Bitcoin Forum

check the chart, it's scary

https://coin360.com/ (https://coin360.com/)

no sign of rebirth

Most people on survey choose it was dying, and maybe the trend on how that works towards the latest market. Based on the link you shared here, I foresee more reasons why this was eventually taking out of the lime light. This was due to non profitable gains, and in fact it was costly when it comes to electricity consumption.

It cannot be allowed to apply to the real economy, the world governments are unprecedented unity on it. It is killing the bitcoin world and I hate this

only the big miners that can survive in the mining contest. So many miners are moving from the big coins to the medium or even small coins. I believe that's why so many people are choosing the dying as their answer to the polling. The difficulty increase combined with the halving makes the profitability in the mining crypto is getting worst and worst day to the day.
That's not a big surprise to see that and i personally will choose the same option as those people.

its crazy, look at who is registering the most blockchain patents these last few years too :(
most of the same groups that said crypto was a scam/bubble.   banks mainly, they register 100's of patents a year for blockchain tech
they are implementing the tech all the while still ostracizing it :(   BTC mining definitally belongs to big money now : /

Not scary to me as long as Bitcoin is still dominating the market, this is only scary if you have invested on some coins that cannot profit for a long time, the chard only confirmed that only Bitcoin is worth to be in our portfolio and because we should not, put all our eggs in our basket we can add some coin slike Ethereum and other top coins in the market.

Traditional mining died some time ago and soon even small miners will die as the difficulty will rise to a point where profits will be no longer in the green area. I'm surprised that someone in 2019 still asking about traditional mining like CPU/GPU ...even if you have the new i9 and amd razen you won't be able to mine a thing on bitcoin network. Mining industry takes necessary investments every few months in order to sustain your hashrate side by side with the network difficulty.

Yes, I believe in this. It is too sad that mining is dying nowadays, here in my country people started to sell their rigs because it is not profitable anymore ,because of many circumstances. Electricity payment here is getting more higher, the graphics card or the video card is expensive since the 2017 hype, so upgrading is too costly. I wonder how does other miners survive with this one.

In general, it is obvious that the trends of the influx of new users into mining are negative. This is due to the fact that the price of bitcoin is extremely unstable and has few visible factors for growth.
In addition, halving is expected soon, which can hit the miners very hard. However, if the price rises, but does not fall, those who decided to take a chance and continued to engage in mining will be a big winner.

It seems so. Even worse those coin that could be mined with ASIC basically spell bankruptcy for GPU mining because ASIC simply mine efficiently than GPU and the gap is too far. Mining is just not profitable anymore for the GPU miners, as a result is a more centralizded hash power and only big miner will remain and the traditional ones will dies out.

The difficulty will adjust when more miners leave and mining will be profitable again later. No need to panic about it. It has happened before and will happen again.

Yes traditional mining is dying now because most of user dont afford to buy expensive equipment on mining,  unlike before that mining 1 bitcoin and other crypto is easy even price is low.  Now mining 1 bitcoins takes 4 years and this is very long to wait and also its cause you losses especially if you are not living on counrty that electricity is cheap Like Russia and China. I think user that afford to mine is big investors and also mining company.

Well, the question is tricky, because as traditional mining we can talk about CPU mining. And since a long time ago no one is mining Bitcoins with CPU, so, from that side we could say it's dying. But on another hand day by day, we see new technology involving miners, and new technology on the mining code. So, i don't think it's dying, i would say it's evolving.

I couldn't agree more on this statement. Small miners tends to stop for a while in mining til it back to profitable as usual or worst case scenario they'll quit mining, why? coz why not. Electricity consumption is at expense on mining generating more electricity rate than the reward for mining. Centralized mining are the only one who can sustain their operation but I guess they were not generating too much from it and they are doing it just to maintain the mining. And worrying if what does the halving would bring to our miners.

The only solution to mining nowadays is if GPU manufacturers start using lower energy tech on graphics card like 7nm or even lower, with this it will make sense because present mining problem is electricity costs

honestly I personally do not really know about mining, but from many users who discuss mining they say that now mining is no longer profitable because it cannot cover operational costs and for several other reasons. maybe now is a good time to add to coin collections when prices are cheap.

I don't think so, mining only dies when the mined currency dies. The top coins scenario like BTC, LTC, BCH die, will never happen.

The whole crypto mining thing is not fun to me anymore since profitability is getting lower every day, i used to mine xmr with my gpus but now CPU mining with xmr is more profitable than using gpu since the new software upgrade, i just quit because of this

Right now, mining brings only a tiny profit, but its all depends on price. If during the next couple of months, crypto prices are going to increase, it can change everything and make mining more profitable than ever.

