Bitcoin Forum

I ask this question because I wonder what Bitcoin will become now that the financial institutions and meme coin advocates have taken over.

If Bitcoin is not peer-to-peer electronic cash then how do you see it?

Financial institutions and meme coins have taken over? Why are you comparing financial institutions with bitcoin? But if you are comparing bitcoin with meme coins, add the marketcap of all existing meme coins together, divide the marketap of bitcoin by 5, all the meme coin marketcap is not worth one fifth of bitcoin marketcap.

Your question has no sense. You are saying bitcoin is not what it is.

Who said bitcoin is not longer digits cash?

Is it because we are seeing a lot of people using bitcoin more as an investment?

Personally, no matter what happens in the market it doesn't change the nature of bitcoin, bitcoin still remains a digital cash for payments purposes and also an asset that can be used as alternative for physical investments or for privacy focus investment.

The volatility of bitcoin has not changed it's initial purpose it's only crested another opportunity for the everyday opportunist to captivate on it and make cool profits especially in a long term.

Bitcoin is and probably will always be a digital cash.

We use it daily in this forum in the service board, just take a look.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=52.0

Basically anything you can do online someone is paying in bitcoin somewhere.

I don't understand why people like @OP is forcing Bitcoin must be used as a currency when the founder itself says Bitcoin can be like a commodity?

I'm glad to see Bitcoin is a decentralized currency and we have a freedom to choose, not necessary to follow what people think/says if Bitcoin must be used as a currency, as a commodity, as a money laundry tool etc.

Look for stores that accept meme coin as a means of payment compared to Bitcoin, and you will find that their number is limited. Unlike Dogecoin, all meme coins are bubbles whose price is inflated to deceive new investors.
Institutional investors buy Bitcoin, but you can still buy Bitcoin and use it to make peer-to-peer payments, so nothing has changed.

I don't understand, why is bitcoin not cash anymore? As far as I know you can still trade bitcoin into a large number of fiat and crypto coins, which means it's still cash. Just because a large number of institutional investors are using now bitcoin as a form of investment doesn't mean it's not digital cash anymore. Just look at Switzerland for example a very small country with a powerful currency. There are so many traders and investors that hold CHF as investment and would never use it as cash. Still nobody would argue that the Swiss franc is not cash anymore. Bitcoin can be cash, asset and investment at the same time.

As P2P electronic cash which is precisely what it is and has always been. Meme coins and other altcoins are products of bitcoin's existence and doesn't change how Bitcoin functions. Financial institutions existed before Bitcoin but also doesn't affect how Bitcoin functions.

You probably have your head deep into the meme coin market that you think that's the reality everywhere else.

Who's to say it's not?  Who gets to decide that?  I still believe that bitcoin is digital cash and that bitcoin still has the potential to be  a much better form of payment, or digital cash, if you will.  I think that it's important for the maturation and adoption for bitcoin to act as such.  Perhaps I am wrong but this is a hill that I've been standing on for a long time and don't plan to get off of anytime soon.

As a source to store value, just like gold but it's a digital gold, As far as I have seen, not so many people used BTC as digital cash, they used it as digital gold, and then made different types of investments in it, some are long term and some are short term (trading). But still, besides this use-case, it did not lose its peer-to-peer electronic cash characteristic. As its infrastructure is still the same, what changes is, its use case.

As how people are utilizing it, many people are even utilizing fiat cash as a store of value as well, for example, the dollar is being used to store the value of funds for a longer period of time. I still see it as Peer-to-peer cash and digital gold, I can use it for my daily buying and selling, and I have the option to hold it for eternity.

I think the bigger question should be what the role of memecoins in the cryptocurrency ecosystem?


Have memecoins becomes widely accepted?


Are their used as electronic cash as you assume?

Haven't bitcoin stood on it own outside of institutional involvement?


What the role of financial institutions in cryptocurrency and bitcoin?

I feel like bitcoin can only be two things: a decentralized payment method or a valuable investment

It’s either one or the other. I don’t think they can be exclusive necessarily if bitcoin were to become strictly a peer to peer method then there should be some ways for it to be actually accessible. But since many are treating bitcoin as a mere investment only, bitcoin can not now be transferred as easily as we would have liked.

It’s definitely not fiat and it would not become one even years after.

https://www.talkimg.com/images/2024/04/17/jy9dH.png

Since Dogecoin has no smart contracts and no ordinals on the chain, seems like it shouldn't be as a surprise to anyone that cheap fees and acceptance everywhere have made it top sometimes by 4 to 5 times the transactions on Bitcoin.Even on this forum that starts with "bitcoin" people end up dealing in doge, ltc and usdt because of fees, you can see the usage washing away.


The ones using it.
And if more are using it as an investment on a CEX slowly it's losing it's p2p currency tag.
After all, let's be real, even here, what's the majority looking at it for, a currency or an investment, imagine how the majority looks outside specialized themed forums or sub reddits.

What do you mean by taken over? They may have taken over your media space, but certainly not mine.

