Bitcoin Forum

Crypto kanoon made this tweet today
https://twitter.com/cryptokanoon/status/1355202893901561860?s=20 according to this, Government of India is planning to out blanket ban on all crypto currencies.
Do you think this will happen? What should we do in such circumstances? Should we sell all out crypto?

I was just going to make a post on this topic until I saw your post. But what you are assuming is completely wrong.
They have mentioned to prohibit the use of private cryptocurrencies with a exception of few to promote the underlying technology, which means they will allow certain cryptocurrencies to be regulated.
This doesn't necessarily mean that they will be banning bitcoin.

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  https://talkimg.com/images/2023/05/16/blob060cb510fc149bf7.png
 (https://imgur.com/uC1vHxb.png)

source : http://164.100.47.193/bull2/2021/29012021.pdf

Points to note here are :

Reserve Bank of India is planning to launch their own cryptocurrency.
They are also planning to regulate few cryptocurrencies.
They are going to prohibit the use of most PRIVATE cryptocurrencies (doesn't necessarily mean they will ban bitcoin)

This doesn't mean they will ban most cryptocurrencies, may be they are just banning their use as a legal tender and allow trading of cryptocurrencies.

The next few days are going to be really interesting for the crypto community in India.

P.S : I don't guarantee if the source is true. Even I saw it on reddit a few minutes ago.
There's a spelling mistake in the word cryptocurrency in the last sentence which creates a doubt in my mind if the source is actually true.

Well, this was unexpected. The information I got from my source was different. It's bad to see that government is still skeptical about cryptocurrencies. I am not very positive about the word 'private'. I don't think government is being technical here and referring to privacy coins. The term 'private' here, more or less referring to the general meaning i.e. the ownership other than that of government.

I am also not very positive about the term 'exceptions'. I don't think it is being used to exclude some of the current coins like bitcoin from the ban. Rather, it would allow certain class of people to create cryptocurrencies. I think this is a kind of corporate favouritism. Since most of the big companies in India have already invested alot in blockchain technology, government will allow them to host their own coins. (Government being controlled by the corporate, this isn't something new we are witnessing, right?).

Anyhow, the details of bill still isn't available in public domain. Let see what it contains when it will be presented in Parliament. :(

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The image is not from the official bill. It's rather a list containing all 20 bills to be presented in upcoming Budget Session. Such mistake can happen, nothing special.

These were my thoughts too. Even after the RBI's previous bans were overturned, there's again gonna be some kind of banning of crypto. And you bet that the government will start promoting their own/cryptos that are made for certain private companies like crazy. I'm hoping for this to not pass during the Budget Session on 1st Feb, but what the hell, it probably will and that's just sad, even after more people embracing crypto, its still being held in a negative light by the government.

I sure hope trading and exchanges like Binance can still operate in India, atleast let trading be legal. Otherwise this stifles the tech in India in people are just missing out. Here's what I want to know though: Even after the ban, can people still trade on platforms that do not require KYC? Can people keep the BTC that they have currently and use it for BTC transactions, without exchanging for fiat in India?

Due to the anonymous nature of BTC, I think yes people can still hold and trade it on dex or exchanges that do not require kyc buy it is going to be risky affair. I don't advice to do anything against law.

do not yet come to any conclusion, Government has been playing with the mind of the Indian cryptocurrency community since 2018. They have signaled that they will ban it many times but the biggest question arises How?

There are more people on the internet in India than anywhere in the world, Is it practically possible to ban cryptocurrency which is also known as Internet currency. I do not think so!

When Pakistan is trying to regulate and China is also how can you think this Indian government will ban crypto?

I posted about the ban last week but webtricks (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=921974) mentioned that it's not gonna happen and government will come up with some clear regulations for crypto currency and though personally I even believed that because a large population of india uses it. But today I read this article
https://www.livemint.com/market/cryptocurrency/government-lists-bill-to-ban-bitcoin-in-india-create-official-digital-currency/amp-11611943365545.html (https://www.livemint.com/market/cryptocurrency/government-lists-bill-to-ban-bitcoin-in-india-create-official-digital-currency/amp-11611943365545.html)
and then I saw this thread.
Budget will be presented on Feb1. I still feel strongly that they won't ban BTC but it's Indian government you really can't expect anything. We can just hope that they don't ban it. 🤞🤞

