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Bitcoin => Bitcoin Discussion => Topic started by: BlackBoss_ on January 10, 2024, 02:06:43 AM



Title: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: BlackBoss_ on January 10, 2024, 02:06:43 AM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.

Within several minutes, SEC. and their hoax triggered both Long liquidation and Short liquidation in Bitcoin market. It's a big opportunity for people to learn and understand risk of Leverage, Futures trading and if they absorb it well, they can protect their capital better and won't lose money like those people who were Long liquidated or Short liquidated hours ago.

What's the hoax?

SEC Grants Approval For Bitcoin ETFs -- HOAX (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5481016.0)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GDb7Yk6WsAA7xOo?format=jpg&name=900x900 (https://twitter.com/therationalroot/status/1706255966801416554)
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GDcDQH9XUAIMrNg?format=jpg&name=900x900 (https://twitter.com/therationalroot/status/1744867095504884211)


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Ben Barubal on January 10, 2024, 03:28:15 AM
   In such cases, it is really good to know, if you also know yourself, that there is not enough knowledge of trading in cryptocurrency. Don't force yourself to make a profit in trading without thinking deeply about it.

   We are in the bull season, and this is not the time to rush to get profit in the short term, so long-term is advisable to do for now, and it is okay to do short-term if you have a deep understanding of crypto trading activity.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Yamane_Keto on January 10, 2024, 03:56:59 AM
When you trade with leverage, you are already aware of the losses that come from it, and if you are not prepared, it is better to trade via spot and place buy and sell orders according to the levels of support and resistance and stay away from trading according to news and leaks, which appear to be of poor quality in cryptocurrencies trading. price did not move very negatively so it is a lesson you should learn and it is not an expensive lesson.



Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: moneystery on January 10, 2024, 04:17:28 AM
futures trading is actually made for people who want to make quick profits but don't want the hassle of investing. it's quite risky because the higher leverage means the faster someone's capital can be lost when they miscalculate their position. but the problem is that most futures traders are beginners who want to make quick profits in the market and ignore the risk that when they trade futures they can risk margin calls when they are in a losing position.

it is much better to trade on spot, where one can trade calmly and there are no margin calls. even when they experience a loss, if they can patiently hold the asset, they can recover the loss and can profit if the price of the bitcoin they hold increases more.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: mk4 on January 10, 2024, 04:21:45 AM
Even without the recent fake news Tweet, bitcoin/crypto has *expectedly* been extra volatile lately. Yesterday we literally just had a scam wick down to $45,700, then immediately bounced back up.

When in shaky situations like this, using leverage(or at least high leverage), seems like suicide.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: ancafe on January 10, 2024, 05:26:17 AM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.
Doing nothing can make things work normally compared to trying to enter amounts in a leveraged or futures trade. It's about who can survive, not about how to produce and it's more about the basics of not being provoked by existing deceptions.

Within several minutes, SEC. and their hoax triggered both Long liquidation and Short liquidation in Bitcoin market. It's a big opportunity for people to learn and understand risk of Leverage, Futures trading and if they absorb it well, they can protect their capital better and won't lose money like those people who were Long liquidated or Short liquidated hours ago.
That's why we are more comfortable holding compared to engaging in trading, because perhaps not everyone understands the pattern and overall it can be learned. This is the closest case that might be an illustration of how prices can change so quickly without starting a deeper correction and if someone moves based on slightly wrong knowledge then there is a break in losses by selling on the decline process.

Though this need not be the case if one understands how the price fluctuation rate and the ESC give approval to a bitcoin ETF and everyone can say as a lie now and perhaps this is more of a ploy to stimulate some people. I don't care about that now because holding would be much more profitable and much safer.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Oshosondy on January 10, 2024, 06:29:50 AM
Within several minutes, SEC. and their hoax triggered both Long liquidation and Short liquidation in Bitcoin market.
Definitely you are not a trader if you are just noticing this.

I can say that holding is better than trading, but the volatility that you are talking about was not that much. Bitcoin did not fall more than $2300. It only dropped to $44700.

Can you remember the volatility before that time that occur like a week or two weeks ago? Bitcoin decreased by $4500 to $4600 when it fall from $45700 to $40200.

Also in the past, we have seen much volatility before several time. It is not about not using leverage at all but not to use too much leverage.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: EarnOnVictor on January 10, 2024, 08:38:22 AM
From the onset, holding has always been the conservative way of trading/investing, you do not leverage anything so the risk is minimal. This is unlike futures trading which could be traded on the leverage, thereby increasing the risk involved so as the potential gains. Future trading is not so bad either, it only depends on the plan of the trader towards it, and even without much trading experience, since we are in the bullish season of Bitcoin now, those who want to use the option of futures trading should plan it better. If you open a trade and your liquidation risk is reasonable, you will be good to go and a situation like the one we experienced yesterday will not affect you. The market itself is risky, so it is all about your good plan and also factors of safety.

I can't imagine myself trading Bitcoin in futures and not having at least a $5000 liquidation gap. This is the mistake many people make, they are too careless about these liquidation plans due to greed of wanting to make more money. For instance, I can buy Bitcoin at $40,000 easily in futures trading and plan my liquidation price to be $35,000. If you are not even a good trader, such has been planned in such a way that the risk of liquidation is very little, and with a little trading experience, you can continue to make money more than as though you traded with spots trading. The main thing is for you to get the trend right. This is smartness to me.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Minor Miner on January 10, 2024, 09:02:39 AM
It depends on each market moment. Of course, in sensitive times like these, holding is much safer than trading. But if 1 or 2 months ago when the market increased strongly, it would be a waste if we just held and ignored the trade. As you can see, in the past 2 months, almost the entire market has recovered very well and if someone took advantage of that, they would have increased their capital significantly.