I "got" into Bitcoin in 2016 p2p. I'm still doing p2p now, it simply makes sense for me to use the network I've trusted (and who trusts me). I still have to scramble for a different wallet each time someone wants some other currency, Bitcoin's simply the easiest for me, the one I trust in the most, the one I know will always have a willing buyer wherever I travel.

I don't know if that circle ever really did shrink. It's just other circles have grown. But the premise of digital cash has never lost its meaning for a lot of people.

Edit: just saw stompix's post above mine and I agree, in the real world, everyone else might see Bitcoin differently, but I still tend to think those like me who found Bitcoin as a solution to every day problems like cross-border payments and remittances still see Bitcoin serve the same purpose. Yes, a lot more people I know online ask for payment in doge, ltc etc. But these are people who see and use crypto as cheaper alternatives to debit card or bank deposits for, say, gambling. Crypto was never a solution for them but a better alternative.

Outside of CEX, I couldn't sell doge/ltc/eth as easily as Bitcoin where I travel or need to send money to, it's been that way since 2016.

BTC is a digital currency, meme coins haven't taking over anything, it is just a pump and dump tool for trading. BTC is p2p electronic cash and you can spend it because it is fungible and is a medium of exchange. You should provide more details in your post, because the little you did provide does not make much sense and is incorrect.

How did you think to compare Meme coins with Bitcoin, don't mix jokes or silly cryptocurrencies with the concept of decentralization, that's a different story, There is no influence of financial institutions with Bitcoin, for example financial institutions completely adopt meme coins circulating in the crypto market.

Whether it's an idea or a trick to destroy Bitcoin by financial institutions by taking over the online joke, no problem just tell them to take all those stupid Cryptocurrencies, remember, Bitcoin has often eaten salt, this is not the first thing for certain institutions to tear apart Bitcoin, the fact is that Bitcoin is increasingly developing and advancing, remember Meme coins are just memes, not the same as Bitcoin which has certainty or is innovative in the development of Cryptocurrency.

Financial institutions and meme coin advocates taking over is just an opinion, and it's not even supported by any evidence by the op, which is unfortunate. Which financial institutions are we talking about? Is it about the ETFs? They exist now, but that doesn't exclude Bitcoin in its pure decentralized form. As for meme coins, I've honestly not heard people defending them or talking seriously about them for a while.
Bitcoin is still digital cash, or at least it's still a part of what Bitcoin is. Sure, sometimes it's a more viable option and sometimes less, but overall, it still works as intended.

Ordinals and Runes have taken over the news cycle.  They have also congested the network and increased the fees to a level that Bitcoin is no longer a valid currency.  When it costs $10 to $30 USD to send and receive Bitcoin in 10 minutes it is no longer an efficient currency.  It is cheaper to use almost any other fiat currency or credit vehicle like Visa.

Most people are buying bitcoin through 3rd parties like exchanges and ETFs and if people are using a 3rd party node instead of hosting their own node it is not a peer-to-peer transaction. All of these Bitcoin transactions are benefiting the 3rd party intermediaries and it is equivalent to the system we currently have.

Wall street is attempting to use blockchains like Bitcoin to create securities that financial institutions can easily monetize.

All the while no one is working to make Bitcoin a more suitable peer-to-peer digital cash system. It is getting slower and more expensive.

In addition most people I hear from are okay with the transition of Bitcoin as an investment especially Wall street.

All of these reasons lead to my question: If Bitcoin is not peer-to-peer digital cash then what?

Bitcoin's still peer-to-peer digital cash to me, and likely to millions of other folks across the globe.  The high fees are temporary while developers try to expand the system (like Lightning Network) so it can process more payments efficiently.  For small everyday buys, you've got a point - there are probably better choices currently.  But Bitcoins great for larger transfers where normal finance can be slow and pricey and  plus Bitcoin's still the most widely accepted digital currency and most secure payment network out there.  That part hasn't changed.

Bitcoin can be whatever you want it to be. Who cares what the minority or majority uses it for. Surround yourself with likeminded people who use and think of Bitcoin the same way you do. I understand your frustrations, though. Bitcoin is currently not a useful type of digital cash, with mining fees as high as they are. I would rather have the Ordinal monkeys gone and have them spam other blockchains, but we can't always have what we want. Even with the current state, Bitcoin is cheap for international transactions compared to fiat via banks and with a much faster settlement.

bitcoins treatment/utility is "no longer digital cash" as in majority treat it as something else.. not due to technical limits of physics. but purely human political decisions on who should, could, would allow bitcoin to have continued scaling onchain vs the politics of pushing bitcoiners to other networks so spammers, scammer and junk fillers can abuse the network more

anyone suggesting bitcoiners should use other networks with made up physics limits/reasons.. but then say not to stop/move the spam,scam junk, are not saying things that benefit bitcoiners or the network

Bitcoin never managed to become digital cash (admittedly, without being widely used and used in this capacity) and found its best use as a speculative investment instrument, very similar to shares (with the difference that you can store these shares at home, and not from a broker).

