Bitcoin Forum

Hi everybody!

I have an idea for a Bitcoin strategy game that I want to share with the community.

The idea could be called "biggest whale wins". Let's say there is a pot, any user can place a bet of any amount that goes to the pot. The only condition is that each bet must be bigger than the previous one. There is a countdown of let's say 24 hours. When the time expires, the biggest bet wins the entire pot. It is very simple, but it can be exciting, how much will you risk to win the pot, how big the pot can be?
To improve the game, we can add the option of a random period of time, so you don't know when the current round is going to end. Or also the option that the time period increases or decreases in each new bet, depending on some factor such as the difference in the bet amount from the previous one.

Example of a game's round:

player 1 places a bet of 0.001 BTC, pot = 0.001 BTC
player 2 places a bet of 0.005 BTC, pot = 0.006 BTC
player 3 places a bet of 0.006 BTC, pot = 0.012 BTC
player 4 places a bet of 0.01 BTC, pot = 0.022 BTC
player 2 places a new bet of 0.02 BTC, pot = 0.042 BTC
player 5 places a bet of 0.025 BTC, pot = 0.067 BTC
player 1 places a new bet of 0.1 BTC, pot = 0.167 BTC
player 6 places a bet of 0.15 BTC, pot = 0.317 BTC
player 2 place a bet of 0.2 BTC, pot = 0.517 BTC
round ends, placer 2 wins 0.517 BTC

What do you think? Since many people play casinos at other random games, would you like to play a game more focused on strategy? What improvements or variations can be added?

So, its just like some Fomo3d game once again but now does have the time limit of 24 hours? There were already games on the said new concept you say
but actually end up on becoming trash yet this one is just really good for those whales out there that do have the money to put before the time runs out
or most people will target out that last minute.Its better to find or consider on creating a new game excluding this one.

I found the idea interesting. Sometimes people say: "this is not going to work". But I think it all depends on the genius of who is behind the idea. Just remember what happened to the tablets.
Steve Jobs took a stage at the Yerba Buena Center for the Arts, an event space in the city of San Francisco, California to present the next step in a successful saga that began with the iPod, went through the iPhone to finally reach the iPad , on January 27 of that year, 2010.
Tablets were not exactly a novelty. The idea has been around for a long time, and some products of this type have been on the market since the 1990s. At the turn of the millennium, Microsoft even coined the term “Tablet PC” to designate computers in portable format, normally thought to be used with a stylus.
Even though it existed for more than a decade, the format was never a commercial success. Companies have always failed to create a product that is attractive to the end consumer and that justifies its price. Only Apple was able to understand what the public wanted for a tablet format, also relying a little on the famous “reality distortion magic” that only Steve Jobs was able to use.

First, Welcome to Bitcointalk gambling community.
This is not a new one. I've seen a lot of these kinds of concepts already. It's just that I forget the specific websites that have the same strategy game. Maybe because I wasn't really interested and I am not a big whale myself. But I think the duration is not a bad idea. It's just that, there is a loophole from the end of the strategy-game provider as they can actually manipulate it. As a suggestion, I guess the period of time is not really the best thing. It is better to make it short, and quick. The players will place their bets within 10-15 seconds. And then boom, the results will show. Nevertheless, more trust, less risk in manipulation.

I don't think this is an unique idea, there are already a lot of similar activities. To my.opinion such game, strategy or to call it whatever name can't attract users to put money into it, at least I wouldn't. Also, I don't think it has a potential for commercial success and that is important. Something more original and creative could maybe have some chances, this is not the case.

Thanks for your comment and the previous ones. I would like to know about these other websites that have similar or the same concept of game.

About the time period, that's why I suggest some way that it depends also on the player's choices. Perhaps players can choose to extend or reduce the time remaining until the end of the round. Or perhaps there is a 60 seconds expiring time from last bet. So, if one bet stays for 60 seconds without any other player placing a bet, it wins.

Also, I am thinking that to open the game to everybody, not only big whales, there could be the option of "pool bets" where many players put together small amounts on the same bet and then they share the jackpot accordingly if they win.

I don't have links to their websites right now but most of them were built using Ethereum smart contracts.
Fomo3D had a similar concept where players buy keys and each buy extends the game session by x seconds. The last buyers wins the jackpot.

I remember there was an ICO with a very similar idea and a pretty cool design.

I've forgotten its name now, but it basically had a jackpot system where if nobody bids higher than the previous amount within a certain deadline, the last bet would win the entire pot.

I'll search for it now and update this when I find it.

It is not a new idea, it is a classic penny auction type of games.

I saw several games based only on this idea, but some Tron DApps have this type of game as an additional game for Tokens burning with real wins, e. g. Fightron DApp.  ;)

I have seen other recet threads that do have the same concept asking on a lottery game that do guess out on what would be the prize pool amount until the timer ends.
This one is no different yet all players would target out or trying to get the last spot for them to win.As said by most people here this isnt new
nor an effective way or idea on getting players or attraction to this community.

Either I am having dejavu or this website was already launched on the ETH network a few months back and everybody said it unfair and not gambling since it wouldn't be based on luck but instead size of bankroll. I am too lazy to search but it was posted sometime in the last 6 months or so. From what I remember it had like 2 rounds before the thread was forgotten about, never really took off.

One of the main reasons was that it was unfair to the small gamblers and it would promote cheating since a large whale can just use a bot to send his BTC until he wins. And others said it wasn't a "lottery" or "gambling" since it wasn't based on luck or strategy like dice or poker but instead it was based on bankroll. If a whale has 1000 BTC and he is challenged against a few people with 0.01 BTC, obviously the whale would win.

