Bitcoin Forum

For those of you who listen/watch the Lex Fridman Podcast, he just uploaded an episode where he interviews Charles Hoskinson, the founder of Cardano (ADA).

If you fast-forward the podcast to 1:38:50 Charles begins to discuss his issues with Bitcoin and what he finds to be the "problems" with Bitcoin. Initially, this really excited me because I love a good argument against Bitcoin from one of the cryptospace's most popular. While I was hoping for a unique, fresh take on Bitcoin's issues, I ended up getting the same progressive response aimed at Bitcoin's lack of "improvement". This turned out to be the same regurgitation of words mixed with some clever verbiage, which I found boring put quite frankly.

He sites that the community has become a religion to the maximalists, resistant to change in any meaningful way. He talks about how Taproot should have happened a long time ago and is shocked at how long it takes this community to produce upgrades for a system that is already so far behind. He argues that a currency with a single-use-case scenario (Bitcoin) will eventually be left in the dust to more ambitious projects that aim to solve more problems. Brushing off the fact that Bitcoin is the strongest reserve currency in crypto or the world.

I expected a little more respect for Bitcoin from Hoskinson. I really thought someone of his mental stature would see that Bitcoins single purpose is its only needed purpose. Being a store of value is far more than enough. While the institution of Smart Contract Platforms will inevitably grow and explode in the years to come, you are simply not able to rule out Bitcoin in any way, shape, or form.

Go visit his Podcast's page and listen for yourself because there is much more that he talks about that you all may find quite interesting. Let me know what you guys think.

I don't see anything wrong with his opinions. They show his preferences and they are not based in ignorance. Personally, I'm not bothered by the educated opinions of others. I feel no need to defend Bitcoin, except to dispel the myths and misconceptions.

Bitcoin may become the most important invention in the 21st century, or it may fade into obscurity or be reduced to nostalgia. People that pin their hopes and dreams on Bitcoin are missing the point.

I think it would be fair to say that there are cryptocurrencies that carry out different functions. For instance, if you want to make a fast profit on short-term trading - the shitcoins can be the best options, and for a store of value there are other options, and yes, they can be better than Bitcoin. But let's not forget that is supposed to be a network, a currency, but not an asset and means of becoming rich. This just comes out as an additional function, a bonus in some cases. And criticizing Bitcoin for not being what it is supposed to be is kind of weird.
And what advancements is he talking about anyway, when Cardano runs on a PoS consensus algorithm, which can pose some big potential problems in the future.

There is no argument there, Taproot is already here and upgraded already. Whether it's late or not, the word and the Bitcoin community constantly grow. If the Taproot nor the ability for BTC to have smart contract functionality had been decided earlier, Charles might not be able to come up with Cardano. I think the update was still in the right moment now that there is the need for a bit of privacy.

Very well said.
 
Everyone has a right to hold their opinions and just like Elon, Warren Buffet, Jack Dorsey, you and me etc we all have our opinions on the subject of bitcoin, though not all are correct but the greatest revealer is time, and time will surely tell whose opinion was correct.

Quite disingenuous for him for him to say that Bitcoin lacks improvement and that improvements should be applied sooner(which going the slow route totally justified, because you know, $700b marketcap, hence we really can't afford to screw this up); knowing that Cardano itself is known for taking the slow heavy-researched route in terms of development to make sure that the updates have no bugs and such.

I mean, it's his opinion though. Most of us are probably thinking that the development of Bitcoin is quite in a good phase considering that developers have to absolutely check to see if everything works. It's not like we need to rush things. I can understand why he's trying to downplay Bitcoin because he wants to make his creation seems something more valuable Bitcoin.

Bitcoin needs to increase its demand for improvement as hoskinson explained, it would enable any user or platform to present valuable information within the system and remove it. The rest can be decided by the consumer focus on the ability to move information values ​​and identities within the chain and then let your kind of market decide where things are going. Decide cardano is more efficient than the more powerful bitcoin blockchains will compete to reduce costs for platforms.