Holding or trading has its advantages and disadvantages, it all depends on the strategy and skills of each investor. Not everyone who holds will always be a winner and those who trade will always be losers.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: criptoevangelista on January 10, 2024, 10:44:32 AM
Operating a leveraged trade in cryptocurrencies has a huge risk of losing all your capital, this type of movement is very common and to be able to win a trade like this is practically a lottery, it requires luck or having privileged information

In short: never operate leveraged, Especially in times of extreme speculation like what we are experiencing now


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Briankimp1 on January 10, 2024, 12:10:00 PM
I believe whoever’s going into trading should have an understanding of what he/she is getting into particularly on futures it’s more or less a lucky adventure which if I’d advice anyone I’ll tell them not to do so with all of their capital cause it’s way too risky so are the rewards very high just like a get rich quick scheme
I would rather take my chances holding.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Assface16678 on January 10, 2024, 01:10:06 PM
And that is the mistake of some beginners in trading, they think that trading will be easy and trading aimless and of course manipulating the leverage which is a very risky thing. Also in futures, yes doing futures will give you a big reward or profit, if only you've done it right or your analysis is correct but also as they say, greatest reward cones with a big risk so if you don't know how to do futures better stay out of it or your money will be burn instantly. I once done this, trading with high leverage because I don't know what is it for and tries once futures and didn't go well so I learned in the hard way, That's why here I am more on holding coins especially bitcoin, I do trading sometimes if I'm very sure with my analysis and decision, while in futures I stay out of it for good. Hold that's the only way a beginner could earn in a long run.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Aanuoluwatofunmi on January 10, 2024, 01:15:56 PM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.

Within several minutes, SEC. and their hoax triggered both Long liquidation and Short liquidation in Bitcoin market. It's a big opportunity for people to learn and understand risk of Leverage, Futures trading and if they absorb it well, they can protect their capital better and won't lose money like those people who were Long liquidated or Short liquidated hours ago.

What's the hoax?

SEC Grants Approval For Bitcoin ETFs -- HOAX (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5481016.0)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GDb7Yk6WsAA7xOo?format=jpg&name=900x900 (https://twitter.com/therationalroot/status/1706255966801416554)
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GDcDQH9XUAIMrNg?format=jpg&name=900x900 (https://twitter.com/therationalroot/status/1744867095504884211)

With the level of how far we have gone with Bitcoin adoption, trading and other activities related to cryptocurrencies, I will only advise that investors should take off their mind from what had been expected of the SEC for approval of Bitcoin ETF, one thing that we are seeming to be forgetting is that they may have this done anytime sooner than the way we all expected that they made the approval on the 10th of January, this may be possible and may not be possible because they have their own encounters and challenges as well fostering the acceptance of this ETFs, what we can concentrate on should be the halving.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: BlackBoss_ on January 10, 2024, 01:24:59 PM
When in shaky situations like this, using leverage(or at least high leverage), seems like suicide.
They want to get profit but don't know they are doing suicide.

Two days ago Vitalik posted (https://twitter.com/VitalikButerin/status/1743991285214527532) an uncommon post because he barely posts with financial advice.
Quote
This is awful advice. Some actual financial advice:

* Diversification is good.
* Save. Get to the point where you have enough to cover multiple years of expenses. Financial safety is freedom.
* Be boring with most of your portfolio.
* Don't use >2x leverage. Just don't.
I really agree with you and Vitalik that use leverage is risky and like suicide. Don't use is better.

Also in the past, we have seen much volatility before several time. It is not about not using leverage at all but not to use too much leverage.
I know Bitcoin has many bigger red candles but the result is if you get a liquidation, you did a bad trading position and 5%, 10% or 20% will not be a concern the market hits a liquidation price of your open position.



Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: kentrolla on January 10, 2024, 01:35:04 PM
I would say leverage and future trading is not for everyone as you can lose it all at a blink but we shouldn't underestimate the profits as well. I would term it as a gamble or mix of gamble, strategy and luck. I would urge people to refrain from future trading with leverages unless they are an expert into it. It's scary to see how people have lost and liquidation numbers on both long and short, has it been some other altcoins we could have considered it as business as usual but not with Bitcoin.

Better for newbie or someone with not so much experience to avoid leverage.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: dunfida on January 10, 2024, 06:43:42 PM
When you trade with leverage, you are already aware of the losses that come from it, and if you are not prepared, it is better to trade via spot and place buy and sell orders according to the levels of support and resistance and stay away from trading according to news and leaks, which appear to be of poor quality in cryptocurrencies trading. price did not move very negatively so it is a lesson you should learn and it is not an expensive lesson.


Totally really that impossible that you wont really be knowing about those risks even if we do say that you are noob but since you are really that touching up futures or high leverage trades then you are really that prone to great risks.Weve seen that recent price manipulation which happened recently on which it would really be that so damn risky if you do put up yourself on making that long position due to that high percentage
approval of ETF on which the news is almost everywhere but it did really end up on having that huge red candle and suddenly those hacking news incidents did really come out on which it did liquidate
tons who do have that long position, but for those who do make out some short then they did make money on that.