Bitcoin has transformed into an investment asset and will probably develop in this direction, because financial institutions will not abandon this asset so easily (everyone wants profit). This means that bitcoin will rise in price under the influence of investments from new financial institutions, and perhaps even entire countries (El Salvador).

How do you even imagine using bitcoin as digital cash if today it costs $72k and tomorrow $63k? Money should be a little less volatile, to say the least.

Bitcoin has gained mass adoption, but not among ordinary users, but among financial institutions, and this imposes corresponding changes on the BTC- system. I believe bitcoin will never become what its creator wanted it to be.

That doesn't even make sense that bitcoin becomes irrelevant just because meme coins and institutional investors are on the loose, that's just not how things work with bitcoin or even the cryptocurrency space in the first place, have you seen who's the first place on the market and how much is the total market value of bitcoin (this one might not be accurate)? Look at how many companies are below bitcoin in terms of value and you'd see that you're not talking something factual. Those stuff that you're talking about, they're going to be gone in a few years if not months but bitcoin? Bitcoin's here to stay, I'm telling you.

Coinbase, Binance, Black Rock, Fidelity, Ark, Michael Saylor...

This is not an opinion. ETFs currently own 4.5% of the total supply.  Michael Saylor owns over 1%. Most of the transactions are through a financial intermediary and the changes to the network benefit other uses of Bitcoin not peer-to-peer digital cash.  

Increasing public interest in Bitcoin cannot change Bitcoin as digital cash. Bitcoin is run based on the P2P network concept with the aim of creating a transaction system that is free from intervention by any central authority or monetary authority. The worst possibility might happen if Bitcoin is no longer P2P digital money, the price could drop to zero if the government can intervene in market efficiency, prices, supply and demand, volatility and profits. Bitcoin is freedom because it is a P2P system that operates without the need for intermediaries such as banks or financial institutions, Bitcoin will remain digital cash in the present and future.

Bitcoin is mostly used as an investment. Even though a lot of people use it for transactions, but largely it has become an investment. This behaviour has become more prominent after these large corporates have come on board. They are holding thousands of Bitcoins in their treasury. Selling them as an investment to the common people.

Also the way ordinals have jammed the Bitcoin network, it's not good as a payment processor. It has become slow and expensive.

What happens if the block size is increased by 400% for NFTs and FTs that congest the network and the fees become unreasonable?  Then the financial institutions market financial products that facilitate them buying up the supply and selling Wall street securities in its place?

Oh, that is what has happened. lol

So, I own a lot of bitcoin, held it for over 8 years. I've never had any meme coin, no NFTs, only a bit of ETH, but the top 10 altcoins was as far as I ever went with my side purchases. How dos a meme coin take over if there are people who don't buy them and never will, but they hold bitcoin. I don't see ETFs launch for all these meme coins.

So if I use my bitcoin to pay someone, tell me how it isn't digital cash anymore. What people do with their coins is their choice. If someone wants to gamble, fine, buy altcoins, fine, prefers ETF than real bitcoin, fine. A proxy exposure is still better than no exposure.

It is not surprising that what will happen to Bitcoin if there are financial institutions and meme coins? Everyone thinks that financial institutions or meme coins are all running with the blessing of Bitcoin. Comparing it to Bitcoin is an inappropriate question. Financial institutions have adopted Bitcion after seeing its surge. How can they take over Bitcoin? Your second question is to compare meme coin with Bitcoin or whether meme coin took over Bitcoin. I laugh at this guy who thinks meme coins are better than Bitcoin. Let him think a little about his sentence. He is doing a camparision for something that does not even have a use case, only jokes are his use case and he is thinking of degrading Bitcoin according to you.

It does not make sense. OP your question is doubtful, complete it and submit it. Bitcoin was and will remain a p2p. It is not possible that Bitcoin would not be peer-to-peer electronic cash.

Meme coin take over? In what sense, these coins are more like living in hype, the same on those who advocates meme coins, its no sole purpose but only for temporary hype and short term too risky investment. You can get millions of holding in simply several weeks then lost them overnight unlike to other major coins they are not even comparable to bitcoin itself.

This is just alike with someone saying that altcoins are a distraction and reducing mass adoption for bitcoin, and to me it makes no sense saying that cause bitcoin still beats them all put together and this insinuates that anyone investing in altcoins are there for the reasons known to them or knew about bitcoin and didn't want to invest in it.

Financial institutions didn't take over, bitcoin is still what it is, although we are still yet to achieve a well used peer-to-peer system with bitcoin, bitcoin has not gone one bit from been the same decentralized project that it started out to be and I Don't see that changing. Same thing was said when centralized exchanges started been a major part of crypto system and acted as a middle man in most transactions but that didn't change anything and that's how it would be even if all the world countries approved ETF, it woudl only be an investment vehicle for those that chose it and prefers to rely on a centralized system other than oweing bitcoin for themselves without need from any Financial institution.