That's exactly what I think. I have a strong gutt feeling which tells me bitcoin won't be getting a ban.
I feel this situation is like "Kabhi Kabhi jo dikhaai deta hai voh sach nahi hota" kind of thing. I may be wrong though.
I will still keep my hopes that crypto won't be banned but regulated in a restricted way. May be they allow trading it as an asset and tax it heavily or something.
Just a few days and we will get to know what the actual truth is. But until then, we will come across many theories about how bitcoin will be banned in India  ;D

China has tried banning crypto MULTIPLE times in the past though. A lot of dips in Bitcoin in the past have been due to the FUD caused by news of crypto ban by China. Still, there exists a banking ban on crypto in China, according to Wikipedia. (Source: Legality of BTC by country (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_bitcoin_by_country_or_territory))


You should also take a look at Nepal, where there has been an absolute ban on BTC from 2017. There's a pretty decent chance that India follows in those footsteps for the foreseeable future.

I think the upcoming bill i.e. The Cryptocurrency and Regulation of Official Digital Currency Bill, 2021 is the updated version of the bill - Banning of Cryptocurrency & Regulation of Official Digital Currency Bill, 2019 proposed in 2019 by the Committee formed by Finance Ministry. If we go by the old bill then it proposed the ban on holding and selling cryptocurrencies too under Section 8(1). If the new bill has same rules then using platform like Binance and non-KYC exchanges would also be deemed as offence.

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Right! This is where I think government is doing mistake. If they think that by just passing a law, they will be able to stop illicit activities which use cryptocurrencies in anonymous nature then they are wrong. Even after passing such law, those activities will continue. Only white-money transactions i.e. sale/purchase on legal and regulated exchanges will stop. This in turn only going to hurt government as it will make dent in government's revenue from taxes. Really foolish from government if they go on with the bill.

By the way,  you can't say China has regulated cryptocurrencies in positive sense. Crypto companies can't use banking services in China so the current Chinese situation is equivalent to what India had between June 8th 2018 and March 4th 2020.

Okay, so Arun Jaitley formed a committee to evaluate the position of cryptocurrencies in India. The committee submitted its results in the form of the bill named as 'Banning of Cryptocurrencies and Regulation of Official Digital Currency, 2019' in 2019. That bill rooted for the blanket ban on cryptocurrency with 10-year jail and Rs. 2 crores fine on using, sending, selling, buying and mining cryptocurrency. However, the government didn't present that bill in houses (I think due to strong opposition from corporate).

Hence, the government modified the bill and finally listed it as the agenda for the upcoming Budget session and named the bill, "Cryptocurrency and Regulation of Official Digital Currency, 2021". They removed the word Banning.
But the three-line explanation of bill includes following basic points:

1. Banning of all private cryptocurrencies
2. Exception for few cryptocurrencies
3. Regulation for CBDC.

Now we are still not sure about the word private and exception. It may or may not mean the banning of bitcoin, etc.

We just know this much. So I am pretty sure Nirmala Behen Ji will mention the bill and give more explanation about the bill in the upcoming budget speech on 1st Feb. Till then lets peace out and don't panic.
                         
       
                                                        source - webtricks (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=921974), Google

It is obvious that by private currency they mean any crypto currency besides government issued digital currency. BTC also falls under this category but exception may be given to cryptos like ETH because their sole purpose is not to transfet value.
Ethereum blockchain is widely used by many fintech companies.

Some positive hopes are circulating in the Indian crypto communtiy as the big heads are taking their stands on regulation instead of banning cryptocurrencies.
Just look out how Zebpay is trying to spread positive awareness about the current situation instead of other media spreading FUD.


  https://talkimg.com/images/2023/05/16/blob36d99309f0eec2da.png
 (https://imgur.com/eYRqfYB.png)

Twitter thread : https://twitter.com/zebpay/status/1355519515941982216

Also read an article on moneycontrol on how entrepreneurs are motivated towards the usage of blockchain as a technology and how they don't want cryptocurrencies to be banned as a whole but regulated under the Government of India.

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/business/regulate-instead-of-banning-cryptocurrencies-in-india-say-entrepreneurs-6420801.html

This just makes my intuition stronger towards the Government not banning cryptocurrencies in the long term.
Interesting debates might occur in the budget session which is why we all must keep an eye on it.