Futures trading isnt recommended into those traders who do have just recently learn up trading or even into those who had known trading unless if you do have that
sufficient trading skills then you might have a chance on taking some shot on futures but if not then it would be always better that you should really be setting
yourself that idle in speaking about dealing up with future trades.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: coolcoinz on January 10, 2024, 08:33:03 PM
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GDb7Yk6WsAA7xOo?format=jpg&name=900x900 (https://twitter.com/therationalroot/status/1706255966801416554)[/center]

If the timeline for this is correct, it's obvious that some insiders knew that this was fake, which is why a very large dump occurred minutes after the announcement. It's possible that some of the people involved in the ETFs knew when the decision was to be announced. I'm pretty sure they have Gensler on speed dial.

-Hey, Gary, It's Larry. Did you post the approval on Twitter today? We thought you were going to announce tomorrow.
-No, it wasn't me.
-OK, thanks.


https://www.talkimg.com/images/2024/01/10/sipJm.jpeg


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: stadus on January 10, 2024, 08:34:43 PM
Even without the recent fake news Tweet, bitcoin/crypto has *expectedly* been extra volatile lately. Yesterday we literally just had a scam wick down to $45,700, then immediately bounced back up.

When in shaky situations like this, using leverage(or at least high leverage), seems like suicide.
It’s always safer to hold most especially when bitcoin price seems very unstable. While using leverage can easily increase the profits, but having this kind of strategy is absolutely not a smart move particularly for beginners. But then again, it’s up for an individual hodler how to balance his investment, but not putting it being compromised. With or without fake news, bitcoin has always been volatile, so always be cautious with your bitcoin investment.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: hatshepsut93 on January 10, 2024, 09:53:53 PM
The best way to trade if to do long-term trades that follow the cycle. Buying during bear market, selling during bull market. Instead of buying during dips and trying to sell tips and repeat this process in a span of weeks or even days. That's surely a good way to lose money quick, because of how unpredictable Bitcoin is in short term.

Just hodling is not a bad idea, but I regret not selling close to ATH and buying back at the bottom. Two times I got greedy and expected a way higher ATH than what actually happened. Hopefully this time I won't make such mistake.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: mirakal on January 10, 2024, 10:59:23 PM
It depends on each market moment. Of course, in sensitive times like these, holding is much safer than trading. But if 1 or 2 months ago when the market increased strongly, it would be a waste if we just held and ignored the trade. As you can see, in the past 2 months, almost the entire market has recovered very well and if someone took advantage of that, they would have increased their capital significantly.

Holding or trading has its advantages and disadvantages, it all depends on the strategy and skills of each investor. Not everyone who holds will always be a winner and those who trade will always be losers.
Certainly, there’s always a perfect time when to hold and when to trade. You cannot just trade when you see the market is very unstable, just like you can’t just continue hodling when you see others are already trading in profits. So there’s always the best time when to take advantage from hodling and trading, but as long as when you consider trading even for small profits, I still think your action is valid knowing you still end up with profits.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: GreatArkansas on January 10, 2024, 11:09:38 PM
https://i.imgflip.com/8bxxfj.jpg

When you realized everything happened was staged and planned :D

I don't believe that they were hacked at all. For sure, they did that so they would able to buy more cheap Bitcoins before announcing a legit approval of ETF.
After ETF was approved, we didn't see any huge pump compared to before, it seems people already knew. It's kinda buy the news, sell the rumors.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: SeriouslyGiveaway on January 11, 2024, 01:47:43 AM
Within several minutes, SEC. and their hoax triggered both Long liquidation and Short liquidation in Bitcoin market. It's a big opportunity for people to learn and understand risk of Leverage, Futures trading and if they absorb it well, they can protect their capital better and won't lose money like those people who were Long liquidated or Short liquidated hours ago.
This is the downside of news-based trading. It's also the trap set by market makers and exchanges to liquidate existing positions in the market to legitimize pushing the price or initiating the next short sale. The market has been incredibly chaotic in recent days with ETF news, but it's hard to accept the reason for the SEC's X account - a seemingly primitive excuse for the largest U.S. regulatory body to be hacked. The blatant manipulation and pricing tricks of those behind the scenes are disgusting. It's tough for news traders right now, personally, I choose to stay on the sidelines and not trade during this chaotic period.

For those holders, this could be seen as a shakeout, take coins from the weak hands. I believe many people had to sell off during this period if they were glued to market developments continuously. Stay calm; otherwise, we'll become easy prey for the sharks.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Jaycoinz on January 11, 2024, 02:15:18 AM

When you realized everything happened was staged and planned :D

I don't believe that they were hacked at all. For sure, they did that so they would able to buy more cheap Bitcoins before announcing a legit approval of ETF.
After ETF was approved, we didn't see any huge pump compared to before, it seems people already knew. It's kinda buy the news, sell the rumors.
And I thought I was the only one thinking such, this long drama of SEC pending the ETF approval for me was just a mirage as the update was sure to come, it was just a matter of time before everything start and plays out. Unlike last time when the market skyrocket this time like you said had already been played out it and people were much in anticipation but already knew the whatsup already and was just a pending official announcement holding and after that nothing much seeing that the news has already utilized ever since.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Minor Miner on January 11, 2024, 02:52:21 AM
It depends on each market moment. Of course, in sensitive times like these, holding is much safer than trading. But if 1 or 2 months ago when the market increased strongly, it would be a waste if we just held and ignored the trade. As you can see, in the past 2 months, almost the entire market has recovered very well and if someone took advantage of that, they would have increased their capital significantly.

Holding or trading has its advantages and disadvantages, it all depends on the strategy and skills of each investor. Not everyone who holds will always be a winner and those who trade will always be losers.
Certainly, there’s always a perfect time when to hold and when to trade. You cannot just trade when you see the market is very unstable, just like you can’t just continue hodling when you see others are already trading in profits. So there’s always the best time when to take advantage from hodling and trading, but as long as when you consider trading even for small profits, I still think your action is valid knowing you still end up with profits.