Maybe it's your first rodeo, but this certainly isn't the first time that greedy shitcoin-peddlers have piggybacked off Bitcoin's blockchain and hogged resources.  Back in 2019 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5129187.0) something called Veriblock was spamming a load of transactions and making it more expensive to transact.  Fast-forward five years and that particular shitcoin is completely dead and hardly anyone remembers it.  The exact same thing is going to happen with all this ordinals and runes trash.  It's just more crap bought by gullible idiots that goes to zero and leaves a bunch of sad bagholders.  Then someone comes up with the next scam.  Rinse, repeat.

Bitcoin is fine.  It survived Veriblock and it'll survive this latest ordinals and runes trash.  The far bigger threat is always the authoritarians who think they can tell people how they can or can't transact.  Shitcoins and spam are merely an inconvenience.  Authoritarians are more dangerous because they try to convince others to surrender their freedoms in order to supposedly "fix Bitcoin".  But it's working exactly as it is meant to.  

It's still the same, it's just that there are more adoption that has came to it. Aren't we happy about that? Bitcoin is for everyone, small fish, big fish or whatever are you. As with these financial institutions that have big names and reputation in the market that they're roaming around, they've added flavour and capitalization to the market and that's why we're having some quick gains as for the pricing of Bitcoin. But to answer your question then mostly will agree that it is more of a store of value which have being done by the most of us.

There can be more of it for its use case like the normal p2p transactions if there are more merchants that accepts it. But one problem that we're dealing again is with the high transaction fees that it is having right now. That's one reason why many don't think that it's good as a p2p alternative from the fiat and digital transactions that we're having together with the credit/debit card payments. And to give the idea of the others, there are offchain transactions where merchants and buyers kind of agree to have without fees and lesser waiting time because transactions are in instant. Again, that's only for off chain transactions or if they both have the same wallet which is common in exchanges.

What have they taken over? ETFs own a tiny percentage of Bitcoin supply, other institutions like banks or hedge funds barely own any coins at all. Memecoins are completely irrelevant to Bitcoin, they are just high risk gambling devices for those who think that Bitcoin is not volatile enough and moves too slowly.

Bitcoin is in good position right now, it's not really threatened by anything right now, it's just hitting its own technical limitations, and there's no tragedy here, because everything has its limits.

Have they taken over? They're taking advantage of the growth of Bitcoin, yes, but I don't think they've taken over. What is there to take over, in the first place? The market? We're all part of it. That's a truly free market, after all. The network? That's impossible to happen.

Bitcoin remains a peer-to-peer electronic cash. It has taken new roles, though, fortunately or unfortunately. These institutional players that are getting a big slice of the market share don't see Bitcoin as money. They only see Bitcoin as a speculative asset. It's their choice. Thus far, however, those who believe that Bitcoin is money remain free to use it as such.

How can they take over and what steps they will take to support your statement. Financial institutions do not have the capacity to take over bitcoin because bitcoin runs on its own power and meme supporters also do not have the capacity for a full takeover of bitcoin. I don't understand what you mean and I don't see what you are talking about making any more sense.

This makes much less sense and I don't think you understand the concept of bitcoin. I still see bitcoin as one of the best assets and some countries still apply bitcoin as an investment asset.

Most of the meme coin hype has nothing to do with bitcoin, there is no meme coin running on the bitcoin blockchain even.

This year most meme coins were on Solana network due to the ultra cheap fees. Last year it was on the Ethereum network. But never on the bitcoin blockchain.

Nothing changes with the financial institutions. You can still send bitcoin peer to peer pretty much as long as the fees are reasonable or you are sending a large amount. Hence why most people use L2 these days for micro transactions.

Who said it dude? It completely depends on the owner of the coins to do whatever they want with the coin. Some treat Bitcoins as a mode of payment, while some use it completely as a digital asset. They take the advantage of the fact that Bitcoins are fixed in numbers, hence they think of holding it. While I also see that some people like to pay with Bitcoins. So the memecoin and other coins, doesn’t really affect the Bitcoins in any perspective.

With these high fees, btc definitely fails at operating as a currency. For a fee years btc acts more like digital gold rather than a digital currency because of the physical limitations of btc. Are meme coins the answers to this problem though? I am not sure. The only promising coins with a fairly well user adoption is dogecoin. The resr are pure trash. Other than that there is xmr which has nearly zero user adoption because the governments don’t like it and there is litecoin which dominates the currency use case on bitpay. To me it is very clear which coin is acting as digital cash lately.

You feel there are competition with bitcoin until most of these projects fail to keep up or are being replaced by new modified projects. Bitcoin has been relevant since it’s invention and it keeps growing in popularity and value and so many years past and it’s still at the top. Bitcoin was invented to serve as an alternative currency (digital money) and be used as payment and Lots of people and businesses still make use of bitcoin as payment method and everyday more people accept it as a means of payment but also it’s volatile nature gives people more benefit to earn from holding bitcoin and that has made it to be seen as an investment tool which is why most people try to benefit by holding bitcoin.

In my opinion people are dealing in alternate currencies because nobody is developing off-chain solutions to move all the junk to.

