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I just discovered nutildah thread  (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5464370.msg62740255#msg62740255) about merit in WO. But it is now locked.

I made this network chart about 3 years ago and didn't updated it anymore. I just updated it now with today's data (using LoyceV website data)


https://www.talkimg.com/images/2023/09/14/6REBo.png
https://public.flourish.studio/visualisation/5379872 (https://public.flourish.studio/visualisation/5379872/)

I just updated it, as I believe people who are looking into those merits may find it useful

You can just click any dot (user) to see who merited who, and how much they received.

Took me a while but I did find my dot pretty good work on your part to make it.

You don't need to worry because I found your dot for you.

Here you go:

https://i.ibb.co/Bqn1dmL/Phil.jpg

This analysis of the bitmover data is very interesting. Good job.


I would like to take this opportunity to leave the link to the file I created, which lists the merits sent and received. It does not detail the origin, just the list of who gave and who received, merits in the WO.
File: https://1drv.ms/x/s!AuWqcTrLK_TciKVm8Z0GKtmpF1rBpQ?e=qyx6gP (https://1drv.ms/x/s!AuWqcTrLK_TciKVm8Z0GKtmpF1rBpQ?e=qyx6gP)

Wow, really nice, is there a map for global merit transactions, I think we could form a planet and identify third world, rich and poor countries ( forums, boards ) and of course finding the infamous 1% rich having 99% of resources.😂

It looked like it was very hard to made! I'm pretty sure it was. Can you please elaborate how you did it? It made me quite interesting.

[BTW it looks like, spider webs from spiderman across the spider verse  ;D ]

Managed to find myself quite quickly  :)

The trick is to move to smaller circles from those that have more merit received than you, and towards members who have sent/received merit.  Is there a way to enable a zoom into this visualisation? Ideally with this and labels it'd show a more complete picture. It's interesting to see though, there are still members I've never heard of who have received hundreds of merit it's ironic.

Thanks

I used pandas , a python library,  to organize LoyceV data. This was the most troubled part. Then I just put data into flourish studio.

Years ago, DdmrDdmr built it for his merit dashboard but after a few months, that platform or package stopped supporting it. He wrote about reasons why he stopped it on his Merit dashboard.

Previously, I thought you did it directly on Flourish studio and wanted to learn it myself but at the end, it is only where you published it. More works behind the scene need to be done and I don't have skills for it.

I saw it on 1miau's merit source application too and he used Google Fusion table (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5158075.0).

I wonder if inspect element can be used to find the exact circle that corresponds with someone's username? For example, if you were looking for a username among the circles. I can do a search and find instances of members' usernames but my knowledge of inspect element is limited. Perhaps one knows a way to get it to point or highlight the exact circle you are looking for.

I believe this is mostly a limitation of the flourish package
I think it was designed for a few dozens of nodes, at most. There are thousands of nodes (users) in this view... A search tool or something like that would be nice.

I will see if I can find configurations to improve the visualization

Yup, this definitely paints a new light on what nutildah was talking about.

Nice job with this data visualization.

Something should definitely be done. I suggest 0.1x all sMerits ever exchanged in the WO thread, rounded down to the nearest unit. Then, appropriate sMerits should then go to merit sources, to provide more appropriately. (whether this applies to user profile Merit count is another topic).

WO is a thread for price discussion and fun. It's not meant to disrupt merit distribution. A one-time fix should be enough to recirculate merits to more appropriate places. If they recirculate there, then so be it and let it be.

This opinion has changed since my post in nutildah's thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5464370.msg62740622#msg62740622). There I basically said anyone can merit whoever they want/as they see fit. Though after seeing the numbers, I see the problem a lot more clearly.

Watching on.

---

btw op, the link to nutildah's thread in the OP is broken. It leads to this url currently:

should lead to

Honestly looking at the numbers, they clearly prove that there is no problem. Although individually there is the feeling that many are taking advantage of themselves to obtain merits in the WO, the reality is not quite like that.

Looking at the numbers, those who received the most merits in this topic (the top100) are users who do not need to hunt for merits, as they have many merits coming from their excellent collaboration on the forum.

I believe that there may be one or two cases of users who obtained some advantage in these merits. But, I don't see it as being something significant that justifies the idea of the problem presented.

Anyway, this is my analysis based on the numbers collected.

Thank you. Just fixed.

About a possible merit abuse , I believe WO is almost a board on its own. I think too many merits circulate there and maybe there are  probably too many merit sources. But I don't think this is a problem. Meta is also a board with lots of merit sources, and a lot of merit circulation, but it isn't  so easy to abuse in neither board imo.

I don't think anyone should intervene or make changes to how people distribute merits. I don't think I have ever posted in that thread and I don't get me merits there, but it's not my problem how they merit each other, why, and how much. It's only a problem if there are merit sources selling their merits or creating some sort of exchange groups. I doubt theymos would intervene for anything else. If someone finds memes, humor, sarcasm, or tragedy merit-worthy, I don't think we should ask why that is. 

Perhaps the merit obtained in WO should be expressed differently on each profile page (I believe that this would be possible with the BPIP browser extension). This would make it easier to distinguish those with "easy" merits and it would be much easier to point the finger at them during every discussion.

The numbers of merits involved in WO are quite staggering. Now that some campaign managers are looking at the number of merits received by prospective participants to set a pay rate for particular campaigns, this is something they might possibly overlook. Having a two-tier merit display though useful to some degree will probably not be implemented as many would argue the need to not distinguish where the merits were received.

