Bitcoin Forum

Interesting, I open a thread about buying some coins off any method that the buyer needs.
Of course offered escrow from this forum for security and then some Tinder spammer came in spamming my thread.
That's okay I don't mind spammers, but them some fraudster a trust abuser came in and from noting and for nothing leave me negative feedback ?
Why people giving powers to trust abusers and how that guy even have that powers?
His account details were also changed soon so it may be bought account ?
That's my thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5112067
And that's the trust abuser: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=932936
Is there still people around who care bout this forum and not letting some jerks to ruin people sales?

Or normal people like me who seek for normal sales with escrows are no more welcome ?

The feedback left by IdiotCoder is not an accusation of being a scammer. It is a warning to others to be more cautious when making a deal with you because you are a newbie asking to buy a big amount of btc.

You have to care more about the feedback left by Vod because he is a DT member.

I never ever offered paypal? That's why I am calling it abusive and fake ?
Do you see me anywhere offering PayPal? I don't think so.
I would never offer any payment method that's not secure for the seller also.
He's abusing the trust system and lying.
Also I am not sure how he even have the "powers" to put negative feedback visible for everyone consider he's liar, abuser and fraudster?

And that pedophile Vod is leaving me negative feedback for nothing?
What kind of forum is that ? All fraudsters and trust abusers?
You can't call randomly a scammer every single person just like that for no reason or no proofs?

IdiotCoder's feedback is showing up as trusted for me, so it might be similar for him--don't know if OP has a custom trust list or not.

I looked at OP's currency exchange thread, and I'm honestly not sure why he got negs from Vod and IdiotCoder.  He wasn't exactly trying to buy bitcoin with PayPal as a noob, which IMO might be worthy of a negative.  He was trying to buy bitcoin while using an on-forum escrow, so I just can't see where the scam attempt is.  Anyone see anything that I'm missing?

I left you negative feedback because your a newbie asking to buy a large amount of bitcoin with a reversable payment system. I never sold my account. Please stop making false accusations or I will sue you in your jurisdiction.

It seems that "Rambotnic" is one of your alts because I got neg trusted twice in a row.

V-Power sounds a lot like Rambotnic. Not quite Thule-level of sockpuppeting, so I'm not gonna neg-trust, but I'd say it's a 75% chance.

Edit:


There you go...

The funny part is I did nothing wrong and everyone tag me for nothing with lies?

Ramwho ? I don't need alts, I have just one account and I totally doing nothing wrong.
I do not care who neg trusted you, but I believe there will be many people tagging you with that lies and attitude.
If I "touch" your scamming business somehow and you want to kick off the competition you are welcome son.

Can staff give me this person's IP so I can sue them in their country?

Says the guy who abuse the trust system with lies ? :D
Where you see me offering paypal you moron ? :D
Pathetic kids... Go cry to your mother now fraudster.

I'm not sure I understand why the OP got given a red trust in the first place? He put up a post (unedited as far as I can tell) wanting to buy BTC using Bank Wire/SEPA... and stated he only wanted to use a trusted forum escrow...

A bunch of people start going on about only using trusted escrows, and then condoras pops up questioning how legit the OP is and then it descends into "I'm more legit than you'll ever be"/"Go spam someone else's thread" type silliness, until IdiotCoder pops up with "enjoy your red trust"...

To wit, IdiotCoder's trust states:

I have not seen anything in the thread that indicated that the guy was asking for a Paypal (PP) trade? ??? And as far as I'm aware... a bank wire transfer is pretty much regarded as being irreversible unless fraud can be proven and both banks involved agree and the funds haven't already been disbursed.

Honestly I thought Bank transfers could be reversed. I'm not in Europe so I don't know how it works. I would remove my red trust but after making violent posts against me, I'll delete my original feedback and post new red trust explaining his vulgar messages to me.

I'd suggest to just delete it and take the high road. If you re-post another neg feedback it will look like you are retaliating...

I know it's annoying to have a pest like Rambotnic post nonsense in your feedback but no one really would take it seriously. So don't feed the troll and let him look like the idiot (pun intended).

Agree, and for the same reason.  I guess we're trying to move away from leaving negs for what anyone posts that isn't a scam or is truly untrustworthy, and in this case whatever was said sounds like trolling.  That shouldn't rise to the level of deserving a neg, IMO. 