In my opinion, we should be flexible and balance between trading and holding, should not be too rigid, we should just always hold and say no to trading or always trade but not hold. Because the market will have different phases, there will be a period when it is good to hold and a period when it is very easy to profit from short-term trading. We should take advantage to optimize our capital whenever we have the opportunity. But trading is riskier than holding so it is important that we allocate capital properly. Don't mix the two together, we will be in trouble if the market does not behave as we expected.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: BlackBoss_ on January 11, 2024, 02:54:09 AM
When you realized everything happened was staged and planned :D

I don't believe that they were hacked at all. For sure, they did that so they would able to buy more cheap Bitcoins before announcing a legit approval of ETF.
After ETF was approved, we didn't see any huge pump compared to before, it seems people already knew. It's kinda buy the news, sell the rumors.
So now, they returned with an uncompromising announcement about approvals for all 11 Bitcoin Spot ETF applications.

The market reacts in not to much interesting way, no pump and no dump. Some people were right that news about Bitcoin Spot ETFs were already reflected in Bitcoin price recent months. They are right now that Bitcoin won't get an instant pump because of Bitcoin Spot ETF approval from SEC.

In long term, Bitcoin will increase in value and price. Halving in April. Institutional investors from Wall Street will bring their huge capital to this market, to buy bitcoin through Bitcoin Spot ETFs in the USA.

It's time to hold bitcoins and do nothing, just hold it.

Will SEC and Gensler be accused because of their news manipulation in court?


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: EarnOnVictor on January 12, 2024, 03:13:07 AM

When you realized everything happened was staged and planned :D

I don't believe that they were hacked at all. For sure, they did that so they would able to buy more cheap Bitcoins before announcing a legit approval of ETF.
After ETF was approved, we didn't see any huge pump compared to before, it seems people already knew. It's kinda buy the news, sell the rumors.
And I thought I was the only one thinking such, this long drama of SEC pending the ETF approval for me was just a mirage as the update was sure to come, it was just a matter of time before everything start and plays out. Unlike last time when the market skyrocket this time like you said had already been played out it and people were much in anticipation but already knew the whatsup already and was just a pending official announcement holding and after that nothing much seeing that the news has already utilized ever since.
Experience traders/investors would have known what would have happened, this is not new, rumours and fake news could at times be more potent than actual news/events. The hype around Bitcoin ETF has already made Bitcoin move about $23,000 upwards even before the news, what does anyone expect further off the coin than this? Fine, the market might still be making efforts to rise even at that, but the effect can't be as strong as many would thought. Bitcoin had even done well by moving that much, you will hardly see any market that will perform like that just because of an expectation. It was because all eyes were on the event and also due to how Bitcoin is structured, these could only explain what happened.

I expected that though, and it is due to the way everything turned out late last year. Going forward, the approval of the ETF would not help Bitcoin much in growing further but the post-halving effect would, it had done what it wanted to do as the market has it priced in already. However, I expect Bitcoin to go up gradually over time, this will be gradual and could be slow but the bullish path will continue since the ETF approval is positive for the coin and the long-term market sentiment remains bullish as well.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: LogitechMouse on January 12, 2024, 07:14:45 AM
Quote
Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
This is another reason why I stopped trading already, but the main reason I stopped is because I had huge losses on it already that I don't want to spend another few hundred bucks just to lose in the end again.

Anyway, news like this can happen anytime. A single news can just dump the price down by a few percent like what happened before the SEC hoax where Bitcoin and the whole crypto market just went down for no reason at all. At that time, the price of Bitcoin went down from ~$45,000 to almost ~$40,000 in just a few hours. Yes it went up a few hours after what happened, but imagine how many traders lost their money just because of that single dump that has no reason at all.

That's why I don't want to trade anymore. I don't have spare money anymore, and at the same time, hodling is less stressful than trading. Still f*ck the SEC, and f*ck Gary Gensler for setting the prank on us investors. :D That pranked cause some traders to lose money for sure.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Tony116 on January 12, 2024, 08:12:23 AM


Will SEC and Gensler be accused because of their news manipulation in court?
I think with the SEC approving the ETF, the SEC and Gensler will not be subject to accusations like previous rumors. Furthermore, social network X has also officially announced that the SEC account has indeed been hacked, so if this act is prosecuted, social network X will inevitably be implicated.
Everyone is happy that the ETF passed, and no one is talking about this manipulation but if the ETF does not pass, I think the SEC and Gensler will be in big trouble.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Ndabagi01 on January 12, 2024, 08:49:50 AM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.

Within several minutes, SEC. and their hoax triggered both Long liquidation and Short liquidation in Bitcoin market. It's a big opportunity for people to learn and understand risk of Leverage, Futures trading and if they absorb it well, they can protect their capital better and won't lose money like those people who were Long liquidated or Short liquidated hours ago.

All traders were ecstatic when the announcement was made. The SEC's approval of a spot Bitcoin ETF was expected to send the market soaring from the moment it was announced. Many people who trade using leverage and futures are affected in some way by the market because the market did not move in the direction they expected. Those who are hodlers will still have what they invested, with no loss in bitcoin amount or profit in bitcoin value. This is just a matter of time before the halving and the bull run, which will be beneficial to long-term investors.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Zigabel on January 12, 2024, 10:40:54 AM
Trading cryptocurrency especially as futures is very risky due to the volatility and this is something you should always have on your mind before you decide to try crypto trading, another point to note is the place of news and it's effect on the market, if you are not really informed well enough you may suffer good loss when there's a news such as that with sec and the Bitcoin ETF yesterday or better still you avoid the trading aspect and just HODL, if you aren't proficient enough make sure not to be in the market when there's great impact news as this because it can actually get you rich at once and also liquidate you in split seconds.

