Bitcoin Forum

Hello Bitcoin Community Members,

Proposed site for Peer to Peer Marketplace
BitFirst.net is the proposed online site to be the online Peer to Peer Marketplace - accepting in bitcoins only (However, Users can decide to accept payments in their preferred crypto currency).

You can buy, you can sell and you can do auctions. You can even create your own decentralized online store and connect it to the BitFirst network. You can also sell Digital Goods, Provide Services, and do Trading.

The current status of BitFirst is at the site mockup step. Once the mockup of BitFirst is completed, estimated time needed to develop the system with milestones will be done, and cost estimates can follow.

Once time and cost estimates are done, donations will be required to fund the development.

Pledges
Pledges will be given Bits as reward for their pledge, and will put into the Hall of Fame as recognition (It will be their Internet Name). Pledges can sell their recognition to others if they wish. There will only be a fixed amount of bitcoins needed to get BitFirst to operating Live. Once Live, there will be no more request for pledges, so no more Bits will be given out. Pledges will be given first come first serve basis, and their Bit allocation will given on a time weighted scale. This will hopefully get pledges in faster as the early Pledges will be recognized more.
Formula: Bits = bitcoins pledged x (total days waiting for full Pledge - day number of Pledge) / total days waiting for full Pledge x total bitcoins Pledged
This means if Pledger pledged 1 bitcoin within 1 day compared to another Pledger that pledges on the last day, the one that pledged first gets more Bit recognition.

The BitFirst Community will also give bitcoin as rewards for their kindness.

The main focus for this proposed site is:
 - Server and Client side encryption with SSL on the entire site
 - Hierarchical Deterministic Wallets (HD Wallet) - BIP32
 - Decentralised Multisignature HD Wallet - Your bitcoins is always in your control. BitFirst do not hold your bitcoins nor does it have your private keys.
 - Multi server and multi domain name redundancy always ON mode

BitFirst.net will never be sold as it does not belong to anyone.

This proposal will be done in steps:
Step 1: Mockup of site BitFirst.net to be completed
Step 2: Milestones to be completed based on the mockup
Step 3: Milestones will be divided into stages
        Stage 1: Live Mode - All milestones needed to get BitFirst operating Live (Security and Core features to be developed and tested).
        Stage 2: BitFirst Community driven Roadmap - All features to be listed and discussed using the BitFirst Roadmap. Milestones for the features to be created and the BitFirst Community can allocate or donate bitcoins for the features they want. Highest ranking features will be worked on first (security and bugs will have higher priority).
Step 4: Time required estimates to develop Stage 1 to be completed
Step 5: Cost estimates to develop Stage 1 to be completed
Step 6: Go Live.

Current Status: Step 1 - Mockup of site BitFirst.net to be completed.

Currently calling for the Bitcoin Community Members to help out with the proposed mockup site for BitFirst.net.

It would be great to get help to create a site like this. Please private message or post below your interest to help out - no coding is required to do the mockup as it is just drag and drop. If you have time, please donate your time and help out.

Site: www.bitfirst.net
Roadmap: www.bitfirst.net/pages/Roadmap
Reddit: www.reddit.com/r/bitfirst
Email: admin@bitfirst.net

Thank you.

Mock up for Basic Members Area is done. This is the default landing page after Members log in.
www.bitfirst.net/pages/Members_Area

Since the Marketplace only accepts bitcoins, it shows the main options on how to get bitcoins.
Members can buy, sell, trade or provide services for bitcoins. The mockup for these links will be done later.

Below that is the main part of the site (Buyers Area, Sellers Area, Auctions Area and Services Area).
These mockups will be done later.

It would be nice if someone can come up ideas on images/icons for the Areas to make it look nice.
The Green buttons and blue box can also be changed to make it look nice. Ideas and suggestions are welcomed.

Mockup for Buyers Area 90% done. www.bitfirst.net/pages/Buyers_Area

This is the page where most of the Buyers will browse BitFirst. You got the search bar, categories on the left, and the settings on the right.
In the middle is the Featured Listings - This is where the Sellers can pay bitcoins to get certain traffic to their page.
Users can view by list view or grid view, and can change options such as see auctions only/buy now only or both.

