Bitcoin Forum

Economy => Economics => Topic started by: hsdjkahskjdh on June 07, 2023, 06:32:40 PM



Title: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: hsdjkahskjdh on June 07, 2023, 06:32:40 PM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

In 15 years we have inflated 3x.

In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: DeathAngel on June 07, 2023, 06:52:38 PM
The bitcoin price was negligible in 2009 when the first block was mined so let’s use May 2011 as an example. The price was $8.81 at May monthly close. If you had $5,000 invested in bitcoin back then, you would have had  567.53BTC. Some simple math tells you that your $5,000 worth of bitcoin would now be worth over $15,000,000.
I think it’s safe to say that regarding inflation, long term bitcoin HODLING fixes this. Returns are naturally getting smaller as bitcoin gets more mainstream but it still beats inflation by far when HODLING long term.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Nwada001 on June 07, 2023, 06:54:58 PM
how does bitcoin fix this?

I don't think Bitcoin has the right to fix this; it's not the work of Bitcoin to fix a country's inflation, nor is it the work of Bitcoin to set up citizens minimum wages. The high cost of living in a country, I believe, is basically dependent on the country's economy and currency devaluation. If the country's currency isn't devalued, I think there are very few chances of product prices going up.

Bitcoin can only be used as a payment system; there is no time Bitcoin is going to overshadow a country's local currency and replace it over time, if that's what you are asking about. I no Bitcoin has all the features that can make it a generally accepted currency, but its limitations won't allow it to be a nation's stand-alone currency. One of those limitations is that you can't conduct a complete trade with Bitcoin for goods without the use of the internet.

I see Bitcoin as a currency that gives Bitcoiners full control over their funds and assets; taking care of a country's economy and minimum wages are not part of what I see in it. It's left to the country's government to fix their own problems. Bitcoiners have theirs..


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: OgNasty on June 07, 2023, 07:12:03 PM
Bitcoin doesn’t fix inflation. It is supposed to function as a means of opting out of the inflationary fiat system. Maybe one day in the distant future if it were used in every aspect of an economy and functions properly without incentives like the block rewards it could possibly help, but population growth and managing currency values is a tricky tightrope to walk.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: ZAINmalik75 on June 07, 2023, 07:23:02 PM
In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?
It's almost true that inflation raised the price of daily routine needs and it's confirmed that this unlimited paper money supply will soon runied entire system. Basically Bitcoin can't fix or save any country currency from inflation but by transferring your wealth into Bitcoin will save your assets from inflation.
Because Satoshi the founder of Bitcoin know that in future inflation will runied each and every fiat, so he put such point in mind during creation of Bitcoin and make a fixed supply of Bitcoin in order to fixed inflation problem and add an event of halving which occurs after every four year to reduced the supply of newly Bitcoin which directly reduced circulating supply as the demand raised continuously which push Bitcoin price to the sky and thus price work....


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: stompix on June 07, 2023, 07:32:27 PM
how does bitcoin fix this?

It doesn't!
Bitcoin won't keep pizza from reaching $45 and then $135 if we're doing x3 or x5 or whatever, it will simply allow you in best case scenario (again, there is no guarantee for this) that the satoshi you bought for $15 will be enough to buy you a $45 pizza. Nothing more.

A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.
Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

Before you hang politicians or anyone else, do a fair comparison.
How many pizzas could you buy with your wage then and how many can you buy with your age now?

I think it’s safe to say that regarding inflation, long term bitcoin HODLING fixes this. Returns are naturally getting smaller as bitcoin gets more mainstream but it still beats inflation by far when HODLING long term.

Then why did you go to 2011, split the last 10-year period in half, and see how big the returns are, you're making 100x in the first 5 years and just 4x in the other five based on yoy numbers, it's enough for a person to go by, let's stop selling Bitcoin as a millionaire making machine.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: BlackHatCoiner on June 07, 2023, 07:37:13 PM
how does bitcoin fix this?
Bitcoin per se can't fix this. While it gives a better interest (as capital appreciates) over the years, inflation will continue as long as there's reckless money printing, debt raising, and government spending.

The entire "Bitcoin can fix inflation" argument is (very) partly correct. For inflation to calm down, introducing Bitcoin-friendly legislation in every part of the world would probably result in scaled-down economy at first. I'm not a economist, but this kind of legislation would virtually limit the government abruptly. Sounds quite extreme to go from one endpoint to the other overnight (and I'm pretty sure it'd suck either).

How many pizzas could you buy with your wage then and how many can you buy with your age now?
I can answer that. About 5 years ago, I could buy a family-sized pizza for €12-15. Now, it costs me at least €20. That's more than a quarter of my pizza eaten by whoever is liable for this (probably politicians, though).


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Victorik on June 07, 2023, 07:49:55 PM
This is a sad reality but unfortunately, the politicians do not care and will only do what suits them and them alone.
BTC will not fix the inflation in your economy, because not everyone will embrace it.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: The Cryptovator on June 07, 2023, 07:51:55 PM
What are your expectations regarding Bitcoin? It's important to note that relying solely on Bitcoin to fix inflation is not feasible. Bitcoin cannot solve all problems on its own. Bitcoin is a cryptocurrency known for its high volatility, which can be advantageous if approached strategically. Investing in Bitcoin can potentially yield profits, but it's crucial to understand that it doesn't guarantee consistent gains. There are instances where the price may plummet, leading to financial losses. Therefore, it is imperative to thoroughly educate yourself before considering Bitcoin investment.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: DannyHamilton on June 07, 2023, 07:58:11 PM
inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.