Trading in cryptocurrency is not advised most times but Hodling is because if you were hodling the news yesterday will definitely be in your favour much more than it would be against you.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Dimitri94 on January 12, 2024, 01:24:11 PM
Holding is more profitable than trading for several reasons. Making money from trading is definitely difficult especially for newbies. Especially when the market is bearish, the chances of loss for newbies are high. A trader needs to be aware of various things in order to trade. His recent knowledge of various subjects such as finance, legal and business aspects is to be observed well. But none of this is binding on a Bitcoin holder. Holdings do not have cash flows but a holder can get large sums of money by holding for long periods of time. Futures trading on the other hand is a very risky trading platform for beginners. I myself have lost my assets into futures trade with little knowledge. All things considered I think holding is better. Holding is excellent for experienced, inexperienced new and old alike.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Patrol69 on January 12, 2024, 01:42:27 PM
If a trader has a good understanding of the market and if his capital is relatively large then there is no need for him to do futures trading. As we saw a few days ago, the price of ethereum was close to $2K , but within a few days, the price of ethereum went close to $2.7K that is, if a trader spent 2000 dollars on spot trading, he would have made a profit of 700 dollars.

Most of the traders go into futures trading mainly with the hope of extra profit but most of the time they lose their money instead of extra profit so they don't have money to do spot trading at that time. We have to stay where the money is very safe, even if the profit is less. If he can trade regularly in spot trading and if he can trade by understanding the market, he can earn a good amount of money monthly than a future trader.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: fuguebtc on January 12, 2024, 03:10:25 PM
If a trader has a good understanding of the market and if his capital is relatively large then there is no need for him to do futures trading. As we saw a few days ago, the price of ethereum was close to $2K , but within a few days, the price of ethereum went close to $2.7K that is, if a trader spent 2000 dollars on spot trading, he would have made a profit of 700 dollars.

Most of the traders go into futures trading mainly with the hope of extra profit but most of the time they lose their money instead of extra profit so they don't have money to do spot trading at that time. We have to stay where the money is very safe, even if the profit is less. If he can trade regularly in spot trading and if he can trade by understanding the market, he can earn a good amount of money monthly than a future trader.

Indeed, between spot trading and futures trading, I find spot trading brings greater profits and is safer than futures trading . But I don't understand why people like to rush into futures trading and lose everything they have.

In recent months , I noticed that the market is gradually warming up and I also participated in spot trading. Up to now, the profit I have earned has been x2, x3 of the initial capital. Spot trading is both profitable and safe, but why people don't realize that, it's baffling.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Cryptomultiplier on January 12, 2024, 05:17:18 PM
If a trader has a good understanding of the market and if his capital is relatively large then there is no need for him to do futures trading. As we saw a few days ago, the price of ethereum was close to $2K , but within a few days, the price of ethereum went close to $2.7K that is, if a trader spent 2000 dollars on spot trading, he would have made a profit of 700 dollars.

Most of the traders go into futures trading mainly with the hope of extra profit but most of the time they lose their money instead of extra profit so they don't have money to do spot trading at that time. We have to stay where the money is very safe, even if the profit is less. If he can trade regularly in spot trading and if he can trade by understanding the market, he can earn a good amount of money monthly than a future trader.

Indeed, between spot trading and futures trading, I find spot trading brings greater profits and is safer than futures trading . But I don't understand why people like to rush into futures trading and lose everything they have.

In recent months , I noticed that the market is gradually warming up and I also participated in spot trading. Up to now, the profit I have earned has been x2, x3 of the initial capital. Spot trading is both profitable and safe, but why people don't realize that, it's baffling.
We can't stop people from trying a trading style that they think might make them more profit.
Spot trading is quite safer as said, but it is still not protected from high fees and market volatilities.
A trader who has learnt a great deal from losing while trading leverage will be more willing to try using bots and might find it better and profitable.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: tabas on January 12, 2024, 05:45:27 PM
Those that don't want to mess up wouldn't trade in futures or leverage, that's a known thing today that if you want to stay calm on this market then it's best to stay holding. Rather than going hand in hand with the market through spot or futures, at least with the spot you've got lesser risk and it won't be as quick as the futures when you're losing. But if you're done with all of these craziness and spontaneity of the market, you don't have to stress yourself and just accumulate, it won't guarantee anything but it's a chiller approach to make profit here.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Antotena on January 12, 2024, 07:21:53 PM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.

Within several minutes, SEC. and their hoax triggered both Long liquidation and Short liquidation in Bitcoin market. It's a big opportunity for people to learn and understand risk of Leverage, Futures trading and if they absorb it well, they can protect their capital better and won't lose money like those people who were Long liquidated or Short liquidated hours ago.

Nobody will tell me otherwise that SEC didn't plan this heinous move. I have so many questions and one of that was "has SEC X account has ever been hack before? I doubt because I search Google and I couldn't see any news about that but it was the day people expected them to announce the ETF they decided to play bitcoin smartness and to say that Gary Gensler was quick to debunk that news under 3 minutes with his own own account, we have been played everyone.

I was watching the CNBC when it was live on YouTube and that guy was just opening his mouth and saying bad things about Bitcoin, if it was another influence person from the Bitcoin community went to CNBC to say bad things about government and the US banks, under 24 hours that news channel will be closed down but they shouldn't worry. The battle line has been drawn.