Settings on the right:
- Shipping to Country filter (so Buyers can focus on only products shipping to their country only).
- Filter by item conditions (some likes bargins whereas others like brand new items)
- search by price range (bitcoin or fiat)
- search by Sellers ratings

Updated the proposed homepage landing page. www.bitfirst.net
Took some features from Buyers Area and put it on the homepage.
Now has Buy bitcoin button for new people that dont know how to get bitcoins. This Buy bitcoin button will go to the page where Sellers put their listing - Buyers can filter their search based on country, bank account type. Sellers will be ranked on speed of service and feedback ratings. This proposed page will be created later.

Your site design leaves much to be desired...

I like the concept of the site, but I completely agree with this. The UI just isn't intuitive enough. You need to be using things like Amazon and eBay as references. While you may not want to be one of those, they spend a lot of time analyzing and researching UI techniques.

Yes I agree. These pages are mockups (think of design plans for building a house). You first talk to a Builder and you tell them what you want. The Builder will get the Architecture to draw the plans for you. Once you are happy, the Builder will get the Engineering plans drawn for you. The Builder can also get a 3D House drawn for you so you can see. You wont see the final product until the Builder builds it for you.

The Builders are the Developers in this case. We need to draw the plans for the Developers to build it to our specifications.
If you have time, you can help design the pages and make it look pretty.
For now, the main priority is to get the concepts done so the Developers can price the time and costing involved.

Ah, I get you now. Sadly, I suck at the UI stuff. I can code and whatnot, but when it comes to making things look great, that's not my area, :p.

@ranlo Sure no problems. You can help with listing what is bad so that it will be improved. I have noted in the roadmap that the UI should be more intuitive. Thank you.

Mockup of Page: Buy bitcoin button www.bitfirst.net/pages/Buy_bitcoins_here
Members can Buy bitcoins online from their bank account in their country:
- 1 search field for country and click Find Offers. Lists all available Sellers in their Country.
- Sellers will be decentralized stores connected to the BitFirst.net network with their own domain name
- Sellers have their pricing all inclusive price
- Clicking on Buy will redirect Buyer to the Sellers website
- Ratings - Volume of trade; Buyers Ratings; Frequency of trade; Age of account.
- All Sellers have Multisignature HD Wallets like BitFirst

Updated Donor section:
Donors
There will only be a fixed amount of bitcoins needed to get BitFirst to operating Live. Donors will be given first come first serve basis, and their Bit allocation will given on a time weighted scale. This will hopefully get Donors in faster as the early Donors will be recognized more.

Formula: Bits = bitcons donated x (total days waiting for full donation - day number of donation) / total days waiting for full donation x total bitcoins donated

This means if Donor donated 1 bitcoin within 1 day compared to another Donor that donates on the last day, the one donated first gets more Bit recognition.
Hopefully this is fair for Donors. Start date of Donations will commence once mockup is done and time and cost estimates are finalized.
Please follow twitter @bitfirst to be notified of the start date
or watch this thread for updates.

Good concept.
needed secure transfer of goods and the design needed to improve

Hi Bibop, yes the secure transfer of goods will be 2 of 3 multisignature HD wallets. HD wallets mean that Seller has 1 tree for each Buyer, and that Buyer whenever they pay, it goes under that tree. Each Buyer is a Tree so all transactions will be structured and easy to see. The 3rd signature will be the BitFirst community. A kind of trust system based on reputation. If you have ideas of design, please share.

That is a good idea my friend but site is not working here.

Hi JessyMatt,
The site is up www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/www.bitfirst.net
DNS https://www.whatsmydns.net/#A/www.bitfirst.net

Can you please check again?
If its not loading
- what country are you loading it from?
- are you loading from a computer? If not, what device?
- what is the error display? Page not loading?

What do you really mean by 3rd key with the community? For this to work well, the key should probably be with the website and not out in the community.