Ok. I'll be that idiot.

Whether or not the price of that pizza went up depends entirely on what currency you are using.

If you are pricing it in Bitcoin, then the price of one of those pizzas on the day of the famous transaction was 5,000 BTC (500,000,000,000 sats)
Today, you can purchase an equivalent pizza for about 0.001258 BTC ( 125,800 sats).

That looks like the opposite of inflation to me.  In terms of the amount of Bitcoin that you need to spend to get the same pizza, it's MUCH MUCH less.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: odolvlobo on June 07, 2023, 08:12:46 PM
It is hard to say how Bitcoin would affect inflation. Bitcoin has a fixed supply so there is (or will be) no money-printing. However, while money-printing is a major factor of inflation, it is not the only factor.

Another factor is fractional reserve banking, which cannot be prevented by Bitcoin. FRB a limited form of money printing and contributes to inflation.

Another factor is the efficiency of the financial system. A Bitcoin-based system would be more efficient and contribute to inflation.

A factor unrelated to Bitcoin is productivity. Increasing productivity contributes to deflation.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: franky1 on June 07, 2023, 08:17:11 PM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

In 15 years we have inflated 3x.

In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.

if you put say $8 into bitcoin in 2012 instead of buying a pizza
right now your would have $27k meaning 1500 pizza's in todays value



Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: mendace on June 07, 2023, 09:16:08 PM
You're asking Bitcoin to fix inflation when that's not its purpose. Bitcoin is a digital payment instrument, which cannot be governed by anyone but cannot solve these types of problems and by its nature it is deflated. But for once I want to row against Bitcoin because unfortunately I think it is not possible to have an entire planet that adopts Bitcoin as a means of payment because its true nature of digital scarcity does not make it suitable, on the contrary it would create more poverty than the current one and the states could not print their money out of thin air anymore.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Upgrade00 on June 07, 2023, 09:22:04 PM
Bitcoin cannot fix inflation or the economy, that is the job of the fiscal policy makers. What Bitcoin can do it give you an option to hedge your funds, so if inflation hits and fiat losses value your Bitcoin grows against it as it retains its own value. Bitcoin gives you that freedom to not be entirely dependent on the current banking system but have the liberty to use a fully decentralised asset.

While I he money printers are working overtime you start building your Bitcoin stash.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Z-tight on June 07, 2023, 10:05:34 PM
how does bitcoin fix this?
Inflation is everywhere in the world right now and governments are working to fix it, but BTC cannot influence the overall value of your nations fiat currency, but if you individually want to protect your money from losing value, you can buy BTC and hold it. So many people accuse the government and believe that inflation is caused by their actions, in that case how does a decentralized currency influence the actions of a government.

The only way BTC can fix this is if you limit your commitment to this centralized system that's causing inflation, by moving a lot of your funds into BTC that's censorship resistant and permissionless. Since BTC cannot be printed out of thin air, maintains a fixed supply and can only be mined ~ 10 minutes on average, its value will go up in the long period, so it is a good currency to protect your funds from inflation.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: drwhobox on June 07, 2023, 10:36:23 PM
Bitcoin is not supposed to fix inflation, if you have 5$ worth of bitcoin when a pizza cost 5$, if its 3x your bitcoin probably can cover the pizza price. It is your government who is the culprit to not increasing the wages with the uprising pizza price. You don't fight inflation with bitcoin but if you are smart enough to invest in bitcoin the value will be more than your fiat is.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: BitDane on June 07, 2023, 10:47:41 PM
how does bitcoin fix this?

Bitcoin is not created to fix the inflation. It is created to be a medium for boundless transaction without any intermediary.  Bitcoin is created to address centralization, fraud and censorship.  It is not a fix all pill that solve all problems.

The creation of Bitcoin is a response to the great financial crisis (https://www.investopedia.com/articles/economics/09/financial-crisis-review.asp) and the financial world’s reliance on banks as intermediaries of all financial transactions[1].  So I think it is not about solving inflation but rather making each person independent from traditional banking system.





[1] https://financialgym.com/blog/2021/1/2/bitcoin-101-what-is-bitcoin-and-why-was-it-created


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: uneng on June 07, 2023, 10:57:47 PM
Bitcoin fix this in the sense the more money you save (in BTC currency), more pizzas you will be able to acquire on long term, while when saving fiat currency, the less pizzas you are going to be able to buy futurely.

The lesson is: avoid saving fiat. Or you put it in good use, or you invest in BTC, but never hold fiat for too long, otherwise you are going to be overcome by inflation. I just feel unconfortable for those elders who have been saving their wages for their entire lives below the bed, thinking to be doing a good business.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: blockman on June 07, 2023, 11:00:49 PM
Inflation is like the arch nemesis of the entire world, there's no way to defeat it. And as the year passes by, the inflation rate will just gonna keep on rising even if the economy is doing well. Is bitcoin fixing inflation? I guess it's just for individuals because it's a deflationary asset so as the inflation keeps going up, the value of it will rise as well and that's how it will keep it but it's not gonna solve it for the entire world's problematic issues like inflation.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: robelneo on June 07, 2023, 11:01:11 PM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.
You did not mention where you are located or the country where you are, but your situation is very much the same here in our country, the worker's salary cannot keep up with inflation and an average worker here in our country needs additional work after the office hours to be able to keep up with the growing prices.