In everything you do, either a trader or holder, make sure you don't sleep on Bitcoin.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Ryu_Ar1 on January 12, 2024, 08:04:48 PM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.


Therefore many people do not really recommend trading especially for those who are not really able to do it well or for those beginners because in the end it is like torturing yourself if you force yourself to trade.

But on the other hand things like this also depends on your capacity about whether you are ready or not in risk management because as long as you are able and willing to accept any form of risk that occurs then it doesn't matter if you really want to trade just don't let you waver and feel that something like this is a scam especially when after seeing what the SEC did before which maybe there could even be some people who were affected by the fraud that was done so as long as you know the risks and are ready to accept things like that then you can still do it but if you are not willing to accept that much risk then it would be better not to do anything in trading and better focus on your future investments


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Vaculin on January 12, 2024, 08:40:26 PM
https://i.imgflip.com/8bxxfj.jpg

When you realized everything happened was staged and planned :D

I don't believe that they were hacked at all. For sure, they did that so they would able to buy more cheap Bitcoins before announcing a legit approval of ETF.
After ETF was approved, we didn't see any huge pump compared to before, it seems people already knew. It's kinda buy the news, sell the rumors.
This is probably happening now as bitcoin price has dropped instead rather than seeing it surging high. However, it's not bad as it is since it widely opens a new opportunity for beginners and long term hodlers to buy and hold more in preparation for the upcoming bitcoin halving. So I guess the whole scene even if we would like to believe that its staged and planned, at least there are still advantages that we can gain from it, we just have to look at the brighter side.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Ben Barubal on January 12, 2024, 08:48:18 PM
   Using leverage and futures trading in this situation is not a good thing to do if you know that you lack knowledge and that your knowledge is not enough. Actually, it's not bad to do this method as long as it won't be complicated for you and you're sure that you can eat it. It's fine.

   Although it cannot be denied that the level of risk is really quite high when you use these tools, because if it is not profitable, I hope no one does this method, which means that this method is effective, if it is long-term and you are an investor, hold on for now. That's what you should do for now.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: TimeTeller on January 12, 2024, 08:54:33 PM
  Using leverage and futures trading in this situation is not a good thing to do if you know that you lack knowledge and that your knowledge is not enough. Actually, it's not bad to do this method as long as it won't be complicated for you and you're sure that you can eat it. It's fine.

   Although it cannot be denied that the level of risk is really quite high when you use these tools, because if it is not profitable, I hope no one does this method, which means that this method is effective, if it is long-term and you are an investor, hold on for now. That's what you should do for now.

As a lot of newcomers are aiming to get rich quick, they have the notion going into futures or leverage, will give them high profits.
However, it is too late when they realized that their position is already liquidated and nothing had left on their funds.
They need to learn their lessons in expensive way before they realized their mistakes but that would give them a different perception on this market.
This there's more than meets the eyes in this area of investment.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Maslate on January 12, 2024, 08:59:57 PM
It depends on each market moment. Of course, in sensitive times like these, holding is much safer than trading. But if 1 or 2 months ago when the market increased strongly, it would be a waste if we just held and ignored the trade. As you can see, in the past 2 months, almost the entire market has recovered very well and if someone took advantage of that, they would have increased their capital significantly.

Holding or trading has its advantages and disadvantages, it all depends on the strategy and skills of each investor. Not everyone who holds will always be a winner and those who trade will always be losers.
Absolutely. Trading does not guarantee success as well as hodling itself. The only way it gets successful and profitable is that if you have the knowledge and skills to do it on a consistent basis.

However, the time to hold or to trade really depends on the market situation. If you are seeing that there is high probability to make profits with trading, then trade but make sure not to leverage if you are less capable to do it. Consider hold than trading, it's way safer and less risky if you prefer to hold long term most particularly for bitcoin.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: MainIbem on January 12, 2024, 09:03:41 PM
Do you think trading will help at the point like this from my looks it seems like is the worst thing to do instead just hold and do not leverage or trading in future. This news give a sudden hype to the market just imagine how many newbies that has lost huge funds within this few days of Sec announcing the ETF. I felt for those who bought bitcoin at the pick price of $47k with the mindset it could gets to 50k and above without knowing it was a wrong entry point.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: _BlackStar on January 12, 2024, 09:30:45 PM
Price volatility can be caused by many factors – which is why there is always a risk warning in trading and investing. They must learn to know the market better rather than getting too comfortable just holding on when there are still too few sat of bitcoin. Of course they should know that trading with futures carries a high risk of loss - but any user can try it as long as they understand the risks and strategies.

Trading futures with high leverage is suicide - that's the reality. However if they set a low leverage for example <5 - then maybe it is something that can be profitable in the long run especially if combined with the right strategy. Futures trading with the right strategy is still fine - the problem is when trader set high margins without consideration of risk.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Distinctin on January 12, 2024, 10:00:11 PM
Trading is actually more productive and profitable than hodling so we can't hold the people if they really desire to trade. While trading is a lot more profitable than holding, but the risks on it are also bigger than hodling alone.

However, every situation requires the proper method or strategy on what's the best thing to do to end up with significant profits. Either you trade or hold, that depends on how skillful you are to that and that would cater the current market situation, otherwise if you take suicidal in trading, you might end up losing everything you have and regret why you trade earlier without setting a plan fisrt.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Emmanuelex on January 13, 2024, 12:14:35 AM
Well, everyone is not the same. I believe that there are people who trading is the main key thing they do to make their own money, so you can't tell such people that they should stop trading, rather they should learn to be very careful while trading, because we all know how volatile the market can be.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Xampeuu on January 13, 2024, 04:57:23 AM
Trading is actually more productive and profitable than hodling so we can't hold the people if they really desire to trade. While trading is a lot more profitable than holding, but the risks on it are also bigger than hodling alone.

