Bitcoin Forum

What I find interesting:



With 1 BTC you could buy about 0,1-1% of coins like dogecoin,darkcoin in their beginings.

With 1 Btc here you ar buying about 0,00385%

To say that differently . You are trusting ethereum about 30-300X more than Darkcoin in its beginning. Interesting.
Or you could invest in 3000-30000 beginning altcoins.

Dont you think few would made that 10x-100x push?
Those mentioned above did just that.

-------------------------------------------------

Now to bitcoin:

The GREAT transparecy and anouncment of the 4000+BTC dumb just killed 20% of bitcoins price. Thats just fantastical. I love to see this. Propably will go around 480 and rebounce (I love it cause I am gonna buy then) but man. Aint those clowns from ethereum stupid, anouncing the dump and dumping the price on them...

I don't think that ethereum IPO have influenced the bitcoin's drop in value, but I'm still a newbye..

ethereum is just Ripple scam 2.0, except they are cashing out way earlier than Ripple did.

ethereum founder's new mansion thank you for your donation.

I'm not even sure why centralized shit like Ripple or ethereum can even scam anyone from Bitcoin community.

A must read for all those getting scammed into ethereum: http://gavintech.blogspot.com/2014/06/bit-thereum.html

And for anyone who honestly believes bitcoin is being "killed" by this non-factor new altcoin, have a look at the big picture reality:

https://i.imgur.com/FnJShDU.png


All of this has happened before, all of it will happen again. And again. And again. And again until fiat no longer exists.

this does highlight one thing.
when someone holds bitcoin due to true value day trading or mining they wont sell at a loss, thus creating a resistance point.. the only problem is when they buy an item 'thinking' its value is on-par with their bitcoin profit, they would spend/sell. yet if that item was vapour product (no cost/no true value) the person receiving bitcoin has no costs to worry about and such would sell bitcoin for anything as its pure profit.

again..
unlike investors who trade bitcoin-fiat who may have bought for over $500, along with miners who have mining costs in excess of $500, these nasty scammy vapour coin makers such as ripple, ether, next, etc. will sell bitcoin for fiat at any price. even below the resistance point of true value day-traders/miners.

so will people stop buying crap or your just ruining the resistance points where smart people refuse to sell for less. dont let the scammy people selling vapour items ruin the price

Like I said before, biggest IPO in crypto history and correct me if im wrong, but if they do decide to dump and leave it would have certainly an impact on the price, unless they dump slowly.

ether is just an sql database,same as ripple. they have not released the ether blockchain (ETA 2015), so at this point its not that clever. its just greed. today selling a 'promise' / a concept not an actual coin and between last month and 2015 all the buyers have is their name on a sql database.

so these etherium peoples greed, outweigh's any smart's that they may have had, so dont expect them to act rationally.

i too thought they would have done private trades away from exchanges to not impact the resistance point, but their greed has proven me wrong and is damaging the resistance point. the only positive of this is the day-traders buying their sells, wont sell below the $530. so lets hope the etherium greedy B.Stards run out of bitcoin to allow bitcoin to retrace back to the $550+ resistance point

That's what a smart scam artist would do, after letting the hype build up the value for some time. Slowly trickle out your earnings so as to not set off any alarm bells that could slow the tide of profit from morons.

BTW Bitcoin has already begun its recovery from the low point of 525, back near 540 now.

From ethereum TOS :

"....for technical reasons EthSuisse may need to change the annual rate of new creation to a value lower than 26% to account for changes to the Ethereum mining algorithm or to address other issues that may arise. There is no guarantee that this percentage will be accurate or that this rate will continue at the same level....."

Ethereum is not a currency. It's an inflationary fuel with nothing guaranteed.

Check your math:

It's a 0.0000385 fraction which is 0.00385 %

ah, thx ofc ur right. gotta edit all.

still..a concept iwth eta of 2015 300x more reputable than some most of innovative coins? just crazy in my books

Big fool to attend ethereum IPO

Bitcoin's price drop has nothing to do with Ethereum. It was on a natural downtrend, and quite likely it will breach $500.

Yeah, the ethereum people are surely not wasting any time. Their initial funding drive is barely a week old, and they are already cashing out thousands of Bitcoin.

there is othing like natural in bitcoin world. The price drops are cause by peple and not some inexpplicable events. Ethereum anounced they are gonna dump 5000btc thats buy walls from 535 to 480. And they hold 20 000 more...and they are gonna dump that too..

There is definitely 300 times more work involved in created something like Etheruem compared to Dogecoin, so why not 300 times the starting value?

Did Etherium alsways plan to have an IPO?  I just get the feeling they are making alot of decisions at the last minute and that may have been one IMO.