Quote
In 15 years we have inflated 3x.
It's bound to happen in third-world countries, even first-world countries experience inflation but they can handle it better than workers in the third world.

Quote
In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.
It depends on where you are buying a pizza, if you're buying it in a first-class restaurant where a chef is the one creating the ingredients and design, but if it is only in your neighborhood you can get it way cheaper.
Quote
how does bitcoin fix this?
The solution is managing your expenses, adding more skills that pay well, and investing in Bitcoin, it's not on Bitcoin but on how you manage your earning and find a job that pays well commensurate to your skill and investing in Bitcoin of course, first thing first and that is fighting inflation through your ability to earn more.



Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: BitDane on June 07, 2023, 11:09:30 PM
Bitcoin fix this in the sense the more money you save (in BTC currency), more pizzas you will be able to acquire on long term, while when saving fiat currency, the less pizzas you are going to be able to buy futurely

This is only applicable if Bitcoin continuously move in an uptrend path.  But once Bitcoin meet its APEX and prize stabilized, it can be affected by inflation in one way or another.

The lesson is: avoid saving fiat. Or you put it in good use, or you invest in BTC, but never hold fiat for too long, otherwise you are going to be overcome by inflation.

I greatly agree don't just hold fiat use them to invest, best if it can be used to create a profitable business than can produce continuous stream of income and not just a one time profit.  Since I believe, to overcome inflation we must earn income that far surpasses the inflation rate in order for our life to be unaffected by this common event.

I just feel unconfortable for those elders who have been saving their wages for their entire lives below the bed, thinking to be doing a good business.

They had successfully  goes through all the problems and troubles financial life had given them and ends up with savings, so I don't think you should feel uncomfortable for them.  


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: hatshepsut93 on June 07, 2023, 11:40:04 PM
Bitcoin doesn't fix anything if it's not getting adopted. And the way things are now, people only use it as an investment for short-medium term, rather than paying with it for goods and services. If people are using Bitcoin as an investment to avoid erasure of their savings, than Bitcoin is no different from gold or real estate. With this logic you can say that inflation doesn't matter because you can invest fiat money into something, including Bitcoin.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: btc_angela on June 08, 2023, 12:18:16 AM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

In 15 years we have inflated 3x.

In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.

Lol, I don't get it, why people really think that bitcoin is that magic bean to really solve every human problems that we have right now? Yes, you can invest on btc and see how it goes for you in the next 4 years (at least full bear/bull cycle run will do and see it for yourself).

But please don't look at bitcoin as something that can make your rich in such small amount of time or will be the answer for all the problems that exists, including poverty and hunger, it's not the answer.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: dansus021 on June 08, 2023, 12:41:55 AM
Some of our users use bitcoin as a store of value like digital gold because it is fight against inflation for the long term. But in the short term the volatility of bitcoin makes some people leave although you can get way more more profit if you can play with the volatility.

But please don't look at bitcoin as something that can make your rich in such small amount of time or will be the answer for all the problems that exists, including poverty and hunger, it's not the answer.

and I agree with this Bitcoin not the answer to all the problems. To achieve the goal of bitcoin we need more adoption and some government support by not ban the crypto too :D 


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: kro55 on June 08, 2023, 03:34:02 AM
Bitcoin cannot solve or fix the inflation of the national or world economy, as long as the government continues to print money unchecked, inflation will continue to soar in the future. But bitcoin as an asset is resistant to inflation due to its limited supply and value increasing over time.
So you can use bitcoin to fight inflation your way. Instead of saving in fiat, allocate some to bitcoin, and if bitcoin continues to grow in the future, at least your money won't be eaten away by inflation.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: adaseb on June 08, 2023, 04:22:33 AM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

In 15 years we have inflated 3x.

In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.

Are you from Canada? Seems we got similar prices as yours mentioned.

Yes inflation is crazy. Hence why Bank of Canada did a surprise hike of 25 bps because inflation is not under control and employment is very tight.

Seems every month there are more and more prices increases. These days a decent medium pizza is like $15 here and maybe $21 or so for a large size. A remember a few years ago a decent pizza was more like $9 or so. So it certainly has gotten crazy.

And the wages obviously haven’t caught up.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: YUriy1991 on June 08, 2023, 04:28:13 AM
Bitcoin cannot solve or fix the inflation of the national or world economy, as long as the government continues to print money unchecked, inflation will continue to soar in the future. But bitcoin as an asset is resistant to inflation due to its limited supply and value increasing over time.
So you can use bitcoin to fight inflation your way. Instead of saving in fiat, allocate some to bitcoin, and if bitcoin continues to grow in the future, at least your money won't be eaten away by inflation.

