Bitcoin Forum

Ukraine is the "island of crypto freedom" in Europe, what to expect?

I propose to discuss interesting news related to both the economy and the crypto world. The essence of the news is that at the moment, Ukraine is preparing to accept a package of documents that:
1. They legitimize the cryptocurrency, and allow to officially conduct transactions in the cryptocurrency.
2. Legalize the cryptocurrency market
3. A virtual hryvnia (the national currency of Ukraine) is being prepared to enter the market
4. Very important - mechanisms / legal framework are being launched to implement the amnesty for profits from crypto assets in connection with the launch of the legalization of the virtual asset market

Below are 2 links to the article (easily translated by google translate)
1. Interview with the Deputy Minister of Digital Transformation on IT Development of Ukraine (https://minfin.com.ua/currency/articles/oleksandr-bornyakov-virtualni-aktivi-mozhut-povnistyu-zaminiti-deyaki-nacionalni-valyuti/)
2. The same Deputy Minister, article "Ukrainians will be allowed to declare their income from cryptocurrencies" (https://biz.ligazakon.net/ru/news/205193_ukraintsam-razreshat-zadeklarirovat-svoi-dokhody-ot-kriptovalyut-proekty)

Interested in your opinion:
1. Will Ukraine become "Crypto Switzerland" or "Island of Crypto Freedom"?
2. What does the opening of such a specific market promise?
3. How can this affect some areas of the economy and which ones?

The Ukrainian government has always been very friendly towards the introduction of cryptocurrency and especially blockchain technology. Blockchain technology is practically being implemented in all ministries and sectors of the economy of this state.
So far, indeed, very good conditions for the circulation of cryptocurrency are planned in Ukraine. Cryptocurrency mining without any restrictions, as long as there are no claims to the consumed energy. 5% tax on profits from cryptocurrency, which is calculated as the difference between the cost of selling a cryptocurrency and the cost of buying it.
However, it will finally be possible to judge this when the relevant law on digital assets enters into force in Ukraine.

How is it exactly an island though, it's a landlocked country iirc. What do you exactly mean with Crypto Switzerland? I assume that you are talking about Swiss banking which has been reformed a long time ago so it's not going to be called that, the opening of such market will surely bolster the adoption of the market throughout Europe. I don't know about economy but it will probably help the microeconomy of a country.

We cannot judge the results until after the legislations have been passed, which may take a lot of time, and after reading the bills that have been approved, then we may be able to pass judgments.

Ukraine is a crypto-friendly country, but nevertheless, accepting cryptocurrencies does not mean that they will not impose taxes on them, and therefore how to deal with the financial system and impose legislation on it will determine the nature of the country's transition to a new concept.

What is moderation for? Are you filtering responses, or will there be a surprise for many later with the deletion of all posts?

Governments will allow people to use Bitcoin and other coins until they create and make their own virtual currencies that are totally controlled and tracked.
Problem is what will happen after that... very likely they will try to ban Bitcoin and say they can't control it or they will blame it because some hackers got paid in Bitcoin.
Never trust government, better wake up and understand that they are working for us and not the other way around, see what happened in United States with that latest crazy bill, same thing can happen all over the world soon.

I don't have high hopes for something like this to happen, it's one thing on paper and it can be totally different thing in reality.

I don't think Ukraine is planning to be crypto friendly for the benefits of the common citizen, what they actually want to do is create their own centralized currency (virtual hryvnia) for their advantage, with the virtual hryvnia, Ukraine will be able to monitor users of the currency, denying them of their privacy, which is exactly what the government is known for; I think the whole reason for generalizing their intentions in the direction of them being crypto friendly is basically so people get the erroneous message and think they'll embrace crypto in general, but I honestly doubt that.

I mean, think of it, why would they be preparing to launch their virtual hryvnia and still nurse the idea of being free to other forms of decentralized cryptocurrency, the thing is whenever a country starts to work on CBDC's, you must understand that sooner or later, they'll hardly want to entertain any other form of decentralized currency that would pose as a sort of competition to their own digital currency that they are controlling.

first i want to say first that ukraine is a country and not an archipelago :)
but i agree with the title of your thread which says that ukraine is not an island country which is identified with crypto freedom. because it's not without reason because ukraine is always open with crypto especially with blockchain and even i've read that there are officials who have btc assets of 46,351 BTC, worth more than 75 billion hryvnia (ukraine currency) and this is proof that the government there is always open with regard to crypto, although until now Ukraine still has no plans to make regulations for cryptocurrency mining because it is considered to have a big risk for the country, but until now, Ukraine is still one of the good countries for cryptocurrencies.

