Bitcoin Forum

Probably nothing that can be done about it but the Telegram Electrum chat is owned by a scammer who just asked for me to fill out a file to give him my seed phrase. Just a heads up.

AFAIK, there is no official telegram group, how did you come across it? Also, I suggest you share the link so we can report it.

I suppose he needed support, so he decided to look for it on the Telegram. A simple search using Google with keywords electrum+telegram gives the following result :


Currently, I see that the group has 190 members, but I don't use Telegram so all I find is this abuse e-mail address :


https://i.imgur.com/J4M1pG3.jpg

What makes you think the owner of the channel is a scammer?  I didn't read the whole history of the channel, but I found a message pinned to the top, that directs people to the official website and twitter account.

https://i.ibb.co/jz2sy6j/Capture-1.jpg (https://i.ibb.co/jz2sy6j/Capture-1.jpg)


Here's the channel owner's profile:

https://i.ibb.co/ScGzmP3/Capture-2.jpg (https://i.ibb.co/ScGzmP3/Capture-2.jpg)


I did a google search for the owner's Telegram username, specifying to search this forum, and the results mostly pointed to user btcven, (u=70647) (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=70647).  Note btcven's signature also references an IRC chat username that's identical to the Telegram username, and has a vanity address that includes the same username.


https://i.ibb.co/ZKtY9Kb/Capture-3.jpg

Maybe because of this bold part? If the truth is what the OP claims (and it would be good to put evidence), asking for seed is sufficient proof that it is a scam. Although I leave the possibility that this is a misinterpreted message from OP side. Also account that you linked is not active from 08 July 2019.

I think he's not talking about a telegram group he might be talking about this user below from telegram.


Username: @Electrum

https://i.imgur.com/faKNkHx.png
It has a weird avatar.

I just found him when searching on the telegram web.

https://i.imgur.com/Qli8ESO.png
https://i.imgur.com/opkm5R0.png
https://i.imgur.com/2fm6wet.png
https://i.imgur.com/Sxctf5V.png
https://i.imgur.com/LZ3P8tQ.png

Just figuring out how to post the images properly sorry, but yes it is the group with 190 odd members and I just quickly jumped on there after I almost lost money from the 4.0 malware.

Thank you for the help I have emailed Telegram.

That user "Randy Brito" is definitely trying to scam you. You should never enter your seed phrase anywhere, and Electrum does not have an official support email like he suggests in that last screenshot.

I suspect he links to the real Electrum website and twitter for one or both of two reasons. Firstly, to give himself an air of legitimacy and fool people in to thinking he is not a scammer. Secondly, he is probably unrelated to the fake version 4.0.0 scammers, and doesn't want people to use fake wallets because then be won't be able to scam them himself.

If you have questions about the 4.0.0 malware, better to ask them on here in the open.

As you can see from the OP reply, it's not about the user you are referencing, it's about a group pretending to be an official Telegram support for Electrum. Anyone trying to convince others that they need to type their seed online is a scammer, and I'm just wondering how many of those 190 members are real, and how many bots that play false satisfied users.

Yes definitely a scam, thanks for the support.
I have reported the google doc he sent me and sent screen shots to Telegram as well.

If the claim of ChrisVandermeer is true, then btcven (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=70647) should be tagged as scammer even though he hasn't logged in for almost a year. But I'm not sure if it's the telegram user who scammed is @rdymac.

Are you sure you are talking to the right person who has an admin or owner tag next to his name? I don't know what kind of channel that is but a well-known scam is when someone pretends to be the admin of a Telegram group. In that case he will use the same photo and duplicate  the profile of an admin.

I am asking because in this screenshot, @rdymac is not the username of that user, it's his bio/personal info. You can write anything you want in that field. Scammers can't duplicate and use the same username so they will try different techniques to make it look legit. From the screenshot it looks like the user you spoke with doesn't have a username at all and instead he has put the username (@rdymac) of the channel admin in his bio. Someone correct me if I am wrong?!

https://talkimg.com/images/2023/11/12/zX3gm.png

If you look at this picture, this should be the real Randy.

