Bitcoin Forum

Recently on this forum, this post was created: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5346148.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5346148.0)      Thank you, JohnBitCo.

The post discusses what would happen to your Bitcoin in the event that you pass away. We are all very well aware if no one knows your keys or the location of your keys, they will not be able to access your funds.

This means it is imperative to make sure our coins end up in the correct hands in the tragic event that something were to happen to us.

This brings me here...

I recently read an article about creating a Dead-Man's switch to ensure specific people will get specific information if you are not present for a specific amount of time. The idea is that if you were not to log in to a specific email account for a predetermined amount of time, a message (containing your keys) would then be sent to the trusted individuals that you selected.

The Google platform has this feature built into it.

You first need to navigate to 'Inactive Account Management': https://myaccount.google.com/inactive (https://myaccount.google.com/inactive)

Then you would need to formulate a plan for when your primary email account is inactive for X amount of time. This includes selecting the recipients and the message itself.

That's it! You may be able to rest easy knowing that if something happened to you, your funds would be secured in the right hands.

...

Notice I said may.

By inputting this information to Google's server, you are inherently trusting them with this information. If your Google account were to be compromised, that data could end up being compromised as well.

So it is important to use this information wisely.   Maybe get creative with it.

Do what you will with this information, but I am sure many of you will be able to put it to good use.

Is anyone familiar with any similar services from a more trusted provider?

If you only read some of the posts in the thread you linked, then you could see that there are several possible solutions on the first page, and it is up to each of us to choose something from what is offered, or to come up with our own unique solution. I personally have a divided opinion about using any online service for this purpose, because there is no guarantee that it will work in xx years, or that the message we sent will not end up in spam where it will remain completely unnoticed and eventually automatically deleted.

I’m not going to talk about what my plan is, I think it’s something that every individual should keep to themselves - but I can say that there are people on this forum who have publicly said they have no plans to leave their coins to anyone - I also agree that it is better to take coins with you to the grave than to leave them to someone who didn’t deserve it.

I wouldn't put sole control of the private key (or funds) with any single entity, that doesn't provide sufficient redundancy in case of a compromise. Rather, I'll prefer having a Multisig of sorts, or a secret sharing mechanism such that it requires more than one form of authentication to spend the funds. For eg. Putting one of the 2-of-3 multisig with a secure service, and giving one of the key to the trusted party. Either that, or I'll have it written up on my will, the unlocking of a certain safe or secured storage upon my death.

There is no reason why you should entrust any of your keys to any centralized party. Or at the very least, it should be encrypted with the password included in the will. There shouldn't be a scenario where a compromise of the secured service results in the complete loss of security.

There's no reason to ever trust a third party for keeping your keys. There are far better ways to secure your funds in case of death. Ever heard of locktime (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5180850.0)?

Once you sign a transaction, you're actually setting when it'll be valid to spend its output(s). So, if you ever want to secure them for your children you could lock them to their address and keep it off-chain until you pass away. They'd then broadcast it.

So don't trust the third party with your keys. Encrypt your keys, give the encrypted copies to family/friends/heirs/whoever, and use the third party dead man's switch to send out the decryption key. Using an online service is risky though, as others have pointed out above, as you have no guarantees they will still exist or function properly when the times comes. If you want to go down a path like this, then better to store the decryption key in your will or with your lawyer.

I am partial to the locktime solution, since it requires no trust, no third parties, and (provided you set it up correctly) no amount of collusion from your heirs (or anybody else, for that matter) can circumvent the protections you have put in place. You just have to remember to periodically destroy/invalidate and then replace the locktime transactions, and your heir has to make sure they do not lose access to their receiving address.

The only issue is that this isn't a very reliable way of creating your own dead man's switch. I mean, I for example have lots of e-mail addresses I use. In time, I might completely forget that I created this switch and I might move on to another e-mail account without de-activating the switch. After the inactivity time expires, my message will be spread across the recipients.

Second of all, the message shouldn't contain sensitive information or something crucial needed to access an account! Because maybe the recipient's e-mail will at the time be in the wrong hands, so will your funds. Besides this, there are multiple other flaws. Google may not be even working anymore by the time you will be inactive.

It has been an inquiry of many before due to the fact that when one encounters death, his bitcoin will be left on hold forever. It could be a very great help for someone who wants all his hard work go to nothing specially if he is doing it for his family. It might seem unnecessary at some point but it would be a huge deal for those who would like to secure their family's future. Nevertheless, it would still be best if you yourself make an advance plan about it when encounter's an unexpected death.

Dead man’s switch I try to look that out on google features but could find nothing like that did I miss the word, anyway, it’s quite exciting information but I think there are safer and convenient ways to store and pass on your wallet private keys in case of death so that your loved ones can get access to your wallet. Just read through this thread first page you will find better options there.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5346148.0

The problem is that it is going to be very likely that a lot of things go wrong with this third party and it leaks your secrets.
For example their servers may have a bug that sends out the message before the defined time or sends it to more than the defined recipient. The worse case scenario is also their servers getting hacked and your secrets falling into the hands of the hacker.