Based on the article you shared, I tried to try it first. Then my conclusion is:
the most basic point is that the legalization of crypto can be said to be 95% achieved. Plus several stages will follow and refer to the Virtual Assets Bill (https://ips.ligazakon.net/document/ji02365i?an=3).
then in the article, it says


The 230 people's representatives who have proven it have shown that the crypto market in Ukraine will increase the number of transactions currently underway, thereby increasing the alternative push to continue to be a financial monitor of assets on a larger scale.

Well, I hope this will be the next El Salvador. Of course, it would be very easy for Ukraine to do this if they really wanted to go on to a more massive level of crypto growth.

Furthermore, I believe that when Ukraine does everything according to procedures, it will only have potential as a global market economy, but will continue to be considered as another desire. Apart from that, the news is quite important, that previously Ukraine had been forgotten in the world's economic growth after the second world war.
And today, they are the first to catch up so that the lagging behind regarding the global economic market has been almost far with countries that are still halfway in supporting the growth of cryptocurrencies.

I have been living in Ukraine for 3 years now, considering this is my fourth year, I can honestly give a good opinion.
1. It's very easy to buy/sell cryptocurrencies like bitcoins here in Ukraine.
2. There are many people interested in the same so you can always find a local buyer.
3. The crypto market is flourishing day by day.
4. More and more stores online are accepting cryptocurrencies, the other day I wanted to buy some stuff for my dogs and apparently there was an option to buy using bitcoins, which honestly baffled me since people were so open towards it.
*
I do believe bitcoins and cryptocurrencies are going to have a safe heavens here. We are going to see bitcoins and other cryptocurrencies becoming legal tender soon enough, fingers crossed.

They aren't going to allow businesses to accept cryptocurrency payments directly. Bitcoin will not be a legal tender like it is in El Salvador. Crypto is not banned in Ukraine, what this law will change is just taxation and some new regulations for exchanges and other services.


This law won't be touching Ukraine's CBDC project. In fact, the law that would allow Ukraine's central bank to issue CBDC has already been passed a few weeks ago.


If EU will be more hostile towards crypto with harsher regulations and higher taxes, you could say that Ukraine is an "island of crypto freedom", but it's still far from what El Salvador is doing.

As a citizen of Ukraine, I cannot agree with you. The reality before that was such - we do not know what cryptocurrencies are, we know what they earn on it, we do not know how to deal with it, we do not know how to take taxes from crypto trading! Believe me, this is how the situation looked and still looks today. BUT! Now the authorities realized that cryptocurrency is a new source of income-taxes and decided to somehow "systematize" it

If this really bothers you - take screenshots of posts, and then prove my "crimes" :) Moderation was done in order to POTENTIALLY be able to clear the thread from spam. I am ready here to answer for the maintenance of the topic, and promise that there will be no electoral "purges" of posts. Except for spam and open insults

That bill (the infrastructure one that has the crypto regulation inserted into it) hasn't been passed yet by the senate, and I think a lot of crypto miners are calling up their state senators and complaining about it--at least that's what seems to the case if Youtube is to be believed.  We'll see on that one.

As far as Ukraine becoming a crypto utopia, I wish them luck and hope that country does turn into one.  Maybe that's where all the miners will end up after all of the big countries regulate all things crypto to death.  My fear would be that Ukrainian politicians change their minds eventually and decide they want some of that crypto wealth for themselves.  Dkbit98 is right about not trusting the government, because politicians change as well as attitudes toward certain things, cryptocurrencies included.

You haven't committed any such crime by self-moderating this thread, and I think it's smart to do so.  The problem is that some members do indeed just start deleting posts at random, so it's tricky whether to spend time posting in a thread like this when there's a risk that it'll have been for nothing.

If other countries will continue to be hard on crypto and will continue to tighten regulations there will definitely come a point when cryptocurrency-related and crypto-friendly industries will look for a particular country conducive to smooth business operations. Ukraine could play such role.

Strict crypto regulations will not only discourage certain companies to enter and do business in a country, they may also cause an exodus of existing ones. If it ever occurs to the likes of the US and UK, for example, surely Ukraine might become the next country of choice. And since the crypto industry is a trillion-dollar industry, this friendly approach of Ukraine toward crypto will certainly help its economy grow.

Regarding the legislation and legalization of cryptocurrency (regardless of whether or not taxes are levied), we can find an interesting phenomenon: Compared with the world's major countries, small countries are more radical, and there will be more third world countries speeding up the pace of cryptocurrency-related legislation.

The reason is actually very simple. Bitcoin is decentralized. I understand that it is de-dollarization. The U.S. dollar acts as a foreign exchange settlement center and a technology monopoly center. It is this center that has allowed many small countries to be sheared by the United States.