Hi kittucrypt,
Thanks for the message. All private keys will not be on the BitFirst website itself. They will be on different servers with different domain names, and these will also be client side and server side encrypted, so server will not have access to the private keys. Servers will call one another, so even though Users are on the bitfirst.net site, it can call to different servers with different domain names (so they can access directly with bitfirst.net or the other allocated domain name). So the private keys are in the BitFirst community network of servers (decentralized, distributed and encrypted).
    3rd Party - BitFirst Trusted Community Member
      Community Members will be anonymous to Buyer and Seller
      Only used when Buyer or Seller request Trade Dispute
      3rd Party will find best outcome for Buyer and Seller
      If Buyer or Seller not happy with Trade Dispute outcome, they can request Resolution Dispute
        Resolution Dispute
          More Trusted Community Members will be Called upon
            Community Auditors will investigate both Buyer and Seller
            Additional questions will be requested and Answers should be given
            Community Jury will be called upon to vote
              They can request additional information for Auditors to investigate
              If Buyer or Seller still not happy with outcome
                They can request 1 more group of Community Jury to vote
                Each Buyer and Seller can request 2 Dispute each
                Max dispute for each trade is 4 times
                  If both Buyer and Seller have even outcomes
                  5th Round of voting can be requested and it will be final and binding
                Both Buyer and Seller cannot interact with each other again to prevent future problems
        Verdict by Voting style involving Trusted Community Members [anonymous and binding]

Updated Donors section in OP (in bold)
Donors will be given Bits for recognition for their kind donations, and will put into the Hall of Fame as recognition (It will be their Internet Name). Donors can sell their recognition to others if they wish. There will only be a fixed amount of bitcoins needed to get BitFirst to operating Live. Once Live, there will be no more request for donations so no more Bits will be given out. Donors will be given first come first serve basis, and their Bit allocation will given on a time weighted scale. This will hopefully get Donors in faster as the early Donors will be recognized more.
Formula: Bits = bitcons donated x (total days waiting for full donation - day number of donation) / total days waiting for full donation x total bitcoins donated
This means if Donor donated 1 bitcoin within 1 day compared to another Donor that donates on the last day, the one donated first gets more Bit recognition.

The BitFirst Community will also give incentives to Donors for their kindness.

While I love the idea of the resolution dispute, what happens if there is no determination as to who is in the right and who is wrong? This has always been a fear of mine, or being proven "wrong" falsely.

Yes this is one of the biggest problem to solve. Both sides have 2 appeals (4 in total). If still 2 vs 2 outcome for Buyer and Seller, then last appeal is final (costs too much time as it can go on forever). Each round of voting will be different people and the number of people can be any amount greater than 1 person. 5 rounds of voting is a lot. Basically trade with your Peers carefully and select your Peers carefully. Put special filters on your trades and weed out the bad apples. The system will be strong with an excellent rating, reputation and filter system. When all goes well, everybody will be happy. If not, then the system can be tweaked based on the BitFirst community.

Would it not be better to have an odd number of votes then (say 5)? This would ensure that there is always one person with more votes than the other. It can still lead to problems, but I think this is a better method than 4 total.

Yes it is 5 in total. Buyer and Seller have 2 appeals each - if it is a tie, then the last appeal (5) will be the decider. A special note is that each round, 1 or more Community Member(s) can check all evidence from Buyer/Seller. The Community members will be an odd number group, and each will have equal voting.

Based on the feedback so far the site is going through a redesign now. The original goal was to complete the mockup of the site as fast as possible and get feedback with the concept, then go back and improve the User Interface. However, the concept will be put aside while site User Interface redesign take priority.

Thanks for the feedback (@siarhei, @ranlo and @JessyMatt). Very much appreciated!

Ah, that should work then. I think it'll be interesting to see how it pans out. At least it helps ensure that each person (assuming they hit the tie) had an equal chance of being sided with.

There is an inherent challenge with this approach. The wisdom of crowds is not always right. Trusted accounts can be manipulative or can exercise muscle. Besides, such a method will open the dispute resolution to prejudices and biases of individuals. How can you ensure that they remain cognitive in their decision making?

Hi kittucrypt, thank you for the insight and yes, you are correct on all your points.
Re: Wisdom of crowds - Each Voter is its own - they will not see others. That is, the voters will not see other voters and will not see their votes. Outcome will be displayed once votes are all completed. So its the wisdom of the individual and not the crowd in this system.

Re: Trusted accounts can be manipulative or can exercise muscle - True. It will be a random selection of Trusted accounts. Trusted accounts are harder to be manipulative compared to untrusted accounts. Exercise muscle is the whole put as they are trusted. When they break the trust, then they will not be trusted so they loose the privilege of having a strong reputation.

