernie run and even give him a lot of publicity. But just like last time, they'll be aiming to fold his votes into the back-room-selected-bred-candidate. And you'll be used, just like last time. I didn't get used. I didn't vote for Clinton, I didn't vote for Trump. Frankly I think 2016 was a big win for what I want. (Which is for policy specifics to take center stage in American politics) And Bernie was the one who did it. I'm working class and I don't regret supporting Bernie, my only regret was that my support was mostly just money. This time around I may take it more seriously and volunteer a few hours for him as well. If you recall before 2016 Medicare for all was considered fringe by the democrats. "Medicare for All" was fringe because the Dems were after a universal health care, which after successive botches and puke worthy failures morphed into the final product called "Obamacare." The only recovery from the current reality of a shit Obamacare being patched/terminated/corrected by Trump's actions is to go a different route for the FREE STUFF FOR ALL. Hence, "Medicare for all." But it doesn't matter because that's an idealist notion, and the election is purely a power struggle. These two realities cannot be confused. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: squatz1 on February 26, 2019, 04:27:18 AM The way it actually works, they'll let Bernie run and even give him a lot of publicity. But just like last time, they'll be aiming to fold his votes into the back-room-selected-bred-candidate. This is why I'm not giving another dollar or minute to Bernie's campaign until he has fully cleared the primary. And you'll be used, just like last time. At least you're honest about it, that's fair. I don't know how he's getting the large amount of donors that he had before -- but, people are stupid I guess. I think that the Democratic establishment put Kamala Harris in as insurance against Bernie-or-bust people. She's pretending to be a Sanders-style Democrat, even though if you actually look at her record, she's basically a neocon. Are you seeing many people fooled by Harris? As a libertarian, I'd be reasonably happy with Sanders because he has OK positions on the two things that a president has the most power over: foreign policy and civil rights. His economic policy is garbage, but a president can't unilaterally make massive economic changes. More worrying is that he has been successfully browbeaten by the establishment into doing things inconsistent with his philosophy on several occasions, but he's still better than most about that. Woah woah woah. Kamala Harris is a neocon? I mean, looking at her platform makes me think that she's a socialist -- though I might be fooled over here too. Though it's pretty easy to get fooled when she's on the Medicare for All, trillion dollar tax plans, and some other random dem style stuff (https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/01/21/sen-kamala-harriss-policy-agenda-trillion-tax-plan-tax-credits-renters-bail-reform-medicare-for-all/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.294c4356f36f) He's fallen in line, and he has had to I guess. Though I still don't know how people can support him after that -- he obviously is just going to flip flop again if given the chance. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: theymos on February 26, 2019, 03:52:21 PM Woah woah woah. Kamala Harris is a neocon? I mean, looking at her platform makes me think that she's a socialist Her stated platform is meaningless, she's just parroting Sanders etc. in order to appear far left. Her record is authoritarian and rather conservative; see for example https://www.jacobinmag.com/2017/08/kamala-harris-trump-obama-california-attorney-general Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on February 26, 2019, 05:00:34 PM The way it actually works, they'll let Bernie run and even give him a lot of publicity. But just like last time, they'll be aiming to fold his votes into the back-room-selected-bred-candidate. This is why I'm not giving another dollar or minute to Bernie's campaign until he has fully cleared the primary. And you'll be used, just like last time. At least you're honest about it, that's fair. I don't know how he's getting the large amount of donors that he had before -- but, people are stupid I guess..... Alternately, quite more likely and useful, BELIEVE NOTHING THEY SAY.... Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: u9y42 on February 26, 2019, 06:42:25 PM I hope that Bernie Sanders support for the false Venezuelan claimant, Guaido, and the way he is pushing for military intervention to force an illegal regime change, will show him up to be the supporter of the globalist elite that are controlling America. Americans need to fight for their independence once again, and a vote for Bernie will take them back into servitude. Spend the tax dollars on rebuilding the US infrastructure and economy, rather than giving it to the bankers who own the defence contractors, and big pharma who are pushing the global eugenics project. Huh? Has he done either of those things? I know he said he is in favor of "internationally supervised early elections" (I imagine to avoid taking flak from his own party more than anything) but, as problematic as that is, it's not military intervention - it's still meant to hit them but, you know, with a smaller stick. :P EDIT: https://edition.cnn.com/2019/02/25/politics/bernie-sanders-venezuela-maduro/ (https://edition.cnn.com/2019/02/25/politics/bernie-sanders-venezuela-maduro/) Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: squatz1 on February 26, 2019, 06:57:59 PM Woah woah woah. Kamala Harris is a neocon? I mean, looking at her platform makes me think that she's a socialist Her stated platform is meaningless, she's just parroting Sanders etc. in order to appear far left. Her record is authoritarian and rather conservative; see for example https://www.jacobinmag.com/2017/08/kamala-harris-trump-obama-california-attorney-general Pretty large read, I'll edit this post down below once I'm done and have some analysis! Thanks for the source Theymos. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on February 27, 2019, 12:56:37 AM .... No I said I will not donate or volunteer in his camapaign this time because he was a sheepdog candidate in 2016 and all of that money and organization ended up being rolled into the Clinton campaign against my interests and will. So there is nothing wrong with him as a candidate except that he is running in a corrupt right-wing party. If you have criticisms of him you need to say what they are instead of falsely claiming he is "retarded". Actually there was everything wrong with him, but nothing that his blinded foolish followers could see. Yes, the corrupt left wing Democrats saw through his shams and used him just like they used his followers. Although the corrupt Democrats are sane enough to know that America isn't going the way of Venezuela, Bernie's followers are not. So the joke's on you and always was. Don't feel too bad, though, because the Repubs played the exact same game. Except this last time around, the People saw through these shams and put Trump in office. That's really worth thinking about a bit. You can't be as simple as "Venezuela tried to help the poor and Bernie wants to help the poor so they are the same" To be fair, though, I realize fully that you and other radicals don't want any of your promoted heroes associated or linked with total fucked losers like Maduro. But it's you and them that put themselves into that total fucked loser category by promoting Free Stuff For All. Not sure how I can help you out of that predicament... Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: coins4commies on February 27, 2019, 03:30:09 AM .... No I said I will not donate or volunteer in his camapaign this time because he was a sheepdog candidate in 2016 and all of that money and organization ended up being rolled into the Clinton campaign against my interests and will. So there is nothing wrong with him as a candidate except that he is running in a corrupt right-wing party. If you have criticisms of him you need to say what they are instead of falsely claiming he is "retarded". Actually there was everything wrong with him, but nothing that his blinded foolish followers could see. Yes, the corrupt left wing Democrats saw through his shams and used him just like they used his followers. Although the corrupt Democrats are sane enough to know that America isn't going the way of Venezuela, Bernie's followers are not. So the joke's on you and always was. Don't feel too bad, though, because the Repubs played the exact same game. Except this last time around, the People saw through these shams and put Trump in office. That's really worth thinking about a bit. You can't be as simple as "Venezuela tried to help the poor and Bernie wants to help the poor so they are the same" To be fair, though, I realize fully that you and other radicals don't want any of your promoted heroes associated or linked with total fucked losers like Maduro. But it's you and them that put themselves into that total fucked loser category by promoting Free Stuff For All. Not sure how I can help you out of that predicament... Quote Countries with universal health care include Austria, Belarus, Croatia, Czech Republic, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Iceland, Ireland, Italy, Luxembourg, Malta, Moldova, the Netherlands, Norway, Portugal, Romania, Russia, Serbia, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Turkey, Ukraine, and the United Kingdom. Free college tuition Quote Argentina Yes Austria Yes Brazil Yes Yes, but classes are taught in Portuguese. Czech Republic Yes Free tuition in the Czech language, not free in other languages. Denmark Yes Egypt Yes Finland Yes Yes France Yes Available to all European Union (EU) citizens. Germany Yes Yes Greece Yes Yes, but classes are taught in Greek. Iceland Yes Yes Kenya Yes Free public tuition for high-scoring secondary school students. Luxembourg Yes Yes Malaysia Yes Morocco Yes Norway Yes Yes, but living expenses are high. Panama Yes Yes Poland Yes Scotland Yes Slovenia Yes Available to all EU citizens. Spain Yes Sweden Yes Available to all EU citizens. Ph.D. programs are tuition-free. Turkey Yes Uruguay Yes Denmark pays students a UBI Quote under the Statens Uddannelsesstøtte program, all Danes over the age of 18 are entitled to funding from the state for up to six years for post-secondary education. Every student who doesn't live with their parents receives about 5,839 Danish krones (about $900) per month, and they do not need to pay the state back — even if they drop out of college — according to the Post. High-performing students have even more funding opportunities. But lets just ignore this heapload of facts because a country that isn't on any of these lists of doing these "socialist" programs has been driven to collapse. Lets ignore that the countries on these lists include the happiest, most successful countries the world has ever seen. Lets also ignore that the US cannot go bankrupt BECAUSE VENEZUELA. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: xxkaiwaxx on February 27, 2019, 07:45:45 PM Americans should have chosen Ron Paul when they had the chance.