OP, do what you like but Theymos wants people to bury the hatchet in situations such as this.  You're probably really pissed off right now, but in a month or so you'll probably have forgotten all about Rambotnic and/or his alt accounts, and even what piqued your ire here.  Retaliatory negs are pretty much frowned upon, so maybe just think it over.

looks like he removed his feedback, now seems like a good time to remove yours too and call it a day, i suggest you pm Vod and ask why he gave you that ratting, i honestly think there was nothing wrong with your wtb topic, as long as you did not offer paypal for payment and you were accepting escrow, i personally would not trust a newbie wanting to buy that much btc , but i certainly wouldn't tag you for that.


edit :

well i just found this






I did not know about SEPA being easily reversed, but i know for sure it's very-very difficult to reverse a wire transfer, and in most cases that person who received the money has to "agree" to that reverse.

i think there is some reasonable suspicion about you here, now if you are legit, i suggest you find a good OTC group, and try to buy btc for cash or simply through the bank.

For me too, although he has since removed his review.  IdiotCoder is DT2 by way of gmaxwell (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=11425)

http://loyce.club/trust/2019-03-09_Sat_06.16h/11425.html


Those payment types are not completely safe.  It would take a lot of work to reverse some of those payments, but scammers have put in a lot of work for far less than $25k.


Yes I noticed that, referencing a thread in which you offer services, where he has not posted.  Very suspicious timing.  

Yes.  He disputes the wire transfer after the escrow releases the coin.

Wire transfers cannot be reversed (https://www.quora.com/Can-wire-transfers-be-reversed-in-case-of-fraud-What-options-does-a-customer-have-if-they-have-been-defrauded-and-paid-via-wire-transfer) in most cases, and doing so is not trivial as it is to dispute a PP or a credit card payment.

Obviously a sender of a wire transfer can take the recipient to court if he wants to claim he was defrauded, but that is also true for all other payment methods. 

A direct debit transaction is NOT the same thing as doing a bank transfer or wire transfer.

A direct debit requires pre-authorisation that you need to have already setup for a 3rd party to issue a debit transaction on your account... like your utility company, insurance company or other company where you need to make regular payments to.

This will then enable them to simple tell the bank "mikeywith" owes me $X dollars this month, authorisation ID is ABC123... bank then transfers $X automatically out of your account to the account of the company.

The reason for allowing reversals on direct debits is in the case of disputes with the company regarding charges etc.

Seems like all of you guys knows way more than me about reversible payment methods.
I am not aware which payment methods can and cannot be reversed and I don't care.
But I guess after all the scammers here and their tricks, you judge everyone with lethal hand and giving me bad names for no reason.
I don't know who Vod is and if he's not a legit seller I don't.
But if you see something wrong with the payment methods I suggest, then feel free to show me the right path instead of attacking every single person who know less than you about the "dark" side of those payment methods.
If you know better and safe ways for the seller which I could offer, then show them and I will offer only them.
I do not care how I would pay, all I care is to start and continue a safe and good business which provides security for both seller and buyer.
So far people react like animals thinking they are judges.
No one is forced or should know the same things you know.
If I do the things wrong based in your own experience or knowledge, it is better to show someone path than pointing fingers and giving names.

Is this actually a verifiable statement?


As Vod is Canadian too, is his feedback also based on the same belief?

Payments Canada (https://www.payments.ca/resources/payment-guides/business-guides/wire-transfers) are quite clear that they are not reversible.


Partial crosspost from here (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5112067.msg50143766#msg50143766)

Is is funny how U.S citizens without base knowledge about the European bank wires or SEPA comment and put rating for something they don't understand.
You can't claim your money back or reverse them.
If you like to start investigation for fraud, in first place, the bank start investigation with economic police.
After at least month investigation there could be result which also do not take the money from the receiver but banks here have their own way to refund money to the seller without taking the money from the receiver.
Only the police can claim that.
But you people still guessing, lying and post false arguments and statements.
Those tags, arguments and statements clearly prove your knowledge about the European payment systems and your IQ.
It is smarter to be silent when you don't know something instead of making yourself look like a fool.
Vod, if you are some good member of this community who spreads false arguments, your words should go from left thru right people ear.
If you like to be useful, not abusive and good member of any community, don't be a prick.
Educate yourself before putting statements.
I do not know and I do not care how and can you reverse payments from Canada and U.S.
I am not focused dealing with people over the sea.
If you like to fight me with proper and proof based arguments, please be my guest to teach me something new about the European bank payment systems.

Hey, buddy. I removed my negative trust, maybe you can remove yours from both your accounts? Because otherwise you're acting in bad faith. We're not omnipotent, and we don't know how banks work overseas. Stop being so unreasonable.