However, every situation requires the proper method or strategy on what's the best thing to do to end up with significant profits. Either you trade or hold, that depends on how skillful you are to that and that would cater the current market situation, otherwise if you take suicidal in trading, you might end up losing everything you have and regret why you trade earlier without setting a plan fisrt.
For beginners, perhaps holding is better than trading, considering that the risk is very high for trading, we must have complex skills to collect profits from each transaction, or we must have the courage to make cut losses so as not to fall into bigger losses. It's true that only a few traders are successful, but we can still learn by holding a larger holding and using less capital to trade, that way we can progress as a trader, until the time comes when we can do both very well.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: cryptodude on January 13, 2024, 12:02:15 PM
In futures trade, if you trade with excess leverage, you can get liquidated at any time. A lot of the negative impact on the crypto market comes from social media news. Just a few days ago, a news was leaked through social media which had a negative impact on the cryptocurrency market. But before trading futures, you must take as much loss as possible. Do not take risks that may endanger your life.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: 2Pizza410000BTC on January 13, 2024, 02:36:39 PM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.

Within several minutes, SEC. and their hoax triggered both Long liquidation and Short liquidation in Bitcoin market. It's a big opportunity for people to learn and understand risk of Leverage, Futures trading and if they absorb it well, they can protect their capital better and won't lose money like those people who were Long liquidated or Short liquidated hours ago.

What's the hoax?

SEC Grants Approval For Bitcoin ETFs -- HOAX (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5481016.0)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GDb7Yk6WsAA7xOo?format=jpg&name=900x900 (https://twitter.com/therationalroot/status/1706255966801416554)
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GDcDQH9XUAIMrNg?format=jpg&name=900x900 (https://twitter.com/therationalroot/status/1744867095504884211)
Better to hold than trade.  If one is holding without trading, then holding would be best for him. There are many people who jump into trading after keeping it for a while. Especially those who entered the futures trade lost all their money and returned home. I have never met a futures trader who never lost money. No matter how experienced a futures trader is, losing money is guaranteed. So I would like to say to every Bitcoin user and Bitcoin investor, hold on and you will profit in the future. Never go to futures trading platform you will lose your money forever. So always keep yourself away from futures trading.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Natsuu on January 13, 2024, 04:37:30 PM
Trading is actually more productive and profitable than hodling so we can't hold the people if they really desire to trade. While trading is a lot more profitable than holding, but the risks on it are also bigger than hodling alone.

However, every situation requires the proper method or strategy on what's the best thing to do to end up with significant profits. Either you trade or hold, that depends on how skillful you are to that and that would cater the current market situation, otherwise if you take suicidal in trading, you might end up losing everything you have and regret why you trade earlier without setting a plan fisrt.

Right. Trading can be more profitable, but it's risky. Your success depends on your skills, strategy, and reading the market right. Jumping into it without a plan can lead to big losses, and you might regret not thinking things through.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: someone703 on January 13, 2024, 04:55:27 PM
Futures seem like they're printed with gold promises and wrapped in flashy neon lights, but those things often come with nasty hidden fees and a fuse shorter than a hangry toddler.

I remember my own newbie days, eyes glazed over by charts and jargon, fingers itching to yank that leverage lever like a slot machine handle. Thankfully, a few quick bursts of panic-induced sweating and a near-death experience with liquidation brought me back down to earth. Holding, yeah, it might not feel like the coolest dance move in the crypto club, but it's like that reliable old friend who always gives you a ride home after a wild night and never judges your questionable pizza choices.

Now, don't get me wrong, trading can be a thrill ride, like riding a rocket built with rocket fuel and fueled by rocket fuel. But it's not for everyone. You gotta have nerves of steel, sharper than a samurai sword, and an analysis game tighter than a drumhead. Even then, one wrong guess and you're face-planting on the moon pavement with your dreams in tatters.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Ale88 on January 13, 2024, 05:17:20 PM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.
Personally I don't trade, I know I'm not good enough to do it, I simply prefer to buy whenever I can and keep accumulating. What the SEC did anyway is just disgusting, they are supposed to protect people from scammers and in reality they are the first one scamming people. And now they say the've been hacked, come on, who is going to believe that?


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: wallet4bitcoin on January 13, 2024, 06:15:47 PM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.

Within several minutes, SEC. and their hoax triggered both Long liquidation and Short liquidation in Bitcoin market. It's a big opportunity for people to learn and understand risk of Leverage, Futures trading and if they absorb it well, they can protect their capital better and won't lose money like those people who were Long liquidated or Short liquidated hours ago.

What's the hoax?

SEC Grants Approval For Bitcoin ETFs -- HOAX (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5481016.0)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GDb7Yk6WsAA7xOo?format=jpg&name=900x900 (https://twitter.com/therationalroot/status/1706255966801416554)
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GDcDQH9XUAIMrNg?format=jpg&name=900x900 (https://twitter.com/therationalroot/status/1744867095504884211)


This remains one of the greatest disaster by SEC in the history of the blockchain space. An entity that claims to be protecting investors but can't protect their channel of information disemination.