Exactly, his ADA has taken a slow step on improving it's performance, so it doesn't make sense for Charles to say that bitcoin lacks improvement because as a dev, he should know that it is not easy to make iterations especially as bitcoin is a prime mover in space.

Bitcoin can still be sound money for majority, store of value, an assets. And yet with that argument that there is no development, from average joe to whales to huge management asset funds, bitcoin is still the king. Maybe he just wanted to shift investors to his ADA in a subtle way.

In Technical Performance Cardano is superior to bitcoin in multiple aspects.

What else is their to say, except for the bitcoiner cultist to cry no it isn't.

Cardano & Algorand are 3rd generation blockchain technology, they blow the doors off bitcoin 1st generation blockchain.

Algorand have transaction finality in only ~5 seconds,
bitcoin never achieves transaction finality since checkpoint use has been banned.

Bitcoin Devs are so afraid of change they won't even boost bitcoin to match the transaction performance of Doge.
But they push 3rd party solutions that they are selling to bankers, so you can pay the middle man to use LN.

Maybe the bitcoiner cultists should look for a new batch of btc priests/devs to actually improve the old outdated btc code.

 

FYI:
A Store of Value does not lose $20K in a month's time.
Bitcoin is not a store of value, and anyone that confuses it for such will suffer dramatically.

This is the classic shitcoin advertisers technique, they use a lot of technobabble to advertise their own shitcoin while spreading misinformation about bitcoin. Anyone who is familiar with Bitcoin protocol, altcoins, cryptography or even programming usually sees through their nonsense very quickly.
For example take the following part you quoted:
Bitcoin is not some plaything that we can just change without enough testing and reviews. We are talking about trillions of dollars here for millions of people worldwide. Imagine if we rushed an upgrade and accidentally introduced a vulnerability that could have been caught with enough time and review!

It is not just vulnerabilities, it is efficiency too. For example take BIP340 (part of Taproot soft fork). There was a wrong benchmark that was giving false results, it was caught and the algorithm to encode signatures and pubkeys in Schnorr signatures changed slightly. If we had rushed it we would have missed this and this inefficiency would have existed in bitcoin forever!

Yeah, we will see in the coming years and decades whether or not Bitcoin will remain relevant amidst the development race within cryptocurrency. Bitcoin surely is facing certain criticisms in line with its huge energy consumption-- not just the fact that a significant portion of which is taken from non-renewable sources-- scalability, high fees, volatility, and so on.

Anyway, it is one thing to listen to the honest take of a Charles Hoskinson and quite another to the uninformed comments of an Elon Musk or a Warren Buffet.

But it certainly does not help that certain personalities are treating Bitcoin as a sort of an infallible religion. While they are diehard fans of Bitcoin and are promoting Bitcoin wholeheartedly, their toxicity seems to be creating more harm than good.

I think this is not the first time that Hoskinson speaks about BTC's issues. So I'm not surprised here, maybe the timing though, I mean BTC is on a downhill battle since last month while his ADA has enjoyed some bull cycle. And it's good that we hear his side again, I will say he is one of those respected personalities in crypto space, but it doesn't mean that he will always be right. This is just one opinion and I don't think it will have a drastic impact on the market.

You have to sell some to profit, bitcoiners cultist will hodl to zero$.  :)

Enjoy the ride, paper gains are worthless.  :D

FYI:
Remember when your Bitcoin was worth $63K and you didn't sell any.
Remember when your Bitcoin was worth $40K and you didn't sell any.
Remember when your Bitcoin was worth $20K and you didn't sell any.
Remember when your Bitcoin was worth $10K and you didn't sell any.
Remember when your Bitcoin was worth $5K and you didn't sell any.
Remember when your Bitcoin was worth less than $3K and you didn't sell any because you did not want a loss.
Remember when your Bitcoin was worth $0 and bitcoin died in a death spiral and you wondered why you never sold any.   :D :D ;)

Charles can talk about his opinion, everyone else can too.

Everyone can see and say Bitcoin is not perfect and need to be improved more and faster. Everyone can say they find better cryptocurrency than Bitcoin and choose it for their digital transactions or investment.