I'm acting in bad faith? Let me ask you something, who go to my topic and abused the trust system first with lies?
If your statements were truth I would take the negative feedback and move on, but you not only abused the trust system but also lied I offer PayPal for bitcoin?
Interesting, even you lied on that, why you don't go after all the paypal-bitcoin threads where you would be right and not lying?
What you want from me and why you lied?
Feel free to apologize and admit that you lied and abused the trust system in first place.
Stand your acts like a man and admit what you've done in first place if you want someone to forgive you.
I wasn't the one lying right?

IdiotCoder has already admitted that his feedback was incorrectly placed and has removed it... which is actually pretty rare for "trust" issues on this forum!

Additionally, he didn't abuse anything... his opinion was that he believed you were a scammer... and he gave you a negative rating because of that. This is exactly what the trust system is for:

What it isn't supposed to be for is "retaliatory" feedback and calling people paedophiles.

Now that he knows that his reasoning for leaving the feedback was incorrect, and has admitted as much, he has removed his feedback... You would do well to do the same.

He sent me threatening messages against my physical safety. I'll post after work. He also threatened my life in my reputation thread but staff deleted it.

Report the PMs to admin. If there is actual threat of violence Rambotnic should get a ban.

There is no much that can be done to convince him to remove his feedback. Just let it go, his feedback is not trusted by default and I strongly doubt he will be a DT member any time soon.


If you can prove it, report it to mods and they will ban his account for breaking this rule:

Do you have proof of that claim or do you just make assumptions and try to convince people about it when repeating it 100 times ?Is this the standard of high ranked DT members you represent ?Or is it your bitch attitude which is coming out again ?

Funny you don't use the same proof standards on your buddies.




Are you a trouble seeker who needs babysitting ?
Am asking based on the posts you made on his thread.

Didn't he just proofed you are an idiot who made false accusations ?As a DT2 you should be kicked out .I could understand the first mistake but for the second abuse of the trust system i gave you a negative rating.As you clearly proofed you have an ego issue unable to let it go.
Btw what do you call yourself with an account which has only arround 100 posts ?A PRO ?



That would be nonsense. Wires can't be revearsed without both banks permission.
Direct debit transactions are diffrent however OP never said anything about a direct debit transaction and SEPA is not a direct debit transaction.
Also a direct debit transaction would be needed to be initiated by the seller and not buyer.

So i also can't see any scam attempt at all.

I don't see Vod's answer for his abusive, false and fake arguments.

OP, is this true? What PMs did you send him?

I don't know this guy is talking about me or someone else, but you can consider all his words as lies.
How you can trust a person who abused the trust system with lies and false arguments?
My topic were never edited and everyone can see that I never ever offered paypal as he stated in his abusive and fake negative feedback he put in me.
I am not sure how that kind of people are allowed to post "trusted" feedback.
The same statement is also for the guy "Vod" who accusing someone without basic knowledge how Bank transfers, Wire or SEPA in Europe works.
How and why that kind of people have any powers ?

So, just so everyone is 💯% on the same page, you have sent no PMs to that person?

I'm at work. Screenshots coming. The violence threats were deleted but any moderator can check the deletion log

@Thule, I'm not even on DT.

Actually, you are... you're on DT2 thanks to gmaxwell. (http://loyce.club/trust/2019-03-09_Sat_06.16h/932936.html)

You can verify this by seeing that the trust feedbacks you have left show under the "Trusted Feedback" section when using the ";dt" view modifier: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=926376;dt

Here's the screenshot: https://postimg.cc/7C3MRtpy

As for the threats against my life, they were posted in my reputation thread and deleted by a moderator. Should still be ]in the deletion log.

That screenshot does not have a post/communication by the OP in it. The only post by V-Power deleted (https://bitcointalk.org/modlog.php) recently was in this (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5117397.0) thread that is entirely unrelated to you...

Seems like this trust abuser Vod doesn't give a shit about his mistakes and just ruing the forum name.
Vod, admit your mistake and move on like a man, just like the other guy did.
Or you are a pussy and can't stand your faults like a man?
I don't care about the negative rating, I will use middleman for all my transactions but that doesn't change the fact that a liar and abuser have "powers" to spread lies and abuse the rating.

I'm pretty sure Rambotnic is an alt of OP.

still i haven't seen the threat to harm your physical health.

Or is the threat to put his cock into your tight little asshole the threat you where talking about ?

I understand it could have a physical damage by destroying your anus ?

Why do you think this?

I got neg repped from both accounts in the span of 10 minutes.
Thule his comment was deleted by the moderator in my other thread. I would have taken screenshots if I knew this drama was going to ensure.