This is a terrible idea mainly because there are better ways to achieve a "dead man's switch" without putting your funds at risk, such as the locktime mentioned before.

Is this different with what @LoyceV has in this forum? I think it's called a Locktime or something with a lock in it's name. I think it's in this discussion but I can't be bothered to search for it. It's good that there are more of this things, we can finally be prepared when the inevitable happens to us.

Is this what you are talking about? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5180850.0

I think that this is different with the Dead Man Switch, and if it's function is the same, it's much better because you will have more choice as to which one you are going to use. The variety is much better than anything else.

If you are controlling a small amount of bitcoin, then it makes sense! But if your google account is hacked by a hacker, then your bitcoins will be gone too. So it's a huge risk, I must say!

I would prefer to use traditional methods to hand over my bitcoin key to my next generation, through a legal will and a reputed law farm. A reputed law farm is least likely to scam you with your legal documents and that's the traditional method. This way, you will be safe from hackers as well as any online third party providers like Google.

I am very fortunate to have people around me who are very trustworthy so I dont need
to trust any third party to handle my private keys but I understand not everyone has that
peace of mind.

I'm sure that Google service can be used as a last resort but it shouldnt be the first option.

What though if you dont have access to a trusted lawyer as im only guessing a lot of people
dont especially in countries where they dont even have access to the banking system maybe
this Google function is the only option.

It essentially achieves the same thing as a dead man's switch, but in a trustless manner. While you are alive, you periodically either destroy the timelocked transactions (if you have kept them hidden from everyone), or you invalidate them by moving the coins to new addresses (if you have shared the timelocked transactions), and then create new ones which unlock at a future date. After you die, you are obviously unable to invalidate these transactions, and so the coins within become available to the intended recipient after a set amount of time.

This is the same idea as a dead man's switch. You take an action every x months while alive to keep the switch active, and when you stop taking said action after you die, then the switch triggers and your heir can access your coins.

Least likely, yes, but not impossible. You still don't know how good their security is, who may be able to sneak a glance of your documents, etc. I would still only store a decryption key or similar with a third party as I discussed above, rather than a raw private key or seed phrase.

I will not store the whole Private Key on a public (centralized) platform, but I will break it up into several pieces and then send those pieces at different times. Let's say your send the first part of the Private key on Day 300 and then the second piece on day 305 and then the last piece of the key on day 310.  ::)

You can even leave the whole "Private Key" and just send them a riddle that only the recipient will understand. Example : Look at my favorite Book on Page 230 and then you leave a paper wallet with instructions on Page 230 in your Moby Dick Book at home.  ;)

That's a terrible idea in my opinion. You should always think that they know what you're doing. Whether you sent them the whole key or a character a week, they could rip you off. That obviously includes the seed phrases; e.g if you sent a word once a month. Also, a centralized platform isn't public.

This includes that the book will be there & that the mail will arrive, after you pass away. Why don't you simply use locktime and avoid any unnecessary needs?

I agree. Even if you split up your secret, you are still storing the whole secret with the same centralized service and sending it to the same email address which is probably operated by another centralized service. It adds nothing to your security. If you split your secret between three different services and have them send to three different email addresses, then all you've done is triple your chance of failure and complete loss of your coins.

If you really want to split up your secret like this, then you should use a Shamir's system or multi-sig system across multiple providers so there is redundancy in your system and one provider can't steal your coins, although they come with their own drawbacks as well.

Better to not trust third parties at all.

all the solutions seem to lead to the same solution but here I only see and assess the level of trust in the closest people - brothers, husband, wife and children (family) - so small and doubtful in them that it doesn't seem safe to share secrets. no matter how great information technology still needs someone to access it.
so building mutual trust is the main solution with what we have, we work and save it for happiness together

Trusting third parties for the privatekey of asset in our possession either partially or wholly is not recommended at all for those who believe that there are unforeseen risks that may occur such as account hacking. As I recall, one of the bounty managers (I forget his name) has lost thousand of dollars of asset he had in the past just because he kept the privatekey in the email. I don't know exactly how it happened to him as it was a long time ago but what is certain is that his google account was hacked and caused him to lose his money. What happened to him we must make a lesson for the good and security of the assets we have.

If we have to prepare ourselves to inherit property ownership in asset after we die, then we must also ensure that the way we go is safe both while we are alive and after we die so that the inheritance can be received by them safely and appropriately. Trusting third parties for our asset is tantamount to ignoring financial privacy without realizing it.

As long as the email is not compromised as the clock counts down to activate the dead man's switch/ the send info to your next of keen, it's the best alternative we have to completely losing the stash of coins.

I know it's a risky channel to use in transferring our crypto assets but it's the less complicated methods have seen so far.

Shamir's system is ten times better than Multi-sig. I consider multi-sig another, maybe not terrible but, idiotic solution. The fact that you also have to keep the master public keys electronically (probably in a cloud service) ruins your privacy and the third party is still required.

But, if I wanted to make my children inherit my money? Surely not Shamir's system. It's not practical neither safe to split phrases and gain control over the funds by having less than all of them. The inheritance is safe (& practical) only with locktime.