My view may be the same where Bitcoin can become one of the instruments that individuals use to protect the value of their wealth from the effects of inflation. For example, rather than keeping all of the money in fiat currency, one might consider allocating some to Bitcoin. If Bitcoin continues to grow in the future, at least the value of the money won't be eroded by inflation and this needs to be underlined Bitcoin can provide protection against inflation on an individual scale, improvement of inflation as a whole requires broader action, including economic policies implemented by governments and financial institutions at the national and international levels.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: coinerer on June 08, 2023, 04:34:41 AM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

In 15 years we have inflated 3x.

In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.
Bitcoin does not guarantee to reduce inflation.  But the way Bitcoin is developing it automatically fights Against inflation. Bitcoin's journey began in 2009. 13 years ago on Jul 15, 2010 the lowest Bitcoin price was $0.04865 according to coinmarketcap data.  Now the price of Bitcoin though has dropped a lot from ATH but still Bitcoin is at  +54247363.89%  from its ATL.  Then you think how much Bitcoin has developed in the last 13 years.  And you now think whether bitcoin is fighting inflation and whether bitcoin can reduce inflation.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: wxa7115 on June 08, 2023, 05:17:06 AM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

In 15 years we have inflated 3x.

In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.
Bitcoin cannot fix the inflation suffered by fiat currencies, bitcoin is a parallel system and at best it can help us to alleviate some of the consequences we may suffer because of that inflation.

This can be done as the increase on the price of bitcoin is faster than the increase on the inflation, but this does not solve the problem of fiat currencies, as any wealth you have stored in that form is going down because of the inflation, in a way this is similar to what the rich and wealthy already do, in which most of their wealth is stored on pieces of art, stocks and real estate, and very little of their wealth is on cash as they understand this mechanism really well.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: josephsonand on June 08, 2023, 05:22:18 AM
Hanging politicians and central bankers might sound like a tempting solution, but I think we need to dig deeper into the complex factors that contribute to inflation. Blaming them alone won't solve the issue. As for Bitcoin, it's not a magical fix to inflation. While it has its benefits, it's not a panacea for economic problems. We need to explore a comprehensive approach rather than looking for quick fixes.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: GreatArkansas on June 08, 2023, 05:31:31 AM
If all or most people will use Bitcoin only as a store of value, maybe it will solve the issue, mass adoption is the answer.
Since Bitcoin is a deflationary asset, supply is limited completely opposite of the fiat currency we have right now. And that's why that we are experiencing high inflation these days even before, and I believe it will continue.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: bitbollo on June 08, 2023, 08:27:13 AM
Ok Bitcoin will probably have a re-evaluation in the future (it will be able to beat inflation? ::) )
However to use past events to evaluate this future it Is a risky approach since it is really unlikely (impossible ???) to see these huge returns in the future/same time span.


If inflation were to grow so much and therefore also Bitcoin get this huge revaluation…what would be the real impact on the world economy? I think it could be just a big mess/disaster....


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: pooya87 on June 08, 2023, 08:32:09 AM
how does bitcoin fix this?
Considering how "this" means the economy on the global scale where the centralized governments in each country keep printing money non-stop and without any actual cap, the answer is no. Bitcoin can not and is not designed to fix the economy or fix the government or the banking system.
In other words governments have been printing fiat non-stop before bitcoin and they will continue doing so after bitcoin (2009). They just raised the money printing cap (debt ceiling) in US to print trillions more :P

Bitcoin is supposed to be that extra option for those who want to gain at least some financial sovereignty in a world where it is lacking.



Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Ojima-ojo on June 08, 2023, 10:49:59 AM
The bitcoin price was negligible in 2009 when the first block was mined so let’s use May 2011 as an example. The price was $8.81 at May monthly close. If you had $5,000 invested in bitcoin back then, you would have had  567.53BTC. Some simple math tells you that your $5,000 worth of bitcoin would now be worth over $15,000,000.
I think it’s safe to say that regarding inflation, long term bitcoin HODLING fixes this. Returns are naturally getting smaller as bitcoin gets more mainstream but it still beats inflation by far when HODLING long term.
Yeah aside from the fact that the $5,000 will not have the same value since inflation would have taken a large chunk from that amount, but with Bitcoin $5,000 ast in 2011 will equal $15,000,000 the value of 567.53.


So the math is clear and simple to understand, BTC is the best and long-term holding is the king of the future.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: NotATether on June 08, 2023, 10:54:46 AM
how does bitcoin fix this?

That only works if Bitcoin becomes the world's global reserve currency which we all know is not going to happen in the distant future. If the prices of everything inflates to extremely crazy levels, to the point where things that used to cost a few dollars now cost hundreds of dollars (or if the US simply hits its debt ceiling at any time), then I doubt the dollar will still be the global reserve, and other countries, or groups of countries such as BRICS, will push forward their own currencies to be the global reserve.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: stompix on June 08, 2023, 10:57:04 AM
How many pizzas could you buy with your wage then and how many can you buy with your age now?
I can answer that. About 5 years ago, I could buy a family-sized pizza for €12-15. Now, it costs me at least €20. That's more than a quarter of my pizza eaten by whoever is liable for this (probably politicians, though).

Well, since we have some feedback can you go on a longer period let's say 10 years, and then match in wages?
I was paying between 4 and 5 euros for a pizza after the crisis, right now it's 10-15, depending much on the location, but just looking at the minimum wage it was 300 euros in 2010 now it's ~700, so if you look at both the increases it's not really that bad anymore.