As Ukraine promotes the legalization of cryptocurrency, the time has come for a change. There will be more investors buying cryptocurrencies all over the world. This trend cannot be stopped. Although investors hold a string of encrypted characters, it is It is a sword of Damocles to counter economic hegemony and build a new world.

In a word, don’t think too much, just do it.

It's actually great to get the opinion of one living in the country we're discussing about, and tbh, I'm actually elated to read your posts and what you have to say about the condition of Bitcoin and cryptocurrency in Ukraine, and prolly the Ukrainian government may actually turn out to be different from the others, we'll just have to wait and see. I'd actually be surprised and I'm as well keeping my fingers crossed to see if the Ukrainian government will take absolutely no action in regulating or stopping the freedom at which people can use Bitcoin when the virtual hryvnia is officially out, but for now, going by your experiences you just narrated, Ukraine sure seems like a wonderful place to use Bitcoin compared to many other parts of the world.

Many nations are drafting such regulations to adopt bitcoin and intergrate crypto payments in the country and same goes with Ukraine also.They have implemented one of the nuclear plant in the country for bitcoin mining also some time back if i remember.But the problem is they want to counter it with bringing up their own central CDBC and issue them as virtual modes of payment across the country and force people to use it.The Ukraine crypto users might not be having problem in trading cryptocurrencies and with such regulations it becomes more easy for them.But government might impose certain restrictions later on and what they are doing is solely for tax purposes and generate revenue out of such business.But such jurisdiction might help it to grow from poverty as it is among poor countries in Europe and ranking 74th in Human Development index.We also hope it become crypto friendly center for all the citizens but it requires strict implementation of government policies and they can change their decisions anytime.So hope it goes well.

I would not be so negative. I am a citizen of Ukraine and have lived here almost all my life, and in the crypto market since 2014. Our country, of course, has its own "jokes", often the government "chuds", quite often openly idiotic laws are launched ... .. But we have very comfortable conditions for IT and technology startups.. I myself work in the IT field and know the reality well. Regarding freedoms on the crypto market - now we have a situation that is difficult to imagine, but cryptocurrency absolutely falls out of the legal framework, and in fact it turns out nonsense when you can profit from the sale of a crypt but not pay taxes, because in the legislative framework, cryptocurrency and operations with it do not have any status and regulatory laws :) This can be used for now. The next steps, it seems to me, will be aimed at regulating this market, introducing light taxes, and allowing for wider use in real life. What should ultimately become attractive to investors, crypto enthusiasts and crypto projects

I have nothing against Ukraine becoming a kind of crypto oasis or, as the OP says, an "island of crypto freedom", but the question is whether it can overtake or reach the countries of Western Europe that already have very well-established crypto regulations. By that I mean Germany, Switzerland, Portugal, Slovenia, Croatia as quite crypto-friendly countries, especially in terms of taxes that you don't even have to pay in some countries if you hold crypto for more than 1 or 2 years after purchase.

When it comes to Ukraine, what about the element of national security in terms of the country not being able to defend its borders when needed? This threat is still relevant and I think that investors are not very interested in investing in such countries, regardless of the conditions that may be very favorable for them. The condition for the progress of every country is to be politically and militarily stable, without which there is no progress.

If we take into consideration GPI (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Peace_Index) (Global Peace Index), Ukraine is in a very poor 143rd place (out of 163 countries) by a factor that measures the "relative position of nations 'and regions' peacefulness."

first we have to know what kind of crypto that country will legalize. I am sure that even though they will legalize cryptocurrency, the people there will not be free to use digital currency to be used as a transaction tool because it can threaten their fiat currency. there have been many discourses of this kind before but the implementation is not in accordance with what we imagine. so we have to wait until the discourse is actually realized in order to really know how it will be implemented.

It's been explained in threads and articles about it, you just need to know carefully. What they say "cryptocurrency" means the outline that we often encounter in the market, and they announced several markets that will be ready to operate in Ukraine.
Then in addition to the cryptocurrency, they will accept, the government there is also finalizing to soon release "e-hryvnia", which means their own crypto for the Ukrainian state. The problem of the community being able to accept it or not, we have to conduct a direct survey for the response of the people in Ukraine regarding the use of cryptocurrencies. In the comments, I found that based on one of the residents who already lived there stated:

As a person living in Ukraine, I can add that in addition to 2000 km of borders with the state of the world terrorist, we still have purely internal problems that can negatively affect any quality decisions. This is:
- corruption
- oligarchic power
- mentality of people

The problem of Russian aggression is now stabilized, we managed to repulse Russian terrorist troops and separatist gangs in 2014-2017, and return a significant part of the occupied territories in eastern Ukraine. Of course, the Kremlin "warriors" will still "rattle their weapons" at our borders and try to destabilize the situation through cloaca like the "Donetsk People's Republic" and the "Luhansk People's Republic" (not recognized by anyone, self-proclaimed territories, led by separatists and international terrorists ), but as reality has shown, despite the fact that the war continues - the economy, after 2016, began to actively grow. I think the European and generally Western vector of development we have adopted will still bring results, and the aggressor will be driven into his place, which will allow Ukraine to become a high-quality and safe partner in the crypto world, for other countries and continents.