Anyone, who have read the Ethereum TOS, knows it is a clear pump & dump scheme relying on a novel idea. The greedy people are gonna loose and the real Bitcoiners dont give a damn to weekly or even monthly fluctuations.

Can someone give me a link showing that Etheruem just dumped their BTC funds?

Ethereum announcing the dump is only a show off in other to promote ripples, but no matter how they tried ripples can not unseat bitcoin.

Could you post a link to the announcment of the 4000+BTC dump?

Let me guess - Ether doesn't publicly display their BTC addresses.

You can see the ethereum ipo bitcoin address here.

https://blockchain.info/address/36PrZ1KHYMpqSyAQXSG8VwbUiq2EogxLo2

https://blockchain.info/address/36PrZ1KHYMpqSyAQXSG8VwbUiq2EogxLo2

hit Filter => Sent below the QR code on the right side to display outgoing transactions only

wow, people still send money there.
wow, just wow.

I dont understand how people had the valor to invest several coins into this scheme..  i mean 1 or 2 if you have hundreds would be fine but there are people spending  even 200 bitcoins into that shit. Cant hold bitcoins.

how is that saying around here? Ah, yes: "Weak hands out"

were did they announce they will dump the 4,000 bitcoins though does anyone have a link?

First time I heard about Ethereum was in Bitcoin magazine last January 2013.

What's the ETA on its release?

for the lazy people.

https://blog.ethereum.org/2014/08/08/announcement-on-planned-exodus-withdrawal/

Thanks, that post explains what they are doing with the bitcoins they have already moved, but what about the vast majority left over? I can find no information about what they plan to do with the vast majority of unspent coins after the ether IPO is over.

They'll end up dumping those too. They need fiat to run and Bitcoin is a competitor to their new product.

I agree, they need fiat to pay wages and rent bills.

So, people are selling alt coin to invest in Ethereum coin which cause alt coin to crash. And Ethereum coin developers are selling bitcoin which cause bitcoin to go down?

bingo! Hence why bitcoin + most alts are getting creamed this week. Those ethereum crooks are killing markets for their own personal gain.

Look like they are only cashing out 2000 bitcoin.

If 2k bitcoin cash out causing bitcoin to drop 10%. Imagine they cash out even more.

They said they are distributing the btc not that they are actually selling it.   Blaming them for dropping the price is like blaming someone for using cash and then spending it.  Isn't that kinda silly?  Btc was made to be used and to easily raise funds online. Looks like it succeeded to me!

+1 ethereum is smart as hell they collected btc from all the stupid ppl who think its an actual investment cuz they fail to understand that ether is hardcore inflationary. LOL !

ethereum team is obviously financial geniouses. they know how to collect dem funds!  bow, slaves!

~CfA~

If you think it is a scam, vote with your wallet. To us the cheap BTC ! :D

Do you even read?

https://blockchain.info/address/36PrZ1KHYMpqSyAQXSG8VwbUiq2EogxLo2

They've split up the transactions into amounts under 1 BTC but they are definitely dumping and I don't mean last week or last month but now.

They've fire sold 2500 BTC in the past days.  That's a dump.

https://blockchain.info/charts/balance?timespan=30days&showDataPoints=false&daysAverageString=1&show_header=true&scale=0&address=36PrZ1KHYMpqSyAQXSG8VwbUiq2EogxLo2

Look at the numbers on the left side of the graph and then pay attention to the right side of the graph.  2500 coins were dumped since August 10.  That's an average of $300K a day.  Granted the volume right now is $30 million but most of that volume is day traders and bots.  Dumping $300K can create a huge amount of volume when all the day traders and bots react to it, never mind the weak hands.

who cares?  did anyone really think they'd just hold dem bitcoins or what? LOL !

~CfA~

just quoting that for history

 - also i like that Gavin called them "Oracles"

It amazes me how many people will come ouf of the woodwork claiming it's the end of Bitcoin.  I tend to believe they are just fishing for cheap coins which I feel is highly immoral.  What really scares me is if they believe it to really be the case.  There is clearly know reason at all for such a thing to happen and it's interesting to see how much fear can dome from fud.

Think I saw an interview a few years back when people think bitcoin is a bubble at 3 dollars. You just can't convince everyone this is not bubble.

"The market climbs a wall of worry and slides down a river of hope." - old Wall Street saying...from old Wall Street.

This is a good one that I'll be sure to keep in mind when I'm finding in myself in a similar situation and facing a tough decision,  You my friend are wise beyond your years.  ;)

Is there evident the price correction is due to Ethereum dumping or pure speculation at this point?

The blockchain address still show they have over 24k BTC, did they say what they are going to do with it?