Don't know how they didn't. Obviously don't like to research claims made by their leaders. First one to spoon feed them coco-pops gets the vote... Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on February 27, 2019, 10:11:48 PM .... Which of course are not facts, but partial truths and complete lies.Free college tuition.... Greece Yes Yes, but classes are taught in Greek..... But lets just ignore this heapload of facts ... Effectively you can't get a college degree in Greece because every year or two the teachers strike. But you left those FACTS out, didn't you? Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: coins4commies on February 27, 2019, 11:55:00 PM I don't know about that but it you're right, you are cherry picking Greece as an example while ignoring the rest of the 25 countries on the list, where for most, that certainly isn't the case. This is right out of the playbook though. Cherry pick extreme examples of places like Greece or Venezuela and ignore all of the most successful countries in the world.
Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on February 28, 2019, 01:02:13 AM I don't know about that but it you're right.... So you don't know about the facts of your own list?.... you are cherry picking Greece as an example while ignoring the rest of the 25 countries on the list, where for most, that certainly isn't the case. This is right out of the playbook though. Cherry pick extreme examples of places like Greece or Venezuela and ignore all of the most successful countries in the world. Oh really? So you cherry picked a list "OF THE MOST SUCCESSFUL COUNTRIES" as far as socialized blah-blah-blah, and I still have an easy time showing the lies and half truths in your list?I guess that's right. You didn't list South Africa, where socialized medicine is an abject, horrible failure. How many other nightmares did you omit? Venezuela, Ethiopia... You did cherry pick your list, didn't you? Come on, admit it. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: BADecker on February 28, 2019, 01:14:57 AM The only way Bernie might EVER stand a chance of winning is the article, below. But even if it succeeds, the Supreme Court will attempt to collapse it. By the time it is legally accepted, Bernie will be old, and dead, and probably forgotten.
Colorado Moves To Bypass Electoral College To Stop Trump: Will Assign Electoral Votes To Popular Vote Winner (http://www.freedomsphoenix.com/News/256797-2019-02-27-colorado-moves-to-bypass-electoral-college-to-stop-trump-will.htm) Certain political elements within the United States simply can’t deal with the fact that our Founders created a voting system that ensured limitations on mob rule stemming from a handful of cities throughout the country. To protect the rights of all Americans, including those living in smaller rural counties, they came up with the electoral college, a method by which all Americans from varying backgrounds and ideologies can be represented during a Presidential election. In 2016, Hillary Clinton officially won the Popular Vote, garnering more total votes than Donald Trump, but because of an Electoral College victory, Trump ultimately became President. Every time a Republican happens to win a Presidency, Democrats argue that the Electoral College is an archaic election method not representative of a democratic government. Up until now there was nothing they can do about it, but Colorado has come up with a plan that, at the very least, will likely wind up in front of the U.S. Supreme Court. 8) Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on February 28, 2019, 01:18:17 AM ...Bernie will be old, and dead, and probably forgotten.... Yes he is. But some people still believe in Bernie Bingo.Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: coins4commies on February 28, 2019, 01:22:10 AM I don't know about that but it you're right.... So you don't know about the facts of your own list?.... you are cherry picking Greece as an example while ignoring the rest of the 25 countries on the list, where for most, that certainly isn't the case. This is right out of the playbook though. Cherry pick extreme examples of places like Greece or Venezuela and ignore all of the most successful countries in the world. Oh really? So you cherry picked a list "OF THE MOST SUCCESSFUL COUNTRIES" as far as socialized blah-blah-blah, and I still have an easy time showing the lies and half truths in your list?I guess that's right. You didn't list South Africa, where socialized medicine is an abject, horrible failure. How many other nightmares did you omit? Venezuela, Ethiopia... You did cherry pick your list, didn't you? Come on, admit it. I didn't cherry pick anything i just copy pasted this list. I don't need to cherry pick because I am arguing on behalf of reality. I said the list "includes" the most successful countries but it also includes some not so successful countries. Its almost as if the success of a nation is not entirely dependent upon whether or not they choose one or 2 policies or don't....Its almost as if there are many more variables at play.... Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: BADecker on February 28, 2019, 01:22:30 AM ...Bernie will be old, and dead, and probably forgotten.... Yes he is. But some people still believe in Bernie Bingo.One of them will take his place. 8) Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: squatz1 on February 28, 2019, 01:25:09 AM Woah woah woah. Kamala Harris is a neocon? I mean, looking at her platform makes me think that she's a socialist Her stated platform is meaningless, she's just parroting Sanders etc. in order to appear far left. Her record is authoritarian and rather conservative; see for example https://www.jacobinmag.com/2017/08/kamala-harris-trump-obama-california-attorney-general Dam, this is actually a really good read. Thanks for this Theymos. Some standout points that I noticed "It should matter to us that Harris, the ardent criminal justice reformer, not only did little to enact this reform during her years as a prosecutor but backed harsh, punitive policies that undermined her own progressive rhetoric on the issue. It should matter that she at times did so needlessly, taking a harsher stance than her right-wing opponents. It should matter that she repeatedly attempted to keep an innocent man locked up in prison and attempted to defend a falsified confession."(Above link) Though even with this, I don't even think that Harris is just lying about her policies. I think she's the type of person who changes their policies when they're elected, she'll do her own thing in office but will promise you the world when she's trying to get elected. I don't think she has any beliefs, I think she's a selfish person who only cares about her looking good enough to get elected. I can't think of the word that describes people like this, though there is a word to describe a politican like this. She's someone who will stop at nothing to win, and will change her views like a pancake. Flip-floppily if you will. She is without a doubt the most dangerous type of politician. As you don't know what they'll when they gain substantial power. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on February 28, 2019, 03:52:17 AM .... She is without a doubt the most dangerous type of politician. As you don't know what they'll when they gain substantial power. At least you've spotted it, instead of being fooled. But I'm not sure that's all accurate. Isn't the true ideologue in politics is far more dangerous? Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: mOgliE on February 28, 2019, 09:07:48 AM Effectively you can't get a college degree in Greece because every year or two the teachers strike. Yeah exactly. And did you know that 10% of French die every week because of the strikes too? I mean as it seems you like to just fabricate shit like a buzzfeed writer why not go even further? Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on February 28, 2019, 12:53:42 PM Effectively you can't get a college degree in Greece because every year or two the teachers strike. Yeah exactly. And did you know that 10% of French die every week because of the strikes too? I mean as it seems you like to just fabricate shit like a buzzfeed writer why not go even further? No. That's from friends I have in Greece. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: r1s2g3 on February 28, 2019, 05:34:27 PM It is not Trump who won the elections,It was Hillary who lost the elections. Results might be different if bernie had contested in lieu of Hillary.
Anyone here who think Trump will get another 4 years? Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on March 01, 2019, 12:10:31 AM It is not Trump who won the elections,It was Hillary who lost the elections. Results might be different if bernie had contested in lieu of Hillary. Anyone here who think Trump will get another 4 years? Yes he'll get another four years. And if Bingo Bernie had stayed in there would have been more split between him and Hillary, and Trump would have won by a larger percentage. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Daniel91 on March 03, 2019, 03:42:48 PM It is not Trump who won the elections,It was Hillary who lost the elections. Results might be different if bernie had contested in lieu of Hillary. Anyone here who think Trump will get another 4 years? I even think that democrats stole elections from Bernie. It was obvious that people wants real change and between Hillary and Trump, of course Trump was real change, not Hillary. But, if democrats gave real chance to Bernie, than I think that election result could be very different. Of course, we will never know. Now, I'm not sure if Bernie still have still the same charisma and energy like in the last presidential elections. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on March 04, 2019, 01:50:25 AM .....Of course, we will never know. Now, I'm not sure if Bernie still have still the same charisma and energy like in the last presidential elections. I'll comment on that as sort of an outside spectator. I only know one individual personally who thought Bernie had "charisma and energy." Almost all thought of him as a tired, washed up old man, babbling stale socialist concepts we've all heard before. Sure, in some places, college students and other young people may not have heard of those ideas before, and they might have thought they were great ideas. But that's a very small percentage of the electorate. Most people though of him as a joke, and knew Hillary was going to crush him. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on March 04, 2019, 07:43:06 PM .... But, if democrats gave real chance to Bernie, than I think that election result could be very different. ..... Sure. It'd be the most resounding defeat for a party in US presidential history. Just check this recent survey out... https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-the-press/nbc-news-wsj-poll-2020-race-will-be-uphill-trump-n978331 ....The NBC/WSJ poll also tested 11 different presidential characteristics. The most popular: An African American (a combined 87 percent of all voters say they are “enthusiastic” or “comfortable” with that characteristic), a white man (86 percent), a woman (84 percent), and someone who is gay or lesbian (68 percent — up from 43 percent in 2006). The least popular: ....someone over the age of75 (37 percent) and a socialist (25 percent). so go ahead, push hard for an old white socialist guy..... Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: coins4commies on March 04, 2019, 10:40:25 PM the poll is bullshit because they didn't define "socialist". Wouldn't expect better from MSNBC Its a good thing that bullshit poll doesn't work anything like the way people get to know candidates in an election. Look at this