Of course that works mostly for us in Eastern Europe cause we were dirt poor and we finally managed to catch a bit with the rest of the EU.
That's why probably nobody here is actually that desperate about the current inflation, 10%, 20% 30% is nothing compared to the 90s.



Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Onset on June 08, 2023, 10:57:36 AM
Money is usually worthless. It devalues over time. We get a false feeling of the opposite happenig. Wage rises and you think you earn more, but reality is you earn.. less or just the same.

Look at how much a McDonald’s burger used to cost back in their first business years. Look up how much it costs now. The price rose, but so did the minimum wage. I mean, salaries typically get a nation wide increase when cost of living becomes hard to cover with the minimum wage..

Bitcoin has so far helped tremendously, given investors bought years ago and held without panicking. In theory, it should do the same in a matter of years if you buy today. Bitcoin has so far exceeded inflation impressively. It’s in fact supposed to do just that, be an asset that protects you from the failing fiat.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: bayu7adi on June 08, 2023, 10:59:05 AM
Yeah aside from the fact that the $5,000 will not have the same value since inflation would have taken a large chunk from that amount, but with Bitcoin $5,000 ast in 2011 will equal $15,000,000 the value of 567.53.
So the math is clear and simple to understand, BTC is the best and long-term holding is the king of the future.
However, very few individuals held such assumptions when Bitcoin was priced below USD $10, as that was a very early stage in Bitcoin's existence. It is only after Bitcoin has reached its current pinnacle that it would be gravely mistaken to evaluate Bitcoin solely based on its price and regard it as the ultimate escape from inflation.

We should instead focus on what causes the value of Bitcoin to rise and reach all-time highs. Variables such as the technology underlying Bitcoin and the community's trust in its existence also play a significant role in driving the price of Bitcoin. Up until now, no one can guarantee Bitcoin's future, whether it will continue to surge by thousands of percentage points in the next ten years or become a mere jest. We simply do not know, unless you possess the power of time travel.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Onset on June 08, 2023, 11:16:41 AM
Well, since we have some feedback can you go on a longer period let's say 10 years, and then match in wages?
I can try something.

In 1960, a McDonald’s burger in the US was $0.15. That’s $1.55 according to inflation calculator (https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=0.15&year1=196001&year2=202303). Today, a hamburger costs $1.61 (source) (https://fastfoodmenupreise.de/mcdonalds-prices-usa/). So the cost is about the same.

Also in 1960, minimum wage was $1. That’s $10.30 adjusted to today’s inflation rate. In 2023 some states are paying more, others are paying less (https://www.thehortongroup.com/resources/2023-minimum-wage-rates-by-state/) than that. The lowest is about 25% less than 1960’s minimum wage, the highest is >50% over it.

It’s not as bad. Burger costs 10x more in USD but the minimum wage has adjusted about accordingly.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: jossiel on June 08, 2023, 11:20:01 AM
Money is usually worthless. It devalues over time.
I wouldn't say that. Yes, it devalues due to inflation but it's not worthless when you still need to buy your stuff.

We get a false feeling of the opposite happenig. Wage rises and you think you earn more, but reality is you earn.. less or just the same. Look at how much a McDonald’s burger used to cost back in their first business years. Look up how much it costs now. The price rose, but so did the minimum wage. I mean, salaries typically get a nation wide increase when cost of living becomes hard to cover with the minimum wage..
That's right and that's all due to inflation, salary may go up for most of the professionals but it's just equivalent to what the inflation that we are experiencing. And the sad part, many salaried men don't even get an appraisal even there's an inflation.

Bitcoin has so far helped tremendously, given investors bought years ago and held without panicking. In theory, it should do the same in a matter of years if you buy today. Bitcoin has so far exceeded inflation impressively. It’s in fact supposed to do just that, be an asset that protects you from the failing fiat.
Well said, a real asset that can be hedge against inflation.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Onset on June 08, 2023, 11:23:27 AM
I wouldn't say that. Yes, it devalues due to inflation but it's not worthless when you still need to buy your stuff.
It’s worthless if you keep it, I wanted to say. You can’t hold on to USD because it’ll just devalue due to inflation. You lose purchasing power. It sucks.

Well said, a real asset that can be hedge against inflation.
Can be, sometimes. If your financial situation sucks and you get to buy Bitcoin in 2021 with all your life savings as a hedge against inflation, you’re screwed. It so far resembled a very very good investment over long term. But reality shows that while its price increased many many times, when economy goes bad Bitcoin gets pretty shaken and destabilized.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Luzin on June 08, 2023, 11:23:44 AM
We should instead focus on what causes the value of Bitcoin to rise and reach all-time highs. Variables such as the technology underlying Bitcoin and the community's trust in its existence also play a significant role in driving the price of Bitcoin. Up until now, no one can guarantee Bitcoin's future, whether it will continue to surge by thousands of percentage points in the next ten years or become a mere jest. We simply do not know, unless you possess the power of time travel.