A quick way for you to check if you spoke with the real admin is to find a post of him in that telegram group, click on his profile and click on 'SEND MESSAGE' like the picture below shows.
Does it open an empty PM history or does it show the previous PMs you already exchanged? If it opens the existing PM history - the real admin of that channel is trying to scam you. If you open a blank PM history, they are two different users.

https://i.ibb.co/ScGzmP3/Capture-2.jpg

*Sorry for the huge image size

You are not wrong.  The image posted by the OP is does make it look like he was chatting with an impostor.



Another way of verifying the user is by forwarding a message to @userinfobot.  Pick any message sent to you by the user in question, right-click on the message, then click on "Forward Message."  A pop-up window titled "Choose recipient" will be displayed, enter @userinfobot into the search field, select the bot, then click send.  The userinfobot will return a message with the user's ID, which is unique and tied to the user's phone number that was used at registration.  The only way an ID can be changed is by registering with a different phone number.

Here's what I get for the admin of that channel:

There are many ways to do it, yeah. One thing you can also do is to check if the user and yourself have any groups in common.
So if you join a group and the admin of the group contacts you, it is logical that you and the admin will have at least that group in common. You are part of it and he is the admin of it. Since scammers impersonate admins they don't join those groups because they would be discovered and banned.

Click on the profile of the user. Notice the field that says "3 groups in common". If you and the person you are talking to have no groups in common, it's an imposer/scammer.

Here is a random picture that shows what I am talking about.

https://i.redd.it/h26f888i58a31.png

It seems both of them are fake no real Randy Brito to any of these accounts.

Randy Brito is one of the contributors according to Electrum Github from here https://github.com/spesmilo/electrum/graphs/contributors
as rdymac.

I can't find telegram account from his GitHub account even on his linked in profile https://www.linkedin.com/in/randybrito

Except for this "@btcven" on GitHub account but when I search this account from telegram and it exists and shows this below.
https://i.imgur.com/hE8K1dF.png
As you can see they are talking about Electrum 4.0.0

So this "@btcven" might be the real account of Randy Brito and the admin of the Electrum group and other accounts from Electrum are fake and only use to attract users to join on that group.

However, I'm still not satisfied if this is own by real Randy Brito unless he actually added it to his GitHub account or LinkedIn and verify that he owns those telegram group.

Yes I get:

Id: 1064611890
First: Randy Brito

From the scammer. And a blank chat box when I message the actual owner.

In that case you were talking to an imposer the whole time. Don't trust anything he says.
Now, this does not mean that the actual owner of that Telegram group is to be trusted. We don't know. What we know now is that the person you were talking to is not who he says he is. We also know that Electrum doesn't have an official Telegram account. They have a link to their Facebook page on their official site and that is it when it comes to social media.

The bottom line is that Electrum does not have any official support pages, services, email addresses, Telegram, etc. If you have questions or problems with using it, then your best bet is to ask them publicly on this forum, and not via private message with someone you don't know, regardless of the medium they are using or how "official" their name sounds. See here for more information: https://electrum.org/#community

Telegram in particular is a terrible program. It is a complete scam fest, and your chats aren't even end-to-end encrypted, meaning Telegram can read anything you type and share that information with anybody they want. I have no idea why anybody continues to use it.

Anyone who ask your seed phrase is scammer, long discussion/investigation isn't necessary.


Good point, Telegram advertised as privacy-oriented messenger, but end-to-end encryption not enabled by default.

I doubt anyone (who actually cares about privacy) bother to choose to enable end-to-end encryption manually since there's better option such as Signal.

Not only that, they only even offer end-to-end encryption for 1-on-1 chats (but as you say, disabled by default). All group chats are not, and cannot be, end-to-end encrypted, meaning anyone with access to Telegram's servers can read all your communications, and Telegram can hand over or sell those communications to anybody they like, if they wanted to.

