Bitcoin Forum

A few weeks ago our company requested a wire withdrawal from our Bitstamp corporate account.

After a week the money came back into our bitstamp account (at a $45 cost to us) with bitstamp saying: "The reason for the failure was stated as a breach of a recipients bank's Terms of Service."

This is quite worrying so we contacted our bank, and no they had not seen or rejected any transfer; and said they'd need to see the SWIFT transfer form (MT103) to check it out further.

Bitstamp then had the nerve to ask us to pay $40 extra just to get the proper receipt of the transfer; which we paid.

The receipt, that we paid $40 for, shows only that they transfer money between Raiffeisen Banka d.d. to Raiffeisen Bank international....and the RBI had rejected to process the transfer saying that they do not execute transfers related to Bitcoin...

Talking to Bitstamp is like talking to a brick wall...in their opinion Raiffeisen Banka is their bank and Raiffeisen Bank international is an intermediary; therefore we have to pay all the costs of this botched transfer and can seemly no longer withdraw funds (because of this intermediary that is supposedly totally unrelated to Bitstamp or their bank)

End of story we paid $85 for a transfer that was never sent to our bank; and we have no way to receive any transfers because bitstamps bank/intermediary will not send to Bitcoin related companies...

HOW CAN A BITCOIN EXCHANGE NOT BE ABLE TO SEND TRANSFERS TO BITCOIN BUSINESSES?

Bitstamp support seems to see no real problem with this situation.

Notes:
- We have previously done many successful wire transfers with the last one being about a month ago with no problem.
- Our company name has "Bitcoin" in it.

Here is a Memo from Bitstamps intermediary (basically Bitcoin hate mail): http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/22i768/raiffeisen_bank_international_internal_memo/

They are simply afraid of KYC/AML shit.

Current discussion about this on Reddit:

Bitstamp: No withdrawals for Bitcoin related companies (http://Bitstamp: No withdrawals for Bitcoin related companies)

I thought they use Unicredit (aka. Bank Austria)?
When did Bitstamp switch their bank partner?

Wasn't Bitstamp in process to change their banking partner? Did they already switch to some German bank?

This is a different case from this, right? http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2e9np5/bitstamp_blocked_my_fiat_withdrawal_and_no/

Why is this apparently a common occurence now?

Is this just FUD?

Lot of people yelled at me for "FUD" here too:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=225707.0

Reading back it looks like people actually went back in and deleted their FUD comments.

Anyways just managed to withdrawal all my funds in BTC.

The warnings (first paragraph) are standard and all perfectly true, and the advice to stay away from bitcoin (last bullet) is good advice.   Bitcoin is a risky investment, mining is lucrative only for well-planed operations, and even experts find it difficult to protect their coins from theft.  People who do not know how computers work should not be pushed into it.

As for the ban on bitcoin-related transactions, it is an abuse of their power, but what did bitcoiners expect?  "Hi, we are your friendly bank, I understand that you want to destroy us, what can we do to help you?"

I'm not yelling I'm just asking you for a direct answer without links to other posts and avoiding to answer this simple question with yes or no. Is this just FUD?

They are correct, however it seems reasonable that Raiffeisen Banka (Slovenia) would resend the transaction through some other intermediary.. how can they possibly justify sending Bitcoin related transactions through a bank that they know will reject them? Bitstamp needs to demand a refund on the failed tx from Raiffeisen Banka and make them resend it some other way.

No I did not make up this story.

Here is the owner (fairly sure Hazek is one of the owners?) of Bitstamp admitting it to be true: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2e9jww/bitstamp_no_withdrawals_for_bitcoin_related/cjxd9lc

How $#!ty  >:(

Banks only listen to one thing. If you have an account at this bank and can cancel it, that will make waves. Tell them your interested in a full service bank, not a bank from the last century.

Exactly there is a war that is happening right now between Bitcoin and Global Banks its a power shift a real game changer, these problems are to be expected.

it would be so much easier if we didn't need banks period.

Is this an isolated incident or it's Bitstamps new MO, anyone else had problems like this? ...cause soon I'll have to make some withdrawal from stamp and I wouldn't like any surprises...

At the moment it appears to be related to companies with "Bitcoin" in the name (or maybe some other filtered words too).

But IMHO if their banking group is this hostile to Bitcoin it can only be a matter of time until that filters down to Bitstamp themselves.

They are total noobs in this banking shit they should use Societe General Group bitcoin friendly bank.

from what i read some of the bank don't allow the word bitcoin on any field.

otherwise: 2 da moon!

When I walked into a bank to open up a business account for my latest venture, I ran into this issue. The representative who helped me filled in my personal info on her screen, verified that I had previously had business and personal accounts with this institution and then asked, "What is the name of your business?"

"Bitcoin General Store," I replied.

She immediately turned away from her keyboard and said, "I'm sorry, we don't allow accounts for any Bitcoin related businesses." It took about twenty minutes of assurances on my part that I would only be selling caps, t-shirts, etc and a phone call to her supervisor before I was allowed to open an account.

Needless to say, I only keep a minimum amount of USD in that account, just in case.

wow! seriously??

its simple really banks have to work within the laws. right now changing BTC to FIAT is a no no. Most any smart person would have told you this would happend. If you are looking to buy BTC with a bank account or even sell BTC and get FIAT for it then playing with a BANK is going to get your burned.
It does not matter if you did not even put the word BITCOIN on the statement. why you might ask because the computer system has already FLAGGED the company that you are exchanging with. Once the computer picks up on that they will close your account and you will be stuck.
I'm sorry for the lost of the $85 but most everyone should have thought it was only a matter of time.
Banks are getting cracked down on for tons of stuff and BTC is just the new thing to add to the list.
BTC = (i.e. money laundering, drug trafficking or fraud) = Thats all folks

MY ADVISE STAY AWAY FROM BANKS

This is actually a 25th Nov 2013 update - someone posted in Trading View trollbox and I did not research enough to see if it is recent!