For large scale I think they are managing their profits very well, but for small time miners like me in the past I don't think so unless you got a free electricity to run your machines. I've already stopped mining when my mother board was fried due to short circuits and the cards were on it. I finally had the chance to grab a low cost energy for mining but I don't have the budget to build a new rig. If there are ways to mine again maybe I will try to mine again.

To enjoy mining you should be ready for high capable GPUs like AMD cards of this generation e.g the RTX leagues and RX VEGA, though it depends on algorithms too but i find Asic miners to be the best, you can make back your ROI in a year, its more than that with GPUs

I think yes unless there comes super high efficient mining equipment that consumes 100x less energy than the current ones or if a highly efficient built in solar powered mining equipment launches in the market that too at even cheaper prices than currently available miners.

I lost my interest in mining long ago. Even when mining was profitable you could still get scammed by people who sell miners that do not exist and then run. It happened a few times. I just didn't trust that. One company I was thinking of buying from turned out to be a scam so I am glad I never fell for that. Mining is just too costly only those with megabucks can mine. It has taken some of the fun out of crypto. The rest of us cannot compete and we have no other options. It doesn't surprise me that mining is less popular then it was.

For small miners, yes.
But if you're from a huge company that's focused on mining, it isn't.
If mining dies, bitcoin transactions will be the first one to die but those altcoins that have a consense of PoW, they usually die if they don't have the demand.

I expected some will be disappointed but the truth is the mining difficulty is quite increasing the only way to still gain profits is to set a large scale mining or deploy powerful and many rigs to be able to gain a stable one. The mining will die for those who do personal mining alone cause you can't sustain the expenses that also arises from it. But for large group that mine there is no problem cause they still can earn and leverage the expenses by quantity.

Ordinary miners just can't keep up with the growth of large miners because they will allocate few percents of their earning to expand their mining rigs using the latest technology, therefore, the difficulties after 2006 blocks will be adjusted and that will takes up a huge portion of the small miners earning. The small and traditional miners are just waiting for the time to get bankrupt because they couldn't handle the expense and maintenance fees which exponentially increasing alongside the inflation over time.

Traditional mining does not die only if it is done now instead of adding profit but increases the loss in electricity paid but the result is not enough to cover it. Reasonable only when BTC rose from the last year was too little that mining because of the generated hash a bit and switch to the mining cloud even at risk.

that will not work when you are doing mining in the high difficulty. that will force you to put more and more GPU to increase your profitability. The new GPUs don't give you a lot of profit. Especially when such coin gets halving and that means the reward will be decreasing again and that's the end of era for mining (small players).

Mining will only die if crypto dies, bear market = low profits, bull market = big profits.  Mining isn't always going to be good it follows the markets ups and downs.  If you have low electrical cost and you bought your equipment at decent prices you can scrap by.  

In my opinion, mining bitcoin, ether is no longer profitable at short range, although in the future 5 years mining on ASic will still pay off at current prices of about $ 7,000.

Gpu mining is unsustainable at these current rates, only reason the difficulty is so high is from all the roi'd equipment from the past cycle.  The farms and home miners are hanging on hoping for another bullrun, but they will exit eventually when their equipment fails or becomes obsolete over time.  So that is what it is, we are in an unbalanced ecosystem currently and eventually it will correct itself but that may take years if profits stay the same.

Generally speaking I would consider the ecosystem in balance if payoff is 1-1.5 yrs time.

Lol, That's why I'm still mining 90% of my equipment is pre 2017 bull run and payed off long ago.   

For us, small miners, the mining is almost dead

For a small miner to keep mining, he have to pay a very low electricity rate, and to pay for investments will be a long time

I miss the 2017 where I bought my GPUs and mining the entire year, I had a lot of fun, money and hardware that I would never buy like 1080tis because of the money

I have a friend and he has been several years to mine some altcoin. If I'm not mistaken he has do that for almost 3 years. But currently, he just selling his computer and decided to stop mine an altcoin because he just made a debt to pay electricity and he holds the altcoin that he mined in hope the altcoin price will increase a lot.

Maybe, there are some something new to get passive income beside mining. Such as being a masternode, reckon the coim who has LPOS as their system because you just need a phone to get passive income through LPOS and through POS who doesn't require a high computer level to mine.

I'm quite new on this place and just interesting how to get altcoin through staking, masternode and etc to get some altcoin.

This is true. However now that mining is more understood, easier to setup and known by more of the masses, it will never return to the era of niche users who had the time/patience/knowledge that preceded the 'normies' where all you needed was a rig with 2 or 3 gpus to turn a reasonable profit.

