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Title: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Loque on August 14, 2019, 05:28:31 PM Tor users can't explore the forum. It is a bit incongruous cause of the nature of the forum.
The problem is recaptcha and the IP blocker. Yes there are a lot of spammer ready to advertise shit. But users that wanna protect their privacy can't enjoy Tor here. A suggestion can be to moderate the first 5 posts of each users, enough to understand if a new registered user is a bot or not. If so, recaptcha can be removed allowing everyone browse the forum with Tor. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Royse777 on August 14, 2019, 05:29:53 PM Instead of using the TOR browser directly use it with your Firefox browser. The hassle is less.
Go to about:preferences scroll down and find the following section https://i.imgur.com/sgz1SEn.png Click Settings https://i.imgur.com/Fk9GITL.png Check manual proxy configuration. Socks host: 127.0.0.1 Port: 9150 Scroll down https://i.imgur.com/vNx3hgl.png Check Enable DNS over HTTPS Then click the OK button. Once you done it, your firefox will be configured to use TOR connection. Remember you will need to keep the TOR browser open to browse using Firefox. Good luck. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: actmyname on August 14, 2019, 05:32:07 PM A suggestion can be to moderate the first 5 posts of each users, enough to understand if a new registered user is a bot or not. Average registrations per day: 401.57If so, recaptcha can be removed allowing everyone browse the forum with Tor. 5 * 401.57 = 2007.85 Moderators still have not gone through all of my 2000 reports from a few days ago. There is a no-captcha link available for signing into specifically your account: https://bitcointalk.org/captcha_code.php. As for the IP block (or evil points) that penalizes banned users. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Loque on August 14, 2019, 05:33:18 PM @Royse777 This bypass the captcha problem but let to be pleased of the same Tor privacy level?
@actmyname thanks I didn't know of the no-captcha login link! The problem is that my real IP is now recorded in the database. Only future logins are Torred! Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Royse777 on August 14, 2019, 05:38:23 PM @Royse777 This bypass the captcha problem but let to be pleased of the same Tor privacy level? I updated my last post with the instruction.You still need to face the captcha but it less irritating than the direct TOR browser. Yeah, you get the same privacy level. It's just different browser. You are in fact using the same TOR connection instead of the regular connection you have. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Loque on August 14, 2019, 05:40:52 PM Thank you for the tip, I was unaware of that.
Gonna test it soon. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: ETFbitcoin on August 14, 2019, 06:07:02 PM @actmyname thanks I didn't know of the no-captcha login link! The problem is that my real IP is now recorded in the database. Only future logins are Torred! Almost all internet website logs your IP nowadays. No-captcha still require you to login without it once to gen no-captcha login link. Instead of using the TOR browser directly use it with your Firefox browser. The hassle is less. --snip-- Once you done it, your firefox will be configured to use TOR connection. Remember you will need to keep the TOR browser open to browse using Firefox. It's horrible suggestion, Firefox default setting heavily leaks many information including unique browser fingerprint and your real IP address (due to WebRTC feature). You need to make lots of tweak even to reach the problem, even so you'd have unique configuration which could be used to deanonymize you. Besides, you don't need to open Tor Browser to use Tor connection. Just download Tor and enable Tor service on startup. Code: sudo systemctl start tor # start tor service sudo systemctl enable tor # start tor service on boot Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: theymos on August 14, 2019, 06:33:12 PM @actmyname thanks I didn't know of the no-captcha login link! The problem is that my real IP is now recorded in the database. Only future logins are Torred! You can login via Tor. I just tried it and it worked on the first attempt, though it took a couple of minutes to solve the captcha. You login once, get the captcha code, and then never have to deal with a captcha again: all via Tor. Enable limited retention in your settings (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;sa=account). The main issue with Tor Browser here is that it doesn't save cookies between restarts, so Cloudflare and Recaptcha treat you as a completely unknown person each time. I think that it's sufficient to use Tor Browser but in its settings disable "always use private browsing mode". This definitely does impact your privacy, though. You'd ideally want a different browser instance (or profile, if Tor Browser supports it) for each site where you want this disabled. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Loque on August 14, 2019, 07:27:15 PM The server and the software of this forum prune IP of users sometimes?
Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: BitCryptex on August 14, 2019, 07:34:28 PM The server and the software of this forum prune IP of users sometimes? Take a look at the bottom of this page (https://bitcointalk.org/privacy.php). You can find the default values there which apply before you limit IP retention in your settings as theymos has already mentioned. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Loque on August 15, 2019, 12:14:05 AM lol I enabled it but it is valid from current login only.