That is something completely different, and the campaign managers together with the clients they represent have the right to determine their own rules. I am not sure if LoyceV's or some other tools can be used to easily display where the members have received their merits. That way, if managers don't want to count WO merits, they know how to do it. It's similar to how they get to decide the boards where the posts won't count for the weekly quota.

I just don't feel like the forum and the moderators should intervene and make their own subjective changes by saying we don't like you getting merits in the WO thread so we will now cancel them or perform any other changes. If the WO thread, its posts, and merit sharing are problems, just lock it. But they haven't done that.   

WO remains (effectively) unmoderated and posts and merits flow as they do without restriction or censor and it seems that status will not change. WO will not be locked and it will continue under the current rules for a long time to come.

I would not be in favour of a two-tier merit display system. If campaign managers will look at the number if merits received by applicants as a condition of acceptance or increased payment, they can discover the source of the merits if it is important to them or their clients.

As per the excellent now locked thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5464370.0) where discussion about merits in WO was initiated, various suggestions were put forward. If theymos took steps to either cap/limit merits based on various criteria then on specific threads then that might make a lot of members unhappy because the poll in that thread resulted in 97 votes of which 59 were against disabling merits in WO and only 38 were in favour.

This is great. Thanks for doing this. I'm guessing the unconnected dots means those accounts received merits from accounts that never received merits in the WO...

I don't mean to be bothersome but is there any chance to make this type of chart for merit sent in the WO thread (as opposed to received)? If its too much work, which is understandable, its no problem.


This is a pretty clear demonstration of what a madman El_Duderino is  :D

For some reason JJG sending merits to spammers for shitposts bothers me more, but to be fair the spammers also suck up to the Dude almost as frequently. Pretty easy to see why... They can't help themselves.. the thought of juicy, bountiful merits overcomes their sensibilities.

That's more something for Ninjastic.space (https://ninjastic.space/user/id/112493?merits) to add. You can suggest it here (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5464142.0).

As far as I know, the closest to what you are looking for can be found in Merit Dashboard (https://public.tableau.com/shared/45JJS32ZQ?:display_count=n&:origin=viz_share_link), but it only shows in which boards boards you got the merit, not the specific threads (or even child boards) so I am not sure how useful could be in this case.

I can do it. I will post here in a few days.

I will try to add something to filter users on the visualisation.  I need to explore flourish a little further

All these (and some previous) discussions were started in order to examine the justification of using merit in the WO thread. If you are already dealing with these statistics, wouldn't it be more interesting to see how much of the earned merits come from the WO thread in relation to the total number of merits earned? At least for the most active users.
Or maybe such statistics already exist somewhere  :-\

Here you go @nutildah


https://www.talkimg.com/images/2023/09/19/6Vdwl.png (https://public.flourish.studio/story/2034376/)
https://public.flourish.studio/story/2034376/

All data from LoyceV (https://loyce.club/)



I can do something like an extension or just a table... i will take a look later.

I have   6357
I had     1000 air dropped
I earned 1736 on wo

so 3621 earned elsewhere.

and the dot chart may be out of date a bit it shows the 1736 from wo I am more say 1800 as a guess.

so say

6357
1000 air dropped
5357 actually given to me
1800 maybe and not 1736 wo
3557 elsewhere.

This seems to be a very cool project! Maybe I understand more about it in the future.
A idiot question but what means Merit in WO?
But thanks for this so far  :)

I assume that you know what merit is (in case you don't (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2766177.0)), and "WO" is an abbreviation of a very well known speculation thread Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=178336.0), therefore this topic is about merit shared there.

I think that merit is not be part of WO people but sharing merits on enjoyable every moment, likely some think is different but more time passed in WO enjoy, fun, discussion & sharing knowledge.

I personally enjoy the moment with more people also some popular people like @philipma1957, @JayJuanGee, @El duderino_, @Biodom, @xhomerx10, @jojo69, @Hueristic, @nutildah and another more people are making interesting moment continue.

This is a very entertaining way to see the merit history. Also, 4995 was bugging me. So I made it 5k  ;D
 Congratulations on being on the 5k milestone bitmover. 

https://i.postimg.cc/7ZfgFw10/screenshot-281.png (https://postimages.org/)

Wow I'm also part of this WO gang with 1555 merits :)

https://i.ibb.co/khtL1Y8/image.png

I think the lines and connection means where the merits are coming from? For example in my case El duderino_ and JayJuanGee are feeding me a lot :D




Wow this map is more interesting for me... look the the dude oh boy 33,162 merits sent only in WO...

Finally found my self after going thought almost all of the dots

https://i.ibb.co/vLxh83Z/image.png

To put in words:

I earned : 1555 merits from WO
I accumulated : 1555/2 = 777 sMerits
I sent : 324 merits sent back to WO

Thank you bitmover for sharing this.


You are right WO is a different place... it's true many new comers come to the party to get some "easy" merits but they fade away pretty soon.

All those names you mention no doubt are the show runners but forgot you to mention one name which is ruling the party now............... it's ChartBuddy :)

I remember some years ago, back in 2018, I was desperate thinking about panic selling in a bottom. I was losing some money.

some colleagues from WO gang advised me not to sell and I was able to hold on more calmly. I am very thankful for WO thread, and I always read the comments from time to time.