The matter is, their thought does not mean it is right and Bitcoin is bad or worse than others. Bitcoin has biggest network (see its hashrate) and if anyone says Bitcoin has low block (10 minutes), I agree. It does not mean Bitcoin is worse than other cryptocurrency as a transaction method.

If you want safety, safety first, Bitcoin is the best.
Else if you want only speed, faster than 10 minutes or you need your transactions get confirmed in a few seconds, choose altcoins but they are not safe.

It is not correct to say Bitcoin is lack of improvement. I disagree.

Short-term, yes they might suffer. If you bought at $60k, your portfolio doesn't look that good right now. But why are you thinking short-term? It's been proven time and time again that its value increases over several years.

And don't forget that when bitcoin falls by 10%, alts fall by 20%. When bitcoin falls by 50%, alts fall by 80% or 90% and some never recover. Bitcoin has recovered every time and reached new highs. 

And as far as I know, based on 'store of value', it should be for long term and not just for a month or 30 days. So still, it falls under the definition if you are going to hold for years, just like the majority here.

In any case, Charles Hoskinson take is not new to us, so what else is expected, not just from him but from the rest of those who are going to criticised bitcoin. And it seems that there argument sounded like a broken record already.

Many investors or holders lost their patience and had losses because they sold their bitcoin before the rally in late of 2020. If they had hold their bitcoin from late 2017 to late 2020, they would have not gotten any loss. They got losses because they don't have enough patience or only have short-sighted, short term investment view.

Their losses are made up of their impatience, bad entries, severity of market, short-sight.
More criticism appears in bear market than in bull market.

I wish more would think like this. Unfortunately, people only see Bitcoin and cryptocurrency in general as a way to get rich. Not a way to improve the financial ecosystem.

How old is Cardano compared to Bitcoin? Maybe that's where he's coming from?

It probably won't if you're talking about cryptocurrency as a whole. It's just that Bitcoin neutrals or doubters would buy ADA if they find out what he said.

The is a proven saying in investing,

Past Performance is No Guarantee of Future Profits.

The problem with Bitcoiners, is that a cult mentality has replaced any reason left,
thinking that a product that ignores the fatal flaws of energy waste, low transaction capacity, & government bans
will continue on a ship to the moon is fantasy.

You would have earned more investing in alts like Doge than bitcoin since 2017.
The major flaw to your thought process is the hodl, you have to sell to profit.
Hodl until you achieve a great profit, then SellZ like your life depends on it, or watch your profit fade away.

Again see the line above in Blue, it is more truthful than any other.
Tulips anyone?  :)


FYI:
A true store of value does not fluctuate thousand$ of Dollars in a month,
A Speculative Gamble does, and that is ok, just don't confuse the two,
because a store of value , you may need at any moment, (Medical treatment, House or Car Payments, Food)
not something you can place on hodl for 5-7 years while it gets back to the price you purchased it at.
  
FYI2:
Your Bitcoin peaked at $63K ,
all you have now is a long long long slow downward drop back to $3k, with a couple of dead cats bounces throw in.

Yes, that's right, even Bitcoin should be included in the list of valuable inventions that have opened the world's eyes to its existence to date. What is the point? was to have displayed a great existence that could let one know one's potential in the future. I hope Bitcoin will be the starting point for the history of the world's technological civilization. so Bitcoin really must be guarded by all circles. even the world must admit that Bitcoin until now has a resistance value that is above Gold.

Cardano is more or less 6 years old as far as I know, so we could say that it's too "early" for Cardano. Compared to it's competitors though, some smart contract platforms are like half the age of Cardano but yet they all have those so called "apps" working already. Maybe Cardano is taking the sort of "play safe" approach in terms of development? Alright, that's  probably a good strategy to prevent bugs and breaches and such. But him calling out Bitcoin for slow development LOL? Just disingenuous.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cardano_(blockchain_platform)

https://cardanoupdates.com/

https://roadmap.cardano.org/en/