That's a nice article by Gavin, and I hadn't seen it yet, so thanks for linking to it. I like how he quotes "complexity is the enemy of security", but there's another angle to approach it from: usability. Complexity is the enemy of real world usage by any significant number of the non-genius-level-technically-inclined part of the human population.

They have moved out about 3,700BTC (https://blockchain.info/address/36PrZ1KHYMpqSyAQXSG8VwbUiq2EogxLo2?filter=1) over the last five days.
However, I think the drop is not caused by this alone. It's a combination of several factors, though I believe the biggest of them all may be the Bitfinex margin calls.
The was a moment of panic when 650BTCs were suddenly sold significantly below market price.
It caused a short chain reaction that was exacerbated by Ethereum's 3,700BTC sell-off on a market already spooked by the proposed BitLicense framework announced by the New York State Department of Financial Services.

You have no idea how beyond. ;D

But I will keep crankin' 'em out when I see an opening. Myself, I prefer not to be clever about the hand-wringing here; I think the people worrying about the end of Bitcoin are just "nervous in the service." 

If 2k bitcoin cash out causes such a 'crash' then the bitcoin ecosystem is not as healthy as some say it is.

Acturlly i don't think so.Yes,ethereum will dump a huge amounts of bitcoin but when the price of bitcoin is low enough people will panic buy.

Gavin re:etherium = "complexity is the enemy of security"...
And I might add Ripple proved that complexity is the enemy of usability.

Mainstream crypto and digital assets MUST  BE  DEAD  SIMPLE...
These eggheads with their Gen 2.0 projects have no clue about this.

Bitcoin is a better investment right now than ANY of the Gen 2.0 nightmares.

Anyway bitcoiners can get back at ethereum?!

I'm glad you at least said Gen 2.0 nightmares.  I'm sure that was a stab at Ethereum, Ripple and 1.5 coins like Maidsafe / Mastercoin.

If you invested today...


  Is BTC a better investment than Ethereum?  Probably.   Is BTC a better investment then Ripple?  Probably

 Is 1 BTC in BTC better than NXT?  Debatable - many people are very bullish about NXT just due to its' ecosystem.


Is 1 BTC in BTC better than NEM?  Definitely not.  NEM is only $600 per stake


Is 1 BTC in BTC better than NODE?  Probably not.  NODE may have issues but it's cheap at $300 and I myself have not had a reason to sell it.


Is .1 BTC in BTC better than ORA?  Probably not.  ORA is only what like $40 per stake?  May as well just grab one and just wait and see what happens.

I view all so call gen 2 crypto as scams.

That would be an unpopular opinion as you are responding to a thread in the alternate section.

  I haven't been scammed out of any money from an actual generation 2.0 coin but that is because I avoided Ethereum and Maidsafe.  NXT, NEM, ORA, NODE and 1.5 coins like Redd did not steal or scam any money from me - these were coins I bought and I always had the option to sell.

too generalised, that's like viewing all americans as terrorists or all short people stupid etc., in other words totally inappropriate

Bitcoin needs to be big enough and strong enough so that it is not affected by these things.  Guys at Ethereum are getting rich, and the bitcoin price is going down.  If bitcoin can be hurt so much, then there is a clear flaw in the bitcoin system. 

The issue here is more that the volume is mainly fake.

Dumping $500K - $1 million a day (like Ethereum is doing) is enough to send the price crashing, because the bots and scripts will play musical chairs with that dumped BTC (dump $1 million and the bots and scripts will turn it into $20+ million).

How much has NEM raised for far, isn't that going to be worse for btc price when that gets dumped out or is Eth IPO a lot bigger?

52 BTC.  NEM was not an IPO but a call for participation, where sending in a token amount of BTC reserved you a spot to become a future stakeholder.  There was publicly audited taint analysis to ensure these were real persons and nobody was certain back in January that NEM would be worth anything.  

There was at least 1200 veteran accounts and a distribution of 1200 beats everything to date (another 1800 were accounts which registered after January).  Even if 1000 out of 3000 accounts were sockpuppets (unlikely due to taint analysis and the time it would take to game it and avoid being caught) this distribution beats everything in crypto history.



 It's a different now that NEM has been $3 - $6 million capitalization for an unreleased coin and people are very bullish about it.  NEM is currently $600 on the NXT asset exchange (the capitalization for NEMstake is incorrect as NEMstake only represents 1 billion coins when NEM is 4 billion).

Here are the numbers to answer your question.