Signal is great. I've been using it for years. It initially took a fair amount of convincing of friends and family to make the switch from WhatsApp, but with more and more stories hitting the headlines about the widespread privacy invasion of various companies, (not least of all Facebook who own and operate WhatsApp), that convincing has become significantly easier over time. It's the only messaging software I use.

Another bad thing with Telegram is that it allows one party to delete all private conversations with other users.
For example if we talked over PM on Telegram, I can delete all traces that we ever talked. You wouldn't be able to see any history of our PMs and have no proof if you needed it.
You would have to make screenshots to use that as proof. It creates many opportunities for scammers to do whatever they want and simply delete the PM history once they are done.       

Wait, what? I can delete other people's messages? That policy is so ridiculous I didn't believe it - but having done a quick search it seems you are right.

I have no problems with people deleting their own messages for all participants in a conversation. Most messaging apps have this functionality, and the good apps such as Signal also allow the option of messages auto-deleting after x amount of time, or pictures or attached media only being able to viewed once. If you want to delete messages or media you have received from your own device, that's fine, but there is absolutely no way you should be able to delete messages I have written from my device. That is ridiculous.

That's not a privacy feature - that's censorship. Anyone you are speaking to can just delete your messages at any time for any reason. As you say, this is a haven for scammers.

Yes, the messages you exchange with someone can be deleted by either of the two parties, like they never happened. It's complete madness and makes no sense. Imagine if I could delete the PMs I sent to you on this forum if I change my mind or if...   

Telegram is unreliable and insecure when dealing with someone privately. It's only to be used as a group messaging app but certainly not if you intend to do business with someone.
I don't know if you can edit PMs as well. ??? I wouldn't be surprised if they allow this as well. You can edit your posts you write in groups.

FIFY.  Yeah, I find that feature sort of odd, almost like they are enabling scammers and thieves, and it's working.  Telegram is full of scammers, but like anything else which grants a level of freedom to it's users, some will abuse that liberty.

I don't blame the platform.  It's a tool, and like any other tool it requires some skill to use it properly.  Assume anyone who contacts you out of the blue to not be who they claim they are.  Verify every contact you make.  As has been shown here there are plenty of ways to verify the user, be skeptical and diligent.

I am trying to think of one benefit of having an option to completely wipe clean shared information for both parties, and I can't think of one. There are no issues with deleting the records for yourself, but being able to do it for the other person as well... I see no positive contribution with that and only negatives and a potential for abuse.   

It depends on your viewpoint. What if you sent something to someone by mistake... this "feature" allows you to correct that mistake.

Additionally, it does allow for more certainty that anything deleted stays deleted (assuming you do it quick enough and the other party hasn't taken screenshots etc). As DireWolfM14 said, it's a tool... and like any tool it can be abused.

As long as you understand how the system works, you can protect yourself from the abuse. Sadly, the "scam accusations" board is littered with instances of people who don't understand how the system works :-\

It might be a secure messaging system... but it's certainly not a "secure" system for trading!

Electrum on Telegram is a scam.  The admin ask you for your seed.  I posted a message to warn the members and got blocked
Signal is great.  At the beginning friends/colleagues didn't understand why not WhatsApp, now many have made the shift and get it.
#deleteWhatsApp #deleteFacebook #deleteGoogle

Valid point but I still would never give my OK for that. Same can be said for Bitcoin transactions. If you sent a transaction to the wrong address by mistake, should you have an option to correct your mistake or should it stay immutable. It's not the same thing, I know, but I'd still vote for not being able to revert changes.

That's fine. If I have written something, I should be allowed to delete that from being viewed by all parties. No issues there.

If I have written something, and you decide you don't want to see it, then you should be allowed to delete it from your device. Again, no issues there.

However, if I have written something, you don't get to prevent that from being viewed by all parties, and you definitely don't get to delete it from my device. That's censorship, and I have no idea why anyone would use an app which lets third parties delete your data from your device without your consent.