Historically, in several periods, it has proven that Bitcoin has become extraordinary. It seems that that period makes them believe that the farther the journey will be better. Although there is no definite guarantee for that. The mass adherence factor of large companies also provides additional stimulants for investors to get into Bitcoin. So I think if bitcoin has more and more users, the possibility of reaching the best price is still very possible. Bitcoin and Crypto thrive on trust, if it's gone it's a bad sign.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: kryptqnick on June 08, 2023, 11:25:41 AM
The situation's different in my country in terms of the wage in the USD (unless you're talking about daily wage), but the inflation I've seen within my life (and I'm of a similar age with the op) is around 5x. There were ups and downs, it wasn't all at once, and now people are sort of used to it, but it's still pretty bad, especially since the salaries never fully caught up and people are now significantly poorer than 10 years ago, although there are good objective reasons for it, which are largely related to a very aggressive neighbour country and somewhat to corruption.
Bitcoin gains rather than loses value over time (or at least it seems to be this way if we look at the price chart so far, but there's no guarantee it will always be this way), but that comes with its own economic challenges (for instance, since it's growing in value, people are less keen on spending it). Bitcoin can supplement fiat and perhaps help people with their savings if they want to suffer less from inflation, but I don't think it's ready to fully replace fiat and make things better this way.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: BlackHatCoiner on June 08, 2023, 11:48:45 AM
but just looking at the minimum wage it was 300 euros in 2010 now it's ~700, so if you look at both the increases it's not really that bad anymore.
This "protection" is only provided to those who're being paid the minimum wage. People who have been earning 1000 euros per month for the past 5 years, and who didn't get any raises, experience more intense inflation.

That's why probably nobody here is actually that desperate about the current inflation, 10%, 20% 30% is nothing compared to the 90s.
I don't know where you live, but in my country, going from a 2% to a 10% within 3 years is bad. The middle class suffers.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: crypticj on June 08, 2023, 11:54:39 AM
No, it's not.

You can say that bitcoin can't inflate because you can't print it, but because everyone is using it as an asset, it's price fluctuates like crazy and for some people, it could be even worse than inflation because when USD inflation is 7% a year and bitcoin is dropping 4% a day, people obviously will go with USD.

But bitcoin is good for other things, it's the best tool to gain financial freedom because no one except you can control your BTC. There are no bank or government that can freeze your BTC. That's why it's so great.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: stompix on June 08, 2023, 12:11:01 PM
but just looking at the minimum wage it was 300 euros in 2010 now it's ~700, so if you look at both the increases it's not really that bad anymore.
This "protection" is only provided to those who're being paid the minimum wage. People who have been earning 1000 euros per month for the past 5 years, and who didn't get any raises, experience more intense inflation.

Agree, but wages have grown even if we go by the median, at least in EE, the region I'm really familiar with since I've lived in 3 countries for more than 4 years each this century.
https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.ADJ.NNTY.PC.CD?end=2021&locations=SK-CZ-HU-RO-PL-SI-HR&start=2015
You can see that most have experienced +50% growth this period.

I won't say the situation is wow, everything is fine, of course, it sucks, but it's not like we're 3x times poorer, I think we can agree it's in the low double digits.Of course, I exclude countries like Turkey, Argentina or Iran from those, with their inflation god knows what's happening there.

That's why probably nobody here is actually that desperate about the current inflation, 10%, 20% 30% is nothing compared to the 90s.
I don't know where you live, but in my country, going from a 2% to a 10% within 3 years is bad. The middle class suffers.

EE, as I said, I was born in one country and moved to another for a few years then living in another but still <200 km from my birthplace. Tour of the Visegrad! Lol! But, the thing is that when finally we got rid of communism inflation was rampant around here, we were dirt poor compared to the rest of the world, we had basically nothing, no jobs, no healthcare, no nothing, and inflation reached 200% in almost every country. (https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/FP.CPI.TOTL.ZG?end=1994&locations=SK-CZ-RO-PL-SI-HR&start=1988) and not for just a year and not just 200%. That graph is missing a lot of data, btw. So, now that we're way better compared to those times, 10% is nothing for the ones that experienced that period, it's like meh!, we had that each day for a week back then.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: franky1 on June 08, 2023, 12:25:37 PM
10% inflation. is a meaningless number.. unless you can work out how that 10% is represented

if its +1% of house prices and 30% of food prices.. to average out as 10%
then it hurts the poor more and doesnt benefit house sellers

if its +12% of house prices and 2% of food prices
then it hurts house buyers more. but benefits the house sellers

if its 50% of car fuel/electric, 50% food and -1% house prices
hurts the working class
then it hurts the house sellers
benefits house buyers

..
bitcoin does not fix fiat inflation.. bitcoin offers another choice of where to store your savings/value to hedge against fiat inflation


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Obari on June 08, 2023, 12:51:19 PM
The bitcoin price was negligible in 2009 when the first block was mined so let’s use May 2011 as an example. The price was $8.81 at May monthly close. If you had $5,000 invested in bitcoin back then, you would have had  567.53BTC. Some simple math tells you that your $5,000 worth of bitcoin would now be worth over $15,000,000.
I think it’s safe to say that regarding inflation, long term bitcoin HODLING fixes this. Returns are naturally getting smaller as bitcoin gets more mainstream but it still beats inflation by far when HODLING long term.

God bless your soul and you really took your time.to break everything down for op and it seems op was getting the concept of bitcoin pizza day wrong and for for the sake of correction, the bitcoin pizza day was in some sort of commensuration to the first official purchase using bitcoin  as a mode of payment and it wasn't in any form expected to regulate the prices of pizza.