http://origin.lcv.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Five-Early-State-Climate-Survey.pdf Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on March 05, 2019, 05:57:02 PM the poll is bullshit because they didn't define "socialist". Wouldn't expect better from MSNBC Its a good thing that bullshit poll doesn't work anything like the way people get to know candidates in an election. Look at this http://origin.lcv.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Five-Early-State-Climate-Survey.pdf You think the poll is bullshit because you don't like the results. Your poll on the other hand, leads the surveyed to a conclusion of your liking. This is called faulty and biased survey design. Yes I've had a job designing surveys scientifically to eliminate bias. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: TECSHARE on March 05, 2019, 06:16:51 PM the poll is bullshit because they didn't define "socialist". Wouldn't expect better from MSNBC Its a good thing that bullshit poll doesn't work anything like the way people get to know candidates in an election. Look at this http://origin.lcv.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Five-Early-State-Climate-Survey.pdf They didn't have to define "Socialist", because Socialism has a firm definition for anyone... except for Socialists who define it as anything great that has nothing to do with actual Socialism. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Daniel91 on March 05, 2019, 08:04:59 PM .... But, if democrats gave real chance to Bernie, than I think that election result could be very different. ..... Sure. It'd be the most resounding defeat for a party in US presidential history. Just check this recent survey out... https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-the-press/nbc-news-wsj-poll-2020-race-will-be-uphill-trump-n978331 ....The NBC/WSJ poll also tested 11 different presidential characteristics. The most popular: An African American (a combined 87 percent of all voters say they are “enthusiastic” or “comfortable” with that characteristic), a white man (86 percent), a woman (84 percent), and someone who is gay or lesbian (68 percent — up from 43 percent in 2006). The least popular: ....someone over the age of75 (37 percent) and a socialist (25 percent). so go ahead, push hard for an old white socialist guy..... Thank you for this info. I agree with you, Bernie had some chance 4 years ago but now is time for democrats to try with some new, younger person, with a new ideas and energy. It seems that already many democrats are preparing for the presidential elections so it will be interesting to see who will be winner and face Trump on the end. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: coins4commies on March 07, 2019, 02:02:03 AM the poll is bullshit because they didn't define "socialist". Wouldn't expect better from MSNBC Its a good thing that bullshit poll doesn't work anything like the way people get to know candidates in an election. Look at this http://origin.lcv.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Five-Early-State-Climate-Survey.pdf They didn't have to define "Socialist", because Socialism has a firm definition for anyone... except for Socialists who define it as anything great that has nothing to do with actual Socialism. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: TECSHARE on March 07, 2019, 02:20:42 AM the poll is bullshit because they didn't define "socialist". Wouldn't expect better from MSNBC Its a good thing that bullshit poll doesn't work anything like the way people get to know candidates in an election. Look at this http://origin.lcv.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Five-Early-State-Climate-Survey.pdf They didn't have to define "Socialist", because Socialism has a firm definition for anyone... except for Socialists who define it as anything great that has nothing to do with actual Socialism. Nice false equivalency and projection combo. You have a lot of nerve talking about semantics Captain Postmodern. I have forgotten more about economics than you will ever know. Title: Re: Bernie or Bust 2020 Post by: Spendulus on March 07, 2019, 12:53:39 PM the poll is bullshit because they didn't define "socialist". Wouldn't expect better from MSNBC Its a good thing that bullshit poll doesn't work anything like the way people get to know candidates in an election. Look at this http://origin.lcv.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Five-Early-State-Climate-Survey.pdf They didn't have to define "Socialist", because Socialism has a firm definition for anyone... except for Socialists who define it as anything great that has nothing to do with actual Socialism. Nice false equivalency and projection combo. You have a lot of nerve talking about semantics Captain Postmodern. I have forgotten more about economics than you will ever know. Well it certainly is communists who tend to say "That's not REAL communism," and socialists who say "That's not REAL socialism" or "That's not Democratic Socialism" blah-blah-blah. And coins-for-commies is in this group... .... Its ok because you think all of the things socialists want are captialism.... Well, people in socialist countries DO WANT the products of capitalism.... Question: What is your opinion of a person lying, if it seems to further a person's cause? |