Yes, our "indices" are not very high, but we still have many problems, but we want changes, we are ready to work, we understand that without effort there are no victories and achievements. I noticed that in recent years, a significant part of the population began to change mentality, values, goals ... People saw how you can live, what to strive for, ... I hope we said goodbye to the legacy of the USSR and its perverted ideology, which was driven into us in the heads of 80 years ... In a word, with a lot of risks, I believe in our success! :)

I will tell you that the Russians got what they really wanted, and that is Crimea - and everything else was a smokescreen that still serves its purpose. I am telling you here about the inability of your state to return the occupied territories in any way (diplomatic or military), which is a very negative signal to any investor who wants to start a business in your country.

From the experience of someone who went through a bloody war for independence and whose country also has a similar problem as far as its eastern borders and territories are concerned. Many large investors who play in the long run simply do not want to take risks in a country that can be attacked at any time by neighbors claiming its territory.

You can hope for the best, or move away like many of your compatriots to be cheap labor in Western countries - your loss is their gain.

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2020/03/ukraine-eastern-europe-depopulation-immigration-crisis/608464/

Different countries with the different perspective for the adoption of crypto. I mean it's not the first time we are seeing any country legalising the crypto tender. First Japan, then El Salvador, Australia, Virginia and many more are in the line already. It's just different because Ukraine is making it stronger tender for crypto in terms of legalities and infrastructure of the same. Though this is just in talks, it's only break through when Ukraine become the hub for various projects and drives the global operations towards it.

Because as far as I know other countries are already equipped with the huge mining farms and run major operations of crypto. So Ukraine needs bigger plans if they wanna be "island of crypto freedom".

"I am telling you here about the inability of your state to return the occupied territories in any way (diplomatic or military), which is a very negative signal to any investor who wants to start a business in your country." - unfortunately I have to completely agree with you - yes, now we do not have methods of direct influence on the aggressor country, and there are no simple methods to quickly return the occupied territories. And it goes without saying that this does not make our country attractive to investors.
But there is another side - financial and technological projects, in today's world, in fact, do not have a territorial connection and can easily, in minutes, move to the other side of the Earth. Convenient tax conditions and legal framework can be a good basis for starting a project.

If we talk about the problems indicated in the article, it would be foolish to deny the above facts. Yes, there are problems, and yes, today's government is essentially a herd of sheep. Although I shouldn't have offended such useful animals by comparison with our current government :)
Although, I slightly distorted reality - they are not sheep, they are not pro-Ukrainian politicians. They play into the hands of the Kremlin, into the hand, or rather into the pocket, of our oligarchs, they are destroying what was created in 2014-2019, they create and increase corruption .. But nothing - we will change, this is a question of some time

The government of Ukraine already shows us and they are friendly with bitcoin and cryptocurrencies. Unlike many other countries, they are scared of any new economic new technology, Ukraine government helped the Ukrainian people to enjoy using cryptocurrencies. I'm not sure about the power cost in Ukraine but I believe due to the reactions of the government we can see more miners migrating to this country and this will help both bitcoiners and the government. I guess, soon the other governments will be forced to be like Ukraine and legitimize the cryptocurrencies in their countries.

Russia never really cared about foreign investors in a meaningful way anyway, not even China really does. All they care about is money and how they make it, if they can make money by angering others then they will do that, if they make money by pleasing others then they will do that. However more than anything the most important thing is to keep their dictatorship going, Putin will murder half of Russia if it means he will keep his power, that is what being in power illegally makes you do because if you lose it one day then the next day your trial will begin, after decades of being a dictator nobody really wants to see fair judgment laid upon them because they know they will lose.

There are dozens like that all around the world. So they look for the middleground, something that will help them stay in power, but also could make them money, and this was the way they did it.

Cryptocurrency legalization is like the 2021 version of "legalize marijuana". Its viewed by many as the most rational and quick answer to create jobs and generate economic growth. And so we see ambitious and innovative efforts to harness the positive effects bitcoin and crypto has on society being made by many. I don't think there's any deep angle to ukraine's crypto proposals. Adopting crypto is a no brainer.