Every time a large amount of a certain kind of auxiliary transaction is made, people need to be looking into how to best optimize the fees for it.

The problem is that bitcoin protocol development is currently paralyzed so it's basically whatever we have in 2021 to deal with all of these new things.

Many people are still dreaming of a future where bitcoin will become a currency and be used as a means of payment but aside from the high transaction fees plus volatility, I'm also pretty sure it won't become a currency in the future.

Regarding the question related to "Meme", I think this idea comes from Elon, I remember correctly that he once said "whoever controls memes can control the world". Dogecoin could also make that happen if Elon really steps up and promotes Dogecoin support. I also wouldn't be surprised if Doge or Shiba become alternative payment solutions in the future  :D :D.

Bitcoin is no longer a digital cash? Maybe in your own world mate, Bitcoin is a digital cash or let me say it can be used as digital cash, if you want to settle a payment you can pay in Bitcoin, it depends if the seller is willing to receive Bitcoin as means of payment.

You can use Bitcoin in anyway that you want, as a store of value, a brilliant way of avoiding devaluation that attacks Fiat most of the time, you can hodl it for future big gains or you can use it to settel payments, the choice is yours.

The existence of memecoins and altcoin did nothing bad for Bitcoin, even if something is created thats better than Bitcoin in terms of payment solution and others, Bitcoin will still remain the No #1.

I don’t think so. Lots of people still feel strongly against memecoins and their existence here in the crypto world.


Actually I believe they might be being used more as a p2p currency because there’s not much congestion in their blockchains thus making the transaction fees cheaper than that in bitcoin. Although of course not a lot of memecoins breakthrough.

Remains as an electronic currency system that facilitates transactions and as an investment asset. Still, I see these two things even though I have never used Bitcoin as a means of payment in a transaction such as paying for basic necessities in a shop considering that I come from a country that makes Bitcoin a commodity asset that can be traded.

Bitcoin will never change, according to the whitepaper when it first appeared. Bitcoin will remain a medium of exchange according to the dream of its creator and now this has become a reality. Has there been any major impact or influence from institutions or supporters of the meme coin since taking over? Of course bitcoin remains the strongest to date. Of course, all communities on this forum agree that bitcoin as an asset can be converted into currency, which means transactions can be made. Not only can it be converted into currency, however, and you have to see how well-known brands and the country of El Salvador have adopted this asset as a means of payment.

Maybe you think because more people now know about Bitcoin as an investment asset and exchanges are campaigning for Bitcoin as a digital asset for future investment that makes you think like that.

Bitcoin will still be called a digital currency. despite government restrictions regarding the use of Bitcoin in certain countries. You can make an analogy of saving US dollars as your investment in a bank, while you use the fiat that applies in your country. Just the things you do will not change the initial nature of the US dollar as a currency into an investment asset.

Maybe you are actually the first person to let me know that financial institutions and meme coins advocates have taken over Bitcoin, I don't know how this sounds to you but just want to let you know that Bitcoin volatility is not a joke, and it is very ridiculous to say that meme coins and financial institutions have taken over like I don't still understand what you trying to say but maybe you didn't get your information from a reliable source.

Bitcoin still remains peer to peer medium of transactions without interference from a third party just like the motives for which it was created even though we are also using it as an investment platform but yet the sole objective is not defeated as it still remains the top modern day digital currency that is trying to find it's way to become the most preferred monetary system all over the globe as it's adoption continues to grow despite the low percentage.

Are you trolling? You promote a BTC wallet, name yourself the name of the wallet that you promote and ask if Bitcoin is a P2P electronic cash or not?

I'm glad you wrote this. You are right, Ordinals and Runes have taken over the Bitcoin blockchain and that will not end up well. I don't know why but there are too many people in Ordinals, half of mempool transaction is filled by Ordinals transactions and it's not going to end as it looks like.

It's not necessary to run your own node and many people can't afford that. Many people prefer to download lightweight wallet like Electrum and connect that to other nodes. We can't expect majority of Bitcoin users to run node but it's important to run it if we can.

When fees are low, yes and when fees are high - no.

I think the OP needs to clarify somewhat that Bitcoin is not now, nor will ever be mainstream digital cash.

Satoshi made Bitcoin for one reason, which is to thwart government subpoenas into transactions.

That's it. That's the only reason Bitcoin--and the blockchain architecture--exists in the first place.

Only a tiny, tiny number of people on any given day have the "problem" for which Bitcoin's original purpose is a solution. Most people are perfectly fine using a trading mechanism that can potentially be scrutinized by a government with a legal subpoena. Most people don't need to evade their government, and/or don't want to try.

If Bitcoin never became popular beyond its original purpose, it would only have a few thousand users today, and its price would probably still be around a dollar or two.

But at some point, people--now probably 99% of Bitcoin's users--found a new use for Bitcoin, which is as a speculation instrument.

And to answer the OP directly, my answer is: please treat Bitcoin for what it is, not what people fantasize it is. It's not going to "take over" sovereign currencies. It's absolutely evil to lobby your government to force Bitcoin on people in order to make the price go up (aka "legal tender").