It will store atleast for three months but geo location for 6 years. :D Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Sutters Mill on August 15, 2019, 08:59:08 AM Why do you need to use tor when there are plenty of other faster options? If you want to protect your privacy and remain anonymous then there are other ways to do it. Use a proxy that doesn't keep logs, or use the internet on a pay as you go burner phone. Get a new sim card or even phone every-time your data runs out. You can even combine them and use a proxy over the burner phone. Probably overkill though just to browse a forum.
I doubt most bots use tor as it's very impractical. Tor is probably just abused by a lot of people like proxies are hence why the forum restricts it. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: LoyceV on August 15, 2019, 10:09:58 AM Use a proxy that doesn't keep logs With a proxy or VPN you always have to trust a third party. They can say they don't keep logs, but you can never be sure.Quote or use the internet on a pay as you go burner phone. I doubt that's faster than Tor. It's also more expensive and less convenient.Quote Get a new sim card or even phone every-time your data runs out. Most people can't afford to use phones as disposables.Quote I doubt most bots use tor as it's very impractical. Tor is probably just abused by a lot of people like proxies are hence why the forum restricts it. The forum doesn't restrict Tor users. Google recaptcha "Easy on Humans, Hard on Bots (https://www.google.com/recaptcha/intro/v3.html)" becomes very difficult when it's used a lot on the same IP (and there are probably other criteria).Even some normal websites (for instance banks) now make me click recaptcha, and it's a terrible waste of time. Bots don't care, I do. it took a couple of minutes to solve the captcha While bots get better at it, I can't even imagine what they'll be like in a few years. Half an hour of clicking to prove you're human?Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Sutters Mill on August 15, 2019, 10:51:52 AM Use a proxy that doesn't keep logs With a proxy or VPN you always have to trust a third party. They can say they don't keep logs, but you can never be sure.There are ones that are very open about what logs they keep and have been independently verified https://nordvpn.com/blog/nordvpn-audit/ I'm not recommending them over any other but they're the one that come to mind. Regardless, if you didn't want to use a vpn just go with the burner option. Quote or use the internet on a pay as you go burner phone. I doubt that's faster than Tor. It's also more expensive and less convenient.It's much faster than tor. in my experience Tor is a pain to use and not recommended for every day use. 4g is very fast even on a mobile connection. It's also not that expensive.Credit can be purchased for $10 a month and if you can afford the internet then you can afford this option, but protecting your privacy is going to come at a small cost but some may feel it's worth the money. Of course you can continue using tor but have to bare its restrictions. There's no guarantee that tor is fully safe either. I think the admin of this forum has mentioned the possibility of tor being compromised in some capacity before. Quote Get a new sim card or even phone every-time your data runs out. Most people can't afford to use phones as disposables.Phones are very cheap these days. New ones can be bought from $20 dollars. You can even buy used ones for less. Using a new phone every time is probably overkill unless you're up to some shady business but if you just want to protect your privacy a new sim every now and again will suffice. Just buy a new one every time you need to top up or chnage it every few months or so but again this is probably overkill. Quote I doubt most bots use tor as it's very impractical. Tor is probably just abused by a lot of people like proxies are hence why the forum restricts it. The forum doesn't restrict Tor users. Google recaptcha "Easy on Humans, Hard on Bots (https://www.google.com/recaptcha/intro/v3.html)" becomes very difficult when it's used a lot on the same IP (and there are probably other criteria).Even some normal websites (for instance banks) now make me click recaptcha, and it's a terrible waste of time. Bots don't care, I do. It restricts them in the sense that you can't sign up via tor - or you can but not without paying a fee. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Welsh on August 15, 2019, 11:05:56 AM The server and the software of this forum prune IP of users sometimes? IP's are kept depending on the way they're recorded, and the settings you've enabled. Full IP is usually around 6 months, if you haven't selected limited retention which is then usually around 3 months. Partial IP is kept for around 2 years. City geolocation probably to assist with recovery is kept for longer than the others, and that's around 6 years. As mentioned above this can be found at: https://bitcointalk.org/privacy.php Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Royse777 on August 15, 2019, 12:34:59 PM It's horrible suggestion, Firefox default setting heavily leaks many information including unique browser fingerprint and your real IP address (due to WebRTC feature). Okay, I was not aware about it at all. How about if I clear my history and cache every time I restart my Firefox? Do I start clean again in this case? You need to make lots of tweak even to reach the problem, even so you'd have unique configuration which could be used to deanonymize you. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: TryNinja on August 15, 2019, 01:13:29 PM Okay, I was not aware about it at all. How about if I clear my history and cache every time I restart my Firefox? Do I start clean again in this case? I don't think your browser's cache has anything to do with WebRTC. What you need to do in this case is disable it: https://www.privacyend.com/disable-webrtc-in-various-browsers/ And maybe install some extra privacy extensions: https://blog.mozilla.org/firefox/make-your-firefox-browser-a-privacy-superpower-with-these-extensions/ Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Welsh on August 15, 2019, 02:26:28 PM Okay, I was not aware about it at all. How about if I clear my history and cache every time I restart my Firefox? Do I start clean again in this case? My advice would be if you care about privacy then don't substitute Tor Browser for firefox extensions, and settings. Tor Browser is bulit on the firefox browser, but has been refined to do exactly what needs to be done to keep your privacy intact. You can't emulate that with extensions or settings without having the same issues Tor Browser is subject too. There are settings within Tor Browser to make it restrictive, and therefore improve browsing experience for some websites. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: ETFbitcoin on August 15, 2019, 05:44:54 PM Okay, I was not aware about it at all. How about if I clear my history and cache every time I restart my Firefox? Do I start clean again in this case? I don't think your browser's cache has anything to do with WebRTC. What you need to do in this case is disable it: https://www.privacyend.com/disable-webrtc-in-various-browsers/ And maybe install some extra privacy extensions: https://blog.mozilla.org/firefox/make-your-firefox-browser-a-privacy-superpower-with-these-extensions/ Those are good steps to achieve some privacy, but manually configured Firefox can't beat Tor Browser, unless you're expert. AFAIK there aren't any extension which makes your browser fingerprint non-unique which used to track user. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Royse777 on August 15, 2019, 07:35:57 PM Okay using my firefox browser I visited this: https://www.vpninsights.com/webrtc-leak-test
It indeed detected my real IP ::) But when I tried with TOR browser directly, it could not detect it. Thanks TryNinja, ETFbitcoin and Welsh. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: malevolent on August 16, 2019, 06:07:11 AM Average registrations per day: 401.57 5 * 401.57 = 2007.85 401 is averaged since 2009. It's probably twice as much now (down from several thousand new user registrations per day during the height of the ICO craze). So, yeah, either way that's too much work for us mods :P Phones are very cheap these days. New ones can be bought from $20 dollars. You can even buy used ones for less. Using a new phone every time is probably overkill unless you're up to some shady business but if you just want to protect your privacy a new sim every now and again will suffice. Just buy a new one every time you need to top up or chnage it every few months or so but again this is probably overkill. If you care about privacy enough to inconvenience yourself with mobile Internet, maybe Tor is what you need. Otherwise your ISP can still locate where you are and who you connect to. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: DdmrDdmr on August 16, 2019, 09:05:22 AM Average registrations per day: 401.57 Going over @Alex-Sr’s thread that keeps track of the number of registered users per month (see Statistics of user registrations on Bitcointalk 2017-2019 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4685601.0)), the recent average registered users is around 675/day so far (en of June) this year:5 * 401.57 = 2007.85 Code: 2019 Month Registered nDays Average January 22234 31 717 February 16202 28 579 March 18932 31 611 April 17910 30 597 May 24472 31 789 June 22357 30 745 Total Acc 122107 181 675 Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: Welsh on August 16, 2019, 10:02:51 AM Okay using my firefox browser I visited this: https://www.vpninsights.com/webrtc-leak-test It indeed detected my real IP ::) But when I tried with TOR browser directly, it could not detect it. Thanks TryNinja, ETFbitcoin and Welsh. Its good practice although probably unnecessary to check whether the tor browser is leaving any fingerprints, and to check it with sites like these. Just in case you've changed a setting which compromises it. Remember, things like maximizing the window on tor browser can compromise privacy when you're browsing sites which collect that information. Title: Re: The forum is penalizing Tor users Post by: tranthidung on August 16, 2019, 10:12:54 AM Assumed monthly statistics on registered accounts of bitcointalk.org (2009-2019) (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5168990.0)
Some main points are: As a result of garbage-posting, admin asked for 1 merit to become Junior Members, since September of 2018. 3 months later, December of 2018, we saw dramatical drops of monthly new registered account. Interesting to see that despite amazingly rally of bitcoin since December of 2018, people have not yet created too many accounts (just 7.8% increase from bottom in December 2018). They likey woke up their old-era Newbie accounts (as the ban wave in April and May shows) Update with newest data from theymos In the last 30 days: The total registed account in one-month period from 15 Nov. 2018 to 15 Dec. 2018 is at 20733.- 16441 users registered. It means that total registered accounts last 30 days is 20 percent lower than the figure in Dec. last year when Bitcoin bottomed out. Code: . di (20733-16441)/20733*100 Latest given data from theymos, is another solid proof that spammers considerably reduce their pace of creating new accounts.20.701297 (1) Despite the rise of bitcoin to around $14,000, monthly registered accounts in last few months are too far away from all time high at 238433, in Dec. 2017. (2) Minimum and maximum are 3 and 238433, in Nov. 2009, and December 2017, respectively. (3) 50% of months (from Nov. 2009 to June 2019) have total monthly registered accounts in the range from 2611 to 24472 (the interquatile range). (4) 50% of those months have total monthly registered accounts above or below 10691 (the median). (5) The lowest and highest medians (of months for each year) found at 148 and 66895, in 2010 and 2018. (6) From peaks on 20/12/2017, BTC close price and monthly registered accounts decreased 91.3%, and 81%, respectively, on 15/12/2018. (7) Since 15/12/2018, BTC close price and monthly registered accounts increased 159%, and 7.8%, respectively, on 1/6/2019. * Details of points (6), (7), please read the second post of this thread. < ... > Combining them, I converted dataset to use for below analysis Code: . list id day month2 year date regacc +------------------------------------------------+ | id day month2 year date regacc | |------------------------------------------------| 1. | 1 2 11 2009 02nov2009 3 | 2. | 2 2 12 2009 02dec2009 8 | 3. | 3 1 1 2010 01jan2010 8 | 4. | 4 31 1 2010 31jan2010 22 | 5. | 5 2 3 2010 02mar2010 5 | |------------------------------------------------| 6. | 6 1 4 2010 01apr2010 22 | 7. | 7 1 5 2010 01may2010 15 | 8. | 8 31 5 2010 31may2010 33 | 9. | 9 30 6 2010 30jun2010 325 | 10. | 10 30 7 2010 30jul2010 159 | |------------------------------------------------| 11. | 11 29 8 2010 29aug2010 148 | 12. | 12 28 9 2010 28sep2010 190 | 13. | 13 28 10 2010 28oct2010 204 | 14. | 14 27 11 2010 27nov2010 383 | 15. | 15 27 12 2010 27dec2010 384 | |------------------------------------------------| 16. | 16 26 1 2011 26jan2011 938 | 17. | 17 25 2 2011 25feb2011 2202 | 18. | 18 27 3 2011 27mar2011 2737 | 19. | 19 26 4 2011 26apr2011 4936 | 20. | 20 26 5 2011 26may2011 14048 | |------------------------------------------------| 21. | 21 25 6 2011 25jun2011 6250 | 22. | 22 25 7 2011 25jul2011 3903 | 