Economic sanctions on russia forced them to rely purely upon banks for business transactions. It allowed banks to seize control over Putin and russia. The effects are tangible. Post economic sanction russia looks very different. The opposite of pre economic sanction russia.

I hope that the sanctions will have the same effect as was achieved after the imposition of sanctions against the USSR, and this "terrorist empire" will also be destroyed and will no longer terrorize the whole world! So far, the real benefit to the world community from Russia tends to 0, but the harm goes off scale reasonable limits. I hope for further support, in this matter, from the West, in particular the United States, Britain, Germany, and many other countries that are not ready to cowardly turn a blind eye to the crimes of Russia

One thing is quite clear, and that is that Ukraine has great support from the US and the EU, and quite another thing is how that support manifests itself in real life. Russia, on the other hand, is under sanctions, but that doesn't stop it from being what it used to be - nothing has changed in that regard. Business with China or Iran is going according to plan, because they don't care too much about sanctions, and I'm sure that the EU and the US are turning their heads to the other side when it suits their national interests.

Ukraine's problem is that it is in front of the Russian door, and they do not want the EU, NATO, or the US in their backyard. Besides, be sure that no one will attack Russia militarily because it would mean World War 3 - and besides, history tells us that Napoleon and Hitler broke their teeth on that country - after all, the Americans only attack the weak, the EU can't defend itself either - and the UK mostly dances like the US plays.

When I read what this old fart said in 2016, I wonder who the EU actually supports...

^^^^ EU in its current form is dominated by Germany and that was one of the reasons why the Brexit happened. Ordinary German citizens have a feeling that German tax money is being used to subsidize the Eastern European states. And this is the prime reason why the EU hasn't expanded for a while. Now including countries like Bosnia, Ukraine, Georgia, Macedonia, Moldovia.etc is supposedly on the "pipeline", but I am not expecting any real movement for the next 20 years at least. Turkey is on a higher priority compared to these countries, and despite the romantic relationship between Angela Merkel and Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, they haven't yet made it in to the EU.

A few years back there was warfare in the eastern part of Ukraine, and close to 100,000 died there. A ceasefire was signed in 2014 and it is holding till now. But a large portion of the eastern part (Donbass) is still outside the authority of the Kiev regime. And the Crimean peninsula was annexed by Russia around that time. The case of Crimea is complex, because it used to be a part of Russia until 1954. Around 80% of the population is ethnic Russian. But for some unknown reason, the region was transferred to Ukraine in 1954.

As far as I know, a few years earlier BTC could be bought or sold in Privat Bank, but then suddenly, this opportunity was removed. I do not know what it was connected with, but it is possible that there was simply a decline in the crypto market and there was a lot of negative news. As for the new laws on the adoption of cryptocurrencies in Ukraine, this is certainly all very good if it all works. Again, if these laws are adopted, then it is likely that the use of cryptocurrencies will only be in large cities, and the rest may remain out of work. But no matter how it was, I hope that these laws will still work in Ukraine and this will help many people earn money and stay afloat in this not very easy time.

If we talk about the losses on the part of Ukraine, about 15,000 people fell victim to the occupation by Russian terrorist forces and separatists.

About Crimea. Crimea belonged to Muscovy / Russia for some time, before that it belonged to Turkey for many centuries. In the USSR, until 1921, Crimea belonged to the UPR (Ukrainian People's Republic), after the occupation by the Red Army, the UPR and Crimea became part of the USSR. Crimea, like some other lands, for example the Kuban region, were transferred to the RSFSR (this is a republic that later became the Russian Federation, the Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic). By the time you specified, the RSFSR realized that they were not able to create anything on the territory of Crimea, neither from the point of view of the economy, nor agriculture, nothing, after which, at the highest level, a decision was made (I can even provide a copy of this document), transfer the Crimea to the Ukrainian SSR (Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic, one of the 15 republics "included" in the USSR, but in reality captured by the RSFSR). The explanations were logical - geographically, these two territories border, the RSFSR cannot implement anything there, the Ukrainian SSR has the best experience in land cultivation, plus there is the Dnieper River, whose waters can feed the arid Crimea. After that, Crimea was transferred to the Ukrainian SSR, and some other regions were "voluntarily" taken away from the Ukrainian SSR in favor of the RSFSR. After that, the Ukrainian SSR spent several decades investing its energy in the development of Crimea. It is very important: during the collapse of the USSR, the territory of Crimea was part of the Ukrainian SSR / Ukraine, which was recorded in all documents, and these borders were recognized by all republics, including the RSFSR / Russia. So the reasons are known, the story is simple ...