SEC caused the liquidation of assets that were supposed to be protected using the same tech they seem to be scrutinising, what a mess.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: aylabadia05 on January 13, 2024, 06:31:54 PM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.
<snip>
The SEC made an ETF approval decision I welcome with good thoughts. They didn't and continued to play around with the decision between being approved or not before I also thought with positive thoughts because the main goal with Bitcoin was to hold, not make Bitcoin an asset for me to trade.
The profits from trading are not as big as the long-term profits so trading is not my specialty.
The flow of FUD will still be strong and will continue to fluctuate so that it can disrupt the market.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Fatunad on January 13, 2024, 06:44:50 PM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.
<snip>
The SEC made an ETF approval decision I welcome with good thoughts. They didn't and continued to play around with the decision between being approved or not before I also thought with positive thoughts because the main goal with Bitcoin was to hold, not make Bitcoin an asset for me to trade.
The profits from trading are not as big as the long-term profits so trading is not my specialty.
The flow of FUD will still be strong and will continue to fluctuate so that it can disrupt the market.
This is the shit thing when it comes to government on which price manipulation would be its finest.They would be telling about those investigation something like this and like that
but look at on what happened? It did really end up on being that quiet after a few days on which people had forgotten.

SEC says the FBI is now involved in investigating false post about spot bitcoin ETFs
https://www.theblock.co/post/271688/sec-says-the-fbi-is-now-involved-in-investigating-false-post-about-spot-bitcoin-etfs

FBI is investigating the SEC hack after its fake bitcoin post
https://edition.cnn.com/2024/01/10/investing/sec-hack-bitcoin-etf/index.html

Do we really believe that they would really be definitely be trying out to do these things? These are just cover ups and pretty sure
it would really be forgotten and people just simply move on.The earlier thing i do say, this is where things or shit things do really
come out when dealing up with the government.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: Sanitough on January 13, 2024, 09:12:33 PM
SEC. made a big hoax hours ago. You and your account are well now with conditions that you did not use leverage or futures in trading.
Personally I don't trade, I know I'm not good enough to do it, I simply prefer to buy whenever I can and keep accumulating. What the SEC did anyway is just disgusting, they are supposed to protect people from scammers and in reality they are the first one scamming people. And now they say the've been hacked, come on, who is going to believe that?
I believe SEC has been very unpredictable these past few days, but we have no control over them so let's just ignore whatever they have to say. The important thing is, they have finally approved bitcoin ETF and that's all that matters. However, while expecting for bitcoin to create a significant price surge, the irony happened instead. I don't know what's the real intention of SEC approving bitcoin ETF, but I just hope it would create a real advantage for bitcoin.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: bluebit25 on January 13, 2024, 09:34:06 PM
The truth is that many people only look at getting money quickly and forget the basics in the market, if you don't hold, nothing belongs to you.

Using leverage is probably not suitable for basic users, because they easily make a lot of capital management mistakes and are also prone to following a certain trend. I am active in a few TG groups, most of the members only discuss the topic of long/short on futures contracts. And usually I see them criticizing CEX, some influencers, regulatory agencies, countries,... for price manipulation that led to trading orders being liquidated. That's still a personal mistake, understand that you're always on the wrong side because you lack the knowledge to get into the quagmire of those who create it.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: AakZaki on January 15, 2024, 08:22:59 PM
The truth is that many people only look at getting money quickly and forget the basics in the market, if you don't hold, nothing belongs to you.

Using leverage is probably not suitable for basic users, because they easily make a lot of capital management mistakes and are also prone to following a certain trend. I am active in a few TG groups, most of the members only discuss the topic of long/short on futures contracts. And usually I see them criticizing CEX, some influencers, regulatory agencies, countries,... for price manipulation that led to trading orders being liquidated. That's still a personal mistake, understand that you're always on the wrong side because you lack the knowledge to get into the quagmire of those who create it.
Trading is only an activity that I can count on when the market is really good for trading. but when the crypto market is not doing well I am more inclined to hold and if the market crashes will buy more to accumulate assets in my portfolio. I do some spot trading and rarely trade futures because of the risk. If you don't use leverage wisely then it will be the beginning of many losses. Leverage is very vulnerable when price predictions are wrong then everything will disappear in an instant.


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: GeorgeJohn on January 15, 2024, 09:38:37 PM
futures trading is actually made for people who want to make quick profits but don't want the hassle of investing. it's quite risky because the higher leverage means the faster someone's capital can be lost when they miscalculate their position. but the problem is that most futures traders are beginners who want to make quick profits in the market and ignore the risk that when they trade futures they can risk margin calls when they are in a losing position.

it is much better to trade on spot, where one can trade calmly and there are no margin calls. even when they experience a loss, if they can patiently hold the asset, they can recover the loss and can profit if the price of the bitcoin they hold increases more.
do you know that it is not everyone that is into threading that makes money in Trading so that is why when we talk about trading or when other people like newbies talk of threading they say it as if that trading is the ultimate or is the highest shortcut in order to make profit in cryptocurrency why trade and have a discipline half a policy that is the operate on


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: doubletheprof on January 16, 2024, 02:09:44 PM
#HODL is the way! ::)


Title: Re: Hold than trade. Just don't use leverage, futures.
Post by: blockman on January 16, 2024, 02:39:11 PM
While these manipulations typically comes to the market and they're hyping some news, the daily traders are the mostly affected by these move by government, SEC or by the financial institutions. That's how they make huge money from these situations and they are not allowing any opportunity to pass by. So, we've seen that Gensler told that he's hacked and there will be no approval but then we've seen it after a few days, 11 Bitcoin spot ETFs have been approved. The same style by financial institution and leaders like Dimon that tells they don't like Bitcoin but then when the price plummets, they're buying.