Bitcoin works perfectly fine as a meme investment and it arguably the biggest one in the world. There's nothing wrong with that.

And as for true "digital cash" for a mainstream audience, as I have myself built such a system that can scale to millions of transactions per second (https://haypenny.net/whitepaper.html), the trick is to not try to solve the very narrow problem of thwarting government subpoenas, and instead focus solely on creating a system with low latency and low cost. This must necessarily be done without blockchain, which is an architectural impediment to any kind of mainstream scale as it was actually designed to be slow and expensive to transact in on purpose.

I believe Bitcoin will always be a peer to peer digital cash whether the fee is high or low.  It is the structure of Bitcoin and is yet to be modified ever since.  There maybe some institutions that integrate Bitcoin into their system and make it centralized like centralized exchanges and other centralized applications but the very core of Bitcoin is still peer to peer digital currency.


Sadly this question is invalid,IMHO, because as far as I know Bitcoin will always be a peer-to-peer digital cash whether it is integrated into a centralized system or works as decentralized network due to the meaning of peer-to-peer being:

There are plenty of places those could go, the problem is that no matter what solutions you offer, what are you going to do if they DON'T WANT to move there?

-Hey bear, look, nice woods, I put food there in the forest, no cars, no stupid people
-Nope, I like trash, I feel fine in your yard!

As long as sidechains are not that profitable for ordinals and posers like bitcoinmagazine which is putting every single month one huge 4mB cover in the chain you won't get rid of them!
So, when somebody is blocking the way and doesn't want to move, what would a normal guy do? Chose another way to get to work, and in this case people who want to make cheap trsanctions migrate to either LN or accepted altcoins like USDT or doge.


If we have adoptions as you claim but we have less p2p transactions and more inscriptions and transactions to CEXs, then, well, it means exactly what the title about this is.


I always said that Bitcoin is the perfect tool, it gives you the freedom to use it as you want.
The only problem arises when the way some users want it affects others.
Much like your freedom rights end where my rights begin!

a good project is very good and does not disappoint and always be the best I will always support this project until it becomes a big and famous project
🚀🚀🚀🥰🥰🥰😍

So let me summarize nowadays and 10 years ago:

step1: Bitcoin is digital cash, freedoom, decentralization!!!

step 2: people praise corporations and institutions saying how it will be good for the bitcoin's price

step 3: corporations enter the market and centralize the ecosystem.

step 4: people praise how good it will be if the market is regulated by laws from governments

step 5: governments force laws against cryptos

step 6: finally bitcoin is digital gold and not digital cash

So, people on the step 1 were only interested by the money to feed their pocket. And they helped to have the system we have nowadays.
It can be called bitcoin or sugar, people do not care as long they make money with it.

The right answer is: As a digital asset.

Simple as that, and if bitcoin isn't money or digital cash in your country, then you always have to option to move to another country that considers Bitcoin as money, a good option is El Salvador. But the question here is, do we really want to use bitcoin as money? if you want to buy a coffee cup, would you be happy to pay more than $1 in fees for that coffee cup? Bitcoin was made to move big amounts of money and not for daily use. That's his role. Just like gold, i want to see you paying a coffee cup with gold or with diamonds, you cant.

Are we just talking here because of the transaction fees again? And Bitcoin and meme coin on the same sentence? Hmm. I don't have the numbers but as per my speculation, average joe like you and me and the regulars here are far greater than this financial institutions.

They could have been here as early as 2017, but still though in the beginning, Bitcoin was for the masses and will remain that way.

And it still peer-to-peer electronic cash as far as I know, we even have Lightning Network for small and faster micro-payments.

It depends on how you see it yourself. You determine how you want to take advantage of Bitcoin. Do you want to use Bitcoin as a currency to buy goods internationally or pay for services and products locally?
Do you want to invest your funds into Bitcoin as an asset and watch it grow to become very significant in some years when it can only be affordable by the large pockets and businesses who receive payments with it?

Bitcoin is still cash, just as much as it is an asset after the launch of the ETF and since it can be traded on the exchange market. I don't need to talk about the countries that use it to pay taxes or for purchase and payments of service, because they exist and the numbers is climbing and the world is becoming more aware of cryptocurrency and the pairs that are cheaper to trade with.

The market is inversely important for each other. We have trends projects and they're very tactical when dealing with the affairs of the market.  We should be extremely catty with the market and be in a tight corner to ensure there's presence of huge fire. Promising projects have come and go in the market, it doesn't the current condition of the market, what matters is Bitcoin is worth the hype and have always been trending in bull and bear season.

What you should understand is that Bitcoin doesn’t care if there are other altcoins being used for other purpose or even being misused. No matter what, Bitcoin is always the same Bitcoin that Satoshi wrote in the whitepaper. Nothing can stop it from being the peer-to-peer electronic cash, not even if it were to be banned in many countries. You can’t stop being a human being. Right? It’s the same thing here.