Many legalize country was their for now.When the  bitcoin was at the bottom,most people had not invested their money.When the price had raised to some good value.Many people had accepted bitcoin is like a stock market and they don't lose when they invested money in bitcoin.Then it was spread all over the world and shining the market.

There was a German source which claimed that the number of dead was much higher than the official source. Anyway, it looks as if Russia has achieved their objective. Most of the dead are ethnic Ukrainians (on both the sides), and now Ukraine is being regarded as a "conflict zone". An unresolved conflict in its territory complicates the entry of Ukraine to EU/NATO (the same strategy was used by Russia in other countries, such as Moldova and Georgia). Also, it serves as a warning to other ex-USSR countries such as Belarus and Kazakhstan.

And it seems logical to me that all the antics of the Kremlin terrorists (including the poisoning of people with chemical warfare agents, provocations and seizure of foreign territories, the abduction and torture of people, and much more) should show the world the real "face" of this terrorist state, and it is logical to expect, push to measures to limit terrorist or reduce to zero, actions on the part of Russia ...
Well, or tomorrow you will have explosions, terrorist attacks, seizure of "zones of interest of Russia" ... Russia will not stop in Ukraine ... Remember - you can stop a terrorist only by destroying him, there are no other options

But I hope that the world community will have enough strength, conscience and understanding to help Ukraine maintain its integrity, end this terrorist war, and become attractive for investments, including in the field of blockchain technologies.

You have forgotten Serbia, Montenegro, and Kosovo as some of the candidates for the EU, and these are perhaps the highest priorities because Serbia outside the EU is increasingly falling under the influence of its Russian brothers, while pro-Serbian politics is in power in Montenegro, which together with Bosnia and Herzegovina, it is a real barrel of gunpowder that can explode at any moment.

Turkey is a completely different story, they want to join the EU without transforming into a European country - which in my opinion is a mission impossible given Turkey's worldview.

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And I hope that the EU and the US will have an interest in putting Ukraine under their protection and helping it get on the right track. Although there will always be some higher interests at stake, because no matter how much the US and the EU are publicly against Russia, I am sure they will never risk any moves that would cause bad consequences for them.

At the end of the day, everyone is on their own - because when my country was bleeding under the attack of Serbian butchers in 1991, no one came to help, but we managed to defend ourselves - our Alamo (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Vukovar) was stand for 3 months, brave 1800 against 36 000 - 42 000 butchers.

I don't think that Serbia will be admitted in to the EU as long as they don't recognize Kosovo as a separate sovereign nation. And no regime in Serbia will be willing to do this, because the Kosovo issue is still very emotional for the local voters. One compromise deal would see the Serb inhabited Northern Kosovo swapped for the Muslim inhabited Presevo valley (currently a part of Serbia).

Demographic changes in Bosnia is working in the EU's direction, as the country recently became Muslim majority. A few weeks back, they passed a controversial law, which would make it a criminal offense for anyone to suggest that there was no genocide against Muslims during the civil war. Serbs oppose this law, because it claims that only Muslims were victimized during the civil war.

This is great input coming from a Ukrainian citizen himself. I can say that Ukrainians are indeed fortunate by having government and state officials that are in favor of cryptocurrency because most often, the government sector and central organization in a particular nation isn't really very supportive and do not promote the usage of cryptocurrency with the reason that the country has fiat, to begin with. I think it has a nice benefit especially to the mental health of the crypto users since they don't have to worry that much compared to other countries' citizens. Hopefully, this scenario will also happen in other countries around the globe. Buying, selling, trading, and investing in crypto at ease is such a dream. In addition, the adoption of it in establishments and stores as a mode of payment is also an advantage.

I created a thread  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5350907.0)to discuss this stuff earlier, but I guess it didn't get much attention back then. All these events and articles are connected to this huge project of Ukraine's detailed roadmap of crypto adoption. You're right about digital hryvnia and other things, but there's so much more to it. Not to repeat what I wrote earlier in different words, I'll just quote myself:
While for now it all sounds very good, things can always go wrong in Ukraine. For instance, the tax rate is not completely established yet. Also, the full report (linked in the quoted message) mentions using Bitcoin to pay for goods, but it says that people will be able to do it with custodial wallets. So it's not clear whether non-custodial wallets will be allowed and whether they'll be limited to certain activities. Also, things like whether there will be obligatory KYC or not also aren't clear and, according to the roadmap, won't be for a while. Ukraine's my country, so I really want this all to work out and for it to be crypto-friendly, but let's not jump ahead of ourselves yet.
Sorry, but you're wrong on many accounts. The death toll from the Russo-Ukrainian war is around 14 thousand (https://hromadske.ua/posts/v-oon-pidrahuvali-kilkist-zhertv-bojovih-dij-na-donbasi), not 100 thousand. Also, there's no ceasefire, and the war has been ongoing for 7 years. It's just not as violent as it used to be in the early days, but some people die every month, and there are shootings every single day. The case of Crimea is complex, but the reason behind the transfer isn't unknown (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_transfer_of_Crimea), and was done because of the following:

Serbians mistake genocide versus war, and that is the law that was passed and that makes sense. srebrenitsa was a genocide at best, Serbs wanted to kill every single muslim bosnian they found, doesn't matter if it is man, women or child or elderly, they killed everyone, over 8 thousand were slaughtered like cattle, all thanks of the dutch army as well, letting Serbs with guns pass into a zone with Bosnians who had no guns.

A war between Bosnia and Serbia is understandable, both sides can kill each other and it will simply be called a war, and to deny that no Serbian died there would be idiotic, but to call srebrenitsa a war conflict would be just racist and genocidal, nothing more. I am quite happy that Bosnia is finally getting some power, for decades Serbia did whatever they want to them, and nobody in the world intervened, even helped Serbia to commit war crimes, finally we are seeing consequences for them.

I think that the European Union, as much as US or any other large and well armed and commercially strong nation, are perfectly able to exert a great degree of influence without the need to incorporate the countries themselves into the European Union.

Do not take this as racist, but the European Union should be very sceptic and wary about any country joining that does not really share the core values of Europe, such as rule of law, respect, democracy, etc... The EU is already having issues with Bulgaria on the sexual discrimination and bigotry and, in my view, should not ever incorporate countries with large Islamic groups of population, as Islam, as it is interpreted by most, is incompatible with the European core values.

You are equating "Bosnian" with Muslim, which I think is false. Bosnia is the region and those who reside there (irrespective of the ethnicity - Serb, Muslim, Croat, Roma - are called as Bosnian). Now I would say that it would be another mistake to claim that the Bosnian Muslims and the Bosnian Croats didn't committed any war crimes and only the Bosnian Serbs did them. For starters, there were thousands of radical Islamists from Afghanistan and other Muslim nations fighting alongside the Bosnian Muslims. I don't want to label all of them as angels. 


The death toll is at least 25,000-30,000 IMO. There are sources which claim that it may be as high as 100,000. And irrespective of how many people died, it is clear that people lost their loved ones for no fault of theirs.

I have a proposal that will allow you to come to reality - please indicate the sources where the figures of 25.000-30.000 and 100,000 dead are reasonably given?
I always refer to official data, including from OSCE missions and similar structures, which have no "personal benefit" from data manipulation

Irrespective of the death toll, the truth is that the vast majority of the dead were civilians. I don't know how many Russian citizens died in Donbass, but I guess at the most the figure should be in three digits. Donbass was supposed to be the richest part of Ukraine, due to the coal deposits. But now majority of the population is destitute. And for Ukraine, they have to deal with the status as "active conflict zone", which would hamper their potential entry to the EU/NATO and discourage bringing in foreign investment.

We are adults, and I believe that the dialogue should be based on arguments and facts. And if this is not the first time you repeat a contradictory figure, still indicate where you get such data from, this is important.

Regarding the "wealth of the region" - such regions have always been, on the contrary, poor. The problem of Donbass and Lugansk is that the regions are highly marginalized, with a specific "subculture" that was formed in 1930-1950, when the indigenous population was removed from these lands (Ukrainians were evicted, persecuted, etc.), and the lumpenized extras from the RSFSR were settled. Then a large number of prisoners (around a huge number of prisons), a corrupt police force (an accompanying "product" of prisons) were added. I was constantly present in this region (Donetsk, Yenakiyevo, Gorlovka, ...) from 2003 to 2012, and I know what I am talking about. All the "wealth" of the region was in the hands of local oligarchs, such as Akhmetov. People of the region, through propaganda, since the times of the USSR, were told about what a rich region it is, and how it almost "feeds" the rest of Ukraine. What gave them a painful "rich region" complex. BUT in fact, this region has always been subsidized, and lived just at the expense of the rest of Ukraine. On the one hand, some of the miners had good salaries, but the total majority lived on a penny, lived in very poor conditions, and most importantly, they had no prospects. Or, more correctly, they have always justified their poverty by the fact that they are "miners, and they have no other knowledge, and they do not want to learn something new." And now - in 2014, separatists and their supporters ran around with slogans "Stop feeding Ukraine", and now they stand in queues to get half a pot of primitive pea porridge for free ...
And about the losses - it is difficult to say exactly what the real losses of Russia are in these zones, since "the most honest ruler Putin", already in 2015, trying to hide the loss of personnel of the Russian armed forces, at the legislative level, categorically forbade disclosing data on "losses of the Russian army , in peacetime. "

And yet - let's get back to the topic of the topic? Otherwise, we are moving more into the field of politics.