Re: Besides, such a method will open the dispute resolution to prejudices and biases of individuals - If there is a better system, please share. This system is better than trusting 1 company and their employees to do the dispute resolution. There will be bottle necks as too many Employees to pay and fees will increase. Then you do not have to worry about the company having a change of management and being unfair to Buyers/Sellers.

Re: How can you ensure that they remain cognitive in their decision making? - Its up to the BitFirst Community. The better the Members are, the better the Community is, and the more widely used the BitFirst.net Marketplace. The system is there to weed out bad players, so hopefully good players will stay and continue to trade.

I think when it really comes down to it, at some point someone has to make the decisions. Even when you deal with a credit card company to dispute a charge, you're dealing with different people that have to pick a side. All of them could be manipulated, but at the end of the day there's really no choice but to either accept it or not. The more people there are you deal with, the lesser the chance of manipulation as well.

As for the OP, can you leave the judges anonymous? This would go a long way towards keeping manipulation down. Basically the way I see it, the entire situation should be anonymous for both sides:

*User sees that there is someone judging. They know nothing. You could even name them User/Judge
*Judge sees the user's situation. They can't tell who that person is, they just know them as "User"

This would help a lot.

*Verdict by Voting style involving Trusted Community Members [anonymous and binding]*
Yes Judges are anonymous - most likely Number ID that changes with each Dispute so nobody can track who they are. Their Reputation/Ratings will show, but ID is anonymous. This prevent the bad players from targeting the Trusted Members of the Community.
User being anonymous would be interesting as you mention. Quite a good idea, thank you. User could be anonymous with only Reputation/Ratings shown with history of trades. I guess the more the dispute increases, the more information can be revealed. You can suggest this feature in the Community Roadmap once the system is Live as it will be a good feature.

Please note that it will not cost anything to go into dispute resolution (prevent rich people vs poor people having access to same service). It will be in the interest of the Trusted Members of the Community to help the system stay healthy as without Buyers and Sellers, they would not be able to trade. This can help keep fees low and help scale up.

I wasn't even thinking about the judges being able to see the user's past ratings and reputation. To enhance this even more, the judge should be able to see how many times that user has been to arbitration (as the buyer and seller) and how many times they won. If someone has gone 50x and has won all 50x, for example, that's a great sign. Someone who has lost every time may be a bigger issue that needs to be evaluated by admins.

Yes correct. The Users that go into arbitration all the time and looses all the time will have a bad Rating/Reputation - so I am sure a lot of other Users would have filtered out those bad apples and wont let them buy or see their listings.
Admins - they will not play a big role. It will fall into the hands of Trusted Community Members. This is a Peer to Peer Marketplace, so there is no room for BitFirst to have a big army of Admins as power will concentrate on the Admins, which is not the goal. Removing the bad apples will be another process - maybe you can think of a good system and suggest it after the system goes Live, as removing and preventing bad apples is a good feature to have.

Redesign of the homepage is done. www.bitfirst.net
Background is grey to prevent brightness, and the main listing is white to attract attention. The text is black to the grey so its not too strong on the eyes, and the white text is not pure white as its too bright.

The page is designed for mobile devices, so everything is bigger than normal, and the width is good too.
The rest of the site will follow this theme.

Thank you for all the feedback so far. Can you please check if this new design is better than the old one, and if anything can be improved?

Thanks.

I like this layout a lot more, but I really don't like that font. The prices look weird (since the numbers are all different sizes), and categories are a little odd as well for the same reason (although this is livable).

There are many Bitcoin Marketplace already exist.You wasted your time on it
I really want you to see this post,these are the creative and unique ideas that are remaining

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=627371.0

Are you using a windows machine? I've just tested it here and it looks like Linux is loading fine but windows is having a different look - both the font and alignment is off. I'm getting the Developers to fix it now.

Re: Price size changed. Made them same size for the line that it is on. Removed Buy and Bid buttons as it was too messy. Now its a clean look. [Thanks for this feedback].

Re: Categories - The rank of the categories will be smart ranking. Based on popularity. The more popular the Listings are in that category, the higher that category will go up the ranking. So good category will move up and bad ones will fade away. The Category heading will have a link enabled to open the category listing and see everything in A to Z format.