What happens if no one wins in the end? Do you redistribute the money back to the owners?
This sounds a little bit like auctioning, only that the participants (aside the winner) loses everything.  I wonder how much goes to the lottery owner.

Noticed a user recently who conducted these games and ended up at a loss which is why this is a tough idea to execute profitably over the long term.

There will always be a winner since you technically need a single bet to decide the winner in these games which is why the money won't be redistributed to everyone after the game ends. The owner will probably receive a small percent of the winnings as commission.

I personally think the idea is crap. Whales are winning enough through trades, dumps and pumps. Why the hell would we invent a game for the whales to win against everyone else? It would literally be an easy income and all the other players will not have any chance against them.

What would be a more fair design is the more you bet, the more chances you have to win. Large players will win a few times, but there is always this risk of losing all you have. In other words:

- player 1 bets 0.01BTC
- player 2 bets 0.09BTC
- player 3 bets 0.40BTC
- player 4 bets 0.50BTC

=> player 1 has 1% chance to win, player 2 has a 9% chance, player 3 has 40% chance and player 4 has 50%.

Making it an assured win for those who bet the most is a bad idea.

There should be a winner on each round, it will be strange if the game has no winner at all and no one will be interested to join if there is a chance of no winner on each round. It is just like a lottery in general imho, the more a player bet then the higher chance of this player to win the whole pot. Not a new idea obviously and the only strategy is to bet as much as possible to get a higher chance than other players. I doubt this kind of game will get good interest from gamblers.

Only way I can eventually see it as a working business is to implement in a smart contract otherwise there would be a huge trust issue regarding the subject holding the funds until game end.

Gamblers with a high amount bankroll will enjoy such game. This migh be exciting to watch and players might get a high amount of money depending on the amount of bets accumulated. Well, I guess it is better to have atleast a number of players winning the pot foe example, the winner gets 50% of the pot, 2nd placer gets 30%, 3rd gets 15% and 4th gets 5% or any of such proportion to atleast give incentives to those who have joined.

It's strange to see that no winners will win for the said round and no gamblers want to see that occuring especially if they place higher bets so they should specify if they will return the existing bets or they will keep it. And same as you I doubt this idea will click since I think I see this kind of idea placed before but didn't work since people didn't find it worthy to play with.

To be honest I don't think that this kind of game would really get some gamblers,
There are so many flaws about it how could we know if we aren't being played by the creator?
What if we are against bot or something and this is one sided game since only the whales win this kind of game no small time gambler would ever want to be part of it.
So sooner or later your so called game would be boring since there would only be some gamblers to play against each other and they would also leave.

Oops! It's looking like auction. Who bid highest he will win eventually. I don't believe it will work like this. As you said, it's just a whales game. Is there any limitation of participants? If not then someone will bid higher at the end second of time. There is so many intelligent since there will be countdown timers. Who bided  first time then he would lost if doesn't bother to bid again. Not interesting to me at all but it would interested for whales. They need just an opportunity to enter.

Sorry but this will not work in the format you suggest as it'll all get down to "who has the biggest bankroll".
Basically if a player had unlimited bankroll he/she could win 100% of all games as he/she would overbid everyone else..

Another angle is to think poker where you can "force" ppl out of the game by being clear chip leader.

The game you are describing is very similar to an auction in which several people want to get an item, the difference here is that the prize itself is the money you are putting in the pot, so most likely the price will increase very slowly instead of the step fashion you present, as such the idea of a countdown of 24 hours seem too long especially if you want to generate excitement among the players, it is not a bad idea and I have seen at least one game similar to that but it will be difficult to make that game popular taking into account the fierce competition among casinos.

It really is the same as auction. I don't think many gamblers will win in this kind of game except whales of course which whales have lots of money to bid and to those doesn't have lots of money are more likely to lose and stop bidding and find other game which they have a chance to win.

This is not a game concept at all but, as some have already stated, the classic penny auction principle. Another drawback I see in your concept is that there is no incentive for the first player to place his bid (bet).

Player 1 must risk his 0.001BTC (which he will surely lose) for a potential pot of ... 0.001BTC??? Why would anyone do that?

Thanks for all the comments. I agree that this game have some problems. The principal one is that a big whale may be able to always win. I am thinking of a way to avoid this. One option is that players may join together their bets in order to bit a bigger whale. Then it can become an exciting strategy game.

I think I am going to make a simple website with 'play money', so everybody can test the idea, suggest variations and perhaps we end up with a game that works. Will see...

And what if whales make a group? You will not be able to win against them.
I think that this game will be without gambling excitement! You place a bet and you wait 24h to see what will happen, in the meantime others will place their bets, higher than yours and if you don't have enough money to place new bet you will just lose the first bet, where is an excitement in that?
Your concept should start from 1 sat. Who would risk 0.1 btc or higher at some auction? You can have great gambling night with that amount, playing slots and all other games you wish, and with nice bets!

To me, this looks like some kind of reverse Ponzi scheme. The last guy takes everything. As someone asked before, why would anyone be first in the chain?

I think It's a good idea to test it first before going public. This should help you determine what will be successful and what will not.
Hope you could comment on fees or how the you/owner intend to earn from the game. And also reply my question on "what happens if no one wins"

Well, for just testing with play money, there will be no fees. In case it is launched with bitcoin, then I am thinking of an small 1% or 2% fee just like in any other gambling site.
In this game, the case that nobody wins ist not possible, because the game starts when one player places a bet, and if there are no more beds, that player just recovers his bet.

So basically this is a game that would only be played by rich people.
Do you think this would really attract anyone?
The idea is so lame who would even waste their money when they know that there are some big whales that could join and take away all of the bets instantly.