23. | 23 24 8 2011 24aug2011 2938 | 24. | 24 23 9 2011 23sep2011 1983 | 25. | 25 23 10 2011 23oct2011 1965 | |------------------------------------------------| 26. | 26 22 11 2011 22nov2011 1835 | 27. | 27 22 12 2011 22dec2011 1812 | 28. | 28 21 1 2012 21jan2012 2082 | 29. | 29 20 2 2012 20feb2012 1901 | 30. | 30 21 3 2012 21mar2012 2158 | |------------------------------------------------| 31. | 31 20 4 2012 20apr2012 1969 | 32. | 32 20 5 2012 20may2012 2057 | 33. | 33 19 6 2012 19jun2012 2040 | 34. | 34 19 7 2012 19jul2012 2145 | 35. | 35 18 8 2012 18aug2012 2419 | |------------------------------------------------| 36. | 36 17 9 2012 17sep2012 2661 | 37. | 37 17 10 2012 17oct2012 2958 | 38. | 38 16 11 2012 16nov2012 2763 | 39. | 39 16 12 2012 16dec2012 2611 | 40. | 40 15 1 2013 15jan2013 3320 | |------------------------------------------------| 41. | 41 14 2 2013 14feb2013 4933 | 42. | 42 16 3 2013 16mar2013 13816 | 43. | 43 15 4 2013 15apr2013 18162 | 44. | 44 15 5 2013 15may2013 11318 | 45. | 45 14 6 2013 14jun2013 8095 | |------------------------------------------------| 46. | 46 14 7 2013 14jul2013 6703 | 47. | 47 13 8 2013 13aug2013 5505 | 48. | 48 12 9 2013 12sep2013 4137 | 49. | 49 12 10 2013 12oct2013 5632 | 50. | 50 11 11 2013 11nov2013 26804 | |------------------------------------------------| 51. | 51 11 12 2013 11dec2013 28776 | 52. | 52 10 1 2014 10jan2014 29576 | 53. | 53 9 2 2014 09feb2014 29839 | 54. | 54 11 3 2014 11mar2014 22534 | 55. | 55 10 4 2014 10apr2014 18065 | |------------------------------------------------| 56. | 56 10 5 2014 10may2014 13071 | 57. | 57 9 6 2014 09jun2014 12180 | 58. | 58 9 7 2014 09jul2014 10561 | 59. | 59 8 8 2014 08aug2014 10925 | 60. | 60 7 9 2014 07sep2014 9418 | |------------------------------------------------| 61. | 61 7 10 2014 07oct2014 8218 | 62. | 62 6 11 2014 06nov2014 7974 | 63. | 63 6 12 2014 06dec2014 8136 | 64. | 64 5 1 2015 05jan2015 23256 | 65. | 65 4 2 2015 04feb2015 36913 | |------------------------------------------------| 66. | 66 6 3 2015 06mar2015 33500 | 67. | 67 5 4 2015 05apr2015 8450 | 68. | 68 5 5 2015 05may2015 8577 | 69. | 69 4 6 2015 04jun2015 10303 | 70. | 70 4 7 2015 04jul2015 11773 | |------------------------------------------------| 71. | 71 3 8 2015 03aug2015 9725 | 72. | 72 2 9 2015 02sep2015 7644 | 73. | 73 2 10 2015 02oct2015 68601 | 74. | 74 1 11 2015 01nov2015 44059 | 75. | 75 1 12 2015 01dec2015 37106 | |------------------------------------------------| 76. | 76 30 1 2016 30jan2016 42233 | 77. | 77 29 2 2016 29feb2016 24213 | 78. | 78 30 3 2016 30mar2016 19336 | 79. | 79 29 4 2016 29apr2016 16031 | 80. | 80 29 5 2016 29may2016 19935 | |------------------------------------------------| 81. | 81 28 6 2016 28jun2016 12582 | 82. | 82 28 7 2016 28jul2016 10646 | 83. | 83 27 8 2016 27aug2016 9986 | 84. | 84 26 9 2016 26sep2016 9844 | 85. | 85 26 10 2016 26oct2016 10718 | |------------------------------------------------| 86. | 86 25 11 2016 25nov2016 10691 | 87. | 87 25 12 2016 25dec2016 12429 | 88. | 88 24 1 2017 24jan2017 13664 | 89. | 89 23 2 2017 23feb2017 13893 | 90. | 90 25 3 2017 25mar2017 15276 | |------------------------------------------------| 91. | 91 24 4 2017 24apr2017 20585 | 92. | 92 24 5 2017 24may2017 31381 | 93. | 93 23 6 2017 23jun2017 35866 | 94. | 94 23 7 2017 23jul2017 40726 | 95. | 95 22 8 2017 22aug2017 45026 | |------------------------------------------------| 96. | 96 21 9 2017 21sep2017 70477 | 97. | 97 21 10 2017 21oct2017 95568 | 98. | 98 20 11 2017 20nov2017 144762 | 99. | 99 20 12 2017 20dec2017 238433 | 100. | 100 19 1 2018 19jan2018 136872 | |------------------------------------------------| 101. | 101 18 2 2018 18feb2018 107237 | 102. | 102 20 3 2018 20mar2018 87087 | 103. | 103 19 4 2018 19apr2018 89659 | 104. | 104 19 5 2018 19may2018 83999 | 105. | 105 18 6 2018 18jun2018 72430 | |------------------------------------------------| 106. | 106 18 7 2018 18jul2018 61360 | 107. | 107 17 8 2018 17aug2018 41451 | 108. | 108 16 9 2018 16sep2018 41516 | 109. | 109 16 10 2018 16oct2018 35335 | 110. | 110 15 11 2018 15nov2018 31502 | |------------------------------------------------| 111. | 111 15 12 2018 15dec2018 20733 | 112. | 112 14 1 2019 14jan2019 20046 | 113. | 113 1 2 2019 01feb2019 16202 | 114. | 114 1 3 2019 01mar2019 18932 | 115. | 115 1 4 2019 01apr2019 17910 | |------------------------------------------------| 116. | 116 1 5 2019 01may2019 24472 | 117. | 117 1 6 2019 01jun2019 22357 | +------------------------------------------------+ Plot: |