And just as @DeathAngel has already mentioned,  and analyzed to you, bitcoin  will help fight inflation if you are a long term holder because if younste to hodl bitcoin  let say about $100 at a price of 20k and along the line, the price rises to over 60k which Invariably means that you're making 3× of your initial  deposit  and no matter the price of commodities by them, you wouldn't be directly affected.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: avikz on June 08, 2023, 01:08:48 PM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

In 15 years we have inflated 3x.

In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.

Bitcoin can't fix inflation because bitcoin is not built to do so. Bitcoin is built to become an internet based currency system, not to fix inflation or economy related issues.

Economy usually resets itself when it goes beyond control. A great reset is incoming and buy as much gold and bitcoin as you can to save yourself.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Artemis3 on June 08, 2023, 01:10:46 PM
I experienced inflation of... The fiat here lost 14 zeroes in the span of a decade, still ongoing, it slowed down somewhat after the economy was flattened at the bottom. I should have gone to bitcoin when things were only starting, its too late after that. There is no time to react when it happens, do it now while you can.

Inflation always starts slow, and progresses logarithmically.

3 times is what, 300%? peanuts.

Its simple, don't keep fiat. Exchange it for bitcoin or anything you can sell later, even bricks are worth more than fiat. No money in banks either, you will lose all of it or its purchasing power. No exchanges, you never know when those fail or the State seizes it. Not Your Keys, Not Your Coins...

The State is there to squeeze the wealth out of you, one way or another. You can only liberate yourselves with Bitcoin. Inflation is the worst tax, it affects the poor most because they don't usually keep wealth invested in things like properties or luxury items they could sell later if things get bad...

And it doesn't matter if bitcoin price goes up or not, don't do it like a "get rich" scheme. Here the important thing is that fiat is designed to lose value, so bitcoin doesn't have to go up when everything else around it is going down. It does goes up from time to time from the people who perceive it as it is: a way to liberate themselves from the State. Speculating traders may push the price up and down a bit in the market, but long term the tendency is clear: the opposite of fiat.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: uneng on June 08, 2023, 03:13:04 PM
Bitcoin fix this in the sense the more money you save (in BTC currency), more pizzas you will be able to acquire on long term, while when saving fiat currency, the less pizzas you are going to be able to buy futurely

This is only applicable if Bitcoin continuously move in an uptrend path.  But once Bitcoin meet its APEX and prize stabilized, it can be affected by inflation in one way or another.
Taking Bitcoin's history in consideration so far, the uptrend path is the most likely scenario on long term. Moreover, since fiat's inflation is unstoppable and it never stops being printed by central banks, why would Bitcoin stabilize at some point? Compared to fiat's price, Bitcoin will move upside continuously , as it maintains its supply fixed and consequently its value preserved, while fiat gets constantly devalued within time.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: kaseygriffin on June 08, 2023, 03:23:52 PM
Bitcoin, as a decentralized cryptocurrency, has no inherent ability to fix a country's inflation or set a minimum wage. Bitcoin operates independently of any government or central authority, and its main function is to provide a decentralized payment system and store of value. The cost of living in a country is affected by many factors, including economic policy, currency devaluation, supply and demand dynamics, and overall economic stability. While Bitcoin can provide people with a way to store value and potentially hedge against inflation, it is not a comprehensive solution to the macroeconomic problems facing countries. face. Remember that the government plays an important role in managing economic policies, including setting minimum wages, controlling inflation, and promoting economic growth. These responsibilities go beyond the scope of Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Ucy on June 08, 2023, 04:13:15 PM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.     .   .   .   .

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

In 15 years we have inflated 3x.

In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some **** mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.


The problem is with fiat currency and its system. With the system, they can secretly/privately print whatever amount they want and the money is overspent or spent unnecessarily on things that don't deserve the amount of money they are given.

With Bitcoin, money is printed transparently and given to people who deserve or work hard for them and the money is valued and not usually overspent or spent unnecessarily, and this also contribute to Bitcoin increasing in both price and value encouraging people to hold more & making the price to increase more & more.



Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: m2017 on June 08, 2023, 05:47:53 PM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

In 15 years we have inflated 3x.

In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.
For 15 years, inflation has grown 3 times, and how many times has bitcoin grown over these years? Even if we neglect the initial years, when it cost almost 0$ (then the growth will be just crazy) and consider even the last 10 years, 5 years, then bitcoin has risen in price more than 3 times. Consequently, those who kept their wealth in btc not only compensated for inflation, but even increased their capital. You kept in money - and what did you get? Loss of value and purchasing power of saved money.

What more explanation do you need? If you are not ready to understand and accept this, then you will continue to ask how bitcoin fix this.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: BlackHatCoiner on June 08, 2023, 08:14:08 PM
Agree, but wages have grown even if we go by the median
Maybe in the private sector, but not in the public of my country. Relatives of mine are teachers and have only got a raise of 20% in the last 10 years. They do private lessons to make a living. This isn't limited to teachers, many wages of the public sector have stayed still. Since we entered the third memorandum in Greece, things don't go well. We're continuously in a crisis since 2008. And now with this inflation? Fuck.