Be careful out there..

A new MtGox coming.

This is very sad, but at the same time it let you know that they have almost nothing left in the clip...
In the meantime, better drop 'bitcoin' from business names. If this is the best they can do they surely can't compile a list of actual bitcoin businesses.

Bitstamp's account just changed to this Raiffeisen Banka d.d. recently, I guess their old account was closed by the original bank, so they are facing the same pressure as bitcoin businesses, it is already amazing such a large exchange still operates under the sight of every bank

Banks are reluctant to provide bitcoin business due to its dangerous nature, not because it is their competition. If legalized, they would also open bitcoin account for normal users who does not command a high level of IT knowledge. Only central bank might worry that bitcoin will affect their monetary policy if it grows too big, but they might just define it as a liquid asset and treat it like gold

The fiat money dominates because it is the money that drive many large projects and hire lots of people, so that people's income is in fiat money's format

I saw this one coming. It was only a matter of time, since banks were closing accounts related to bitcoin long ago. Bitstamp's main bank has no control over what the intermediary bank does, so it's not really their fault if this initially happens. HOWEVER, if they knowing keep sending the wire to the same bank that blocks the transaction, then they should eat the fees. It should be a given that you don't disclose a business name that is related to bitcoin.

You will get into bigger trouble by not informing the bank your business nature.

Better to be upfront and be known of the potential problems than having money either stucked or frozen.

Exactly, even though it will cost you a lot of time and nerves in the beginning, having a good banking partner instead of viewing your bank as something that just executes your transaction orders will likely pay off.

Do you smell the bullshit? Bitfinex doesn't have any of these problem and they process as much volume as Bitstamp.

I never had any problems with Bitstamp so far.
I use it regularly. So my Bank must have no problems with Bitcoin so far.

My bank is Postfinance Switzerland.

This is old news and bs. Take your time and research it properly on https://www.bitstamp.net/news/

Sadly, time will tell. We'll see if they can dig themselves out of the hole they are covering up. I pray they do but just like the MtGox fiasco, apologists are not managing their risk properly and given the signs you will deserve whatever comes to you for ignoring the warnings. I might point out even BTC-e has a better track record than Bitstamp. This isn't an isolated issue, nor is it the only category of issue.

In every exchange you need to put some trust in it. So I agree to be carefull and keep as liddle fiat and BTC on the exchanges as possible.
If a desaster happens only your coins and your fiat on the exchange is in danger.

You are free to use any other exchange, but Bitstamp is doing a great job im my opinion. I also tried Mt. Gox (as long as they existed) and BTC-e but their fiat handling was very slow compared to Bitstamp.

Hmm, wish I read that before I sent quite a lot of money to Bitstamp just a few days ago.

The deposit went well and the money appeared on my account. So far so good.
Bought some BTC. But I am worried if BTC withdrawal will work in the near future ...

Bitfinex operates in Hong Kong, a well known free trade port. However, bitfinex still needs to change their bank frequently.

You will be hit with KYC procedures when you make withdrawal. Enjoy ;D

i withdrew more than 50 btc yesterday without any problem. i dont think bitstamp is in trouble.

KYC will come, no matter if you withdraw or just buy. It's just a couple of innocent questions. I don't know why this is so threatening to some people  ???

obv bad news, but the kind of bad news that makes the price of bitcoin go UP!

I can confirm that BTC withdrawal worked for me today. So:

SEPA deposit - worked for me
buying BTC - worked for me
BTC withdrawal - worked for me

I have read and understood the term KYC for a long time then today I realized its pronounced (kick). Sorry guys. Sometimes I'm a little slow. haha

Good. Whenever any financial enterprise has difficulty processing withdrawals, get your money out immediately. That is a huge red flag. Talk to a lawyer. Threaten to go to the press. Raise hell until you get paid. This is a get out now signal for Bitstamp.

Legit businesses with "know your customer" requirements, like stockbrokers, do the checking before they let you put money in.

MtGox ?

It´s a bit frustrating when most people do not do any own research (e.g.: visiting the websites in question).

Some are so quick to yell "FUD!", or even "MTGOX!" while for others it seems to be news that bitstamp switched from unicredit to raiffeisen (Slovenia).

Well they obviously have some issues concerning speed of deposits or handling of fiat withdrawals, but as there is not one report of btc withdrawal problems or "missing" fiat, I´d suggest to turn the panic volume down a bit.

Id would certainly be a nice move to have bitstamp switch it´s banking to fidor (germany). They are actively endorsing bitcoin biz (bitcoin.de market place is run in their name for regulatory reasons) and even kraken (also a british Limited) have their bank account there.
The question is rather, why have bitstamp not moved there yet, but switched to a bank which is not known for any bitcoinfriendlyness, but rather being one of the very few banks without any offices or operations inside the US (think regulation, think US sanctions on other countries)?

UPDATE.

raiffeisen bank, Bitstamps bank, are now rejecting all bank payments.

I just waited 3 days to be told this.  My Bank in the UK told me before Bitstamp did that raiffeisen bank are rejecting payments. So lord knows how long i will have to wait before i see my money again.

Simply AVOID Bitstamp. Not worth the hassle.

In the UK i am buying all my bitcoins from Bitbargain. 

RIPstamp

You mean you cannot deposit funds, withdraw funds or neither? And does it have to do with your bank, or is Raiffeisen just sitting on money & doing nothing?

I've used BitStamp in the past before the hack, and didn't seem to have a lot of problems, except that wire withdrawals took quite a long time to arrive after being approved (over a week or so). Looks like I'll have to find another reliable exchange to use.