Haha, I guess I wrote those words in one of the group yesterday. And thanks for not including what I wrote in bracket after 'Nirmala Behen Ji' else I would have been in big trouble.  :D

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I really hope that government is just planning to ban the usage of cryptocurrencies as legal tender (medium of exchange, mean of foreign remittance, etc). And this is also justified because government is unable to collect 5% TCS which it levies on foreign fund transfers. Trading in heavily regulated environment should be allowed. Let's see.  :-\

However, I don't agree much with Zebpay here. Don't expect too technical definition of 'private cryptocurrencies'. I won't be amazed if Section 2 of the bill simply defines 'private cryptocurrencies' as 'the cryptocurrencies issued other than those issued by government'.

It can very much happen! Especially with the current regressive government, it definitely can! That's why I have been saying - if the government doesn't show any interest on cryptos, we will be safe! The moment government starts looking into it, it will be a blanket ban only! That's what happens when uneducated persons and criminals make policy decision!

However, CryptoKanoon also tweeted this,

https://twitter.com/cryptokanoon/status/1355895598860255240

And that's true! It's difficult to enforce such law!

People may keep holding their coins secretly but once it is banned, all exchanges will be shut down and we will not be able to cash out our coins.
Also account associated with bitcoin trading in the past will come understand surveillance.

Right. This will instill fear in everyone mind. Only real criminals would want to hold Bitcoin once ban is introduced. This is not the right decision by government buy then this regime is known to make laws which are against common man.

And why do you think that ?
If the Government introduces a bill/law or any rule, it doesn't mean it is always right. There are times when the Government may implement a new law but eventually has to change it.
And even if the Government takes the decision of banning cryptocurrencies, I will still be holding on to my cryptocurrencies. It does not mean I am a "Criminal".
It only means I believe in the technology. I might not use it though, but I will definitely hold it until the Government changes its opinion about cryptocurrencies (at some point of time it has to)
It's just a matter of perspective.

Technically you will be criminal by breaking a law. That's what point here is. Government is making all crypto lovers criminal by passing a law that will only harm the country and take it backwards.

Well said. We do not want to break laws though we do love btc and crypto and we do believe they can improve economy of country but if it is declared illegal by our government, we will follow the law.

Meetings were held, current law is insufficient. Bill is in process,it will go in Cabinet tor approval.
Crypto Bill coming soon.
             
https://twitter.com/cryptokanoon/status/1359008918018478083?s=19 (https://twitter.com/cryptokanoon/status/1359008918018478083?s=19)

Now that ban seems inevitable, the big question is will government allow holders to sell off their holdings or will not. What if they don't allow it?
We all will suffer big loss.

I believe its just the govt's way of promoting their own crypto, which will be a centralized one, with none of the actual benefits that are offered by the usual crypto like bitcoin. And if India's track record is to be of any indication about digital currency/databases/apps, they have been prone to many data and security leaks, on top of being closed source. The proof of why bitcoin works is out there and if its somehow "hacked", say like a double spend, the whole community will know about it, whereas in this case, if there is some kind of a hack that does get discovered, it will likely be exploited long before the community has any time to respond.

Crypto Exchanges in India (https://thecoingraph.com/news/the-largest-crypto-exchange-in-india-begins-a-user-friendly-program-50m-new-eyes/) are moving fast as they will give fight to the Regulation.

Good move. If we get more crypto users, we can out more pressure on Government to reconsider their proposed ban bill.
We all must also keep posting about cryptos on our social media accounts. This will attract more people to crypto.
Currently we have 8 million crypto users, we have to get 100 million.

They certainly can't ban but it can affect/scare away the user base of crypto in India, in just last week or so usdt price came down because of this ban news.

What are you saying? Why can't they ban it? They can ban it but it will not be easy to implement the ban.
BTC is untraceable, you can hold it in your mobile wallet and nobody will know it.
Just stop usind centralised exchanges to buy and sell and you will be good.

We really don't have an idea about what is going to happen next. But the move by the gov is not positive. They might put a ban but I don't think that ban will last long enough. When the whole world is going with it, going against it will certainly is not a good idea.  As per media report even holding will not be allowed, that is really crazy.


Any decentralized exchange operating in India?

You can use localbitvoin and paxful. They are p2p exchanges

Decentralized exchange even if available can not do crypto to fiat conversion. For that you will either need p2p ot centralised exchange.

I didn't wanted to created another topic and so posting it in this relevant thread.

So the RBI governor Shaktikanta Das has confirmed that they are working towards launching their own Digital Currency.
The CBDC is receiving full attention from the RBI as cryptocurrencies are gaining popularity these days.
They are exploring the options whether a digital version of the fiat currency is necessary or not.