But, the thing is that when finally we got rid of communism inflation was rampant around here, we were dirt poor compared to the rest of the world, we had basically nothing, no jobs, no healthcare, no nothing
You've probably experienced worse times than I have, but it doesn't change the fact that 10% inflation, among all other problems, is a significant economic decline.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: darkangel11 on June 08, 2023, 08:27:16 PM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

So your minimum wage went up 3x and so did the cost of a pizza and you're asking how bitcoin fixes it...
If you bought bitcoin in the last bear market and held until today, you'd have made 6.5x (4k lows to 26k now). I feel like bitcoin fixes it pretty well. In the same period of time holding fiat money would mean a loss of at least 5% a year, so 20% in the last 4 years while bitcoin holders were making money.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Cookdata on June 08, 2023, 08:37:20 PM
A pizza now cost a full days wages when I first started working.  We need to hang the politicians and central bankers.

Min wage was $5.50 when I started it is $16.50 now.

In 15 years we have inflated 3x.

In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.

I know right! Poor humans that are controlled by hooligan's democratic system of government policy, the poor, and inflation are inseparable because there is never in history that inflation has ever taken a rest, it always goes up every day, and yet the government keeps printing the same paper every day without thinking of another solution that will eliminate inflation, the only thing they want to understand is cash without any alternatives; why create a value when it doesn't have anything that backs it.  :-\

It is not an assurance but in 3 years to come, Bitcoin will triple after halving if we are to predict how the cycle has always been after the halving and that is why it is always the best to put your money in Bitcoin, it may not be all to mitigate the risk of fall but always have some of your assets in Bitcoin, it is the best assets out there that has beaten inflation over the years.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: kro55 on June 09, 2023, 02:42:06 AM
Bitcoin cannot solve or fix the inflation of the national or world economy, as long as the government continues to print money unchecked, inflation will continue to soar in the future. But bitcoin as an asset is resistant to inflation due to its limited supply and value increasing over time.
So you can use bitcoin to fight inflation your way. Instead of saving in fiat, allocate some to bitcoin, and if bitcoin continues to grow in the future, at least your money won't be eaten away by inflation.

My view may be the same where Bitcoin can become one of the instruments that individuals use to protect the value of their wealth from the effects of inflation. For example, rather than keeping all of the money in fiat currency, one might consider allocating some to Bitcoin. If Bitcoin continues to grow in the future, at least the value of the money won't be eroded by inflation and this needs to be underlined Bitcoin can provide protection against inflation on an individual scale, improvement of inflation as a whole requires broader action, including economic policies implemented by governments and financial institutions at the national and international levels.


Honestly, with population growth and so many problems going on with our society and government, there is no optimal solution other than to print money every time something happens, the collapse of our economy is only a matter of time. Instead of trying to solve the inflation of our country or the world, we should focus on finding ways to protect ourselves and our families from the inflation of the economy. Nowadays, jobs and fiat are no longer a guarantee for us, we should find other solutions, and indeed, bitcoin is a possible solution to personal inflation. I hope people will understand and see the potential of bitcoin.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: Mauser on June 10, 2023, 06:15:17 AM
In another 15 years a pizza will cost $100.

how does bitcoin fix this?

inb4 some idiot mentions the bitcoin pizza and does not realize the price of that pizza still went up as well.


That is very like   with the high inflation rates we have right now, there is not really an end in sight for the price increases. Even if the inflation slows down to only 6-7%, its still going to be devastating effects for the average person a few years down the road.  It's important for us to invest our money and not leave it in savings an account at the bank. The bank is never going to pay enough money to fully compensate us for the inflation. One way to try and beat inflation is crypto currencies. With bitcoins the main idea is that the supply is limited, we have halvings every 4 years that reduces the new amount of bitcoins being mined in the next 4 years. That means that the long term price trend of bitcoin is upwards, as the miners will require higher prices in the future for their hardware and electricity costs. 


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: jossiel on June 10, 2023, 07:49:15 AM
I wouldn't say that. Yes, it devalues due to inflation but it's not worthless when you still need to buy your stuff.
It’s worthless if you keep it, I wanted to say. You can’t hold on to USD because it’ll just devalue due to inflation. You lose purchasing power. It sucks.
It's true and that's what really happens but it's not really worthless at all, we convert btc to usd and to other fiat and that's why there's the process and use of it.

Well said, a real asset that can be hedge against inflation.
Can be, sometimes. If your financial situation sucks and you get to buy Bitcoin in 2021 with all your life savings as a hedge against inflation, you’re screwed. It so far resembled a very very good investment over long term. But reality shows that while its price increased many many times, when economy goes bad Bitcoin gets pretty shaken and destabilized.
That's true and another mistake that has been done by many, I saw people done it on 2017 and then 2018 has came and that was a long bear market.

But those that understands that bitcoin is truly a good asset that can defeat inflation, you know what you are in.


Title: Re: 3x inflation in my life time (Im 30) does bitcoin fix this?
Post by: SyndicateLabs on June 10, 2023, 08:13:39 AM
Sometimes in life we ​​always want fair things to appear to us, but the truth is that it is proven through the efforts of each person. There are things in common for everyone to overcome together, the problem it dominates us or our control over it also needs to be recognized. I don't want to blame any of the problems but just want to accept the fact that it is and will continue or may be different, adapting and not being affected by social change is what what we need to do in life, we simply can't let someone give us food forever, let's do everything ourselves and accept it happily.