There would be no drama in the first place if you wouldn't have abused the trust system.
You got a reaction of your trust abuse.If that reaction was appropiate or not is another question

And it's ironic that you negged him for abusing the trust system.  I thought we were moving away from giving people red trust for petty shit like that.  Was it your intention to further weaken your credibility?  Either way, congrats on doing so.

I still would like to see the evidence that Rambotnic PM'ed this guy with threats and won't believe it 100% until I do, but it's not something I find terribly hard to believe.  I think I recall him posting some borderline threatening posts when he got his panties in a twist over something not too long ago.  Nothing that rose to the level of getting himself banned, but it was aggressive trolling.  It's not that far of a stretch to think that he'd actually threaten someone via PM.  But as I said, proof is needed. 

And Rambotnic is another one who's misusing the trust system, negging IdiotCoder for scamming without providing any proof.  He and Thule are becoming a running joke here, but not one that's very humorous.

Does SMF archive deleted posts for staff? The threats were made in my reputation thread.

Not sure about SMF but LoyceV might be able to dig it up if you tell him where to look (thread URL, approximate date, user IDs...).

Lol, that's the first thing that came to my mind when I saw this post.  Thule has proven himself to be a liar and a now, a hypocrite.

On a semi-related topic: I don't know if I'm the only one, but I have an issue with IdiotCoder being on DT2 (so I've excluded him from my trust list.)  I don't distrust IdiotCoder, but I don't necessarily trust his judgement.  This situation has shown he can be quick to judgement, at the expense of being wrong.  Also, he seems to be a bit thin-skinned for DT2.  Just my observation.  

Where did i ever stated that i will stop giving negative trust for trust abuse ?

Don't put words into my mouth i never said or agreed with.

If somebody as DT member is abusing the trust system then he deserves negative trust to get him back in line.

I didn't negative trusted him instantly even i was very upset how he was talking to V-Power and throwing false claims.

He deleted his negative trust for the accused paypal offer but at the same time instantly added another negative trust claiming its for the upset behavior of V-Power because of his abuse.

Seeing that i decided to give a negative trust as i clearly stated in that threat that such kind of people who first abuses the trust system and after that can't let it go don't belong to DT members at all.

I took a week ago away my negative ratings against Vod but seeing he made false claims and is as DT member unable to recognize his mistake and remove his false negative tag will me make reconsider adding these red tags back to him as i don't accept such behavior on any DT member



Where did i ever proofed it ?I know i won't receive a clear answer from you since a moron aka merit whore like you only throughs claims with no proof

The comments that were deleted were posted in this thread about 10 minutes after creation: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5119952.0
User: Rambotnic


Well, I never asked to be DT2 and I wasn't even aware I had that privilege until this drama ensued.

I think only Admins can see deleted posts.

Is this what you're looking for?

I agree with that, but not to the extent that I'm going to exclude him from my trust list--but you're obviously free to do what you like as far as your own trust list goes.  I'll keep my eye on any further evidence of his judgement or lack thereof.  There's going to be a lot of new DT2 members, so we're all kind of going to have to get used to that.

I don't think I ever stated that you were going to stop handing out ridiculous negs for stuff that doesn't need tagging, nor did I put any words in your mouth.  That's all in your harebrained, malodorous head.  The only thing I did say was that your doing that detracted from the credibility of any arguments you're making against DT members and their actions.  If you can't use the trust system properly yourself, why would anyone in their right mind listen to your ramblings about how the trust system needs an overhaul, etc., etc.?

Edit:

Man, all of the above sentiments and even the style of writing seems soooo familiar.  Makes me wonder what the extent of sockpuppeteering is in your little anti-DT clique is.  Not saying you employ alt accounts in order to make it seem like people agree with you, but...

Tagging trust abuse is not ridiculous for you?

I can tell you something its far more legit than your scammy negative ratings which have ZERO evidence calling people scammer and being unable to show a single scammed member or even an attempt to scam someone.

You are the pathetic bitch who used a racist alt flooding the forum with racist post just to make some money for posting.
You were the issue that the quality of the forum went down.

Seeing my account and yours i can clearly say which one did more positiv to that forum.You punk just joined the Lauda group and played scam hunter and nothing else.
You are a poor loser who needs to post racist comments to make a few bucks.Somebody like you with such an attitude who has no problems posting racist posts for a few bucks shouldn't be on DT at all.
Playing it down like it was all a joke isn't going to work if people would just once look at the amount of racist posts you made.

Seeing your avatar i can also see from where your racism is coming.