Ethereum: 28011 BTC (https://blockchain.info/address/36PrZ1KHYMpqSyAQXSG8VwbUiq2EogxLo2)  (still ongoing)
NEM: 66 BTC (https://blockchain.info/address/1Lk5Paws9T1YpoSeLeZT7ZeSQKW7UNq4TJ) + 400k NXT (https://nxtblocks.info/#section/accountId/NXT-PW84-22VF-KJFX-22222)  (0.23% of ethereum's BTC as of posting)
NXT: 21 BTC (https://blockchain.info/address/1BCN1ugdKdWd9pQ8Am9hMhtHZfmbXzxE8a)                      (0.07% of ethereum's BTC a.o.p.)

66 BTC is the correct figure.  I said 52 BTC as that is what I happened to recall it to be.  It is an immaterial difference when we consider all these IPOs on Bitcointalk which do 100s - 10,000s of BTC.

NEM is theoretically trying to repeat the Bitcoin experience where all early adopters (like Bitcoin pre-2012) are given a fair chance in the distribution.

Didn't realise the IPO was that massive!

They must of had impressive concepts to fool so many people into buying in.

Maidsafe was $8 -  $12 million altogether and it was alleged with evidence to had involved laundered MtGox Bitcoins.

Ethereum is like $15 million with 4400 participants.  Top 100 wallets control half of Ethereum.  The thing is wallets are not humans.  If I invested $1 million $Fiat into Ethereum, I would do it in 5 to 20 wallets to minimize loss from a hack theft.  As well the 4400 participants is not impressive considering all of Ethereum's marketing and marketing budget.  NEM probably could had done up to 10,000 as there was big demand to become a stakeholder (it was capped at 3000 as the intent wasn't to become a planetary relief fund).
 

Maybe Proof of Concept coins will be the next big thing.

Great ideas with great photoshop skills and you can make yourself a lot of btc and never having to release the product.

This is one of the older scam concepts actually, i.e.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=457575.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=457575.msg5302833#msg5302833
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=384097.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=400356.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=422309.0
[...]

You mentioned Visa Coin.  Yes  ;D  Other people wouldn't find it funny (esp those who lost money) but it was comically the worst scam on BTT which took like $120K+ at the time.


As I said here - never ever ever ever ever ever trust a developer with an account named after the coin.  I have almost never seen any of them work out.  The odd exceptions might be Redd, Qora and Ora but last I check none of these coins have yet to go past $5 million capitalization.

I think the one exception I have seen is Guldencoin, the main account is Guldencoin, but this is one of the creators on TV and giving out his name.
https://vimeo.com/98412899

Oops it was this one

http://vimeo.com/101441955

Not sure what happened with Guldencoin.  It used to be like $300K and now it's like $30K something.  I haven't been following it but it reinforces the skepticism I have about developers naming themselves after coins and POW coins in general.

I theorize the national coins should just move away from POW and Airdrop.

If I made my own national coin it would be POS and I would restrict the number of applicants who can receive their stake in a given week and/or month.  So yes it would still technically be an air drop but if only 100 or 1000 people can claim their coins every month then it lessens the sell off (it shouldn't be hard to figure out an appropriate release)

It's looks to be making a slight comeback at close to $70k , but yeah far off the 5 million capitalization you mentioned. hehe

So no one thinks that the Co-Creator of Ethereum is also the Co-Creator of Bitcoin Magazine ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitalik_Buterin

What do you mean?  Are you suggesting a tin foil hat conspiracy that Vitalik Buterin could be a paid Mascot for Goldman Sachs, and there's 20 Indians in the backroom doing all the programming?   :D

OMG if you get a chance read there 10 page terms and conditions before buying the coin. lol. Dangers of Quantum Computing is in there.. to funny.

Doubt Ethereum is the reason. People who invest into Ethereum probably having a big regret right now seeing all altcoin sinking down.

Dumping $500K+ a day...   then the bots and scripts betting short increasing that to $5 million downward pressure?  Then the exchanges which are being hacked.



There could be some legit people freaking out about Bitlicense but I think the IRS ruling was more destructive.

It has been a bit of a 'perfect storm' of different things coming together, and I think all the things you've mentioned played a part in addition to the fact that its summer and buyers are on holiday while others may be cashing out to pay for a holiday. It certainly can't be just Etheruem devs dumping and nothing else.

how can this destroy fiat currency?

Fiat will exists as long as we have goverments.

Has anyone posted the Ethereum BTC wallet?

This guy has

Qora dev is a genious
Buy the original one not the fake (Ora, Kora)
Im not impressed by Vitalik, Qora dev is stronger

Bitcoin is really over rated if one whale or Ethereum can cause the price to drop this much.

Peer to peer protocol suppose to make it more resilient and anti-fragile. We still have a long way to go apparently.

Ripple is still on the top 3 spots in term of market cap. While it didn't replace bitcoin, it manage to pull out a lot of money from bitcoin market cap.