For me bitcoin is a suitable currency, whatever the owner functions, be it as a p2p sarapa investment with barter or with other valuable payments. with a reputation as great as bitcoin and can be called a crypto legend, it is certainly difficult to imagine if that happened because the innovation of this currency is so good and accepted by most countries in the world. even the fundamentals are learned by many people with more and more ease. I don't like the way any financial institution works but since bitcoin is truly decentralised it's the opposite of function and authority, and I still choose bitcoin. Maybe you mean there are developers who make trading instruments like etf? they are whales who register themselves on exchanges and resell their bitcoins for fun. I prefer the bitcoin that I have.

and bitcoin a fair unit of exchange, including not being affected by economic turmoil in various countries. because everyone gets the best and the same price.

That's true because even though many countries ban bitcoin it won't change the essence of peer-to-peer electronic currency. Bitcoin was not created to limit anything and Bitcoin is actually an alternative for all humans if they are able to see its function. Sometimes people see things from a different point of view and make assumptions that do not match the facts. But the problem is that we think too negatively so that the level of rationality of something that has been tested is simply ignored without real consideration.

Bitcoin has gained ground all over the world and it not only functions as a currency, there are still some countries that see bitcoin as an investment asset to run with freedom. This shows that there is not a complete ban and although some countries are still opposed. So thinking rationally is an effort to create awareness regarding financial freedom in bitcoin.

although quite a lot of countries have implemented Bitcoin as an investment asset. but they will not remove the inherent definition of Bitcoin as a digital currency. no matter whether they legalize the use of Bitcoin as a transaction tool or not. If trading is carried out on a P2P basis by service providers or services with their customers, Bitcoin's function as a digital currency that provides financial freedom to its users is actually running.

It is basically a way to say that ETF situation has taken over the bitcoin market because they are buying in thousands, and retail investors are not buying that much, which means that it is a way of controlling the bitcoin market by those ETF companies that spends billions every week on bitcoin.

On the altcoin part of the world, the hype around meme projects are so high that people are acting as if we are talking about something that is making them insane amount of profit and they are acting as if this is normal. I personally believe that the mindset of "companies and meme projects took over" is not really impossible, it does make sense and a lot of people can see that, not going to agree, but they do trade a lot more compared to back in the day.

Up to now, my country's government still calls bitcoin a digital currency, virtual currency, but they still prohibit people from using it as a payment method or currency. They just allow people to invest, treating it as a tradable commodity. Even though they still call it digital currency, we can't use it as its name suggests, so what does that mean?

I know that there are still some people who haven't given up on supporting bitcoin as a currency but I think that has failed. Not only because the government doesn't recognize it, but we also only use bitcoin as an investment instead of using it as currency. Not to mention problems like sudden increases in transaction fees and long confirmation times, bitcoin really cannot become a popular currency.

Generally it depends on the use of bitcoins if you can use bitcoins correctly then you can definitely be successful with bitcoin investment no matter what the market is. Many times it is seen that they invest without understanding well about Bitcoin or make a hasty decision. Due to hasty decision, they suffer a lot in investing in Bitcoin. For them, it may be better to invest in alt coins or different coins than Bitcoin. But I will always advise to invest in bitcoins from other coins because if we can check the bitcoin market and invest with patience and long term plan then surely we will get proper success through bitcoin investment. Many times it is seen that even big investors lose patience. Of course, patience is very important in our investment. We should not lose patience.

Bitcoin remains a digital cash and a store of value, it's not dragging positions with financial institutions or memecoins, it's in a class of it's own and has proven it's reputation as a means of payments and as an investment asset. Some businesses and individuals accept it as an alternative currency for payments, the only thing that has not made it's acceptance to gain the popularity that it deserves is the slow adoption rate, but it's less than two decades old compered to fiat that has always been here. Although I can't deny that Bitcoin is used more as an investment asset, investors buys and sells it for profit, all the same, you can't compare memecoins to Bitcoin.

Bitcoin is no longer digital cash if you can't buy in fraction instead you need to buy the whole coin and Bitcoin become tangible asset i.e. real coin. Since there's no change in Bitcoin, Bitcoin is still a digital cash, as long as you spend it to buy something online, you're already use Bitcoin as a digital cash.

Even you haven't use Bitcoin as a currency, but there are some people use it.

I wonder where you go the idea that bitcoin is no longer a digital currency, If bitcoin is no longer a digital currency then what do you think it is?
Also I think your choice of topic is not accurate because I'm still trying to figure out if you're asking a question or saying it cause it's true. If your question is whether bitcoin is no longer a digital cash the answer is no, it can't be held physically like other fiat currency or gold, bitcoin is a digital currency created by Satoshi and would continue to be a digital currency whether the financial institutions or meme coin advocates have taken over like you claim, but I also doubt if that's possible cause it's the most superior cryptocurrency and can't be controlled by any government or institution.

I think what the OP meant is that it is not a mainstream digital currency that people would want to use to buy everyday things. It's not impossible to buy your lunch with Bitcoin, but almost nobody would want to do that since it's impractical.