Yes

This thread become a trash can...
I don't know any of you guys but the most important is the trust abuser is not posting in this thread.
The most important here is to see the trust abuser "Vod" what have to say for his false and fake claims.
If you like to consider other people problems and false claims, please open topic about that.
If you have to say anything against the Vod's false trust abuse, please do so.

Isn't it funny how Thule shuts his mouth but doesn't retract his allegation that I was lying about the death threats after the deleted comments were posted?

Am still waiting for the death threats.
Maybe you can point them to me.
I guess everyone can see there were no death threats so i stop wasting my time on a trust abuser.

You already proofed in the past to claim false facts.So i'm still waiting to see the threats posted to you

What do you call that?

Is he threatening you to harm you?

He's talking about my death. It's not unreasonable to think he may mean me harm. Especially when you consider, €30000

IdiotCoder, those aren't death threats...

Same as wishing someone would kill themselves

Same as telling someone to go kill themselves.

tHE FORUM IS FILLED WITH THOSE EXAMPLES.

Yeah but still is quite vulgar.

Welcome to the Internet. You're getting a crash course, what with being in DT and all, but look on the bright side - it takes most people a couple of years to absorb the wealth of knowledge bestowed upon you in this thread :)

Vulgar, definitely.  Inappropriate, yes--but that's not a death threat by any means.  If I was a bit more inclined to, I think I might be able to locate a PM I got some months ago that really was a death threat, made by someone I'd tagged.  But I've got an inbox full of PMs dating back to 2015, since I rarely delete any of them.  In any case, this is just smoke being blown up your ass and isn't anything worth mentioning, much less worrying about.

Also, welcome to DT2.  If you didn't realize this already, your feedback now carries a lot more weight than untrusted members, so be careful when handing out either positive or negative trust.  You can expect people to challenge you to no end when you give them red trust, and it's a good idea to be conservative with the positives.  Good luck.

He seems to be totally lost and has no idea about the basic use of the system

1- he gave a negative to the OP for buying btc with pp ( which was a false accusation)
2- non of his ratings are refferenced
3- look at this rating > https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=2270050 ,he gave a negative rating for someone who offers to pray for people, whether you believe in prayers/God or not, you should not tag someone for that, specially that the accused member does not even ask for money in return for his "prayers".

4- look at how he handles the positive feedback >https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1719863;dt ,he left a positive feedback for a member , probably for some logo design, giving positive feedback for people just like that is more harmful than you can imagine.


I have nothing against this user , not saying he is untrustworthy ,but he clearly should not be on DT2 until he learns how to use it.

IdiotCoder has been included by gmaxwell for a while (see http://loyce.club/trust/2019-03-09_Sat_06.16h/932936.html), but was excluded by tmfp in the past week.
After reading mikeywith's post (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5119936.msg50177385#msg50177385), I've excluded him too. He's no longer on DT2.

Glad to hear that :) I have nothing against you, but I agree with mikeywith that your trust ratings aren't DT-material.

Do you contribute to the development of the code for Bitcoin? Greg Maxwell usually likes to include those types in his trust lists.

No, I'm mostly a web dev.

I would go with rainbows.

...and in particular, one 745 page nonsense thread comes to mind where there are plenty of those examples.
Need I say more? no link needed....

@IdiotCoder

I removed your negative trust i gave since i see you were able to change your mind.
Please remember to only tagg scammers where proof is given

Still waiting valid proofs or any valid arguments from this trust abuser Vod for his claims.
Why people like this one even have powers here?
Liar and trust abuser and no one give a fuck ?

Ask theymos why he allowes the abuse of the individual.
He is making it possible

Look in the mirror, idiot.  :)

You are pathetic idiot who spread lies and abuse the trust system.
There is not a single proof that the transfers from Europe to Europe (banks) can be reversed.
You are pathetic child rapist and trust abuser who don't have life.
If you guys accept that kind of people to have powers on this website and abuse the trust system, then I will create more than 1000 accounts just to abuse his trust system.
Its not that hard to be an idiot and break the rules like this kid, but when you trying to do the things right, you get this ?
Why everyone closing your eyes to the facts?
His claims are not only false and absurd but also abusive and stupid.
Vod, I will give you two days to realize your mistake and fix your bullshits before I start doing just the same you doing but in 1000x time.

I think it would be good to have Rambotnic busy with 1000 sockpuppets so that he doesn't have time to scam.

OP for fuck sake , this is so much effort for a newbie account with no trading history neither a single merit.

Don't do that.  No one knows what 1000 x 0 equals!   :P