A bit of news about the Ukrainian crypto market (in this case, about software companies) and around it, for the last 3 months:
- Ukrainian company ELEKS opens an office in Switzerland
https://ain.ua/en/2021/09/01/eleks-opens-an-office-in-switzerland/
- Ukrainian SoftServe opens its office in Dubai
https://ain.ua/en/2021/07/30/softserve-opens-office-in-dubai/
- Ukrainians sell technology to Audi, earn € 14M - the story of Apostera (not about blockchain, but a high-tech solution)
https://ain.ua/en/2021/07/12/story-of-apostera/
- Startup Zerion, co-founded by Ukrainian, raises $ 8.2 million
https://ain.ua/en/2021/07/08/zerion-raises-8-2-million/
- Ukrainian cryptocurrency startup Weld Money attracted investments
Concorde Capital (Ukraine), Magnus Capital (USA) and 7 O'Clock Capital (China) have invested in Ukrainian startup Weld Money, which allows you to pay with cryptocurrency like a traditional bank card.
https://ain.ua/2021/08/30/investicii-v-weld-money/

Using Bitcoin can counteract the effects of manipulation and economic sabotage from outside the country. Ukraine's support for cryptocurrencies is a legitimate defense. Although the idea is like that, consideration should be given to including crypto in the framework. Maybe a few years from now, they will have a country that is adopting Bitcoin, El Salvador. If the results are good, they will embark on the adoption of Bitcoin like El Salvador.

Ukraine only? What about Georgia? This country is great option in this case also because cryptocurrencies aren't taxed here in a regular ways (people who mine don't have to pay tax, also, people who receive cryptocurrencies and withdraw it, don't have to pay any tax when income isn't from own business).
Also, they created free industrial zone exclusively for BitFury (until that, there was no free industrial zone). Electricity is cheap and it gets especially cheap when you get them in free industrial zone.
Also (again), the government cooperated with Bitfury to help on developing and adopting of blockchain technologies (one successful project is land title registry).

O! Georgia! I love this country! This year, with Covid and all the attendant problems, I could not fly to rest there, I'm very sorry! A wonderful country, beautiful nature, amazing history and culture, wonderful people, unforgettable national cuisine! :)
By the way, it was the passion for cryptocurrency that made it possible to invest very well in the tourism business in Georgia! In a word - I highly recommend visiting Georgia - memories and "warmth" are guaranteed to you! :)

Yesterday, that is, on September 8, the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine adopted in the second reading bill # 3637, which allows to legalize virtual assets and cryptocurrency business in Ukraine.

This law is basic and defines the legal status of virtual assets in Ukraine, provides legal protection to users and market participants. Thus, foreign and Ukrainian crypto-exchanges will officially be able to work in this country, and banks - to open accounts for crypto companies.

The volume of transactions in Ukraine with cryptocurrency is about $ 150-200 million per day, and their capitalization is more than $ 2 billion.

Thus, Ukraine has become one of the most crypto-friendly countries. It would be nice if they also accept, as expected, a tax within five percent of the profits in the cryptocurrency.

A few clarifications on the adopted law:
The Verkhovna Rada at a meeting on September 8 supported in the second reading the bill №3637, which will legalize virtual assets and business in this area in Ukraine.
This law is basic and defines the legal status of virtual assets, thereby providing legal protection to users and market participants. Thus, foreign and Ukrainian crypto-exchanges will officially be able to operate, and banks will be able to open accounts for crypto companies.
In addition, this means that Ukrainians will be able to declare their income in virtual assets.
The ministry explains that the law is based on the current standards for regulating operations with virtual assets of the international group for combating money laundering (FATF). They establish rules for service providers related to the circulation of virtual assets and help to shade this market.

The market regulator will be the Ministry of Digital Industry, except in some cases, where the NBU or the National Securities Commission enters. The agency will facilitate the adaptation of Ukrainian legislation on the circulation of virtual assets with international standards and protect the rights of market participants.
In order to carry out activities related to the circulation of virtual assets, service providers will have to disclose ownership structure in order to be able to identify the ultimate beneficial owners.
https://www.epravda.com.ua/rus/news/2021/09/8/677595/

This means that Ukraine is becoming very attractive for the development of crypto projects, and any solutions working with or on cryptocurrency