Hi Coinbuddy, thanks for the comment. We've already got donation to do this proposal and to complete the roadmap with all milestones with time and cost estimates - so it will be done. Having said that, there is no other sites that do HD Wallets, Multisignature, Client and Server side encryption, decentralized, Users have full control of their private keys (and not the site), and best of all, Community driven focused.

Thanks.

Yeah, I'm on Windows. Feel free to toss over an update when you get this fixed and I'll re-evaluate things and let you know how it looks, :).

This is by far the cheapest self plug I have seen. While the OP and other people on this thread are discussing his idea,  you swoop in between saying that this idea has already been implemented? And then when we click on the link, it is to a post by you listing two of your own ideas.

Do you think my misleading people to your post, you can get some attention?

OP has been edited: To make things more easy to see - Donors are now called Pledges.

Great article on how a startup became a success:
www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-regulation-lessons-early-days-skype

Redesigned finished for Buy bitcoins here page: www.bitfirst.net/pages/Buy_bitcoins_here
The page as a simple design. Just 1 search bar - searches your country for any Offers to sell bitcoin in your country. Has the Seller's name, feedback/ratings/reputation, website or BitFirst store, Bank name description, Price selling, min and max Sell limits, payment type, and speed of service (48hr and 30 day average time of Seller to finalize trade).
Clicking on the Headers of the column will arrange the column highest to lowest or lowest to highest.

Sign up page redesigned: www.bitfirst.net/pages/Sign_Up_for_an_Account
User creates a temporary account with email and password.

Clicks sign up now button -  brings the page www.bitfirst.net/pages/Sign_Up_for_an_Account_confirm_email
They log in with the email and password that was just created.

Clicks log in now button - brings page www.bitfirst.net/pages/Sign_Up_for_an_Account_Login_Successful_confirm_email
User needs to verify their email address. A confirmation code gets sent to their email address.

They copy that code to confirm it - clicks confirm code button - brings page www.bitfirst.net/pages/Sign_Up_Confirmed
User creates a unique Login ID and unique Display name (this name is what other Users see when they are in the system).

User clicks save button [AJAX window will display successful or error - if successful redirects to login page www.bitfirst.net/pages/Login
User logs in with their new Login ID and their password.

Any feedback on this process and website User Interface would be greatly appreciated.

Proposal for Setting 2 Factor Authentication with Google Authenticator is done: www.bitfirst.net/pages/Google_Authenticator_Settings
Feedback on anything missing would be much appreciated.

Proposal for Main Security Settings page done: www.bitfirst.net/pages/Security_Settings
It has security setting for 2 Factor Authentication, IP Lock, Computer Lock and Time Lock.

Proposal for IP lock settings done: www.bitfirst.net/pages/IP_Address_Lock
Users can put IP lock on their static IP, their country, or manually add IP lock range.
IP Lock can be customized to their entire account, or certain sections of their account (eg sending bitcoins).

Proposal for Computer Lock Settings done: www.bitfirst.net/pages/Computer_Lock_Settings
Users can lock their account or certain part of their account to their computer.
Users also have the option to give access to more computers with the Add more computers button by entering the MAC address of their other computers.

Proposal for Time Lock Settings done: www.bitfirst.net/pages/Time_Lock_Settings
Users can lock their account or sections of their account based on Time Settings.
This is good for outside business hours, sleeping or vacation.
Users set their Local Time based on their timezone. Then set the lock time. Daylight savings auto adjust feature will be built in.

Any feedback on User Interface or missing features, please post here or PM.

Proposed Buyers Area done: www.bitfirst.net/pages/buyers_area
Search Settings option can be shown or hidden. Buyers can filter by item conditions, change to their local fiat currency, search by price range in fiat or bitcoins, view listings by Grid or list view, and filter shipping to country.

Hi,

Good news. BitFirst.net has been fully funded. Thank you everybody for the help so far. If anybody still wants to fund this project, please PM or contact below. Offer will expire in 7 days and ends Friday 20th 2014 GMT.

Please keep an eye out for the when this project runs live in the near future.

Thank you again.

I like this concept perhaps there is something we can do to work together contact me if your interested
and working together.