More info at : Explained: India inches closer to launching a digital currency; 5 key points (https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/business/explained-india-inches-closer-to-launching-a-digital-currency-5-key-points-6568201.html)

Indian payment systems are already digital enough. A CBDC would probably just serve the central banks better for settlement transactions with banks that they do on a daily basis. It may reduce the workload with DLT servers between the banks themselves.
Besides that, I don't think these will be anything like blockchains or cryptocurrencies. It is as good as replacing the database for central banks. Interestingly though, if the banks launch such currencies; it will become very easy for them to keep track of business transactions done by individuals and professionals. This also means more tax revenue. I think it will be fair if the public too gets to scrutinize the expenses from public authorities in return. Let us do away with CAG and all the other numerous audit agencies. Lets put everything on RBI's CBDC and let everyone watch the transactions.

If this is not the ultimate goal then using CBDC is only going to be an eyewash to dissuade the general public from bitcoin and crypto in general.

Yes cbdc will bring transparency and will prevent lots of financial crimes and discrepancies in private and government sectors.
But fiat is not going to be in use soon. Unless there is some law that if your income is above a certain limit, you must keep your savings in cbdc.

You are probably right that the CBDC might benefit us if everything is transparent but the major concern here is whether they will make it on a private blockchain or a public blockchain.
I guess it will only benefit us when they create it on a public blockchain so that everything is transparent and verifiable by everyone.
But yes of course that depends on it's utility whether they are planning to develop it for banking purposes only or as a mainstream payment mechanism carried out by ever entity in India.

According to an article I read today Shaktikanta Das mentioned in an interview that their major concerns revolve around financial stability.
This means that the CBDC will most probably be a stable coin. He also mentioned that once CBDC is launched they might tie up with banks of China where they have electronic Yuan.
Well, I am not sure how good this idea would be but it shows how determined RBI is to launch their own CBDC.

My only concern is "Jo karna hai karo lekin Ban mat karo".  ;D

7 days remain for this parliament session to resume. Their is still confusion if crypto bill will be placed on table during current session or will it be postponed till mansion session.
I hope they don't present bill during current session.

I don't mean it will benefit us as general public. It will benefit the government enabling them to collect more taxes. As citizens, if they impose CBDC on us and track every single transaction, it is but natural justice for citizens to be able to trace every penny spent. If a CBDC comes into usage, this will be a fight akin to the Right to Information.

If my Tax Commissioner and District Magistrate wants to know what I earn and how I spend, I want to know how he spends my taxes too.

Of course it'll be a stablecoin, pegged to INR. By stability he wants to imply that crypto can cause financial instability. Crypto usage means that more people can have access to funds and revenue from alternate sources without ever touching the banks. This disturbs their precious cycle of keeping the masses bound with EMIs and Wage-cycles. The fear is irrational though, considering that most Indians usng crypto do so through KYC etc. Most others are really just seeing them as dev job opportunities. In their fear and ignorance, they are doing more harm than good.

Amen Bro..

Parliament session is over without the bill. That means either government will make changes in the bill as demanded by crypto community or it will postpone it for few years and maintain the status quo.

Not sure about that and there is no clarity on what they are planning to do, one thing i know is that the government has asked companies to report their cryptocurrency holdings when they file the financial statement next month which means all the exchanges in India will hand over the customer data to the government. Will see what happens next after collecting all these data, will they start freezing bank accounts or monitor our transactions is to be seen.

I don't think you are correct here. Government has asked companies to report their crypto holdings when filing financial statement - this does not mean exchanges in India have to hand over their customer data to the government. Not sure how did you arrive at this inference. In a way this is good because it means that government is moving towards regulation (which is good) instead of outright crypto ban. We just have to see if government also asks individuals to declare their crypto holdings while filing IT Returns.

I think in the last 1.5 months this issue was blown up by media with news reports everyday citing their 'sources'. One news report even said that government would track and block IP addresses which buy/sell cryptos. Now this is going over the cliff without any basis.

I feel since the government didn't bring in the crypto bill in Budget session, they are re-looking into it and maybe making some changes.

Let me explain that to you, you agree that the government asked companies to report their crypto holdings when filing financial statement right, what happens with the exchanges they need to disclose their personal company holdings majority customer funds stored in the exchange and what do you think will happen, they will be providing those customer information as well and it is not a big deal for a government to ask for all the customer data from these exchanges and if they are planning to ban they can target these users.