From that time each time you've heard about new gpu's you'll be interested to learned how big the profits it can bring you. Buying whenever you already afford and upgrade your rigs, many small time miners gave up and accept the fate of this business.

Nothing is working especially if you are in the place where electricity is too expensive.

No idea why you would post Coin360 which is just a heatmap of all the market cap of all cryptos. You do realise that many of those cryptos you can't mine.

Is traditional mining dying? Yes, sort of and its because Satoshi never assumed that people would be so profit oriented and not follow his "One CPU One Vote" rule. He probably didn't expect companies like Bitmain to make an ASIC which is thousands of times faster than a GPU and probably hundreds of thousands of times faster than a CPU.

The reason why its dying is due to competition and this is how it is in most fields. We might get another shot at mining if ETH switches to ProgPOW and many of the ETH ASICs leave the network but who knows if that ever will be implemented.

It's sad, but it's true that sometime you have to think and stop mining. It's hard to keep putting money to maintain your rigs working if market is too low on prices






I already stopped to waste my time looking for new GPUs or CPUs to mine, because it's the same, I can buy a strong, brand new model of GPU, mine for profit only a few days and them the market will be flooded by new GPUs, big miners are adding power/hashrate everyday

couldn't be further from the truth. the graphics cards are cheaper than ever, especially used cards that can still mine and be profitable. The ROI of course is much longer these days, but somebody who owns a gaming PC can mine on it when idling and get some money back (some AMD Ryzen CPUs are rather profitable)

What I don't understand is the big risks and doubling down by Canaan and Bitmain on 5nm chips for the next set of ASIC miners, supposedly out in Q1 of 2020!

I mean from what I read, this is supposedly a 15% improvement in speed vs electric use. So at current BTC prices, this makes little or no sense to me.

Also, I'd imagine when they come out they will be in the $3k range and a 3 month pre-order too boot. This most likely will be after the BTC Halving before they arrive,

IMHO, so 'what'? Does this mean you are going to pay this kinda $$ for the same lousy ROI as you can get now with the current 7nm machines?

Really, why bother?

With no risk/pre-order/$$$ etc, etc, for every $1 BTC you get now 'supposedly,' you would get $2 BTC mining after the block reward downturn from

12.50 BTC a block to 6.25 BTC a block. I mean it seems a lot of development costs and effort just to find out once the units arrive you are basically

running in place!

So did I miss a memo? Why is everybody from Bitmain to Canaan to whomever, losing their frigging mind and buying ASIC's at these 'dubious' prices?

Are folks really, really, that frigging sure that the halving gonna DOUBLE the BTC price in a manner that makes these 5nm ASIC units make sense?

This is like the very wealthy in the Bitcoin Universe have just lost their minds after drinking the kool-aid and are running a amuck on the sugar high.

Again, for my above reasons, what the heck are they seeing that is escaping my notice on all this?

later

Brad

Isn't every ASIC that is released overpriced however? Even going back to the Antminer S5 which was released during a bear market. People said it was over-priced and then they slashed prices to compete with the SP 20 miner.

Same with the miners before that the Antminer S3 and S4, they were released during a sideways market, were overpriced and most likely any home miner which bought those never ROI'd if you took into account USD fiat rewards.

I am guessing that there are farms that get these miners at a discount and they got tons of capital to run them almost at break-even and they probably only sell during a bull rally. Why they don't just buy the BTC directly I don't understand however.

That set me a-thinking. Who profits the most (if at all) from mining? Not the miners. But the equipment sellers. They know how to ride the cryptowave

I agree. But it is not just the big-time miners and data halls. It is Canaan and Bitmain as well, taking huge risks on their on data halls and 5nm chips by Q1. I mean I kinda get

HODL'ing BTC at this time, before halving. But sh*t, it is like anyone Whale with really big BTC hoards has drunk the kool-aid and is balls to the walls on equipment.

Indeed I would expect such equipment to be above 3.25k at least! For what a 15% improvement over 7nm?

Also, from what I can tell, (correct my math please if I'm way off), you will need like a BTC price of at least $10,500 USD at halving, to kinda be at the same mining profitability

as we are now...or at least treading water.

Maybe it is just balls to the wall, beanie baby or dust and Charge of the Light Brigade...but it is way over the top, IMHO, among big-money players in crypto to be swarming like this.

Brad

there are a lot of degenerates out there with GPU's and new degenerates who just learned computers. mining might be dead for some but it is a huge world we live in folks  ;)