All that, and also that Bitcoin is, defacto, almost never used that way today, and is instead an investment instrument like gold, stocks, or whatever.

You could also use shares of AAPL or slivers of gold as a trading mechanism too, but... why would you?

Even if FIAT and meme coins become more powerful than Bitcoin (which will likely not happen), it will not change the fact that Bitcoin is a digital currency. Currently, Bitcoin is the number one cryptocurrency yet altcoins are still seen as digital currencies. Bitcoin has all the features that qualifies it to be called a digital currency.

• it is divisible
• its supply is scarce
• it is a store of value
• it is a means of payment
• A unit of account

Although many people still appreciate it more as an investment, it is still a currency and it is slowing gaining general acceptance.  Therefore, you should erase all doubts from your mind, the purpose for which Bitcoin was created still is still very valid.

people in steps 2-5 are the wall street types not the original OG liberals
these people screamed, begged and lobbied for those steps "for mainstream" and yet the intervention/integrations of those steps had caused alot of corporate sponsorship of centralised dev group and political push of corporations operating at the edges of the network to change bitcoins perceived utility, on purpose

there is a reason we hear cultish narratives blindly repeating, supporting, suggesting bitcoiners should abandon using bitcoin for small sat movements whilst allowing spammers, scammers, junkers and bloaters to continue using bitcoin and being told we should not stop the spammers/scammers annoying the network

segregation has 2 meaning: one code related and one socioeconomic related. the second one is this time a rich/poor divide rather than skin colour,
but welcome to wall street integrating and gentrifying the neighbourhood, all over again

BTC hasn't been cash for years. We diverted from Satoshi's vision years ago... I guess these days people will call it a "store of value" but nothing which drops 80% in a bear cycle is considering a store of value....

     For me, bitcoin is still a digital cash payment that can still be converted to real money. Not only is it proven to be a long-term investment, but as another opportunity, it can also provide good help to many people who believe in it.

    But the majority of those who believe in bitcoin are really good, and it's proven to be a long-term investment. Ultimately,  institutional investors are accumulating it for the long term.
But for now it is not good to use it as a mode of payment instead much better to hold it.

This definition will never disappear and will continue to be applied and many countries legalize bitcoin as an investment asset because they cannot possibly provide access to bitcoin as legal tender. It seems like we are thinking too far ahead and what the OP said will most likely not be realized in the near future because to legalize bitcoin as legal tender requires a lot of approval from the government in power and not to mention the regulations that regulate it

The problem is that not many people understand how to use it, even though if use is done P2P it will truly provide financial freedom. Basically, the definition of bitcoin as a digital currency will never change even if people try to explain it in any way because this definition was inherent when bitcoin was created.

I wasn't referring to the OGs, but the parrots on this forum who were repeating things they didn't have any idea of the result.
In the U.S politic they call them "low information voters".

The real OGs aren't in bitcointalk anymore since decade, except 2-3 grandpa.

By the way, I agree about the segregation

First of all you have a massive misunderstanding and it seems bit messed up when I see people comparing financial institutions with Bitcoin as they are two different and opposite entities. Meme coins are joke and cannot be considered for peer to peer as you never know when it will become zero, though some may use it for small transactions. Bitcoin has not lost an inch except the fact that transactions fee are pain in wrong place.

OP, what are you worried about, the use of bitcoin as a means of payment will not change even though the actual use cases may be lower or higher at certain times.

Each user has their own interest in bitcoin regardless of whether they want to use it as a means of payment or simply as an investment instrument, and both will not change anything about bitcoin other than just the volatility of its usage graph.

Don't worry, bitcoin will still be an alternative means of payment for anyone who is interested. No single project will take over completely although it makes sense that people would be interested in altcoins that have low transaction fees as a means of payment. The main purpose of bitcoin is as a means of payment, that will be a permanent use of bitcoin even if one day bitcoin is not the most interest as a means of payment.

bitcoin is a digital currency which will all know that from the process of knowing Bitcoin it is quite all right that Bitcoin is an independable currency and which is not under the control of government so looking at it in all round its an independable currency  and that's why government continues to fight against bitcoin

If we allow Bitcoin to be undermined with slow transactions and high fees we all lose. If we don't adopt Bitcoin the way it was intended, financial institutions win.

I've yet to hear a proposal for how you'd "disallow" it.  Mostly it just sounds like you want to tell people how they can and can't transact and are playing the hysteria card to make it sound as though people should agree with you.  I see your cries falling on deaf ears.  People are going to continue doing whatever the hell they want.  Because they can.

You bid for space in blocks.  That's the design.  Always has been.  Sometimes it gets expensive.  That's how bidding works.  The way Bitcoin was intended is that no one can interfere with anyone else's transactions.  That's what it's currently doing while it continues to resist forum hysteria about it supposedly being "slow" and "expensive".  Bitcoin is doing exactly what it's supposed to do.   

If you want fast and cheap, find a design that wasn't based on bidding for finite space in blocks.  You'll soon learn what you're sacrificing to obtain fast and cheap, though.