Well, not necessarily.

To recover your multi-sig wallet, you need the threshold number of private keys, and you need at least the public key from all the remaining shares, right? So, for example, in a 2-of-3 set up, I need at least 2 master private keys, and either the third master private key or master public key. So I can then make three back ups, as follows:

Back up 1 - xprv A, xpub B
Back up 2 - xprv B, xpub C
Back up 3 - xprv C, xpub A

Having any two of my three back ups provides me with two master private keys and the third master public key, but having only one of my back ups does not compromise my privacy since the attacker who found one back up only has keys from two out of the three shares. I also don't need to store the master public keys anywhere else, and certainly not on a cloud service.

Remember that anything in online third-party services providers is also prone to hack and we don't know they still running their system very well after how many years.  So, I don't think this is a good idea, it might a terrible idea.

It's very simple and I tend to agree with this, hire a professional lawyer that will organize and legalize your will.  This is the safest method to inherit your Bitcoin when you will pass away and your other assets aside from Bitcoin.  But all of us have preferences, if they think using Google to keep your Bitcoin safe, it's up to them, they are lucky enough once they didn't being scammed or the service provider will not stop in the future when the inheritance will need it.  You must think first about the possible consequences.

I remember the time when we had probelms with Google regarding privacy on a big scale. They were even monitoring the incognito mode which is not something that should be done. At the same time everyone saves their passwords in google and at the same time they are suggested strong passwords too, google is much like a *safe* for the most people. When we are talking about *dead man's switch* it would not only be a necessity for some people but it would also be interesting for the family too.I feel we can use other options too. Like in Zebpay we have few options where we can state whosoever is going to get the power over our account on our demise. Therefore if you do not trust google. Find a good wallet! Or you can just put it in a nano x and lock it with specific informations which you can provide to a good and trustable lawyer.
Honestly I would love to have a last quest after my demise where my family would get the opportunity to search all the secrets and all the bitcoins. ^ ^

This actually is quite a good idea, but not something I would do myself since I have already experienced being phished on a public wifi some time ago. Although not that big of a loss, it still frightened me a lot that made me buy myself a new laptop. Which is why I really am against trusting others even an ai with my private keys. Instead though, I might leave a message about the whereabouts of the place where I hid a manually written copy of my private keys. Better yet, leave the location details to a trusted person. Of course, the information that it is about where my private keys are will be kept as a secret. The information will be sealed very well and will only be accessible by the people that I want to have access to it. Like a multiple authentication thing or something like that.

I do have some notes in my computer wherein they will be able too see that there crypto list and also includes the key or passwords but with additional codes or icons in it to avoid some hackers or if there are people nearby. I'd been too worried on not them knowing what I have and not being able to access it so we need to tell them what we are up to just make sure that they are trusted people if they knew it beforehand.

If I can't trust my family, my parents, and my kids with my secrets and my money, then I wouldn't want them inhering my bitcoin either. I think such arrangements should be made while you are alive and healthy without relying on a system or service to do it for you. Your next of kin and life partner should already know what is what while you are still around. That's how our parents did it with my siblings and me. Each one of us knows what they'll be inheriting one day. Just my two cents.   

It isn't. It is far safer than trusting Google with anything, sure, but it is not as safe as simply telling your heir where you have hidden your seed phrase if you can trust them not to rob you (although why are you leaving them anything if you can't trust them not to rob you?), or using the timelocked transaction method otherwise. Using a professional lawyer still requires trusting an unknown third party and still risks any number of people working for that third party being able to access your seed phrase.

Incognito mode does literally nothing for your internet privacy. All it does is stop your browser from saving your browser history or search history on to your local device. It is designed to keep your activities private from other people using that computer - it does not keep your activities private from Google or any of the other entities which are monitoring you.

People use Chrome to generate long and random passwords, and then back them all up to their Google account which is protected by a password like "sunshine". Completely pointless.

I wouldn't trust a hardware wallet for this purpose. If you are looking at inheritance in 10, 25, 50 years, who's to say the hardware wallet will still be working after all that time?

I'm a super paranoid bitcoiner but three people on Earth in different geographies know how to safely restore my coins if something bad should happen to me. I don't see the point of allowing my btc to die with me, they need to extend their life after me.
I know we're all for the Don't trust, verify mantra but I trust these guys a lot. In fact, I know how to recover their keys in case they die as well.
Couldn't think of a better use case for death recovery  ;D

In this part? the trusting is badly in displace , compromising our google account are usually happens because of Google itself are not that trusted anymore.

I think i would rather tell my family about the funds and let them decide when time happens i died accidentally .

Exactly, planning ahead but not close to being paranoid is the best thing to when you want those coins to continue circulating and having their purpose still being served and at the same time leave something behind for your family. To me, this kind of thing is a thing that needs a careful planning and execution because you don't want the people you will leave behind hanging high and dry expecting that they will have some inheritance.

What if this doesn’t work in the long run! The idea is mind blowing and I didn’t know if we could do anything of that sort but I don’t think I can rely on it. Maybe some other alternative would work.